RE: Does anyone here have an 11/60? - VMS

This is a discussion on RE: Does anyone here have an 11/60? - VMS ; It would be interesting to know the internal history on it - as you say, they dropped the ball and didn't develop this good idea further. I wonder if someone just caught Ken on the wrong day.... :-) -- Ian ...

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Thread: RE: Does anyone here have an 11/60?

  1. RE: Does anyone here have an 11/60?

    It would be interesting to know the internal history on it - as you say,
    they dropped the ball and didn't develop this good idea further. I
    wonder if someone just caught Ken on the wrong day.... :-) -- Ian

    -----Original Message-----
    From: owner-info-pdp11@village.org [mailtowner-info-pdp11@village.org]
    On Behalf Of Christopher Zach
    Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 7:49 AM
    To: Johnny Billquist
    Cc: Stuart Brook; info-pdp11@village.org
    Subject: Re: Does anyone here have an 11/60?


    They were used as MUMPS machines IIRC back in the Boston area. The
    problem with the 11/60 was that it pulled a lot of power, used rather
    low capacity "lard" disk units (RK06/07) and worst of all didn't have 22

    bit mode. Thus they were not much more use than say an 11/34a. Although
    they did have supervisor mode; don't remember if they had the dual
    registers. Still, what could you do with that?

    It was a great design; it just didn't go far enough. The little blip
    that DEC did towards microprogramming pretty much fell flat after the
    11/03 WCS and the 11/60 in the 11 line. They continued with the 11/23
    (CIS) and 11/44 (CIS) but that was about it.

    So I can see most of them being junked for being too fat, too slow (not
    11/44 speed), and too limited.

    Chris


    Johnny Billquist wrote:
    > On Fri, 29 Apr 2005, Stuart Brook wrote:
    >
    >
    >>On Fri, 29 Apr 2005 09:12:31 -0700, Ian King wrote:
    >>
    >>> I saw one on eBay a couple of years back. IIRC, it was in Europe
    >>> (so shipping to the States would have been horrendous, which is why
    >>> I didn't try to buy it!) and it went for a fairly high price. That's


    >>> the only one I've seen on the market in the last five years or so.
    >>> -- Ian

    >>
    >>Indeed they are rare beasts.
    >>
    >>I've seen only one since my involvement with DEC systems began in
    >>1971.
    >>
    >>As somebody I know would say
    >>
    >>They're nearly as rare as rocking horse droppings!

    >
    >
    > So the fact that a computer club I'm involved in having had four at
    > the same time a number of years ago is kindof unique?
    >
    > All I have left now is the cards for a complete CPU. Tossed the
    > cabinet like six years ago now. Don't think anyone would be interested


    > in the cost of shipping it from Sweden anyhow... :-)
    >
    > Johnny
    >
    > Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
    > || on a psychedelic trip
    > email: bqt@update.uu.se || Reading murder books
    > pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
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  2. Re: Does anyone here have an 11/60?

    > they dropped the ball and didn't develop this good idea further.

    Rumors float around about:

    1) The 11/60 was originally going to have 22-bit addressing

    and

    2) The 11/68 "Bluefin" was going to be SMP (ala the real 11/74) and
    based on multiple 11/60's.

    AND that both of these ideas got canned because they would compete with
    the not-quite-yet-formulated VAX-11.

    BUT neither of the above rumors is really supported by the engineering
    that's apparent in the 11/60 (e.g. no obvious remnants of cache
    invalidation for multiple CPU's and no obvious remnants of an external
    shared memory box interface).

    The 11/60's WCS must've lent itself to a couple of internal hacking
    projects like the PDP-8-via-microcode well, so it's not inconceivable
    that someone tried ideas like 1 and 2, but that they didn't really go
    anywhere in terms of real usability. The 11/60 and its microcode
    format was well publicized in a popular textbook of the late 70's/early
    80's. (Murdocca and Heuring? I think the HP 9100A is in there too...)

    Tim.


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