GroupWise - Suse

This is a discussion on GroupWise - Suse ; It's been a while since I check up on this issue (March 25, 2004: http://groups.google.com/group/alt.o...t&q=groupwise# ), so it's time again. We run Novel servers and use GroupWise for email and integration of document management. We use Windows XP on our ...

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Thread: GroupWise

  1. GroupWise

    It's been a while since I check up on this issue (March 25, 2004:
    http://groups.google.com/group/alt.o...t&q=groupwise#),
    so it's time again.

    We run Novel servers and use GroupWise for email and integration of
    document management. We use Windows XP on our workstations and
    Microsoft Office products, word, excel and power point for our work
    applications.

    When Novel bought Suse, I hoped that perhaps we would get a Suse
    package that could eliminate the Microsoft products and save us $400
    to $600 US per PC.

    I bought the newest boxed package from Novel, OpenSuse 11, had my IT
    load it and was truly disappointed to see that while it shipped with
    the usual abundance of applications, including Open Office, it did not
    ship with GroupWise as an "installed package."

    Amazing. I thought that at last I could simply load this and be able
    to use the GroupWise product to get to my Novel servers, email, save
    and recall documents.

    I don't know what we missed, but this is not the easy substitute that
    I was looking forward to.

    What did we miss? I just sent my IT to "Novel" school for
    certification, and I can't afford to now send him to Suse school too!

    Comments?

  2. Re: GroupWise

    RichardE99 turned on the Etch-A-Sketch and wrote:

    > It's been a while since I check up on this issue (March 25, 2004:
    >

    http://groups.google.com/group/alt.o...t&q=groupwise#),
    > so it's time again.



    Are you asking about this portion of your question?

    > 4. Am I correct that Novel Linux will work with the NetWare
    > Server and GroupWise so that we can have a "mixed" network of Microsoft
    > and Linux workstations? Up until now, I've not been able to give either
    > Star Office or Open Office a serious look because they would not import
    > a Word Perfect file and more importantly they would not integrate into
    > our GroupWise document management system. '


    If so, I believe that you can have this. I know our retirement system runs
    on a mixed group of Outlook clients on Windows, Evolution clients on SLED
    and have groupwise as the email/calendaring solution.

    I am also pretty sure they use the novell client for connecting.


    --
    www.perfectreign.com || www.filesite.org

    powered by the lizard: www.opensuse.org

  3. Re: GroupWise

    RichardE99 wrote:

    > It's been a while since I check up on this issue (March 25, 2004:
    >

    http://groups.google.com/group/alt.o...t&q=groupwise#),
    > so it's time again.
    >
    > We run Novel servers and use GroupWise for email and integration of
    > document management. We use Windows XP on our workstations and
    > Microsoft Office products, word, excel and power point for our work
    > applications.
    >
    > When Novel bought Suse, I hoped that perhaps we would get a Suse
    > package that could eliminate the Microsoft products and save us $400
    > to $600 US per PC.
    >
    > I bought the newest boxed package from Novel, OpenSuse 11, had my IT
    > load it and was truly disappointed to see that while it shipped with
    > the usual abundance of applications, including Open Office, it did not
    > ship with GroupWise as an "installed package."


    That one does not have to pay for OpenSuSE does not mean that Novell has
    turned into a charity project ;-)
    Check the enterprise desktop SLED and the clients by Novell offered for
    this distribution.

    > Comments?


    You might find more experts on this topic in one of the support groups
    at NNTP server support-forums.novell.com. Aols is mostly about
    openSuSE, and you won't get the desired functions for free with that
    distribution. Though they might integrate as well as in the enterprise
    desktop, but then I simply don't have experience with Novell's
    groupware products.

    GŁnther

  4. Re: GroupWise

    Vahis wrote:
    > One thing is unclear to me: SLED comes with default Gnome.
    > Is this jus the default while KDE is available?
    > Can it be changed to KDE and still be SLED?


    Yes. Just select it with the software packages. The option that is not
    there is the selection to do a GNOME or KDE install (or any of the
    others)

    > Gnome is not my thing


    Mine not either.

    > What I would really like:
    > My basic OS would have 7 years of worryless life without having to
    > upgrade versions, just keep it running, automagically patched.


    Not (yet?) an option with openSUSE.

    > The web server would run on that host.
    >
    > Then all daily playing would take place on virtual machines.


    Put the web server on a virtual machine as well.

    > I wonder what a single licence would cost and what software you
    > can install on that within the terms.


    SLED is 65USD I think per year. SLES a lot more (350USD?) That gives you
    all the updates. Whatever else you put on their is your problem.
    If you realy do not want to do the updates, then don't run openSUSE,
    although I have seen some 'update' here and there mentioned with
    openSUSE as well.

    houghi
    --

    You are standing at the end of a road before a small brick building.
    Around you is a forest. A small stream flows out of the building and
    down a gully.

  5. Re: GroupWise

    On 2008-09-17, houghi wrote:
    > Vahis wrote:
    >> One thing is unclear to me: SLED comes with default Gnome.
    >> Is this jus the default while KDE is available?
    >> Can it be changed to KDE and still be SLED?

    >
    > Yes. Just select it with the software packages. The option that is not
    > there is the selection to do a GNOME or KDE install (or any of the
    > others)


    I thought so.
    >
    >> Gnome is not my thing

    >
    > Mine not either.


    I think gnomes are ugly.
    And I think that having a gnome even in the backyard means you're weird.

    >
    >> What I would really like:
    >> My basic OS would have 7 years of worryless life without having to
    >> upgrade versions, just keep it running, automagically patched.

    >
    > Not (yet?) an option with openSUSE.


    That's why I might consider SLES/SLED.
    >
    >> The web server would run on that host.
    >>
    >> Then all daily playing would take place on virtual machines.

    >
    > Put the web server on a virtual machine as well.


    I'm considering to do just that to test SLES/SLED.
    SLED in case HTTP and MYSQL servers go within the deal.

    But in real world I'd like the server to run on the worryless part, the host.
    It would just be set up once, then after that, no additional nothing.
    It would just run year after year.

    I'd wish the kernel to stay the same also, no reboots
    >
    >> I wonder what a single licence would cost and what software you
    >> can install on that within the terms.

    >
    > SLED is 65USD I think per year. SLES a lot more (350USD?) That gives you
    > all the updates. Whatever else you put on their is your problem.


    Is this about the number of users or something?
    Could put also server stuff on SLED?
    Like FTP, Apache, MySQL, the normal stuff...

    > If you realy do not want to do the updates, then don't run openSUSE,
    > although I have seen some 'update' here and there mentioned with
    > openSUSE as well.


    I hate it when I have to an upgrade or install fresh every second year.

    I'd prefer 7 years interval.

    Sure I like to play but the basic stuff should just keep running.
    I'd play on top of that, virtually.

    --
    Vahis
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    More about the vessel in the header image:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GTS_Finnjet

  6. Re: GroupWise

    Vahis wrote:
    > I think gnomes are ugly.
    > And I think that having a gnome even in the backyard means you're weird.


    I agree. The same goes for KDE.

    >> SLED is 65USD I think per year. SLES a lot more (350USD?) That gives you
    >> all the updates. Whatever else you put on their is your problem.

    >
    > Is this about the number of users or something?


    Number of machines.

    > Could put also server stuff on SLED?
    > Like FTP, Apache, MySQL, the normal stuff...


    It is Linux. You put on it whatever you like. I am just not sure what
    the upgrades entail. If there is no MySQL on it then you will need to do
    security upgrades yourself.

    >> If you realy do not want to do the updates, then don't run openSUSE,
    >> although I have seen some 'update' here and there mentioned with
    >> openSUSE as well.

    >
    > I hate it when I have to an upgrade or install fresh every second year.
    >
    > I'd prefer 7 years interval.


    Then I would advice to look at other distributions and come back when it
    is solved. At least for that. Take an extremely small PC with a small HD
    and put LAMP on it. Put as many HD's in it as is humanly possible to
    have it as a fileserver. Use as well as a print server, proxy
    server, firewall, p2p client, p2p server and what not.

    > Sure I like to play but the basic stuff should just keep running.
    > I'd play on top of that, virtually.


    Do that on a different machines.


    houghi
    --

    You are standing at the end of a road before a small brick building.
    Around you is a forest. A small stream flows out of the building and
    down a gully.

  7. Re: GroupWise

    On 2008-09-17, houghi wrote:
    > Vahis wrote:
    >> I think gnomes are ugly.
    >> And I think that having a gnome even in the backyard means you're weird.

    >
    > I agree. The same goes for KDE.


    I've seen gnomes in peoples gardens but never a KDE
    >
    >>> SLED is 65USD I think per year. SLES a lot more (350USD?) That gives you
    >>> all the updates. Whatever else you put on their is your problem.

    >>
    >> Is this about the number of users or something?

    >
    > Number of machines.


    OK.
    >
    >> Could put also server stuff on SLED?
    >> Like FTP, Apache, MySQL, the normal stuff...

    >
    > It is Linux. You put on it whatever you like. I am just not sure what
    > the upgrades entail. If there is no MySQL on it then you will need to do
    > security upgrades yourself.


    Obviously Apache and MySQL servers would come from SLES side with SLES
    licences.
    >
    >>> If you realy do not want to do the updates, then don't run openSUSE,
    >>> although I have seen some 'update' here and there mentioned with
    >>> openSUSE as well.

    >>
    >> I hate it when I have to an upgrade or install fresh every second year.
    >>
    >> I'd prefer 7 years interval.

    >
    > Then I would advice to look at other distributions and come back when it
    > is solved. At least for that. Take an extremely small PC with a small HD
    > and put LAMP on it. Put as many HD's in it as is humanly possible to
    > have it as a fileserver. Use as well as a print server, proxy
    > server, firewall, p2p client, p2p server and what not.
    >
    >> Sure I like to play but the basic stuff should just keep running.
    >> I'd play on top of that, virtually.

    >
    > Do that on a different machines.


    For once in my life I have assembled _one_ machine replacing four.

    And he goes "run more machines" on me!

    How's your overclocking?

    --
    Vahis
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    Congressman Wilson has an expression:
    "You can teach them to type, but you can't teach them to grow tits."

  8. Re: GroupWise

    On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:11:34 +0000, Vahis wrote:
    > I've seen gnomes in peoples gardens but never a KDE

    Are you sure you are not confusing gnomes and garden dwarves?

    The two are not the same thing and people frequently use the name
    gnome for garden dwarf in English.

    Garden Dwarves --

    <http://images.google.com/images?ie=U...UTF-8&q=garden
    +dwarf&um=1&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&resnum=1&ct=title>

    Furthermore, gnomes are believed to work in banks in Zurich,
    according to James Harold Wilson, in a speech which he gave to the
    Westminster Parliament in 1964.


  9. Re: GroupWise

    On 2008-09-17, J G Miller wrote:
    > On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:11:34 +0000, Vahis wrote:
    >> I've seen gnomes in peoples gardens but never a KDE

    > Are you sure you are not confusing gnomes and garden dwarves?


    LOL. It may have also been intentional in this context

    How's this:
    http://www.wowwiki.com/Gnome
    >
    > The two are not the same thing and people frequently use the name
    > gnome for garden dwarf in English.
    >
    > Garden Dwarves --
    >
    ><http://images.google.com/images?ie=U...UTF-8&q=garden
    > +dwarf&um=1&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&resnum=1&ct=title>
    >
    > Furthermore, gnomes are believed to work in banks in Zurich,
    > according to James Harold Wilson, in a speech which he gave to the
    > Westminster Parliament in 1964.
    >


    That I didn't know

    --
    Vahis
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    Congressman Wilson has an expression:
    "You can teach them to type, but you can't teach them to grow tits."

  10. Re: GroupWise

    Vahis wrote:

    > I'd wish the kernel to stay the same also, no reboots


    As compared to many other Linux distributions including Debian stable
    new kernel versions are not frequent indeed. But one does not get one
    year uptime still, three to four month might be typical.

    > Could put also server stuff on SLED?
    > Like FTP, Apache, MySQL, the normal stuff...


    Yes. SLES comes with additional packages for the Yast management tool.
    It is also the basis for the Linux based Open Enterprise Server from
    Novell which won't install on SLED. And support for hardware typically
    found in servers might be missing in SLED. Check the installation media
    for differences in the list of rpm packages.
    As for using it as a web server: make sure the versions supplied for php
    and such stuff are recent enough for your needs.

    G√ľnther

  11. Re: GroupWise

    Vahis wrote:

    > On 2008-09-17, houghi wrote:


    >
    > You download SLES or SLED, during the free evaluation period (was it
    > 60 days?) you get the security updates, too.


    Yes.

    > Then you decide and if you don't want to continue, you change the
    > repos and it becomes openSUSE. At least how I have understood it.
    >
    > Actually I have thought of trying that on a virtual machine.
    > I just would like to see if the current SLES/SLED goes smoothly to
    > openSUSE 11.0


    While this should work in principle it won't go smoothly. The current
    OpenSuSE 11.0 is several releases ahead of the SLED 10. So it's a
    leapfrog over intermediate Kernels and configurations. Given that
    OpenSuSE 11.0 installs really fast as compared to SLED or prior
    OpenSuSE versions a fresh install will be much preferable.

    > What I would really like:
    > My basic OS would have 7 years of worryless life without having to
    > upgrade versions, just keep it running, automagically patched.


    Check the Novell webpages on the lifetime of their products. The seven
    years apply to the freshly released enterprise desktop. AFAIR there are
    now about three years left ;-)
    SLED 11 is likely to be released in 2009 and will have full lifetime
    from there on.

    > The web server would run on that host.
    >
    > Then all daily playing would take place on virtual machines.


    For running virtual machines with Xen I would recommend SLES/SLED. I did
    not have luck running OpenSuSE as dom0. It runs nicely as domU though.

    > I wonder what a single licence would cost and what software you
    > can install on that within the terms.


    Anything you like unless you have a service contract that tells
    otherwise. Updates and patches apply to software from the official
    repositories only, of course

    G√ľnther

  12. Re: GroupWise

    Vahis wrote:
    >> It is Linux. You put on it whatever you like. I am just not sure what
    >> the upgrades entail. If there is no MySQL on it then you will need to do
    >> security upgrades yourself.

    >
    > Obviously Apache and MySQL servers would come from SLES side with SLES
    > licences.


    I was thinking about SLED.

    > How's your overclocking?


    I am reluctant to do it, because I have no idea what I am doing. I would
    have no idea on where to start and what is dangerous and what not.

    houghi
    --
    If God doesn't destroy Hollywood Boulevard, he owes Sodom and
    Gomorrah an apology.

  13. Re: GroupWise

    J G Miller wrote:
    >
    >
    > On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:11:34 +0000, Vahis wrote:
    >> I've seen gnomes in peoples gardens but never a KDE

    > Are you sure you are not confusing gnomes and garden dwarves?


    He is Finnish who speaks Sweadish, so he as never an idea what he is
    talking about. If you don't believe me, just ask Tanenbaum. ;-)

    houghi
    --
    If God doesn't destroy Hollywood Boulevard, he owes Sodom and
    Gomorrah an apology.

  14. Re: GroupWise

    GŁnther Schwarz wrote:
    > Vahis wrote:
    >
    >> I'd wish the kernel to stay the same also, no reboots

    >
    > As compared to many other Linux distributions including Debian stable
    > new kernel versions are not frequent indeed. But one does not get one
    > year uptime still, three to four month might be typical.


    If you pay a bit of attention, you can see what the danger realy is and
    not do the update as long as you are behind a hardware router/firewall.

    houghi
    --
    If God doesn't destroy Hollywood Boulevard, he owes Sodom and
    Gomorrah an apology.

  15. Re: GroupWise

    houghi wrote:

    > GŁnther Schwarz wrote:
    >> Vahis wrote:
    >>
    >>> I'd wish the kernel to stay the same also, no reboots

    >>
    >> As compared to many other Linux distributions including Debian stable
    >> new kernel versions are not frequent indeed. But one does not get one
    >> year uptime still, three to four month might be typical.

    >
    > If you pay a bit of attention, you can see what the danger realy is
    > and not do the update as long as you are behind a hardware
    > router/firewall.


    Vahis wrote about webservers. These are of not much use behind a
    firewall :-)
    Actually I host everything externally now because keeping them up to
    date and safe is much too much hazzle. As for other services: If a few
    hours downtown per year are not acceptable one might think of a
    redundant implementation rather than running a single machine as long
    as ever possible. And then keeping track of all the security issues and
    which patch has been applied and which one is still missing is a lot
    more work than running a daily update script and rebooting if necessary
    IMHO. It does get annoying though as kernel updates come just too
    frequently. But this has not been the case for SLES/D the last time.
    One machine with SLES 10 SP1 was up more than six month with daily
    updates.

    GŁnther

  16. Re: GroupWise

    GŁnther Schwarz wrote:
    >> If you pay a bit of attention, you can see what the danger realy is
    >> and not do the update as long as you are behind a hardware
    >> router/firewall.

    >
    > Vahis wrote about webservers. These are of not much use behind a
    > firewall :-)


    Sure they are. I see no reason not to put them behind a router/firewall.
    Just leave only port 80 open. Obviously you need to pay attention as to
    what kernel security updates there are and see if they woud have an
    impact.

    I am sure that you can easily skip a few before you need one that is a
    security leak. All other updates are still done.


    houghi
    --
    If God doesn't destroy Hollywood Boulevard, he owes Sodom and
    Gomorrah an apology.

  17. Re: GroupWise

    On 2008-09-17, houghi wrote:
    > Vahis wrote:
    >>> It is Linux. You put on it whatever you like. I am just not sure what
    >>> the upgrades entail. If there is no MySQL on it then you will need to do
    >>> security upgrades yourself.

    >>
    >> Obviously Apache and MySQL servers would come from SLES side with SLES
    >> licences.

    >
    > I was thinking about SLED.
    >
    >> How's your overclocking?

    >
    > I am reluctant to do it, because I have no idea what I am doing. I would
    > have no idea on where to start and what is dangerous and what not.


    That's what I see everywhere. One should be aware of what one is doing
    there. It also voids the guarantee.

    Do you feel you have a need for it?

    Is something taking too long? Here not
    --
    Vahis
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    Congressman Wilson has an expression:
    "You can teach them to type, but you can't teach them to grow tits."

  18. Re: GroupWise

    Vahis wrote:
    >> I am reluctant to do it, because I have no idea what I am doing. I would
    >> have no idea on where to start and what is dangerous and what not.

    >
    > That's what I see everywhere. One should be aware of what one is doing
    > there. It also voids the guarantee.


    **** the guarantee. If things break after a few weeks, I seldom go back.
    I just buy a new one.

    > Do you feel you have a need for it?


    Yes, I do feel the need. However it is more an inner need, then a
    technical one.

    > Is something taking too long? Here not


    Absolutely not. In fact the PC I replaced fullfilled all tasks perfectly
    with little or no delay.

    houghi
    --
    If God doesn't destroy Hollywood Boulevard, he owes Sodom and
    Gomorrah an apology.

  19. Re: GroupWise

    On 2008-09-18, houghi wrote:
    > Vahis wrote:
    >>> I am reluctant to do it, because I have no idea what I am doing. I would
    >>> have no idea on where to start and what is dangerous and what not.

    >>
    >> That's what I see everywhere. One should be aware of what one is doing
    >> there. It also voids the guarantee.

    >
    > **** the guarantee. If things break after a few weeks, I seldom go back.
    > I just buy a new one.


    Sounds expensive. I was referring to the processor
    >
    >> Do you feel you have a need for it?

    >
    > Yes, I do feel the need. However it is more an inner need, then a
    > technical one.
    >
    >> Is something taking too long? Here not

    >
    > Absolutely not. In fact the PC I replaced fullfilled all tasks perfectly
    > with little or no delay.


    I can imagine you sitting there with screens allover the place around you.

    All I'm missing here really is upstream bandwith.
    Downstream is good, 24 megs.

    Maybe I should have more and bigger screens...
    --
    Vahis
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    Congressman Wilson has an expression:
    "You can teach them to type, but you can't teach them to grow tits."

  20. Re: GroupWise

    Vahis wrote:
    >>> That's what I see everywhere. One should be aware of what one is doing
    >>> there. It also voids the guarantee.

    >>
    >> **** the guarantee. If things break after a few weeks, I seldom go back.
    >> I just buy a new one.

    >
    > Sounds expensive. I was referring to the processor


    Even then I would most likely not go back. I once had a 400EUR dvd
    player. It broke down. Instead of going back and using the guarantee, I
    bought a new one (for 35EUR)

    >> Absolutely not. In fact the PC I replaced fullfilled all tasks perfectly
    >> with little or no delay.

    >
    > I can imagine you sitting there with screens allover the place around you.


    I just need one small one. Just for fun. :-D

    > All I'm missing here really is upstream bandwith.
    > Downstream is good, 24 megs.


    I am nowhere near that. I also would like much more upstream.

    > Maybe I should have more and bigger screens...


    One can never have enough screen.

    houghi
    --
    If God doesn't destroy Hollywood Boulevard, he owes Sodom and
    Gomorrah an apology.

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