Running a news server on OpenVMS - VMS

This is a discussion on Running a news server on OpenVMS - VMS ; Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote: > In article , Jim Mehlhop > writes: >> I'd like to know how to set up my VMS box as a news server. I am >> running Multinet 5.1 and OpenVMS8.2 Alpha on a PWS500au ...

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Thread: Running a news server on OpenVMS

  1. Re: Running a news server on OpenVMS

    Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:
    > In article <4537e741$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, Jim Mehlhop
    > writes:
    >> I'd like to know how to set up my VMS box as a news server. I am
    >> running Multinet 5.1 and OpenVMS8.2 Alpha on a PWS500au with 640 meg
    >> and about 60 GB of free disk space. I could probably dedicate an
    >> 18GB disk for this.

    >
    > Problem is that there is no current news server software for OpenVMS.


    Now there would be a project for someone - port INN over to OpenVMS.

    >
    > There used to be DNEWS from NETWINSITE (which I still use at home)
    > and ANUNEWS freeware. Both have been discontinued many years ago, but
    > still might work (I don't know if I could reinstall DNEWS if I need to
    > but it still runs on my V8.2 - and I still have problems - like
    > premature
    > expiration of posts - which won't get fixed anymore - but I can't
    > blame
    > them, they got me my licenses for free! Thanks again, folks).
    >
    > If you have more than one disk, run VOLSHAD every time!
    >
    > If you want to run a news server, think how many groups you want to
    > run
    > and if they are binary (Binary groups are umpteen GB a day, so a 18GB
    > will
    > last a couple of minutes/hours). Make your the disk is not a IDE
    > disk, but
    > SCSI. IDE disks are only for storing the data (not for using the data
    > then).
    > Both my new 160GB IDE disks (with an ACARD USCSI Converter on my
    > PWS433au)
    > died within days after being used by the newsserver (I got a warranty
    > replacement for both of them).


    I run the news server for our company on *nix, which is a full text feed
    with a couple of binary hierarchies, and it averages about 40 GB inbound and
    40GB outbound of traffic. A couple of my text-only peers are averaging
    anywhere between 500-1000 MB per day, with tens of thousands of articles.

    With that being said not only do you need a big internet link, you need
    disks that can handle a lot of I/O. (like a HSG80 at minimum with RAID 0 or
    0+1) AFAIK, the older versions of DNEWS do not have any other storage
    mechanisms than a "traditional" spool - which is every article is stored in
    a separate file, and I don't think VMS deals well with I/O of that
    magnitude. There are other methods that try and deal with the huge volume of
    usenet. INN has what is called CNFS (Cyclical News File System) that stores
    articles into large buffers rather than separate files. I do not know about
    ANUNEWS. For a full feed, some sort of buffered storage mechanism is a *must
    have* for a full feed.

    I don't know what your intentions are for your newsfeed (full feed,
    text-only) and for readership on your server (do you plan on being relay
    only or having readers on the same machine?) But if you plan on going with a
    full feed, you are looking at 250-300 GB per day of data.



  2. Re: Running a news server on OpenVMS

    Schroeder, AJ wrote:

    > Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:
    >
    >>In article <4537e741$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, Jim Mehlhop
    >> writes:
    >>
    >>>I'd like to know how to set up my VMS box as a news server. I am
    >>>running Multinet 5.1 and OpenVMS8.2 Alpha on a PWS500au with 640 meg
    >>> and about 60 GB of free disk space. I could probably dedicate an
    >>>18GB disk for this.

    >>
    >>Problem is that there is no current news server software for OpenVMS.

    >
    >
    > Now there would be a project for someone - port INN over to OpenVMS.
    >
    >
    >>There used to be DNEWS from NETWINSITE (which I still use at home)
    >>and ANUNEWS freeware. Both have been discontinued many years ago, but
    >>still might work (I don't know if I could reinstall DNEWS if I need to
    >>but it still runs on my V8.2 - and I still have problems - like
    >>premature
    >>expiration of posts - which won't get fixed anymore - but I can't
    >>blame
    >>them, they got me my licenses for free! Thanks again, folks).
    >>
    >>If you have more than one disk, run VOLSHAD every time!
    >>
    >>If you want to run a news server, think how many groups you want to
    >>run
    >>and if they are binary (Binary groups are umpteen GB a day, so a 18GB
    >>will
    >>last a couple of minutes/hours). Make your the disk is not a IDE
    >>disk, but
    >>SCSI. IDE disks are only for storing the data (not for using the data
    >>then).
    >>Both my new 160GB IDE disks (with an ACARD USCSI Converter on my
    >>PWS433au)
    >>died within days after being used by the newsserver (I got a warranty
    >>replacement for both of them).

    >
    >
    > I run the news server for our company on *nix, which is a full text feed
    > with a couple of binary hierarchies, and it averages about 40 GB inbound and
    > 40GB outbound of traffic. A couple of my text-only peers are averaging
    > anywhere between 500-1000 MB per day, with tens of thousands of articles.
    >
    > With that being said not only do you need a big internet link, you need
    > disks that can handle a lot of I/O. (like a HSG80 at minimum with RAID 0 or
    > 0+1) AFAIK, the older versions of DNEWS do not have any other storage
    > mechanisms than a "traditional" spool - which is every article is stored in
    > a separate file, and I don't think VMS deals well with I/O of that
    > magnitude. There are other methods that try and deal with the huge volume of
    > usenet. INN has what is called CNFS (Cyclical News File System) that stores
    > articles into large buffers rather than separate files. I do not know about
    > ANUNEWS. For a full feed, some sort of buffered storage mechanism is a *must
    > have* for a full feed.
    >
    > I don't know what your intentions are for your newsfeed (full feed,
    > text-only) and for readership on your server (do you plan on being relay
    > only or having readers on the same machine?) But if you plan on going with a
    > full feed, you are looking at 250-300 GB per day of data.



    was looking to feed COV and the networking newsgroups so not a lot of
    bandwidth. :-)


    >
    >


  3. Re: Running a news server on OpenVMS

    In article <4537e741$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, Jim Mehlhop writes:
    > I'd like to know how to set up my VMS box as a news server. I am
    > running Multinet 5.1 and OpenVMS8.2 Alpha on a PWS500au with 640 meg and
    > about 60 GB of free disk space. I could probably dedicate an 18GB
    > disk for this.
    >
    > Is there any documentation for this?
    >
    >
    > Jim


    I used ANUNEWS in the past (up to about 7-8 years ago). The problem was that
    VMS couldn't hold the load of creating and deleting a lot of small files (each
    item was a separate file). I finally moved it to a Linux server with Inn.

    Nothing is perfect...
    __Yehavi:

  4. Re: Running a news server on OpenVMS

    "Yehavi Bourvine (58-4279)" wrote:
    > I used ANUNEWS in the past (up to about 7-8 years ago). The problem was that
    > VMS couldn't hold the load of creating and deleting a lot of small files (each
    > item was a separate file). I finally moved it to a Linux server with Inn.


    With the supposedly improved caching/file system in version 8.*, has
    this made a big difference in performance for file create/delete when
    there is a large directory ?

  5. Re: Running a news server on OpenVMS

    Jim Mehlhop wrote:
    > Thanks Ruslan,
    >
    > I saw some datatrieve in there and Pthreads so I assume performance and
    > disk fragmentation is not as bad as everyone is telling me about ANU (
    > Which I couldn't find anymore at the old web site anyway).

    ANU have not support ACL, also it's keep article in separated files...



    >
    >
    >
    > Ruslan R. Laishev wrote:
    >
    >> Hello, Jim!
    >>
    >> I running for the past 10 years this NNTP server:
    >>
    >> http://starlet.deltatel.ru/~laishev/nntp/
    >>
    >>
    >> Jim Mehlhop wrote:
    >>
    >>> I'd like to know how to set up my VMS box as a news server. I am
    >>> running Multinet 5.1 and OpenVMS8.2 Alpha on a PWS500au with 640 meg
    >>> and about 60 GB of free disk space. I could probably dedicate an
    >>> 18GB disk for this.
    >>>
    >>> Is there any documentation for this?
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> Jim
    >>>

    >>

    >



    --
    Cheers, Ruslan.
    +---------------------pure personal opinion------------------------+
    RADIUS Server for OpenVMS -> www.starlet.spb.ru/~laishev/
    ICQ: 319518233, Skype: SysMan-One, Mobile: +7 (812) 716-3222

  6. Re: Running a news server on OpenVMS

    Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:
    > In article <4537e741$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, Jim Mehlhop
    > writes:
    >> I'd like to know how to set up my VMS box as a news server. I am
    >> running Multinet 5.1 and OpenVMS8.2 Alpha on a PWS500au with 640 meg
    >> and about 60 GB of free disk space. I could probably dedicate an
    >> 18GB disk for this.

    >
    > Problem is that there is no current news server software for OpenVMS.


    Now there would be a project for someone - port INN over to OpenVMS.

    >
    > There used to be DNEWS from NETWINSITE (which I still use at home)
    > and ANUNEWS freeware. Both have been discontinued many years ago, but
    > still might work (I don't know if I could reinstall DNEWS if I need to
    > but it still runs on my V8.2 - and I still have problems - like
    > premature
    > expiration of posts - which won't get fixed anymore - but I can't
    > blame
    > them, they got me my licenses for free! Thanks again, folks).
    >
    > If you have more than one disk, run VOLSHAD every time!
    >
    > If you want to run a news server, think how many groups you want to
    > run
    > and if they are binary (Binary groups are umpteen GB a day, so a 18GB
    > will
    > last a couple of minutes/hours). Make your the disk is not a IDE
    > disk, but
    > SCSI. IDE disks are only for storing the data (not for using the data
    > then).
    > Both my new 160GB IDE disks (with an ACARD USCSI Converter on my
    > PWS433au)
    > died within days after being used by the newsserver (I got a warranty
    > replacement for both of them).


    I run the news server for our company on *nix, which is a full text feed
    with a couple of binary hierarchies, and it averages about 40 GB inbound and
    40GB outbound of traffic. A couple of my text-only peers are averaging
    anywhere between 500-1000 MB per day, with tens of thousands of articles.

    With that being said not only do you need a big internet link, you need
    disks that can handle a lot of I/O. (like a HSG80 at minimum with RAID 0 or
    0+1) AFAIK, the older versions of DNEWS do not have any other storage
    mechanisms than a "traditional" spool - which is every article is stored in
    a separate file, and I don't think VMS deals well with I/O of that
    magnitude. There are other methods that try and deal with the huge volume of
    usenet. INN has what is called CNFS (Cyclical News File System) that stores
    articles into large buffers rather than separate files. I do not know about
    ANUNEWS. For a full feed, some sort of buffered storage mechanism is a *must
    have* for a full feed.

    I don't know what your intentions are for your newsfeed (full feed,
    text-only) and for readership on your server (do you plan on being relay
    only or having readers on the same machine?) But if you plan on going with a
    full feed, you are looking at 250-300 GB per day of data.



  7. Re: Running a news server on OpenVMS

    Schroeder, AJ wrote:

    > Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:
    >
    >>In article <4537e741$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, Jim Mehlhop
    >> writes:
    >>
    >>>I'd like to know how to set up my VMS box as a news server. I am
    >>>running Multinet 5.1 and OpenVMS8.2 Alpha on a PWS500au with 640 meg
    >>> and about 60 GB of free disk space. I could probably dedicate an
    >>>18GB disk for this.

    >>
    >>Problem is that there is no current news server software for OpenVMS.

    >
    >
    > Now there would be a project for someone - port INN over to OpenVMS.
    >
    >
    >>There used to be DNEWS from NETWINSITE (which I still use at home)
    >>and ANUNEWS freeware. Both have been discontinued many years ago, but
    >>still might work (I don't know if I could reinstall DNEWS if I need to
    >>but it still runs on my V8.2 - and I still have problems - like
    >>premature
    >>expiration of posts - which won't get fixed anymore - but I can't
    >>blame
    >>them, they got me my licenses for free! Thanks again, folks).
    >>
    >>If you have more than one disk, run VOLSHAD every time!
    >>
    >>If you want to run a news server, think how many groups you want to
    >>run
    >>and if they are binary (Binary groups are umpteen GB a day, so a 18GB
    >>will
    >>last a couple of minutes/hours). Make your the disk is not a IDE
    >>disk, but
    >>SCSI. IDE disks are only for storing the data (not for using the data
    >>then).
    >>Both my new 160GB IDE disks (with an ACARD USCSI Converter on my
    >>PWS433au)
    >>died within days after being used by the newsserver (I got a warranty
    >>replacement for both of them).

    >
    >
    > I run the news server for our company on *nix, which is a full text feed
    > with a couple of binary hierarchies, and it averages about 40 GB inbound and
    > 40GB outbound of traffic. A couple of my text-only peers are averaging
    > anywhere between 500-1000 MB per day, with tens of thousands of articles.
    >
    > With that being said not only do you need a big internet link, you need
    > disks that can handle a lot of I/O. (like a HSG80 at minimum with RAID 0 or
    > 0+1) AFAIK, the older versions of DNEWS do not have any other storage
    > mechanisms than a "traditional" spool - which is every article is stored in
    > a separate file, and I don't think VMS deals well with I/O of that
    > magnitude. There are other methods that try and deal with the huge volume of
    > usenet. INN has what is called CNFS (Cyclical News File System) that stores
    > articles into large buffers rather than separate files. I do not know about
    > ANUNEWS. For a full feed, some sort of buffered storage mechanism is a *must
    > have* for a full feed.
    >
    > I don't know what your intentions are for your newsfeed (full feed,
    > text-only) and for readership on your server (do you plan on being relay
    > only or having readers on the same machine?) But if you plan on going with a
    > full feed, you are looking at 250-300 GB per day of data.



    was looking to feed COV and the networking newsgroups so not a lot of
    bandwidth. :-)


    >
    >


  8. Re: Running a news server on OpenVMS

    In article <4537e741$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, Jim Mehlhop writes:
    > I'd like to know how to set up my VMS box as a news server. I am
    > running Multinet 5.1 and OpenVMS8.2 Alpha on a PWS500au with 640 meg and
    > about 60 GB of free disk space. I could probably dedicate an 18GB
    > disk for this.
    >
    > Is there any documentation for this?
    >
    >
    > Jim


    I used ANUNEWS in the past (up to about 7-8 years ago). The problem was that
    VMS couldn't hold the load of creating and deleting a lot of small files (each
    item was a separate file). I finally moved it to a Linux server with Inn.

    Nothing is perfect...
    __Yehavi:

  9. Re: Running a news server on OpenVMS

    "Yehavi Bourvine (58-4279)" wrote:
    > I used ANUNEWS in the past (up to about 7-8 years ago). The problem was that
    > VMS couldn't hold the load of creating and deleting a lot of small files (each
    > item was a separate file). I finally moved it to a Linux server with Inn.


    With the supposedly improved caching/file system in version 8.*, has
    this made a big difference in performance for file create/delete when
    there is a large directory ?

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