At least one survey Slack scores well - Slackware

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  1. At least one survey Slack scores well


  2. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Sun, 25 May 2008, No_One wrote:

    >
    > http://bentham.k2.t.u-tokyo.ac.jp/media/linux-srom.html


    Performs the best on this server poll http://polls.ausics.net/v7.php
    (thats been up for over 12 months now I think...) interesting that even
    suse is way ahead of RH...

    But Slack lacks in desktop poll http://polls.ausics.net/v1.php
    Just about every person I've spoken to says they wont use it there because
    gnome is not included, and its "too much messing around" to put gnome on
    it or use an unknown third party repo and install some customised gnome,
    especially when they get it in the install CD/DVD's in fu#kdora and
    Ubuntu and so on.

    Plenty of people simply hate KDE, and I confess I'm one of em.


    --
    Cheers
    Res

    I read usenet and lists in pine. But m$ outlook, thunderbird and gmail
    often use html span/whatever for quotes, makes it hard to tell who said
    what, so I dont try. If I ignore you, thats why! Use a compliant mailer.

  3. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Mon, 26 May 2008 08:44:52 +1000, Res wrote:

    > But Slack lacks in desktop poll http://polls.ausics.net/v1.php
    > Just about every person I've spoken to says they wont use it there because
    > gnome is not included, and its "too much messing around" to put gnome on
    > it or use an unknown third party repo and install some customised gnome,
    > especially when they get it in the install CD/DVD's in fu#kdora and
    > Ubuntu and so on.
    >
    > Plenty of people simply hate KDE, and I confess I'm one of em.


    Me too. When Slack dropped Gnome, I used the various third party Gnomes
    for a while, and then switched to XFCE. Haven't looked back since.


    --
    "Ubuntu" -- an African word, meaning "Slackware is too hard for me".
    Now filtering out all posts originating from Google Groups.
    The Usenet Improvement Project: http://improve-usenet.org


  4. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    Dan C wrote:
    >
    > Me too. When Slack dropped Gnome, I used the various third party Gnomes
    > for a while, and then switched to XFCE. Haven't looked back since.


    Still using Blackbox after all these years - change is bad....

    - Kurt

  5. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On 2008-05-25, Dan C wrote:
    > On Mon, 26 May 2008 08:44:52 +1000, Res wrote:
    >
    >> But Slack lacks in desktop poll http://polls.ausics.net/v1.php
    >> Just about every person I've spoken to says they wont use it there because
    >> gnome is not included, and its "too much messing around" to put gnome on
    >> it or use an unknown third party repo and install some customised gnome,
    >> especially when they get it in the install CD/DVD's in fu#kdora and
    >> Ubuntu and so on.
    >>
    >> Plenty of people simply hate KDE, and I confess I'm one of em.

    >
    > Me too. When Slack dropped Gnome, I used the various third party Gnomes
    > for a while, and then switched to XFCE. Haven't looked back since.


    On the bright side, no one will ever confuse your desktop with a concrete
    lawn ornament.

    ken

  6. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On 2008-05-25, Res wrote:


    >
    > But Slack lacks in desktop poll http://polls.ausics.net/v1.php
    > Just about every person I've spoken to says they wont use it there because
    > gnome is not included, and its "too much messing around" to put gnome on
    > it or use an unknown third party repo and install some customised gnome,
    > especially when they get it in the install CD/DVD's in fu#kdora and
    > Ubuntu and so on.


    I would have thought SUSE would have a better showing in the desktop field

    >
    > Plenty of people simply hate KDE, and I confess I'm one of em.
    >
    >


    Never liked it myself, when I have to use a GUI I use fluxbox, simple,
    uncomplicated and easy to manage.

    ken

  7. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Sun, 25 May 2008 23:33:48 -0500, No_One wrote:

    > On the bright side, no one will ever confuse your desktop with a
    > concrete lawn ornament.




  8. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Mon, 26 May 2008 08:44:52 +1000, Res wrote:

    > But Slack lacks in desktop poll http://polls.ausics.net/v1.php Just
    > about every person I've spoken to says they wont use it there because
    > gnome is not included, and its "too much messing around" to put gnome on
    > it or use an unknown third party repo and install some customised gnome,
    > especially when they get it in the install CD/DVD's in fu#kdora and
    > Ubuntu and so on.
    >
    > Plenty of people simply hate KDE, and I confess I'm one of em.


    This is like saying that you have to paint your walls salmon pink because
    you hate cerise.

    There are loads of choices. Loads.

  9. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Mon, 26 May 2008, Mark Madsen wrote:

    >
    > On Mon, 26 May 2008 08:44:52 +1000, Res wrote:
    >
    >> But Slack lacks in desktop poll http://polls.ausics.net/v1.php Just
    >> about every person I've spoken to says they wont use it there because
    >> gnome is not included, and its "too much messing around" to put gnome on
    >> it or use an unknown third party repo and install some customised gnome,
    >> especially when they get it in the install CD/DVD's in fu#kdora and
    >> Ubuntu and so on.
    >>
    >> Plenty of people simply hate KDE, and I confess I'm one of em.

    >
    > This is like saying that you have to paint your walls salmon pink because
    > you hate cerise.
    >
    > There are loads of choices. Loads.


    That there is, and we stay with what we like, we dont stop liking it
    (Gnome) just because Pat doesn't like it and deciodes to not include it
    in Slack, for some of us we go to the trouble to install gnome, some dont
    want that hassle and go with another distro that has that they want
    built in.



    --
    Cheers
    Res

    I read usenet and lists in pine. But m$ outlook, thunderbird and gmail
    often use html span/whatever for quotes, makes it hard to tell who said
    what, so I dont try. If I ignore you, thats why! Use a compliant mailer.

  10. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Sun, 25 May 2008, No_One wrote:

    > I would have thought SUSE would have a better showing in the desktop field


    *shrug* used SuSE once, a few years ago, its just another rpm based
    system, nothing special about it, and RH seem to have that type of market
    share in their hands... rpm is ok, but its bloated.


    --
    Cheers
    Res

    I read usenet and lists in pine. But m$ outlook, thunderbird and gmail
    often use html span/whatever for quotes, makes it hard to tell who said
    what, so I dont try. If I ignore you, thats why! Use a compliant mailer.

  11. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    Res wrote:
    >
    > *shrug* used SuSE once, a few years ago, its just another rpm based


    Hmm, didn't remeber it using rpms - but what I do remember were all the
    config files that said "DO NOT EDIT" - you were supposed to use their
    little config tool for everything. My SuSE experiment didn't last very
    long....

    - Kurt

  12. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Mon, 26 May 2008 16:21:25 +1000, Res wrote:

    > On Mon, 26 May 2008, Mark Madsen wrote:
    >
    >> On Mon, 26 May 2008 08:44:52 +1000, Res wrote:
    >>
    >>> But Slack lacks in desktop poll http://polls.ausics.net/v1.php Just
    >>> about every person I've spoken to says they wont use it there because
    >>> gnome is not included, and its "too much messing around" to put gnome
    >>> on it or use an unknown third party repo and install some customised
    >>> gnome, especially when they get it in the install CD/DVD's in fu#kdora
    >>> and Ubuntu and so on.
    >>>
    >>> Plenty of people simply hate KDE, and I confess I'm one of em.

    >>
    >> This is like saying that you have to paint your walls salmon pink
    >> because you hate cerise.
    >>
    >> There are loads of choices. Loads.

    >
    > That there is, and we stay with what we like, we dont stop liking it
    > (Gnome) just because Pat doesn't like it and deciodes to not include it
    > in Slack, for some of us we go to the trouble to install gnome, some
    > dont want that hassle and go with another distro that has that they want
    > built in.


    There is a huge logical gap between "I use Gnome because I like it better
    than anything else" and "I use Gnome because I hate KDE" is all.

    Personally, I never met a desktop or window manager I couldn't like,
    although I've also never met one that didn't annoy me from time to
    time....

  13. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well




    Res said...

    >(Gnome) just because Pat doesn't like it and deciodes to not include it
    >in Slack,


    He didn't "just decide to not include it" there were sound
    reasons to do so

    From the Mar 26 2005 Slackware Current ChangeLog:


    New Entry: gnome/*: Removed from -current, and turned over to community support and
    New Entry: distribution. I'm not going to rehash all the reasons behind this, but it's
    New Entry: been under consideration for more than four years. There are already good
    New Entry: projects in place to provide Slackware GNOME for those who want it, and
    New Entry: these are more complete than what Slackware has shipped in the past. So, if
    New Entry: you're looking for GNOME for Slackware -current, I would recommend looking at
    New Entry: these two projects for well-built packages that follow a policy of minimal
    New Entry: interference with the base Slackware system:
    New Entry:
    New Entry: http://gsb.sf.net
    New Entry: http://gware.sf.net
    New Entry:
    New Entry: There is also Dropline, of course, which is quite popular. However, due to
    New Entry: their policy of adding PAM and replacing large system packages (like the
    New Entry: entire X11 system) with their own versions, I can't give quite the same sort
    New Entry: of nod to Dropline. Nevertheless, it remains another choice, and it's _your_
    New Entry: system, so I will also mention their project:
    New Entry:
    New Entry: http://www.dropline.net/gnome/
    New Entry:
    New Entry: Please do not incorrectly interpret any of this as a slight against GNOME
    New Entry: itself, which (although it does usually need to be fixed and polished beyond
    New Entry: the way it ships from upstream more so than, say, KDE or XFce) is a decent
    New Entry: desktop choice. So are a lot of others, but Slackware does not need to ship
    New Entry: every choice. GNOME is and always has been a moving target (even the
    New Entry: "stable" releases usually aren't quite ready yet) that really does demand a
    New Entry: team to keep up on all the changes (many of which are not always well
    New Entry: documented). I fully expect that this move will improve the quality of both
    New Entry: Slackware itself, and the quality (and quantity) of the GNOME options
    New Entry: available for it.
    New Entry:
    New Entry: Folks, this is how open source is supposed to work. Enjoy. :-)

    Slackware may drop GNOME
    By Sam Varghese
    October 27, 2004

    One of the oldest Linux distributions may drop the GNOME desktop and leave it
    to users to install this environment if they so wish.

    Slackware Linux was started by Patrick Volkerding in early 1993.

    In reply to a recent mailing list post, asking why the packages for the latest
    GNOME - version 2.8 - was still not available for Slackware, Volkerding wrote
    that since GNOME 1.4 he had felt that it (GNOME) was going in a direction that
    did not fit well with Slackware's goals.

    He said as far back as release 1.4 he had considered removing it completely
    "and taking whatever flames I get for that decision."

    "Right now, I think removing it would be the best thing for Slackware as it's
    become a maintainance (sic) nightmare," Volkerding wrote.

    "I do believe it would be best to let Dropline produce Slackware's GNOME and
    quit wasting my own time with it. Probably 1/3 of developement time here is
    used maintaining GNOME, and *most* of the bug reports I get have something to
    do with GNOME (and aren't bugs I caused, or can fix)."

    Dropline Systems is now producing a version of GNOME, designed specifically for
    Slackware systems.

    Volkerding continued: "KDE, on the other hand, tends to build using the
    existing build scripts with no changes at all. I can start the build and come
    back to finished packages in a few hours. A GNOME update usually takes at least
    a week of manual labor, and another week of cleaning up broken things. It's
    been a long time (like I said, around GNOME 1.4), since I've felt the effort
    was worth the return."

    Asked for a reaction, Jeff Waugh, release manager for GNOME, said he could
    speak for himself and not the GNOME Project or Foundation.

    Waugh said: "Integrating and supporting a complete desktop software stack such
    as GNOME is a challenging task, comparable to the maintenance of a simplified
    Linux system such as Slackware. It is no surprise to me that Patrick is
    thinking about passing the torch to Dropline, who have done a sterling job
    providing high-quality, up-to-date releases of GNOME for Slackware.

    "That will give Patrick more time to focus on the core system, while leaving
    desktop integration to the Dropline folks, who rock so hard."




  14. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    you are telling me nothing i did not already know.
    i disagree with its removal as I dont consider it any more of a nightmare
    to maintain then kde, but Pat made his decision, one that I know has cost
    him many desktop users, but its his distro and he can do what he wants
    with it.


    On Mon, 26 May 2008, me@privacy.net wrote:


    --
    Cheers
    Res

    I read usenet and lists in pine. But m$ outlook, thunderbird and gmail
    often use html span/whatever for quotes, makes it hard to tell who said
    what, so I dont try. If I ignore you, thats why! Use a compliant mailer.

  15. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Mon, 26 May 2008, Mark Madsen wrote:

    > There is a huge logical gap between "I use Gnome because I like it better
    > than anything else" and "I use Gnome because I hate KDE" is all.


    I do like it better than kde, hence my reason to sticking with it, but I
    also hate kde so that sealed it.


    --
    Cheers
    Res

    I read usenet and lists in pine. But m$ outlook, thunderbird and gmail
    often use html span/whatever for quotes, makes it hard to tell who said
    what, so I dont try. If I ignore you, thats why! Use a compliant mailer.

  16. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Mon, 26 May 2008, ~kurt wrote:

    >
    > Res wrote:
    >>
    >> *shrug* used SuSE once, a few years ago, its just another rpm based

    >
    > Hmm, didn't remeber it using rpms - but what I do remember were all the


    yep, you can bascially install any rpm from RH into aSuSE system or at
    erlast you could a few years back when I tried it.

    > config files that said "DO NOT EDIT" - you were supposed to use their
    > little config tool for everything. My SuSE experiment didn't last very
    > long....


    agreed

    --
    Cheers
    Res

    I read usenet and lists in pine. But m$ outlook, thunderbird and gmail
    often use html span/whatever for quotes, makes it hard to tell who said
    what, so I dont try. If I ignore you, thats why! Use a compliant mailer.

  17. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On Mon, 26 May 2008 21:02:19 +1000, Res wrote:

    > On Mon, 26 May 2008, Mark Madsen wrote:
    >
    >> There is a huge logical gap between "I use Gnome because I like it
    >> better than anything else" and "I use Gnome because I hate KDE" is all.

    >
    > I do like it better than kde, hence my reason to sticking with it, but I
    > also hate kde so that sealed it.


    OK, but that's not a logical flow of argument, it's a confluence of
    decision factors.

    There is an argument that the default desktop on any distro is the one
    best adapted to work with that distro. If one believes this, one should
    use Gnome on Debian, KDE or Xfce on Slack, and twm on NetBSD :-)

  18. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On May 26, 12:04 am, ~kurt wrote:
    > Dan C wrote:
    >
    > > Me too. When Slack dropped Gnome, I used the various third party Gnomes
    > > for a while, and then switched to XFCE. Haven't looked back since.

    >
    > Still using Blackbox after all these years - change is bad....
    >
    > - Kurt


    Yup blackbox is what I have been using for the past few years.
    George

  19. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    Dan C wrote:


    >> Plenty of people simply hate KDE, and I confess I'm one of em.

    >
    > Me too. When Slack dropped Gnome, I used the various third party Gnomes
    > for a while, and then switched to XFCE. Haven't looked back since.


    Horses for courses. Installed Ubuntu to have a look and I've decided I'm
    happy with KDE.

    --
    http://www.petezilla.co.uk

  20. Re: At least one survey Slack scores well

    On 2008-05-26, Res wrote:
    > you are telling me nothing i did not already know.
    > i disagree with its removal as I dont consider it any more of a nightmare
    > to maintain then kde, but Pat made his decision, one that I know has cost
    > him many desktop users, but its his distro and he can do what he wants
    > with it.



    Ran across this while I was, supposedly, catching up on my paperwork...

    http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20060129

    ken

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