openSUSE as small bussiness server - Suse

This is a discussion on openSUSE as small bussiness server - Suse ; 1.Is openSUSE appropriate as a server for a small company with 1 to 25 users? 2.Any example of openSUSE being use as production server? 3.If choose to buy instead of download openSUSE I will receive 1-year of maintenance. Anybody could ...

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  1. openSUSE as small bussiness server

    1.Is openSUSE appropriate as a server for a small company with 1 to 25
    users?
    2.Any example of openSUSE being use as production server?
    3.If choose to buy instead of download openSUSE I will receive 1-year
    of maintenance. Anybody could tell me what is included in that
    ďmaintenance) (http://www.novell.com/products/opensuse/howtobuy.html)
    4.Is SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop a better server than openSUSE? I
    know that it is suppose to be use on desktops but everybody knows that
    there is no real ďdesktop versionĒon linux. Or I am wrong?



  2. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    Artificer wrote:

    > 1.Is openSUSE appropriate as a server for a small company with 1 to 25
    > users?


    Yes. (Depending on the IT crew which can mess it up nevertheless)

    > 2.Any example of openSUSE being use as production server?


    web hosting, mail server, groupware, databases, DHCP, DNS, proxy, firewall,
    content filtering, routing, PDC, file server, application development, ftp,
    media, blogs, chat, usenet, terminal services, distributed compiling,
    number crunching... The IT crew is the limit.

    > 3.If choose to buy instead of download openSUSE I will receive 1-year
    > of maintenance. Anybody could tell me what is included in that
    > “maintenance) (http://www.novell.com/products/opensuse/howtobuy.html)


    Recommend you read the terms and conditions for the enterprise products.

    > 4.Is SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop a better server than openSUSE? I
    > know that it is suppose to be use on desktops but everybody knows that
    > there is no real ‚Äúdesktop version‚ÄĚon linux. Or I am wrong?


    SLED is a desktop. SLES is a server. The difference is the product lifetime
    and orientation towards specific tasks.

    regards,
    Andreas


  3. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    Artificer wrote:
    > 1.Is openSUSE appropriate as a server for a small company with 1 to 25
    > users?


    The marketing people of Microsoft would say no. The marketing people of
    Novell would say yes. To me it all depends on what you think is
    "appropriate".

    > 2.Any example of openSUSE being use as production server?


    Half of Germany is running (figure of speeech) But if you want a real
    world example, try www.openSUSE.org

    > 3.If choose to buy instead of download openSUSE I will receive 1-year
    > of maintenance. Anybody could tell me what is included in that
    > ?maintenance) (http://www.novell.com/products/opensuse/howtobuy.html)


    I get a deja-vu feeling here.

    > 4.Is SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop a better server than openSUSE?


    Are blondes sexier then redheads? I am doing an ivestigation and try
    them all out first. (and to make the test valid, I use the brunettes as
    a sort of denominator. Sorry bald women, you can't ave me(1))

    > I know that it is suppose to be use on desktops but everybody knows
    > that there is no real ?desktop version?on linux. Or I am wrong?


    You are wrong. I am running a desktop version of Linux for about 10
    years, If it were not available I would not be able to do that. The only
    difference between a server and a desktop is ther programs you run on
    them.

    As always, the answer to these sort of questions can only be answerd by
    two people. The first is the marketing department. Listen to them if you
    want or need to hear a lot of yes. The second is yourself. If your
    question is seriously only "will this work?" then you have serious
    problems and should re-define your question.

    So my advice to you is (as much of a *SUSE fanboy I am) os the
    following:
    1) Start wondering what you really want and write that down. Give points
    to the differnt things. Do the first step in a brainstorming session
    where the outcome will be something like:
    * Cheap
    * Fast
    * Good
    * A pony
    Select any two (I would go for a fast pony)

    When you have determines IN WRITING (I mean that. Write it down and
    stick to it) you can download openSUSE, SLES and SLED and determone for
    yourself if this is something you need to do.

    Now can you send me my 10.000EUR. That is about the amount that a
    contractor would ask you to give the same information(2)

    (1) unless you ask me or are just willing. I am not picky.
    (2) Contractors, prostitues of the mind.
    houghi
    --
    Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done,
    and why. Then do it.
    -- Heinlein : Time Enough For Love

  4. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    On Sep 28, 7:37*am, houghi wrote:
    > Artificer wrote:
    > > 1.Is openSUSE appropriate as a server for a small company with 1 to 25
    > > users?

    >
    > The marketing people of Microsoft would say no. The marketing people of
    > Novell would say yes. To me it all depends on what you think is
    > "appropriate".
    >
    > > 2.Any example of openSUSE being use as production server?

    >
    > Half of Germany is running (figure of speeech) But if you want a real
    > world example, trywww.openSUSE.org
    >
    > > 3.If choose to buy instead of download openSUSE I will receive 1-year
    > > of maintenance. Anybody could tell me what is included in that
    > > ?maintenance) (http://www.novell.com/products/opensuse/howtobuy.html)

    >
    > I get a deja-vu feeling here.
    >
    > > 4.Is SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop a better server than openSUSE?

    >
    > Are blondes sexier then redheads? I am doing an ivestigation and try
    > them all out first. (and to make the test valid, I use the brunettes as
    > a sort of denominator. Sorry bald women, you can't ave me(1))
    >
    > > I know that it is suppose to be use on desktops but everybody knows
    > > that there is no real ?desktop version?on linux. Or I am wrong?

    >
    > You are wrong. I am running a desktop version of Linux for about 10
    > years, If it were not available I would not be able to do that. The only
    > difference between a server and a desktop is ther programs you run on
    > them.
    >
    > As always, the answer to these sort of questions can only be answerd by
    > two people. The first is the marketing department. Listen to them if you
    > want or need to hear a lot of yes. The second is yourself. If your
    > question is seriously only "will this work?" then you have serious
    > problems and should re-define your question.
    >
    > So my advice to you is (as much of a *SUSE fanboy I am) os the
    > following:
    > 1) Start wondering what you really want and write that down. Give points
    > to the differnt things. Do the first step in a brainstorming session
    > where the outcome will be something like:
    > * Cheap
    > * Fast
    > * Good
    > * A pony
    > Select any two (I would go for a fast pony)
    >
    > When you have determines IN WRITING (I mean that. Write it down and
    > stick to it) you can download openSUSE, SLES and SLED and determone for
    > yourself if this is something you need to do.
    >
    > Now can you send me my 10.000EUR. That is about the amount that a
    > contractor would ask you to give the same information(2)
    >
    > (1) unless you ask me or are just willing. I am not picky.
    > (2) Contractors, prostitues of the mind.
    > houghi
    > --
    > Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done,
    > and why. Then do it.
    > * * * * -- Heinlein : Time Enough For Love


    Thanks a lot for the answers! What I meant on question 2 was if
    anybody could raise your hand and say: Yeas my small bussiness is
    using openSUSE as a server for this or that!

  5. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    Artificer wrote:

    > 1.Is openSUSE appropriate as a server for a small company with 1 to 25
    > users?


    As you have to ask this question: no, don't do it. You will have to
    upgrade or freshly install the server every two years which is a PITA
    for a complex server setup. You will also spend a lot of time upon
    initial configuration which is fine for a fun project but a problem in
    a professional environment.

    > 2.Any example of openSUSE being use as production server?


    I do run OpenSuSE as a CUPS printing server. But this is a very easy
    task, and the choice was based on more recent version of CUPS available
    which offers additional functionality.

    > 3.If choose to buy instead of download openSUSE I will receive 1-year
    > of maintenance. Anybody could tell me what is included in that
    > “maintenance) (http://www.novell.com/products/opensuse/howtobuy.html)


    Most probably just answers to simple questions regarding hardware
    support and other issues of the basic setup. Do not expect to get IT
    services for free or a minimal charge.

    > 4.Is SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop a better server than openSUSE?


    No, as compared to SLES or other server distributions it is missing
    important packages for setting up and running server applications. But
    you do not write about which services you want to offer. Just for CUPS
    or a Samba server it will be fine. OpenSuSE also comes with the
    additional benefit of newer versions for many packages. But it won't be
    a good starting point for directory services, for example. At least as
    long as you do not want to start from scratch with OpenLDAP writing all
    configuration files by hand.

    > I
    > know that it is suppose to be use on desktops but everybody knows that
    > there is no real ‚Äúdesktop version‚ÄĚon linux. Or I am wrong?


    Any Linux distributions can do the job in principle, even OpenWRT. But
    then the problem is: if you have to ask these questions you will much
    profit from a dedicated server distribution like the SBS version of
    SLES/OES. Have a look also at Red Hat, CentOS, Collax or even Microsoft
    SBS. The latter might well be the most fool proof server distribution
    available.
    And as a last point: check closely that the distribution of choice will
    work on your hardware. RAID controller, NIC, etc.

    G√ľnther

  6. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    Re Q2

    I am not using openSUSE as such.

    I have however over the years used various standard version for
    server/router/firewall system. I actually started with 6.1!

    I currently have a site that has maybe 7x 9.3 boxes that do a various
    things. There is even a Samba environment that for all intents and
    purposes looks like a Windows server to the clients. They also run a
    squid proxy service, openvpn between offices and a central cyrus/imap
    server. 30 users..

    Apart from the usual human induced errors and hardware failures I havent
    had any instability to speak of.

    Cheers Bob

    Artificer wrote:
    > 2.Any example of openSUSE being use as production server?


  7. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    Hi,

    G√ľnther Schwarz wrote:

    > Artificer wrote:
    >
    >> 1.Is openSUSE appropriate as a server for a small company with 1 to 25
    >> users?

    >
    > As you have to ask this question: no, don't do it. You will have to
    > upgrade or freshly install the server every two years which is a PITA
    > for a complex server setup. You will also spend a lot of time upon
    > initial configuration which is fine for a fun project but a problem in
    > a professional environment.


    This is why you maintain a server setup and administration log. If the
    server is mission critical, give it appropriate attention.

    regards,
    Andreas

  8. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    Andreas Stieger wrote:

    > G√ľnther Schwarz wrote:
    >
    >> Artificer wrote:
    >>
    >>> 1.Is openSUSE appropriate as a server for a small company with 1 to
    >>> 25 users?

    >>
    >> As you have to ask this question: no, don't do it. You will have to
    >> upgrade or freshly install the server every two years which is a PITA
    >> for a complex server setup. You will also spend a lot of time upon
    >> initial configuration which is fine for a fun project but a problem
    >> in a professional environment.

    >
    > This is why you maintain a server setup and administration log. If the
    > server is mission critical, give it appropriate attention.


    Of course. But then the problem of short lifetime still remains.
    Dedicated server distributions for professional use also have a
    documented and tested upgrade path. As uncounted posts here and in
    other places show the upgrade of a community Linux is more or less a
    try and error procedure. For some it works, others, including me,
    prefer to start with a freshly formatted drive. So even with a well
    done local documentation and possibly automated configuration with a
    tool like cfengine it will be more work than necessary. Most likely
    this additional time spent on administration will cost more than a
    license fee for SLES or another server distribution. It also adds to
    downtime which, depending on the business, can be costly.

    G√ľnther

  9. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    =?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=FCnther?= Schwarz wrote:
    >Andreas Stieger wrote:
    >> G√ľnther Schwarz wrote:
    >>> Artificer wrote:


    >>>> 1.Is openSUSE appropriate as a server for a small company with 1 to
    >>>> 25 users?


    >>> As you have to ask this question: no, don't do it. You will have to
    >>> upgrade or freshly install the server every two years which is a PITA
    >>> for a complex server setup. You will also spend a lot of time upon
    >>> initial configuration which is fine for a fun project but a problem
    >>> in a professional environment.


    >> This is why you maintain a server setup and administration log. If the
    >> server is mission critical, give it appropriate attention.


    >Of course. But then the problem of short lifetime still remains.


    Not a problem for a lot of companies. They like to "roll over" their
    server hardware every 3 years or so anyway. There must be good
    "accounting reasons" as technically; server-class hardware runs for
    a decade or more if you look after it reasonably well.

    If you're using SLES, then you will have an older kernel than
    openSuSE; and migration to new server hardware can be hampered.
    Somebody will have to back-port drivers.

    >Dedicated server distributions for professional use also have a
    >documented and tested upgrade path.


    The security of operation is in the _maintenance_. Nothing prevents
    a third party from providing the same level of support.

    SLES support is from Novell. They too are a "third party" on Linux
    systems.

    >As uncounted posts here and in other places show the upgrade of a
    >community Linux is more or less a try and error procedure.


    That's because "Engineering" is a dirty word in I.T..

    >For some it works, others, including me, prefer to start with a
    >freshly formatted drive.


    Why not new hardware? The old hardware can be redeployed to other
    tasks; perhaps as a warm standby, or as part of a cluster.

    Running the new installation on new hardware provides a complete
    testing environment. Going live, after all testing has been signed
    off, can then be done in a structured manner without the shrapnel
    of a big-bang.

    >So even with a well done local documentation and possibly automated
    >configuration with a tool like cfengine it will be more work than
    >necessary.


    Somebody has to do the work. There is not guarantee with SLES that
    an upgrade will work out of the box. Applications and customisations
    will often have to be adapted.

    >Most likely this additional time spent on administration
    >will cost more than a license fee for SLES or another server
    >distribution. It also adds to downtime which, depending on the
    >business, can be costly.


    It would be very foolish to cut over to a new, untested system.
    --
    /"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia
    \ / ASCII ribbon campaign | Science is the belief in
    X against HTML mail | the ignorance of the experts.
    / \ and postings | -- Richard Feynman

  10. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    Bernd Felsche wrote:
    >>Of course. But then the problem of short lifetime still remains.

    >
    > Not a problem for a lot of companies. They like to "roll over" their
    > server hardware every 3 years or so anyway. There must be good
    > "accounting reasons" as technically; server-class hardware runs for
    > a decade or more if you look after it reasonably well.


    openSUSE is 2 years. Also sever hardware is used much longer then 3
    years. Desktops is indeed often just three years as that is the lease
    period, although I see many ushing towards 5 years.

    > If you're using SLES, then you will have an older kernel than
    > openSuSE; and migration to new server hardware can be hampered.
    > Somebody will have to back-port drivers.


    SLE does upgrades. openSUSE does only security updates.
    Also having an older kernel on a server is not a bad thing. On a server
    more then anywhere else: if it ain't broken, don't fix it.

    houghi
    --
    Remind me to write an article on the compulsive reading of news. The
    theme will be that most neuroses can be traced to the unhealthy habit
    of wallowing in the troubles of five billion strangers. -- Heinlein

  11. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    Andreas Stieger wrote:
    >>As uncounted posts here and in other places show the upgrade of a
    >>community Linux is more or less a try and error procedure.


    That is not the case with CentOS and Debian, and is not the policy,
    unlike the attitude which *appears* to prevail with openSUSE.

    *Almost* always these distributions can be upgraded from one
    version to the next without any problems.

    But as with everything, there is sometimes the exception to the rule --
    but that has never meant installing from scratch.


  12. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    On Mon, 29 Sep 2008, J G Miller wrote:-

    > Andreas Stieger wrote:
    > >>As uncounted posts here and in other places show the upgrade of a
    > >>community Linux is more or less a try and error procedure.

    >
    >That is not the case with CentOS and Debian, and is not the policy,
    >unlike the attitude which *appears* to prevail with openSUSE.


    I don't think it's either the policy or attitude of any of the
    distributions, and certainly not openSUSE/Novell, that a version jump
    should be a trial-and-error experience. The feelings of the users of the
    various distributions may not hold the same attitudes though.

    As for my own experience, on the times that I've started with vanilla
    systems, I've never had problems where there's been a single version
    jump, e.g. going from SuSE 9.1 -> 9.2 -> 9.3. Where I have had to do
    some extra work, it's because I've added package from other sources,
    including ones I've built myself. Even then, the extra work was quite
    minimal.

    >*Almost* always these distributions can be upgraded from one
    >version to the next without any problems.


    As I mentioned above, vanilla systems can be upgraded from one version
    to the next. That's the only upgrade that is actually tested by
    openSUSE/Novell to make sure it works.

    Jumping over one, or many, releases can cause even more work to be
    required. A jump from 10.3 to 11.1 will probably require some extra work
    to be done, while even more would be needed when going from 10.2 or
    10.1.

    >But as with everything, there is sometimes the exception to the rule --
    >but that has never meant installing from scratch.


    That's something I'm going to have to do sometime in the future, but
    it'll be 11.2 or 11.3 when I need do it. The reason for this fresh
    install? The M/B on my 32bit 10.3 system died and so, as it's not easy
    to get 32bit M/Bs, it was replaced by a new M/B with a 64bit CPU. After
    sorting out things so the new kernel modules were loaded when booting,
    the system was brought up and is running just fine[0]. When that system
    gets upgraded, it will have to be a new install as I'll be moving it
    over from a 32bit to a 64bit version.


    [0] FSVO fine. I have to add a little extra cooling, since it's running
    a little too warm for my liking when under full load.

    Regards,
    David Bolt

    --
    www.davjam.org/lifetype/ www.distributed.net: OGR@100Mnodes, RC5-72@15Mkeys
    SUSE 10.1 32b | | openSUSE 10.3 32b | openSUSE 11.0 32b
    | openSUSE 10.2 64b | openSUSE 10.3 64b | openSUSE 11.0 64b
    RISC OS 3.6 | TOS 4.02 | openSUSE 10.3 PPC | RISC OS 3.11

  13. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    First: I would like to thanks all the responses so far. Second I still
    got a couple of doubt. Do you mean that the process of upgrading
    openSUSE is too complex? the 2 years of lifecycle for openSUSE what
    really mean?

  14. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    On 2008-09-29, Artificer wrote:
    > First: I would like to thanks all the responses so far. Second I still
    > got a couple of doubt. Do you mean that the process of upgrading
    > openSUSE is too complex?


    According to my experience upgrading from 10.3 to 11.0 was like a couple
    of hours at the beach

    I've done several upgrades, even 10.0 to 10.2 was quite easy although there
    was a version leap. That happened because I skipped 10.1 after trying it
    for some time. That's the only version I've skipped after starting to
    run Suse as my distro of choice.

    This is probably, at least partially, due to my systems being close to
    vanilla, only packman stuff added.

    Coming from 10.3 to 11.0 was quite pleasant.
    There you can change also packman and other extra repos on the fly
    during the upgrading installation, so you miss all the "fun" of
    temporary depency problems. These dependency problems used to be something
    you had to deal with in upgrades prior to 11.0.


    > the 2 years of lifecycle for openSUSE what
    > really mean?


    It means that after two years from publishing an openSUSE version Novell
    stops security patching it.

    --
    Vahis
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    Congressman Wilson has an expression:
    "You can teach them to type, but you can't teach them to grow tits."

  15. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    J G Miller wrote:
    > *Almost* always these distributions can be upgraded from one
    > version to the next without any problems.


    As it is with openSUSE and for that reason the same advice is given
    since ages and will be given for ever.

    > But as with everything, there is sometimes the exception to the rule --
    > but that has never meant installing from scratch.


    I do it that way. Others don't.

    The advice is always the same and is irregardless of what OS you are
    using. Want to upgrade? Take a backup and try it. If it doesn't work,
    you do the new installation and you have your backup to put data back.

    You can do with that advice whatever you like to do as it is not my data
    that will be gone if things go wrong.

    houghi
    --
    Remind me to write an article on the compulsive reading of news. The
    theme will be that most neuroses can be traced to the unhealthy habit
    of wallowing in the troubles of five billion strangers. -- Heinlein

  16. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    On 2008-09-29, houghi wrote:
    > J G Miller wrote:
    >> *Almost* always these distributions can be upgraded from one
    >> version to the next without any problems.

    >
    > As it is with openSUSE and for that reason the same advice is given
    > since ages and will be given for ever.
    >
    >> But as with everything, there is sometimes the exception to the rule --
    >> but that has never meant installing from scratch.

    >
    > I do it that way. Others don't.
    >
    > The advice is always the same and is irregardless of what OS you are
    > using. Want to upgrade? Take a backup and try it. If it doesn't work,
    > you do the new installation and you have your backup to put data back.
    >
    > You can do with that advice whatever you like to do as it is not my data
    > that will be gone if things go wrong.


    I do both fresh installations and upgrades, for the fun of it

    But OTOH I have a separate extra large disk for you know what
    I couldn't bare them to go missing

    --
    Vahis
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    Congressman Wilson has an expression:
    "You can teach them to type, but you can't teach them to grow tits."

  17. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server


    >
    > According to my experience upgrading from 10.3 to 11.0 was like a couple
    > of hours at the beach
    >
    > I've done several upgrades, even 10.0 to 10.2 was quite easy although there
    > was a version leap. That happened because I skipped 10.1 after trying it
    > for some time. That's the only version I've skipped after starting to
    > run Suse as my distro of choice.
    >
    > This is probably, at least partially, due to my systems being close to
    > vanilla, only packman stuff added.
    >
    > Coming from 10.3 to 11.0 was quite pleasant.
    > There you can change also packman and other extra repos on the fly
    > during the upgrading installation, so you miss all the "fun" of
    > temporary depency problems. These dependency problems used to be something
    > you had to deal with in upgrades prior to 11.0.
    >
    > > the 2 years of lifecycle for openSUSE what
    > > really mean?

    >
    > It means that after two years from publishing an openSUSE version Novell
    > stops security patching it.


    Is Novell that provides the patches or opensuse.org? I mean is Novell
    or the comunity the one that decided the 2-year lifecycle? If I choose
    to install openSUSE 11 and I dont want to upgrade every six months can
    I just wait untill the end of the lifecycle and do upgrades only every
    2 years? Will be hard to upgrade after two years of missing upgrades?


  18. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    On 2008-09-30, Artificer wrote:
    >
    >>
    >> According to my experience upgrading from 10.3 to 11.0 was like a couple
    >> of hours at the beach
    >>
    >> I've done several upgrades, even 10.0 to 10.2 was quite easy although there
    >> was a version leap. That happened because I skipped 10.1 after trying it
    >> for some time. That's the only version I've skipped after starting to
    >> run Suse as my distro of choice.
    >>
    >> This is probably, at least partially, due to my systems being close to
    >> vanilla, only packman stuff added.
    >>
    >> Coming from 10.3 to 11.0 was quite pleasant.
    >> There you can change also packman and other extra repos on the fly
    >> during the upgrading installation, so you miss all the "fun" of
    >> temporary depency problems. These dependency problems used to be something
    >> you had to deal with in upgrades prior to 11.0.
    >>
    >> > the 2 years of lifecycle for openSUSE what
    >> > really mean?

    >>
    >> It means that after two years from publishing an openSUSE version Novell
    >> stops security patching it.

    >
    > Is Novell that provides the patches or opensuse.org? I mean is Novell
    > or the comunity the one that decided the 2-year lifecycle?


    Novell sponsors the opanSUSE development team which administrates
    openSUSE.

    > If I choose
    > to install openSUSE 11 and I dont want to upgrade every six months can
    > I just wait untill the end of the lifecycle and do upgrades only every
    > 2 years? Will be hard to upgrade after two years of missing upgrades?
    >

    See my answer above. I have done both, as many others have and will.
    First you need to know what you are using you system for, then you need
    to maintain your goals. It obviously means installing and administrating
    the current version as phase one.
    In phases from there on you obviously install and test the upcoming new
    versions on a test bed and decide whether you skip a version or upgrade
    to that.

    Just an example: I kept 10.0 as long as it lived because I didn't want
    10.1 due to my testing period experiences.
    I went from 10.0 to 10.2. I needed to because 10.0 was about to end.
    10.2 was very good, but still I went to 10.3 due to my testring
    experiences, I liked it and there was probably something I wanted then.
    ..
    Then I changed to 64 bit HW. 11.0 was out, so I made a fresh install on
    new HW. Now I'm on 11.0 and I've upgraded also the 32 bit machines.

    Either way can be and has been done many, many times.

    --
    Vahis
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    Congressman Wilson has an expression:
    "You can teach them to type, but you can't teach them to grow tits."

  19. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    Artificer wrote:
    > Is Novell that provides the patches or opensuse.org?


    openSUSE for openSUSE and Novell for SLE if you look at it very
    scrictly.

    > I mean is Novell or the comunity the one that decided the 2-year
    > lifecycle?


    That is a complete different question. The answer is that it is the
    community. Many people of Novell are an extremely important part of that
    community.

    > If I choose to install openSUSE 11 and I dont want to upgrade every
    > six months can I just wait untill the end of the lifecycle and do
    > upgrades only every 2 years?


    It is your machine. You decide what to do with it. You can decide to
    never upgrade, or upgrade each version or do new installs or run a
    different distribution every day or do the security updates yourself for
    the next 500 years. It is YOUR machine. YOU must decide what to do.

    > Will be hard to upgrade after two years of missing upgrades?


    Oh boy. The answer has been given multiple time and is true for ANY
    upgrade. Backup and try. If it works, great. If not, you do a new
    installation and use your backup to restore the data.

    As always YMMV. Some hove done it without any problem. Others have
    failed. Also it is not possible to know what will happen in 2 years.

    houghi
    --
    Microsoft says, "Where do you want to go today?"
    Apple says, "Where do you want to go tomorrow?"
    FOSS says, "Are you coming, or what?"

  20. Re: openSUSE as small bussiness server

    On Sep 30, 5:41*am, houghi wrote:
    > Artificer wrote:
    > > Is Novell that provides the patches or opensuse.org?

    >
    > openSUSE for openSUSE and Novell for SLE if you look at it very
    > scrictly.
    >
    > > I mean is Novell or the comunity the one that decided the 2-year
    > > lifecycle?

    >
    > That is a complete different question. The answer is that it is the
    > community. Many people of Novell are an extremely important part of that
    > community.
    >
    > > If I choose to install openSUSE 11 and I dont want to upgrade every
    > > six months can I just wait untill the end of the lifecycle and do
    > > upgrades only every 2 years?

    >
    > It is your machine. You decide what to do with it. You can decide to
    > never upgrade, or upgrade each version or do new installs or run a
    > different distribution every day or do the security updates yourself for
    > the next 500 years. It is YOUR machine. YOU must decide what to do.
    >
    > > Will be hard to upgrade after two years of missing upgrades?

    >
    > Oh boy. The answer has been given multiple time and is true for ANY
    > upgrade. Backup and try. If it works, great. If not, you do a new
    > installation and use your backup to restore the data.
    >
    > As always YMMV. Some hove done it without any problem. Others have
    > failed. Also it is not possible to know what will happen in 2 years.
    >
    > houghi
    > --
    > * * * * * * * * Microsoft says, "Where do you want to go today?"
    > * * * * * * * * *Apple says, "Where do you want to go tomorrow?"
    > * * * * * * * * * * * * * *FOSS says, "Are you coming, or what?"


    Great Quote. LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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