"Khalid Schofield" wrote:
> I want to edit on my Octane as it's got loads more power in it. How can I
> edit DV-AVI files on irix or what format can I convert them to?

Well, it depends what app you want to use to edit them, and as you're aware
your choice is a bit limited there.

> mpeg2
> seems to butcher using 'TMPGEnc' and setting it to max quality.

Mmm, MPEG2 is really not suitable for editing unless you have your source
footage compressed with it and you're desperate to avoid recompression...
and even then you have to muck about making sure you're using only I frames
and... just don't

> It's probably not worth converting it to uncompressed video as DV is
> already compressed so it would seem pointless. Or am I wrong? Would
> converting it to images be better?

If you have the storage, uncompressed is definitely easier all round. ISTR
you getting some FC arrays a while back - if you can sustain 40 Mbytes/sec
and have tens of Gbytes free, I'd go uncompressed. It'll have much less
processor load than editing with some compressed format.

> I'll edit in Adobe Permier 7

On an Octane? That'd be a good trick...

oops it's premier 4.2...... sorry for mistake

yeh ok good idea. What format shall I convert it too then? What happens to
the audio? mplayer will convert it to all jpeg images. Would I be better
with all bmp images?

*********************
Khalid Schofield
System Administrator / EM Technician
Dept. Of Materials
University Of Oxford
Parks Road
Oxford
OX1 3PH

Email: khalid.schofield@materials.ox.ac.uk
Tel: 01865 273785
Fax: 01865 283333
Web: http://www-em.materials.ox.ac.uk/peo...eld/index.html


On Tue, 15 Jun 2004, Lewis Saunders wrote:

> "Khalid Schofield" wrote:
> > I want to edit on my Octane as it's got loads more power in it. How can I
> > edit DV-AVI files on irix or what format can I convert them to?
>
> Well, it depends what app you want to use to edit them, and as you're aware
> your choice is a bit limited there.
>
> > mpeg2
> > seems to butcher using 'TMPGEnc' and setting it to max quality.
>
> Mmm, MPEG2 is really not suitable for editing unless you have your source
> footage compressed with it and you're desperate to avoid recompression...
> and even then you have to muck about making sure you're using only I frames
> and... just don't
>
> > It's probably not worth converting it to uncompressed video as DV is
> > already compressed so it would seem pointless. Or am I wrong? Would
> > converting it to images be better?
>
> If you have the storage, uncompressed is definitely easier all round. ISTR
> you getting some FC arrays a while back - if you can sustain 40 Mbytes/sec
> and have tens of Gbytes free, I'd go uncompressed. It'll have much less
> processor load than editing with some compressed format.
>
> > I'll edit in Adobe Permier 7
>
> On an Octane? That'd be a good trick...
>
>
>

"Khalid Schofield" wrote:
> yeh ok good idea. What format shall I convert it too then? What happens to
> the audio? mplayer will convert it to all jpeg images. Would I be better
> with all bmp images?

I've never used Premiere (note trailing e) on IRIX, but I assume from
screenshots that it's a straight port (I'm assuming it won't import DV AVIs
otherwise you could just edit them as they are). You should be able to use
mencoder to make raw AVI files with uncompressed PCM audio, which Premiere
will like. I forget the options you have to give it, you may have problems
with packings and depths - there are options for these, buried somewhere in
man mplayer. Maybe Premiere will only take raw YUV, maybe only raw RGB, I
have no idea.

If that works you should be able to edit nicely, and play back in real time
with no problems. If it doesn't you can import image sequences into
Premiere, but it's a bit of a pain in the bum. Use mencoder, obviously an
uncompressed format (BMP, TGA, SGI) or at least lossless (PNG) is best.

thanks for the info

I've found that the dv tools for linux allow capture of raw dv I'm also
going to try AVI 1 and AVI 2 formats as IRIX nativly supports those too


Oh man DV over IEEE1394 is a mess on linux. SuSE 9 is horrible. I'm
getting firewire on my Octane or a shiny new G5 as soon as I have funds.

Thanks for everyone's advise on this topic. I'm going to try to make a
movie of the sun rise in the morning using my digital camera set at
1600x1200 (far lower res that I normaly use it on) and take one pic (or
frame as I'll be using it as) every few secs for 2 hours or more. Very
high quality uncompressed video and none of this pal trash in sight

I bet an SGI will kick ass doing that sorts of work.



*********************
Khalid Schofield
System Administrator / EM Technician
Dept. Of Materials
University Of Oxford
Parks Road
Oxford
OX1 3PH

Email: khalid.schofield@materials.ox.ac.uk
Tel: 01865 273785
Fax: 01865 283333
Web: http://www-em.materials.ox.ac.uk/peo...eld/index.html


On Tue, 15 Jun 2004, Lewis Saunders wrote:

> "Khalid Schofield" wrote:
> > yeh ok good idea. What format shall I convert it too then? What happens to
> > the audio? mplayer will convert it to all jpeg images. Would I be better
> > with all bmp images?
>
> I've never used Premiere (note trailing e) on IRIX, but I assume from
> screenshots that it's a straight port (I'm assuming it won't import DV AVIs
> otherwise you could just edit them as they are). You should be able to use
> mencoder to make raw AVI files with uncompressed PCM audio, which Premiere
> will like. I forget the options you have to give it, you may have problems
> with packings and depths - there are options for these, buried somewhere in
> man mplayer. Maybe Premiere will only take raw YUV, maybe only raw RGB, I
> have no idea.
>
> If that works you should be able to edit nicely, and play back in real time
> with no problems. If it doesn't you can import image sequences into
> Premiere, but it's a bit of a pain in the bum. Use mencoder, obviously an
> uncompressed format (BMP, TGA, SGI) or at least lossless (PNG) is best.
>
>
>

In article ,
Khalid Schofield wrote:

: I'm getting firewire on my Octane

How exactly do you intend to do that?


: or a shiny new G5 as soon as I have funds.

That would probably work a bit better.


Cheers - Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler

--
Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler -- Master of Code-fu -- nicoya@ubb.ca
-- http://nicoya.feline.pp.se/ -- http://www.ubb.ca/ --

Le Wed, 16 Jun 2004 23:27:59 +0100, Khalid Schofield a écrit*:

>
> Oh man DV over IEEE1394 is a mess on linux.

Well I've setup dvgrab and Kino on my slackware box, it seems OK. To
install on debian it was just a matter of "apt-get install dvgrab" and it
did the trick fine Why is it a mess exactly?

--
Si ça a l'air facile, c'est difficile. Si ça a l'air difficile, c'est
carrément impossible. Si ça a l'air impossible, c'est un compilateur
Ada.
Théorème de Stockmayer.

Havn't SGI released a firewire option for Octanes now

*********************
Khalid Schofield
System Administrator / EM Technician
Dept. Of Materials
University Of Oxford
Parks Road
Oxford
OX1 3PH

Email: khalid.schofield@materials.ox.ac.uk
Tel: 01865 273785
Fax: 01865 283333
Web: http://www-em.materials.ox.ac.uk/peo...eld/index.html


On Wed, 16 Jun 2004, Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler wrote:

> In article ,
> Khalid Schofield wrote:
>
> : I'm getting firewire on my Octane
>
> How exactly do you intend to do that?
>
>
> : or a shiny new G5 as soon as I have funds.
>
> That would probably work a bit better.
>
>
> Cheers - Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler
>
> --
> Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler -- Master of Code-fu -- nicoya@ubb.ca
> -- http://nicoya.feline.pp.se/ -- http://www.ubb.ca/ --
>

In article ,
Khalid Schofield wrote:

: Havn't SGI released a firewire option for Octanes now

Ah, I found it now. DM10 option. They certainly hid it well enough.


Cheers - Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler

--
Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler -- Master of Code-fu -- nicoya@ubb.ca
-- http://nicoya.feline.pp.se/ -- http://www.ubb.ca/ --

yeh SGI's website is really on a fast downhill run

*********************
Khalid Schofield
System Administrator / EM Technician
Dept. Of Materials
University Of Oxford
Parks Road
Oxford
OX1 3PH

Email: khalid.schofield@materials.ox.ac.uk
Tel: 01865 273785
Fax: 01865 283333
Web: http://www-em.materials.ox.ac.uk/peo...eld/index.html


On Thu, 17 Jun 2004, Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler wrote:

> In article ,
> Khalid Schofield wrote:
>
> : Havn't SGI released a firewire option for Octanes now
>
> Ah, I found it now. DM10 option. They certainly hid it well enough.
>
>
> Cheers - Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler
>
> --
> Tony 'Nicoya' Mantler -- Master of Code-fu -- nicoya@ubb.ca
> -- http://nicoya.feline.pp.se/ -- http://www.ubb.ca/ --
>

"Khalid Schofield" wrote
> I've found that the dv tools for linux allow capture of raw dv I'm also
> going to try AVI 1 and AVI 2 formats as IRIX nativly supports those too
>

Hey - if you do manage to capture some raw DV, do you think you could try
renaming the file to be a .dif, then playing it with movieplayer on IRIX?
The dmIC API allegedly supports .dif files, I don't know if movieplayer
knows about them. You should be able to play them with hardware
decompression on O2, in theory.

wow your right it works

Playback under mediaplayer on my Octane.

*********************
Khalid Schofield
System Administrator / EM Technician
Dept. Of Materials
University Of Oxford
Parks Road
Oxford
OX1 3PH

Email: khalid.schofield@materials.ox.ac.uk
Tel: 01865 273785
Fax: 01865 283333
Web: http://www-em.materials.ox.ac.uk/peo...eld/index.html


On Thu, 17 Jun 2004, Lewis Saunders wrote:

> "Khalid Schofield" wrote
> > I've found that the dv tools for linux allow capture of raw dv I'm also
> > going to try AVI 1 and AVI 2 formats as IRIX nativly supports those too
> >
>
> Hey - if you do manage to capture some raw DV, do you think you could try
> renaming the file to be a .dif, then playing it with movieplayer on IRIX?
> The dmIC API allegedly supports .dif files, I don't know if movieplayer
> knows about them. You should be able to play them with hardware
> decompression on O2, in theory.
>
>
>

[...]
> Thanks for everyone's advise on this topic. I'm going to try to make a
> movie of the sun rise in the morning using my digital camera set at
> 1600x1200 (far lower res that I normaly use it on) and take one pic (or
> frame as I'll be using it as) every few secs for 2 hours or more. Very
> high quality uncompressed video and none of this pal trash in sight

> I bet an SGI will kick ass doing that sorts of work.

.... but your camera might not survive this "burn-in" test

[...]

can't be that hard on the cam though

Does the CCD chip kick out lots of heat? Will the cam over heat ?

I just HATE pal so badly.

*********************
Khalid Schofield
System Administrator / EM Technician
Dept. Of Materials
University Of Oxford
Parks Road
Oxford
OX1 3PH

Email: khalid.schofield@materials.ox.ac.uk
Tel: 01865 273785
Fax: 01865 283333
Web: http://www-em.materials.ox.ac.uk/peo...eld/index.html


On Fri, 18 Jun 2004, Rainer Latka wrote:

> [...]
> > Thanks for everyone's advise on this topic. I'm going to try to make a
> > movie of the sun rise in the morning using my digital camera set at
> > 1600x1200 (far lower res that I normaly use it on) and take one pic (or
> > frame as I'll be using it as) every few secs for 2 hours or more. Very
> > high quality uncompressed video and none of this pal trash in sight
>
> > I bet an SGI will kick ass doing that sorts of work.
>
> ... but your camera might not survive this "burn-in" test
>
> [...]
>

Khalid Schofield wrote:
> can't be that hard on the cam though
>
> Does the CCD chip kick out lots of heat? Will the cam over heat ?

For an example of what can happen if you point your camera
at the sun for too long, look for the diagonal stripes on
http://www.geonet.org.nz/images/volc...40618.1500.jpg
or
http://www.geonet.org.nz/images/volc...40618.0700.jpg

> I just HATE pal so badly.

I'd suggest getting a really cheap digital camera for your
sunrise/-set experiments. Maybe an old one that has a serial
interface and has software available for *nix to actually
control it (instead of just beeing able to download stored
images).


rainer

> can't be that hard on the cam though

yes it can

> Does the CCD chip kick out lots of heat? Will the cam over heat ?

actually it's the sun that kicks out a lot of heat, and the lens will
focus it. A little test with a lens focusing the sun on the back of your
hand will convince you.

Of course, right at sunrise, the atmosphere absorbs a good deal of it,
but as the sun rises higher, the heat concentration at the focus may
eventually fry the CCD chip, especially, if you mount the camera in a
fixed position and it is the type of camera where the CCD is permanently
exposed.

See e.g. (randomly selected from a google search):

http://www.photozo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1587
http://www.mreclipse.com/SENL/SENL9902/SENL902as.htm

Khalid Schofield wrote in
news:Pine.LNX.4.58.0406151359410.12429@crow.linux. ox.ac.uk:

> oops it's premier 4.2...... sorry for mistake
>
> yeh ok good idea. What format shall I convert it too then? What
> happens to the audio? mplayer will convert it to all jpeg images.
> Would I be better with all bmp images?
>
> *********************
> Khalid Schofield
> System Administrator / EM Technician
> Dept. Of Materials
> University Of Oxford
> Parks Road
> Oxford
> OX1 3PH
>
> Email: khalid.schofield@materials.ox.ac.uk
> Tel: 01865 273785
> Fax: 01865 283333
> Web: http://www-em.materials.ox.ac.uk/peo...eld/index.html
>
>
> On Tue, 15 Jun 2004, Lewis Saunders wrote:
>
>> "Khalid Schofield" wrote:
>> > I want to edit on my Octane as it's got loads more power in it. How
>> > can I edit DV-AVI files on irix or what format can I convert them
>> > to?
>>
>> Well, it depends what app you want to use to edit them, and as you're
>> aware your choice is a bit limited there.
>>
>> > mpeg2
>> > seems to butcher using 'TMPGEnc' and setting it to max quality.
>>
>> Mmm, MPEG2 is really not suitable for editing unless you have your
>> source footage compressed with it and you're desperate to avoid
>> recompression... and even then you have to muck about making sure
>> you're using only I frames and... just don't
>>
>> > It's probably not worth converting it to uncompressed video as DV
>> > is already compressed so it would seem pointless. Or am I wrong?
>> > Would converting it to images be better?
>>
>> If you have the storage, uncompressed is definitely easier all round.
>> ISTR you getting some FC arrays a while back - if you can sustain 40
>> Mbytes/sec and have tens of Gbytes free, I'd go uncompressed. It'll
>> have much less processor load than editing with some compressed
>> format.
>>
>> > I'll edit in Adobe Permier 7
>>
>> On an Octane? That'd be a good trick...
>>
>>
>>

Khalid,
Convert all your stuff to motion-JPEG. It does not use keyframes and is
well-supported on multiple platforms. The lack of keyframes means it is
not dependent on the frame before it, thus lending itself to editing. If
you have to do this on a Peecee, use Quicktime Pro to convert the files
to motion-jpeg. I think there is some kind of 2gb filesize limit so you
may have to splice the files into multiple parts.

Logan

"Diazonin" wrote:
> Convert all your stuff to motion-JPEG. It does not use keyframes and is
> well-supported on multiple platforms. The lack of keyframes means it is
> not dependent on the frame before it, thus lending itself to editing.

All true, but since he's using an Octane he wouldn't be able to watch his
footage in real time. Plus rendering effects and transitions would be
slower, and would add yet more compression artifacts. DV is an intra-frame
only codec too, with very wide support, but needs much less CPU power to
work with. And looks a bit crappy compared to decent rate MJPEG.

Obviously if you have an O2 or a Cosmo card, MJPEG is the way to go.