Python on VMS status ? - VMS

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  1. Python on VMS status ?

    What is the current status of Python on VMS ?

    Is the existing port considered to be robust and production ready ?

    Are there any plans for HP to do a Perl/PHP style official port ?

    Thanks,

    Simon.

    --
    Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
    Microsoft: Bringing you 1980's technology to a 21st century world

  2. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    On 30 May, 18:33, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon
    Clubley) wrote:
    > What is the current status of Python on VMS ?
    >
    > Is the existing port considered to be robust and production ready ?


    I didn't know there was a python port? Got any good URLs?

    >
    > Are there any plans for HP to do a Perl/PHP style official port ?


    I don't know of any official perl but we have perl on our VMS system.
    Not sure how it got there....

    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > Simon.
    >
    > --
    > Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
    > Microsoft: Bringing you 1980's technology to a 21st century world



  3. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    On Fri, 30 May 2008 12:08:49 -0700, wrote:

    > I didn't know there was a python port? Got any good URLs?


    The Python RTE has received a significant update - WSGI.

    In a nut-shell, WSGI attempts to standardise the API for, and interactions
    with a Web-server, of a Web application written using Python - the Python
    Web Server Gateway Interface v1.0, as described in PEP 333

    http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0333/

    The WSGI code has been developed under the sponsorship of SysGroup

    http://www.sysgroup.fr/

    and generously been made available to the wider WASD community.

    The kit may be found on the WASD download page

    http://wasd.vsm.com.au/wasd/

    and the new PyRTE source directory at

    http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ht_root/src/python/

    Jean-François Piéronne will follow-up this email with news of Python on
    VMS, further Python/Web applications, and developments based on the WSGI
    model.

    Regards, Mark.

    --
    PL/I for OpenVMS
    www.kednos.com

  4. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    marlow.andrew@googlemail.com wrote:
    > On 30 May, 18:33, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon
    > Clubley) wrote:
    >> What is the current status of Python on VMS ?
    >>
    >> Is the existing port considered to be robust and production ready ?

    >
    > I didn't know there was a python port? Got any good URLs?


    http://vmspython.dyndns.org/

    I uses the two LD-disks. Just to download and mount as LDA
    drives. They are pre-installed and rady to run. Works
    like a charm, inkl the Rdb interface and a lot of VMS
    specific system functions.

    Jan-Erik.


  5. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    It's always flattering to find yourself quoted :-) but this one would be
    better in context. Jean-François Piéronne is the energetic 'team' that
    provided and maintains the port of Python for VMS (amongst other
    things). His Python-for-VMS site is

    http://vmspython.dyndns.org/

    a Python based wiki made available via a WASD

    http://wasd.vsm.com.au/

    enabled Web site running on VMS. WASD has an efficient, persistent
    environment for hosting Python web applications. What Tom has posted
    here is an announcement made on the info-WASD mailing list about recent
    enhancements to that environment. Not purely about VMS Python :-)

    Tom Linden wrote:
    > On Fri, 30 May 2008 12:08:49 -0700, wrote:
    >
    >> I didn't know there was a python port? Got any good URLs?

    >
    >
    > The Python RTE has received a significant update - WSGI.
    >
    > In a nut-shell, WSGI attempts to standardise the API for, and
    > interactions with a Web-server, of a Web application written using
    > Python - the Python Web Server Gateway Interface v1.0, as described in
    > PEP 333
    >
    > http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0333/
    >
    > The WSGI code has been developed under the sponsorship of SysGroup
    >
    > http://www.sysgroup.fr/
    >
    > and generously been made available to the wider WASD community.
    >
    > The kit may be found on the WASD download page
    >
    > http://wasd.vsm.com.au/wasd/
    >
    > and the new PyRTE source directory at
    >
    > http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ht_root/src/python/
    >
    > Jean-François Piéronne will follow-up this email with news of Python on
    > VMS, further Python/Web applications, and developments based on the
    > WSGI model.
    >
    > Regards, Mark.


    --
    There may be fairies at the bottom of the garden. There is no evidence
    for it, but you can't prove that there aren't any, so shouldn't we be
    agnostic with respect to fairies?
    [Richard Dawkins; from The Nullifidian (Dec 94)]

  6. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    In article , clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) writes:
    > What is the current status of Python on VMS ?
    >
    > Is the existing port considered to be robust and production ready ?
    >
    > Are there any plans for HP to do a Perl/PHP style official port ?


    I've never had any problems with the Python on VMS that I grabbed
    a few months ago.


  7. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    Bob Koehler wrote:
    > In article , clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) writes:
    >> What is the current status of Python on VMS ?
    >>
    >> Is the existing port considered to be robust and production ready ?
    >>
    >> Are there any plans for HP to do a Perl/PHP style official port ?

    >
    > I've never had any problems with the Python on VMS that I grabbed
    > a few months ago.
    >


    Is there a mod_python for CSWS (Apache) readily available? I'm
    interested in trying out the Python stuff JFP has done, but I'm using
    Apache. I'd rather find a mod_python than learn a new web server.

  8. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:
    > In article , clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) writes:
    >> What is the current status of Python on VMS ?
    >>
    >> Is the existing port considered to be robust and production ready ?
    >>
    >> Are there any plans for HP to do a Perl/PHP style official port ?

    >
    > I've never had any problems with the Python on VMS that I grabbed
    > a few months ago.


    Thanks for the feedback everyone.

    It makes me more comfortable installing it on a production system knowing
    that others are using it ok.

    Simon.

    --
    Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
    Microsoft: Bringing you 1980's technology to a 21st century world

  9. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    Marty Kuhrt wrote:
    > Bob Koehler wrote:
    >> In article ,
    >> clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) writes:
    >>> What is the current status of Python on VMS ?
    >>>
    >>> Is the existing port considered to be robust and production ready ?
    >>>
    >>> Are there any plans for HP to do a Perl/PHP style official port ?

    >>
    >> I've never had any problems with the Python on VMS that I grabbed
    >> a few months ago.
    >>

    >
    > Is there a mod_python for CSWS (Apache) readily available? I'm
    > interested in trying out the Python stuff JFP has done, but I'm using
    > Apache. I'd rather find a mod_python than learn a new web server.


    I remember that years ago, someone has tried to build mod_python.
    But Python set numbers of crtl features and some of these features break
    CSWS. After this I have add the ability to control these features
    settings using some specific Python logical names, but doing this will
    probably break some python tools (for example I suspect that Mercurial
    or Django won't work correctly). May be latest version of CSWS doesn't
    have this problem, I don't know.
    You can try to build mod_python or better mod_wsgi, I expect that it
    will be not very difficult.
    Or you can use the Python embedded web server using mod_proxy. But a
    WASD solution has many advantages.
    I know sites which run, successfully, WASD/Python on production system
    for years.

    A few interesting articles about WASD (not related to Python):
    http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ht_root/other..._the_load.html
    http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ht_root/other..._the_load.html
    http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ht_root/other/uma_2tb.html
    http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ht_root/doc/htd/htd_2100.html


    JFP

  10. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    In article <484822e9$0$7210$426a34cc@news.free.fr>, =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jean-Fran=E7ois_Pi=E9ronne?= writes:
    >Marty Kuhrt wrote:
    >> Bob Koehler wrote:
    >>> In article ,
    >>> clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) writes:
    >>>> What is the current status of Python on VMS ?
    >>>>
    >>>> Is the existing port considered to be robust and production ready ?
    >>>>
    >>>> Are there any plans for HP to do a Perl/PHP style official port ?
    >>>
    >>> I've never had any problems with the Python on VMS that I grabbed
    >>> a few months ago.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Is there a mod_python for CSWS (Apache) readily available? I'm
    >> interested in trying out the Python stuff JFP has done, but I'm using
    >> Apache. I'd rather find a mod_python than learn a new web server.

    >
    >I remember that years ago, someone has tried to build mod_python.
    >But Python set numbers of crtl features and some of these features break
    >CSWS. After this I have add the ability to control these features
    >settings using some specific Python logical names, but doing this will
    >probably break some python tools (for example I suspect that Mercurial
    >or Django won't work correctly). May be latest version of CSWS doesn't
    >have this problem, I don't know.
    >You can try to build mod_python or better mod_wsgi, I expect that it
    >will be not very difficult.
    >Or you can use the Python embedded web server using mod_proxy. But a
    >WASD solution has many advantages.
    >I know sites which run, successfully, WASD/Python on production system
    >for years.


    But if you're committed to Apache and just want to run Python scripts,
    you can wrap them in .COM files and put them in CGI-BIN, or you can access
    them via MOD_OSU and copy the code in the DECnet object which invokes perl
    for perl scripts and invoke python for .py scripts.

    That obviously won't give you the highest possible performance - in general,
    WASD is the way to go for highest performance as a VMS webserver - but it
    cleanly separates the Python and Apache execution environments, lets you set
    whatever CRTL things you need for Python, and lets you test your Python
    programs from the command line, which is handy.

    -- Alan


  11. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:
    [snip]
    >
    > But if you're committed to Apache and just want to run Python scripts,
    > you can wrap them in .COM files and put them in CGI-BIN, or you can access
    > them via MOD_OSU and copy the code in the DECnet object which invokes perl
    > for perl scripts and invoke python for .py scripts.
    >


    That correct, another option is to use mod_fastcgi, if it is available
    on VMS, this will, probably, work with all Python application supporting
    wsgi.



    [snip]

    JFP

  12. Re: Python on VMS status ?

    Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:
    > In article <484822e9$0$7210$426a34cc@news.free.fr>, =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jean-Fran=E7ois_Pi=E9ronne?= writes:
    >
    >>Marty Kuhrt wrote:
    >>
    >>>Bob Koehler wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>In article ,
    >>>>clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) writes:
    >>>>
    >>>>>What is the current status of Python on VMS ?
    >>>>>
    >>>>>Is the existing port considered to be robust and production ready ?
    >>>>>
    >>>>>Are there any plans for HP to do a Perl/PHP style official port ?
    >>>>
    >>>> I've never had any problems with the Python on VMS that I grabbed
    >>>> a few months ago.
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>Is there a mod_python for CSWS (Apache) readily available? I'm
    >>>interested in trying out the Python stuff JFP has done, but I'm using
    >>>Apache. I'd rather find a mod_python than learn a new web server.

    >>
    >>I remember that years ago, someone has tried to build mod_python.
    >>But Python set numbers of crtl features and some of these features break
    >>CSWS. After this I have add the ability to control these features
    >>settings using some specific Python logical names, but doing this will
    >>probably break some python tools (for example I suspect that Mercurial
    >>or Django won't work correctly). May be latest version of CSWS doesn't
    >>have this problem, I don't know.
    >>You can try to build mod_python or better mod_wsgi, I expect that it
    >>will be not very difficult.
    >>Or you can use the Python embedded web server using mod_proxy. But a
    >>WASD solution has many advantages.
    >>I know sites which run, successfully, WASD/Python on production system
    >>for years.

    >
    >
    > But if you're committed to Apache and just want to run Python scripts,
    > you can wrap them in .COM files and put them in CGI-BIN, or you can access
    > them via MOD_OSU and copy the code in the DECnet object which invokes perl
    > for perl scripts and invoke python for .py scripts.


    This could only be for experimental or casual purposes for at least a
    couple of reasons. 1) The VMS Apache CGI implementation is notoriously
    latent and resource intensive as to make it unusable for anything but
    casual access (using mod_osu would probably circumvent this, I haven't
    experimented). 2) The Python engine itself is expensive to instantiate
    (again latency and resources).

    > That obviously won't give you the highest possible performance - in general,
    > WASD is the way to go for highest performance as a VMS webserver - but it
    > cleanly separates the Python and Apache execution environments, lets you set
    > whatever CRTL things you need for Python, and lets you test your Python
    > programs from the command line, which is handy.


    Web server skirmishes aside; most interpreted web environments intended
    for non-trivial usage require a persistent engine. Hence much of the
    rationale for the mod_perl, mod_php, mod_wsgi, etc., of this world.
    More so for VMS. Most non-trivial web applications are themselves
    expensive and latent to load and initialise. For (at least) these
    reasons the Python developers and Python web application designers
    appear to go to some trouble to make an application equally capable of
    persistence.

    > -- Alan


    --
    The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple
    unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.
    [Richard Dawkins; The Selfish Gene]

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