Who is left at VMS engineering ? - VMS

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Thread: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

  1. Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    is no longer aboard.

    Anyone else having similar feelings ?

    Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    longer participating here ?

  2. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    In article <48fe39a7$0$12386$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>, JF Mezei writes:
    > I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    > by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    > does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    > is no longer aboard.
    >
    > Anyone else having similar feelings ?
    >
    > Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    > longer participating here ?


    Perhaps your kill file runneth over?


  3. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    Brad Hamilton wrote:
    > I also investigated teranews, which claims to be "free" after a USD$3.95 charge
    > to my credit card. Does anyone use this service?


    I used to use this. But found it less reliable than Astraweb. But you
    can't complain since it is essentially free. The $3.95 fee is really
    just to weed out casual users and only give free access to serious users.

  4. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    On Oct 21, 9:14*pm, JF Mezei wrote:
    > I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    > by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    > does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    > is no longer aboard.
    >
    > Anyone else having similar feelings ?
    >
    > Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    > longer participating here ?



    Perhaps more people have given up due to the poor signal to noise
    ratio.


  5. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    On Oct 22, 9:44*am, IanMiller wrote:
    > On Oct 21, 9:14*pm, JF Mezei wrote:
    >
    > > I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    > > by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    > > does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    > > is no longer aboard.

    >
    > > Anyone else having similar feelings ?

    >
    > > Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    > > longer participating here ?

    >
    > Perhaps more people have given up due to the poor signal to noise
    > ratio.


    Agree and back on topic, my *guess* is that the VMS organization is
    smaller than it used to be. The same could probably be said about
    other HP groups as well. More with less is an often heard (Hurd)
    mantra these days.

    Disclaimer: I have no insider information on this. Just guessin'




  6. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    I have been toying with the idea of a 'regulated" newsgroup for VMS hosted
    here.
    We only have a T1 1.5 both ways but that should be easily enough for simple
    text.
    something like news.islandco.com
    Software is free on Linux so ....

    Thoughts?


    --
    David B Turner

    =============================================

    Island Computers US Corp
    PO Box 86
    Tybee GA 31328

    Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    Email: dturner@islandco.com
    International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    Fax: 912 786 8505
    Web: www.islandco.com

    =============================================
    "DaveG" wrote in message
    news:89df9927-f160-482a-9812-537c7c57521e@34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
    On Oct 22, 9:44 am, IanMiller wrote:
    > On Oct 21, 9:14 pm, JF Mezei wrote:
    >
    > > I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    > > by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    > > does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    > > is no longer aboard.

    >
    > > Anyone else having similar feelings ?

    >
    > > Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    > > longer participating here ?

    >
    > Perhaps more people have given up due to the poor signal to noise
    > ratio.


    Agree and back on topic, my *guess* is that the VMS organization is
    smaller than it used to be. The same could probably be said about
    other HP groups as well. More with less is an often heard (Hurd)
    mantra these days.

    Disclaimer: I have no insider information on this. Just guessin'





  7. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    IanMiller wrote:
    > On Oct 21, 9:14 pm, JF Mezei wrote:
    >> I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    >> by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    >> does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    >> is no longer aboard.
    >>
    >> Anyone else having similar feelings ?
    >>
    >> Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    >> longer participating here ?

    >
    >
    > Perhaps more people have given up due to the poor signal to noise
    > ratio.
    >


    The signal to noise ratio has been a problem for many years!

    VMS tends to generate fewer problems and the solutions tend to be more
    straightforward than under some other operating systems.

    VMS has been in decline for the last ten to twenty years or so. DEC's
    ambitions to compete with IBM were a poor match for their customer base!
    What was that poem about "a banner with a strange device" and
    "Excelsior" he cried?

  8. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    John Reagan wrote:

    > I'm still here. Who are you concerned about? Perhaps we're busy or on
    > vacation? All of the folks that normally post here from VMS are still
    > around as far as I know.


    I was thinking about FredKleinsorge for instance.

    I know Hoff is no longer HP employee, but his, and FredK's lack of
    participation here has been noticed (at least by me).

    BTW, aren't you technically an Intel employee ? Or are you still
    officially VMS engineering and paid by HP ?


  9. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    In article , "John Reagan" writes:
    >
    >"JF Mezei" wrote in message
    >news:48fe39a7$0$12386$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
    >>I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    >> by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    >> does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    >> is no longer aboard.
    >>
    >> Anyone else having similar feelings ?
    >>
    >> Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    >> longer participating here ?

    >
    >I'm still here. Who are you concerned about? Perhaps we're busy or on
    >vacation? All of the folks that normally post here from VMS are still
    >around as far as I know.


    Don't believe this -- John is gone and this is just a random response
    program left running in his place!

    Seriously, I've had myriad private emails in recent weeks with the VMS
    engineering staff. They've all responded to me. They might not be in
    their offices (working remotely or at home for all I know) but they are
    working. John has been most helpful and I keep him busy with bugs that
    I find in the Macro compiler. I'll wager that most don't want to sift
    through the typical detritus here to find anything worth their while.

    PS. John, I'm still trying to find some small reproducer for the weird
    argument register problem I sent you last week. Other work has taken a
    driver's seat to that problem though.

    --
    VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM

    .... pejorative statements of opinion are entitled to constitutional protection
    no matter how extreme, vituperous, or vigorously expressed they may be. (NJSC)

    Copr. 2008 Brian Schenkenberger. Publication of _this_ usenet article outside
    of usenet _must_ include its contents in its entirety including this copyright
    notice, disclaimer and quotations.

  10. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    JF Mezei wrote:

    > I know Hoff is no longer HP employee, but his, and FredK's lack of
    > participation here has been noticed (at least by me).


    You rang?





  11. We have quorum! (Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?)

    Hi John,

    > I'm still here.


    Good man!

    Cheers Richard Maher

    PS. Still can't source a cheap rx2600 in Oz (or any other dev Itanium) but I
    hope to once more be in a position to beg for advice shortly.

    "John Reagan" wrote in message
    news:j-udnfxrGZ_oO2LVnZ2dnUVZ_s_inZ2d@earthlink.com...
    >
    > "JF Mezei" wrote in message
    > news:48fe39a7$0$12386$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
    > >I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    > > by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    > > does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    > > is no longer aboard.
    > >
    > > Anyone else having similar feelings ?
    > >
    > > Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    > > longer participating here ?

    >
    > I'm still here. Who are you concerned about? Perhaps we're busy or on
    > vacation? All of the folks that normally post here from VMS are still
    > around as far as I know.
    >
    > John
    >
    >




  12. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    In article <7YILk.51592$rD2.28765@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "David Turner, islandco.com" writes:

    > Software is free on Linux so ....


    How dare you suggest hosting comp.os.vms on anything but VMS! 8-)


  13. Re: We have quorum! (Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?)

    Richard

    If you want you can buy it and have it shipped to us and we can check it
    out.
    We can ship to Oz and do say weekly...

    I wouldn't charge you as we wouldn't have to repack it but you would be
    responsible for shipping.
    If you want it tested etc then yes we charge $120 per hour and a full test
    would run about 1 hour.

    FYI Y'all, We are acting as buying agents now for some entities - not by
    choice but because some of our Government customers are only allowed to buy
    from certain vendors (Us ! Woo Hoo !).

    We charge a commision of 10% but the savings we offer easily cover our fees.

    --
    David B Turner

    =============================================

    Island Computers US Corp
    PO Box 86
    Tybee GA 31328

    Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    Email: dturner@islandco.com
    International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    Fax: 912 786 8505
    Web: www.islandco.com

    =============================================
    "Richard Maher" wrote in message
    news:gdpp1p$6cn$1@news-01.bur.connect.com.au...
    > Hi John,
    >
    >> I'm still here.

    >
    > Good man!
    >
    > Cheers Richard Maher
    >
    > PS. Still can't source a cheap rx2600 in Oz (or any other dev Itanium) but
    > I
    > hope to once more be in a position to beg for advice shortly.
    >
    > "John Reagan" wrote in message
    > news:j-udnfxrGZ_oO2LVnZ2dnUVZ_s_inZ2d@earthlink.com...
    >>
    >> "JF Mezei" wrote in message
    >> news:48fe39a7$0$12386$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com...
    >> >I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    >> > by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    >> > does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    >> > is no longer aboard.
    >> >
    >> > Anyone else having similar feelings ?
    >> >
    >> > Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    >> > longer participating here ?

    >>
    >> I'm still here. Who are you concerned about? Perhaps we're busy or on
    >> vacation? All of the folks that normally post here from VMS are still
    >> around as far as I know.
    >>
    >> John
    >>
    >>

    >
    >




  14. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?


    > I also investigated teranews, which claims to be "free" after a USD$3.95 charge
    > to my credit card. Does anyone use this service?
    >

    I also have Comcast, but never use it for (the few) newsgroups I read,
    and was not aware they were pulling out of news.

    What I use, for free, is nntp.aioe.org
    for comp.os.vms

  15. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:

    > In article <7YILk.51592$rD2.28765@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "David Turner,
    > islandco.com" writes:


    >> Software is free on Linux so ....


    > How dare you suggest hosting comp.os.vms on anything but VMS! 8-)


    An interesting notion, "hosting" a Usenet newsgroup. That would imply a
    centralized database of postings, would it not? Net.news is of course quite
    intentionally *not* centralized, to avoid

    1. Single point of failure issues
    b) Censorship of views differing from those of the owner(s) of the host

    comp.os.vms <> info-vax !

    --
    Rich Alderson "You get what anybody gets. You get a lifetime."
    news@alderson.users.panix.com --Death, of the Endless

  16. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    Rich Alderson wrote:
    > koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:
    >
    >
    >>In article <7YILk.51592$rD2.28765@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "David Turner,
    >>islandco.com" writes:

    >
    >
    >>>Software is free on Linux so ....

    >
    >
    >> How dare you suggest hosting comp.os.vms on anything but VMS! 8-)

    >
    >
    > An interesting notion, "hosting" a Usenet newsgroup. That would imply a
    > centralized database of postings, would it not? Net.news is of course quite
    > intentionally *not* centralized, to avoid
    >
    > 1. Single point of failure issues
    > b) Censorship of views differing from those of the owner(s) of the host
    >
    > comp.os.vms <> info-vax !
    >


    I took David to mean that he was willing to set up a nntp server that
    would include comp.os.vms (and hopefully the other DEC/VMS related
    news groups, such as the vmsnet tree, comp.sys.dec, etc.) Comcast has
    apparently dropped (or is about to drop) all of usenet. Verizon has
    dropped all but the big 8, including vmsnet.* I think a free news
    server that gathered all the VMS/DEC/Compaq*/HP* groups in one place
    would be a worthy enterprise (* if there are any Compaq or HP groups
    that specifically relate to VMS and other inherited DEC hardware or
    software, I don't think anyone here is particularly interested in any
    of the HP-UX, Compaq PC. etc. groups unless they also own one of them,
    and there are other sources for those.)

    If he is really just proposing "yet another web site catering to the
    usual bunch of VMS suspects" (YAWSCTTUBOVS), there are already
    openvms.org, ITRC, Encompass, Eisner, Death-Row, and a bunch of other
    places. I think distributed consolidation (usenet) would be better
    than dispersal.

    --
    John Santos
    Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc.
    781-861-0670 ext 539

  17. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    In article ,
    Rich Alderson writes:
    > koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:
    >
    >> In article <7YILk.51592$rD2.28765@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "David Turner,
    >> islandco.com" writes:

    >
    >>> Software is free on Linux so ....

    >
    >> How dare you suggest hosting comp.os.vms on anything but VMS! 8-)

    >
    > An interesting notion, "hosting" a Usenet newsgroup. That would imply a
    > centralized database of postings, would it not? Net.news is of course quite
    > intentionally *not* centralized, to avoid
    >
    > 1. Single point of failure issues
    > b) Censorship of views differing from those of the owner(s) of the host


    Actually, I doubt either of those was consideredc whrn USENET News first
    came into being. :-)

    David does have a nice idea, however. It should be rather easy to
    find sites willing to feed him one or two groups taht he could then
    offer to a select group without putting too much strain on his pipe.
    Back when I was in the USENET News Admin biz I used to feed just the
    vmsnet groups to somebody in Eastern Europe.

    David, if you need expertise setting this up I would be glad to help.

    >
    > comp.os.vms <> info-vax !


    And having run both News and Mailing-lists I can honestly say both have
    their advantages and dis-advantages.

    bill

    --
    Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves
    billg999@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    University of Scranton |
    Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include

  18. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    I would need the expertise
    We have never done it and apart from downloading an NNTP server that is as
    far as we have gotten.
    Someone else here is pretty Linux Savvy.

    Opening up the NNTP port isn't an issue - We would only allow registered
    users to log in though.
    Free, as we pay for the T1 anyhow for Web and mailserver hosting.

    Can someone point us in the right direction for starters?


    --
    David B Turner

    =============================================

    Island Computers US Corp
    PO Box 86
    Tybee GA 31328

    Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    Email: dturner@islandco.com
    International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    Fax: 912 786 8505
    Web: www.islandco.com

    =============================================
    "Bill Gunshannon" wrote in message
    news:6me00gFfv20iU1@mid.individual.net...
    > In article ,
    > Rich Alderson writes:
    >> koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:
    >>
    >>> In article <7YILk.51592$rD2.28765@bignews4.bellsouth.net>, "David
    >>> Turner,
    >>> islandco.com" writes:

    >>
    >>>> Software is free on Linux so ....

    >>
    >>> How dare you suggest hosting comp.os.vms on anything but VMS! 8-)

    >>
    >> An interesting notion, "hosting" a Usenet newsgroup. That would imply a
    >> centralized database of postings, would it not? Net.news is of course
    >> quite
    >> intentionally *not* centralized, to avoid
    >>
    >> 1. Single point of failure issues
    >> b) Censorship of views differing from those of the owner(s) of the host

    >
    > Actually, I doubt either of those was consideredc whrn USENET News first
    > came into being. :-)
    >
    > David does have a nice idea, however. It should be rather easy to
    > find sites willing to feed him one or two groups taht he could then
    > offer to a select group without putting too much strain on his pipe.
    > Back when I was in the USENET News Admin biz I used to feed just the
    > vmsnet groups to somebody in Eastern Europe.
    >
    > David, if you need expertise setting this up I would be glad to help.
    >
    >>
    >> comp.os.vms <> info-vax !

    >
    > And having run both News and Mailing-lists I can honestly say both have
    > their advantages and dis-advantages.
    >
    > bill
    >
    > --
    > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves
    > billg999@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    > University of Scranton |
    > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include




  19. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    On Oct 21, 4:14*pm, JF Mezei wrote:
    > I get the feeling we are in some Star Trek episode where the crew, one
    > by one, disapears without any sound/noise and it isn't until someone
    > does a head count or tries to contact a crew member that they notice he
    > is no longer aboard.
    >
    > Anyone else having similar feelings ?
    >
    > Or is it truly just a case of the formely regular posters to COV no
    > longer participating here ?


    You are correct that there are fewer people working in OpenVMS
    engineering. On the flip side, I am in private contact with some
    OpenVMS developers and maintainers who toldf me they never post here
    because of the constant bickering and negativity. One HP employee told
    me that the "comp" in "comp.os.vms" stands for "complain" and
    sometimes I agree with them. Lets hope those same "non posters" are
    still lurking.

    Neil Rieck
    Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,
    Ontario, Canada.
    http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/OpenVMS.html

  20. Re: Who is left at VMS engineering ?

    Neil Rieck wrote:
    > [snip]
    > You are correct that there are fewer people working in OpenVMS
    > engineering. On the flip side, I am in private contact with some
    > OpenVMS developers and maintainers who toldf me they never post here
    > because of the constant bickering and negativity. One HP employee told
    > me that the "comp" in "comp.os.vms" stands for "complain" and
    > sometimes I agree with them. Lets hope those same "non posters" are
    > still lurking.


    To them I say this:

    Suppose YOU run a business, and your staff cause your customers to
    become irate.

    There are two choices here:

    1. Ignore the complaints = conditions and/or the product/business
    stagnate or continue to deteriorate.

    2. Address the complaints = conditions and/or the product/business
    improve.

    It's -YOUR- choice.

    Suppose you have pain and inflammation in an appendage.

    1. You can ignore the pain and possibly lose the effected appendage,
    possibly your life.

    2. You can address the pain and save the effected appendage, possibly
    your life.

    "Complaints" are like pain: they tell us when something is wrong.

    Our response to that warning determines the quality of our results.

    Again, it's -YOUR- choice.

    Either you want things to improve, or you are willing to let things go
    to the point of destruction / necrosis, etc.

    "Although its been said, many times, many ways", choose wisely.

    David J Dachtera
    formerly dba DJE Systems
    (Emphasis on: "formerly" - not by my choice)

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