RAD 6.0 Evaluation version -- Portal Test Environment - Websphere

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Thread: RAD 6.0 Evaluation version -- Portal Test Environment

  1. RAD 6.0 Evaluation version -- Portal Test Environment

    Hi,

    while evaluating RAD 6 I was interested in the portal test environment
    but it is not quite clear what is included in the downloads and what is
    to be obtained from other sources.
    I couldn't find the Porta 5.1 test environment in the list of server
    runtimes. I think I read somewhere in this forum that Portal 5.1 does
    not come with the RAD 6 evaluation version. I think it was suggested
    that it is included in the Portal 5.1 download.
    Is that right?

    Could please somebody explain what is in the Windows FULL evaluation
    version and what one should expect as I suspect that the installation is
    not working completely, as I have installation errors with Portal 5.02
    at least.
    Who knows what else is not ok with the core installation, except that
    there was no error message shown. I haven't studied all the dozens of
    log files with 100's KB content to be completely sure whether there were
    problems with the core installation or not.


    This is the list of the downloads I have:

    File Size
    extractor.exe 28.970.041
    C81N2ML.bin 97.661.781
    C81N0ML.bin 1.463.707.578
    C81N4ML.bin 313.340.148
    C81N3ML.bin 388.101.937
    C81N5ML.bin 626.541.418
    C82BIML.bin 626.415.857

    I guess the last 2 are the same except "C82BIML.bin" was downloaded a
    few days later and a few bytes larger!

    By the way: trying to install Portal 5.02 fails at around 40% of the
    installation without any error message, eccept that it didn't work!


    I am wondering what this install is about? I thought a test environment
    comes already with RAD 6 OR is it supposed to be a full version as
    opposed to "test environment" from RAD 6 itself?


    I must say at large this RAD 6 is extremely confusing!

    I hope somebody can kindly help clarifying this for me. I know that I am
    not the first to ask these questions but the answers I have seen sofar
    don't really fit what I have.

    Regards
    Nawi Xom

  2. Re: RAD 6.0 Evaluation version -- Portal Test Environment

    The FULL trial does not include the WebSphere 5.x Test Environments,
    Crystal Reports or the WebSphere Portal 5.1 test server.

    It does include WPS 5.0 test environment.

    We did have a problem in mid-January right after the trials were posted
    with the WPS 5.0 bits not being correct.

    You can also get phone support throught the trial period.

    Nawi Xom wrote:

    > Hi,
    >
    > while evaluating RAD 6 I was interested in the portal test environment
    > but it is not quite clear what is included in the downloads and what
    > is to be obtained from other sources.
    > I couldn't find the Porta 5.1 test environment in the list of server
    > runtimes. I think I read somewhere in this forum that Portal 5.1 does
    > not come with the RAD 6 evaluation version. I think it was suggested
    > that it is included in the Portal 5.1 download.
    > Is that right?
    >
    > Could please somebody explain what is in the Windows FULL evaluation
    > version and what one should expect as I suspect that the installation
    > is not working completely, as I have installation errors with Portal
    > 5.02 at least.
    > Who knows what else is not ok with the core installation, except that
    > there was no error message shown. I haven't studied all the dozens of
    > log files with 100's KB content to be completely sure whether there
    > were problems with the core installation or not.
    >
    >
    > This is the list of the downloads I have:
    >
    > File Size
    > extractor.exe 28.970.041
    > C81N2ML.bin 97.661.781
    > C81N0ML.bin 1.463.707.578
    > C81N4ML.bin 313.340.148
    > C81N3ML.bin 388.101.937
    > C81N5ML.bin 626.541.418
    > C82BIML.bin 626.415.857
    >
    > I guess the last 2 are the same except "C82BIML.bin" was downloaded a
    > few days later and a few bytes larger!
    >
    > By the way: trying to install Portal 5.02 fails at around 40% of the
    > installation without any error message, eccept that it didn't work!
    >
    >
    > I am wondering what this install is about? I thought a test
    > environment comes already with RAD 6 OR is it supposed to be a full
    > version as opposed to "test environment" from RAD 6 itself?
    >
    >
    > I must say at large this RAD 6 is extremely confusing!
    >
    > I hope somebody can kindly help clarifying this for me. I know that I
    > am not the first to ask these questions but the answers I have seen
    > sofar don't really fit what I have.
    >
    > Regards
    > Nawi Xom



    --
    Jim Palistrant
    IBM Rational WW Technical Consultant - Rational Development Tools

  3. Crystal reports

    Hi,

    In another thread, Jim Palistrant wrote:

    > The FULL trial does not include the WebSphere 5.x Test Environments,
    > Crystal Reports or the WebSphere Portal 5.1 test server.


    I downloaded and installed a trial version on my D: drive that did
    include a lot of Crystal reports related stuff. The installer installed
    a whole directory with many DLLs somewhere on my C: drive without even
    asking. Is this supposed to happen or should there have been an option
    'install cr yes/no' ?

    As I will not use this part of WSAD I would prefer not to install the
    dlls and plugins.

    Luc.

  4. Re: Crystal reports

    I noticed the same thing. I also noticed the included sample projects
    really suck compared to those in WSAD 5.1.2. I hope this isn't an
    indication of what Rational is bringing to the table.

    Luc Peerdeman wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > In another thread, Jim Palistrant wrote:
    >
    >> The FULL trial does not include the WebSphere 5.x Test Environments,
    >> Crystal Reports or the WebSphere Portal 5.1 test server.

    >
    >
    > I downloaded and installed a trial version on my D: drive that did
    > include a lot of Crystal reports related stuff. The installer installed
    > a whole directory with many DLLs somewhere on my C: drive without even
    > asking. Is this supposed to happen or should there have been an option
    > 'install cr yes/no' ?
    >
    > As I will not use this part of WSAD I would prefer not to install the
    > dlls and plugins.
    >
    > Luc.


  5. Re: RAD 6.0 Evaluation version -- Portal Test Environment

    thank you for your reply.

    Jim Palistrant wrote:

    > The FULL trial does not include the WebSphere 5.x Test Environments,
    > Crystal Reports or the WebSphere Portal 5.1 test server.


    Crystal Reports IS in the download images, at least in the ones I had
    listed.

    >
    > It does include WPS 5.0 test environment.
    >


    Well I was not sure of that because when trying to define a server
    instance and configuration the wizard was asking me about the location
    where "WPS 5.0" is installed..
    This is confusing because the test environment seems to be an integral
    part of the core installation of RAD. So RAD should know where it is
    installed...
    By asking, I assume that something went wrong with the installation or
    it is just a new "strange" way of RAD to work.

    On the other hand I do see directories under $RAD_INSTALL_DIRECTORY\runtime

    like portal_v5, .._base etc..

    with 100's MB in them...

    So there must be a Porta 5.xx to work with.

    > We did have a problem in mid-January right after the trials were posted
    > with the WPS 5.0 bits not being correct.


    My downloads are some 12 days old.


    Thanks again for helping.


  6. Re: Crystal reports

    Ray McVay wrote:
    > I noticed the same thing. I also noticed the included sample projects
    > really suck compared to those in WSAD 5.1.2. I hope this isn't an
    > indication of what Rational is bringing to the table.
    >


    I guess there is another mechanism of importing ready mades samples, not
    the way WSAD 5.x used to...

    Not only this feature but as a whole I found WSAD 5.x much much better...
    Just starting with the name:
    WSAD was meanwhile a well known name with really great features etc...

    renaming the thing to something new like RAD is really typical IBM. They
    have a great tool to offer but detsroy the whole good thing with their
    own (anti)policy and horrible marketing...

    Besides... the installation of their tools is getting worse & worse...

    It is meanwhile almost rocket science to comprehend what tools &
    applications IBM/Rational/Alphaworks etc. have and how to find or hunt
    for them...
    and if you are well informed enough to finally understand what the tool
    is all about and what version you should grab and what other
    prerequisites you need and what version you should use and which one
    not... etc..
    and if you are finally there to start the installation you must have
    some 100 Gigs space and wait only some 30-40-60 minutes, just to find
    out that the installation didn't work and the hunt for the well hidden
    log files starts.. in order to get at least an idea of what might have
    gone wrong...

    I am still learning the art of decoding IBM/Rational log files to learn
    about the reason of why I must sit there depressed and not getting
    rewarded with a fuctioning IBM/Rational application development IDE
    although I have spent countless hours trying to get and run the BEAST.


    This new IBM/Rational thing is a horrible issue I must say.
    I am amazed that after so many years of successful offering of JAVA
    development tools and platforms (starting with the good old VAJ, Visual
    Age for Java) they have managed to mess around with their new toy.

    Many months ago as I first heard about the new name instead of WSAD I
    was pretty disappointed and was worried what the actual tool will be like...

    But sofar it seems to be even worse than my expectations...

    While I am at it I have to say that this is my impression while I
    haven't been able to really test the functionality and how well it works
    etc..

    It is perfectly possible that the tool is great once you have managed to
    understand which parts it consists of and how to install them.

    I was able to learn that the new way of defining servers/configurations
    is a big set-back compared to the seemless way with the 4.x/5.x versions.
    It is confusing, is a crude version compared to the previous versions
    and was causing massive problems.. like keeping to animate that it was
    starting but not doing so for minutes...
    Launcing a defined server but RAD was executing 3 instances of 6.0 Test
    Environment servers ....

    The samples issue is another annoying thing I found...

    It is pretty disappointing too that they just ignore MySQL although it
    is a DB server which is so widely used by millions of developers and
    countless web applications are MySQL based...

    But IBM seems to care only about companies who happily afford to buy an
    Oracle or DB2 for the silliest applications.

    I can remember that we were having lengthy discussions with the WSAD 4.x
    version already as to how to create a DB connection to MySQL or create
    EJB's based on MySQL...


    I know someone could say: hey.. why the whole excitement... if you don't
    like it.. don't take it!!

    One could say so but I guess it is not so easy... having worked for many
    years with WSAD it is a matter of time/efforts and experience
    investments in a tool ... by just jumping to another tool you have to
    swallow the fact that you are throwing away a great amount of
    experience, speed, workaround tricks etc. ...

    It is also embarassing having fought long to convince the decision
    makers to buy WSAD for development and now recommending it to my team,
    just to tell them now:
    you know what.. I was wrong .. lets buy IDEA, IntelliJ, JBuilder,
    JDeveloper, whatever ...

    Or just take Eclipse the real thing... combined with WTP IBM's other
    donation to the Eclipse webtools project...

    I hope noone is really offended by what I said. It is just my honest
    impression ...
    my intention is defintely not to hurt anyone involved in the making of
    RAD. I really appreciate the great tools sofar from IBM and certainly
    the developers have also put great functionality in this tool too, as
    they have always done with the other/previous versions...


    I guess the whole thing has went a bit wrong because of the (forced)
    marriage between IBM & Rational as the name change also indicates....

    This reminds me of the fact that I never managed to cinvince the right
    people in the company to buy "Rational Rose" for UML matters..
    It was always said that it is hard to use, too big, too expensive, with
    dozens of features you won't discover even in 7 years, etc...

    Is it possible that Rational was more dominant in bringing in its "bad
    habits" into the smooth and sweet WSAD?

    Regarsd,
    Nawi Xom







  7. Re: Crystal reports

    Nawi Xom wrote:

    >
    > Besides... the installation of their tools is getting worse & worse...



    Howdy :-)
    I can't comment on the rest of your post beyond saying I am sorry you
    feel that way, but, I would like to understand why you feel the
    installation is getting worse. Feel free to iterate a list of problems
    you found with with it :-)

    Peter

  8. Re: RAD 6.0 Evaluation version -- Portal Test Environment

    Investigating ....

    Nawi Xom wrote:

    > thank you for your reply.
    >
    > Jim Palistrant wrote:
    >
    >> The FULL trial does not include the WebSphere 5.x Test Environments,
    >> Crystal Reports or the WebSphere Portal 5.1 test server.

    >
    >
    > Crystal Reports IS in the download images, at least in the ones I had
    > listed.
    >
    >>
    >> It does include WPS 5.0 test environment.
    >>

    >
    > Well I was not sure of that because when trying to define a server
    > instance and configuration the wizard was asking me about the location
    > where "WPS 5.0" is installed..
    > This is confusing because the test environment seems to be an integral
    > part of the core installation of RAD. So RAD should know where it is
    > installed...
    > By asking, I assume that something went wrong with the installation or
    > it is just a new "strange" way of RAD to work.
    >
    > On the other hand I do see directories under
    > $RAD_INSTALL_DIRECTORY\runtime
    >
    > like portal_v5, .._base etc..
    >
    > with 100's MB in them...
    >
    > So there must be a Porta 5.xx to work with.
    >
    >> We did have a problem in mid-January right after the trials were
    >> posted with the WPS 5.0 bits not being correct.

    >
    >
    > My downloads are some 12 days old.
    >
    >
    > Thanks again for helping.
    >


    --
    Jim Palistrant
    IBM Rational WW Technical Consultant - Rational Development Tools

  9. Re: Crystal reports

    Hi Nawi,

    I was also a bit worried about the renamed WSAD as the previous attempt
    by Rational to do something with Eclipse (XDE) IMHO failed miserably -
    it was a HUGE application using a number of new non eclipse like gui
    widgets and not usable at all for me. The original Rational tools we
    never used, instead opted for WSAD + something else like Visual
    Paradigm, which we thought was easier to use.

    However, the IBM people who brought us WSAD 4 and 5 are still there, so
    I am still hoping the new team wil have built something as good as those
    tools. Time will tell. At least it will be possible to 'turn off' (via
    capabilities) features like uml modelling of entity beans (yuck ! we
    just got past the idea of using those !) and other things we don't need.

    The server definition changes really bother me though, we understand the
    proces pretty well as it works now and I would hate to spend much time
    on changes in this area.

    O yes, there is a draft redbook on www.redbooks.ibm.com about migrating
    from 5 to 6, might be useful !

    Cheers, Luc.

    PS Why is it so quiet on this group ? I think I remeber much more buzz
    with previous WSAD releases.

  10. Re: Crystal reports

    Hi Luc,

    sorry for the other post. It was meant to be for Peter Manahan

    Luc Peerdeman wrote:

    >
    > However, the IBM people who brought us WSAD 4 and 5 are still there, so
    > I am still hoping the new team wil have built something as good as those
    > tools. Time will tell.


    That's what I think and hope as well.

    > The server definition changes really bother me though, we understand the
    > proces pretty well as it works now and I would hate to spend much time
    > on changes in this area.
    >


    Of course I don't know about the internal changes and why they had to
    change the way servers were defined etc.. but it is annoying and a
    waste of time to be forced to spend time on things you had already once
    to invest time in.
    I mean with new standards and technologies emerging literally on daily
    basis the time is defintely more needed to cope up with it than
    reinventing the wheel..

    On the other hand it is certainly legitimate for a software vendor to
    remodel things.

    But I think all is IBM's fault. They have spoiled us with so good stuff
    so far

    > O yes, there is a draft redbook on www.redbooks.ibm.com about migrating
    > from 5 to 6, might be useful !


    This is the other thing which I didn't like. I tried redbooks.com and
    other places for help but there is almost nothing out there...

    Searching for RAD gave me 3 hits which are not exactly what could help:
    ---------------------------
    3 results found in Redbooks, Redpapers, Drafts and Technotes

    To learn more about Redbooks and Redpapers, click here.

    1. VisualAge Generator V4 System Development Guide, SG24-5467-00
    Redbook, published 14 October 1999
    2. WebSphere Version 6 Web Services Handbook Development and
    Deployment, SG24-6461-00
    Draft Redbook, last update 28 January 2005, Rating: (based on 5 reviews)
    3. iSeries Acronyms Glossary, TIPS0404
    Technote, published 26 April 2004
    ---------------------------


    Searching for "rational application developer" comes with:

    ---------------------------
    3 results found in Redbooks, Redpapers, Drafts and Technotes

    To learn more about Redbooks and Redpapers, click here.

    1. Rational Application Developer V6 Programming Guide, SG24-6449-00
    Draft Redbook, last update 17 February 2005
    2. WebSphere Version 6 Web Services Handbook Development and
    Deployment, SG24-6461-00
    Draft Redbook, last update 28 January 2005, Rating: (based on 5 reviews)
    3. Patterns: Implementing an SOA Using an Enterprise Service Bus with
    WebSphere Application Server V6, SG24-6494-00
    Draft Redbook, last update 18 February 2005
    ---------------------------



    At least the first one is fine but it is 17 February 2005. May be that's
    why I couldn't find it 2 days ago.

    >
    > PS Why is it so quiet on this group ? I think I remeber much more buzz
    > with previous WSAD releases.


    You are completely right. This is what I have noticed as well.
    I wonder whether the people are 100% happy and in command of their
    WSAD's or does it mean that there are no longer too many who use WSAD.

    May be a mixture of both?

    Cheers,
    Nawi Xom

  11. Re: Crystal reports

    Peter Manahan wrote:

    > Nawi Xom wrote:
    >
    >>
    >> Besides... the installation of their tools is getting worse & worse...

    >
    >
    >
    > Howdy :-)
    > I can't comment on the rest of your post beyond saying I am sorry
    > you feel that way, but, I would like to understand why you feel the
    > installation is getting worse. Feel free to iterate a list of problems
    > you found with with it :-)
    >
    > Peter


    Hi Peter :-)

    thank you for caring to reply and ask. You don't have to feel sorry for
    how I feel. But if you insist then thank you for the condolences :-)

    Anyway, I guess my post has ended pretty negative which is actually not
    my intention because I really like WSAD and it has sofar done a great
    job in doing my work.
    What I was trying to say in an essence is that WSAD was and still is
    great in all versions and it is a pitty that the latest version which
    one would expect to top the previous one, is introducing new and
    unnecessary problems & hassle.

    As I said may be at the end once you have a working installation and are
    used to the new mechanisms how things are done in RAD 6, one would
    forget about any trouble and would find that RAD 6.0 is indeed as good
    as WSAD 4,5.x but with more capabilities.


    You ask about why I feel that way: I described that already in my posts
    but let me put it together in the next few points:

    1- as the whole package is quite big it would be very helpful to explain
    better and more detailed the following (for all who don't know
    Rationa/WSAD so good):
    a- list of the software blocks which make up the complete package. I
    know you have in the download list a brief description what it is and
    the size of the download but it is coming too late, while you are at
    downloading and one would easily overlook it.

    It would be much better to have this with the pages which introduce the
    software.
    The usual listing of features OR the marketing stuff about the software
    is not so helpful for developers.
    Developers need a concrete and detailed idea about all the blocks and
    the structure and how they relate together.

    How about a simple graph of the directory structure such as SUN does for
    JDK downloads sothat developers know what directory structure they
    should expect once the installation is done.

    b- in addition to that one needs a graphical and textual presentation of
    the functional structure like which blocks relate to which one , how and
    why... how is the dependency if any...
    this helps to understand the whole package and in case of trouble better
    understand it and find possible solutions...

    I understand that the structure and functional blocks are depending on
    the (partly optional) fetaures... but this can be pointed out as well in
    the presentation.

    c- meanwhile the readme file is pretty big (almost 200 KB) so how about
    having at least 2 different files for Windows & Linux because one can
    really get lost in jumping back and forth in the big file and trying to
    reiterate which part was not working with which version etc...

    d- explicitly showing where log files (installation and otherwise) is
    stored and may be FAQ list for how to resolve the most common issues...

    .....
    I could definitely extend this list for quite a while... but enough
    details and depth for today I guess


    2- I think the installation wizard could be more helpful. As far as I
    can remember it doesn't (or can't) check what download images one has to
    determine what options you have for installation.
    Basically you can select installation options and later find out that
    teh installation fails because you don't have the installation sources.

    For example once I had selected the multilanguage package which I didn't
    have the download for, the isnatllation aborted and the error messages
    were not very helpful by saying some file named like
    "ddhsghsdgfsd3624325edfeg__fjsdhjsddd.asd" or so was not found....

    I had to find out via trial and error that the reason for that message
    was that I had selected something I didn't have.

    Well a simple dependency check in the insatllation would make it much
    easier and newcomers are not forced to become RAD 6 installation
    maestro's to get it up and running.


    I am sure that you have heard about such sugegstions before ... but
    since you asked I mentioned some of the points ...


    Again for all who accidentally come across this post: I still think that
    IBM is doing great and WSAD in my opinion is great.

    Nawi Xom








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