[Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005 - Samba

This is a discussion on [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005 - Samba ; Hi, I have some problem with a network that use Samba as the main FileServer. All client are Windows XP and are identical in almost every point of view. User complain of several crash of AutoCad that happen during the ...

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Thread: [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005

  1. [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005

    Hi,

    I have some problem with a network that use Samba as the main
    FileServer. All client are Windows XP and are identical in almost every
    point of view.

    User complain of several crash of AutoCad that happen during the day for
    no special reason. It usually happen when the user execute a command.

    The problem it's self it's not really important, I just want to know if
    any body complain about similar problem with AutoCad+Samba. If it's not
    the case, I will not care about the server and take a further look to
    other network component.

    Thanks for your help

    Patrik Dufresne
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  2. Re: [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005

    Hello,
    I have same setup here; all the CAD standards and profiles are loaded
    in to AutoCAD using SAMBA shares, CAD project files are also accessed
    from SAMBA shares. This generates very heavy traffic over network and
    this is I/O bound operation; you should have sufficient RAM at both
    server and client side. Your AutoCAD should be update with all service
    packs and CAD fixes released by Autodesk. The problem you are talking
    about should be related to AutoCAD or possibly some network issues and
    not with SAMBA; as this happens when user executes certain command.
    Make sure that AutoCAD is configured properly in case you are using
    some CAD standards/customizations and file paths should not be missing.

    Thank you.
    Rahul.


    Patrik Dufresne wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > I have some problem with a network that use Samba as the main
    > FileServer. All client are Windows XP and are identical in almost
    > every point of view.
    >
    > User complain of several crash of AutoCad that happen during the day
    > for no special reason. It usually happen when the user execute a command.
    >
    > The problem it's self it's not really important, I just want to know
    > if any body complain about similar problem with AutoCad+Samba. If it's
    > not the case, I will not care about the server and take a further look
    > to other network component.
    >
    > Thanks for your help
    >
    > Patrik Dufresne

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  3. Re: [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005

    Rahul Tidke wrote:
    > Hello,
    > I have same setup here; all the CAD standards and profiles are
    > loaded in to AutoCAD using SAMBA shares, CAD project files are also
    > accessed from SAMBA shares. This generates very heavy traffic over
    > network and this is I/O bound operation; you should have sufficient
    > RAM at both server and client side. Your AutoCAD should be update with
    > all service packs and CAD fixes released by Autodesk. The problem you
    > are talking about should be related to AutoCAD or possibly some
    > network issues and not with SAMBA; as this happens when user executes
    > certain command.
    > Make sure that AutoCAD is configured properly in case you are using
    > some CAD standards/customizations and file paths should not be missing.

    Interesting. I had a complaint today about AutoCAD being slow to access
    files. Once in a while users see very slow access when accessing files
    from the server. Apparently this is particular to AutoCAD.

    I am waiting on more information, so that's all I know at this point.

    --Yan

    >
    > Thank you.
    > Rahul.
    >
    >
    > Patrik Dufresne wrote:
    >> Hi,
    >>
    >> I have some problem with a network that use Samba as the main
    >> FileServer. All client are Windows XP and are identical in almost
    >> every point of view.
    >>
    >> User complain of several crash of AutoCad that happen during the day
    >> for no special reason. It usually happen when the user execute a
    >> command.
    >>
    >> The problem it's self it's not really important, I just want to know
    >> if any body complain about similar problem with AutoCad+Samba. If
    >> it's not the case, I will not care about the server and take a
    >> further look to other network component.
    >>
    >> Thanks for your help
    >>
    >> Patrik Dufresne



    --
    o__
    ,>/'_ o__
    (_)\(_) ,>/'_ o__
    Yan Seiner (_)\(_) ,>/'_ o__
    Personal Trainer (_)\(_) ,>/'_ o__
    Professional Engineer (_)\(_) ,>/'_
    Who says engineers have to be pencil necked geeks? (_)\(_)

    "I worry about my child and the Internet all the time, even though she's too young to have logged on yet. Here's what I worry about. I worry that 10 or 15 years from now, she will come to me and say 'Daddy, where were you when they took freedom of the press away from the Internet?'"
    --Mike Godwin, Electronic Frontier Foundation

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  4. Re: [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005

    >> Patrik Dufresne wrote:
    >>> Hi,
    >>>
    >>> I have some problem with a network that use Samba as the main
    >>> FileServer. All client are Windows XP and are identical in almost
    >>> every point of view.
    >>>
    >>> User complain of several crash of AutoCad that happen during the day
    >>> for no special reason. It usually happen when the user execute a
    >>> command.
    >>>
    >>> The problem it's self it's not really important, I just want to know
    >>> if any body complain about similar problem with AutoCad+Samba. If
    >>> it's not the case, I will not care about the server and take a
    >>> further look to other network component.
    >>>
    >>> Thanks for your help
    >>>
    >>> Patrik Dufresne

    >
    >
    > Rahul Tidke wrote:
    >> Hello,
    >> I have same setup here; all the CAD standards and profiles are
    >> loaded in to AutoCAD using SAMBA shares, CAD project files are also
    >> accessed from SAMBA shares. This generates very heavy traffic over
    >> network and this is I/O bound operation; you should have sufficient
    >> RAM at both server and client side. Your AutoCAD should be update with
    >> all service packs and CAD fixes released by Autodesk. The problem you
    >> are talking about should be related to AutoCAD or possibly some
    >> network issues and not with SAMBA; as this happens when user executes
    >> certain command.
    >> Make sure that AutoCAD is configured properly in case you are using
    >> some CAD standards/customizations and file paths should not be missing.
    >>
    >> Thank you.
    >> Rahul.
    >>
    >>

    Yan Seiner wrote:

    > Interesting. I had a complaint today about AutoCAD being slow to access
    > files. Once in a while users see very slow access when accessing files
    > from the server. Apparently this is particular to AutoCAD.
    >
    > I am waiting on more information, so that's all I know at this point.
    >
    > --Yan
    >
    >>


    I went through number of problems while setting up CAD softwares and
    Samba file server, we use softwares like

    1) Graphisoft ArchiCAD which uses a concept called Teamwork (Multiple
    people working on same project file)

    2) Autodesk Revit which uses concept of Central file (This is also
    shared by multiple peoples with restricted access to certain part of
    file; after finishing the work everyone saves back to central file and
    changes are reflected to central file).

    3) Autodesk Architecture, this uses number of different client wise CAD
    standards, libraries , profiles which is all loaded in to AutoCAD
    project file from SAMBA share and this project files is accessed from
    different SAMBA share ( A common share is created for CAD
    standards,CAD Libraries, customization files), in addition this project
    file has multiple external references (called xrefs) which is also
    loaded from common SAMBA share.

    What I am trying to mention is a single file has multiple objects loaded
    from different SAMBA shares and a user saves the data (file on which he
    is working) back to server frequently (say after every 2-3 minutes);
    plus these software have "Auto save" feature which also saves the data
    back to server after particular time interval. So if your network
    disconnects (even if for fraction of seconds) in between; all the files
    become read only and sometime this affects the teamwork file or central
    file (file may get corrupt)!

    My question to SAMBA developers is; whether accessing files this way
    from different SAMBA shares in to a single CAD project file and how
    SAMBA serves files are inter related in any way?? What kind of SAMBA
    configuration one should have in above cases?

    Thanks
    Rahul.
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  5. Re: [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005

    Rahul Tidke wrote:
    > >> Patrik Dufresne wrote:
    > >>> Hi,
    > >>>
    > >>> I have some problem with a network that use Samba as the main
    > >>> FileServer. All client are Windows XP and are identical in almost
    > >>> every point of view.
    > >>>
    > >>> User complain of several crash of AutoCad that happen during the day
    > >>> for no special reason. It usually happen when the user execute a
    > >>> command.
    > >>>
    > >>> The problem it's self it's not really important, I just want to know
    > >>> if any body complain about similar problem with AutoCad+Samba. If
    > >>> it's not the case, I will not care about the server and take a
    > >>> further look to other network component.
    > >>>
    > >>> Thanks for your help
    > >>>
    > >>> Patrik Dufresne

    > >
    > >
    > > Rahul Tidke wrote:
    > >> Hello,
    > >> I have same setup here; all the CAD standards and profiles are
    > >> loaded in to AutoCAD using SAMBA shares, CAD project files are also
    > >> accessed from SAMBA shares. This generates very heavy traffic over
    > >> network and this is I/O bound operation; you should have sufficient
    > >> RAM at both server and client side. Your AutoCAD should be update with
    > >> all service packs and CAD fixes released by Autodesk. The problem you
    > >> are talking about should be related to AutoCAD or possibly some
    > >> network issues and not with SAMBA; as this happens when user executes
    > >> certain command.
    > >> Make sure that AutoCAD is configured properly in case you are using
    > >> some CAD standards/customizations and file paths should not be

    > missing.
    > >>
    > >> Thank you.
    > >> Rahul.
    > >>
    > >>

    > Yan Seiner wrote:
    >
    >> Interesting. I had a complaint today about AutoCAD being slow to
    >> access files. Once in a while users see very slow access when
    >> accessing files from the server. Apparently this is particular to
    >> AutoCAD.
    >>
    >> I am waiting on more information, so that's all I know at this point.
    >>
    >> --Yan
    >>
    >>>

    >
    > I went through number of problems while setting up CAD softwares and
    > Samba file server, we use softwares like
    >
    > 1) Graphisoft ArchiCAD which uses a concept called Teamwork (Multiple
    > people working on same project file)
    >
    > 2) Autodesk Revit which uses concept of Central file (This is also
    > shared by multiple peoples with restricted access to certain part of
    > file; after finishing the work everyone saves back to central file and
    > changes are reflected to central file).
    >
    > 3) Autodesk Architecture, this uses number of different client wise
    > CAD standards, libraries , profiles which is all loaded in to AutoCAD
    > project file from SAMBA share and this project files is accessed from
    > different SAMBA share ( A common share is created for CAD
    > standards,CAD Libraries, customization files), in addition this
    > project file has multiple external references (called xrefs) which is
    > also loaded from common SAMBA share.
    >
    > What I am trying to mention is a single file has multiple objects
    > loaded from different SAMBA shares and a user saves the data (file on
    > which he is working) back to server frequently (say after every 2-3
    > minutes); plus these software have "Auto save" feature which also
    > saves the data back to server after particular time interval. So if
    > your network disconnects (even if for fraction of seconds) in between;
    > all the files become read only and sometime this affects the teamwork
    > file or central file (file may get corrupt)!
    >
    > My question to SAMBA developers is; whether accessing files this way
    > from different SAMBA shares in to a single CAD project file and how
    > SAMBA serves files are inter related in any way?? What kind of SAMBA
    > configuration one should have in above cases?
    >
    > Thanks
    > Rahul.

    Hi Rahul,

    I have very similar configuration expect that AutoCAD profile are loaded
    for local hard drive and not from share on Samba. All other project file
    of AutoCad are access via Samba file server (the user mount the share on
    O: )

    For your information, AutoCAd 2005 SP1 are install on all machine and
    every client have 4Gig of memory with a Core2Duo. We made an unpgrade
    recently of the machine and I got this problem only on those machine.

    Also, My Network work on 100Mbit and Not 1Gbit, do you thing it can the
    cause the problem ? What is your setup ?

    I really sure the problem are related to the network because a user made
    a test Monday. The take the entire project file and copy it locally on
    the hard drive. Usually, after 1 hour of work, AutoCad crash. This user
    work all the day on the project without any crash. He take the same file
    Tuesday and work on it via the samba share and got the usual crash.

    I'm running out of time to write other explanation .. I have to got working.

    Thanks

    Patrik Dufresne


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  6. Re: [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005

    Hi everyone--

    I've worked with many, many CAD, CAM and PLM products including AutoCAD,
    CATIA, I-DEAS, UG/NX, 3DStudio Max, Teamcenter, etc. for many, many years
    and consider myself to be an expert in performance, scalability and
    reliability of these systems.

    Most likely, your problems are not specifically related to Samba and are
    related to network issues. A good way to track down these types of issues
    would be setup a test network with identical server and client
    configurations to what you use in production. Set Samba's debug level to
    at least 3 or 4 and start watching the logs as you run various test
    scenarios. Also, try watching the event viewer on the Windows clients.

    If you're not sure what to look for, post some log excerpts and your
    smb.conf up on the list and many people here, myself included, should be
    able to tell you what's going on.
    --
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  7. Re: [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005

    Patrik Dufresne wrote:
    >
    > I have very similar configuration expect that AutoCAD profile are
    > loaded for local hard drive and not from share on Samba. All other
    > project file of AutoCad are access via Samba file server (the user
    > mount the share on O: )
    >
    > For your information, AutoCAd 2005 SP1 are install on all machine and
    > every client have 4Gig of memory with a Core2Duo. We made an unpgrade
    > recently of the machine and I got this problem only on those machine.
    >
    > Also, My Network work on 100Mbit and Not 1Gbit, do you thing it can
    > the cause the problem ? What is your setup ?
    >
    > I really sure the problem are related to the network because a user
    > made a test Monday. The take the entire project file and copy it
    > locally on the hard drive. Usually, after 1 hour of work, AutoCad
    > crash. This user work all the day on the project without any crash. He
    > take the same file Tuesday and work on it via the samba share and got
    > the usual crash.
    >
    > I'm running out of time to write other explanation .. I have to got
    > working.
    >

    This is my share setup for Revit. Note the veto oplocks line; this was
    necessary to get revit happy.

    [data]
    comment = Project files
    path = /home/samba
    public = yes
    writable = yes
    printable = no
    create mask = 0771
    directory mask = 0771
    veto oplock files = /*.rvt/

    Have you looked in the samba log files? I'd turn up the debugging and
    see what it is doing when a crash occurs. One of my customers is a
    legacy firm - they have been around for about 60 years, and they went to
    computers early, so we're always finding stuff that is 'just barely
    failing', with strange symptoms and intermittent faults. It can be hard
    to diagnose those faults.

    The samba log files are really detailed and help out in figuring out
    what is at fault.

    --Yan

    --
    o__
    ,>/'_ o__
    (_)\(_) ,>/'_ o__
    Yan Seiner (_)\(_) ,>/'_ o__
    Personal Trainer (_)\(_) ,>/'_ o__
    Professional Engineer (_)\(_) ,>/'_
    Who says engineers have to be pencil necked geeks? (_)\(_)

    "I worry about my child and the Internet all the time, even though she's too young to have logged on yet. Here's what I worry about. I worry that 10 or 15 years from now, she will come to me and say 'Daddy, where were you when they took freedom of the press away from the Internet?'"
    --Mike Godwin, Electronic Frontier Foundation

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  8. Re: [Samba] Samba & AutoCAd 2005

    Rob Shinn wrote:
    > Hi everyone--
    >
    > I've worked with many, many CAD, CAM and PLM products including
    > AutoCAD, CATIA, I-DEAS, UG/NX, 3DStudio Max, Teamcenter, etc. for
    > many, many years and consider myself to be an expert in performance,
    > scalability and reliability of these systems.
    >
    > Most likely, your problems are not specifically related to Samba and
    > are related to network issues. A good way to track down these types
    > of issues would be setup a test network with identical server and
    > client configurations to what you use in production. Set Samba's
    > debug level to at least 3 or 4 and start watching the logs as you run
    > various test scenarios. Also, try watching the event viewer on the
    > Windows clients.
    >
    > If you're not sure what to look for, post some log excerpts and your
    > smb.conf up on the list and many people here, myself included, should
    > be able to tell you what's going on.
    >

    Hi Rob Shinn,

    Thanks for your suggestion, I will probably setup a testing environment
    to know if the problem come from network component or the server it
    self. It's will be easy because the Samba server is a Ubuntu guest
    running on VMWareServer.

    I will keep you inform If I find anything strange in log file.

    Thanks

    Patrik Dufresne
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