Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed - Ubuntu

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Thread: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

  1. Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    I want to reformat the HD on my old PC [1] and install Ubunto

    Where can I get _IDIOTPROOF_ info please

    Before I reformat, I also need to know how to first create a boot CD in case
    the wheel comes off.
    (So that I can reinstall XP if all else fails)

    [1] The PC is a DELL Pentium 3 700
    40GB HDD with 512MB of RAM
    It currently is dual booted with XP Pro and Win98

    --
    ¦zulu¦
    Excuse any typos - I'm nearly blind :-(






  2. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:49:14 +0000, zulu wrote:

    > I want to reformat the HD on my old PC [1] and install Ubunto
    >
    > Where can I get _IDIOTPROOF_ info please


    Take it from a programmer that idiotproof doesn't exist. Everytime I
    think I finally managed to idiotproof my software, the world simply
    invents a better idiot.

    http://www.ubuntu.com would be a good start though.

    http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Feisty is also a good site.

    >
    > Before I reformat, I also need to know how to first create a boot CD in
    > case the wheel comes off.
    > (So that I can reinstall XP if all else fails)


    The Ubuntu Live CD is bootable, just burn it.
    The same goes for your XP CD, it is bootable as well so if you want to
    reinstall XP, just grab your XP CD, boot with it and off you go.


    --
    Stephan
    2003 Yamaha R6

    君のこと思い出す日なんてないのは
    君のこと忘れたときがないから

  3. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed


    "Stephan Rose" wrote in message
    news:spqdnVR7Ud3yzG_bnZ2dnUVZ8tSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
    > On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:49:14 +0000, zulu wrote:
    >
    >> I want to reformat the HD on my old PC [1] and install Ubunto
    >>
    >> Where can I get _IDIOTPROOF_ info please

    >
    > Take it from a programmer that idiotproof doesn't exist. Everytime I
    > think I finally managed to idiotproof my software, the world simply
    > invents a better idiot.


    That's me

    >
    > http://www.ubuntu.com would be a good start though.
    >
    > http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Feisty is also a good site.
    >


    Off to investigate
    Thanks.

    >> Before I reformat, I also need to know how to first create a boot CD in
    >> case the wheel comes off.
    >> (So that I can reinstall XP if all else fails)

    >
    > The Ubuntu Live CD is bootable, just burn it.
    > The same goes for your XP CD, it is bootable as well so if you want to
    > reinstall XP, just grab your XP CD, boot with it and off you go.
    >
    >


    So I can safely *Format* whatever at any time, (The HDD must be partitioned,
    I guess) and then it will just reboot when I insert the CD for either XP or
    Obunto>

    In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    irretrievably!

    Cheers

    --
    ¦zulu¦


    > 君のこと思い出す日なんてないのは
    > 君のこと忘れたときがないから




  4. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    "zulu" writes:

    > "Stephan Rose" wrote in message
    > news:spqdnVR7Ud3yzG_bnZ2dnUVZ8tSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
    >> On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:49:14 +0000, zulu wrote:
    >>
    >>> I want to reformat the HD on my old PC [1] and install Ubunto
    >>>
    >>> Where can I get _IDIOTPROOF_ info please

    >>
    >> Take it from a programmer that idiotproof doesn't exist. Everytime I
    >> think I finally managed to idiotproof my software, the world simply
    >> invents a better idiot.

    >
    > That's me
    >
    >>
    >> http://www.ubuntu.com would be a good start though.
    >>
    >> http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Feisty is also a good site.
    >>

    >
    > Off to investigate
    > Thanks.
    >
    >>> Before I reformat, I also need to know how to first create a boot CD in
    >>> case the wheel comes off.
    >>> (So that I can reinstall XP if all else fails)

    >>
    >> The Ubuntu Live CD is bootable, just burn it.
    >> The same goes for your XP CD, it is bootable as well so if you want to
    >> reinstall XP, just grab your XP CD, boot with it and off you go.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > So I can safely *Format* whatever at any time, (The HDD must be partitioned,
    > I guess) and then it will just reboot when I insert the CD for either XP or
    > Obunto>


    Stop. What about your XP? Are you sure you can reinstall it? The install
    media for XP is not there hidden on a secret partition?

    >
    > In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    > irretrievably!


    really, little can go wrong. Wack the Feisty live cd in and opt to
    install. I strongly recommend making 5 partitions.

    about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root".
    about 5 gig for a swap file (you dont need this as your could use a swap
    file too) but its probably easier to go with it.
    about 10 gig for /var
    about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition
    the rest for /home

    if you want to be really good and you dont have any external hard
    drives, also create a backup ext3 partition for you to use as a
    repository for the excellent rsnapshot which can takes periodic
    snapshots of your configured critical files.

    obviously all relative to the size of the disk.

    Why? Well, nearly all your important data will be stored in /home. With
    /home mounted on a separate partition it is a doddle to reinstall an OS
    - just tell the new installation to mount your "old" /home as /home in
    order to get all your data and setting backs. Why the fat32/ntfs? Believe me,
    just do it - even if its just to have common read/write between
    linux/windows of varying versions. Why /var? Because of spool mostly.


    These are just a few quick comments to whet your appetite. Read up on
    partitioning via google - if you start properly now you won't look back.


    >
    > Cheers


    --
    Lo que se mueve por sÃ* mismo es inmortal.
    -- Platón. (427-347 a.C.) Filósofo griego.

  5. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:05:47 +0200, Hadron wrote:

    > "zulu" writes:
    >
    >> "Stephan Rose" wrote in message
    >> news:spqdnVR7Ud3yzG_bnZ2dnUVZ8tSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
    >>> On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:49:14 +0000, zulu wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> I want to reformat the HD on my old PC [1] and install Ubunto
    >>>>
    >>>> Where can I get _IDIOTPROOF_ info please
    >>>
    >>> Take it from a programmer that idiotproof doesn't exist. Everytime I
    >>> think I finally managed to idiotproof my software, the world simply
    >>> invents a better idiot.

    >>
    >> That's me
    >>
    >>
    >>> http://www.ubuntu.com would be a good start though.
    >>>
    >>> http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Feisty is also a good site.
    >>>
    >>>

    >> Off to investigate
    >> Thanks.
    >>
    >>>> Before I reformat, I also need to know how to first create a boot CD
    >>>> in case the wheel comes off.
    >>>> (So that I can reinstall XP if all else fails)
    >>>
    >>> The Ubuntu Live CD is bootable, just burn it. The same goes for your
    >>> XP CD, it is bootable as well so if you want to reinstall XP, just
    >>> grab your XP CD, boot with it and off you go.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>

    >> So I can safely *Format* whatever at any time, (The HDD must be
    >> partitioned, I guess) and then it will just reboot when I insert the CD
    >> for either XP or Obunto>

    >
    > Stop. What about your XP? Are you sure you can reinstall it? The install
    > media for XP is not there hidden on a secret partition?
    >
    >
    >> In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    >> irretrievably!

    >
    > really, little can go wrong. Wack the Feisty live cd in and opt to
    > install. I strongly recommend making 5 partitions.
    >
    > about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root". about 5 gig for a swap file
    > (you dont need this as your could use a swap file too) but its probably
    > easier to go with it. about 10 gig for /var
    > about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition the rest for /home
    >
    > if you want to be really good and you dont have any external hard
    > drives, also create a backup ext3 partition for you to use as a
    > repository for the excellent rsnapshot which can takes periodic
    > snapshots of your configured critical files.
    >
    > obviously all relative to the size of the disk.
    >
    > Why? Well, nearly all your important data will be stored in /home. With
    > /home mounted on a separate partition it is a doddle to reinstall an OS
    > - just tell the new installation to mount your "old" /home as /home in
    > order to get all your data and setting backs. Why the fat32/ntfs?
    > Believe me, just do it - even if its just to have common read/write
    > between linux/windows of varying versions. Why /var? Because of spool
    > mostly.
    >


    Hmm that is interesting about /var.

    I usually go with 4 partitions myself.

    One for root, one for home, one for swap and one shared fat32 partition.

    --
    Stephan
    2003 Yamaha R6

    君のこと思い出す日なんてないのは
    君のこと忘れたときがないから

  6. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:05:47 +0200, Hadron wrote:

    >> In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    >> irretrievably!


    Systems are easily replaceable. Your crucial data somewhat less so.

    Make sure you have a backup. And another backup at a friend's house. And
    keep your first backup away from things that catch fire (like Dell laptops).

    > really, little can go wrong. Wack the Feisty live cd in and opt to
    > install. I strongly recommend making 5 partitions.


    You can also simply accept the default choices that the Ubuntu installer
    makes for you. It's done this a lot more often than have any of us :-)

    > about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root".


    Only if you intend to install every damn thing in the repository.
    Otherwise 5Gb is plenty.

    > about 5 gig for a swap file


    If you need 5Gb of swap you EITHER have a lot of memory and do a lot of
    numbercrunching, OR you need more RAM.

    > (you dont need this as your could use a swap file too) but its probably
    > easier to go with it.


    RAM < swap < 2xRAM is fine for most people.

    > about 10 gig for /var


    Again, only if you run a server and keep really detailed logs. Or if you
    really do install every damn thing in the repositories and keep the cached
    packages to boot (near-pun unintended).

    > about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition


    Depends on taste. I wouldn't give it a single nibble, let alone several
    Gb!

    > the rest for /home


    That's the idea. Hopefully the OP still has some left by this stage...!

  7. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    Stephan Rose writes:

    > On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:05:47 +0200, Hadron wrote:
    >
    >> "zulu" writes:
    >>
    >>> "Stephan Rose" wrote in message
    >>> news:spqdnVR7Ud3yzG_bnZ2dnUVZ8tSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
    >>>> On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:49:14 +0000, zulu wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> I want to reformat the HD on my old PC [1] and install Ubunto
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Where can I get _IDIOTPROOF_ info please
    >>>>
    >>>> Take it from a programmer that idiotproof doesn't exist. Everytime I
    >>>> think I finally managed to idiotproof my software, the world simply
    >>>> invents a better idiot.
    >>>
    >>> That's me
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> http://www.ubuntu.com would be a good start though.
    >>>>
    >>>> http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Feisty is also a good site.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>> Off to investigate
    >>> Thanks.
    >>>
    >>>>> Before I reformat, I also need to know how to first create a boot CD
    >>>>> in case the wheel comes off.
    >>>>> (So that I can reinstall XP if all else fails)
    >>>>
    >>>> The Ubuntu Live CD is bootable, just burn it. The same goes for your
    >>>> XP CD, it is bootable as well so if you want to reinstall XP, just
    >>>> grab your XP CD, boot with it and off you go.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>> So I can safely *Format* whatever at any time, (The HDD must be
    >>> partitioned, I guess) and then it will just reboot when I insert the CD
    >>> for either XP or Obunto>

    >>
    >> Stop. What about your XP? Are you sure you can reinstall it? The install
    >> media for XP is not there hidden on a secret partition?
    >>
    >>
    >>> In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    >>> irretrievably!

    >>
    >> really, little can go wrong. Wack the Feisty live cd in and opt to
    >> install. I strongly recommend making 5 partitions.
    >>
    >> about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root". about 5 gig for a swap file
    >> (you dont need this as your could use a swap file too) but its probably
    >> easier to go with it. about 10 gig for /var
    >> about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition the rest for /home
    >>
    >> if you want to be really good and you dont have any external hard
    >> drives, also create a backup ext3 partition for you to use as a
    >> repository for the excellent rsnapshot which can takes periodic
    >> snapshots of your configured critical files.
    >>
    >> obviously all relative to the size of the disk.
    >>
    >> Why? Well, nearly all your important data will be stored in /home. With
    >> /home mounted on a separate partition it is a doddle to reinstall an OS
    >> - just tell the new installation to mount your "old" /home as /home in
    >> order to get all your data and setting backs. Why the fat32/ntfs?
    >> Believe me, just do it - even if its just to have common read/write
    >> between linux/windows of varying versions. Why /var? Because of spool
    >> mostly.
    >>

    >
    > Hmm that is interesting about /var.
    >


    I'm not 100% sure to be honest. I do it because it's where my leafnode
    spool is. BUT possibly it *might* cause problems with .deb caches? I'm
    not 100% sure. I haven't had any issues though.

    > I usually go with 4 partitions myself.
    >
    > One for root, one for home, one for swap and one shared fat32 partition.


    --
    Do not underestimate the value of print statements for debugging.

  8. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    On 2007-09-20, Hadron wrote:
    > Stephan Rose writes:
    >
    >> On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:05:47 +0200, Hadron wrote:
    >>
    >>> about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root". about 5 gig for a swap file
    >>> (you dont need this as your could use a swap file too) but its probably
    >>> easier to go with it. about 10 gig for /var
    >>> about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition the rest for /home
    >>>
    >>> Why? Well, nearly all your important data will be stored in /home. With
    >>> /home mounted on a separate partition it is a doddle to reinstall an OS
    >>> - just tell the new installation to mount your "old" /home as /home in
    >>> order to get all your data and setting backs. Why the fat32/ntfs?
    >>> Believe me, just do it - even if its just to have common read/write
    >>> between linux/windows of varying versions. Why /var? Because of spool
    >>> mostly.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Hmm that is interesting about /var.
    >>

    >
    > I'm not 100% sure to be honest. I do it because it's where my leafnode
    > spool is. BUT possibly it *might* cause problems with .deb caches? I'm
    > not 100% sure. I haven't had any issues though.
    >


    i came across the concept of putting /home, /tmp and /var on
    different partitions because these parts of the file system will be written
    to most often and would then be at most risk of disk corruption. Since / is
    on a different partition it presumably will have least corruption, hence
    your system is more likely to be in a bootable state, even though you lost
    some data.
    Not sure how/if the concept still applies to journalling file systems.

    >> I usually go with 4 partitions myself.
    >>
    >> One for root, one for home, one for swap and one shared fat32 partition.

    >


    --
    l'air du temps


  9. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    Hadron wrote:
    > Stephan Rose writes:
    >
    >
    >> On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:05:47 +0200, Hadron wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>> "zulu" writes:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> "Stephan Rose" wrote in message
    >>>> news:spqdnVR7Ud3yzG_bnZ2dnUVZ8tSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
    >>>>
    >>>>> On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:49:14 +0000, zulu wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> I want to reformat the HD on my old PC [1] and install Ubunto
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Where can I get _IDIOTPROOF_ info please
    >>>>>>
    >>>>> Take it from a programmer that idiotproof doesn't exist. Everytime I
    >>>>> think I finally managed to idiotproof my software, the world simply
    >>>>> invents a better idiot.
    >>>>>
    >>>> That's me
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> http://www.ubuntu.com would be a good start though.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Feisty is also a good site.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>> Off to investigate
    >>>> Thanks.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>> Before I reformat, I also need to know how to first create a boot CD
    >>>>>> in case the wheel comes off.
    >>>>>> (So that I can reinstall XP if all else fails)
    >>>>>>
    >>>>> The Ubuntu Live CD is bootable, just burn it. The same goes for your
    >>>>> XP CD, it is bootable as well so if you want to reinstall XP, just
    >>>>> grab your XP CD, boot with it and off you go.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>> So I can safely *Format* whatever at any time, (The HDD must be
    >>>> partitioned, I guess) and then it will just reboot when I insert the CD
    >>>> for either XP or Obunto>
    >>>>
    >>> Stop. What about your XP? Are you sure you can reinstall it? The install
    >>> media for XP is not there hidden on a secret partition?
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    >>>> irretrievably!
    >>>>
    >>> really, little can go wrong. Wack the Feisty live cd in and opt to
    >>> install. I strongly recommend making 5 partitions.
    >>>
    >>> about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root". about 5 gig for a swap file
    >>> (you dont need this as your could use a swap file too) but its probably
    >>> easier to go with it. about 10 gig for /var
    >>> about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition the rest for /home
    >>>
    >>> if you want to be really good and you dont have any external hard
    >>> drives, also create a backup ext3 partition for you to use as a
    >>> repository for the excellent rsnapshot which can takes periodic
    >>> snapshots of your configured critical files.
    >>>
    >>> obviously all relative to the size of the disk.
    >>>
    >>> Why? Well, nearly all your important data will be stored in /home. With
    >>> /home mounted on a separate partition it is a doddle to reinstall an OS
    >>> - just tell the new installation to mount your "old" /home as /home in
    >>> order to get all your data and setting backs. Why the fat32/ntfs?
    >>> Believe me, just do it - even if its just to have common read/write
    >>> between linux/windows of varying versions. Why /var? Because of spool
    >>> mostly.
    >>>
    >>>

    >> Hmm that is interesting about /var.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > I'm not 100% sure to be honest. I do it because it's where my leafnode
    > spool is. BUT possibly it *might* cause problems with .deb caches? I'm
    > not 100% sure. I haven't had any issues though.


    The data in the /var partition grows and shrinks with normal use. Not
    only a news spool, but (system) mail, locks, and logs are written to it.
    So you never know just exactly how much disk space is required for this
    dynamic partition. If /var fills up completely, and it is not a separate
    partition but part of the root partition "/" then guess what happens
    when the HDD runs out of space? ;-)

    Here is what one of my Debian Etch systems uses for various partitions:

    john@deb4:~$ df
    Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on
    /dev/hda1 264445 155251 95541 62% /
    tmpfs 242232 0 242232 0% /lib/init/rw
    udev 10240 84 10156 1% /dev
    tmpfs 242232 0 242232 0% /dev/shm
    /dev/hda9 105597692 50805296 49428296 51% /home
    /dev/hda8 381138 10303 351157 3% /tmp
    /dev/hda5 4806904 1997380 2565340 44% /usr
    /dev/hda6 2885780 1236508 1502684 46% /var


    This scheme seems reasonable -- at least for my use -- and verified
    simply because each partition is approximately 50% full. This provides a
    lot of space for growth. It was determined from several years of study,
    using several different Unix-like OSes in my computer farm.

    The ball-park determination above is:

    / = 256 MB
    /usr = 5 GB
    /var = 3 GB
    /home = the remainder

    This Debian Etch box does not have tons of software installed. For
    someone who likes to download and install lots of goodies, then the size
    of the /usr partition should be increased. Maybe even the root ("/")
    could be larger to hold the increased amount of configuration files in
    the /etc partition.

    I know that some will believe I have "wasted" several gigabytes in /usr
    and /var, but gigabytes of hard disk storage are now down to less than
    two-bits (25 cents US) per GB. That means I may have sacrificed less
    than a dollar to be on the safe side. ;-)

    Not shown in the df listing above is hda2, which would be the extended
    partition containing hda5 through hda9. Unused primary partitions are
    hda3 and hda4.

    The /hda7 partition is also not shown in the df above because it is the
    swap partition.

    It is shown below in the fstab listing:

    john@deb4:~$ less /etc/fstab
    # /etc/fstab: static file system information.
    #
    #
    proc /proc proc defaults 0 0
    /dev/hda1 / ext3 defaults,errors=remount-ro 0 1
    /dev/hda9 /home ext3 defaults 0 2
    /dev/hda8 /tmp ext3 defaults 0 2
    /dev/hda5 /usr ext3 defaults 0 2
    /dev/hda6 /var ext3 defaults 0 2
    /dev/hda7 none swap sw 0 0
    /dev/hdc /media/cdrom0 udf,iso9660 user,noauto 0 0
    /dev/fd0 /media/floppy0 auto rw,user,noauto 0 0
    /etc/fstab (END)


    Fstab has provided me with a mount point for a floppy drive, even though
    there has never been a floppy drive installed in this computer.

    BTW, this Debian Etch (4.0) was a complete new install overwriting a
    Debian Sarge (3.1) system, instead of an upgrade. However, the /home
    partition is the same one used for the Debian Sarge system with all 51
    GB of data remaining intact. Sure glad I had learned to create /home in
    a separate partition years ago! Evidentially I had forgotten to use my
    preferred reiserfs back then, since all of the partitions are ext3,
    following /home's file system.


    --
    John

    No Microsoft products were used in the preparation or transmission of this message.

    The EULA sounds like it was written by a team of lawyers who want to tell me what I can't do. The GPL sounds like it was written by a human being, who wants me to know what I can do.

  10. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    Mark South wrote:
    > On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:05:47 +0200, Hadron wrote:
    >
    >
    >>> In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    >>> irretrievably!
    >>>

    >
    > Systems are easily replaceable. Your crucial data somewhat less so.
    >
    > Make sure you have a backup. And another backup at a friend's house. And
    > keep your first backup away from things that catch fire (like Dell laptops).
    >
    >
    >> really, little can go wrong. Wack the Feisty live cd in and opt to
    >> install. I strongly recommend making 5 partitions.
    >>

    >
    > You can also simply accept the default choices that the Ubuntu installer
    > makes for you. It's done this a lot more often than have any of us :-)
    >
    >
    >> about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root".
    >>

    >
    > Only if you intend to install every damn thing in the repository.
    > Otherwise 5Gb is plenty.
    >
    >
    >> about 5 gig for a swap file
    >>

    >
    > If you need 5Gb of swap you EITHER have a lot of memory and do a lot of
    > numbercrunching, OR you need more RAM.
    >
    >
    >> (you dont need this as your could use a swap file too) but its probably
    >> easier to go with it.
    >>

    >
    > RAM < swap < 2xRAM is fine for most people.
    >
    >
    >> about 10 gig for /var
    >>

    >
    > Again, only if you run a server and keep really detailed logs. Or if you
    > really do install every damn thing in the repositories and keep the cached
    > packages to boot (near-pun unintended).
    >
    >
    >> about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition
    >>

    >
    > Depends on taste. I wouldn't give it a single nibble, let alone several
    > Gb!
    >
    >
    >> the rest for /home
    >>

    >
    > That's the idea. Hopefully the OP still has some left by this stage...!
    >



    Sound advice, Mark.

    If I may expound on one of your paragraphs:

    "You can also simply accept the default choices that the Ubuntu
    installer makes for you. It's done this a lot more often than have any
    of us :-)"

    This idea should fit any new GNU/Linux (or BSD) user. Actually, any
    computer user who has not yet had any experience with a new OS.

    It takes many trials and errors, over a long period (sometimes years),
    before the knowledge is learned, and that light bulb comes on, "Why
    didn't I do that a long time ago?"

    Getting Ubuntu (or whatever) installed and put into use *as a learning
    tool* is far more important than worrying about how to set up a system
    to meet the requirements in 2010. By then the new Ubuntu user may be off
    on Debian, Slackware or BSD, probably using a newer computer.

    Reading all of the various opinions and personal preferences in a
    newsgroup like this one, won't help the new user understand much,
    because they have no real foundation built on which the ideas can make
    sense.

    Jump in and do it! Learning from mistakes is the most permanent form of
    education. I can remember more which I learned in the alley, the
    lunchroom and the cloakroom than the classroom! ;-)


    --
    John

    No Microsoft products were used in the preparation or transmission of this message.

    The EULA sounds like it was written by a team of lawyers who want to tell me what I can't do. The GPL sounds like it was written by a human being, who wants me to know what I can do.

  11. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed


    "Mark South" wrote in message
    news:46f2729e$0$90265$14726298@news.sunsite.dk...
    > On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:05:47 +0200, Hadron wrote:
    >
    >>> In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    >>> irretrievably!

    >
    > Systems are easily replaceable. Your crucial data somewhat less so.
    >
    > Make sure you have a backup. And another backup at a friend's house. And
    > keep your first backup away from things that catch fire (like Dell
    > laptops).
    >
    >> really, little can go wrong. Wack the Feisty live cd in and opt to
    >> install. I strongly recommend making 5 partitions.

    >
    > You can also simply accept the default choices that the Ubuntu installer
    > makes for you. It's done this a lot more often than have any of us :-)
    >
    >> about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root".

    >
    > Only if you intend to install every damn thing in the repository.
    > Otherwise 5Gb is plenty.
    >
    >> about 5 gig for a swap file

    >
    > If you need 5Gb of swap you EITHER have a lot of memory and do a lot of
    > numbercrunching, OR you need more RAM.
    >
    >> (you dont need this as your could use a swap file too) but its probably
    >> easier to go with it.

    >
    > RAM < swap < 2xRAM is fine for most people.
    >
    >> about 10 gig for /var

    >
    > Again, only if you run a server and keep really detailed logs. Or if you
    > really do install every damn thing in the repositories and keep the cached
    > packages to boot (near-pun unintended).
    >
    >> about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition

    >
    > Depends on taste. I wouldn't give it a single nibble, let alone several
    > Gb!
    >
    >> the rest for /home

    >
    > That's the idea. Hopefully the OP still has some left by this stage...!


    I am _rapidly_ losing my bottle, actually!!!
    Don't forget the KISS principle guys

    --
    ¦zulu¦
    Excuse any typos - I'm nearly blind :-(




  12. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed


    "John F. Morse" wrote in message
    news:rzwIi.575900$p47.64387@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
    > Mark South wrote:
    >> On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:05:47 +0200, Hadron wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>> In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    >>>> irretrievably!
    >>>>

    >>
    >> Systems are easily replaceable. Your crucial data somewhat less so.
    >>
    >> Make sure you have a backup. And another backup at a friend's house.
    >> And
    >> keep your first backup away from things that catch fire (like Dell
    >> laptops).
    >>
    >>
    >>> really, little can go wrong. Wack the Feisty live cd in and opt to
    >>> install. I strongly recommend making 5 partitions.
    >>>

    >>
    >> You can also simply accept the default choices that the Ubuntu installer
    >> makes for you. It's done this a lot more often than have any of us :-)
    >>
    >>
    >>> about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root".

    >>
    >> Only if you intend to install every damn thing in the repository.
    >> Otherwise 5Gb is plenty.
    >>
    >>
    >>> about 5 gig for a swap file
    >>>

    >>
    >> If you need 5Gb of swap you EITHER have a lot of memory and do a lot of
    >> numbercrunching, OR you need more RAM.
    >>
    >>
    >>> (you dont need this as your could use a swap file too) but its probably
    >>> easier to go with it.

    >>
    >> RAM < swap < 2xRAM is fine for most people.
    >>
    >>
    >>> about 10 gig for /var

    >>
    >> Again, only if you run a server and keep really detailed logs. Or if you
    >> really do install every damn thing in the repositories and keep the
    >> cached
    >> packages to boot (near-pun unintended).
    >>
    >>
    >>> about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition

    >>
    >> Depends on taste. I wouldn't give it a single nibble, let alone several
    >> Gb!
    >>
    >>
    >>> the rest for /home
    >>>

    >>
    >> That's the idea. Hopefully the OP still has some left by this stage...!
    >>

    >
    >
    > Sound advice, Mark.
    >
    > If I may expound on one of your paragraphs:
    >
    > "You can also simply accept the default choices that the Ubuntu installer
    > makes for you. It's done this a lot more often than have any of us :-)"
    >
    > This idea should fit any new GNU/Linux (or BSD) user. Actually, any
    > computer user who has not yet had any experience with a new OS.
    >
    > It takes many trials and errors, over a long period (sometimes years),
    > before the knowledge is learned, and that light bulb comes on, "Why didn't
    > I do that a long time ago?"
    >
    > Getting Ubuntu (or whatever) installed and put into use *as a learning
    > tool* is far more important than worrying about how to set up a system to
    > meet the requirements in 2010. By then the new Ubuntu user may be off on
    > Debian, Slackware or BSD, probably using a newer computer.
    >
    > Reading all of the various opinions and personal preferences in a
    > newsgroup like this one, won't help the new user understand much, because
    > they have no real foundation built on which the ideas can make sense.
    >
    > Jump in and do it! Learning from mistakes is the most permanent form of
    > education. I can remember more which I learned in the alley, the lunchroom
    > and the cloakroom than the classroom! ;-)
    >
    >
    > --
    > John
    >

    Good advice which will be taken.
    As I said in my other post just now
    KISS :-)

    Cheers!

    --
    ¦zulu¦
    Excuse any typos - I'm nearly blind :-(



  13. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 07:50:44 -0500, Stephan Rose wrote:

    >>
    >>

    > Hmm that is interesting about /var.
    >
    > I usually go with 4 partitions myself.
    >
    > One for root, one for home, one for swap and one shared fat32 partition.


    I always keep a separate partition for /var and for /tmp. Makes it less
    likely that a rogue app is going to crash the system. If a log file runs
    on, /var fills up and chokes the system. If a print spool or an app (had
    it happen with a video editor once) runs on, it crushes /tmp.




    --
    Joe - Registered Linux User #449481
    joe at hits - buffalo dot com
    "Hate is baggage, life is too short to go around pissed off all the
    time..." - Danny, American History X

  14. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed


    "zulu" wrote in message
    news:%YyIi.36443$Db6.24978@newsfe3-
    > I am _rapidly_ losing my bottle, actually!!!
    > Don't forget the KISS principle guys



    Wether you think you can, or think you can't, you're probably right!



  15. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed


    "Dogma Discharge" wrote in message
    news:1190377631.943271@vasbyt.isdsl.net...
    >
    > "zulu" wrote in message
    > news:%YyIi.36443$Db6.24978@newsfe3-
    >> I am _rapidly_ losing my bottle, actually!!!
    >> Don't forget the KISS principle guys

    >
    >
    > Wether you think you can, or think you can't, you're probably right!


    I'll give it a go one day soon.
    I'm waiting for *her downstairs* to go out for the day, so I won't be
    interrupted :-))

    --
    ¦zulu¦



  16. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed


    "zulu" wrote in message
    news:S4PIi.7987$aN2.7072@newsfe2-gui.ntli.net...

    > I'll give it a go one day soon.
    > I'm waiting for *her downstairs* to go out for the day, so I won't be
    > interrupted :-))



    Are you South African? If so, where about are you?



  17. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    Stephan Rose wrote:
    > On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:05:47 +0200, Hadron wrote:
    >
    >> "zulu" writes:
    >>
    >>> "Stephan Rose" wrote in message
    >>> news:spqdnVR7Ud3yzG_bnZ2dnUVZ8tSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
    >>>> On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:49:14 +0000, zulu wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> I want to reformat the HD on my old PC [1] and install Ubunto
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Where can I get _IDIOTPROOF_ info please
    >>>> Take it from a programmer that idiotproof doesn't exist. Everytime I
    >>>> think I finally managed to idiotproof my software, the world simply
    >>>> invents a better idiot.
    >>> That's me
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> http://www.ubuntu.com would be a good start though.
    >>>>
    >>>> http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Feisty is also a good site.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>> Off to investigate
    >>> Thanks.
    >>>
    >>>>> Before I reformat, I also need to know how to first create a boot CD
    >>>>> in case the wheel comes off.
    >>>>> (So that I can reinstall XP if all else fails)
    >>>> The Ubuntu Live CD is bootable, just burn it. The same goes for your
    >>>> XP CD, it is bootable as well so if you want to reinstall XP, just
    >>>> grab your XP CD, boot with it and off you go.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>> So I can safely *Format* whatever at any time, (The HDD must be
    >>> partitioned, I guess) and then it will just reboot when I insert the CD
    >>> for either XP or Obunto>

    >> Stop. What about your XP? Are you sure you can reinstall it? The install
    >> media for XP is not there hidden on a secret partition?
    >>
    >>
    >>> In that case, TYVM, That is good to know, I was scared of nadgerung it
    >>> irretrievably!

    >> really, little can go wrong. Wack the Feisty live cd in and opt to
    >> install. I strongly recommend making 5 partitions.
    >>
    >> about 20 gig for the base Ubuntu "root". about 5 gig for a swap file
    >> (you dont need this as your could use a swap file too) but its probably
    >> easier to go with it. about 10 gig for /var
    >> about 20 gig for a windows/fat32 partition the rest for /home
    >>
    >> if you want to be really good and you dont have any external hard
    >> drives, also create a backup ext3 partition for you to use as a
    >> repository for the excellent rsnapshot which can takes periodic
    >> snapshots of your configured critical files.
    >>
    >> obviously all relative to the size of the disk.
    >>
    >> Why? Well, nearly all your important data will be stored in /home. With
    >> /home mounted on a separate partition it is a doddle to reinstall an OS
    >> - just tell the new installation to mount your "old" /home as /home in
    >> order to get all your data and setting backs. Why the fat32/ntfs?
    >> Believe me, just do it - even if its just to have common read/write
    >> between linux/windows of varying versions. Why /var? Because of spool
    >> mostly.
    >>

    >
    > Hmm that is interesting about /var.
    >
    > I usually go with 4 partitions myself.
    >
    > One for root, one for home, one for swap and one shared fat32 partition.
    >

    I was advised the following partitions:
    /boot 100mb (when linux is f**ked up, the pc still boots.)
    /root a lot, say 20 gb
    /swap a bit more than the memory, 2 gb will do / is the max accepted
    /home the rest

    --

    Xubunt6

    "Xubuntu 6 just installed ..."

  18. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed


    "Dogma Discharge" wrote in message
    news:1190379664.306185@vasbyt.isdsl.net...
    >
    > "zulu" wrote in message
    > news:S4PIi.7987$aN2.7072@newsfe2-gui.ntli.net...
    >
    >> I'll give it a go one day soon.
    >> I'm waiting for *her downstairs* to go out for the day, so I won't be
    >> interrupted :-))

    >
    >
    > Are you South African? If so, where about are you?

    No, sorry...I'm in the UK




  19. Re: Janet & John for installing Ubunto needed

    On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 05:54:39 -0500
    Stephan Rose wrote:

    > Take it from a programmer that idiotproof doesn't exist. Everytime I
    > think I finally managed to idiotproof my software, the world simply
    > invents a better idiot.


    Amen to that. 10% of my time is spent writing code to do what I want
    the program to do, the other 90% is spent writing code to protect it
    from the users' stupidity.

    --
    To err is human, to moo bovine.

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