Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine - Ubuntu

This is a discussion on Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine - Ubuntu ; Mike Easter wrote: > Some people see a troll behind every bush. Troll mania or something. Nope, just common sense. By your own link's definition of troll: " ... the intention of baiting other users into an emotional response or ...

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Thread: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

  1. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    Mike Easter wrote:
    > Some people see a troll behind every bush. Troll mania or something.


    Nope, just common sense. By your own link's definition of troll:

    " ... the intention of baiting other users into an emotional response or
    to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion."

    Did you read his Subject line? It's ****. He doesn't want help, he
    doesn't ask for it. Just troll-bait. Are you blind?

    > Saying, 'you must be a troll; I'm an experienced linux user and I've set
    > up systems for those who don't know how to set up an operating system and
    > its apps and those systems and users I've set up don't have any trouble
    > with what I've set up.' ... is not actually addressing the issues which
    > were brought up.


    He doesn't ask for them to be addressed. What if I went to a Windows NG
    and said, Mum & Dad will never use a Windows machine. There's no
    software but a text editor. Where's my word processor? All the **** I
    have to install just to have a basic useful Operating System. Until
    recently no Firewall and ports wide open, just begging for a virus. All
    the updates, all the restarts just to install any basic application. Why
    the hell would *anyone* want to put their parents through that?

    He's a troll.

    --
    As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be
    glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours;
    and this we should do freely and generously.
    --Benjamin Franklin

  2. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    Julian Cann wrote:

    ......
    > Like many Windows people I have become curious about the Linux
    > phenomenon and have spent weeks with first Ubuntu 7.10/8.04, and more
    > recently Mandriva 2008...both running under VirtualBox.


    Virtualbox. Have you configured it to emulate a soundcard?
    Have you installed the provided guest tools to make use of enhanced
    graphics, network and, last but not least, sound?

    > They install beautifully and look fantastic. Internet configs itself,
    > email is a breeze...hey this is really cool.
    >
    > Then I try to play an audio CD...!
    >
    > Initially Ubuntu popped it onto the desktop and fired up a CD
    > player...perfect. Unfortunately it's never done it again since. It has
    > also never done it ever with Mandriva.


    Most probably you had no sound installed at all. Did you check with system
    sounds, kcontrol or a mp3 player?

    > OK I'll Google a fix. Lots and lots of command line ways to achieve my
    > end, and I've tried so many of them my head is
    > spinning...permissions...mounting/unmounting...attached folders etc.
    > None have worked ever, and each helpful person gives different code to
    > the last one..!
    >
    > You see it's that 5% that will never allow mum & dad access to these
    > OS's.
    >

    Your failure. No real hardware.

    --
    vista policy violation: Microsoft optical mouse found penguin patterns
    on mousepad. Partition scan in progress to remove offending
    incompatible products. Reactivate MS software.
    Linux 2.6.24. [LinuxCounter#295241,ICQ#4918962]

  3. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    johnny bobby bee wrote:
    > Mike Easter wrote:
    >> Some people see a troll behind every bush. Troll mania or something.

    >
    > Nope, just common sense. By your own link's definition of troll:
    >
    > " ... the intention of baiting other users into an emotional response or
    > to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion."


    He is a relative linux newbie who uses Win and has an extensive non-troll
    posting history and mostly posts about win issues, but also linux related
    issues and is posting with a win newsreader here.

    He is posting in a linux group with a win app with an opinion which is
    mixed positive and negative regarding linux distro experience.

    I think that calling any linux 'gripe' which is so posted to be a trolling
    process by a 'windroid' is overcalling trolls, which overcall is also
    discussed in the same link I cited and you pasted from. As such, it is an
    ad hominem attack.

    > Did you read his Subject line? It's ****. He doesn't want help, he
    > doesn't ask for it. Just troll-bait. Are you blind?


    If you are getting emotional about his message body content and subject,
    then you are responding too emotionally. I'm not blind and that is also
    an ad hominem remark.

    > He's a troll.


    Here's a snurled link to his posting history as seen in GG advanced search
    on the posting email address http://snipr.com/2obm6

    Look over a few score previous posts and see if you still think that they
    are the posts of a 'typical' or stereotypical usenet troll. Then think
    about if you just reacted emotionally to a slightly negative remark about
    linux and because of your own reaction you called somone else a troll.

    I didn't react emotionally to his post. I've seen some people do just as
    well with a linux install 'from the factor' such as Linspire did as they
    do with a Windows install from the factory, which people would not do as
    well if they had to install windows 'from scratch' while encountering
    hardware or driver problems and might also have trouble with a linux
    distro install from scratch if they encountered hardware or driver
    problems.

    Saying that you installed and support a linux system for a 'mum & dad' and
    they don't have trouble doesn't mean that the OP didn't hit some snags and
    have an opinion that some of his relatives would have a hard time with
    that.



    --
    Mike Easter


  4. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On Tuesday 24 Jun 2008 08:29 Julian Cann licked a pencil and jotted:

    > Whenever I read a Linux newbie (like me) complain about the need to use
    > command line, every man and his dog comes out of the woodwork to say how
    > secure the system is and how they must learn how it all works in order
    > to run it properly.
    > Now I really believe that this is true.
    > I also believe that this is just fine, and suits many people who love to
    > get down and dirty with there Op. Sys. and learn a huge amount of code.
    >
    > I guess I take issue with the development of fancy GUI's and the
    > pretence that these distros can actually be used by mum and dad. At
    > first sight they appear to be as user friendly as that "other" OS, but
    > in reality are never going to tread that territory.
    >
    > Giving people 95% GUI is worse than giving them none, because it can
    > still only be functional if you are a command line aficionado, and want
    > to learn a whole new language.
    >
    > Like many Windows people I have become curious about the Linux
    > phenomenon and have spent weeks with first Ubuntu 7.10/8.04, and more
    > recently Mandriva 2008...both running under VirtualBox.
    > They install beautifully and look fantastic. Internet configs itself,
    > email is a breeze...hey this is really cool.
    >
    > Then I try to play an audio CD...!
    >
    > Initially Ubuntu popped it onto the desktop and fired up a CD
    > player...perfect. Unfortunately it's never done it again since. It has
    > also never done it ever with Mandriva.
    > OK I'll Google a fix. Lots and lots of command line ways to achieve my
    > end, and I've tried so many of them my head is
    > spinning...permissions...mounting/unmounting...attached folders etc.
    > None have worked ever, and each helpful person gives different code to
    > the last one..!
    >
    > You see it's that 5% that will never allow mum & dad access to these
    > OS's.
    >
    > Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking any Linux distro, I am sure they
    > are fantastic at what they do, but per-lease, don't pretend the public
    > will ever take them up.
    >
    > So why bother with a GUI? Pure deception if you ask me. Leave it all on
    > the terminal and let the code boys have their fun. Just stop pretending
    > it will compete with Windows.
    >
    > I can easily play a CD under DOS...Windows...OS/2...eCS...you name it,
    > but Linux?
    >
    > I hope the people who sell these distros pre-installed onto laptops
    > point this out to their prospective buyers? They could be very pissed
    > off, otherwise.
    >
    > regards
    >


    A month after being a total Linux virgin I was converted.

    I went nowhere near the command line in the first few weeks. Now, just over
    a year later, I use it when I *choose* to because it is often faster when
    you learn commands, you know, a little bit like tying appwiz.cpl in the run
    Windows run command is quicker than pointy clicking and waiting for loads
    of windows to open to get to the add/remove programs. Depends how well you
    type and how keen on learning you are of course.

    You do know there are quite a few command line tools in Windows too don't
    you? Not as many and nowhere near as useful, fast, efficient and productive
    as you get installed as standard in Ubuntu (I am guessing other distros
    have varying degrees of quantity and quality but I am only familiar with
    Ubuntu so far - whatever the details it's going to be better quality and
    quantity than Windows)

    The point is, you don't have to use those commands - at work, I am glad
    Windows kept some of them as many admins would be lost without them, I also
    regularly curse that I cannot use a simple command line tool to do a fairly
    simple job I can do at home with one command - good design dictates an easy
    intuitive interface for beginners to stumble around and keep the real,
    powerful features there, out of sight but easily accessed for when you have
    got used to the "product" and want to get some real work (or play) done.
    That good design goes for anything, from software through cookers to cars.
    Windows seemed to lose the plot, believing that all their users will never
    need to do anything other than point and click.

    My 12 yo daughter asked for Ubuntu on her PC a few months after I put it on
    mine - I set it as a dual boot when I rebuilt it and it has never, not
    once, been booted into XP.

    She manages just fine, she installs programs; customises her icons,
    desktop(s) and password mask; does arty stuff; chats on MSN and does all
    the other stuff that that girls her age do and more - the main difference
    is I don't have to keep doing housekeeping tasks on it for her like I did
    when she used Windows.

    She does an occasional "sudo mount -a" to remount the dozen or so mounted
    shares that contain all the video and music on the server, then only if I
    have been messing with stuff on the server or network. It's run for months
    without me having to really touch it - compare that to the hour or so every
    week or two I needed to spend sorting something out when she used XP.

    My wife switched at about the same time as my daughter, said she would give
    it a go - she was less enthusiastic but has not asked to switch back. She
    occasionally has minor problems which she can't sort out, again though, far
    less often than she did on XP. She also installs programs (which she rarely
    did before, because it is so easy to add them compared to Windows), edits
    music and burns CDs - hell, she never used Nero before but seems happy with
    k3b.

    ISTM (I may be wrong) but yours seems the typical moan of someone who hasn't
    given it a fair crack of the whip, has been scared off by fixes given by
    experienced users who don't necessarily know what desktop environment the
    helpee is using and above all is frightened because it is different to what
    they have already learned parrot fashion about using Windows.

    One other thing, don't expect everything to behave perfectly using
    virtualisation - I tried Ubuntu for about an hour in VMware and almost
    straight away realised that I was making trouble for myself. A proper
    install a little while later and things started to just work.

    David
    --
    Knowledge is of two kinds: we know a subject ourselves, or we know where we
    can find information upon it. (Samuel Johnson)
    Only the mediocre are always at their best. (Jean Giraudoux)
    (Reply address genuine - Checked occasionally)

  5. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 17:29:36 +1000, Julian Cann wrote:

    > Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking any Linux distro, I am sure they
    > are fantastic at what they do, but per-lease, don't pretend the public
    > will ever take them up.



    ___________________
    /| /| | |
    ||__|| | Please do |
    / O O\__ NOT |
    / \ feed the |
    / \ \ trolls |
    / _ \ \ ______________|
    / |\____\ \ ||
    / | | | |\____/ ||
    / \|_|_|/ \ __||
    / / \ |____| ||
    / | | /| | --|
    | | |// |____ --|
    * _ | |_|_|_| | \-/
    *-- _--\ _ \ // |
    / _ \\ _ // | /
    * / \_ /- | - | |
    * ___ c_c_c_C/ \C_c_c_c____________



    --
    "Bother!" said Pooh, as he inserted the suppository.


  6. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 18:12:06 -0500, Dan C wrote:

    > On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 17:29:36 +1000, Julian Cann wrote:
    >
    >> Don't get me wrong, I am not knocking any Linux distro, I am sure they
    >> are fantastic at what they do, but per-lease, don't pretend the public
    >> will ever take them up.

    >
    >
    > ___________________
    > /| /| | |
    > ||__|| | Please do |
    > / O O\__ NOT |
    > / \ feed the |
    > / \ \ Dan C Troll |
    > / _ \ \ ______________|
    > / |\____\ \ ||
    > / | | | |\____/ ||
    > / \|_|_|/ \ __||
    > / / \ |____| ||
    > / | | /| | --|
    > | | |// |____ --|
    > * _ | |_|_|_| | \-/
    > *-- _--\ _ \ // |
    > / _ \\ _ // | /
    > * / \_ /- | - | |
    > * ___ c_c_c_C/ \C_c_c_c____________


    Edited for the TRVTH!



  7. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 20:06:02 -0400, Meat Plow wrote:



    > Edited for the TRVTH!


    I'm not the one doing the trolling, dimwit.


    --
    "Bother!" said Pooh, as he put on the hockey mask and started the saw.


  8. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    In article <1608774.75pF3AKulJ@baldylocks>, me.signup@gmail.com says...
    > One other thing, don't expect everything to behave perfectly using
    > virtualisation - I tried Ubuntu for about an hour in VMware and almost
    > straight away realised that I was making trouble for myself. A proper
    > install a little while later and things started to just work.
    >
    > David
    >
    >

    Goodness, I have struck a nerve!

    To address a couple of points:

    I have configured Virtualbox correctly for sound etc.

    I currently have approx 30 virtual OS's configured at the moment, using
    Virtualbox, Virtual PC and VMware. I think I have by now figured out how
    to configure the VM's.

    I have a keen interest in alternate and bygone OS's and GUI's and am
    currently collecting old boxes to install them on "real" machines as
    well as VM's.
    I agree that there is a possibility that VirtualBox can't process the
    CD/sound handling of Ubuntu and Mandriva, although I think it unlikely.

    I am not at all averse to command line applications and indeed many of
    my virtual OS's are heavily command line oriented.

    Indeed, my history includes 20 years (1969-1988)of commercial
    programming and system design on mainframes and mini's running assembler
    apps. punched cards..paper tape..mag tapes etc. so I am by no means a
    newbie in those terms, nor do I hold a negative view of those kinds of
    disciplines.

    I guess I originally turned my attention to Linux distros because I saw
    them constantly touted as real opposition to Windows for everyday use,
    and I was curious to just give them a go, anyway.
    They are, as I said before, now pre-installed onto some new machines,
    which fueled my belief that they must be mum-and-dad ready.

    To be honest I am very impressed with the two distros I have tried, and
    am keen to make them work for me. I probably will, too.

    My question is the underlying philosophy of where they are aimed, which
    I can't reconcile in my mind, hence the points I raised previously. I
    have no criticisms of them as they are and for what they are obviously
    capable of, merely the apparent target market.

    It has not been my intention to troll, rather to raise a matter which
    obviously frustrated me, so please don't let this issue upset you guys.
    I confess that is interesting to see such a mixed response, though.
    regards
    --
    ....
    Jules
    Brisbane, Australia

  9. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    Julian Cann wrote:

    > Goodness, I have struck a nerve!


    Nope. You have posted lots of bull****.

    > To address a couple of points:
    >


    You have no point. You are a windummy

    < snip drivel >
    --
    Microsoft's Product Strategy: "It compiles, let's ship it!"


  10. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    Julian Cann wrote:

    .....
    > Goodness, I have struck a nerve!
    >

    ;-//

    > To address a couple of points:

    ......
    > I agree that there is a possibility that VirtualBox can't process the
    > CD/sound handling of Ubuntu and Mandriva, although I think it unlikely.
    >

    Since even linux now attempts to play cds via ide/sata bus directly by
    default, that may be a reason why it fails with virtualized hardware (the
    host OS not allowing for direct access, or other incompatibilities).
    We have another problem as well: windows basically contains just the OS and
    really basic/crippled applications - or very sophisticated looking apps
    like mediaplayer, where that big effort is thrown in mainly to force
    acceptence of DRM'd content. While linux distributions more and more want
    to offer all the goodies with it, like perfect hardware recognition, all
    possible drivers/modules included, a truckload of applications from office
    to internet related apps to multimedia of all sorts.
    There is always one or the other flaw in putting these things together
    ......
    > I guess I originally turned my attention to Linux distros because I saw
    > them constantly touted as real opposition to Windows for everyday use,
    > and I was curious to just give them a go, anyway.
    > They are, as I said before, now pre-installed onto some new machines,
    > which fueled my belief that they must be mum-and-dad ready.
    >
    > To be honest I am very impressed with the two distros I have tried, and
    > am keen to make them work for me. I probably will, too.
    >
    > My question is the underlying philosophy of where they are aimed, which
    > I can't reconcile in my mind, hence the points I raised previously. I
    > have no criticisms of them as they are and for what they are obviously
    > capable of, merely the apparent target market.
    >

    Some linux distributions try too hard to be fit for grandma, and may run
    things in the backyard just like windows does. Maybe windows is a bit more
    perfect in doing that, linux still has the good old commandline/shell tools
    to find and correct one or the other mistake. However, to do that it needs
    some experience which Grandma won't have.
    Well, that applies to windows as well - did you ever have to mess with the
    latest and greatest HDaudio on windows? Anyways, most windows installs come
    preinstalled with all the drivers (and other trialware/nagware/adware) from
    the retailer.

    --
    vista policy violation: Microsoft optical mouse found penguin patterns
    on mousepad. Partition scan in progress to remove offending
    incompatible products. Reactivate MS software.
    Linux 2.6.24. [LinuxCounter#295241,ICQ#4918962]

  11. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    Dan C wrote:
    >
    > ___________________
    > /| /| | |
    > ||__|| | Please do |
    > / O O\__ NOT |
    > / \ feed the |
    > / \ \ trolls |
    > / _ \ \ ______________|
    > / |\____\ \ ||
    > / | | | |\____/ ||
    > / \|_|_|/ \ __||
    > / / \ |____| ||
    > / | | /| | --|
    > | | |// |____ --|
    > * _ | |_|_|_| | \-/
    > *-- _--\ _ \ // |
    > / _ \\ _ // | /
    > * / \_ /- | - | |
    > * ___ c_c_c_C/ \C_c_c_c____________
    >


    See, if Dan thinks he's a troll, that's good enough for me.

    --
    As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be
    glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours;
    and this we should do freely and generously.
    --Benjamin Franklin

  12. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    Mike Easter wrote:
    > If you are getting emotional about his message body content and subject,
    > then you are responding too emotionally. I'm not blind and that is also
    > an ad hominem remark.


    Sorry for the 'blind' comment. Didn't mean to offend you. And yes,
    sometimes I respond emotionally. Especially to troll-bait.

    > Look over a few score previous posts and see if you still think that they
    > are the posts of a 'typical' or stereotypical usenet troll. Then think
    > about if you just reacted emotionally to a slightly negative remark about
    > linux and because of your own reaction you called somone else a troll.


    I haven't looked into his previous posts, nor do I really care to. It
    doesn't mean that he's not trolling here. I may be wrong about him, but
    there are better, more constructive ways to give feedback, even criticism.

    > Saying that you installed and support a linux system for a 'mum & dad' and
    > they don't have trouble doesn't mean that the OP didn't hit some snags and
    > have an opinion that some of his relatives would have a hard time with
    > that.


    I never implied that. Nor would I expect everyone to have a trouble-free
    Linux install. I just stated my experience as did the OP. You know, to
    balance things.

    --
    As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be
    glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours;
    and this we should do freely and generously.
    --Benjamin Franklin

  13. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 15:03:08 +1000, Julian Cann wrote:

    > Goodness, I have struck a nerve!


    No, you have succeeded with your trolling attempt.

    Bugger off, Win-droid.


    --
    "Bother!" said Pooh, as he inhaled.


  14. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 21:21:00 -0500, Dan C wrote:

    > On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 20:06:02 -0400, Meat Plow wrote:


    >


    Coward.


    >> ___________________
    >> /| /| | |
    >> ||__|| | Please do |
    >> / O O\__ NOT |
    >> / \ feed the |
    >> / \ \ Dan C Troll |
    >> / _ \ \ ______________|
    >> / |\____\ \ ||
    >> / | | | |\____/ ||
    >> / \|_|_|/ \ __||
    >> / / \ |____| ||
    >> / | | /| | --|
    >> | | |// |____ --|
    >> * _ | |_|_|_| | \-/
    >> *-- _--\ _ \ // |
    >> / _ \\ _ // | /
    >> * / \_ /- | - | |
    >> * ___ c_c_c_C/ \C_c_c_c____________

    >
    >> Edited for the TRVTH!

    >
    > I'm not the one doing the trolling, dimwit.


    Surrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrre you're not.



  15. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 08:20:26 -0500, Dan C wrote:

    > On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 15:03:08 +1000, Julian Cann wrote:
    >
    >> Goodness, I have struck a nerve!

    >
    > No, you have succeeded with your trolling attempt.
    >
    > Bugger off, Win-droid.



    ___________________
    /| /| | |
    ||__|| | Please do |
    / O O\__ NOT |
    / \ feed the |
    / \ \ Dan C Troll |
    / _ \ \ ______________|
    / |\____\ \ ||
    / | | | |\____/ ||
    / \|_|_|/ \ __||
    / / \ |____| ||
    / | | /| | --|
    | | |// |____ --|
    * _ | |_|_|_| | \-/
    *-- _--\ _ \ // |
    / _ \\ _ // | /
    * / \_ /- | - | |
    * ___ c_c_c_C/ \C_c_c_c____________


  16. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    Meat Plow illuminated alt.os.linux.ubuntu by typing:

    >


    Too much noise. Not enough substance from this particular poster.



    --
    Moog

    “Are you going to come quietly, or do I have to use earplugs?”

  17. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 19:55:54 +0000, Moog wrote:

    > Meat Plow illuminated alt.os.linux.ubuntu by typing:
    >
    >>

    >
    > Too much noise.


    Oooooooooooooooohhhh the IRONY.

    > Not enough substance from this particular poster.


    At least my substance is not to berate and embarrass new posters
    because they don't know what you know.

    >


    Ah what the matter? Don't like hearing the truth?

    Moog and Dan C both troll .ubuntu. Both have HUGE chips on their shoulders.
    Both are petulant hypocrites. Both pick on new posters. So you don't see
    it but you already know who you are so it doesn't matter.





  18. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On 2008-06-25, Meat Plow wrote:
    > On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 19:55:54 +0000, Moog wrote:
    >> Meat Plow illuminated alt.os.linux.ubuntu by typing:
    >>>

    >>
    >> Too much noise.

    >
    > Oooooooooooooooohhhh the IRONY.
    >
    >> Not enough substance from this particular poster.

    >
    > At least my substance is not to berate and embarrass new posters
    > because they don't know what you know.
    >
    >>

    >
    > Ah what the matter? Don't like hearing the truth?
    >
    > Moog and Dan C both troll .ubuntu. Both have HUGE chips on their shoulders.
    > Both are petulant hypocrites. Both pick on new posters. So you don't see
    > it but you already know who you are so it doesn't matter.


    We know that. We don't need you to keep telling us.

    We have Dan C killfiled and wouldn't see his rubbish if you didn't
    keep re-posting it.

    Your own signal-to-noise ration is little better than Dan C's.



    --
    Chris F.A. Johnson, author |
    Shell Scripting Recipes: | My code in this post, if any,
    A Problem-Solution Approach | is released under the
    2005, Apress | GNU General Public Licence

  19. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 20:15:46 +0000, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote:

    > On 2008-06-25, Meat Plow wrote:
    >> On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 19:55:54 +0000, Moog wrote:
    >>> Meat Plow illuminated alt.os.linux.ubuntu by typing:
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Too much noise.

    >>
    >> Oooooooooooooooohhhh the IRONY.
    >>
    >>> Not enough substance from this particular poster.

    >>
    >> At least my substance is not to berate and embarrass new posters
    >> because they don't know what you know.
    >>
    >>>

    >>
    >> Ah what the matter? Don't like hearing the truth?
    >>
    >> Moog and Dan C both troll .ubuntu. Both have HUGE chips on their
    >> shoulders. Both are petulant hypocrites. Both pick on new posters. So
    >> you don't see it but you already know who you are so it doesn't matter.

    >
    > We know that. We don't need you to keep telling us.
    >
    > We have Dan C killfiled and wouldn't see his rubbish if you didn't
    > keep re-posting it.
    >
    > Your own signal-to-noise ration is little better than Dan C's.
    >
    >


    Chris,
    I hope you didn't mean this about Moog, as no sane person who has read
    this group for a while could possibly call him a troll. If anyone has
    kept a sane head with a bit of humour when things have got heated it's
    Moog. And he has always been around to give good advice in a non-
    confrontational way.
    Good God. Compared with a lot of the folk here he's a bloody saint.
    I think an apology is called for.

  20. Re: Mum & Dad will never use a Linux machine

    On 2008-06-25, davesurrey wrote:
    > On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 20:15:46 +0000, Chris F.A. Johnson wrote:
    >
    >> On 2008-06-25, Meat Plow wrote:
    >>> On Wed, 25 Jun 2008 19:55:54 +0000, Moog wrote:
    >>>> Meat Plow illuminated alt.os.linux.ubuntu by typing:
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Too much noise.
    >>>
    >>> Oooooooooooooooohhhh the IRONY.
    >>>
    >>>> Not enough substance from this particular poster.
    >>>
    >>> At least my substance is not to berate and embarrass new posters
    >>> because they don't know what you know.
    >>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Ah what the matter? Don't like hearing the truth?
    >>>
    >>> Moog and Dan C both troll .ubuntu. Both have HUGE chips on their
    >>> shoulders. Both are petulant hypocrites. Both pick on new posters. So
    >>> you don't see it but you already know who you are so it doesn't matter.

    >>
    >> We know that. We don't need you to keep telling us.
    >>
    >> We have Dan C killfiled and wouldn't see his rubbish if you didn't
    >> keep re-posting it.
    >>
    >> Your own signal-to-noise ration is little better than Dan C's.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Chris,
    > I hope you didn't mean this about Moog,


    Of course not. See the top attribution, which refers to the message
    I was responding to.

    --
    Chris F.A. Johnson, author |
    Shell Scripting Recipes: | My code in this post, if any,
    A Problem-Solution Approach | is released under the
    2005, Apress | GNU General Public Licence

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