BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression - Veritas Backup Exec

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Thread: BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

  1. BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

    I am using a DS3 tape in a hardware compressing drive (Seagate
    Scorpion).
    Native capacity of DS3 is 12GB. With hardware compression the estimate
    is 24GB in one tape. Presumably this is an average, and I should not
    expect 50% compression in all cases. I can expect though, 20% or around
    it.

    Now, with an estimated backup size of 13.7GB ( that is less than 20%
    above native capacity) BUMP asks me for a second tape. So where is
    my hardware compression recognized. It appears that it is not!. Somehow
    BUMP decides that the tape capacity is exceeded and asks for a second
    tape when presumably there is still free space on that tape (using a
    conservative 20% compression rate, which is modest, I think).

    Where the compression is lost?
    Any insights?
    -APT



  2. Re: BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

    That is odd. I have a DDS4 drive that I have run with both hardware
    compression on and off. The problem that I found is that there is not an
    easy way for the user to tell when the tape is full, as BUMP seems to track
    tape capacity as uncompressed, and does not account for hardware compression
    (and perhaps has no way to account for it). I don't recall having a problem
    with the tape filling prematurely, BUMP just thought it was full for a long
    time.

    I opted to use software compression, as at least I could guess at how much
    tape capacity is remaining, as BUMP could then report the uncompressed
    capacity correctly. This also helped if I was backing up data which was
    already compressed, since I could easily turn compression off in the backup
    job settings, so that the actual data backed up would not get larger.
    Unless you are running on a slow machine, you probably won't notice much of
    a performance difference between software or hardware compression (at least
    I don't, and I'm running a faster tape drive).

    Please bear in mind that if you are backing up data that is already
    compressed, you will actually fill the tape early with hardware compression,
    as the data written to tape will be larger than the original.

    I hope this helps,

    Mike Anton


    "Aryeh Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    news:3DC6D78B.F711C08F@pacbell.net...
    > I am using a DS3 tape in a hardware compressing drive (Seagate
    > Scorpion).
    > Native capacity of DS3 is 12GB. With hardware compression the estimate
    > is 24GB in one tape. Presumably this is an average, and I should not
    > expect 50% compression in all cases. I can expect though, 20% or around
    > it.
    >
    > Now, with an estimated backup size of 13.7GB ( that is less than 20%
    > above native capacity) BUMP asks me for a second tape. So where is
    > my hardware compression recognized. It appears that it is not!. Somehow
    > BUMP decides that the tape capacity is exceeded and asks for a second
    > tape when presumably there is still free space on that tape (using a
    > conservative 20% compression rate, which is modest, I think).
    >
    > Where the compression is lost?
    > Any insights?
    > -APT
    >
    >




  3. Re: BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

    Aryeh,

    I assume it is typo -2.81 for 4.81.

    I have 4.81 and a DDT drive and Bump 4.81 works fine with it. The capacity
    is 24 GB for which compression by default is enabled. If software
    compression is selected i Bump a message appears in the "Report" that it was
    disabled because hardware compression is automatic.

    I am not sure that you have anything wrong. How much compression you get
    depends very much on what you are backing up. Particularly in Windows XP,
    which automatically compresses old files, there may not be much gain with
    additional compression.

    I suggest you check in Device Manager to be sure that hardware compression
    is working [shown in the device properties]. Provided that is OK, do a
    backup adding the extra tape demanded. Then check the bytes backed up
    according to your report and compare the total with the size of the files on
    disk.


    --
    John Butler


    "Michael Anton" wrote in message
    news:3dc72870@hronntp01....
    > That is odd. I have a DDS4 drive that I have run with both hardware
    > compression on and off. The problem that I found is that there is not an
    > easy way for the user to tell when the tape is full, as BUMP seems to

    track
    > tape capacity as uncompressed, and does not account for hardware

    compression
    > (and perhaps has no way to account for it). I don't recall having a

    problem
    > with the tape filling prematurely, BUMP just thought it was full for a

    long
    > time.
    >
    > I opted to use software compression, as at least I could guess at how much
    > tape capacity is remaining, as BUMP could then report the uncompressed
    > capacity correctly. This also helped if I was backing up data which was
    > already compressed, since I could easily turn compression off in the

    backup
    > job settings, so that the actual data backed up would not get larger.
    > Unless you are running on a slow machine, you probably won't notice much

    of
    > a performance difference between software or hardware compression (at

    least
    > I don't, and I'm running a faster tape drive).
    >
    > Please bear in mind that if you are backing up data that is already
    > compressed, you will actually fill the tape early with hardware

    compression,
    > as the data written to tape will be larger than the original.
    >
    > I hope this helps,
    >
    > Mike Anton
    >
    >
    > "Aryeh Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    > news:3DC6D78B.F711C08F@pacbell.net...
    > > I am using a DS3 tape in a hardware compressing drive (Seagate
    > > Scorpion).
    > > Native capacity of DS3 is 12GB. With hardware compression the estimate
    > > is 24GB in one tape. Presumably this is an average, and I should not
    > > expect 50% compression in all cases. I can expect though, 20% or around
    > > it.
    > >
    > > Now, with an estimated backup size of 13.7GB ( that is less than 20%
    > > above native capacity) BUMP asks me for a second tape. So where is
    > > my hardware compression recognized. It appears that it is not!. Somehow
    > > BUMP decides that the tape capacity is exceeded and asks for a second
    > > tape when presumably there is still free space on that tape (using a
    > > conservative 20% compression rate, which is modest, I think).
    > >
    > > Where the compression is lost?
    > > Any insights?
    > > -APT
    > >
    > >

    >
    >




  4. Re: BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

    Correct. It is BUMP 4.81 (of course). An indeed, what Michael is proposing
    about enabling software compression I can not do (or at least I don't know
    how to do) because bump will enable hardware compression automatically.
    May be that I can disable hardware compression in the device itself (hints
    appreciated).

    I am trying to backup (part of) a Win98/FAT32 filesystem. It has indeed
    a bunch of .zip and executable files, which can not be compressed
    further, and perhaps will be expanded a bit by HC (hardware compression)
    but against these there are quite a bit of files that are highly compressable,
    such as "help" files, in both windows format and html, text documents, .PDFs
    and so forth. I was sort-of expecting that the large number of (mostly) text
    files will compensate and more for the tightly compact executables and zips.

    But sometimes I don't even get native capacity on the tape. A DDS3 is
    reported full sometimes with only 11GB written on it ... This is odd.

    How do I disable hardware compression so that I can experiment with what
    Michael proposes?

    Many thanks for your help!!
    -APT


    John Butler wrote:

    > Aryeh,
    >
    > I assume it is typo -2.81 for 4.81.
    >
    > I have 4.81 and a DDT drive and Bump 4.81 works fine with it. The capacity
    > is 24 GB for which compression by default is enabled. If software
    > compression is selected i Bump a message appears in the "Report" that it was
    > disabled because hardware compression is automatic.
    >
    > I am not sure that you have anything wrong. How much compression you get
    > depends very much on what you are backing up. Particularly in Windows XP,
    > which automatically compresses old files, there may not be much gain with
    > additional compression.
    >
    > I suggest you check in Device Manager to be sure that hardware compression
    > is working [shown in the device properties]. Provided that is OK, do a
    > backup adding the extra tape demanded. Then check the bytes backed up
    > according to your report and compare the total with the size of the files on
    > disk.
    >
    > --
    > John Butler
    >
    > "Michael Anton" wrote in message
    > news:3dc72870@hronntp01....
    > > That is odd. I have a DDS4 drive that I have run with both hardware
    > > compression on and off. The problem that I found is that there is not an
    > > easy way for the user to tell when the tape is full, as BUMP seems to

    > track
    > > tape capacity as uncompressed, and does not account for hardware

    > compression
    > > (and perhaps has no way to account for it). I don't recall having a

    > problem
    > > with the tape filling prematurely, BUMP just thought it was full for a

    > long
    > > time.
    > >
    > > I opted to use software compression, as at least I could guess at how much
    > > tape capacity is remaining, as BUMP could then report the uncompressed
    > > capacity correctly. This also helped if I was backing up data which was
    > > already compressed, since I could easily turn compression off in the

    > backup
    > > job settings, so that the actual data backed up would not get larger.
    > > Unless you are running on a slow machine, you probably won't notice much

    > of
    > > a performance difference between software or hardware compression (at

    > least
    > > I don't, and I'm running a faster tape drive).
    > >
    > > Please bear in mind that if you are backing up data that is already
    > > compressed, you will actually fill the tape early with hardware

    > compression,
    > > as the data written to tape will be larger than the original.
    > >
    > > I hope this helps,
    > >
    > > Mike Anton
    > >
    > >
    > > "Aryeh Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    > > news:3DC6D78B.F711C08F@pacbell.net...
    > > > I am using a DS3 tape in a hardware compressing drive (Seagate
    > > > Scorpion).
    > > > Native capacity of DS3 is 12GB. With hardware compression the estimate
    > > > is 24GB in one tape. Presumably this is an average, and I should not
    > > > expect 50% compression in all cases. I can expect though, 20% or around
    > > > it.
    > > >
    > > > Now, with an estimated backup size of 13.7GB ( that is less than 20%
    > > > above native capacity) BUMP asks me for a second tape. So where is
    > > > my hardware compression recognized. It appears that it is not!. Somehow
    > > > BUMP decides that the tape capacity is exceeded and asks for a second
    > > > tape when presumably there is still free space on that tape (using a
    > > > conservative 20% compression rate, which is modest, I think).
    > > >
    > > > Where the compression is lost?
    > > > Any insights?
    > > > -APT
    > > >
    > > >

    > >
    > >



  5. Re: BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

    Aryeh,

    For my HP dat drive I can enable or disable hardware compression from device
    manager.
    If your Seagate Drive enables hardware compression automatically you may be
    able to do this: I remember from my previous Seagate drive that there was a
    configuration utility that could be downloaded and enable one to turn
    compression on or off.
    However be aware that Bump may still believe that the drive has hardware
    compression and turn off software compression.
    I have used Veritas backup through various incarnations and I never found
    that it gave a very high degree of compression. Personally I do not like
    very high compression on tape media as it increases the chance of read
    failure and the possibility that another drive will not be able to read the
    tape. If you are backing up for security it is better to have simple
    compression on new media.


    --
    John Butler


    "Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    news:3DCEEF4A.56687A89@hotmail.com...
    > Correct. It is BUMP 4.81 (of course). An indeed, what Michael is proposing
    > about enabling software compression I can not do (or at least I don't know
    > how to do) because bump will enable hardware compression automatically.
    > May be that I can disable hardware compression in the device itself (hints
    > appreciated).
    >
    > I am trying to backup (part of) a Win98/FAT32 filesystem. It has indeed
    > a bunch of .zip and executable files, which can not be compressed
    > further, and perhaps will be expanded a bit by HC (hardware compression)
    > but against these there are quite a bit of files that are highly

    compressable,
    > such as "help" files, in both windows format and html, text documents,

    ..PDFs
    > and so forth. I was sort-of expecting that the large number of (mostly)

    text
    > files will compensate and more for the tightly compact executables and

    zips.
    >
    > But sometimes I don't even get native capacity on the tape. A DDS3 is
    > reported full sometimes with only 11GB written on it ... This is odd.
    >
    > How do I disable hardware compression so that I can experiment with what
    > Michael proposes?
    >
    > Many thanks for your help!!
    > -APT
    >
    >
    > John Butler wrote:
    >
    > > Aryeh,
    > >
    > > I assume it is typo -2.81 for 4.81.
    > >
    > > I have 4.81 and a DDT drive and Bump 4.81 works fine with it. The

    capacity
    > > is 24 GB for which compression by default is enabled. If software
    > > compression is selected i Bump a message appears in the "Report" that it

    was
    > > disabled because hardware compression is automatic.
    > >
    > > I am not sure that you have anything wrong. How much compression you get
    > > depends very much on what you are backing up. Particularly in Windows

    XP,
    > > which automatically compresses old files, there may not be much gain

    with
    > > additional compression.
    > >
    > > I suggest you check in Device Manager to be sure that hardware

    compression
    > > is working [shown in the device properties]. Provided that is OK, do a
    > > backup adding the extra tape demanded. Then check the bytes backed up
    > > according to your report and compare the total with the size of the

    files on
    > > disk.
    > >
    > > --
    > > John Butler
    > >
    > > "Michael Anton" wrote in message
    > > news:3dc72870@hronntp01....
    > > > That is odd. I have a DDS4 drive that I have run with both hardware
    > > > compression on and off. The problem that I found is that there is not

    an
    > > > easy way for the user to tell when the tape is full, as BUMP seems to

    > > track
    > > > tape capacity as uncompressed, and does not account for hardware

    > > compression
    > > > (and perhaps has no way to account for it). I don't recall having a

    > > problem
    > > > with the tape filling prematurely, BUMP just thought it was full for a

    > > long
    > > > time.
    > > >
    > > > I opted to use software compression, as at least I could guess at how

    much
    > > > tape capacity is remaining, as BUMP could then report the uncompressed
    > > > capacity correctly. This also helped if I was backing up data which

    was
    > > > already compressed, since I could easily turn compression off in the

    > > backup
    > > > job settings, so that the actual data backed up would not get larger.
    > > > Unless you are running on a slow machine, you probably won't notice

    much
    > > of
    > > > a performance difference between software or hardware compression (at

    > > least
    > > > I don't, and I'm running a faster tape drive).
    > > >
    > > > Please bear in mind that if you are backing up data that is already
    > > > compressed, you will actually fill the tape early with hardware

    > > compression,
    > > > as the data written to tape will be larger than the original.
    > > >
    > > > I hope this helps,
    > > >
    > > > Mike Anton
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > "Aryeh Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    > > > news:3DC6D78B.F711C08F@pacbell.net...
    > > > > I am using a DS3 tape in a hardware compressing drive (Seagate
    > > > > Scorpion).
    > > > > Native capacity of DS3 is 12GB. With hardware compression the

    estimate
    > > > > is 24GB in one tape. Presumably this is an average, and I should not
    > > > > expect 50% compression in all cases. I can expect though, 20% or

    around
    > > > > it.
    > > > >
    > > > > Now, with an estimated backup size of 13.7GB ( that is less than 20%
    > > > > above native capacity) BUMP asks me for a second tape. So where is
    > > > > my hardware compression recognized. It appears that it is not!.

    Somehow
    > > > > BUMP decides that the tape capacity is exceeded and asks for a

    second
    > > > > tape when presumably there is still free space on that tape (using a
    > > > > conservative 20% compression rate, which is modest, I think).
    > > > >
    > > > > Where the compression is lost?
    > > > > Any insights?
    > > > > -APT
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >
    > > >

    >




  6. Re: BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

    If you run the Configure Devices program from the BUMP start menu folder,
    you should be able to turn off hardware compression there, then BUMP will
    allow you to use software compression. Please note that even PDF files are
    actually compressed. Also, with software compression enabled on already
    compressed files (this is the same for hardware compression), will often
    also make the resulting data backed up larger.

    Hope this helps,

    Mike Anton


    "Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    news:3DCEEF4A.56687A89@hotmail.com...
    > Correct. It is BUMP 4.81 (of course). An indeed, what Michael is proposing
    > about enabling software compression I can not do (or at least I don't know
    > how to do) because bump will enable hardware compression automatically.
    > May be that I can disable hardware compression in the device itself (hints
    > appreciated).
    >
    > I am trying to backup (part of) a Win98/FAT32 filesystem. It has indeed
    > a bunch of .zip and executable files, which can not be compressed
    > further, and perhaps will be expanded a bit by HC (hardware compression)
    > but against these there are quite a bit of files that are highly

    compressable,
    > such as "help" files, in both windows format and html, text documents,

    ..PDFs
    > and so forth. I was sort-of expecting that the large number of (mostly)

    text
    > files will compensate and more for the tightly compact executables and

    zips.
    >
    > But sometimes I don't even get native capacity on the tape. A DDS3 is
    > reported full sometimes with only 11GB written on it ... This is odd.
    >
    > How do I disable hardware compression so that I can experiment with what
    > Michael proposes?
    >
    > Many thanks for your help!!
    > -APT
    >
    >
    > John Butler wrote:
    >
    > > Aryeh,
    > >
    > > I assume it is typo -2.81 for 4.81.
    > >
    > > I have 4.81 and a DDT drive and Bump 4.81 works fine with it. The

    capacity
    > > is 24 GB for which compression by default is enabled. If software
    > > compression is selected i Bump a message appears in the "Report" that it

    was
    > > disabled because hardware compression is automatic.
    > >
    > > I am not sure that you have anything wrong. How much compression you get
    > > depends very much on what you are backing up. Particularly in Windows

    XP,
    > > which automatically compresses old files, there may not be much gain

    with
    > > additional compression.
    > >
    > > I suggest you check in Device Manager to be sure that hardware

    compression
    > > is working [shown in the device properties]. Provided that is OK, do a
    > > backup adding the extra tape demanded. Then check the bytes backed up
    > > according to your report and compare the total with the size of the

    files on
    > > disk.
    > >
    > > --
    > > John Butler
    > >
    > > "Michael Anton" wrote in message
    > > news:3dc72870@hronntp01....
    > > > That is odd. I have a DDS4 drive that I have run with both hardware
    > > > compression on and off. The problem that I found is that there is not

    an
    > > > easy way for the user to tell when the tape is full, as BUMP seems to

    > > track
    > > > tape capacity as uncompressed, and does not account for hardware

    > > compression
    > > > (and perhaps has no way to account for it). I don't recall having a

    > > problem
    > > > with the tape filling prematurely, BUMP just thought it was full for a

    > > long
    > > > time.
    > > >
    > > > I opted to use software compression, as at least I could guess at how

    much
    > > > tape capacity is remaining, as BUMP could then report the uncompressed
    > > > capacity correctly. This also helped if I was backing up data which

    was
    > > > already compressed, since I could easily turn compression off in the

    > > backup
    > > > job settings, so that the actual data backed up would not get larger.
    > > > Unless you are running on a slow machine, you probably won't notice

    much
    > > of
    > > > a performance difference between software or hardware compression (at

    > > least
    > > > I don't, and I'm running a faster tape drive).
    > > >
    > > > Please bear in mind that if you are backing up data that is already
    > > > compressed, you will actually fill the tape early with hardware

    > > compression,
    > > > as the data written to tape will be larger than the original.
    > > >
    > > > I hope this helps,
    > > >
    > > > Mike Anton
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > "Aryeh Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    > > > news:3DC6D78B.F711C08F@pacbell.net...
    > > > > I am using a DS3 tape in a hardware compressing drive (Seagate
    > > > > Scorpion).
    > > > > Native capacity of DS3 is 12GB. With hardware compression the

    estimate
    > > > > is 24GB in one tape. Presumably this is an average, and I should not
    > > > > expect 50% compression in all cases. I can expect though, 20% or

    around
    > > > > it.
    > > > >
    > > > > Now, with an estimated backup size of 13.7GB ( that is less than 20%
    > > > > above native capacity) BUMP asks me for a second tape. So where is
    > > > > my hardware compression recognized. It appears that it is not!.

    Somehow
    > > > > BUMP decides that the tape capacity is exceeded and asks for a

    second
    > > > > tape when presumably there is still free space on that tape (using a
    > > > > conservative 20% compression rate, which is modest, I think).
    > > > >
    > > > > Where the compression is lost?
    > > > > Any insights?
    > > > > -APT
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >
    > > >

    >




  7. Re: BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

    Thank you Michael and Anton! Yes. The Configure Devices does indeed let me
    turn hardware compression off. I will experiment with this. Still the
    fact that I
    less or only marginally more than native capacity on the tape with hardware
    compression seems odd. I was suspecting that somehow bump "computes"
    a "reasonable" capacity of the tape, when hardware compression is on, and
    decides that there is no more room on the tape according to this
    computation,
    regardless of whether the drive reported end-of-tape or not. Does this make
    any sense?
    Thanks again, many indeed.
    -P


    Michael Anton wrote:

    >If you run the Configure Devices program from the BUMP start menu folder,
    >you should be able to turn off hardware compression there, then BUMP will
    >allow you to use software compression. Please note that even PDF files are
    >actually compressed. Also, with software compression enabled on already
    >compressed files (this is the same for hardware compression), will often
    >also make the resulting data backed up larger.
    >
    >Hope this helps,
    >
    >Mike Anton
    >
    >
    >"Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    >news:3DCEEF4A.56687A89@hotmail.com...
    >
    >
    >>Correct. It is BUMP 4.81 (of course). An indeed, what Michael is proposing
    >>about enabling software compression I can not do (or at least I don't know
    >>how to do) because bump will enable hardware compression automatically.
    >>May be that I can disable hardware compression in the device itself (hints
    >>appreciated).
    >>
    >>I am trying to backup (part of) a Win98/FAT32 filesystem. It has indeed
    >>a bunch of .zip and executable files, which can not be compressed
    >>further, and perhaps will be expanded a bit by HC (hardware compression)
    >>but against these there are quite a bit of files that are highly
    >>
    >>

    >compressable,
    >
    >
    >>such as "help" files, in both windows format and html, text documents,
    >>
    >>

    >.PDFs
    >
    >
    >>and so forth. I was sort-of expecting that the large number of (mostly)
    >>
    >>

    >text
    >
    >
    >>files will compensate and more for the tightly compact executables and
    >>
    >>

    >zips.
    >
    >
    >>But sometimes I don't even get native capacity on the tape. A DDS3 is
    >>reported full sometimes with only 11GB written on it ... This is odd.
    >>
    >>How do I disable hardware compression so that I can experiment with what
    >>Michael proposes?
    >>
    >>Many thanks for your help!!
    >>-APT
    >>
    >>
    >>John Butler wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>>Aryeh,
    >>>
    >>>I assume it is typo -2.81 for 4.81.
    >>>
    >>>I have 4.81 and a DDT drive and Bump 4.81 works fine with it. The
    >>>
    >>>

    >capacity
    >
    >
    >>>is 24 GB for which compression by default is enabled. If software
    >>>compression is selected i Bump a message appears in the "Report" that it
    >>>
    >>>

    >was
    >
    >
    >>>disabled because hardware compression is automatic.
    >>>
    >>>I am not sure that you have anything wrong. How much compression you get
    >>>depends very much on what you are backing up. Particularly in Windows
    >>>
    >>>

    >XP,
    >
    >
    >>>which automatically compresses old files, there may not be much gain
    >>>
    >>>

    >with
    >
    >
    >>>additional compression.
    >>>
    >>>I suggest you check in Device Manager to be sure that hardware
    >>>
    >>>

    >compression
    >
    >
    >>>is working [shown in the device properties]. Provided that is OK, do a
    >>>backup adding the extra tape demanded. Then check the bytes backed up
    >>>according to your report and compare the total with the size of the
    >>>
    >>>

    >files on
    >
    >
    >>>disk.
    >>>
    >>>--
    >>>John Butler
    >>>
    >>>"Michael Anton" wrote in message
    >>>news:3dc72870@hronntp01....
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>That is odd. I have a DDS4 drive that I have run with both hardware
    >>>>compression on and off. The problem that I found is that there is not
    >>>>
    >>>>

    >an
    >
    >
    >>>>easy way for the user to tell when the tape is full, as BUMP seems to
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>track
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>tape capacity as uncompressed, and does not account for hardware
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>compression
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>(and perhaps has no way to account for it). I don't recall having a
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>problem
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>with the tape filling prematurely, BUMP just thought it was full for a
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>long
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>time.
    >>>>
    >>>>I opted to use software compression, as at least I could guess at how
    >>>>
    >>>>

    >much
    >
    >
    >>>>tape capacity is remaining, as BUMP could then report the uncompressed
    >>>>capacity correctly. This also helped if I was backing up data which
    >>>>
    >>>>

    >was
    >
    >
    >>>>already compressed, since I could easily turn compression off in the
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>backup
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>job settings, so that the actual data backed up would not get larger.
    >>>>Unless you are running on a slow machine, you probably won't notice
    >>>>
    >>>>

    >much
    >
    >
    >>>of
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>a performance difference between software or hardware compression (at
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>least
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>I don't, and I'm running a faster tape drive).
    >>>>
    >>>>Please bear in mind that if you are backing up data that is already
    >>>>compressed, you will actually fill the tape early with hardware
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>compression,
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>as the data written to tape will be larger than the original.
    >>>>
    >>>>I hope this helps,
    >>>>
    >>>>Mike Anton
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>"Aryeh Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    >>>>news:3DC6D78B.F711C08F@pacbell.net...
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>I am using a DS3 tape in a hardware compressing drive (Seagate
    >>>>>Scorpion).
    >>>>>Native capacity of DS3 is 12GB. With hardware compression the
    >>>>>
    >>>>>

    >estimate
    >
    >
    >>>>>is 24GB in one tape. Presumably this is an average, and I should not
    >>>>>expect 50% compression in all cases. I can expect though, 20% or
    >>>>>
    >>>>>

    >around
    >
    >
    >>>>>it.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>Now, with an estimated backup size of 13.7GB ( that is less than 20%
    >>>>>above native capacity) BUMP asks me for a second tape. So where is
    >>>>>my hardware compression recognized. It appears that it is not!.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>

    >Somehow
    >
    >
    >>>>>BUMP decides that the tape capacity is exceeded and asks for a
    >>>>>
    >>>>>

    >second
    >
    >
    >>>>>tape when presumably there is still free space on that tape (using a
    >>>>>conservative 20% compression rate, which is modest, I think).
    >>>>>
    >>>>>Where the compression is lost?
    >>>>>Any insights?
    >>>>>-APT
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>

    >
    >
    >
    >



  8. Re: BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

    Sorry, I mean "Thank you Michael and John" you both have been very
    helpful.

    Polo T wrote:

    > Thank you Michael and Anton! Yes. The Configure Devices does indeed
    > let me
    > turn hardware compression off. I will experiment with this. Still the
    > fact that I
    > less or only marginally more than native capacity on the tape with
    > hardware
    > compression seems odd. I was suspecting that somehow bump "computes"
    > a "reasonable" capacity of the tape, when hardware compression is on, and
    > decides that there is no more room on the tape according to this
    > computation,
    > regardless of whether the drive reported end-of-tape or not. Does this
    > make
    > any sense?
    > Thanks again, many indeed.
    > -P
    >
    >
    > Michael Anton wrote:
    >
    >> If you run the Configure Devices program from the BUMP start menu
    >> folder,
    >> you should be able to turn off hardware compression there, then BUMP
    >> will
    >> allow you to use software compression. Please note that even PDF
    >> files are
    >> actually compressed. Also, with software compression enabled on already
    >> compressed files (this is the same for hardware compression), will often
    >> also make the resulting data backed up larger.
    >>
    >> Hope this helps,
    >>
    >> Mike Anton
    >>
    >>
    >> "Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    >> news:3DCEEF4A.56687A89@hotmail.com...
    >>
    >>
    >>> Correct. It is BUMP 4.81 (of course). An indeed, what Michael is
    >>> proposing
    >>> about enabling software compression I can not do (or at least I
    >>> don't know
    >>> how to do) because bump will enable hardware compression automatically.
    >>> May be that I can disable hardware compression in the device itself
    >>> (hints
    >>> appreciated).
    >>>
    >>> I am trying to backup (part of) a Win98/FAT32 filesystem. It has
    >>> indeed
    >>> a bunch of .zip and executable files, which can not be compressed
    >>> further, and perhaps will be expanded a bit by HC (hardware
    >>> compression)
    >>> but against these there are quite a bit of files that are highly
    >>>

    >>
    >> compressable,
    >>
    >>
    >>> such as "help" files, in both windows format and html, text documents,
    >>>

    >>
    >> .PDFs
    >>
    >>
    >>> and so forth. I was sort-of expecting that the large number of (mostly)
    >>>

    >>
    >> text
    >>
    >>
    >>> files will compensate and more for the tightly compact executables and
    >>>

    >>
    >> zips.
    >>
    >>
    >>> But sometimes I don't even get native capacity on the tape. A DDS3 is
    >>> reported full sometimes with only 11GB written on it ... This is odd.
    >>>
    >>> How do I disable hardware compression so that I can experiment with
    >>> what
    >>> Michael proposes?
    >>>
    >>> Many thanks for your help!!
    >>> -APT
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> John Butler wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> Aryeh,
    >>>>
    >>>> I assume it is typo -2.81 for 4.81.
    >>>>
    >>>> I have 4.81 and a DDT drive and Bump 4.81 works fine with it. The
    >>>>
    >>>

    >> capacity
    >>
    >>
    >>>> is 24 GB for which compression by default is enabled. If software
    >>>> compression is selected i Bump a message appears in the "Report"
    >>>> that it
    >>>>
    >>>

    >> was
    >>
    >>
    >>>> disabled because hardware compression is automatic.
    >>>>
    >>>> I am not sure that you have anything wrong. How much compression
    >>>> you get
    >>>> depends very much on what you are backing up. Particularly in Windows
    >>>>
    >>>

    >> XP,
    >>
    >>
    >>>> which automatically compresses old files, there may not be much gain
    >>>>
    >>>

    >> with
    >>
    >>
    >>>> additional compression.
    >>>>
    >>>> I suggest you check in Device Manager to be sure that hardware
    >>>>
    >>>

    >> compression
    >>
    >>
    >>>> is working [shown in the device properties]. Provided that is OK, do a
    >>>> backup adding the extra tape demanded. Then check the bytes backed up
    >>>> according to your report and compare the total with the size of the
    >>>>
    >>>

    >> files on
    >>
    >>
    >>>> disk.
    >>>>
    >>>> --
    >>>> John Butler
    >>>>
    >>>> "Michael Anton" wrote in message
    >>>> news:3dc72870@hronntp01....
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> That is odd. I have a DDS4 drive that I have run with both hardware
    >>>>> compression on and off. The problem that I found is that there is
    >>>>> not
    >>>>>
    >>>>

    >> an
    >>
    >>
    >>>>> easy way for the user to tell when the tape is full, as BUMP seems to
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> track
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> tape capacity as uncompressed, and does not account for hardware
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> compression
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> (and perhaps has no way to account for it). I don't recall having a
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> problem
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> with the tape filling prematurely, BUMP just thought it was full
    >>>>> for a
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> long
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> time.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I opted to use software compression, as at least I could guess at how
    >>>>>
    >>>>

    >> much
    >>
    >>
    >>>>> tape capacity is remaining, as BUMP could then report the
    >>>>> uncompressed
    >>>>> capacity correctly. This also helped if I was backing up data which
    >>>>>
    >>>>

    >> was
    >>
    >>
    >>>>> already compressed, since I could easily turn compression off in the
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> backup
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> job settings, so that the actual data backed up would not get larger.
    >>>>> Unless you are running on a slow machine, you probably won't notice
    >>>>>
    >>>>

    >> much
    >>
    >>
    >>>> of
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> a performance difference between software or hardware compression (at
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> least
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> I don't, and I'm running a faster tape drive).
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Please bear in mind that if you are backing up data that is already
    >>>>> compressed, you will actually fill the tape early with hardware
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> compression,
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> as the data written to tape will be larger than the original.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I hope this helps,
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Mike Anton
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> "Aryeh Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    >>>>> news:3DC6D78B.F711C08F@pacbell.net...
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> I am using a DS3 tape in a hardware compressing drive (Seagate
    >>>>>> Scorpion).
    >>>>>> Native capacity of DS3 is 12GB. With hardware compression the
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>

    >> estimate
    >>
    >>
    >>>>>> is 24GB in one tape. Presumably this is an average, and I should not
    >>>>>> expect 50% compression in all cases. I can expect though, 20% or
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>

    >> around
    >>
    >>
    >>>>>> it.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Now, with an estimated backup size of 13.7GB ( that is less than 20%
    >>>>>> above native capacity) BUMP asks me for a second tape. So where is
    >>>>>> my hardware compression recognized. It appears that it is not!.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>

    >> Somehow
    >>
    >>
    >>>>>> BUMP decides that the tape capacity is exceeded and asks for a
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>

    >> second
    >>
    >>
    >>>>>> tape when presumably there is still free space on that tape (using a
    >>>>>> conservative 20% compression rate, which is modest, I think).
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Where the compression is lost?
    >>>>>> Any insights?
    >>>>>> -APT
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>

    >



  9. Re: BUMP 2.81 does not recognize hardware compression

    Polo,

    It is good that you have got the solution.

    Regards

    --
    John Butler


    "Polo T" wrote in message
    news:3DDAEE84.1030104@hotmail.com...
    > Sorry, I mean "Thank you Michael and John" you both have been very
    > helpful.
    >
    > Polo T wrote:
    >
    > > Thank you Michael and Anton! Yes. The Configure Devices does indeed
    > > let me
    > > turn hardware compression off. I will experiment with this. Still the
    > > fact that I
    > > less or only marginally more than native capacity on the tape with
    > > hardware
    > > compression seems odd. I was suspecting that somehow bump "computes"
    > > a "reasonable" capacity of the tape, when hardware compression is on,

    and
    > > decides that there is no more room on the tape according to this
    > > computation,
    > > regardless of whether the drive reported end-of-tape or not. Does this
    > > make
    > > any sense?
    > > Thanks again, many indeed.
    > > -P
    > >
    > >
    > > Michael Anton wrote:
    > >
    > >> If you run the Configure Devices program from the BUMP start menu
    > >> folder,
    > >> you should be able to turn off hardware compression there, then BUMP
    > >> will
    > >> allow you to use software compression. Please note that even PDF
    > >> files are
    > >> actually compressed. Also, with software compression enabled on

    already
    > >> compressed files (this is the same for hardware compression), will

    often
    > >> also make the resulting data backed up larger.
    > >>
    > >> Hope this helps,
    > >>
    > >> Mike Anton
    > >>
    > >>
    > >> "Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    > >> news:3DCEEF4A.56687A89@hotmail.com...
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>> Correct. It is BUMP 4.81 (of course). An indeed, what Michael is
    > >>> proposing
    > >>> about enabling software compression I can not do (or at least I
    > >>> don't know
    > >>> how to do) because bump will enable hardware compression

    automatically.
    > >>> May be that I can disable hardware compression in the device itself
    > >>> (hints
    > >>> appreciated).
    > >>>
    > >>> I am trying to backup (part of) a Win98/FAT32 filesystem. It has
    > >>> indeed
    > >>> a bunch of .zip and executable files, which can not be compressed
    > >>> further, and perhaps will be expanded a bit by HC (hardware
    > >>> compression)
    > >>> but against these there are quite a bit of files that are highly
    > >>>
    > >>
    > >> compressable,
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>> such as "help" files, in both windows format and html, text documents,
    > >>>
    > >>
    > >> .PDFs
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>> and so forth. I was sort-of expecting that the large number of

    (mostly)
    > >>>
    > >>
    > >> text
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>> files will compensate and more for the tightly compact executables and
    > >>>
    > >>
    > >> zips.
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>> But sometimes I don't even get native capacity on the tape. A DDS3 is
    > >>> reported full sometimes with only 11GB written on it ... This is odd.
    > >>>
    > >>> How do I disable hardware compression so that I can experiment with
    > >>> what
    > >>> Michael proposes?
    > >>>
    > >>> Many thanks for your help!!
    > >>> -APT
    > >>>
    > >>>
    > >>> John Butler wrote:
    > >>>
    > >>>
    > >>>
    > >>>> Aryeh,
    > >>>>
    > >>>> I assume it is typo -2.81 for 4.81.
    > >>>>
    > >>>> I have 4.81 and a DDT drive and Bump 4.81 works fine with it. The
    > >>>>
    > >>>
    > >> capacity
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>> is 24 GB for which compression by default is enabled. If software
    > >>>> compression is selected i Bump a message appears in the "Report"
    > >>>> that it
    > >>>>
    > >>>
    > >> was
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>> disabled because hardware compression is automatic.
    > >>>>
    > >>>> I am not sure that you have anything wrong. How much compression
    > >>>> you get
    > >>>> depends very much on what you are backing up. Particularly in Windows
    > >>>>
    > >>>
    > >> XP,
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>> which automatically compresses old files, there may not be much gain
    > >>>>
    > >>>
    > >> with
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>> additional compression.
    > >>>>
    > >>>> I suggest you check in Device Manager to be sure that hardware
    > >>>>
    > >>>
    > >> compression
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>> is working [shown in the device properties]. Provided that is OK, do

    a
    > >>>> backup adding the extra tape demanded. Then check the bytes backed up
    > >>>> according to your report and compare the total with the size of the
    > >>>>
    > >>>
    > >> files on
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>> disk.
    > >>>>
    > >>>> --
    > >>>> John Butler
    > >>>>
    > >>>> "Michael Anton" wrote in message
    > >>>> news:3dc72870@hronntp01....
    > >>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> That is odd. I have a DDS4 drive that I have run with both hardware
    > >>>>> compression on and off. The problem that I found is that there is
    > >>>>> not
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >> an
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>>> easy way for the user to tell when the tape is full, as BUMP seems

    to
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>> track
    > >>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> tape capacity as uncompressed, and does not account for hardware
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>> compression
    > >>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> (and perhaps has no way to account for it). I don't recall having a
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>> problem
    > >>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> with the tape filling prematurely, BUMP just thought it was full
    > >>>>> for a
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>> long
    > >>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> time.
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>> I opted to use software compression, as at least I could guess at

    how
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >> much
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>>> tape capacity is remaining, as BUMP could then report the
    > >>>>> uncompressed
    > >>>>> capacity correctly. This also helped if I was backing up data which
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >> was
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>>> already compressed, since I could easily turn compression off in the
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>> backup
    > >>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> job settings, so that the actual data backed up would not get

    larger.
    > >>>>> Unless you are running on a slow machine, you probably won't notice
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >> much
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>> of
    > >>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> a performance difference between software or hardware compression

    (at
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>> least
    > >>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> I don't, and I'm running a faster tape drive).
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>> Please bear in mind that if you are backing up data that is already
    > >>>>> compressed, you will actually fill the tape early with hardware
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>> compression,
    > >>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> as the data written to tape will be larger than the original.
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>> I hope this helps,
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>> Mike Anton
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>> "Aryeh Polo Talnir" wrote in message
    > >>>>> news:3DC6D78B.F711C08F@pacbell.net...
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>>> I am using a DS3 tape in a hardware compressing drive (Seagate
    > >>>>>> Scorpion).
    > >>>>>> Native capacity of DS3 is 12GB. With hardware compression the
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>
    > >> estimate
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>>>> is 24GB in one tape. Presumably this is an average, and I should

    not
    > >>>>>> expect 50% compression in all cases. I can expect though, 20% or
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>
    > >> around
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>>>> it.
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>> Now, with an estimated backup size of 13.7GB ( that is less than

    20%
    > >>>>>> above native capacity) BUMP asks me for a second tape. So where is
    > >>>>>> my hardware compression recognized. It appears that it is not!.
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>
    > >> Somehow
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>>>> BUMP decides that the tape capacity is exceeded and asks for a
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>
    > >> second
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>>>> tape when presumably there is still free space on that tape (using

    a
    > >>>>>> conservative 20% compression rate, which is modest, I think).
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>> Where the compression is lost?
    > >>>>>> Any insights?
    > >>>>>> -APT
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>

    > >

    >




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