Best way to image active system partitions - Storage

This is a discussion on Best way to image active system partitions - Storage ; To my knowldege, there are still 3 major players in drive imaging: Drive Image, Ghost and Acronis. Since the first two seem to be in a state of flux, I thought Acronis would be the best bet. Their simple, directl ...

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Thread: Best way to image active system partitions

  1. Best way to image active system partitions

    To my knowldege, there are still 3 major players in drive imaging:
    Drive Image, Ghost and Acronis. Since the first two seem to be
    in a state of flux, I thought Acronis would be the best bet.
    Their simple, directl layouts general present things in a
    way that can be understood in the context of the operation.

    As a software engineer, you'd think I'd be able to understand
    the logic and choices in all three of the programs but that is
    not correct.

    Sometimes confusion arises in clonig a smaller partition to a larger
    one. (Decisions: Fill out the partitiion w 0's? Shorten the
    partititon?).

    My problem is the often the less practical path is taken, probably
    by one of the engineers who knows his own program to well.

    What's the general difference between Acronis' Imager,
    Drive Image, and Ghost these days?

    -------

    I'm particularly interested in how you clone the C drive to
    another drive letter (calll it J). Then remove the C drive
    make J the new C so it can be booted. This sounds
    easy but it's not.


  2. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    _R wrote:

    ....

    > I'm particularly interested in how you clone the C drive to
    > another drive letter (calll it J). Then remove the C drive
    > make J the new C so it can be booted. This sounds
    > easy but it's not.


    While I can't answer the questions that you asked, I'll observe that
    everything you described is a snap if you use, say, Partition Magic.

    - bill

  3. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    In article <5ZSdnYKtYqaZ-PvfRVn-iA@metrocastcablevision.com>,
    Bill Todd wrote:
    >_R wrote:
    >
    >...
    >
    >> I'm particularly interested in how you clone the C drive to
    >> another drive letter (calll it J). Then remove the C drive
    >> make J the new C so it can be booted. This sounds
    >> easy but it's not.

    >
    >While I can't answer the questions that you asked, I'll observe that
    >everything you described is a snap if you use, say, Partition Magic.
    >
    >- bill



    Many tools can make an image of your running system. I use Acronis
    TrueImage.

    ntbackup.exe (which is part of XP) can do a complete valid backup but
    it's not an image and is a bit of a PITA if you need to do a full
    system recovery.

    If you are running an application that's updating files while you are
    backup up you have a problem. Outlook/OE is a common example. You
    should exit your mail application during th ebackup.


    --
    a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

    Don't blame me. I voted for Gore.

  4. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    > To my knowldege, there are still 3 major players in drive imaging:
    > Drive Image, Ghost and Acronis. Since the first two seem to be
    > in a state of flux, I thought Acronis would be the best bet.


    No more PowerQuest. PowerQuest was acquired by Symantec, and now PQ's v2i
    Protector is rebranded as Norton Ghost 9.

    Look at their driver filenames and version info stamps on them.

    --
    Maxim Shatskih, Windows DDK MVP
    StorageCraft Corporation
    maxim@storagecraft.com
    http://www.storagecraft.com



  5. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    In article ,
    Maxim S. Shatskih wrote:
    >> To my knowldege, there are still 3 major players in drive imaging:
    >> Drive Image, Ghost and Acronis. Since the first two seem to be
    >> in a state of flux, I thought Acronis would be the best bet.

    >
    >No more PowerQuest. PowerQuest was acquired by Symantec, and now PQ's v2i
    >Protector is rebranded as Norton Ghost 9.
    >
    >Look at their driver filenames and version info stamps on them.
    >
    >--
    >Maxim Shatskih, Windows DDK MVP
    >StorageCraft Corporation
    >maxim@storagecraft.com
    >http://www.storagecraft.com
    >
    >



    BootitNG (http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/) is well reguarded.

    --
    a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

    Don't blame me. I voted for Gore.

  6. Re: Best way to image active system partitions


    _R <_R@nomail.org> wrote in message
    news:guvb61pso236qf64jasb4shc567vqqb0ur@4ax.com...

    > To my knowldege, there are still 3 major players
    > in drive imaging: Drive Image, Ghost and Acronis.


    Nope, DI has been renamed as the latest Ghost 9.

    > Since the first two seem to be in a state of
    > flux, I thought Acronis would be the best bet.


    They do have some advantages, but they arent perfect,
    largely because its a linux based system for the rescue CD
    and that has some real downsides with bleeding edge hardware.

    > Their simple, directl layouts general present things in a
    > way that can be understood in the context of the operation.


    Yeah, tho like with lots of things, they still have some way to go.

    One example with TI 8 is the 2 choices you get with a new hard drive
    being added to an existing system. The difference between adding
    a new hard drive and cloning a hard drive is obvious once you know
    what they mean, but the text isnt good enough if you dont IMO.

    And it doesnt make it clear enough that its not desirable
    to clone the system drive at the XP level and that that
    should be done from the booted CD either.

    > As a software engineer, you'd think I'd be able to understand the
    > logic and choices in all three of the programs but that is not correct.


    True. Still got some way to go even with TI which
    in my opinion is currently the best in that regard.

    > Sometimes confusion arises in clonig a smaller partition to a larger
    > one. (Decisions: Fill out the partitiion w 0's? Shorten the partititon?).


    That is reasonably well covered in the
    manual, and not too bad on the screen either.

    > My problem is the often the less practical path is taken, probably
    > by one of the engineers who knows his own program to well.


    Yeah, not enough effort put into watching users use the software
    and see what causes confusion for them in my opinion.

    > What's the general difference between Acronis'
    > Imager, Drive Image, and Ghost these days?


    DI is gone now except that its still buyable.

    Ghost 9 has some real problems, particularly for cloning system
    drives. You cant do that from the booted CD and thats the only
    really viable way to do that particular task. You cant even image
    a system from the booted CD, you have to install Ghost before
    you can image anything. That stinks if you want to make a
    safety image of a system before doing any work on it.

    TI isnt perfect, Acronis has a hell of a capacity for fixing
    a problem that a user reports and then breaking that again
    in the next release. Thats evidence that they havent got their
    act into gear on the software side with that sort of thing.

    And there is a worrying level of flakeyness with TI too.

    Not that Ghost is much better there, it failed to
    clone my system drive properly and TI did that fine.




  7. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    > > To my knowldege, there are still 3 major players
    > > in drive imaging: Drive Image, Ghost and Acronis.

    >
    > Nope, DI has been renamed as the latest Ghost 9.


    But currently there is also Ghost 8.2.

    >
    > > Since the first two seem to be in a state of
    > > flux, I thought Acronis would be the best bet.

    >
    > They do have some advantages, but they arent perfect,
    > largely because its a linux based system for the rescue CD
    > and that has some real downsides with bleeding edge hardware.
    >
    > > Their simple, directl layouts general present things in a
    > > way that can be understood in the context of the operation.

    >
    > Yeah, tho like with lots of things, they still have some way to go.
    >
    > One example with TI 8 is the 2 choices you get with a new hard drive
    > being added to an existing system. The difference between adding
    > a new hard drive and cloning a hard drive is obvious once you know
    > what they mean, but the text isnt good enough if you dont IMO.
    >
    > And it doesnt make it clear enough that its not desirable
    > to clone the system drive at the XP level and that that
    > should be done from the booted CD either.
    >
    > > As a software engineer, you'd think I'd be able to understand the
    > > logic and choices in all three of the programs but that is not correct.

    >
    > True. Still got some way to go even with TI which
    > in my opinion is currently the best in that regard.
    >
    > > Sometimes confusion arises in clonig a smaller partition to a larger
    > > one. (Decisions: Fill out the partitiion w 0's? Shorten the

    partititon?).
    >
    > That is reasonably well covered in the
    > manual, and not too bad on the screen either.
    >
    > > My problem is the often the less practical path is taken, probably
    > > by one of the engineers who knows his own program to well.

    >
    > Yeah, not enough effort put into watching users use the software
    > and see what causes confusion for them in my opinion.
    >
    > > What's the general difference between Acronis'
    > > Imager, Drive Image, and Ghost these days?

    >
    > DI is gone now except that its still buyable.
    >
    > Ghost 9 has some real problems, particularly for cloning system
    > drives. You cant do that from the booted CD and thats the only
    > really viable way to do that particular task. You cant even image
    > a system from the booted CD, you have to install Ghost before
    > you can image anything. That stinks if you want to make a
    > safety image of a system before doing any work on it.


    It works fine with Ghost 8.2.

    >
    > TI isnt perfect, Acronis has a hell of a capacity for fixing
    > a problem that a user reports and then breaking that again
    > in the next release. Thats evidence that they havent got their
    > act into gear on the software side with that sort of thing.
    >
    > And there is a worrying level of flakeyness with TI too.
    >
    > Not that Ghost is much better there, it failed to
    > clone my system drive properly and TI did that fine.




  8. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 03:19:37 -0400, _R <_R@nomail.org> wrote:

    >What's the general difference between Acronis' Imager,
    >Drive Image, and Ghost these days?
    >
    >I'm particularly interested in how you clone the C drive to
    >another drive letter (calll it J). Then remove the C drive
    >make J the new C so it can be booted. This sounds
    >easy but it's not.


    I have tried all of them and I tried Acronis last. Of all three of them Ghost
    was the most convoluted to install and to configure. I am sure there are a lot
    of people who love Ghost but as I was doing my research, I liked it the least.
    What really turned me off where the confusing options for creating a boot cd. I
    still scratch my head as I think of it.

    Vi Protector and Acronis were about the same in my humble opinion as far
    functionality and ease of use. One negative I found between the two which
    caused me to pick Acronis was that Vi Protector needed .NET installed on my
    server or it wouldn't install. That really torked me plus the security guys
    were asking me.......... "What!!.. you wanna install .NET on all our 500
    production servers!!" As you can imagine, that went over like a lead balloon.

    I love Acronis. I have recovered multiple servers and laptops. One particular
    thing to note is that our note book HDs at work are encrypted with PointSec.
    One of the guys laptop HDs was going bad and I was able to do an image of it
    before we replaced the drive. When I did the image, I used the bit-by-bit image
    of the HD due to the encryption. We were very surprise that the image restore
    worked prefectly. I mean everything. All the word docs, registery settings,
    the works, even the screen saver!

    Anyway, that's my story and experience and I'm stickin to it!!

  9. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    Maxim S. Shatskih wrote:

    >> To my knowldege, there are still 3 major players in drive imaging:
    >> Drive Image, Ghost and Acronis. Since the first two seem to be
    >> in a state of flux, I thought Acronis would be the best bet.

    >
    > No more PowerQuest. PowerQuest was acquired by Symantec, and now PQ's v2i
    > Protector is rebranded as Norton Ghost 9.


    Actually, that's Drive Image 7. v2i Protector is now "Livestate Recovery.

    > Look at their driver filenames and version info stamps on them.


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

  10. Re: Best way to image active system partitions


    Peter wrote in message
    news:CXx9e.5043$9G.459176@news20.bellglobal.com...

    >>> To my knowldege, there are still 3 major players
    >>> in drive imaging: Drive Image, Ghost and Acronis.


    >> Nope, DI has been renamed as the latest Ghost 9.


    > But currently there is also Ghost 8.2.


    Yeah, but it isnt the home user app and has a price to match.

    >>> Since the first two seem to be in a state of
    >>> flux, I thought Acronis would be the best bet.


    >> They do have some advantages, but they arent perfect,
    >> largely because its a linux based system for the rescue CD
    >> and that has some real downsides with bleeding edge hardware.


    >>> Their simple, directl layouts general present things in a
    >>> way that can be understood in the context of the operation.


    >> Yeah, tho like with lots of things, they still have some way to go.


    >> One example with TI 8 is the 2 choices you get with a new hard drive
    >> being added to an existing system. The difference between adding
    >> a new hard drive and cloning a hard drive is obvious once you know
    >> what they mean, but the text isnt good enough if you dont IMO.


    >> And it doesnt make it clear enough that its not desirable
    >> to clone the system drive at the XP level and that that
    >> should be done from the booted CD either.


    >>> As a software engineer, you'd think I'd be able to understand the
    >>> logic and choices in all three of the programs but that is not correct.


    >> True. Still got some way to go even with TI which
    >> in my opinion is currently the best in that regard.


    >>> Sometimes confusion arises in clonig a smaller partition to a larger
    >>> one. (Decisions: Fill out the partitiion w 0's? Shorten the partititon?).


    >> That is reasonably well covered in the
    >> manual, and not too bad on the screen either.


    >>> My problem is the often the less practical path is taken, probably
    >>> by one of the engineers who knows his own program to well.


    >> Yeah, not enough effort put into watching users use the software
    >> and see what causes confusion for them in my opinion.


    >>> What's the general difference between Acronis'
    >>> Imager, Drive Image, and Ghost these days?


    >> DI is gone now except that its still buyable.


    >> Ghost 9 has some real problems, particularly for cloning system
    >> drives. You cant do that from the booted CD and thats the only
    >> really viable way to do that particular task. You cant even image
    >> a system from the booted CD, you have to install Ghost before
    >> you can image anything. That stinks if you want to make a
    >> safety image of a system before doing any work on it.


    > It works fine with Ghost 8.2.


    Yeah, but see above on price. And symantec has
    a mindless ripoff on the use on multiple systems too.

    >> TI isnt perfect, Acronis has a hell of a capacity for fixing
    >> a problem that a user reports and then breaking that again
    >> in the next release. Thats evidence that they havent got their
    >> act into gear on the software side with that sort of thing.


    >> And there is a worrying level of flakeyness with TI too.


    >> Not that Ghost is much better there, it failed to
    >> clone my system drive properly and TI did that fine.





  11. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    adykes@panix.com (Al Dykes) wrote:

    >In article <5ZSdnYKtYqaZ-PvfRVn-iA@metrocastcablevision.com>,
    >Bill Todd wrote:
    >>_R wrote:
    >>
    >>...
    >>
    >>> I'm particularly interested in how you clone the C drive to
    >>> another drive letter (calll it J). Then remove the C drive
    >>> make J the new C so it can be booted. This sounds
    >>> easy but it's not.

    >>
    >>While I can't answer the questions that you asked, I'll observe that
    >>everything you described is a snap if you use, say, Partition Magic.
    >>
    >>- bill

    >
    >
    >Many tools can make an image of your running system. I use Acronis
    >TrueImage.


    hi al
    are u acronis literate? cause i sure need help. see my post above
    pleading for help so that i can patch an acronis burp. and now it
    can't even see the drive !!!
    no - not the dreaded "start from scratch" when i was trying to prevent
    an outage!
    as the poster says - not easy
    >
    >ntbackup.exe (which is part of XP) can do a complete valid backup but
    >it's not an image and is a bit of a PITA if you need to do a full
    >system recovery.
    >
    >If you are running an application that's updating files while you are
    >backup up you have a problem. Outlook/OE is a common example. You
    >should exit your mail application during th ebackup.



  12. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    In article ,
    neon <**navajo@neonfeather.com**> wrote:
    >adykes@panix.com (Al Dykes) wrote:
    >
    >>In article <5ZSdnYKtYqaZ-PvfRVn-iA@metrocastcablevision.com>,
    >>Bill Todd wrote:
    >>>_R wrote:
    >>>
    >>>...
    >>>
    >>>> I'm particularly interested in how you clone the C drive to
    >>>> another drive letter (calll it J). Then remove the C drive
    >>>> make J the new C so it can be booted. This sounds
    >>>> easy but it's not.
    >>>
    >>>While I can't answer the questions that you asked, I'll observe that
    >>>everything you described is a snap if you use, say, Partition Magic.
    >>>
    >>>- bill

    >>
    >>
    >>Many tools can make an image of your running system. I use Acronis
    >>TrueImage.

    >
    >hi al
    >are u acronis literate? cause i sure need help. see my post above
    >pleading for help so that i can patch an acronis burp. and now it
    >can't even see the drive !!!
    >no - not the dreaded "start from scratch" when i was trying to prevent
    >an outage!
    >as the poster says - not easy



    I don't do cloning.

    I've never done what you are trying.

    If you've got the use of a PC with lots of disk space and an ethernet
    connection running windows and NTFS file system you can use it
    as backup device with TI.

    You need to get your machine and the backup machine working on you LAN.

    Then boot the TI CD, image the C drive to the server, swap
    disks and image back. That's how I'd do it.

    You need to describe your hookup. Are you cloning
    disks on IDE channels in the box?


    --
    a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

    Don't blame me. I voted for Gore.

  13. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    Al Dykes wrote:

    > In article <5ZSdnYKtYqaZ-PvfRVn-iA@metrocastcablevision.com>,
    > Bill Todd wrote:
    >>_R wrote:
    >>
    >>...
    >>
    >>> I'm particularly interested in how you clone the C drive to
    >>> another drive letter (calll it J). Then remove the C drive
    >>> make J the new C so it can be booted. This sounds
    >>> easy but it's not.

    >>
    >>While I can't answer the questions that you asked, I'll observe that
    >>everything you described is a snap if you use, say, Partition Magic.
    >>
    >>- bill

    >
    >
    > Many tools can make an image of your running system. I use Acronis
    > TrueImage.
    >
    > ntbackup.exe (which is part of XP) can do a complete valid backup but
    > it's not an image and is a bit of a PITA if you need to do a full
    > system recovery.


    BartPE is a big help here. Boot up the CD, start Windows backup

    > If you are running an application that's updating files while you are
    > backup up you have a problem. Outlook/OE is a common example. You
    > should exit your mail application during th ebackup.


    While I agree that it's a good idea to close applications that keep files
    open, with 2K3 and I believe XP as well Microsoft has recognized this and
    included a shadow-copy feature in the OS which with a backup application
    that supports the capability allows even open files to be backed
    up--Windows backup supports this, so do DriveImage 7, Ghost 9, v2i, and
    LiveState Recovery. Acronis does _not_ seem to support it--the feature in
    Windows is called "Shadow copy" and a search of the Acronis site on keyword
    "shadow" does not get any hits--if they supported this capability I would
    expect them to at least mention it.
    >
    >


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

  14. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    Using older Outlook 2K. This has an update for autosaving the pst to your
    location choice upon exiting from Outlook. Imagine the new versions do
    also.
    "Al Dykes" wrote in message
    news:d45r37$r3i$1@panix5.panix.com...
    > In article <5ZSdnYKtYqaZ-PvfRVn-iA@metrocastcablevision.com>,
    > Bill Todd wrote:
    > >_R wrote:
    > >
    > >...
    > >
    > >> I'm particularly interested in how you clone the C drive to
    > >> another drive letter (calll it J). Then remove the C drive
    > >> make J the new C so it can be booted. This sounds
    > >> easy but it's not.

    > >
    > >While I can't answer the questions that you asked, I'll observe that
    > >everything you described is a snap if you use, say, Partition Magic.
    > >
    > >- bill

    >
    >
    > Many tools can make an image of your running system. I use Acronis
    > TrueImage.
    >
    > ntbackup.exe (which is part of XP) can do a complete valid backup but
    > it's not an image and is a bit of a PITA if you need to do a full
    > system recovery.
    >
    > If you are running an application that's updating files while you are
    > backup up you have a problem. Outlook/OE is a common example. You
    > should exit your mail application during th ebackup.
    >
    >
    > --
    > a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m
    >
    > Don't blame me. I voted for Gore.




  15. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    Are you referring to a "Personal Folder Backup"?
    Not a reliable product.

    "Lil' Dave" wrote in message
    news:hp6ae.11330$go4.280@newsread2.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
    > Using older Outlook 2K. This has an update for autosaving the pst to your
    > location choice upon exiting from Outlook. Imagine the new versions do
    > also.
    > "Al Dykes" wrote in message
    > news:d45r37$r3i$1@panix5.panix.com...
    > > In article <5ZSdnYKtYqaZ-PvfRVn-iA@metrocastcablevision.com>,
    > > Bill Todd wrote:
    > > >_R wrote:
    > > >
    > > >...
    > > >
    > > >> I'm particularly interested in how you clone the C drive to
    > > >> another drive letter (calll it J). Then remove the C drive
    > > >> make J the new C so it can be booted. This sounds
    > > >> easy but it's not.
    > > >
    > > >While I can't answer the questions that you asked, I'll observe that
    > > >everything you described is a snap if you use, say, Partition Magic.
    > > >
    > > >- bill

    > >
    > >
    > > Many tools can make an image of your running system. I use Acronis
    > > TrueImage.
    > >
    > > ntbackup.exe (which is part of XP) can do a complete valid backup but
    > > it's not an image and is a bit of a PITA if you need to do a full
    > > system recovery.
    > >
    > > If you are running an application that's updating files while you are
    > > backup up you have a problem. Outlook/OE is a common example. You
    > > should exit your mail application during th ebackup.
    > >
    > >
    > > --
    > > a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m
    > >
    > > Don't blame me. I voted for Gore.

    >
    >




  16. Re: Best way to image active system partitions

    Lo m8,
    See now one seems to have helped u yet .
    Not sure that i can , but , try this.
    Get a copy of laplink 3. If u cant email me and ill send u a copy.
    Its an old dos version . And to do wat u want t do its the only way.
    You then have to start ur comp in Dos. WITHOUT WINDOWS RUNNING.
    Then usin ll3 tag all files on system drive and copy all onto ur
    other.E,J, watever.
    I cant promise it will work If ur runnin XP as iv not tried it YET.
    Wish u luck.
    Rgrds Steve ( turk2045 )

    savers200@hotmail.co.uk


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