Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr - Redhat

This is a discussion on Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr - Redhat ; Forgive me if this gets a little rantish, but there are rant-worthy elements of my experience. I just went from RH7.2 to FC1, basically by sticking the FC1 CD into the drive and rebooting. When it was all done, I ...

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Thread: Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr

  1. Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr

    Forgive me if this gets a little rantish, but there are rant-worthy
    elements of my experience.

    I just went from RH7.2 to FC1, basically by sticking the FC1 CD into the
    drive and rebooting.

    When it was all done, I found that the sendmail and lpr programs were
    gone.

    WHAT???!!!

    I didn't have any special sendmail and lpr configuration before. It was
    just what RH7.2 gave me. But simply by upgrading, I find that I can't
    send mail or print anymore. That's pretty lame.

    I did a lot of poking, and I figure that the printing system changed.
    It uses CUPS now. I don't know what it used before. And there's
    supposed to be some sort of lpr interface, but for some reason the
    symbolic link that lpr was supposed to be isn't there. And I think the
    default MTA changed too.

    But still, even if they change the underlying package, the upgrade
    shouldn't leave me without the standard commands to send mail and print!

    What am I supposed to do now? I try could find the correct symlink, but
    what happens when I upgrade again? Or *gasp* change packages? I want
    the packaging system to take care of this for me. I don't know anything
    about CUPS, or Postfix, or whatever it is that's used. I just want the
    standard sendmail and lpr commands -- the ones that all these other
    programs depend on -- to work!

    What is the "proper" way in the weird FC universe for these programs to
    get here?

    Please reply to the newsgroup. Thanks!

  2. Re: Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr


    wrote in message
    news:1gsecvh.1xt5ganv4vlzyN%os7ly0h7lwxebir@jetabl e.org...
    > Forgive me if this gets a little rantish, but there are rant-worthy
    > elements of my experience.
    >
    > I just went from RH7.2 to FC1, basically by sticking the FC1 CD into the
    > drive and rebooting.
    >
    > When it was all done, I found that the sendmail and lpr programs were
    > gone.


    First, you should be using FC3. FC1 just fell off the support list.

    Second, stay calm. RedHat has been schizophrenically supporting both cups
    and LPRng printing, both sendmail and postfix as well. You need to find the
    packages and commands called something like "switch-printir" and
    "switch-mailer" commands, which will generate a werd set symlinks into an
    intermediate directory and a weird symlinks *out* of it to provide lpd, mail
    and other basich shell commands.

    > WHAT???!!!
    >
    > I didn't have any special sendmail and lpr configuration before. It was
    > just what RH7.2 gave me. But simply by upgrading, I find that I can't
    > send mail or print anymore. That's pretty lame.
    >
    > I did a lot of poking, and I figure that the printing system changed.
    > It uses CUPS now. I don't know what it used before. And there's
    > supposed to be some sort of lpr interface, but for some reason the
    > symbolic link that lpr was supposed to be isn't there. And I think the
    > default MTA changed too.
    >
    > But still, even if they change the underlying package, the upgrade
    > shouldn't leave me without the standard commands to send mail and print!


    You're right. It shouldn't But this is what you get for waiting 4 years
    between OS upgrades, then upgrading from one deprecated OS to *ANOTHER*
    deprecated OS that has also fallen off the support tree.



  3. Re: Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr

    In article , "Nico Kadel-Garcia"
    wrote:

    > wrote in message
    > news:1gsecvh.1xt5ganv4vlzyN%os7ly0h7lwxebir@jetabl e.org...
    >> Forgive me if this gets a little rantish, but there are rant-worthy
    >> elements of my experience.
    >>
    >> I just went from RH7.2 to FC1, basically by sticking the FC1 CD into
    >> the drive and rebooting.
    >>
    >> When it was all done, I found that the sendmail and lpr programs were
    >> gone.

    >
    > First, you should be using FC3. FC1 just fell off the support list.
    >
    > Second, stay calm. RedHat has been schizophrenically supporting both
    > cups and LPRng printing, both sendmail and postfix as well. You need to
    > find the packages and commands called something like "switch-printir"
    > and "switch-mailer" commands, which will generate a werd set symlinks
    > into an intermediate directory and a weird symlinks *out* of it to
    > provide lpd, mail and other basich shell commands.
    >
    >> WHAT???!!!
    >>
    >> I didn't have any special sendmail and lpr configuration before. It
    >> was just what RH7.2 gave me. But simply by upgrading, I find that I
    >> can't send mail or print anymore. That's pretty lame.
    >>
    >> I did a lot of poking, and I figure that the printing system changed.
    >> It uses CUPS now. I don't know what it used before. And there's
    >> supposed to be some sort of lpr interface, but for some reason the
    >> symbolic link that lpr was supposed to be isn't there. And I think the
    >> default MTA changed too.
    >>
    >> But still, even if they change the underlying package, the upgrade
    >> shouldn't leave me without the standard commands to send mail and
    >> print!

    >
    > You're right. It shouldn't But this is what you get for waiting 4 years
    > between OS upgrades, then upgrading from one deprecated OS to *ANOTHER*
    > deprecated OS that has also fallen off the support tree.
    >
    >


    I tend to disagree, I've ran rh since 4.2 and dont use fedora at all. I
    like senmail myself. Rh said they we're removing it in the list of
    changes in the fedora passover news they past us. Also the page said they
    were eventually removing lile, wich I like. They also removed all mp3
    support, wich is bs in my opinion like xmms. Since rh has gotten the pay
    up every year or switch distro attitude, like most others, I'm switching.
    The thing that made rh great in the old days was it came with a ton of
    3rd party software when high speed internet was out of most ppl's reach
    wich of course made them popular. Well in a world of DSL and cable , that
    software isn't a pain to get anymore. Having the chioce of software is
    what linux is all about. In reading on fedora core , well FD1 is only a
    year old and not supported, I personallly dont want to tell my users to
    backup stuff 3 times a year so I can do a distro version update. By the
    time ya'll dial in FD3 , FD4 will be here and time to start over. As far
    as mp3 support, I only want xmms, not the music files. As far as grub,
    wtf was wrong with lilo, never had a problem with it and it aint broke so
    I don't intend to fix it. Of course tho I like my BitchX but what do ya
    no, it wont compile on FD3. In my reading on rh's site and fedora's , I
    noticed they are trying to alot like debian with all the apt package
    management so I considered going to debian , then on debians site I read
    they are making a linux distro with a BSD kernel. I got to thinking about
    all this, decided when I learned apfwadm , ipchains come around, when I
    got ipchains down , iptables come around , so piss on the whole bunch , I
    went bsd , comes with a ton of 3rd party sofware the rh used to and then
    some and I only have to learn ipfw for the firewall and can use it
    without a full system upgrade for years

    Cheers

  4. Re: Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr

    In article <1gsecvh.1xt5ganv4vlzyN%os7ly0h7lwxebir@jetable.org>,
    os7ly0h7lwxebir@jetable.org wrote:
    > Forgive me if this gets a little rantish, but there are rant-worthy
    > elements of my experience.
    >
    > I just went from RH7.2 to FC1, basically by sticking the FC1 CD into the
    > drive and rebooting.
    >
    > When it was all done, I found that the sendmail and lpr programs were
    > gone.
    >
    > WHAT???!!!
    >
    > I didn't have any special sendmail and lpr configuration before. It was
    > just what RH7.2 gave me. But simply by upgrading, I find that I can't
    > send mail or print anymore. That's pretty lame.
    >
    > I did a lot of poking, and I figure that the printing system changed.
    > It uses CUPS now. I don't know what it used before. And there's
    > supposed to be some sort of lpr interface, but for some reason the
    > symbolic link that lpr was supposed to be isn't there. And I think the
    > default MTA changed too.
    >
    > But still, even if they change the underlying package, the upgrade
    > shouldn't leave me without the standard commands to send mail and print!
    >
    > What am I supposed to do now? I try could find the correct symlink, but
    > what happens when I upgrade again? Or *gasp* change packages? I want
    > the packaging system to take care of this for me. I don't know anything
    > about CUPS, or Postfix, or whatever it is that's used. I just want the
    > standard sendmail and lpr commands -- the ones that all these other
    > programs depend on -- to work!
    >
    > What is the "proper" way in the weird FC universe for these programs to
    > get here?
    >
    > Please reply to the newsgroup. Thanks!


    I can't say for certain, but I made that same change about 6 months ago and I
    don't think that 7.2 -> FC1 is a "supported" upgrade. You bypassed 7.3, 8.0,
    8.1 and 9.0 there - what did you THINK would happen? I did a fresh install of
    FC1 and I have sendmail working with no problems - didn't need anything special
    to use it vs postfix...

    And CUPS has a lot of nice features - I know that doesn't do you any good if
    you've got an LPR setup, but CUPS came in at (I think) RH 9.0...

    Also, be sure to setup your up2date or yum settings to point at
    fedoralegacy.org so you can keep updated on security patches.

    Kevin

  5. Re: Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr

    In article ,
    Kevin Collins wrote:

    > I can't say for certain, but I made that same change about 6 months ago and I
    > don't think that 7.2 -> FC1 is a "supported" upgrade. You bypassed 7.3, 8.0,
    > 8.1 and 9.0 there - what did you THINK would happen?


    Perhaps I was naive, but I THOUGHT it would work. Certainly there
    wasn't any indication during the upgrade process that I'd have to go
    download 5 different OS and go through the upgrade 5 different times.

    If something popped up on the screen and said "Sorry, you're stuck on
    7.2 until you upgrade to some intermediate step", I'd be having a
    different rant here, but I'd still be able to send mail and print.

  6. Re: Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr

    In article ,
    Nico Kadel-Garcia wrote:

    > wrote in message
    > news:1gsecvh.1xt5ganv4vlzyN%os7ly0h7lwxebir@jetabl e.org...
    > > Forgive me if this gets a little rantish, but there are rant-worthy
    > > elements of my experience.
    > >
    > > I just went from RH7.2 to FC1, basically by sticking the FC1 CD into the
    > > drive and rebooting.
    > >
    > > When it was all done, I found that the sendmail and lpr programs were
    > > gone.

    >
    > First, you should be using FC3. FC1 just fell off the support list.
    >
    > Second, stay calm. RedHat has been schizophrenically supporting both cups
    > and LPRng printing, both sendmail and postfix as well. You need to find the
    > packages and commands called something like "switch-printir" and
    > "switch-mailer" commands, which will generate a werd set symlinks into an
    > intermediate directory and a weird symlinks *out* of it to provide lpd, mail
    > and other basich shell commands.


    Thanks for your help!

    It turns out that this wasn't quite what wanted. But, armed with those
    keywords and several iterations of doing a web search, reading through
    the results (many irrelevant), doing more searches, more reading, etc.,
    I finally figured out what I needed to do.

    /usr/sbin/alternatives --auto mta
    /usr/sbin/alternatives --auto print

    These commands set up the links.

    No package actually owns files like /usr/sbin/sendmail, and you need
    this to create it.

    Alternatives were introduced in RH7.3, as far as I can tell. The
    upgrade process created the alternatives directories, but for some
    reason never actually took the obvious last step.

    > > WHAT???!!!
    > >
    > > I didn't have any special sendmail and lpr configuration before. It was
    > > just what RH7.2 gave me. But simply by upgrading, I find that I can't
    > > send mail or print anymore. That's pretty lame.
    > >
    > > I did a lot of poking, and I figure that the printing system changed.
    > > It uses CUPS now. I don't know what it used before. And there's
    > > supposed to be some sort of lpr interface, but for some reason the
    > > symbolic link that lpr was supposed to be isn't there. And I think the
    > > default MTA changed too.
    > >
    > > But still, even if they change the underlying package, the upgrade
    > > shouldn't leave me without the standard commands to send mail and print!

    >
    > You're right. It shouldn't But this is what you get for waiting 4 years
    > between OS upgrades, then upgrading from one deprecated OS to *ANOTHER*
    > deprecated OS that has also fallen off the support tree.


    OK, so first of all, this next bit isn't directed at you, Mr.
    Kadel-Garcia, because you have been very helpful, and I'm sure you don't
    set Red Hat and/or Fedora policy. You can just skip it, if you want.

    But I am saying that if Red Hat/Fedora is taking the attitude that
    you're not allowed make "big" upgrades, then they're out of touch.

    Clearly, if I had made this upgrade from RH7.2 to FC1 when FC1 was
    current, the same thing would have happened. So they can't use FC1
    isn't supported as an excuse. It's not like that bug just spontaneously
    appeared 6 months after it came out.

    The fact is, upgrading is a hassle, especially Red Hat products. I've
    had a lot of problems getting everything working again every time I
    upgrade, and if I can get away with waiting 4 years between them, you
    better believe I'm going to take it.

    Upgrades are hard. I can accept that. But if Red Hat and/or Fedora
    want to blame me for that -- I can't accept that.

  7. Re: Upgraded RH7.2 to FC1, but lost sendmail and lpr


    wrote in message
    news:1gsjwnt.688ze11imz2v4N%os7ly0h7lwxebir@jetabl e.org...
    > In article ,
    > Kevin Collins wrote:
    >
    >> I can't say for certain, but I made that same change about 6 months ago
    >> and I
    >> don't think that 7.2 -> FC1 is a "supported" upgrade. You bypassed 7.3,
    >> 8.0,
    >> 8.1 and 9.0 there - what did you THINK would happen?

    >
    > Perhaps I was naive, but I THOUGHT it would work. Certainly there
    > wasn't any indication during the upgrade process that I'd have to go
    > download 5 different OS and go through the upgrade 5 different times.
    >
    > If something popped up on the screen and said "Sorry, you're stuck on
    > 7.2 until you upgrade to some intermediate step", I'd be having a
    > different rant here, but I'd still be able to send mail and print.


    My concern was that FC1 is not a "supported" upgrade, because FC1 is no
    longer supported. Upgrading from an unsupported OS to another, more recent,
    but also unsupported OS is asking for grief.

    I'd have gone RH 7.2 to FC3, maybe FC2. There are a bunch of significant
    changes and FC has been evolving: the switch to the FC naming and
    structures, the 2.6 kernel introduced with FC2, the discarding of LPRng with
    FC2 or FC3, the switch to xorg instead of XFree86, etc. would be easier to
    do right now while doing the basic upgrade rather than next year.

    The skip over the intervening OS's was probably a good idea, that would have
    introduced all sorts of fun whackinesses and uncertainties and potential
    breakages.



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