NTFS - Setup

This is a discussion on NTFS - Setup ; Hi, I am new to Linux and are now trying to gather some basic knowledge; can I install Kubuntu on a hdd formatted as NTFS? ulf...

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Thread: NTFS

  1. NTFS

    Hi,
    I am new to Linux and are now trying to gather some basic knowledge; can I
    install Kubuntu on a hdd formatted as NTFS?

    ulf



  2. Re: NTFS

    On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 05:18:26 GMT, cgi-bin/Count wrote:
    > Hi,
    > I am new to Linux and are now trying to gather some basic knowledge; can I
    > install Kubuntu on a hdd formatted as NTFS?


    No. What happens is the ntfs partition is shrunk, the free space is
    used for the linux install. This assumes you have defragged ntfs and
    there is enough space for your install. I like to have about 10 gig
    free space and leave 10gig for windows update.

  3. Re: NTFS

    Thank you for the answer.
    ulf

    "Bit Twister" wrote in message
    news:slrnfblacm.577.BitTwister@wb.home.invalid...
    > On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 05:18:26 GMT, cgi-bin/Count wrote:
    >> Hi,
    >> I am new to Linux and are now trying to gather some basic knowledge; can
    >> I
    >> install Kubuntu on a hdd formatted as NTFS?

    >
    > No. What happens is the ntfs partition is shrunk, the free space is
    > used for the linux install. This assumes you have defragged ntfs and
    > there is enough space for your install. I like to have about 10 gig
    > free space and leave 10gig for windows update.




  4. Re: NTFS

    cgi-bin/Count wrote:
    > Hi,
    > I am new to Linux and are now trying to gather some basic knowledge; can I
    > install Kubuntu on a hdd formatted as NTFS?


    Create a partition on it and install on the new partition. The installation
    process will reformat the partition.

    --
    Al Qaeda is back to its pre-911 strength of 300. I am so frightened I can
    only laugh to relieve the anxiety. 300 is the highest US government estimate
    of their numbers ever made public.
    -- The Iron Webmaaster, 3831
    nizkor http://www.giwersworld.org/nizkook/nizkook.phtml
    Iraqi democracy http://www.giwersworld.org/911/armless.phtml a3

  5. Re: NTFS

    On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 05:18:26 +0000, cgi-bin/Count wrote:
    > Hi,
    > I am new to Linux and are now trying to gather some basic knowledge; can I
    > install Kubuntu on a hdd formatted as NTFS?
    >
    > ulf
    >

    I agree with other answers you have received on this thread. In general,
    GNU/Linux works best when using its own filesystem. You are better off
    resizing your existing partitions and allocating a new partition which
    can be formatted and used by your GNU/Linux distribution. In general,
    GNU/Linux will use two partitions (minimum): root and swap (optional). A
    full discussion of disk partitioning is beyond the scope of this answer-
    I'll just leave it at that, except to add this semi-off-topic exception
    below.

    More info about the root filesystem, native filesystems, exceptions to the
    rules...

    NTFS does not meet the requirements for a filesystem on GNU/Linux and
    cannot be used (without some extra tricks). GNU/Linux is a unix-like OS,
    and requires a filesystem where the unix file permission model can be
    accommodated. There are a lot a native filesystems which can
    be used on GNU/Linux: ext2, ext3, xfs, reiserfs, etc. Other filesystems
    which have been adapted, but may not meet the requirement to be used a
    root filesystem, can still be used with GNU/Linux. The files stored
    there can be read. There has been _readonly_ support for NTFS within
    GNU/Linux for a long time. That has allowed minimal access to the files
    stored there, but it is not _suitable_*_ for use as the _root filesystem_.
    There is a project which adapts file permissions to the FAT filesystem
    called usmsdos. I am not sure how well maintained that project is, of
    late, though.

    _*_ Recent developments with the ntfs-3g project have made NTFS
    read-write. Still, I am not sure how (or if) that project can handle unix
    file permissions. My _guess_, is that it cannot. I haven't studied the
    documentation for ntfs-3g.

    With the above in mind, there is at least one exception that allows
    GNU/Linux's root filesystem to reside on NTFS. The trick is to encapsulate
    the entire root filesystem into a large file which resides on the NTFS
    partition. This places the root filesystem on a single loopback file. For
    example, if you want to allocate 8G of space for GNU/Linux's root
    filesystem, then (while running Windows) allocate a single 8G file. The
    file's contents can be set as "zero" (be unitialized). Or another option
    is to "rollout" a base setup with a loopback file which has been built in
    advance. The act of copying the file effectively clones the preset OS to
    the target. With this option your rollout image is ready to go with the
    complete root filesystem of your GNU/Linux distribution. It can contain
    all of the software you intend to use, along with some free working space.
    This is one method to install GNU/Linux quickly. You only need a
    bootloader, kernel, and simple initrd to begin using the prebuilt
    filesystem on loopback.

    The specific details of creating a preset filesystem within a loopback
    file is not too hard, but is beyond the scope of this thread; and it is
    not what you asked anyway ;-). This response is somewhat off-topic. The
    main reason I went off topic is to show that there are exceptions to
    every rule. I'll quit here, except to offer these reasons why this
    approach could be a good option. A root filesystem on a loopback file
    can provide these benefits:

    1. It avoids repartitioning your hard disk. Repartitioning is tricky and
    always involves risk. Be careful and have good backups if repartitioning.

    2. It provides is a good alternative to using a live CD/DVD. A loopback
    filesystem on a magnetic media will have better performance than
    optical. Also, the loopback files will not be limited to using the
    space available from standard optical media. That is, your setup will
    not be limited to 700M (CD-R), 4.7G (DVD-R), etc. The loopback file can
    be allocated using whatever space you have available on your hard disk
    (and want to allocate for that purpose.) The changes to root filesystems
    will be saved when using loopbacks, whereas, changes are often
    volatile when booting simple live CDs/DVDs.

    3. It's a fun exercise for learning about the technical bootup
    requirements for using GNU/Linux ;-)

    --
    Douglas Mayne

  6. Re: NTFS

    cgi-bin/Count wrote:
    > I am new to Linux and are now trying to gather some basic knowledge; can
    > I install Kubuntu on a hdd formatted as NTFS?


    Just put the Kubuntu CD in the drive, boot the computer, and follow
    instruction. The installer will shrink the NTFS partition and create the
    partitions it needs. Be sure you have a fresh backup of your important
    data first, of course.
    --
    John Hasler
    john@dhh.gt.org
    Dancing Horse Hill
    Elmwood, WI USA

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