Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server - Suse

This is a discussion on Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server - Suse ; I need to be able to network boot some HP T5500 Thin Clients from a SuSE 10.3 Netserver. This thin client business is new to me so I could use some very basic help to start with. -- Jim Carter ...

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Thread: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

  1. Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    I need to be able to network boot some HP T5500 Thin Clients from a SuSE
    10.3 Netserver. This thin client business is new to me so I could use some
    very basic help to start with.

    --
    Jim Carter
    Rogers, Arkansas



  2. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    Jim Carter wrote:

    > I need to be able to network boot some HP T5500 Thin Clients from a SuSE
    > 10.3 Netserver. This thin client business is new to me so I could use some
    > very basic help to start with.
    >


    This may not be exactly what you are looking for, but have a look at drbl



    Install SUSE 10.3 (or Debian, Ubuntu, Mandriva, Red Hat, Fedora, CentOS) on
    your thin client server, then install drbl, run it, and it will set up your
    thin clients for you. If you have problems, contact the developers, they
    are incredibly helpful
    --
    David WIlson Clarke


  3. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    "David Wilson Clarke" wrote in message
    news:dun685-gqc.ln1@pinguino.site...
    > Jim Carter wrote:
    >
    >> I need to be able to network boot some HP T5500 Thin Clients from a SuSE
    >> 10.3 Netserver. This thin client business is new to me so I could use
    >> some
    >> very basic help to start with.
    >>

    >
    > This may not be exactly what you are looking for, but have a look at drbl
    >
    >
    >
    > Install SUSE 10.3 (or Debian, Ubuntu, Mandriva, Red Hat, Fedora, CentOS)
    > on
    > your thin client server, then install drbl, run it, and it will set up
    > your
    > thin clients for you. If you have problems, contact the developers, they
    > are incredibly helpful
    > --
    > David WIlson Clarke
    >


    I'm sorry - I should've specified that the user community wants these thin
    clients to run some version of Windows. I did install the drbl system as
    suggested and other than tuning a few things it gave me a workable Linux
    thin client. I just need to get them over to Windows... (and still serve
    them from the SuSE 10.3 server.)


    --
    Jim Carter
    Rogers, Arkansas



  4. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    Jim Carter wrote:

    > "David Wilson Clarke" wrote in
    > message news:dun685-gqc.ln1@pinguino.site...
    >> Jim Carter wrote:
    >>
    >>> I need to be able to network boot some HP T5500 Thin Clients from a SuSE
    >>> 10.3 Netserver. This thin client business is new to me so I could use
    >>> some
    >>> very basic help to start with.
    >>>

    >>
    >> This may not be exactly what you are looking for, but have a look at drbl
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> Install SUSE 10.3 (or Debian, Ubuntu, Mandriva, Red Hat, Fedora, CentOS)
    >> on
    >> your thin client server, then install drbl, run it, and it will set up
    >> your
    >> thin clients for you. If you have problems, contact the developers, they
    >> are incredibly helpful
    >> --
    >> David WIlson Clarke
    >>

    >
    > I'm sorry - I should've specified that the user community wants these thin
    > clients to run some version of Windows. I did install the drbl system as
    > suggested and other than tuning a few things it gave me a workable Linux
    > thin client. I just need to get them over to Windows... (and still serve
    > them from the SuSE 10.3 server.)


    Ok, probably a lot more complicated than I'm used to. Sorry I couldn't help.
    --
    David Wilson Clarke

  5. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    On 2008-02-13, Jim Carter wrote:
    > "David Wilson Clarke" wrote in message
    > news:dun685-gqc.ln1@pinguino.site...
    >> Jim Carter wrote:
    >>
    >>> I need to be able to network boot some HP T5500 Thin Clients from a SuSE
    >>> 10.3 Netserver. This thin client business is new to me so I could use
    >>> some
    >>> very basic help to start with.
    >>>

    >>
    >> This may not be exactly what you are looking for, but have a look at drbl
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> Install SUSE 10.3 (or Debian, Ubuntu, Mandriva, Red Hat, Fedora, CentOS)
    >> on
    >> your thin client server, then install drbl, run it, and it will set up
    >> your
    >> thin clients for you. If you have problems, contact the developers, they
    >> are incredibly helpful
    >> --
    >> David WIlson Clarke
    >>

    >
    > I'm sorry - I should've specified that the user community wants these thin
    > clients to run some version of Windows. I did install the drbl system as
    > suggested and other than tuning a few things it gave me a workable Linux
    > thin client. I just need to get them over to Windows... (and still serve
    > them from the SuSE 10.3 server.)
    >
    >


    I think then what you need is FreeNX.
    Follow the link in my sig and browse to my notes about installing
    FreeNX in Suse.
    --
    I'm remodeling my site to train new things:
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    "The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
    Henry Ford

  6. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    Jim Carter wrote:
    > I did install the drbl system as suggested and other than tuning a
    > few things it gave me a workable Linux thin client. I just need to
    > get them over to Windows... (and still serve them from the SuSE 10.3
    > server.)



    If that worked, then all you need to do is to dole out licensed copies
    of the HP T5500 Thin Client Windows image, rather than a Linux image.
    Were the clients not accompanied by these?

  7. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    "Gary Gapinski" wrote in message
    news:61lih0F1v9lcjU1@mid.individual.net...
    > Jim Carter wrote:
    >> I did install the drbl system as suggested and other than tuning a
    >> few things it gave me a workable Linux thin client. I just need to
    >> get them over to Windows... (and still serve them from the SuSE 10.3
    >> server.)

    >
    >
    > If that worked, then all you need to do is to dole out licensed copies
    > of the HP T5500 Thin Client Windows image, rather than a Linux image.
    > Were the clients not accompanied by these?


    AFAIK, The T5500 came with Windows CE in ROM and expects the consumer to
    provide their selected Windows version of choice on the server.



    --
    Jim Carter
    Rogers, Arkansas



  8. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    "Vahis" wrote in message
    news:20080214160451@usenet.waxborg.local...
    > On 2008-02-13, Jim Carter wrote:
    >> "David Wilson Clarke" wrote in
    >> message
    >> news:dun685-gqc.ln1@pinguino.site...
    >>> Jim Carter wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> I need to be able to network boot some HP T5500 Thin Clients from a
    >>>> SuSE
    >>>> 10.3 Netserver. This thin client business is new to me so I could use
    >>>> some
    >>>> very basic help to start with.
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> This may not be exactly what you are looking for, but have a look at
    >>> drbl
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> Install SUSE 10.3 (or Debian, Ubuntu, Mandriva, Red Hat, Fedora, CentOS)
    >>> on
    >>> your thin client server, then install drbl, run it, and it will set up
    >>> your
    >>> thin clients for you. If you have problems, contact the developers, they
    >>> are incredibly helpful
    >>> --
    >>> David WIlson Clarke
    >>>

    >>
    >> I'm sorry - I should've specified that the user community wants these
    >> thin
    >> clients to run some version of Windows. I did install the drbl system as
    >> suggested and other than tuning a few things it gave me a workable Linux
    >> thin client. I just need to get them over to Windows... (and still serve
    >> them from the SuSE 10.3 server.)
    >>
    >>

    >
    > I think then what you need is FreeNX.
    > Follow the link in my sig and browse to my notes about installing
    > FreeNX in Suse.
    > --
    > I'm remodeling my site to train new things:
    > http://waxborg.servepics.com
    > "The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
    > Henry Ford


    I looked at the docs on FreeNX which describe a Full Screen Graphical
    Interface over networks - i.e. remote desktop in the Windows world.

    Again, my request is to serve the Windows O/S to diskless thin clients from
    a Linux server.


    --
    Jim Carter
    Rogers, Arkansas



  9. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    Jim Carter wrote:

    > "Vahis" wrote in message
    > news:20080214160451@usenet.waxborg.local...
    >> On 2008-02-13, Jim Carter wrote:
    >>> "David Wilson Clarke" wrote in
    >>> message
    >>> news:dun685-gqc.ln1@pinguino.site...
    >>>> Jim Carter wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> I need to be able to network boot some HP T5500 Thin Clients from
    >>>>> a SuSE
    >>>>> 10.3 Netserver. This thin client business is new to me so I could
    >>>>> use some
    >>>>> very basic help to start with.
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> This may not be exactly what you are looking for, but have a look
    >>>> at drbl
    >>>>
    >>>>


    >>> I'm sorry - I should've specified that the user community wants
    >>> these thin
    >>> clients to run some version of Windows. I did install the drbl
    >>> system as suggested and other than tuning a few things it gave me a
    >>> workable Linux thin client.


    >> I think then what you need is FreeNX.
    >> Follow the link in my sig and browse to my notes about installing
    >> FreeNX in Suse.


    > I looked at the docs on FreeNX which describe a Full Screen Graphical
    > Interface over networks - i.e. remote desktop in the Windows world.
    >
    > Again, my request is to serve the Windows O/S to diskless thin clients
    > from a Linux server.


    So can't you simply run rdesktop or krdc on the server from the Thin
    Client as a terminal? Or do I miss something here?

    Günther

  10. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    "Günther Schwarz" wrote in message
    news:3384128.ldopx7sxeg@news.individual.de...
    >

    ....
    > So can't you simply run rdesktop or krdc on the server from the Thin
    > Client as a terminal? Or do I miss something here?
    >
    > Günther


    I'm sorry Gunther, I must be missing something also. Running krdc will give
    me a SuSE desktop on the thin client won't it? I'm trying to run Windows
    2003 (or at least XP Pro) on the thin clients so I can run MS Office and all
    the associated VB programs the users have.

    I'll check into krdc because I've not used it before, but if it won't
    flawlessly emulate windows (there's an oxymoron) then it probably won't be a
    solution.

    --
    Jim Carter
    Rogers, Arkansas



  11. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    On 2008-02-15, Jim Carter wrote:
    > "Vahis" wrote in message
    > news:20080214160451@usenet.waxborg.local...
    >> On 2008-02-13, Jim Carter wrote:
    >>> "David Wilson Clarke" wrote in
    >>> message
    >>> news:dun685-gqc.ln1@pinguino.site...
    >>>> Jim Carter wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> I'm sorry - I should've specified that the user community wants these
    >>> thin
    >>> clients to run some version of Windows. I did install the drbl system as
    >>> suggested and other than tuning a few things it gave me a workable Linux
    >>> thin client. I just need to get them over to Windows... (and still serve
    >>> them from the SuSE 10.3 server.)
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> I think then what you need is FreeNX.
    >> Follow the link in my sig and browse to my notes about installing
    >> FreeNX in Suse.
    >> --
    >> I'm remodeling my site to train new things:
    >> http://waxborg.servepics.com
    >> "The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
    >> Henry Ford

    >
    > I looked at the docs on FreeNX which describe a Full Screen Graphical
    > Interface over networks - i.e. remote desktop in the Windows world.
    >
    > Again, my request is to serve the Windows O/S to diskless thin clients from
    > a Linux server.
    >

    So your server must run Linux and it must boot your clients which must run
    windows?

    OK. Then I think you need a virtual machine(s) on that server.

    I would do openSUSE 10.3 server with DRBL and VMware Server.
    Obviously VirtualBox could be used instead of VMware but I have
    experience only of VMware.

    Vahis
    Remodeling my site to train new things:
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    --
    "The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
    Henry Ford

  12. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    Jim Carter wrote:
    > [...]
    > Again, my request is to serve the Windows O/S to diskless thin clients from
    > a Linux server.


    The OS you serve is not the same as the desktop you provide. You serve
    an OS in order to provide the thin client with software it can use to
    establish a remote desktop. The remote desktop is the OS that *runs* on
    the server. The OS you *serve* does *not* run on the server, it only
    runs on the thin client.

    You can serve any OS to the thin client; it's just a bunch of files
    served over FTP. However, the desktop that will be displayed remotely
    on the thin client, does not run on that thin client; it runs on the
    server. You serve the graphics of the desktop, not the OS.

    That is the nature of remote desktop. To provide a Windows remote
    desktop, the server must run Windows. If it's a Unix/Linux server, you
    need to run Windows on top of Unix/Linux. With VMWare, for example.

  13. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    Jim Carter wrote:

    > "Günther Schwarz" wrote in message
    > news:3384128.ldopx7sxeg@news.individual.de...
    >>

    > ...
    >> So can't you simply run rdesktop or krdc on the server from the Thin
    >> Client as a terminal? Or do I miss something here?


    > I'm sorry Gunther, I must be missing something also. Running krdc will
    > give me a SuSE desktop on the thin client won't it? I'm trying to run
    > Windows 2003 (or at least XP Pro) on the thin clients so I can run MS
    > Office and all the associated VB programs the users have.


    So I did misunderstand it. You do not have a Windows Server running
    somewhere where people can get their Windows session from?!

    > I'll check into krdc because I've not used it before, but if it won't
    > flawlessly emulate windows (there's an oxymoron) then it probably
    > won't be a solution.


    It will open a remote session on a Windows computer or any other machine
    that supports the protocol, there is no emulation involved.

    Günther

  14. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    On 2008-02-15, Jim Carter wrote:
    > "Gary Gapinski" wrote in message
    > news:61lih0F1v9lcjU1@mid.individual.net...
    >> Jim Carter wrote:
    >>> I did install the drbl system as suggested and other than tuning a
    >>> few things it gave me a workable Linux thin client. I just need to
    >>> get them over to Windows... (and still serve them from the SuSE 10.3
    >>> server.)

    >>
    >>
    >> If that worked, then all you need to do is to dole out licensed copies
    >> of the HP T5500 Thin Client Windows image, rather than a Linux image.
    >> Were the clients not accompanied by these?

    >
    > AFAIK, The T5500 came with Windows CE in ROM and expects the consumer to
    > provide their selected Windows version of choice on the server.


    In my case the version of choise would be any windows OS in a virtual
    machine like VMware:

    http://waxborg.servepics.com/english...vmware.en.html

    Vahis
    Remodeling my site to train new things:
    http://waxborg.servepics.com
    --
    "The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
    Henry Ford

  15. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    Vahis wrote:

    > On 2008-02-15, Jim Carter wrote:


    > In my case the version of choise would be any windows OS in a virtual
    > machine like VMware:
    >
    > http://waxborg.servepics.com/english...vmware.en.html
    >
    > Vahis
    > Remodeling my site to train new things:
    > http://waxborg.servepics.com


    Just a note about VMWare on openSUSE in combination with Thin CLients:
    Depending on the overall scenario it might become very tricky to make this
    work. Reason: All VMWare products (Server, Workstation, Viewer) may cause
    Windows blue screens while resizing the VMWare window when executed from a
    thin client. This is not on a regular base (> 50%), but definitly not
    stable enough to run a production system.

    One of my customers had the following scenario:
    Server running openSUSE with NX server
    Thin Clients running any kind of OS plus NX CLient software

    Running any kind of Software (except VMWare) was just fine. Due to some old
    Windows based Software there was a need to run WinXP (i.e. Wine did not
    fit).
    As soon as we started VMWare (Server, Workstation, Player - we've tested
    them all) from the thin client and resized the guest OS window (or,
    depending on the setup, it was resized by VMWare itself: Autosize option),
    VMWare crashed causing a blue screen on Windows. This is not a windows
    problem - its VMWare crashing the X windows for its virtual machine.

    We also tested VirtualBox: It was much more reliable than VMWare but still
    not stable enough for a production environment.

    Finally we gave up: For this very special environment the customer is
    using "normal" PCs (openSUSE) and runs VirtualBox on the local machine.

    Such scenario might not apply in your case, because we had a mix of
    openSuSE, thin clients, vmware products and WinXP. It might help others
    running into similar problems.

    Chris






  16. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    "Günther Schwarz" wrote in message
    news:1677963.MInoQBsbEp@news.individual.de...
    > Jim Carter wrote:
    >
    >> "Günther Schwarz" wrote in message
    >> news:3384128.ldopx7sxeg@news.individual.de...
    >>>

    >> ...
    >>> So can't you simply run rdesktop or krdc on the server from the Thin
    >>> Client as a terminal? Or do I miss something here?

    >
    >> I'm sorry Gunther, I must be missing something also. Running krdc will
    >> give me a SuSE desktop on the thin client won't it? I'm trying to run
    >> Windows 2003 (or at least XP Pro) on the thin clients so I can run MS
    >> Office and all the associated VB programs the users have.

    >
    > So I did misunderstand it. You do not have a Windows Server running
    > somewhere where people can get their Windows session from?!
    >


    No - I do not have a Windows server running anywhere in the environment, but
    now have a requirement to put up some Windows thin clients that boot from my
    Linux server.


    --
    Jim Carter
    Rogers, Arkansas



  17. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    "Nikos Chantziaras" wrote in message
    news:fp61c5$hnt$1@volcano1.grnet.gr...
    > Jim Carter wrote:
    >> [...]
    >> Again, my request is to serve the Windows O/S to diskless thin clients
    >> from a Linux server.

    >
    > The OS you serve is not the same as the desktop you provide. You serve an
    > OS in order to provide the thin client with software it can use to
    > establish a remote desktop. The remote desktop is the OS that *runs* on
    > the server. The OS you *serve* does *not* run on the server, it only runs
    > on the thin client.
    >
    > You can serve any OS to the thin client; it's just a bunch of files served
    > over FTP. However, the desktop that will be displayed remotely on the
    > thin client, does not run on that thin client; it runs on the server. You
    > serve the graphics of the desktop, not the OS.
    >
    > That is the nature of remote desktop. To provide a Windows remote
    > desktop, the server must run Windows. If it's a Unix/Linux server, you
    > need to run Windows on top of Unix/Linux. With VMWare, for example.


    So you're saying that I can not pxeboot a Windows image that resides on a
    Linux server?

    My understanding of Thin Clients is that they boot their own O/S from a
    network server then execute that O/S locally. Doesn't that mean that the
    network server does not necessarily have to run the same O/S as what is
    booted by (served to) the Thin Clients?

    --
    Jim Carter
    Rogers, Arkansas



  18. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    Jim Carter hatte geschrieben:

    > "Günther Schwarz" wrote in message
    > news:1677963.MInoQBsbEp@news.individual.de...
    >> Jim Carter wrote:
    >>
    >>> "Günther Schwarz" wrote in message
    >>> news:3384128.ldopx7sxeg@news.individual.de...
    >>>>
    >>> ...
    >>>> So can't you simply run rdesktop or krdc on the server from the
    >>>> Thin Client as a terminal? Or do I miss something here?

    >>
    >>> I'm sorry Gunther, I must be missing something also. Running krdc
    >>> will give me a SuSE desktop on the thin client won't it? I'm trying
    >>> to run Windows 2003 (or at least XP Pro) on the thin clients so I
    >>> can run MS Office and all the associated VB programs the users have.

    >>
    >> So I did misunderstand it. You do not have a Windows Server running
    >> somewhere where people can get their Windows session from?!
    >>

    >
    > No - I do not have a Windows server running anywhere in the
    > environment, but now have a requirement to put up some Windows thin
    > clients that boot from my Linux server.


    So I'm still confused. What are your users supposed to do with a Thin
    Client running Windows CE or whatever and without any applications
    other than a web browser or a terminal emulation which might be
    included in the client's software? If they want to use Word or such
    software there has to be a Windows Computer somewhere in the system.
    The Thin Client is too small to run such applications by itself.

    Günther

  19. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    Günther Schwarz wrote:
    > So I'm still confused. What are your users supposed to do with a Thin
    > Client running Windows CE or whatever and without any applications
    > other than a web browser or a terminal emulation which might be
    > included in the client's software?


    It could be that they use a website that forces them to use IE. Where I
    work we have at least one site that works only with IE6¹
    Or it could be that they must run an aplication that only runs on
    Windows.

    Sure that can be a bad idea and all that, yet you do not always have a
    choice. e.g. the whole IT department where I work would not mind one bit
    of going over to Linux. However it is not up to them.

    And that with 80% of the PC's only run the following: IE for webmail to
    an Outlook server (No Outlook or Outlook Express, webmail), a printer
    and a telnet to an AS 400 billing service

    ¹That sites gives some strange things running under IE7, like no
    pictures sometimes. Also we have a site that does NOT run with IE, so
    we have Firefox as well. Then there are sites that are on a special part
    on Intrabet, so we can only access it through
    Yeah, it is a mess.
    houghi
    --

    You are standing at the end of a road before a small brick building.
    Around you is a forest. A small stream flows out of the building and
    down a gully.

  20. Re: Windows Thin Clients served up from SuSE 10.3 server

    houghi wrote:

    > Günther Schwarz wrote:
    >> So I'm still confused. What are your users supposed to do with a Thin
    >> Client running Windows CE or whatever and without any applications
    >> other than a web browser or a terminal emulation which might be
    >> included in the client's software?

    >
    > It could be that they use a website that forces them to use IE. Where I
    > work we have at least one site that works only with IE6¹
    > Or it could be that they must run an aplication that only runs on
    > Windows.
    >
    > Sure that can be a bad idea and all that, yet you do not always have a
    > choice. e.g. the whole IT department where I work would not mind one bit
    > of going over to Linux. However it is not up to them.
    >
    > And that with 80% of the PC's only run the following: IE for webmail to
    > an Outlook server (No Outlook or Outlook Express, webmail), a printer
    > and a telnet to an AS 400 billing service
    >
    > ¹That sites gives some strange things running under IE7, like no
    > pictures sometimes. Also we have a site that does NOT run with IE, so
    > we have Firefox as well. Then there are sites that are on a special part
    > on Intrabet, so we can only access it through
    > Yeah, it is a mess.
    > houghi


    Have you tried the IE only website using Firefox with the User Agent
    Switcher? That works many times except when the web site insists on using
    ActiveX.

    I don't know about laws where you live, but in the US a website requiring a
    program that can cause damage like ActiveX is legally liable for any
    damage, or even virus infection that causes damage.

    One of my clients was one of the largest travel agencies in the world with
    offices everywhere. They started sending viruses in email and documents to
    clients, many of which were major players in the corporate world. Their
    legal department told them to fix the problem fast.

    There is no reason whatsoever for a website to require an IE only browser.
    The only is excuse is the incompetence of the programmers or they want more
    control of the visitors computer than they should have.

    --
    Later,
    Darrell Stec darstec@neo.rr.com

    Webpage Sorcery
    http://webpagesorcery.com
    We Put the Magic in Your Webpages

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