paging James Carlson: Annex TSTTY query - TCP-IP

This is a discussion on paging James Carlson: Annex TSTTY query - TCP-IP ; Greetings: I use 'rtelnet' and various annex erpc calls (depending on the app) to access annex ports as ptys with limited ioctl() control; in (re)reading the admin software docs recently I saw mention of a package called 'TSTTY' which provides ...

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  1. paging James Carlson: Annex TSTTY query

    Greetings:

    I use 'rtelnet' and various annex erpc calls (depending on the app)
    to access annex ports as ptys with limited ioctl() control;
    in (re)reading the admin software docs recently I saw mention
    of a package called 'TSTTY' which provides termios compatible
    tty ports to the host.

    How was this package distributed? There is no mention of it
    in the sources for 'na' and the other bundled utils. Was this the
    native tty method used on the Encore? Was it only available as
    binaries?

    Thanks,

    Michael Grigoni
    Cybertheque Museum


  2. Re: paging James Carlson: Annex TSTTY query

    [Yikes! Scary to see my name used in a subject line ... let alone
    with museum quality software. ;-}]

    msg@waste.org writes:
    > I use 'rtelnet' and various annex erpc calls (depending on the app)
    > to access annex ports as ptys with limited ioctl() control;
    > in (re)reading the admin software docs recently I saw mention
    > of a package called 'TSTTY' which provides termios compatible
    > tty ports to the host.


    Yes.

    > How was this package distributed? There is no mention of it
    > in the sources for 'na' and the other bundled utils. Was this the
    > native tty method used on the Encore? Was it only available as
    > binaries?


    No, it was built as a STREAMS driver for System V, including ICL and
    Solaris. If there was a cdev as well for BSDish systems, I don't
    recall it. (But that was a while ago.)

    Basically, all it did was package up the raw ioctls and sent them over
    TCP to the Annex. The Annex had some (fairly limited, as I recall)
    software embedded in it that would do its best to service the ioctl
    and send a reply back over TCP.

    A little kludgy and slow, but it worked, and was much more reliable
    than rtelnet. (Rtelnet is a different beast: it allocates a pty pair,
    and listens on the master side. When the slave is opened, it opens a
    TCP connection to the Annex -- using TELNET protocol by default -- and
    shuttles data back and forth. Strictly user space. Because it uses
    ptys in a way that nobody else does, though, it tends to expose bugs
    in lots of pty implementations. That makes it not entirely reliable.)

    We also had TELNET extensions (mostly creative spec interpretations,
    not actual protocol changes) so that you didn't have to do most of the
    crazy erpc or ioctl dances to do most common operations, if you had a
    TELNET-speaking application. This includes changing bit (baud) rate,
    flushing output, and controlling DTR remotely.

    I really don't know what became of the tstty software. I suppose you
    could ask Nortel and see if there's anyone still there who remembers
    it (Russ Lamoreaux?). Maybe someone can blow some dust of a QIC-150
    tape for you. ;-}

    --
    James Carlson, KISS Network
    Sun Microsystems / 1 Network Drive 71.232W Vox +1 781 442 2084
    MS UBUR02-212 / Burlington MA 01803-2757 42.496N Fax +1 781 442 1677

  3. Re: paging James Carlson: Annex TSTTY query


    "James Carlson" wrote in message
    news:xoav1wrolykz.fsf@sun.com...
    > [Yikes! Scary to see my name used in a subject line ... let alone
    > with museum quality software. ;-}]
    >
    > msg@waste.org writes:
    >> I use 'rtelnet' and various annex erpc calls (depending on the app)
    >> to access annex ports as ptys with limited ioctl() control;
    >> in (re)reading the admin software docs recently I saw mention
    >> of a package called 'TSTTY' which provides termios compatible
    >> tty ports to the host.

    >
    > Yes.
    >
    >> How was this package distributed? There is no mention of it
    >> in the sources for 'na' and the other bundled utils. Was this the
    >> native tty method used on the Encore? Was it only available as
    >> binaries?

    >
    > No, it was built as a STREAMS driver for System V, including ICL and
    > Solaris. If there was a cdev as well for BSDish systems, I don't
    > recall it. (But that was a while ago.)
    >
    > Basically, all it did was package up the raw ioctls and sent them over
    > TCP to the Annex. The Annex had some (fairly limited, as I recall)
    > software embedded in it that would do its best to service the ioctl
    > and send a reply back over TCP.
    >
    > A little kludgy and slow, but it worked, and was much more reliable
    > than rtelnet. (Rtelnet is a different beast: it allocates a pty pair,
    > and listens on the master side. When the slave is opened, it opens a
    > TCP connection to the Annex -- using TELNET protocol by default -- and
    > shuttles data back and forth. Strictly user space. Because it uses
    > ptys in a way that nobody else does, though, it tends to expose bugs
    > in lots of pty implementations. That makes it not entirely reliable.)
    >
    > We also had TELNET extensions (mostly creative spec interpretations,
    > not actual protocol changes) so that you didn't have to do most of the
    > crazy erpc or ioctl dances to do most common operations, if you had a
    > TELNET-speaking application. This includes changing bit (baud) rate,
    > flushing output, and controlling DTR remotely.
    >
    > I really don't know what became of the tstty software. I suppose you
    > could ask Nortel and see if there's anyone still there who remembers
    > it (Russ Lamoreaux?). Maybe someone can blow some dust of a QIC-150
    > tape for you. ;-}
    >
    > --
    > James Carlson, KISS Network
    > Sun Microsystems / 1 Network Drive 71.232W Vox +1 781 442 2084
    > MS UBUR02-212 / Burlington MA 01803-2757 42.496N Fax +1 781 442 1677



    Wow, seriously... at another employer, I used not the TSTTY but at least
    'na'
    as recently as 2 years ago when for some forgotten reason it was impossible
    to
    properly get to the admin prompt of a MicroAnnex terminal server. That
    software
    saved many a day, and allowed some pretty crazy on-the-fly cut-and-paste
    emergency configurations.

    I still have a tar'd up copy of it at home, fearing it would be lost
    forever, and
    even scripted up a mini-suite of shell scripts around it.

    Thanks for the utility. It literally saved hundreds of thousands of dollars
    in
    a very short amount of time, dozens of times, as it became the centerpiece
    of hack after hack after hack there was no other way without creating
    an entirely new setup for stuff that was deployed around the world, so I
    made
    do with the hardware and 'na'.

    Cheers!


    jcj









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