Guy Macon on using terms such as "Professional Engineer" - Slackware

This is a discussion on Guy Macon on using terms such as "Professional Engineer" - Slackware ; In article , rm@baseballproctologist.com (Roger Manyard) wrote: > Gee, and we thought you were an underrated supporting actor, > primarily of westerns, who died prematurely of a heart attack. In my past life. -- W. Oates...

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Thread: Guy Macon on using terms such as "Professional Engineer"

  1. Re: on using terms such as "Professional Engineer"

    In article ,
    rm@baseballproctologist.com (Roger Manyard) wrote:

    > Gee, and we thought you were an underrated supporting actor,
    > primarily of westerns, who died prematurely of a heart attack.


    In my past life.
    --
    W. Oates

  2. Re: Guy Macon on using terms such as "Professional Engineer"

    On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 20:42:26 -0500, Dan C
    wrote:

    >On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 18:28:51 +0000, Guy Macon wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    >> Safety comes from insuring that the product is designed to
    >> comply with appropriate standards, not by attempting to control
    >> who is and isn't allowed to design things.

    >
    >Correction to your English: in this context, the word should be
    >"ensuring", not "insuring". Completely different meanings...
    >
    >With that said, who exactly *ensures* that a product complies with
    >standards, if it's not done by the designer? Someone else has to come
    >along behind the designer and check the design for compliance?


    Often, yes. There are "compliance engineers" and they have their own
    magazine.

    http://www.ce-mag.com/


    John




  3. Re: Guy Macon on using terms such as "Professional Engineer"

    On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 11:19:24 -0700, John Larkin
    wrote:

    >On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 20:42:26 -0500, Dan C
    > wrote:
    >
    >>On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 18:28:51 +0000, Guy Macon wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>> Safety comes from insuring that the product is designed to
    >>> comply with appropriate standards, not by attempting to control
    >>> who is and isn't allowed to design things.

    >>
    >>Correction to your English: in this context, the word should be
    >>"ensuring", not "insuring". Completely different meanings...
    >>
    >>With that said, who exactly *ensures* that a product complies with
    >>standards, if it's not done by the designer? Someone else has to come
    >>along behind the designer and check the design for compliance?

    >
    >Often, yes. There are "compliance engineers" and they have their own
    >magazine.
    >
    >http://www.ce-mag.com/
    >
    >
    >John


    See also the usenet group sci.engr.electrical.compliance, though it
    doesn't get a lot of traffic.


  4. Re: Guy Macon on using terms such as "Professional Engineer"

    > The applicable California law is:
    >
    > Professional Engineers Act
    > Business And Professions Code §§ 6700 – 6799
    > Effective January 1, 2007
    > Chapter 7. Professional Engineers
    > http://www.dca.ca.gov/pels/pe_act.pdf
    >
    > § 6704 Defines who may use engineer titles:
    >
    > "Only persons licensed under this chapter shall be entitled
    > to take and use the titles 'consulting engineer,' 'professional
    > engineer,' or 'registered engineer,' or any combination of
    > those titles or abbreviations thereof."


    Our government at work again. With all the abuse big business (the guys with
    enough bucks to actually buy their influence) generates, you'd think our reps
    would be too busy keeping these guys in check to pay attention to the "there
    oughtta be a law" fools who come whining at their door.

    FBt


  5. Re: Guy Macon on using terms such as "Professional Engineer"

    On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 20:42:26 -0500, Dan C wrote:
    > On Mon, 16 Jul 2007 18:28:51 +0000, Guy Macon wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    >> Safety comes from insuring that the product is designed to
    >> comply with appropriate standards, not by attempting to control
    >> who is and isn't allowed to design things.

    >
    > Correction to your English: in this context, the word should be
    > "ensuring", not "insuring". Completely different meanings...
    >
    > With that said, who exactly *ensures* that a product complies with
    > standards, if it's not done by the designer? Someone else has to come
    > along behind the designer and check the design for compliance?


    Of course. It's called "checking". ;-)

    And, about "professional engineer", I'd call myself a de facto engineer,
    since I've been doing engineer work (and getting paid for it, which makes
    me a professional) for some years now.

    You see, I graduated Summa Cum Laude from the School Of Hard Knocks. ;-)
    (line lifted from last night's late-night "Frasier" rerun.)

    Cheers!
    Rich


  6. Re: Guy Macon on using terms such as "Professional Engineer"

    In alt.os.linux.slackware Rich Grise trolled:

    >And, about "professional engineer", I'd call myself a de facto
    >engineer, since I've been doing engineer work (and getting paid for
    >it, which makes me a professional) for some years now.


    >You see, I graduated Summa Cum Laude from the School Of Hard
    >Knocks. ;-) (line lifted from last night's late-night "Frasier"
    >rerun.)


    So you are, in reality, a handyman, who duplicates the work of real
    engineers while lacking the understanding necessary to the design of
    the work in question.

    A monkey-see-monkey-do type. There are a lot of you guys in the
    world of Computer Science.

    cordially, as always,

    rm

  7. Re: Warning to employers about Guy Macon

    On Jul 15, 11:47 am, r...@dudleydoright.org (Rhonda Moffat) wrote:
    > Guy Macon wrote:
    > > Exactly so. In the state of California there is no requirement
    > > that an engineer has a degree or license. A California engineer
    > > can have a license without a degree, a degree without a license,
    > > neither, or both.

    >
    > Mr. Macon has neither the education, nor the recognized
    > qualifications necessary to call himself an "Electrical Engineer",
    > and those who hire him as an Engineer should know that he is not
    > insurable as such and he is legally unable to sign off on jobs as an
    > Engineer.
    >
    > To the extent that Mr. Macon misrepresents himself, he is a fraud.


    I'm not sure that it's enough of a qualifier to say "to the extent Mr.
    _______ misrepresents himself / herself". You've made an assertion
    that may be actionable. I don't know this Macon fellow; however, your
    statement could be considered libelous, especially if Mr. Macon has
    sufficient works or qualifications to demonstrate he is an engineer.

    Frank


  8. Re: on using terms such as "Professional Engineer"

    Tue, 17 Jul 2007 10:50:54 -0400, Warren Oates did catÂ*:

    > In article ,
    > rm@baseballproctologist.com (Roger Manyard) wrote:
    >
    >> Gee, and we thought you were an underrated supporting actor, primarily
    >> of westerns, who died prematurely of a heart attack.

    >
    > In my past life.


    Hold your fire, pass it on ;-)

  9. Re: Warning to employers about Guy Macon

    Frank Raffaeli trolled:
    > r...@dudleydoright.org (Rhonda Moffat) wrote:


    >> Mr. Macon has neither the education, nor the recognized
    >> qualifications necessary to call himself an "Electrical
    >> Engineer", and those who hire him as an Engineer should know that
    >> he is not insurable as such and he is legally unable to sign off
    >> on jobs as an Engineer.


    >> To the extent that Mr. Macon misrepresents himself, he is a fraud.


    >I'm not sure that it's enough of a qualifier to say "to the extent Mr.
    >_______ misrepresents himself / herself". You've made an assertion
    >that may be actionable.


    What statement is actionable? To the extent that anybody
    misrepresents him or herself, such a person is a fraud. That's just
    a simple tautology.

    >I don't know this Macon fellow; however, your statement could be
    >considered libelous, especially if Mr. Macon has sufficient works
    >or qualifications to demonstrate he is an engineer.


    Anybody can be hired and given the job title of "Engineer." But the
    law in California demands that you be a licensed Engineer before you
    can undertake certain tasks and responsibilities and since Mr. Macon
    is not licensed, these tasks and responsibilities are without his
    purview.

    cordially, as always,

    rm
    --
    Guy Bacon's new resume can be found here:

    http://guybacon.boldlygoingnowhere.org/

  10. Re: Warning to employers about Guy Macon

    On Jul 15, 11:47 am, r...@dudleydoright.org (Rhonda Moffat) wrote:
    > Guy Macon wrote:
    > > Exactly so. In the state of California there is no requirement
    > > that an engineer has a degree or license. A California engineer
    > > can have a license without a degree, a degree without a license,
    > > neither, or both.

    >
    > Mr. Macon has neither the education, nor the recognized
    > qualifications necessary to call himself an "Electrical Engineer",
    > and those who hire him as an Engineer should know that he is not
    > insurable as such and he is legally unable to sign off on jobs as an
    > Engineer.
    >
    > To the extent that Mr. Macon misrepresents himself, he is a fraud.


    It is libelous to call someone a fraud if it's not true. Not knowing
    Mr. Macon's qualifications, I wouldn't be so loose with the f-word.

    Frank Raffaeli


  11. Re: Warning to employers about Guy Macon




    Frank Raffaeli wrote:

    >It is libelous to call someone a fraud if it's not true. Not knowing
    >Mr. Macon's qualifications, I wouldn't be so loose with the f-word.


    I appreciate the defense, but those who choose to respond are becoming
    part of the problem. Please don't feed the trolls. Responding only
    encourages them.



  12. Re: Warning to employers about Guy Macon

    In alt.os.linux.slackware Frank Raffaeli trolled:
    >On Jul 15, 11:47 am, r...@dudleydoright.org (Rhonda Moffat) wrote:
    >> Guy Macon wrote:
    >> > Exactly so. In the state of California there is no requirement
    >> > that an engineer has a degree or license. A California engineer
    >> > can have a license without a degree, a degree without a license,
    >> > neither, or both.

    >>
    >> Mr. Macon has neither the education, nor the recognized
    >> qualifications necessary to call himself an "Electrical Engineer",
    >> and those who hire him as an Engineer should know that he is not
    >> insurable as such and he is legally unable to sign off on jobs as an
    >> Engineer.


    >> To the extent that Mr. Macon misrepresents himself, he is a fraud.


    >It is libelous to call someone a fraud if it's not true. Not knowing
    >Mr. Macon's qualifications, I wouldn't be so loose with the f-word.


    To the extent that you misrepresent yourself, you are a fraud as
    well. To the extent that anyone misrepresents himself or herself,
    that person is a fraud as well.

    You have to learn to read.

    cordially, as always,

    rm
    --
    Guy Bacon's new resume can be found here:

    http://guybacon.boldlygoingnowhere.org/

  13. Re: Warning to employers about Guy Bacon

    Guy Macon trolled:
    >Frank Raffaeli wrote:


    >>It is libelous to call someone a fraud if it's not true. Not knowing
    >>Mr. Macon's qualifications, I wouldn't be so loose with the f-word.


    >I appreciate the defense, but those who choose to respond are
    >becoming part of the problem. Please don't feed the trolls.
    >Responding only encourages them.


    Let's just get the name out of the subject headers, ok?

    cordially, as always,

    rm
    --
    Guy Bacon's new resume can be found here:

    http://guybacon.bounceme.net

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