chk drive for errors? - Suse

This is a discussion on chk drive for errors? - Suse ; On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 15:17:38 +0100, David Bolt wrote: > On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, class_a wrote:- > >Mff'ppm fmffmmmffpppmfm >>mfpfmpfmppfm://fppfppfpp.pppmmmppmmppfmmfmfpfmpfmpffmppfmmfmmmppm pm.mmf >>ppfppm/pmpmppppppppffm/ > mfpfmpfmppfm://fppfppfpp.mpmmmmfpmpmmmmmppm.ppfpffmfm/~mpmmmmfpmpmmmmmppm > /pmfmffpppfmffpf/pmpmppppppppffm/ > > Mff mmfmmmppp'fmp pffmppppmmppppmmmpmpppff fppmfpffm Mff > fmmfmpfmfppmmmppmfmppmpm fmfpfmppfppp fmpmfpmpp MfmFmfMff ...

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Thread: chk drive for errors?

  1. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 15:17:38 +0100, David Bolt wrote:

    > On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, class_a wrote:-
    >
    >Mff'ppm fmffmmmffpppmfm
    >>mfpfmpfmppfm://fppfppfpp.pppmmmppmmppfmmfmfpfmpfmpffmppfmmfmmmppm pm.mmf
    >>ppfppm/pmpmppppppppffm/




    > mfpfmpfmppfm://fppfppfpp.mpmmmmfpmpmmmmmppm.ppfpffmfm/~mpmmmmfpmpmmmmmppm
    > /pmfmffpppfmffpf/pmpmppppppppffm/
    >
    > Mff mmfmmmppp'fmp pffmppppmmppppmmmpmpppff fppmfpffm Mff
    > fmmfmpfmfppmmmppmfmppmpm fmfpfmppfppp fmpmfpmpp MfmFmfMff
    > fpmmpppfffmmmffppfppp, mmpfmffmp Mff fmpmfpppffmfmfmmfpfmp mfffmp
    > fppppffmfpmfmpm mmpmpp fmffmmmppmpffmfpmf fmpppf pppppffmp mfpmmmfpmmpp
    > fmpppf pmpmppmpppfm fmmfmppffmppmmmppmmffpppmfm fmpmppfpffmp
    > fmpmfppffppffmfmfmmfp fmpmfpmpp .pfmpmf fpmmpppfffmmmffppfppp, fmmppf
    > pfmmmmmmfpmpmmmmfmmppmpm fmpmfpmmmfmp fmfpfm mmmfmm fppmpppmfpmf.
    > Fppmfpmffpmfmpp fmpmfpmmmfmp'fmm pfmmmmmmfpmpmmmmfmmppmpm mpfppfpff
    > (ppfpfmmppppp)FmmFmfFmmMpp, mfffmp fppppfpffpmpfmm ppfppp mmmfmp
    > pmfmppmmmfmmfmp ppfpppmpp pppppfppp-FmmFmfFmmMpp mpmmfffmmfmppffppf,
    > mmmfmm mffppmppffmpmfmppm fmffmmmppfmm ppmffm pfmmmmmmfpmpmmmmfmmpp
    > ppfppp PfmMmfPmfmffpppfmffpfPpfFmm. Fmpmfpmppppfpffffm mfffmm
    > fmpmfpmmmfmp mfffmp fmmmfpppffmfpmfmpm mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmf ppfppp
    > mmmpppffm PffPfmPpm mmpmmmfmmmppmpm mpmmfffmmfmppffppf, mmpfmffmp
    > fmpmfpmpp ppmmpppppfmf mpppppfmppffffm fppmffpmfpmf ppfppppmfffm
    > fppppfpffpmp mpfppfpff fmpmfpppffmmmpp mpfppfpmfpmfppffppmffpppmfm
    > fmpmfpmpp mpfpffmppmppmpmmppfmmpmpfmpppfpfm.ppfpffmfm ppmmpppppfmf
    > fmmfmppfffmfmmffmpfmfpffmpp.


    PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm mfpmmmfmm mppfpmmppppp mmmmpmppfpfmfmpmppmpm fmpmfpmpp
    "Pmpmffmmfpmpppfmpfmpf" fmmpmfmmmmmp ppmmpppppfmf mpfpffppfppm
    FmmFmfFmmMpp, mmmpmffmpmfpppffmfmfmmfp fmpmfpmpppffmppfmm mmm
    pfmmpppppmfmfmfmffppp ppfppp mfffmp pffmmmfmpmfpmpppff fmpmfpmmmppp
    fmpmfpmpp mfmmppmmfpmpppf. Mfffmp'fmm pffmmmfmpmfpmpppff
    mffpppfmpmpppffmppfmmfmpmffpppmfm, mmmfmm mfffmp'fmm mpfpffppfppm mmm
    Ppmmmmpppmpmpffmfffpmmmm mmpmmmfmmmpp, fmffmmmppfmm mmmpfmfmp-mfmmmmfmp
    mmmpppmpm fmmffmpppmmmpfmfmpmffmmf mpfppfpff fmpmfpmpp
    pfmmmmmmfpmpmmmmfmmpp ppmmmmpppmmmmfmmpppff, mfpmmmfmm PmpMpmMpp 3.5.7
    mpfppfpff fmpmfpmpp mpmmppmpfmmmfmfpmffmp mpmmppfmmpmpfmpppfpfm, mmmpppmpm
    mmpppfpffpffppffppfmm mmpmfffmpfmm mmmpppmpm pfmmffmppmmfmppfmm
    mpfpffppfppm FmmFmfFmmMpp, mmmpppmpm ppffmpmfpmpppfffmm. Mmmpmfpmf mffppp
    mmmpmfpmf, mfffmp'fmm fpmmpppffffm fmmpmfmffmmfpmp, pfffmfpppfmm mmmpppmpm
    mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmffmm mpfpffppfppm mmm pmfmfffpmmpp MmfMpm, mmmpppmpm
    fmpmfpmpp mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmfmmmfmpmffppfppp ppfppp ppmffm
    ppmmmmmmfmfpmffpppmpp fmpppfppfpmp 10-15 ppmmffpppfmffmpmppfmm
    fmpppffmpmmmpmf fmpmffppmmpp.

    --
    imotgm
    "Lost? Lost? I've never been lost... Been a tad confused for a
    month or two, but never lost."



  2. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-

    >PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm mfpmmmfmm mppfpmmppppp mmmmpmppfpfmfmpmppmpm fmpmfpmpp
    >"Pmpmffmmfpmpppfmpfmpf" fmmpmfmmmmmp ppmmpppppfmf mpfpffppfppm
    >FmmFmfFmmMpp,


    Ppfmfp ffmfmfmmfpmp!

    >mmmpmffmpmfpppffmfmfmmfp fmpmfpmpppffmppfmm mmm
    >pfmmpppppmfmfmfmffppp ppfppp mfffmp pffmmmfmpmfpmpppff fmpmfpmmmppp
    >fmpmfpmpp mfmmppmmfpmpppf.


    Fmmfmpmffpmfpmf ffmfmfmmfpmp.

    >Mfffmp'fmm pffmmmfmpmfpmpppff
    >mffpppfmpmpppffmppfmmfmpmffpppmfm, mmmfmm mfffmp'fmm mpfpffppfppm mmm
    >Ppmmmmpppmpmpffmfffpmmmm mmpmmmfmmmpp, fmffmmmppfmm mmmpfmfmp-mfmmmmfmp
    >mmmpppmpm fmmffmpppmmmpfmfmpmffmmf mpfppfpff fmpmfpmpp
    >pfmmmmmmfpmpmmmmfmmpp ppmmmmpppmmmmfmmpppff, mfpmmmfmm PmpMpmMpp 3.5.7
    >mpfppfpff fmpmfpmpp mpmmppmpfmmmfmfpmffmp mpmmppfmmpmpfmpppfpfm, mmmpppmpm
    >mmpppfpffpffppffppfmm mmpmfffmpfmm mmmpppmpm pfmmffmppmmfmppfmm
    >mpfpffppfppm FmmFmfFmmMpp, mmmpppmpm ppffmpmfpmpppfffmm.


    Fppmpppmfpmf, Mff'mpm mfpmmmfpmmpp fmmmmmmffmpm mfffmp
    pfmmffmmfpmpmppmpm fmpmfpmpp mmpmppfmmfmp mpfpffppfppm fmpmfpmpp
    ppffmpmfpmpppff mpmmfffmmfmppffppffmm mppfpfmmfmpppfmfmp mpfppfpff
    fmpmfpmpp FmmFmfFmmMpp/Pppppffpmmpppmfpmf fmmfmpffmpmfmpp
    pmpmffmmfpmpppfmpfmpf. Fppmpppmfpmf, ppmmmmffmmmpmpp. Mff mpmppfppp'fmp
    pmppppppffpp mmmmmpppffmffmp Fmmffmpppmmmpfmfmpmffmmf fmmppf
    mmfmmmppp'fmp fmmmmmffm mffmpf Mff'mpm pfmpffmppmpfmpppff mfffmp fmpppf
    FfmmmmFmmFmp.

    >Mmmpmfpmf mffppp
    >mmmpmfpmf, mfffmp'fmm fpmmpppffffm fmmpmfmffmmfpmp, pfffmfpppfmm mmmpppmpm
    >mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmffmm mpfpffppfppm mmm pmfmfffpmmpp MmfMpm, mmmpppmpm
    >fmpmfpmpp mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmfmmmfmpmffppfppp ppfppp ppmffm
    >ppmmmmmmfmfpmffpppmpp fmpppfppfpmp 10-15 ppmmffpppfmffmpmppfmm
    >fmpppffmpmmmpmf fmpmffppmmpp.


    Mff'pmfpmf mmmmpmmpm mfmpffmmmmmpmmpmffpppmfm mmm mmfppfpfmffm mmmpppmpm
    fmmmppmppmffpppmfm fppmfpmmmfmp mfffmp pmfppfppfpmpfmm pmfmffpmpmpp
    fmpppf ppmffm pmfmfffmmfmp ppfmpf "fmpmfpmffpppmfmfmm Mff'mpm
    pmfmffpmpmpp fmpppf mpmppf".


    Regards,
    David Bolt

    --
    Member of Team Acorn checking nodes at 100 Mnodes/s: www.distributed.net
    RISC OS 3.11 | SUSE 10.0 32bit | SUSE 10.1 32bit | openSUSE 10.2 32bit
    RISC OS 3.6 | SUSE 10.0 64bit | SUSE 10.1 64bit | openSUSE 10.2 64bit
    TOS 4.02 | SUSE 9.3 32bit | | openSUSE 10.3a5 32bit

  3. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 10:43:23 +0100, David Bolt wrote:

    >
    > Mff'pmfpmf mmmmpmmpm mfmpffmmmmmpmmpmffpppmfm mmm mmfppfpfmffm mmmpppmpm
    > fmmmppmppmffpppmfm fppmfpmmmfmp mfffmp pmfppfppfpmpfmm pmfmffpmpmpp
    > fmpppf ppmffm pmfmfffmmfmp ppfmpf "fmpmfpmffpppmfmfmm Mff'mpm
    > pmfmffpmpmpp fmpppf mpmppf".


    Mff mfpmmmmpm fmpmfpmpp fpmmpppffffm mpfmffpfffmmfmp fpmmpppfffmmmffppfppp
    ppfmpf PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm, mpmmpppffmfffpmmppmpm mpfpffppfppm
    ppmmmmpppmpmpffmmmpmpmpp 9.2. Fmpmfpmpp
    mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmfmmmfmpmffppfppp fppmmmfmm fmpmpppffpffmffmmppmfmpp,
    mmpfmffmp ppfpppmmfmpp Mff mfmppffmp mfffmp
    fmmfmppffmmmmffmfmmfpfmpmpppppmppmpm ppffmffmp fmpmfpmpp PpfFmm fppmmmfmm
    mfmpffmppmmmfmp. Mmm mmfppffmfpfmpmfmpp ppfmpf ppmppfpppfmpmfpfmm
    mmmmfmppf, Mff fppmmmfmm mfpmmmfpmmffpppmfm pfmpffppfmmppmfmppppmfmm
    fppmfffmpmfp FmmFmfFmmMpp 10.2 pppppffmp mmpmppmffpppmfm
    mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmfmmmmmppmfmpp ppfppp ppmffm mfpmmmpffmpmfppmmmpffmpp.
    Fmpppf mpmppf mmm mpfmmmfmmfmp fmpmppfmmfmp ppfmpf fmpmfpmpp fmmmmmppmmpp
    pmpmpppffpppmpppmf, mpfpffppfppm mmmpppppffmpmfpmpppff mpmmfffmmfmppffppf,
    Mff mpm/pmf'mpm fmpmfpmpp PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm pmfmfffpmmpp MmfMpm. Mfffmp
    pffmmmppp fmmppf pppmffmmfmpp mmmfmm mmm pmfmfffpmmpp MmfMpm, Mff
    ppffpmmpppfffpppffppffmpmpp fmpmfpmpp ppfpmfmpm fpmmpppfffmmmffppfppp
    ppfppp fmpmfpmpp mfpmmmpffmpm mpmpffmfffpmmpp. Mff'fpmmpp mfmppffmp
    FmmFmfFmmMpp 10.2 pfffmfppppppmffpppmfm fppmfffmpmfp mmm
    mmffmffmmfmpppfppm pmpmpppffpppmpppmf Mff mmfppfppmpfmmffpmfmppmpm,
    fmffmmmffpppmfm fmpmfpmpp FmmFmfFmmMpp pmpmpppffpppmpppmf
    fmmppffmfpffmmfmppfmm, mmmpppmpm fmpmfpmpp PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm
    ..mmfppfpppmpfmffmfm mpfmffpmfmpp. Fmpmfpmpp fmmfmpppfmmfpmp FmmFmfFmmMpp
    pmpmpppffpppmpppmffmm pmfppfmmfpmp ppfppp pmfppfmmmmpm fmmfmpmffpmfpmf,
    (Mff pmmfmffmmfmp fmfpfmmpmmmmfmpmppmpm mmmmfmmmmmffppp fmpppfmpmmmmffm)
    mmmpppmpm Mff mfpmmmfpmmpp mmm mmpfmfmfm pffmpppfmppfpfffmp fmpmfpmmmfmp
    mfpmmmfmm mmmmmpppffmffmp 60 mpppppfmppffmffmppfmm pppppffpp, fppmfffmpmfp
    pppppf mfmppfppfmpm pffmppfmmfmfpmffmpfmm.
    Mmfppfpppfmmmpppfpfmfmpppppfmppmfffm, Mff'fpmmpp fmmpfmmpppppfmp
    ppmppfpffmpp fmpmffppmmpp ppfppp PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm fmpmfpmmmppp FmmFmfFmmMpp
    mppfpmmpppff fmmmffpppmmfmpp. Fmpmfpmmmfmp'fmm fmmfmppffmmmpppmfmmpp
    mpfppfpff ppmmpp, mmmfmm Mff'fpmmpp mfpmmmmpm FmmFmfFmmMpp mmmfmm ppmffm
    ppmmmmmffppp mpmmppfmmpmpfmpppfpfm fmmmffpppmmfmpp 6.4.

    Mff'ppm mffppp FmmFmfFmmMpp 10.2 pffmffmfmmfpfmp pppppffpp, mmmpppmpm
    mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmfmppmpm ffmppffmfpff pmpmppppppppffm-fpf, mmmpppmpm
    mpmmffmpm fmpmfpmpp fmfpfmmpmmmmfmpmppfmm. Mff
    pffmppmmfppfppmpfmmffpmfmppmpm fmpmfpmpp pppmppfppmppfmmfmp
    pmpmpppffpppmpppmf fppmfffmpmfp fmpmfpmpp PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm
    ..mmfppfpppmpfmffmfm, mmpfmffmp pppppffpp fmpmfpmmmfmp pmpmpppffpppmpppmf
    pmfppfmmfpmpfmm fmfpfm. Fmpmfpmpp pmfmmmfmmfmp fmfpfmmpmmmmfmpmpp
    pffmppmmfppfppmpfmmffpmfmppmpm mmmpppmpm pffmmmppp mpfmffpppmpp, fmmppf
    fmmppfppmmppfmpmfpmffpppmfm mffppp fmpmfpmpp pmfmmmfmmfmp "mpfmfffpf",
    mmfpffmppmmmfmpmppmpm mmm pppmppfpp "mmppffppfpmpmpp mmmmfmmmmmffppp"
    mpfppfpff ppmmpp. Mff mfpmmmfpmmpp fmpppf pfffmfppp fmpmfpmpp
    ppfpmfmpmmpppff 2.6.18.8-0.3-1-mffppmppffmpmfmppm mpfpffppfppm fmpmfpmpp
    pmfmmmfmmfmp fmfpfmmfmpffmmmmpmmpp mmmpppmpm pffmppmmfppfppmpfmmffpmfmpp,
    fmfpppfmpmffpmf Mff mpfmffmfmfmfpffmpp ppffmffmp fppmfpmmmfmp fmpmfpmppffm
    mmppffppfpmpmpp fppmfffmpmfp fmpmfpmppmffpff mpfmfffpf.


    --
    imotgm
    "Lost? Lost? I've never been lost... Been a tad confused for a
    month or two, but never lost."



  4. Re: chk drive for errors?

    BearItAll wrote:
    > calgon wrote:
    >
    >> Whats the linux equivalent? fsck right? But to run that dont you have to
    >> get the cd out and boot to a weird mode where nothing is mounted..?
    >>
    >> I just want to check the file system for errors.

    >
    > So you got as far as finding the name but couldn't be arsed to 'man' it or
    > google 'man fsck'
    >
    > Would you like one of us to pop round and type the command in for you?
    >
    > Just tell us what town you are in and whether you would prefer a morning,
    > afternoon or evening visit. Who ever turns up can wipe the dribble off your
    > chin while they are there and and Oh you know some days you
    > just can't be arsed.
    >


    I did read up on it. I just thought maybe there were alternatives or
    tricks I didn't know as there always are in *nix. Yeah maybe I could've
    spent 20 man hours and become an expert on fsck. Or I can ask a ? in an
    anonymous public forum and some friendly person might help.

    Sheesh, I think you must be a slackware guru who showed up at the wrong
    hangout. Are you lost? This forum is for suse.

  5. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Fri, 20 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-

    Pppppffpp fmpmfpmfffmm mfffmm mmpmppmmfppfppmmffpppmfm
    fmpmppmmfmfppppmffmmfmmmpmf, mfffmp ppmmffmfmmfpfmp mmpmpp mmmppp
    mffmpmmppmmm fmpppf fmmfppmfffmpmmfmfp mmpmmmmmfpmp fmpppf
    Mpppppmfmpmfmfffmmmfp.

    >Mff mfpmmmmpm fmpmfpmpp fpmmpppffffm mpfmffpfffmmfmp fpmmpppfffmmmffppfppp
    >ppfmpf PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm, mpmmpppffmfffpmmppmpm mpfpffppfppm
    >ppmmmmpppmpmpffmmmpmpmpp 9.2.


    Mff'ppm pppppffmp fmmfmfpffmpp fppmfpmppfmpmfpmpppff fmpppf mfmppf
    "ffmfmfmmfpmp!" ppfpff pppppffmp. Mmmfmm ffmppffmf mmfppffmfpmfmpm
    pfmpffppfmmpmmmmmppmfffm mfmfmfmppfmmfmm, Mff'ppm pppppffmp mmmpmfpmf
    fmpmfpmmmfmp pmpmppmppppp ppfppp
    Ppmmmmpppmpmpffmmmpmpmpp/Ppmmmmpppmpmpffmfffpmmmm.


    >Mmm mmfppffmfpfmpmfmpp ppfmpf ppmppfpppfmpmfpfmm
    >mmmmfmppf, Mff fppmmmfmm mfpmmmfpmmffpppmfm pfmpffppfmmppmfmppppmfmm
    >fppmfffmpmfp FmmFmfFmmMpp 10.2 pppppffmp mmpmppmffpppmfm
    >mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmfmmmmmppmfmpp ppfppp ppmffm mfpmmmpffmpmfppmmmpffmpp.
    >Fmpppf mpmppf mmm mpfmmmfmmfmp fmpmppfmmfmp ppfmpf fmpmfpmpp fmmmmmppmmpp
    >pmpmpppffpppmpppmf, mpfpffppfppm mmmpppppffmpmfpmpppff mpmmfffmmfmppffppf,
    >Mff mpm/pmf'mpm fmpmfpmpp PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm pmfmfffpmmpp MmfMpm. Mfffmp
    >pffmmmppp fmmppf pppmffmmfmpp mmmfmm mmm pmfmfffpmmpp MmfMpm, Mff
    >ppffpmmpppfffpppffppffmpmpp fmpmfpmpp ppfpmfmpm fpmmpppfffmmmffppfppp
    >ppfppp fmpmfpmpp mfpmmmpffmpm mpmpffmfffpmmpp.


    Fmpmfpmmmfmp'fmm mmmfmm mfmppfppfmpm mmm pffmppmmmfmmppfppp mmmfmm
    mmmpppffm mpfppfpff mmmppp fmfpfmmfmpffmmmmpmmpp.

    >Mff'fpmmpp mfmppffmp
    >FmmFmfFmmMpp 10.2 pfffmfppppppmffpppmfm fppmfffmpmfp mmm
    >mmffmffmmfmpppfppm pmpmpppffpppmpppmf Mff mmfppfppmpfmmffpmfmppmpm,
    >fmffmmmffpppmfm fmpmfpmpp FmmFmfFmmMpp pmpmpppffpppmpppmf
    >fmmppffmfpffmmfmppfmm, mmmpppmpm fmpmfpmpp PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm
    >.mmfppfpppmpfmffmfm mpfmffpmfmpp.


    Mfpmmmfpmmpp ffmppffmf mmmmmffmpfmfmmmpmfpmfffm mpmppfpppmpp mmm
    mpmmffmpfmpf ppfppp fmpmfpmpp fmpfppppf mpmmffmpfmpfmpppffmpppppfmp
    ..mmfppfpppmpfmffmfm mpfmffpmfmppfmm fmpppf fmmmppmpp fppmfpmmmfmp
    fmpmfpmpp mpmmffmpfmpfmpppffmpppppmmfmppfmm mmmpffmpp? Ffmppffmf
    ppmmffmfmmfpfmp mmpmpp mmmmmppmfmpp fmpppf fmppffmmmmmfpmp
    mppfpfmmmmmffmppmfffm fppmfpmffmmfmfp mmfmfpmmmpppmfmmpp mfffmm
    mmfmmmfmffmmmffpppmfm fmpmfpmpp pmfppfmmfpmpfmfpfmfmm.

    >Fmpmfpmpp fmmfmpppfmmfpmp FmmFmfFmmMpp
    >pmpmpppffpppmpppmffmm pmfppfmmfpmp ppfppp pmfppfmmmmpm fmmfmpmffpmfpmf,
    >(Mff pmmfmffmmfmp fmfpfmmpmmmmfmpmppmpm mmmmfmmmmmffppp fmpppfmpmmmmffm)
    >mmmpppmpm Mff mfpmmmfpmmpp mmm mmpfmfmfm pffmpppfmppfpfffmp fmpmfpmmmfmp
    >mfpmmmfmm mmmmmpppffmffmp 60 mpppppfmppffmffmppfmm pppppffpp, fppmfffmpmfp
    >pppppf mfmppfppfmpm pffmppfmmfmfpmffmpfmm.


    Mmpfmfmfm #248860?

    >Mmfppfpppfmmmpppfpfmfmpppppfmppmfffm, Mff'fpmmpp fmmpfmmpppppfmp
    >ppmppfpffmpp fmpmffppmmpp ppfppp PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm fmpmfpmmmppp FmmFmfFmmMpp
    >mppfpmmpppff fmmmffpppmmfmpp. Fmpmfpmmmfmp'fmm fmmfmppffmmmpppmfmmpp
    >mpfppfpff ppmmpp, mmmfmm Mff'fpmmpp mfpmmmmpm FmmFmfFmmMpp mmmfmm ppmffm
    >ppmmmmmffppp mpmmppfmmpmpfmpppfpfm fmmmffpppmmfmpp 6.4.


    Mmfppfppmpfmpmfmppfmpmpppmfffm
    fmfpppmpmmpppfffmmfmpmmmpppmpmmmmmmppmfmpp. Mff fppppffmfpmfmpmppp'fmp
    fmffmmmpp mmm fmmffmfmmfmpmppppm fmpmfpmmmfmp pmpmpppfmfmp
    pmfppfmmfpmpmffpppmfm fmfpfm (mfpmpp fmmmmmffmfmm fppmfpmffpmfmpp
    fmmfmpmffpmfpmf fmffmmmffpppmfm Fppmffpppmpmppffppfmm :/ )
    fmfppppmfmppfmmfmm Mff mmfppffmfpmfmpm mmmmmffmpfmfmmmpmfpmfffm
    mpfmffpppmpm fmpmfpmpp mmfmmmfmffmmmpp ppfmpf fmpmfpmpp
    pmfppfmmfpmpfmfpfmfmm.

    >Mff'ppm mffppp FmmFmfFmmMpp 10.2 pffmffmfmmfpfmp pppppffpp, mmmpppmpm
    >mffpppfmmfmpmmmpmfpmfmppmpm ffmppffmfpff pmpmppppppppffm-fpf, mmmpppmpm
    >mpmmffmpm fmpmfpmpp fmfpfmmpmmmmfmpmppfmm. Mff
    >pffmppmmfppfppmpfmmffpmfmppmpm fmpmfpmpp pppmppfppmppfmmfmp
    >pmpmpppffpppmpppmf fppmfffmpmfp fmpmfpmpp PfmMmfPmfPpfFmm
    >.mmfppfpppmpfmffmfm, mmpfmffmp pppppffpp fmpmfpmmmfmp pmpmpppffpppmpppmf
    >pmfppfmmfpmpfmm fmfpfm.


    Fmpmfpmpp mppfpfmmmmmffmp fmmmmmppmmpp .mmfppfpppmpfmffmfm fmpmfpmmmfmp
    fppppfpffpmpmppmpm pfmpffmppfpmmffppffmffmmpmfffm?
    Mffpppfmpmpppffmppfmmfmpmffpppmfm.

    >Fmpmfpmpp pmfmmmfmmfmp fmfpfmmpmmmmfmpmpp
    >pffmppmmfppfppmpfmmffpmfmppmpm mmmpppmpm pffmmmppp mpfmffpppmpp, fmmppf
    >fmmppfppmmppfmpmfpmffpppmfm mffppp fmpmfpmpp pmfmmmfmmfmp "mpfmfffpf",
    >mmfpffmppmmmfmpmppmpm mmm pppmppfpp "mmppffppfpmpmpp mmmmfmmmmmffppp"
    >mpfppfpff ppmmpp.


    Fppmpppmfpmf, mfffmmfmmfmfmffpppmfm mmm mmppffppfpmpmppppp
    "fmfpfmmpmmmmfmpmpp" mfffmmppp'fmp pmmfmffmmfmp
    pffmppfmmfmppffmffmmffmpmppmpm fmpppf Ppm$. Pppppffpmmpppmfpmf mpmmffmpm
    pffmpppmfmppmmmfmmmpp mmmfmp pmfmppmmmfmmfmp ppfpppmpp fpmmpppffffm
    mmmppppppppfffmmffpppmfm ppfpppmpp fmpmfpmmmfmp pffmpppppmpmmpppffmppmpm
    fmmppfppmmpp fmmffmfmmfmpmppppmfmm fmfpppmmpppfppffmpmmmmmppmfmpp.

    >Mff mfpmmmfpmmpp fmpppf pfffmfppp fmpmfpmpp
    >ppfpmfmpmmpppff 2.6.18.8-0.3-1-mffppmppffmpmfmppm mpfpffppfppm fmpmfpmpp
    >pmfmmmfmmfmp fmfpfmmfmpffmmmmpmmpp mmmpppmpm pffmppmmfppfppmpfmmffpmfmpp,
    >fmfpppfmpmffpmf Mff mpfmffmfmfmfpffmpp ppffmffmp fppmfpmmmfmp fmpmfpmppffm
    >mmppffppfpmpmpp fppmfffmpmfp fmpmfpmppmffpff mpfmfffpf.


    Mfmppfppfmpm mmpfmfmfm-mfpfmfpppfmpmffpppmfm


    Regards,
    David Bolt

    --
    Member of Team Acorn checking nodes at 100 Mnodes/s: www.distributed.net
    RISC OS 3.11 | SUSE 10.0 32bit | SUSE 10.1 32bit | openSUSE 10.2 32bit
    RISC OS 3.6 | SUSE 10.0 64bit | SUSE 10.1 64bit | openSUSE 10.2 64bit
    TOS 4.02 | SUSE 9.3 32bit | | openSUSE 10.3a5 32bit

  6. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Sat, 21 Jul 2007 15:42:41 +0100, David Bolt wrote:

    > On Fri, 20 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-


    > Now this is becoming technical, it might be an idea to switch back to
    > English.


    It's about time anyway, as we're not smoking out any more "fish".

    >>I had the very first version of PCLOS, derived from mandrake 9.2.

    >
    > I'm not sure whether to go "yuck!" or not. As you could probably guess,
    > I'm not all that keen on Mandrake/Mandriva.


    Mandrake 6.0 was the first Linux I installed on my machine. Didn't like
    it, so tried SuSE and stayed with that. Tried Mandrake again when 9.1 came
    out, and it was much better, so I kept it for comparison purposes. 9.2
    came out, and there was some discord about TexStar making unofficial
    packages that Mandrake claimed were bad. As the TexStar packages worked
    perfectly, and the Mandrake ones were broken, that didn't fly too well.
    End result was that TexStar stopped making packages for Mandrake, and
    started PCLinuxOS, which has been referred to as, "Mandriva, done right,"
    "What Mandriva should have been," and "What Mandriva wishes they were." in
    various revues.

    >>A couple of months ago, I was having problems with SUSE 10.2 not being
    >>installable on my hardware. To do a fast test of the same kernel, from
    >>another distro, I d/l'd the PCLOS live CD. It ran so nice as a live CD,
    >>I overwrote the old version on the hard drive.

    >
    > That's as good a reason as any for an upgrade.


    I've run the PCLinuxOS versions in between, from the live CD, but the
    installation program was sort of broken on the first version, while the OS
    itself was excellent, so I didn't want to go through the hassle of the
    install process. This new one worked so well, I thought I'd risk the
    installation, on a different hard drive. It was so smooth, and the end
    result so good, I blew away the ancient version, on my main drive, and
    installed the latest, and greatest, there.

    >>I've got SUSE 10.2 running with a custom kernel I compiled, using the
    >>SUSE kernel sources, and the PCLOS .config file.

    >
    > Have you actually done a diff on the two different .config files to see
    > what the differences are? You might be able to track exactly which
    > change is causing the lockups.


    First thing I did. The problem is the pata_ drivers. In
    particular, the pata_it821x driver. Not only is it bad, but if it is
    compiled, the process somehow breaks the standard it821x as well. by
    eliminating all of the pata_ modules the kernel works.
    Menuconfig shows these to be listed as either, "Experimental" or "Very
    Experimental" which, to me, means they do not have any place in a default
    installation kernel.

    >>The stock SUSE kernels lock on load still, (I just updated again today)
    >>and I have a bug report that has about 60 entries now, with no good
    >>results.

    >
    > Bug #248860?


    Yup, that be the one.

    >>Consequently, I've spent more time on PCLOS than SUSE ever since. That's
    >>strange for me, as I've had SUSE as my main desktop since 6.4.

    >
    > Completely understandable. I wouldn't use a system that kept locking up
    > (he says while still using Windows :/ ) unless I could actually find the
    > cause of the lockups.


    If you notice, on bugzilla, no one wants to admit I'm right. They keep
    looking for "other explanations". They say try this, try that, but nothing
    makes any difference, other than not compiling the duff modules. That
    gives instant, positive results.

    >>I'm in SUSE 10.2 right now, and installed your kenny-x, and did the
    >>updates. I recompiled the newest kernel with the PCLOS .config, but now
    >>that kernel locks up.

    >
    > The exact same .config that worked previously? Interesting.


    My thought, exactly.

    >>The last update recompiled and ran fine, so something in the last "fix",
    >>created a new "broke again" for me.

    >
    > Well, issuing a broken "update" isn't just restricted to M$. Novell did
    > release at least one very annoying one that rendered some systems
    > unbootable.
    >
    >>I have to run the older 2.6.18.8-0.3-1-imotgm from the last upgrade and
    >>recompile, until I figure out what they broke with their fix.

    >
    > Good bug-hunting


    Do I detect a "Glad it's you, and not me," note in that smiley? ;-D

    --
    imotgm
    "Lost? Lost? I've never been lost... Been a tad confused for a
    month or two, but never lost."



  7. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Sat, 21 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-

    >On Sat, 21 Jul 2007 15:42:41 +0100, David Bolt wrote:
    >
    >> On Fri, 20 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-

    >
    >> Now this is becoming technical, it might be an idea to switch back to
    >> English.

    >
    >It's about time anyway, as we're not smoking out any more "fish".


    It was fun while it lasted :-)

    >>>I had the very first version of PCLOS, derived from mandrake 9.2.

    >>
    >> I'm not sure whether to go "yuck!" or not. As you could probably guess,
    >> I'm not all that keen on Mandrake/Mandriva.

    >
    >Mandrake 6.0 was the first Linux I installed on my machine. Didn't like
    >it, so tried SuSE and stayed with that.


    SuSE 6.1 was the first I tried. I liked it, and so stuck with it ever
    since. I have, on occasion, tried a few others. I tried RH 5.something,
    Debian and a version of Mandrake, although I don't know which one.

    I do know I liked the Mandrake partitioner, but the rest of the
    installation I wasn't keen upon. I disliked the desktop even more. As
    for Debian and RH, I can't recall why I dropped them, but I kept ending
    back with SuSE.

    >Tried Mandrake again when 9.1 came
    >out, and it was much better, so I kept it for comparison purposes. 9.2
    >came out, and there was some discord about TexStar making unofficial
    >packages that Mandrake claimed were bad. As the TexStar packages worked
    >perfectly, and the Mandrake ones were broken, that didn't fly too well.


    That sounds a little like sour grapes.

    >End result was that TexStar stopped making packages for Mandrake, and
    >started PCLinuxOS, which has been referred to as, "Mandriva, done right,"
    >"What Mandriva should have been," and "What Mandriva wishes they were." in
    >various revues.


    I'll have to fire up a couple of VMs and do a comparison. I know that
    Mandriva 2007 wasn't too bad when I tried it, although it "still didn't
    feel quite right." A worse thing, for me at the time, was I didn't like
    the package management. I wanted a quick and easy method of installing
    the development packages so I could build for multiple distros, and it
    didn't seem to be an easy thing with their package management system. I
    suppose I should have stuck with it a little longer and I'd have figured
    it out.


    >> Have you actually done a diff on the two different .config files to see
    >> what the differences are? You might be able to track exactly which
    >> change is causing the lockups.

    >
    >First thing I did. The problem is the pata_ drivers. In
    >particular, the pata_it821x driver. Not only is it bad, but if it is
    >compiled, the process somehow breaks the standard it821x as well.


    Ouch!

    >by
    >eliminating all of the pata_ modules the kernel works.


    And I guess you need the pata_it821x driver. Now, do you really need to
    eliminate every pata_* module, or just some of them?

    >Menuconfig shows these to be listed as either, "Experimental" or "Very
    >Experimental" which, to me, means they do not have any place in a default
    >installation kernel.


    If you look, you'll probably find quite a few other things listed as
    "Experimental" or "Very Experimental" that, despite the labels, are
    actually quite stable.

    >>>The stock SUSE kernels lock on load still, (I just updated again today)
    >>>and I have a bug report that has about 60 entries now, with no good
    >>>results.

    >>
    >> Bug #248860?

    >
    >Yup, that be the one.


    I was going to ask for the bug number, in a "I can't be a***ed to do the
    search" sort of "me, me, me" manner, but decided it'd be quicker if I
    searched the mails from the mailing list instead.

    >> Completely understandable. I wouldn't use a system that kept locking up
    >> (he says while still using Windows :/ ) unless I could actually find the
    >> cause of the lockups.

    >
    >If you notice, on bugzilla, no one wants to admit I'm right. They keep
    >looking for "other explanations".


    Have you tried the vanilla kernel.org sources and used the SUSE .config?

    >They say try this, try that, but nothing
    >makes any difference, other than not compiling the duff modules.


    Oops

    >That
    >gives instant, positive results.



    This certainly points towards something being broken there.


    >> The exact same .config that worked previously? Interesting.

    >
    >My thought, exactly.


    Extract the sources for both versions and do a diff on both of the
    trees. See if you can find any changes to the modules.

    >>>I have to run the older 2.6.18.8-0.3-1-imotgm from the last upgrade and
    >>>recompile, until I figure out what they broke with their fix.


    Forgot to say, diff can be your friend[0].

    >> Good bug-hunting

    >
    >Do I detect a "Glad it's you, and not me," note in that smiley? ;-D


    I did try to hide it but, yes, I certainly am glad it's you and not me.
    :-)


    [0] Well, sometimes it can be. Other times it can be a massive pain when
    there's a lot of differences.

    Regards,
    David Bolt

    --
    Member of Team Acorn checking nodes at 100 Mnodes/s: www.distributed.net
    RISC OS 3.11 | SUSE 10.0 32bit | SUSE 10.1 32bit | openSUSE 10.2 32bit
    RISC OS 3.6 | SUSE 10.0 64bit | SUSE 10.1 64bit | openSUSE 10.2 64bit
    TOS 4.02 | SUSE 9.3 32bit | | openSUSE 10.3a5 32bit

  8. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Sun, 22 Jul 2007 01:22:48 +0100, David Bolt wrote:

    > On Sat, 21 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-
    >
    >>On Sat, 21 Jul 2007 15:42:41 +0100, David Bolt wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Fri, 20 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-

    >>


    > It was fun while it lasted :-)


    I'm sure we'll do it again, sometime. ;-)


    > That sounds a little like sour grapes.


    I thought so. Last thing they (Mandriva) bitched about was how TexStar
    used the Mandriva sources, but didn't give the rebuilt packages back to
    Mandriva.

    WTF? "You build bad packages, why don't you give them back to us?" What's
    wrong with this picture?

    > I'll have to fire up a couple of VMs and do a comparison. I know that
    > Mandriva 2007 wasn't too bad when I tried it, although it "still didn't
    > feel quite right." A worse thing, for me at the time, was I didn't like
    > the package management. I wanted a quick and easy method of installing
    > the development packages so I could build for multiple distros, and it
    > didn't seem to be an easy thing with their package management system. I
    > suppose I should have stuck with it a little longer and I'd have figured
    > it out.


    If you have a partition to spare, I'd suggest a full installation, if
    you're interested in seeing how they set up Beryl. You can just run it
    from the live CD, but I don't think it will work on a VM. Maybe the newest
    VMWare might, as I hear it does 3D now.


    > Ouch!
    >
    >>by
    >>eliminating all of the pata_ modules the kernel works.

    >
    > And I guess you need the pata_it821x driver. Now, do you really need to
    > eliminate every pata_* module, or just some of them?


    No, I need the older it821x, which is what I have. The pata_it821x makes
    the IDE drives appear as SCSI drives, the same as SATA drives, and limits
    the number of partitions to 15. I have some IDE/PATA drives with 18
    partitions, so that's a no go from the start, even if the drivers worked
    properly. With drive size going up constantly, I have a hard time grasping
    why it was OK to allow drives, less than 1GB in size, to be able to have
    63 partitions, but a new 1TB drive should be limited to 15. The logic here
    escapes me. Also hdparm automatically gets broken in the process, and
    sdparm doesn't work right with PATA drives either.

    Because the drives had different physical properties, unix always treated
    IDE, and SCSI, as separate entities. With SATA mostly replacing SCSI
    drives, they were treated by Linux as SCSI, to separate them from PATA, so
    you'd know which was which, even though the are in fact, still IDE drives,
    with a serial interface. Now the kernel boys, claiming the older IDE code
    is getting krufty, decided all drives should be brought under libata, and
    treated as SCSI, so they only have one drive source tree to worry about.
    My take is, that's just lazy. If the code is krufty, fix it, don't break
    the functionality of the drives, for coder convenience. Same goes for USB.
    Windows does not treat USB as SCSI, but as an entity with it's own
    identity. Most of the problems with USB on Linux come from insisting on
    using the SCSI tree to control USB, and trying to work within the confines
    of that format.


    >>Menuconfig shows these to be listed as either, "Experimental" or "Very
    >>Experimental" which, to me, means they do not have any place in a
    >>default installation kernel.

    >
    > If you look, you'll probably find quite a few other things listed as
    > "Experimental" or "Very Experimental" that, despite the labels, are
    > actually quite stable.


    These aren't. I figure, one should be presented with an installation
    kernel that is pretty much plain jane, with solid drivers, for most
    computers, and a choice to have another, experimantal kernel, that has all
    the latest whiz bang stuff for those who can't live with any hardware not
    produced in the last week. I mostly choose my hardware very carefully, so
    I know it's fully supported in Linux. When my two year old, fully
    supported from day one, hardware suddenly becomes unsupported, because
    someone had the bright idea that in order to support the newest, latest
    and greatest, we should break that which has performed flawlessly,
    for years, before the change, I get a bit miffed.

    >
    >>>>The stock SUSE kernels lock on load still, (I just updated again
    >>>>today) and I have a bug report that has about 60 entries now, with no
    >>>>good results.
    >>>
    >>> Bug #248860?

    >>
    >>Yup, that be the one.

    >
    > I was going to ask for the bug number, in a "I can't be a***ed to do the
    > search" sort of "me, me, me" manner, but decided it'd be quicker if I
    > searched the mails from the mailing list instead.


    I meant to include it, and only noticed it's absence after i checked the
    post. Had you not found it, I would have included it in this post. ;-)


    >>> Completely understandable. I wouldn't use a system that kept locking
    >>> up (he says while still using Windows :/ ) unless I could actually
    >>> find the cause of the lockups.

    >>
    >>If you notice, on bugzilla, no one wants to admit I'm right. They keep
    >>looking for "other explanations".

    >
    > Have you tried the vanilla kernel.org sources and used the SUSE .config?


    Not actually, as I'm still trying to work with the bugzilla boys, so want
    as much of the SUSE kernel as possible, patches and fixes included, just
    not the broken parts.

    > This certainly points towards
    > something being broken there.

    >
    >>> The exact same .config that worked previously? Interesting.

    >>
    >>My thought, exactly.

    >
    > Extract the sources for both versions and do a diff on both of the
    > trees. See if you can find any changes to the modules.


    That's the plan, Stan. However, the .configs could be exactly the same,
    while the patch code changes how it compiles, and I don't read code any
    better than I write it.

    >>> Good bug-hunting

    >>
    >>Do I detect a "Glad it's you, and not me," note in that smiley? ;-D

    >
    > I did try to hide it but, yes, I certainly am glad it's you and not me.
    > :-)


    I knew it. That evil glint, in the eye of your smiley, gave it away.

    Naughty, naughty David.

    --
    imotgm
    "Lost? Lost? I've never been lost... Been a tad confused for a
    month or two, but never lost."



  9. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Sat, 21 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-

    >On Sun, 22 Jul 2007 01:22:48 +0100, David Bolt wrote:


    >> It was fun while it lasted :-)

    >
    >I'm sure we'll do it again, sometime. ;-)


    And why not. There's always news fish to catch :-)

    >> That sounds a little like sour grapes.

    >
    >I thought so. Last thing they (Mandriva) bitched about was how TexStar
    >used the Mandriva sources, but didn't give the rebuilt packages back to
    >Mandriva.


    Erm...

    >WTF? "You build bad packages, why don't you give them back to us?" What's
    >wrong with this picture?


    Whoever said it was playing the idiot? And was stopping them from
    building their own packages, using the TexStar source packages as the
    basis?

    >> I'll have to fire up a couple of VMs and do a comparison. I know that
    >> Mandriva 2007 wasn't too bad when I tried it, although it "still didn't
    >> feel quite right." A worse thing, for me at the time, was I didn't like
    >> the package management. I wanted a quick and easy method of installing
    >> the development packages so I could build for multiple distros, and it
    >> didn't seem to be an easy thing with their package management system. I
    >> suppose I should have stuck with it a little longer and I'd have figured
    >> it out.

    >
    >If you have a partition to spare, I'd suggest a full installation,


    It's a VM. It'll have a virtual machine all to itself :-)

    >if
    >you're interested in seeing how they set up Beryl.


    Not particularly. I much prefer a plain(ish) desktop, which is strange
    since I use KDE.

    >You can just run it
    >from the live CD, but I don't think it will work on a VM.


    It should do. Even Toms Root Boot disc works, as does the Live CD for
    knoppix :-)

    >Maybe the newest
    >VMWare might, as I hear it does 3D now.


    I'm running VMware Server 1.0.3 and Parallels and I know Parallels
    doesn't do 3D. I don't think the version of VMware I'm using does
    either.

    >> And I guess you need the pata_it821x driver. Now, do you really need to
    >> eliminate every pata_* module, or just some of them?

    >
    >No, I need the older it821x, which is what I have. The pata_it821x makes
    >the IDE drives appear as SCSI drives, the same as SATA drives, and limits
    >the number of partitions to 15.


    That's an old limit that SCSI had. Moving SATA, and now IDE, under SCSI
    means everything gets that 15 partition limit. LVM is one way round that
    limit.

    >I have some IDE/PATA drives with 18
    >partitions, so that's a no go from the start, even if the drivers worked
    >properly.


    IIRC, there was discussion on the Factory list about this when the swap
    was made, and the suggestion was to make the kernel use the older
    modules. IIRC, there was mention of patching libata[0] so it would
    support more than 15 partitions. I don't recall exactly what the
    conclusion was, or whether there was actually going to be a patch, but
    I'm sure a search of the archive will show it up.

    >With drive size going up constantly, I have a hard time grasping
    >why it was OK to allow drives, less than 1GB in size, to be able to have
    >63 partitions, but a new 1TB drive should be limited to 15.


    I think the idea is that, nowadays, people would be using LVM and
    putting (almost) all the various partitions inside a logical volume.

    >The logic here
    >escapes me. Also hdparm automatically gets broken in the process, and
    >sdparm doesn't work right with PATA drives either.


    You did tell it to use the ATA transport ( -t ATA ) ?

    >Because the drives had different physical properties, unix always treated
    >IDE, and SCSI, as separate entities. With SATA mostly replacing SCSI
    >drives, they were treated by Linux as SCSI, to separate them from PATA, so
    >you'd know which was which, even though the are in fact, still IDE drives,
    >with a serial interface.


    Have you looked at the ATA commands? AFAIK they're almost a subset of
    SCSI.

    >Now the kernel boys, claiming the older IDE code
    >is getting krufty, decided all drives should be brought under libata, and
    >treated as SCSI, so they only have one drive source tree to worry about.


    I can understand that. Less stuff to maintain, and less duplication of
    efforts.

    >My take is, that's just lazy. If the code is krufty, fix it, don't break
    >the functionality of the drives, for coder convenience. Same goes for USB.


    In most common situations it doesn't the functionality. It's only when
    you get someone creating a larger than normal number of partitions that
    there's a problem.

    >Windows does not treat USB as SCSI, but as an entity with it's own
    >identity.


    That's probably because the Windows developers don't like the idea of
    talking to each other and sharing ideas. On top of that, it's all been
    bolted on, with additional bolt-ons with each new release.

    >Most of the problems with USB on Linux come from insisting on
    >using the SCSI tree to control USB, and trying to work within the confines
    >of that format.


    Well, so far, I've not had a problem with USB drives.

    >> If you look, you'll probably find quite a few other things listed as
    >> "Experimental" or "Very Experimental" that, despite the labels, are
    >> actually quite stable.

    >
    >These aren't. I figure, one should be presented with an installation
    >kernel that is pretty much plain jane, with solid drivers, for most
    >computers, and a choice to have another, experimantal kernel, that has all
    >the latest whiz bang stuff for those who can't live with any hardware not
    >produced in the last week.


    Well, I can honestly say I'm not in that group. Almost all my hardware
    is over a year old. The only things that aren't are a single replacement
    NIC, for one that went duff, and a couple of hard drives.

    >I mostly choose my hardware very carefully, so
    >I know it's fully supported in Linux. When my two year old, fully
    >supported from day one, hardware suddenly becomes unsupported, because
    >someone had the bright idea that in order to support the newest, latest
    >and greatest, we should break that which has performed flawlessly,
    >for years, before the change, I get a bit miffed.


    I can understand that.

    >> I was going to ask for the bug number, in a "I can't be a***ed to do the
    >> search" sort of "me, me, me" manner, but decided it'd be quicker if I
    >> searched the mails from the mailing list instead.

    >
    >I meant to include it, and only noticed it's absence after i checked the
    >post. Had you not found it, I would have included it in this post. ;-)


    I'm on the bugzilla mailing list and just did a search for your nick.
    It's not like it's a common nick :-)

    >> Have you tried the vanilla kernel.org sources and used the SUSE .config?

    >
    >Not actually, as I'm still trying to work with the bugzilla boys, so want
    >as much of the SUSE kernel as possible, patches and fixes included, just
    >not the broken parts.


    I'd start with the vanilla kernel and see if that works. If it does,
    it's a SUSE patch that's at fault. If it doesn't, you need to be talking
    to the kernel guys.

    >> Extract the sources for both versions and do a diff on both of the
    >> trees. See if you can find any changes to the modules.

    >
    >That's the plan, Stan. However, the .configs could be exactly the same,
    >while the patch code changes how it compiles, and I don't read code any
    >better than I write it.


    :-)

    >> I did try to hide it but, yes, I certainly am glad it's you and not me.
    >> :-)

    >
    >I knew it. That evil glint, in the eye of your smiley, gave it away.


    I'll wear mirrored glasses next time.

    >Naughty, naughty David.


    You been talking to my wife? She keeps saying that to me as well ;-)


    [0] That speel chucker of mine still wants to change that to labia. I'm
    sure it's trying to shift my train of thought :-)

    Regards,
    David Bolt

    --
    Member of Team Acorn checking nodes at 100 Mnodes/s: www.distributed.net
    RISC OS 3.11 | SUSE 10.0 32bit | SUSE 10.1 32bit | openSUSE 10.2 32bit
    RISC OS 3.6 | SUSE 10.0 64bit | SUSE 10.1 64bit | openSUSE 10.2 64bit
    TOS 4.02 | SUSE 9.3 32bit | | openSUSE 10.3a6 32bit

  10. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 23:21:26 +0100, David Bolt wrote:

    > On Sat, 21 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-
    >
    >>On Sun, 22 Jul 2007 01:22:48 +0100, David Bolt wrote:


    > Whoever said it was playing the idiot? And what was stopping them from
    > building their own packages, using the TexStar source packages as the
    > basis?


    That was TexStar's line. There in the repos, help yourself.

    >>If you have a partition to spare, I'd suggest a full installation,

    >
    > It's a VM. It'll have a virtual machine all to itself :-)


    I run VMWare server also. I was just making the suggestion for checking
    Beryl. I don't use it either. I like having 20 desktops to spread out on.

    >>> And I guess you need the pata_it821x driver. Now, do you really need to
    >>> eliminate every pata_* module, or just some of them?

    >>
    >>No, I need the older it821x, which is what I have. The pata_it821x makes
    >>the IDE drives appear as SCSI drives, the same as SATA drives, and limits
    >>the number of partitions to 15.

    >
    > That's an old limit that SCSI had. Moving SATA, and now IDE, under SCSI
    > means everything gets that 15 partition limit. LVM is one way round that
    > limit.


    Also another layer of complexity, unneeded up until now. What happened to KISS?

    >>I have some IDE/PATA drives with 18
    >>partitions, so that's a no go from the start, even if the drivers worked
    >>properly.

    >
    > IIRC, there was discussion on the Factory list about this when the swap
    > was made, and the suggestion was to make the kernel use the older
    > modules.


    But the process breaks the older modules. I can actually boot the last
    updated default kernel with the included older module but my entire hde
    drive still disappears. It's pretty hard to read or write to a drive that
    the system can't see. My hard drives are all in removable caddies. It
    doesn't matter which of ten drives I attach to hde, they are all invisable
    with the default SUSE 10.2 kernels. All are properly seen by all other
    distros, SUSE up through 10.1, and by my kernels in 10.2

    > IIRC, there was mention of patching libata[0] so it would
    > support more than 15 partitions. I don't recall exactly what the
    > conclusion was, or whether there was actually going to be a patch, but
    > I'm sure a search of the archive will show it up.


    Last I heard was, "If you need more than 15 partitions, use LVM."

    >>With drive size going up constantly, I have a hard time grasping
    >>why it was OK to allow drives, less than 1GB in size, to be able to have
    >>63 partitions, but a new 1TB drive should be limited to 15.

    >
    > I think the idea is that, nowadays, people would be using LVM and
    > putting (almost) all the various partitions inside a logical volume.


    I liken that to the $64.00 answer to a $2.00 question. Offered solution to
    unnecessary problem !=KISS.


    >>The logic here escapes me. Also hdparm automatically gets broken in the
    >>process, and sdparm doesn't work right with PATA drives either.

    >
    > You did tell it to use the ATA transport ( -t ATA ) ?


    No one has mentioned that, when I posed the questions, and posted commands
    given, and error messages received. What I got was, "We're still working
    on that."

    >>Because the drives had different physical properties, unix always
    >>treated IDE, and SCSI, as separate entities. With SATA mostly replacing
    >>SCSI drives, they were treated by Linux as SCSI, to separate them from
    >>PATA, so you'd know which was which, even though the are in fact, still
    >>IDE drives, with a serial interface.

    >
    > Have you looked at the ATA commands? AFAIK they're almost a subset of
    > SCSI.


    Yet how the commands are processed is enough different that they were
    treated as seperate entities, and each works well as long as the
    difference is addressed. If they lumped all drives as simply "hard drives"
    and the new system actually worked, I would have no real objection with
    that, but the system clearly is not working on my hardware, and it is
    common hardware. There is nothing exotic about this hardware, and it has
    worked fine up until this change.

    My total argument is this;

    When a system is composed of two parts and works without problems, through
    the interaction of the two parts, and one of the two parts is changed,
    while the other remains constant, if new problems suddenly arise, the
    cause of the problems surely resides in the part that was changed, not the
    part that remained constant, and those that made the changes need to
    correct that which causes the problems before claiming the system to be
    stable, and usable.

    If I have no viable choice in the matter, as neither of the choices I am
    given actually works, and must therefore abandon my otherwise fully
    functional, two year old hardware, and also abandon the practices and
    procedures that I have developed over years of use, in order to continue
    using this changed software, how is this different from Vista?

    >>Now the kernel boys, claiming the older IDE code is getting krufty,
    >>decided all drives should be brought under libata, and treated as SCSI,
    >>so they only have one drive source tree to worry about.

    >
    > I can understand that. Less stuff to maintain, and less duplication of
    > efforts.
    >
    >>My take is, that's just lazy. If the code is krufty, fix it, don't break
    >>the functionality of the drives, for coder convenience. Same goes for
    >>USB.

    >
    > In most common situations it doesn't the functionality. It's only when
    > you get someone creating a larger than normal number of partitions that
    > there's a problem.


    My present drive hde has only four partitions, and the system can't even
    see it with the current SUSE kernel using libata. It locks while booting
    if it loads pata_it821x. It's blind to hde if it loads it821x. I consider
    that a problem.

    >>Windows does not treat USB as SCSI, but as an entity with it's own
    >>identity.

    >
    > That's probably because the Windows developers don't like the idea of
    > talking to each other and sharing ideas. On top of that, it's all been
    > bolted on, with additional bolt-ons with each new release.


    There's nothing wrong with bolt-ons, when they work. Most of a Linux
    kernel is now a series of bolt on modules. You bolt on the ones that work
    for your hardware, and leave the rest in the toolbox. All of SUSE's USB is
    compiled as bolt-on modules. I don't know of any distro that doesn't
    compile USB as modules.

    >
    >>Most of the problems with USB on Linux come from insisting on
    >>using the SCSI tree to control USB, and trying to work within the confines
    >>of that format.

    >
    > Well, so far, I've not had a problem with USB drives.


    My problems are relatively minor, but they do include drives that suddenly
    disappear, while I'm writing to the drive, then return with a different
    drive designation, and different mount points. This happens to some
    extent with all Linux distros. It does not happen under Win2K, on this
    same machine, using the same drive, and I hate having to say that, because
    I hate running Windows, and have no need to, except to test things like
    this. Win2K is eight years old, but it's USB, and as an aside, also it's
    UDF CD/DVD packet writing ability, through third party apps of the same
    vintage, is more mature, and more stable than in present day Linux. That's
    a long time to play catch up, and not yet arrive. I've never run XP, never
    even seen it run, until a couple months ago. Whether there are any
    improvements in these two items with XP, I have no way of knowing, but I
    suspect there are.

    I discount games in any Windows vs Linux, argument, because it's a
    straw man. I dislike, intensely, having to admit that any basic process of
    the OS is handled better on, any version of, Windows than Linux, in any
    give contemporary time frame. I really hate it when an eight year old
    Windows appears superior, on even trivial matters, than a current Linux.

    > I'm on the bugzilla mailing list and just did a search for your nick.
    > It's not like it's a common nick :-)


    I must admit that I'm pretty easy to find on google group searches too. I
    could have filed the bug reports under my real name. ;-)

    I've got to be the only person out here that could use his real name, to
    hide his real identity. My own mother has never called me by, or ever
    referred to me by my given name. None of my friends do, nor either of my
    wives. or any of my children, or grand children. I've had both personal
    and business checking accounts that would not cash any checks that had a
    signature that was any form of my real name, because that was a sure sign
    that it was a forgery.

    On that note, I once knew a woman, (still do, for that matter) whom I
    visited in the hospital, on the occasion of her first son's birth. I asked
    her what she named her son, and she said, "Mathursalees". This being
    somewhat unusual, the obvious question to me was, "Why?" but her answer,
    "So we can call him Jessie," left me almost speechless. (Imagine that)
    After a moment's stunned silence, and seeking the logic that would make
    sense of this, I asked, "If you want to call your son Jessie, why not name
    him Jessie? Where does Mathursalees fit into this picture?" She looked at
    me like I was the dumbest form of stupid on the planet, and answered, with
    a quite superior tone, "My grandfather's name was Mathursalees, and
    everyone always called HIM Jessie." Now, there must truly be some logic to
    that, indeed, because Mathursalees is in his mid thirties now, and I have
    never heard him called anything, but Jessie.

    >
    >>> Have you tried the vanilla kernel.org sources and used the SUSE .config?

    >>
    >>Not actually, as I'm still trying to work with the bugzilla boys, so want
    >>as much of the SUSE kernel as possible, patches and fixes included, just
    >>not the broken parts.

    >
    > I'd start with the vanilla kernel and see if that works. If it does,
    > it's a SUSE patch that's at fault. If it doesn't, you need to be talking
    > to the kernel guys.


    Good point. I hadn't thought of that aspect. I have some irons in the
    fire, at the moment, but I'll try that as soon as time allows.

    > I'll wear mirrored glasses next time.
    >
    >>Naughty, naughty David.

    >
    > You been talking to my wife? She keeps saying that to me as well ;-)


    Damn, now we're going to have to stop meeting like that. The old man is
    getting suspicious.

    >
    > [0] That speel chucker of mine still wants to change that to labia. I'm
    > sure it's trying to shift my train of thought :-)


    My train was derailed a few minutes ago. I just got an e-mail from my
    sister telling me her husband died last night. No details beyond he was in
    hospital, about to be released, and died while dressing, to leave. Cause
    of death, uncertain at the moment. I may be gone for a bit.

    --
    imotgm
    "Lost? Lost? I've never been lost... Been a tad confused for a
    month or two, but never lost."



  11. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Tue, 24 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-



    >My train was derailed a few minutes ago. I just got an e-mail from my
    >sister telling me her husband died last night. No details beyond he was in
    >hospital, about to be released, and died while dressing, to leave. Cause
    >of death, uncertain at the moment. I may be gone for a bit.


    I'm not surprised it was derailed. You have my condolences.


    Regards,
    David Bolt

    --
    Member of Team Acorn checking nodes at 100 Mnodes/s: www.distributed.net
    RISC OS 3.11 | SUSE 10.0 32bit | SUSE 10.1 32bit | openSUSE 10.2 32bit
    RISC OS 3.6 | SUSE 10.0 64bit | SUSE 10.1 64bit | openSUSE 10.2 64bit
    TOS 4.02 | SUSE 9.3 32bit | | openSUSE 10.3a6 32bit

  12. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 13:32:19 +0100, David Bolt wrote:

    > On Tue, 24 Jul 2007, imotgm wrote:-
    >
    >
    >
    >>My train was derailed a few minutes ago. I just got an e-mail from my
    >>sister telling me her husband died last night. No details beyond he was
    >>in hospital, about to be released, and died while dressing, to leave.
    >>Cause of death, uncertain at the moment. I may be gone for a bit.

    >
    > I'm not surprised it was derailed. You have my condolences.
    >
    >
    > Regards,
    > David Bolt


    Thank you, for your thoughts.

    David was a real good man. My sister had been previously married to a guy
    who went a bit bonkers, and treated her badly. David came along when she
    was a freshly divorced basket case, and treated her like she was God's
    special gift to him. They had 23 years together, and I never heard a
    bitter word pass between them, even in jest. I don't believe she would
    mind my sharing this, which was the original message I received, before
    the follow up with the sketchy details above.


    "Well, my beloved, sweet, wonderful husband lost his battle today, I am
    sorry to have to report. It was totally unexpected. I am beyond grief
    stricken. He was a warm, gentle, kind, kind man who was totally honorable
    and especially respectful toward me. It was my privilege to be his
    beloved for so many years of my life, and have really no more to say at
    this time..."

    --
    imotgm
    "Lost? Lost? I've never been lost... Been a tad confused for a
    month or two, but never lost."



  13. Re: chk drive for errors?

    On Wed, 25 Jul 2007 07:43:27 +0200, houghi wrote:

    > imotgm wrote:
    >> My train was derailed a few minutes ago. I just got an e-mail from my
    >> sister telling me her husband died last night. No details beyond he was
    >> in hospital, about to be released, and died while dressing, to leave.
    >> Cause of death, uncertain at the moment. I may be gone for a bit.

    >
    > Condolences.
    >
    > houghi


    Thank you, my friend. I don't have much time, but do read the message I
    posted to Dave a moment ago.

    Later

    --
    imotgm
    "Lost? Lost? I've never been lost... Been a tad confused for a
    month or two, but never lost."



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