PC Systems for sale - VMS

This is a discussion on PC Systems for sale - VMS ; Very quick NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems These have become very popular with our customers as we can still sell NEW XP Pro with these Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower ASUS Motherboard 2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2) 512MB Nvidia Graphics ...

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  1. PC Systems for sale

    Very quick

    NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems

    These have become very popular with our customers as we can still sell NEW
    XP Pro with these

    Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower
    ASUS Motherboard
    2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2)
    512MB Nvidia Graphics
    250GB SATAII Disk
    CD/DVDRW-DL
    On Board Gigabit
    Windows XP Pro
    Keytronic Heavy Duty Keyboard and Mouse (Old IBM Style)
    No Monitor

    Total Per System $820

    Shipping within the US: $26

    3 Year Warranty


    --
    David B Turner

    =============================================

    Island Computers US Corp
    PO Box 86
    Tybee GA 31328

    Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    Email: dturner@islandco.com
    International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    Fax: 912 786 8505
    Web: www.islandco.com

    =============================================



  2. Re: PC Systems for sale

    On Oct 15, 3:33 pm, "David Turner, islandco.com"
    wrote:
    > Very quick
    >
    > NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems
    >
    > These have become very popular with our customers as we can still sell NEW
    > XP Pro with these
    >
    > Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower
    > ASUS Motherboard
    > 2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2)
    > 512MB Nvidia Graphics
    > 250GB SATAII Disk
    > CD/DVDRW-DL
    > On Board Gigabit
    > Windows XP Pro
    > Keytronic Heavy Duty Keyboard and Mouse (Old IBM Style)
    > No Monitor
    >
    > Total Per System $820
    >
    > Shipping within the US: $26
    >
    > 3 Year Warranty
    >
    > --
    > David B Turner
    >
    > =============================================
    >
    > Island Computers US Corp
    > PO Box 86
    > Tybee GA 31328
    >
    > Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    > Email: dtur...@islandco.com
    > International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    > Fax: 912 786 8505
    > Web:www.islandco.com
    >
    > =============================================


    For those who don't mind slumming it, both HP and Dell websites are
    quite happy to sell desktops with Windows XP support. Eg Dell Optiplex
    can still be bought with XP pre-installed for a small additional fee,
    and HP/Compaq dx-series desktops sold with Vista Business comes with
    XP Pro downgrade rights and support (Vista Business brings the
    downgrade rights, whether the box is supported with XP is decided by
    the box builder).

    And for those who don't mind a bit of DIY, Windows XP OEM licence
    +media should still be available (at least while stocks last) from the
    usual retail PCbuilder outlets.

    Vista still isn't mandatory yet, much to their disappointment.

  3. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <22dc096d-6865-406e-bc77-8eaa2762cb6b@75g2000hso.googlegroups.com>, johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk writes:
    >On Oct 15, 3:33 pm, "David Turner, islandco.com"
    > wrote:
    >> Very quick
    >>
    >> NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems
    >>
    >> These have become very popular with our customers as we can still sell NEW
    >> XP Pro with these
    >>
    >> Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower
    >> ASUS Motherboard
    >> 2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2)
    >> 512MB Nvidia Graphics
    >> 250GB SATAII Disk
    >> CD/DVDRW-DL
    >> On Board Gigabit
    >> Windows XP Pro
    >> Keytronic Heavy Duty Keyboard and Mouse (Old IBM Style)
    >> No Monitor
    >>
    >> Total Per System $820
    >>
    >> Shipping within the US: $26
    >>
    >> 3 Year Warranty
    >>
    >> --
    >> David B Turner
    >>
    >> =============================================
    >>
    >> Island Computers US Corp
    >> PO Box 86
    >> Tybee GA 31328
    >>
    >> Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    >> Email: dtur...@islandco.com
    >> International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    >> Fax: 912 786 8505
    >> Web:www.islandco.com
    >>
    >> =============================================

    >
    >For those who don't mind slumming it, both HP and Dell websites are
    >quite happy to sell desktops with Windows XP support. Eg Dell Optiplex
    >can still be bought with XP pre-installed for a small additional fee,
    >and HP/Compaq dx-series desktops sold with Vista Business comes with
    >XP Pro downgrade rights and support (Vista Business brings the
    >downgrade rights, whether the box is supported with XP is decided by
    >the box builder).
    >
    >And for those who don't mind a bit of DIY, Windows XP OEM licence
    >+media should still be available (at least while stocks last) from the
    >usual retail PCbuilder outlets.
    >
    >Vista still isn't mandatory yet, much to their disappointment.


    ....and this has "WHAT?" to do with VMS??? Why, abso-****ing-lutely nothing!

    Take it to comp.system.WEENDOZE.WANKERZ (aka. comp.system.WEENDOZE.advocacy)

    --
    VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM

    .... pejorative statements of opinion are entitled to constitutional protection
    no matter how extreme, vituperous, or vigorously expressed they may be. (NJSC)

    Copr. 2008 Brian Schenkenberger. Publication of _this_ usenet article outside
    of usenet _must_ include its contents in its entirety including this copyright
    notice, disclaimer and quotations.

  4. Re: PC Systems for sale

    VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
    > In article <22dc096d-6865-406e-bc77-8eaa2762cb6b@75g2000hso.googlegroups.com>, johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk writes:
    >> On Oct 15, 3:33 pm, "David Turner, islandco.com"
    >> wrote:
    >>> Very quick
    >>>
    >>> NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems
    >>>
    >>> These have become very popular with our customers as we can still sell NEW
    >>> XP Pro with these
    >>>
    >>> Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower
    >>> ASUS Motherboard
    >>> 2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2)
    >>> 512MB Nvidia Graphics
    >>> 250GB SATAII Disk
    >>> CD/DVDRW-DL
    >>> On Board Gigabit
    >>> Windows XP Pro
    >>> Keytronic Heavy Duty Keyboard and Mouse (Old IBM Style)
    >>> No Monitor
    >>>
    >>> Total Per System $820
    >>>
    >>> Shipping within the US: $26
    >>>
    >>> 3 Year Warranty
    >>>
    >>> --
    >>> David B Turner
    >>>
    >>> =============================================
    >>>
    >>> Island Computers US Corp
    >>> PO Box 86
    >>> Tybee GA 31328
    >>>
    >>> Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    >>> Email: dtur...@islandco.com
    >>> International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    >>> Fax: 912 786 8505
    >>> Web:www.islandco.com
    >>>
    >>> =============================================

    >> For those who don't mind slumming it, both HP and Dell websites are
    >> quite happy to sell desktops with Windows XP support. Eg Dell Optiplex
    >> can still be bought with XP pre-installed for a small additional fee,
    >> and HP/Compaq dx-series desktops sold with Vista Business comes with
    >> XP Pro downgrade rights and support (Vista Business brings the
    >> downgrade rights, whether the box is supported with XP is decided by
    >> the box builder).
    >>
    >> And for those who don't mind a bit of DIY, Windows XP OEM licence
    >> +media should still be available (at least while stocks last) from the
    >> usual retail PCbuilder outlets.
    >>
    >> Vista still isn't mandatory yet, much to their disappointment.

    >
    > ...and this has "WHAT?" to do with VMS??? Why, abso-****ing-lutely nothing!
    >
    > Take it to comp.system.WEENDOZE.WANKERZ (aka. comp.system.WEENDOZE.advocacy)
    >


    A nice table-top front-end to your VMS servers, of course ! :-)

  5. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <00A81252.9ED4222D@sendspamhere.org>,
    VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:
    > In article <22dc096d-6865-406e-bc77-8eaa2762cb6b@75g2000hso.googlegroups.com>, johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk writes:
    >>On Oct 15, 3:33 pm, "David Turner, islandco.com"
    >> wrote:
    >>> Very quick
    >>>
    >>> NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems
    >>>
    >>> These have become very popular with our customers as we can still sell NEW
    >>> XP Pro with these
    >>>
    >>> Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower
    >>> ASUS Motherboard
    >>> 2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2)
    >>> 512MB Nvidia Graphics
    >>> 250GB SATAII Disk
    >>> CD/DVDRW-DL
    >>> On Board Gigabit
    >>> Windows XP Pro
    >>> Keytronic Heavy Duty Keyboard and Mouse (Old IBM Style)
    >>> No Monitor
    >>>
    >>> Total Per System $820
    >>>
    >>> Shipping within the US: $26
    >>>
    >>> 3 Year Warranty
    >>>
    >>> --
    >>> David B Turner
    >>>
    >>> =============================================
    >>>
    >>> Island Computers US Corp
    >>> PO Box 86
    >>> Tybee GA 31328
    >>>
    >>> Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    >>> Email: dtur...@islandco.com
    >>> International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    >>> Fax: 912 786 8505
    >>> Web:www.islandco.com
    >>>
    >>> =============================================

    >>
    >>For those who don't mind slumming it, both HP and Dell websites are
    >>quite happy to sell desktops with Windows XP support. Eg Dell Optiplex
    >>can still be bought with XP pre-installed for a small additional fee,
    >>and HP/Compaq dx-series desktops sold with Vista Business comes with
    >>XP Pro downgrade rights and support (Vista Business brings the
    >>downgrade rights, whether the box is supported with XP is decided by
    >>the box builder).
    >>
    >>And for those who don't mind a bit of DIY, Windows XP OEM licence
    >>+media should still be available (at least while stocks last) from the
    >>usual retail PCbuilder outlets.
    >>
    >>Vista still isn't mandatory yet, much to their disappointment.

    >
    > ...and this has "WHAT?" to do with VMS??? Why, abso-****ing-lutely nothing!
    >
    > Take it to comp.system.WEENDOZE.WANKERZ (aka. comp.system.WEENDOZE.advocacy)


    Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    box. Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough
    of the message to know if it was a good deal or not, but knowing Island,
    it probably was. Or are you just mad because they didn't offer Macs
    as well? It's time to accept that the days of VT100's are over and
    you really need something else just to install VMS. It might as well
    be a PC running Windows as anything else. And, yes, I have a PC with
    a bunch of serial ports on the back providing consoles to my PDP-11's.
    It is, however not running Windows or OSX. :-)

    bill

    --
    Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves
    billg999@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    University of Scranton |
    Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include

  6. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <6lmq0dFd01o7U1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu
    says...
    > In article <00A81252.9ED4222D@sendspamhere.org>,
    > VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:
    > > In article <22dc096d-6865-406e-bc77-8eaa2762cb6b@75g2000hso.googlegroups.com>, johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk writes:
    > >>On Oct 15, 3:33 pm, "David Turner, islandco.com"
    > >> wrote:
    > >>> Very quick
    > >>>
    > >>> NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems
    > >>>
    > >>> These have become very popular with our customers as we can still sell NEW
    > >>> XP Pro with these
    > >>>
    > >>> Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower
    > >>> ASUS Motherboard
    > >>> 2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2)
    > >>> 512MB Nvidia Graphics
    > >>> 250GB SATAII Disk
    > >>> CD/DVDRW-DL
    > >>> On Board Gigabit
    > >>> Windows XP Pro
    > >>> Keytronic Heavy Duty Keyboard and Mouse (Old IBM Style)
    > >>> No Monitor
    > >>>
    > >>> Total Per System $820
    > >>>
    > >>> Shipping within the US: $26
    > >>>
    > >>> 3 Year Warranty
    > >>>
    > >>> --
    > >>> David B Turner
    > >>>
    > >>> =============================================
    > >>>
    > >>> Island Computers US Corp
    > >>> PO Box 86
    > >>> Tybee GA 31328
    > >>>
    > >>> Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    > >>> Email: dtur...@islandco.com
    > >>> International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    > >>> Fax: 912 786 8505
    > >>> Web:www.islandco.com
    > >>>
    > >>> =============================================
    > >>
    > >>For those who don't mind slumming it, both HP and Dell websites are
    > >>quite happy to sell desktops with Windows XP support. Eg Dell Optiplex
    > >>can still be bought with XP pre-installed for a small additional fee,
    > >>and HP/Compaq dx-series desktops sold with Vista Business comes with
    > >>XP Pro downgrade rights and support (Vista Business brings the
    > >>downgrade rights, whether the box is supported with XP is decided by
    > >>the box builder).
    > >>
    > >>And for those who don't mind a bit of DIY, Windows XP OEM licence
    > >>+media should still be available (at least while stocks last) from the
    > >>usual retail PCbuilder outlets.
    > >>
    > >>Vista still isn't mandatory yet, much to their disappointment.

    > >
    > > ...and this has "WHAT?" to do with VMS??? Why, abso-****ing-lutely nothing!
    > >
    > > Take it to comp.system.WEENDOZE.WANKERZ (aka. comp.system.WEENDOZE.advocacy)

    >
    > Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    > of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    > system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    > box.



    Talk about bull****! This statement is utter crap. All you need is a
    terminal. Though hyperterminal on a PC would do, it is the worst
    possible choice. What else would you need a PC for? (A Mac, Linux,
    Unix, or another, all-ready running, VMS system would do as well or
    better.)


    Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough
    > of the message to know if it was a good deal or not, but knowing Island,
    > it probably was. Or are you just mad because they didn't offer Macs
    > as well? It's time to accept that the days of VT100's are over and
    > you really need something else just to install VMS. It might as well
    > be a PC running Windows as anything else. And, yes, I have a PC with
    > a bunch of serial ports on the back providing consoles to my PDP-11's.
    > It is, however not running Windows or OSX. :-)
    >


    It might asxx wellxxxx better be *anything* than a M$ PC.

    And you certainly don't need either a terminal nor a terminal emulator
    if you have a graphics-capable VMS box plus KVM.



    > bill
    >
    >


    --
    John

  7. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article ,
    John Santos writes:
    > In article <6lmq0dFd01o7U1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu
    > says...
    >> In article <00A81252.9ED4222D@sendspamhere.org>,
    >> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:
    >> > In article <22dc096d-6865-406e-bc77-8eaa2762cb6b@75g2000hso.googlegroups.com>, johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk writes:
    >> >>On Oct 15, 3:33 pm, "David Turner, islandco.com"
    >> >> wrote:
    >> >>> Very quick
    >> >>>
    >> >>> NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems
    >> >>>
    >> >>> These have become very popular with our customers as we can still sell NEW
    >> >>> XP Pro with these
    >> >>>
    >> >>> Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower
    >> >>> ASUS Motherboard
    >> >>> 2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2)
    >> >>> 512MB Nvidia Graphics
    >> >>> 250GB SATAII Disk
    >> >>> CD/DVDRW-DL
    >> >>> On Board Gigabit
    >> >>> Windows XP Pro
    >> >>> Keytronic Heavy Duty Keyboard and Mouse (Old IBM Style)
    >> >>> No Monitor
    >> >>>
    >> >>> Total Per System $820
    >> >>>
    >> >>> Shipping within the US: $26
    >> >>>
    >> >>> 3 Year Warranty
    >> >>>
    >> >>> --
    >> >>> David B Turner
    >> >>>
    >> >>> =============================================
    >> >>>
    >> >>> Island Computers US Corp
    >> >>> PO Box 86
    >> >>> Tybee GA 31328
    >> >>>
    >> >>> Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    >> >>> Email: dtur...@islandco.com
    >> >>> International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    >> >>> Fax: 912 786 8505
    >> >>> Web:www.islandco.com
    >> >>>
    >> >>> =============================================
    >> >>
    >> >>For those who don't mind slumming it, both HP and Dell websites are
    >> >>quite happy to sell desktops with Windows XP support. Eg Dell Optiplex
    >> >>can still be bought with XP pre-installed for a small additional fee,
    >> >>and HP/Compaq dx-series desktops sold with Vista Business comes with
    >> >>XP Pro downgrade rights and support (Vista Business brings the
    >> >>downgrade rights, whether the box is supported with XP is decided by
    >> >>the box builder).
    >> >>
    >> >>And for those who don't mind a bit of DIY, Windows XP OEM licence
    >> >>+media should still be available (at least while stocks last) from the
    >> >>usual retail PCbuilder outlets.
    >> >>
    >> >>Vista still isn't mandatory yet, much to their disappointment.
    >> >
    >> > ...and this has "WHAT?" to do with VMS??? Why, abso-****ing-lutely nothing!
    >> >
    >> > Take it to comp.system.WEENDOZE.WANKERZ (aka. comp.system.WEENDOZE.advocacy)

    >>
    >> Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    >> of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    >> system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    >> box.

    >
    >
    > Talk about bull****! This statement is utter crap. All you need is a
    > terminal.


    Did you sleep thru the last two or three weeks here? We just went over
    this. Remember the thread about cut-and-paste for inputing PAKS? Hard
    to do on a terminal. Of copurse you CAN do it all on a terminal, but
    nobody in this day and age is likely to be willing to do that. It's
    another of them there reality-checks that seem to evade so many people
    here.

    > Though hyperterminal on a PC would do, it is the worst
    > possible choice.


    Yes, it is. :-)

    > What else would you need a PC for?


    Putty on a PC. :-)

    > (A Mac, Linux,
    > Unix,


    Stil requires another system running another OS, n'est-ce pas?

    > or another, all-ready running, VMS system would do as well or
    > better.)


    And that's the same original problem only recursive. :-)

    >
    >
    > Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough
    >> of the message to know if it was a good deal or not, but knowing Island,
    >> it probably was. Or are you just mad because they didn't offer Macs
    >> as well? It's time to accept that the days of VT100's are over and
    >> you really need something else just to install VMS. It might as well
    >> be a PC running Windows as anything else. And, yes, I have a PC with
    >> a bunch of serial ports on the back providing consoles to my PDP-11's.
    >> It is, however not running Windows or OSX. :-)
    >>

    >
    > It might asxx wellxxxx better be *anything* than a M$ PC.
    >
    > And you certainly don't need either a terminal nor a terminal emulator
    > if you have a graphics-capable VMS box plus KVM.


    Graphics don't work until after you enter the PAK. We just went
    all over that, too.

    bill

    --
    Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves
    billg999@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    University of Scranton |
    Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include

  8. Re: PC Systems for sale

    I AM SORRY - We have been selling a lot of these and I know the pricing is
    better than DELL AND without all the crap
    they load on them to get you to bite.

    I just know that XP Pro systems are getting harder to find and as you guys
    all tend to make decisions for the companies
    where you work I thought it was a good little deal.

    I am sure you all hate to admit it but methinks you are reading this message
    on an XP box. Or maybe MAC.
    If I am not mistaken, most desktop users are PC users connected in this case
    to a VMS Server?!?!



    --
    David B Turner

    =============================================

    Island Computers US Corp
    PO Box 86
    Tybee GA 31328

    Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    Email: dturner@islandco.com
    International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    Fax: 912 786 8505
    Web: www.islandco.com

    =============================================
    "Bill Gunshannon" wrote in message
    news:6lms8pFd34alU1@mid.individual.net...
    > In article ,
    > John Santos writes:
    >> In article <6lmq0dFd01o7U1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu
    >> says...
    >>> In article <00A81252.9ED4222D@sendspamhere.org>,
    >>> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:
    >>> > In article
    >>> > <22dc096d-6865-406e-bc77-8eaa2762cb6b@75g2000hso.googlegroups.com>,
    >>> > johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk writes:
    >>> >>On Oct 15, 3:33 pm, "David Turner, islandco.com"
    >>> >> wrote:
    >>> >>> Very quick
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> These have become very popular with our customers as we can still
    >>> >>> sell NEW
    >>> >>> XP Pro with these
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower
    >>> >>> ASUS Motherboard
    >>> >>> 2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2)
    >>> >>> 512MB Nvidia Graphics
    >>> >>> 250GB SATAII Disk
    >>> >>> CD/DVDRW-DL
    >>> >>> On Board Gigabit
    >>> >>> Windows XP Pro
    >>> >>> Keytronic Heavy Duty Keyboard and Mouse (Old IBM Style)
    >>> >>> No Monitor
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> Total Per System $820
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> Shipping within the US: $26
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> 3 Year Warranty
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> --
    >>> >>> David B Turner
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> =============================================
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> Island Computers US Corp
    >>> >>> PO Box 86
    >>> >>> Tybee GA 31328
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    >>> >>> Email: dtur...@islandco.com
    >>> >>> International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    >>> >>> Fax: 912 786 8505
    >>> >>> Web:www.islandco.com
    >>> >>>
    >>> >>> =============================================
    >>> >>
    >>> >>For those who don't mind slumming it, both HP and Dell websites are
    >>> >>quite happy to sell desktops with Windows XP support. Eg Dell Optiplex
    >>> >>can still be bought with XP pre-installed for a small additional fee,
    >>> >>and HP/Compaq dx-series desktops sold with Vista Business comes with
    >>> >>XP Pro downgrade rights and support (Vista Business brings the
    >>> >>downgrade rights, whether the box is supported with XP is decided by
    >>> >>the box builder).
    >>> >>
    >>> >>And for those who don't mind a bit of DIY, Windows XP OEM licence
    >>> >>+media should still be available (at least while stocks last) from the
    >>> >>usual retail PCbuilder outlets.
    >>> >>
    >>> >>Vista still isn't mandatory yet, much to their disappointment.
    >>> >
    >>> > ...and this has "WHAT?" to do with VMS??? Why, abso-****ing-lutely
    >>> > nothing!
    >>> >
    >>> > Take it to comp.system.WEENDOZE.WANKERZ (aka.
    >>> > comp.system.WEENDOZE.advocacy)
    >>>
    >>> Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    >>> of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    >>> system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    >>> box.

    >>
    >>
    >> Talk about bull****! This statement is utter crap. All you need is a
    >> terminal.

    >
    > Did you sleep thru the last two or three weeks here? We just went over
    > this. Remember the thread about cut-and-paste for inputing PAKS? Hard
    > to do on a terminal. Of copurse you CAN do it all on a terminal, but
    > nobody in this day and age is likely to be willing to do that. It's
    > another of them there reality-checks that seem to evade so many people
    > here.
    >
    >> Though hyperterminal on a PC would do, it is the worst
    >> possible choice.

    >
    > Yes, it is. :-)
    >
    >> What else would you need a PC for?

    >
    > Putty on a PC. :-)
    >
    >> (A Mac, Linux,
    >> Unix,

    >
    > Stil requires another system running another OS, n'est-ce pas?
    >
    >> or another, all-ready running, VMS system would do as well or
    >> better.)

    >
    > And that's the same original problem only recursive. :-)
    >
    >>
    >>
    >> Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough
    >>> of the message to know if it was a good deal or not, but knowing Island,
    >>> it probably was. Or are you just mad because they didn't offer Macs
    >>> as well? It's time to accept that the days of VT100's are over and
    >>> you really need something else just to install VMS. It might as well
    >>> be a PC running Windows as anything else. And, yes, I have a PC with
    >>> a bunch of serial ports on the back providing consoles to my PDP-11's.
    >>> It is, however not running Windows or OSX. :-)
    >>>

    >>
    >> It might asxx wellxxxx better be *anything* than a M$ PC.
    >>
    >> And you certainly don't need either a terminal nor a terminal emulator
    >> if you have a graphics-capable VMS box plus KVM.

    >
    > Graphics don't work until after you enter the PAK. We just went
    > all over that, too.
    >
    > bill
    >
    > --
    > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves
    > billg999@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    > University of Scranton |
    > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include




  9. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <6lms8pFd34alU1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu
    says...
    > In article ,
    > John Santos writes:
    > > In article <6lmq0dFd01o7U1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu
    > > says...
    > >> In article <00A81252.9ED4222D@sendspamhere.org>,
    > >> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:
    > >> > In article <22dc096d-6865-406e-bc77-8eaa2762cb6b@75g2000hso.googlegroups.com>, johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk writes:
    > >> >>On Oct 15, 3:33 pm, "David Turner, islandco.com"
    > >> >> wrote:
    > >> >>> Very quick
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> NEW Island Datastore P2Duo Syhstems
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> These have become very popular with our customers as we can still sell NEW
    > >> >>> XP Pro with these
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> Intel P2CoreDuo 3Ghz Minitower
    > >> >>> ASUS Motherboard
    > >> >>> 2GB Memory (2 x 1GB DDR2)
    > >> >>> 512MB Nvidia Graphics
    > >> >>> 250GB SATAII Disk
    > >> >>> CD/DVDRW-DL
    > >> >>> On Board Gigabit
    > >> >>> Windows XP Pro
    > >> >>> Keytronic Heavy Duty Keyboard and Mouse (Old IBM Style)
    > >> >>> No Monitor
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> Total Per System $820
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> Shipping within the US: $26
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> 3 Year Warranty
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> --
    > >> >>> David B Turner
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> =============================================
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> Island Computers US Corp
    > >> >>> PO Box 86
    > >> >>> Tybee GA 31328
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
    > >> >>> Email: dtur...@islandco.com
    > >> >>> International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
    > >> >>> Fax: 912 786 8505
    > >> >>> Web:www.islandco.com
    > >> >>>
    > >> >>> =============================================
    > >> >>
    > >> >>For those who don't mind slumming it, both HP and Dell websites are
    > >> >>quite happy to sell desktops with Windows XP support. Eg Dell Optiplex
    > >> >>can still be bought with XP pre-installed for a small additional fee,
    > >> >>and HP/Compaq dx-series desktops sold with Vista Business comes with
    > >> >>XP Pro downgrade rights and support (Vista Business brings the
    > >> >>downgrade rights, whether the box is supported with XP is decided by
    > >> >>the box builder).
    > >> >>
    > >> >>And for those who don't mind a bit of DIY, Windows XP OEM licence
    > >> >>+media should still be available (at least while stocks last) from the
    > >> >>usual retail PCbuilder outlets.
    > >> >>
    > >> >>Vista still isn't mandatory yet, much to their disappointment.
    > >> >
    > >> > ...and this has "WHAT?" to do with VMS??? Why, abso-****ing-lutely nothing!
    > >> >
    > >> > Take it to comp.system.WEENDOZE.WANKERZ (aka. comp.system.WEENDOZE.advocacy)
    > >>
    > >> Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    > >> of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    > >> system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    > >> box.

    > >
    > >
    > > Talk about bull****! This statement is utter crap. All you need is a
    > > terminal.

    >
    > Did you sleep thru the last two or three weeks here? We just went over


    It was something called "work." I don't know if you are familiar with
    it. It takes up a lot of time. On the other hand, it does pay well.

    The net result was a recapture by VMS (3 Itaniums) of an application at
    at a major telecommunications company that had previously migrated to
    Unix. :-) They are *very* *very* happy.

    > this. Remember the thread about cut-and-paste for inputing PAKS? Hard
    > to do on a terminal. Of copurse you CAN do it all on a terminal, but
    > nobody in this day and age is likely to be willing to do that. It's
    > another of them there reality-checks that seem to evade so many people
    > here.
    >


    All you need to enter 2 PAK's (VMS Base license (either VAX-VMS or
    OPENVMS-ALPHA) and TCPIP (UCX) and then you can email the rest of them
    to the VMS system, export the .com file from VMS mail, and execute it to
    get all the rest of the licenses. (I don't think you need the OPENVMS-
    ALPHA-USER PAK to run from the console.)

    > > Though hyperterminal on a PC would do, it is the worst
    > > possible choice.

    >
    > Yes, it is. :-)
    >
    > > What else would you need a PC for?

    >
    > Putty on a PC. :-)
    >
    > > (A Mac, Linux,
    > > Unix,

    >
    > Stil requires another system running another OS, n'est-ce pas?
    >
    > > or another, all-ready running, VMS system would do as well or
    > > better.)

    >
    > And that's the same original problem only recursive. :-)



    Or get a frigging terminal. They're easily obtainable on Ebay.

    A windows/linux box without a monitor, keyboard and mouse is
    equally crippled. Level playing field here.

    >
    > >
    > >
    > > Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough
    > >> of the message to know if it was a good deal or not, but knowing Island,
    > >> it probably was. Or are you just mad because they didn't offer Macs
    > >> as well? It's time to accept that the days of VT100's are over and
    > >> you really need something else just to install VMS. It might as well
    > >> be a PC running Windows as anything else. And, yes, I have a PC with
    > >> a bunch of serial ports on the back providing consoles to my PDP-11's.
    > >> It is, however not running Windows or OSX. :-)
    > >>

    > >
    > > It might asxx wellxxxx better be *anything* than a M$ PC.
    > >
    > > And you certainly don't need either a terminal nor a terminal emulator
    > > if you have a graphics-capable VMS box plus KVM.

    >
    > Graphics don't work until after you enter the PAK. We just went
    > all over that, too.
    >


    Okay, 1) you don't need DECwindows running to use the console in glass
    TTY mode, and 2) that's one more PAK, or 3. They aren't *that* hard to
    type in. Certainly a lot quicker and less work than downloading and
    installing the hundreds of patches required by a virgin M$ install and
    rebooting it about every third patch.

    > bill
    >
    >


    --
    John

  10. Re: PC Systems for sale

    John Santos wrote:

    > Talk about bull****! This statement is utter crap. All you need is a
    > terminal. Though hyperterminal on a PC would do, it is the worst
    > possible choice.


    Correct, Putty or (in my case) Reflection is much better.

    > What else would you need a PC for?


    Mail, web, word-processing, calculating, programming (not VMS,
    PIC microcontrollers), worktime reporting, invoicing my customers,
    image/picture manegement. Just about everyting else apart from
    mangaging the VMS servers. Including the VPN Citrix client
    tools to be able to access my clients sites at all.

    This "VMS-only" idea is making VMS more harm then anything else.

    Jan-Erik.

  11. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article , jan-
    erik.soderholm@telia.com says...
    > John Santos wrote:
    >
    > > Talk about bull****! This statement is utter crap. All you need is a
    > > terminal. Though hyperterminal on a PC would do, it is the worst
    > > possible choice.

    >
    > Correct, Putty or (in my case) Reflection is much better.
    >
    > > What else would you need a PC for?

    >
    > Mail, web, word-processing, calculating, programming (not VMS,
    > PIC microcontrollers), worktime reporting, invoicing my customers,
    > image/picture manegement. Just about everyting else apart from
    > mangaging the VMS servers. Including the VPN Citrix client
    > tools to be able to access my clients sites at all.
    >


    The statement was "A VMS system requires a PC (or other non-VMS
    computer) to install and operate it." None of those things are
    required to install or operate a VMS system (except maybe mail
    to download the PAKs, but then you don't need anything but VMS
    to use mail), and most of them can be done just fine on a VMS
    system. I do mail with Pine, web browsing with Mozilla (admittedly
    far from perfect), calculating, programming and worktime reporting
    on VMS. My company uses something else for invoicing, and I don't
    do much imaging for work, so it's irrelevent. VPN is done by the
    routers. (VMS is my primary DNS server, amongst many other
    functions.)

    BTW, if you are going to dispute a statement that something is
    incorrect, it would be very helpful *NOT* to snip the original
    disputed statement!

    > This "VMS-only" idea is making VMS more harm then anything else.
    >


    I'm not asserting the VMS-only is ideal or the only "worthy"
    situation. I'm disputing the claim that it is *never* possible.

    This is called the fallacy of the excluded middle.

    > Jan-Erik.
    >


    --
    John

  12. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <6lmq0dFd01o7U1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:
    >{...snip...}
    >
    >Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    >of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    >system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    >box. Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough


    That's bull**** and you know it. I have VAX, Alpha and Itanium boxes here
    and NO WEENDOZE. All three are happily humming along without some brain-
    damaged PoS from Micro$haft in the fold.



    >of the message to know if it was a good deal or not, but knowing Island,
    >it probably was. Or are you just mad because they didn't offer Macs
    >as well? It's time to accept that the days of VT100's are over and
    >you really need something else just to install VMS. It might as well
    >be a PC running Windows as anything else. And, yes, I have a PC with
    >a bunch of serial ports on the back providing consoles to my PDP-11's.
    >It is, however not running Windows or OSX. :-)


    My comment was directed towards John's follow-up and not at David's advert.

    --
    VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM

    .... pejorative statements of opinion are entitled to constitutional protection
    no matter how extreme, vituperous, or vigorously expressed they may be. (NJSC)

    Copr. 2008 Brian Schenkenberger. Publication of _this_ usenet article outside
    of usenet _must_ include its contents in its entirety including this copyright
    notice, disclaimer and quotations.

  13. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <_3rJk.46767$XT1.3622@bignews5.bellsouth.net>, "David Turner, islandco.com" writes:
    >I AM SORRY - We have been selling a lot of these and I know the pricing is
    >better than DELL AND without all the crap
    >they load on them to get you to bite.
    >
    >I just know that XP Pro systems are getting harder to find and as you guys
    >all tend to make decisions for the companies
    >where you work I thought it was a good little deal.
    >
    >I am sure you all hate to admit it but methinks you are reading this message
    >on an XP box. Or maybe MAC.
    >If I am not mistaken, most desktop users are PC users connected in this case
    >to a VMS Server?!?!


    Newsrdr and VMS! Weendoze: never had it; never will!

    David, my reply was direct at the follow-up and not at your advert. If
    there was a *guarantee* that NO BILLY-TAX would be paid for the item you
    advertised -- perhaps, even a discount without that commercial virus col-
    lector product installed -- I might buy one.

    --
    VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM

    .... pejorative statements of opinion are entitled to constitutional protection
    no matter how extreme, vituperous, or vigorously expressed they may be. (NJSC)

    Copr. 2008 Brian Schenkenberger. Publication of _this_ usenet article outside
    of usenet _must_ include its contents in its entirety including this copyright
    notice, disclaimer and quotations.

  14. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article , =?ISO-8859-15?Q?Jan-Erik_S=F6derholm?= writes:
    >John Santos wrote:
    >
    >> Talk about bull****! This statement is utter crap. All you need is a
    >> terminal. Though hyperterminal on a PC would do, it is the worst
    >> possible choice.

    >
    >Correct, Putty or (in my case) Reflection is much better.
    >
    >> What else would you need a PC for?

    >
    >Mail,


    Mail is available on my OS X Mac or there is Evolution Mail on my Ubuntu
    Linux. I still read most mail on VMS and only forward crap which has an
    attachment to one of the aformentioned.


    > web,


    Safari on my OS X Mac and Firefox on the Ununtu Linux.


    >word-processing,


    Pages on my OS X Mac and OpenOffice Word Processor on my Ubuntu Linux.


    >calculating,


    Calulators on my OS X Mac amd on my Ubuntu Linux.
    Numbers on my OS X Mac and OpenOffice Spreadsheet on my Ubuntu Linux.
    I've never in my life had to create a spreadsheet.


    > programming (not VMS,


    My only other programming is web stuff which I can do on VMS, OSX or
    Ubuntu.


    >PIC microcontrollers), worktime reporting, invoicing my customers,


    Invoicing... QuickBooks on Mac OS X.


    >image/picture manegement. Just about everyting else apart from


    There's only one app for that. As a photographer, I use Aperture.


    >mangaging the VMS servers. Including the VPN Citrix client
    >tools to be able to access my clients sites at all.
    >
    >This "VMS-only" idea is making VMS more harm then anything else.


    Who said VMS-only? Stop pushing the WEENDOZE only ****.

    --
    VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM

    .... pejorative statements of opinion are entitled to constitutional protection
    no matter how extreme, vituperous, or vigorously expressed they may be. (NJSC)

    Copr. 2008 Brian Schenkenberger. Publication of _this_ usenet article outside
    of usenet _must_ include its contents in its entirety including this copyright
    notice, disclaimer and quotations.

  15. Re: PC Systems for sale

    On Oct 15, 9:57 pm, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
    > In article <6lmq0dFd01o...@mid.individual.net>, billg...@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:
    > >{...snip...}

    >
    > >Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    > >of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    > >system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    > >box. Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough

    >
    > That's bull**** and you know it. I have VAX, Alpha and Itanium boxes here
    > and NO WEENDOZE. All three are happily humming along without some brain-
    > damaged PoS from Micro$haft in the fold.
    >
    > >of the message to know if it was a good deal or not, but knowing Island,
    > >it probably was. Or are you just mad because they didn't offer Macs
    > >as well? It's time to accept that the days of VT100's are over and
    > >you really need something else just to install VMS. It might as well
    > >be a PC running Windows as anything else. And, yes, I have a PC with
    > >a bunch of serial ports on the back providing consoles to my PDP-11's.
    > >It is, however not running Windows or OSX. :-)

    >
    > My comment was directed towards John's follow-up and not at David's advert.
    >
    > --
    > VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM
    >
    > ... pejorative statements of opinion are entitled to constitutional protection
    > no matter how extreme, vituperous, or vigorously expressed they may be. (NJSC)
    >
    > Copr. 2008 Brian Schenkenberger. Publication of _this_ usenet article outside
    > of usenet _must_ include its contents in its entirety including this copyright
    > notice, disclaimer and quotations.


    "I have VAX, Alpha and Itanium boxes here and NO WEENDOZE. "

    Good for you. Unfortunately, you're not yet typical of the IT
    community at large, where Windows is often still considered acceptable
    (sometimes it's The One True Way, sometimes it's tolerated as a
    necessary evil).

    Perhaps you'd rather I'd stayed quiet and that readers in mixed VMS/
    Windows environments continued living with the MS-sourced but widely
    spread deception that Vista was now the only Windows OS readily
    available on volume commercial x86 boxes?

    Personally, I'd prefer that those readers here who are stuck with
    Windows boxes were able to make a fully informed decision before
    buying new ones. Those whose IT/x86 suppliers are toeing the MS lie/
    line ("it's Vista; there is no alternative") will not be able to make
    a fully informed decision unless they know from other sources that XP
    is still readily available for now. Island are one possible supplier
    of Windows boxes without Vista but for various reasons Island's deal
    may not be appropriate for everyone.

  16. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <00A8126F.8C11E173@sendspamhere.org>,
    VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:
    > In article <6lmq0dFd01o7U1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:
    >>{...snip...}
    >>
    >>Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    >>of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    >>system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    >>box. Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough

    >
    > That's bull**** and you know it. I have VAX, Alpha and Itanium boxes here
    > and NO WEENDOZE. All three are happily humming along without some brain-
    > damaged PoS from Micro$haft in the fold.


    Still, not just VMS, is it? So, you think Windows is a piece of ****
    and I think Macs are.

    bill

    --
    Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves
    billg999@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    University of Scranton |
    Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include

  17. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <8c7985cf-03c9-4b8d-a09f-4ebd76928a14@2g2000hsn.googlegroups.com>, johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk writes:
    >On Oct 15, 9:57 pm, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
    >> In article <6lmq0dFd01o...@mid.individual.net>, billg...@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:
    >> >{...snip...}

    >>
    >> >Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    >> >of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    >> >system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    >> >box. Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough

    >>
    >> That's bull**** and you know it. I have VAX, Alpha and Itanium boxes here
    >> and NO WEENDOZE. All three are happily humming along without some brain-
    >> damaged PoS from Micro$haft in the fold.
    >>
    >> >of the message to know if it was a good deal or not, but knowing Island,
    >> >it probably was. Or are you just mad because they didn't offer Macs
    >> >as well? It's time to accept that the days of VT100's are over and
    >> >you really need something else just to install VMS. It might as well
    >> >be a PC running Windows as anything else. And, yes, I have a PC with
    >> >a bunch of serial ports on the back providing consoles to my PDP-11's.
    >> >It is, however not running Windows or OSX. :-)

    >>
    >> My comment was directed towards John's follow-up and not at David's advert.
    >>
    >> --
    >> VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM
    >>
    >> ... pejorative statements of opinion are entitled to constitutional protection
    >> no matter how extreme, vituperous, or vigorously expressed they may be. (NJSC)
    >>
    >> Copr. 2008 Brian Schenkenberger. Publication of _this_ usenet article outside
    >> of usenet _must_ include its contents in its entirety including this copyright
    >> notice, disclaimer and quotations.

    >
    >"I have VAX, Alpha and Itanium boxes here and NO WEENDOZE. "
    >
    >Good for you. Unfortunately, you're not yet typical of the IT
    >community at large, where Windows is often still considered acceptable
    >(sometimes it's The One True Way, sometimes it's tolerated as a
    >necessary evil).
    >
    >Perhaps you'd rather I'd stayed quiet and that readers in mixed VMS/
    >Windows environments continued living with the MS-sourced but widely
    >spread deception that Vista was now the only Windows OS readily
    >available on volume commercial x86 boxes?
    >
    >Personally, I'd prefer that those readers here who are stuck with
    >Windows boxes were able to make a fully informed decision before
    >buying new ones. Those whose IT/x86 suppliers are toeing the MS lie/
    >line ("it's Vista; there is no alternative") will not be able to make
    >a fully informed decision unless they know from other sources that XP
    >is still readily available for now. Island are one possible supplier
    >of Windows boxes without Vista but for various reasons Island's deal
    >may not be appropriate for everyone.


    Then let them go read comp.system.WEENDOZE.WANKERZ. We're all quite aware
    of the shortcomings of Visual Interface Similar To Apple's. I don't think
    we need a perpetual billboarding of Billzebub's inferior warez here.


    --
    VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM

    .... pejorative statements of opinion are entitled to constitutional protection
    no matter how extreme, vituperous, or vigorously expressed they may be. (NJSC)

    Copr. 2008 Brian Schenkenberger. Publication of _this_ usenet article outside
    of usenet _must_ include its contents in its entirety including this copyright
    notice, disclaimer and quotations.

  18. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <6lnf6pFdb8tdU1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:
    >In article <00A8126F.8C11E173@sendspamhere.org>,
    > VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:
    >> In article <6lmq0dFd01o7U1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:
    >>>{...snip...}
    >>>
    >>>Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    >>>of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    >>>system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    >>>box. Not being int he market for yet another PC I didn't read enough

    >>
    >> That's bull**** and you know it. I have VAX, Alpha and Itanium boxes here
    >> and NO WEENDOZE. All three are happily humming along without some brain-
    >> damaged PoS from Micro$haft in the fold.

    >
    >Still, not just VMS, is it? So, you think Windows is a piece of ****
    >and I think Macs are.


    ....and here, all this time, I thought you liked unix.

    --
    VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM

    .... pejorative statements of opinion are entitled to constitutional protection
    no matter how extreme, vituperous, or vigorously expressed they may be. (NJSC)

    Copr. 2008 Brian Schenkenberger. Publication of _this_ usenet article outside
    of usenet _must_ include its contents in its entirety including this copyright
    notice, disclaimer and quotations.

  19. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article , =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jan-Erik_S=F6derholm?= writes:
    >
    > A nice table-top front-end to your VMS servers, of course ! :-)


    VMS itself makes a better table-top front end. 8-)


  20. Re: PC Systems for sale

    In article <6lmq0dFd01o7U1@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:
    >
    > Oh bull****. We just went thru this whole discussion with numerous
    > of the VMS faithful openly admiting that you need another non-VMS
    > system in order to even bring up something as simple as a hobbyist
    > box.


    No, we didn't. We did cite examples where it would avoid typing
    in one or two PAKs. BFD.


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