Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse - Unix

This is a discussion on Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse - Unix ; On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 20:21:40 GMT, Peter Flass wrote: >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote: >> >> Actually I seem to have several versions of 'Small-C' compilers. The >> one I mentioned above is not the one that I was thinking of when ...

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Thread: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

  1. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    On Sun, 23 Apr 2006 20:21:40 GMT, Peter Flass
    wrote:

    >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    >>
    >> Actually I seem to have several versions of 'Small-C' compilers. The
    >> one I mentioned above is not the one that I was thinking of when I
    >> wrote the following paragraph. The version I was thinking of is:
    >> "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain"
    >>
    >> It's main problem is that it generates fairly ugly code, at least the
    >> x86 version does. I could probably hack a version of this in a week
    >> or two, and get it to output Nova assembler code. Maybe I will, just
    >> for something to do.

    >
    >It couldn't do much else, given the hardware it was originally targeted
    >to run on. Also, perhaps it would do better on a less CISC machine than
    >the x86.

    Maybe.
    >...
    >>
    >> Another issue, do I write it for the only Nova OS that I have (IRIS
    >> from EDS, later Point4) or standalone?

    >
    >Is it possible to generate code that will run either way, and have the
    >OS-dependent (or standalone-dependent) stuff in the RTL?

    I suppose. IRIS didn't have any notion of a loader or linker,
    relocatable or otherwise. Programs were assembled at absolute load
    locations, and used hard coded entries to "REX", (the kernel) for
    various subroutine things, like keyboard input & output. Also, this
    was a time sharing system, and programs had to check the time slice
    counter, and swap themselves out, at the end of a time slice. (I don't
    remember the details, just now. It's only been 20 years since I last
    used this)

    For example, IIRC, the command to write a string to the terminal was
    "OUTTEXT", which was actually a "JSR @134" instruction. Loc 134 held
    the address of the terminal output routine.

    Since the various small-c compilers all output asm source, by not
    specifying any location info it should be possible to do both. Then
    for IRIS you could do something like:

    asm cstart cbody clib

    where cbody came from the c compiler. cstart would be the IRIS based
    startup code, and clib would be all of the c library routines.

    If I remember the assembler command correctly. :-)
    --
    ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html

    To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.

  2. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    > On 23 Apr 2006 10:45:08 -0700, "toby"
    > wrote:
    >
    > >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    > >> On 22 Apr 2006 23:07:33 -0700, "toby"
    > >> >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    > >> >> Well, I have the pcc source from 7th Ed., and if I got interested
    > >> >> enough, I could always tackle porting it to the Nova.
    > >> >
    > >> >Is that pcc1 or pcc2 (I'm going from vague memory here from some
    > >> >reading a year or so ago, that pcc went through an improved rewrite)?
    > >> I have no idea.
    > >>
    > >> >> I wonder if I
    > >> >> could use the auto-increment/auto-decrement low core locations as a
    > >> >> fake stack pointer? I would also have to use R2 as a frame pointer.
    > >> >
    > >> >I put quite a bit of thought into targeting lcc[1] to Nova, but this
    > >> >foundered mainly on these points:
    > >> >* an essential presumption of byte addressing means modifying lcc
    > >> >itself to deal with the concept of 2 pointer classes;
    > >> That problem would exist for any word addressed system.

    > >
    > >Indeed. I expect pcc made the same presumption.
    > >
    > >>
    > >> >* lcc much prefers many more registers (even the PDP-11[2] strains this
    > >> >to the limit);
    > >> I would be more inclined to start with something like the 'Small-C'
    > >> compiler, and work up.
    > >>
    > >> this one:
    > >> Small-C Compiler
    > >> Copyright 1982, 1983, 1985, 1988 J. E. Hendrix
    > >>
    > >>
    > >> >* supporting long types is not particularly elegant in lcc 16-bit
    > >> >machine descriptions.
    > >> All I would tackle is char, int, long (8,16,32) -- and maybe skip long

    > >
    > >I was referring to long = 32. In an lcc machine description this gets
    > >ugly for PDP-11; another of its presumptions is that you'll have
    > >registers of your operand width (which for longs is true on any 32 bit
    > >system of course). Just another indication that while it's possible to
    > >go there, 16 bitters are outside lcc's sweet spot. I agree other
    > >compilers are probably easier starting points (I wonder about tcc[3]?).
    > >lcc's advantage, apart from anything else, is it is correct and
    > >complete ANSI.
    > >
    > >[3] http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/tcc/
    > >

    > tcc looks a little too 32BITish and a little too X86ish for my taste,
    > after a very quick look.
    >
    > The reason I would start with a Small-C Compiler is that it is already
    > a 16 BITter, and the fact that I have the source and a working
    > version.
    >
    > Actually I seem to have several versions of 'Small-C' compilers. The
    > one I mentioned above is not the one that I was thinking of when I
    > wrote the following paragraph. The version I was thinking of is:
    > "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain"
    >
    > It's main problem is that it generates fairly ugly code, at least the
    > x86 version does. I could probably hack a version of this in a week
    > or two, and get it to output Nova assembler code. Maybe I will, just
    > for something to do.


    If you want any help, I'm happy to join forces. I can offer a colocated
    Subversion repository for collaboration. Also another pair of coding
    hands that likes compilers and knows Nova 3 reasonably well ;-) I also
    have some rough notes[5] that I made when I was looking at lcc.

    --Toby

    [5] http://www.telegraphics.com.au/svn/d...arch_notes.txt
    (some of this may be out of date, incorrect or just plain silly. But
    it's version controlled so you can check it out and commit any
    corrections if I give you a login. Same goes for the rest of the
    assembler project of which it is a part).

    >
    > Hmmm, size may be an issue. The MS/PC DOS exe is 40k bytes - that's
    > over half of the Nova's memory. :-)
    >
    > Another issue, do I write it for the only Nova OS that I have (IRIS
    > from EDS, later Point4) or standalone?
    >
    > Also, write for a stock Nova, or the modified clone processors that I
    > have. The ones I have support 64k words of core, but you lose the
    > LDA/STA memory indirect chaining feature. But they will run as stock.
    >
    > --
    > ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    > BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html
    >
    > To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.



  3. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    On 23 Apr 2006 22:40:25 -0700, "toby"
    >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:


    >> Actually I seem to have several versions of 'Small-C' compilers. The
    >> one I mentioned above is not the one that I was thinking of when I
    >> wrote the following paragraph. The version I was thinking of is:
    >> "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain"
    >>
    >> It's main problem is that it generates fairly ugly code, at least the
    >> x86 version does. I could probably hack a version of this in a week
    >> or two, and get it to output Nova assembler code. Maybe I will, just
    >> for something to do.

    >
    >If you want any help, I'm happy to join forces.

    For the moment, I am just going to look at the routines to see how
    feasible such a hack would be.

    The "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain" is version 1.1, and I have no
    idea where I originally got it. Probably off some BBS. The original
    files are dated 1985. I am more familiar with this version as I
    converted it from C to Basic at some point.

    The later version is still available online, and it would be a better
    place to start. This copy matches the ones that I have on file:
    http://www.programmersheaven.com/zon...t207/16184.htm

    I will look at this versions code generating routines.


    >I can offer a colocated Subversion repository for collaboration.

    The compiler is only 4 small source files. :-)

    >Also another pair of coding
    >hands that likes compilers and knows Nova 3 reasonably well ;-) I also
    >have some rough notes[5] that I made when I was looking at lcc.
    >[5] http://www.telegraphics.com.au/svn/d...arch_notes.txt
    >(some of this may be out of date, incorrect or just plain silly. But
    >it's version controlled so you can check it out and commit any
    >corrections if I give you a login. Same goes for the rest of the
    >assembler project of which it is a part).


    Most of it looks reasonable, except I have no idea about the lcc
    parts.

    The stack instructions only apply to the Nova 3 & later -- none of my
    hardware has it. The FP instructions were always optional, and, of
    course, I don't have them either.

    IRIS used decimal floating point subroutines in 3 sizes with 6 to 14
    decimal digits of accuracy.

    Hmm, maybe I should grab that routine and add it to my basic compiler.
    --
    ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html

    To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.

  4. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse


    ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    > On 23 Apr 2006 22:40:25 -0700, "toby"
    > >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:

    >
    > >> Actually I seem to have several versions of 'Small-C' compilers. The
    > >> one I mentioned above is not the one that I was thinking of when I
    > >> wrote the following paragraph. The version I was thinking of is:
    > >> "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain"
    > >>
    > >> It's main problem is that it generates fairly ugly code, at least the
    > >> x86 version does. I could probably hack a version of this in a week
    > >> or two, and get it to output Nova assembler code. Maybe I will, just
    > >> for something to do.

    > >
    > >If you want any help, I'm happy to join forces.

    > For the moment, I am just going to look at the routines to see how
    > feasible such a hack would be.
    >
    > The "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain" is version 1.1, and I have no
    > idea where I originally got it. Probably off some BBS. The original
    > files are dated 1985. I am more familiar with this version as I
    > converted it from C to Basic at some point.
    >
    > The later version is still available online, and it would be a better
    > place to start. This copy matches the ones that I have on file:
    > http://www.programmersheaven.com/zon...t207/16184.htm
    >
    > I will look at this versions code generating routines.
    >
    >
    > >I can offer a colocated Subversion repository for collaboration.

    > The compiler is only 4 small source files. :-)


    I find version control indispensable even as a lone developer working
    on a single source file. But collaboration would be impossible without
    Subversion - now that I am accustomed to its advantages

    > ...
    > --
    > ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    > BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html
    >
    > To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.



  5. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    On 24 Apr 2006 09:42:09 -0700, "toby"
    >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:


    >>
    >> >I can offer a colocated Subversion repository for collaboration.

    >> The compiler is only 4 small source files. :-)

    >
    >I find version control indispensable even as a lone developer working
    >on a single source file. But collaboration would be impossible without
    >Subversion - now that I am accustomed to its advantages
    >

    Yes, I think that it would be useful for me, also. However, neither
    of the two programs I most often use for source file editing know
    anything about source control systems, being old DOS programs.

    If my editors would automaticly grab their input from source control
    and then save it back, I would be using it.

    I have tried to use source control in the past, but I tend to get
    involved in the project, and forget to use it.

    Some time back, I was thinking that it would be nice if I knew of a
    filesystem that did automatic source control, either FreeBSD or Win32
    based. Then I could just store all the source on it, and access it as
    if it were just a directory structure.

    You don't happen to know of such a critter, do you?
    --
    ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html

    To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.

  6. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    > On 24 Apr 2006 09:42:09 -0700, "toby"
    > >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:

    >
    > >>
    > >> >I can offer a colocated Subversion repository for collaboration.
    > >> The compiler is only 4 small source files. :-)

    > >
    > >I find version control indispensable even as a lone developer working
    > >on a single source file. But collaboration would be impossible without
    > >Subversion - now that I am accustomed to its advantages
    > >

    > Yes, I think that it would be useful for me, also. However, neither
    > of the two programs I most often use for source file editing know
    > anything about source control systems, being old DOS programs.
    >
    > If my editors would automaticly grab their input from source control
    > and then save it back, I would be using it.


    There is no need for editor integration. I've often used Subversion
    from CLI but an IDE on top (for instance Microchip). Simply check out a
    working copy and use whatever IDE/editor you like in it. This is quite
    convenient, because commits are typically separated by bouts of
    editing, building and testing (I make a rule of thumb to not commit
    anything that doesn't build).

    >
    > I have tried to use source control in the past, but I tend to get
    > involved in the project, and forget to use it.


    Well, Subversion's simplicity and convenience might help. It is a
    matter of habit, for sure.

    Let's give this project a name, I'll create a repo and you can check in
    the initial source (license permitting, we can have a public or private
    repo).

    >
    > Some time back, I was thinking that it would be nice if I knew of a
    > filesystem that did automatic source control, either FreeBSD or Win32
    > based. Then I could just store all the source on it, and access it as
    > if it were just a directory structure.
    >
    > You don't happen to know of such a critter, do you?


    I have seen similar things. In fact you can use Subversion itself in
    this way via a WebDAV mount. But for things like documentation TWiki is
    a user friendly versioned system.

    > --
    > ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    > BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html
    >
    > To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.



  7. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    On 24 Apr 2006 12:27:10 -0700, "toby"
    wrote:

    >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    >> On 24 Apr 2006 09:42:09 -0700, "toby"
    >> >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:

    >>
    >> >>
    >> >> >I can offer a colocated Subversion repository for collaboration.
    >> >> The compiler is only 4 small source files. :-)
    >> >
    >> >I find version control indispensable even as a lone developer working
    >> >on a single source file. But collaboration would be impossible without
    >> >Subversion - now that I am accustomed to its advantages
    >> >

    >> Yes, I think that it would be useful for me, also. However, neither
    >> of the two programs I most often use for source file editing know
    >> anything about source control systems, being old DOS programs.
    >>
    >> If my editors would automaticly grab their input from source control
    >> and then save it back, I would be using it.

    >
    >There is no need for editor integration. I've often used Subversion
    >from CLI but an IDE on top (for instance Microchip).
    >Simply check out a working copy and use whatever IDE/editor you like in it.

    That's the part I tend to forget until it's too late. :-)

    >This is quite
    >convenient, because commits are typically separated by bouts of
    >editing, building and testing (I make a rule of thumb to not commit
    >anything that doesn't build).



    >> I have tried to use source control in the past, but I tend to get
    >> involved in the project, and forget to use it.

    >
    >Well, Subversion's simplicity and convenience might help. It is a
    >matter of habit, for sure.
    >
    >Let's give this project a name, I'll create a repo and you can check in
    >the initial source (license permitting, we can have a public or private
    >repo).


    cc1.c thru cc4.c from smallc22.zip from:
    http://www.programmersheaven.com/zon...t207/16184.htm

    Most of the code generation appears to be in cc4.

    I need to dig thru and see if the optimizer is at the p-code level or
    somewhere else. The 1.1 version used less registers, IIRC, and would
    have been easier to modify. But, it supports much less of C features.

    >> Some time back, I was thinking that it would be nice if I knew of a
    >> filesystem that did automatic source control, either FreeBSD or Win32
    >> based. Then I could just store all the source on it, and access it as
    >> if it were just a directory structure.
    >>
    >> You don't happen to know of such a critter, do you?

    >
    >I have seen similar things. In fact you can use Subversion itself in
    >this way via a WebDAV mount. But for things like documentation TWiki is
    >a user friendly versioned system.


    Oh, well.
    --
    ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html

    To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.

  8. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    CBFalconer wrote:

    > ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    >
    >>>ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    >>>

    >
    > ... snip ...
    >
    >>>>this one:
    >>>>Small-C Compiler
    >>>>Copyright 1982, 1983, 1985, 1988 J. E. Hendrix
    >>>>

    >
    > ... snip ...
    >
    >>Actually I seem to have several versions of 'Small-C' compilers.
    >>The one I mentioned above is not the one that I was thinking of
    >>when I wrote the following paragraph. The version I was thinking
    >>of is: "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain"

    >
    >
    > Ron Cain was the originator, who then retired from the field. I
    > always felt that the seizure by Hendrix was not right, although he
    > did make improvements.
    >


    I remember that Doctor Dobbs Journal published the source (1.1?) in, I
    believe, three parts, for the user to key in themselves. I think I kept
    these issues somewhere.


  9. Versioned filesystems, was Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    > ...
    > Some time back, I was thinking that it would be nice if I knew of a
    > filesystem that did automatic source control, either FreeBSD or Win32
    > based. Then I could just store all the source on it, and access it as
    > if it were just a directory structure.
    >
    > You don't happen to know of such a critter, do you?


    Apart from Subversion over WebDAV, I see:
    * Wayback: A User-level Versioning File System for Linux,
    http://wayback.sourceforge.net/ &
    http://www.usenix.org/events/usenix0...tml/index.html
    * CopyFS, A copy-on-write, versioned filesystem,
    http://invaders.mars-attacks.org/~boklm/copyfs/
    * CvsFS, http://cvsfs.sourceforge.net/ "...presents the CVS contents as
    mountable file system. It allows to view the versioned files as like
    they were ordinary files on a disk. There is also a possibility to
    check in/out some files for editing."
    * Katie, "somewhat like a cross between CVS and NFS",
    http://www.netcraft.com.au/geoffrey/katie/
    * versionfs,
    http://www.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu/docs/ve...t04/index.html ,
    http://www.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu/project-versionfs.html ,
    http://www.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu/docs/ve...sis/index.html - not
    sure if source is published
    * ext3cow, "a time-shifting file system implemented with copy-on-write
    (COW) and based on the very popular ext2/ext3 file system",
    http://www.ext3cow.com/
    * Elephant for FreeBSD,
    http://www.hpl.hp.com/personal/Alist...tos/index.html

    For non-automatic versioning, there are snapshotting facilities built
    into various filesystems including Solaris UFS and Sun's new ZFS.

    > --
    > ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    > BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html
    >
    > To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.



  10. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 22:28:56 GMT, Peter Flass
    wrote:

    >CBFalconer wrote:
    >
    >> ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    >>
    >>>>ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    >>>>

    >>
    >> ... snip ...
    >>
    >>>>>this one:
    >>>>>Small-C Compiler
    >>>>>Copyright 1982, 1983, 1985, 1988 J. E. Hendrix
    >>>>>

    >>
    >> ... snip ...
    >>
    >>>Actually I seem to have several versions of 'Small-C' compilers.
    >>>The one I mentioned above is not the one that I was thinking of
    >>>when I wrote the following paragraph. The version I was thinking
    >>>of is: "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain"

    >>
    >>
    >> Ron Cain was the originator, who then retired from the field. I
    >> always felt that the seizure by Hendrix was not right, although he
    >> did make improvements.
    >>

    >
    >I remember that Doctor Dobbs Journal published the source (1.1?) in, I
    >believe, three parts, for the user to key in themselves. I think I kept
    >these issues somewhere.


    I have:
    1.1 source (Ron Cain)
    2.1, 2.2 (Hendrix) usually found as "smallc2?.zip"
    3.0, 3.1 (Someone else) found as "smallc3?.zip"

    And a couple of other odd versions.

    All found on the web, over the last 10 years.
    --
    ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html

    To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.

  11. Re: Versioned filesystems, was Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    On 24 Apr 2006 15:41:31 -0700, "toby"
    wrote:

    >ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    >> ...
    >> Some time back, I was thinking that it would be nice if I knew of a
    >> filesystem that did automatic source control, either FreeBSD or Win32
    >> based. Then I could just store all the source on it, and access it as
    >> if it were just a directory structure.
    >>
    >> You don't happen to know of such a critter, do you?

    >
    >Apart from Subversion over WebDAV, I see:
    >* Wayback: A User-level Versioning File System for Linux,
    >http://wayback.sourceforge.net/ &
    >http://www.usenix.org/events/usenix0...tml/index.html
    >* CopyFS, A copy-on-write, versioned filesystem,
    >http://invaders.mars-attacks.org/~boklm/copyfs/
    >* CvsFS, http://cvsfs.sourceforge.net/ "...presents the CVS contents as
    >mountable file system. It allows to view the versioned files as like
    >they were ordinary files on a disk. There is also a possibility to
    >check in/out some files for editing."
    >* Katie, "somewhat like a cross between CVS and NFS",
    >http://www.netcraft.com.au/geoffrey/katie/
    >* versionfs,
    >http://www.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu/docs/ve...t04/index.html ,
    >http://www.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu/project-versionfs.html ,
    >http://www.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu/docs/ve...sis/index.html - not
    >sure if source is published
    >* ext3cow, "a time-shifting file system implemented with copy-on-write
    >(COW) and based on the very popular ext2/ext3 file system",
    >http://www.ext3cow.com/
    >* Elephant for FreeBSD,
    >http://www.hpl.hp.com/personal/Alist...tos/index.html
    >


    Ok, I will look info those.

    >For non-automatic versioning, there are snapshotting facilities built
    >into various filesystems including Solaris UFS and Sun's new ZFS.

    --
    ArarghMail604 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com
    BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html

    To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address.

  12. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    Peter Flass wrote:
    >
    > CBFalconer wrote:
    >
    > > ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    > >
    > >>>ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    > >>>

    > >
    > > ... snip ...
    > >
    > >>>>this one:
    > >>>>Small-C Compiler
    > >>>>Copyright 1982, 1983, 1985, 1988 J. E. Hendrix
    > >>>>

    > >
    > > ... snip ...
    > >
    > >>Actually I seem to have several versions of 'Small-C' compilers.
    > >>The one I mentioned above is not the one that I was thinking of
    > >>when I wrote the following paragraph. The version I was thinking
    > >>of is: "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain"

    > >
    > >
    > > Ron Cain was the originator, who then retired from the field. I
    > > always felt that the seizure by Hendrix was not right, although he
    > > did make improvements.
    > >

    >
    > I remember that Doctor Dobbs Journal published the source (1.1?) in, I
    > believe, three parts, for the user to key in themselves. I think I kept
    > these issues somewhere.
    >

    I can't put my hands on the issues right now...but I think Ron Cain's
    Small C was published in the May, June and July issues of 1980 in
    Dr. Dobb's magazine.


    --
    +----------------------------------------------------------------+
    | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net |
    +----------------------------------------------------------------+

  13. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 21:14:12 -0500 in alt.folklore.computers, Charles
    Richmond wrote:

    >Peter Flass wrote:
    >>
    >> CBFalconer wrote:
    >>
    >> > ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    >> >
    >> >>>ArarghMail604NOSPAM@NOT.AT.Arargh.com wrote:
    >> >>>
    >> >
    >> > ... snip ...
    >> >
    >> >>>>this one:
    >> >>>>Small-C Compiler
    >> >>>>Copyright 1982, 1983, 1985, 1988 J. E. Hendrix
    >> >>>>
    >> >
    >> > ... snip ...
    >> >
    >> >>Actually I seem to have several versions of 'Small-C' compilers.
    >> >>The one I mentioned above is not the one that I was thinking of
    >> >>when I wrote the following paragraph. The version I was thinking
    >> >>of is: "small-c:PC compiler by Ron Cain"
    >> >
    >> >
    >> > Ron Cain was the originator, who then retired from the field. I
    >> > always felt that the seizure by Hendrix was not right, although he
    >> > did make improvements.
    >> >

    >>
    >> I remember that Doctor Dobbs Journal published the source (1.1?) in, I
    >> believe, three parts, for the user to key in themselves. I think I kept
    >> these issues somewhere.
    >>

    >I can't put my hands on the issues right now...but I think Ron Cain's
    >Small C was published in the May, June and July issues of 1980 in
    >Dr. Dobb's magazine.


    Also reprinted in "Dr.Dobb's Toolbook of C", by the Editors of
    Dr.Dobb's Journal, Brady, 1986.

    --
    Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada

    Brian.Inglis@CSi.com (Brian[dot]Inglis{at}SystematicSW[dot]ab[dot]ca)
    fake address use address above to reply

  14. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    "toby" writes:

    > Hi,
    >
    > In their paper, "Portability of C Programs and the UNIX System", S.C.
    > Johnson and Dennis Ritchie write,
    >
    > \\
    > Even before the idea of moving UNIX occurred to us, it was clear that C
    > was successful enough to warrant production of compilers for an
    > increasing variety of machines. Therefore, one of the authors (SCJ)
    > undertook to produce a new compiler intended from the start to be
    > easily modified. This new compiler is now in use on the IBM System/370
    > under both OS and TSS, the Honeywell 6000, the
    > Interdata 8/32, the SEL86 the Data General Nova and Eclipse, the DEC
    > VAX11/780, and a Bell System processor. Versions are in progress for
    > the Intel 8086 microprocessor and other machines.
    > //
    >
    > Do any of these ports of pcc or pcc2 still exist? I am interested in
    > the Nova/Eclipse versions in particular.


    Speaking as the person who was one of the primary authors of the C front for
    the MV/Eclipse, I have severe doubts PCC could generate code for the DG
    machines with their concept of word pointers and byte pointers, and the severe
    lack of registers.

    --
    Michael Meissner
    email: mrmnews@the-meissners.org
    http://www.the-meissners.org

  15. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    Michael Meissner wrote:
    > "toby" writes:
    >
    > > Hi,
    > >
    > > In their paper, "Portability of C Programs and the UNIX System", S.C.
    > > Johnson and Dennis Ritchie write,
    > >
    > > \\
    > > Even before the idea of moving UNIX occurred to us, it was clear that C
    > > was successful enough to warrant production of compilers for an
    > > increasing variety of machines. Therefore, one of the authors (SCJ)
    > > undertook to produce a new compiler intended from the start to be
    > > easily modified. This new compiler is now in use on the IBM System/370
    > > under both OS and TSS, the Honeywell 6000, the
    > > Interdata 8/32, the SEL86 the Data General Nova and Eclipse, the DEC
    > > VAX11/780, and a Bell System processor. Versions are in progress for
    > > the Intel 8086 microprocessor and other machines.
    > > //
    > >
    > > Do any of these ports of pcc or pcc2 still exist? I am interested in
    > > the Nova/Eclipse versions in particular.

    >
    > Speaking as the person who was one of the primary authors of the C front for
    > the MV/Eclipse, I have severe doubts PCC could generate code for the DG
    > machines with their concept of word pointers and byte pointers, and the severe
    > lack of registers.


    I imagine it would have required quite a bit of surgery to do so, yes -
    but Dennis' paper I quoted* does claim such a beast existed. I wish we
    could find a copy floating in formaldehyde somewhere, so we could
    marvel at it.

    * http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/dmr/portpap.html

    >
    > --
    > Michael Meissner
    > email: mrmnews@the-meissners.org
    > http://www.the-meissners.org



  16. Re: Looking for Johnson's pcc - DG Nova and Eclipse

    G'day Toby (et al) -

    Quick notes:

    IPT (Information Processing Techniques) sold a C compiler for Data General
    Nova, Eclipse and MVs systems during the 1980s. It ran under the RDOS, AOS
    and AOS/VS operating system, and generated code that could be used on any
    Nova, Eclipse or MV.

    IPT also sold a UNIX system that ran on DG Eclipse computers.

    The IRIS system from EDS / Point 4 (Educational Data Systems) usually ran
    nonstandard disk and multiplexor devices from 3rd party vendors, and SimH
    does not [yet] support these devices.


    Bruce


    Bruce Ray
    Wild Hare Computer Systems, Inc.
    bkr@WildHareComputers.com


    ....preserving the Data General legacy: www.NovasAreForever.com



    "toby" wrote in message
    news:1145627720.914581.63620@v46g2000cwv.googlegro ups.com...
    > Hi,
    >
    > In their paper, "Portability of C Programs and the UNIX System", S.C.
    > Johnson and Dennis Ritchie write,
    >
    > \\
    > Even before the idea of moving UNIX occurred to us, it was clear that C
    > was successful enough to warrant production of compilers for an
    > increasing variety of machines. Therefore, one of the authors (SCJ)
    > undertook to produce a new compiler intended from the start to be
    > easily modified. This new compiler is now in use on the IBM System/370
    > under both OS and TSS, the Honeywell 6000, the
    > Interdata 8/32, the SEL86 the Data General Nova and Eclipse, the DEC
    > VAX11/780, and a Bell System processor. Versions are in progress for
    > the Intel 8086 microprocessor and other machines.
    > //
    >
    > Do any of these ports of pcc or pcc2 still exist? I am interested in
    > the Nova/Eclipse versions in particular.
    >
    > --Toby
    >




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