NTFS access in Linux - Questions

This is a discussion on NTFS access in Linux - Questions ; Gentlefolk, I am running a dual boot Win2K/Linux system. I have a Windows partition that contains the OS and programs, my Linux partitions, and a 20GB User partition where I store files, pictures, MP3s etc. I have been running Paragon's ...

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Thread: NTFS access in Linux

  1. NTFS access in Linux

    Gentlefolk,

    I am running a dual boot Win2K/Linux system. I have a Windows partition
    that contains the OS and programs, my Linux partitions, and a 20GB User
    partition where I store files, pictures, MP3s etc. I have been running
    Paragon's Mount Anything 3.0 on Win98, and it has worked fine in
    allowing Win98 (old OS) to access the Ext3 User partition (/dev/hda8).
    I tried formatting the 20GB partition as FAT32 (which Win98 was fine
    with), but Red hat would tell me that the partition was too large (I am
    assuming that was because it was larger than 2GB).

    I have moved one machine to Win2K Pro, beginning to migrate 3 of my
    systems off 98/Me. Win2K won't recognize Ext 2 or 3 natively, and Mount
    Anything does not appear to allow partition access, either (tells me
    that the partition needs to be formatted).

    I have been running Red Hat 8 (which Red Hat has stopped supporting),
    and have downloaded Fedora as a replacement. I also have a Knoppix disk
    that I use for emergency access. Knoppix allows access to an NTFS
    partition natively. Fedora does not.

    I seem to be stuck. If I format the User partition as Ext3, I can't
    access it from Win2K. If I format as NTFS, I can't access from
    Fedora/Linux.

    Questions (my most humble thanks in advance):
    1) Is there a Linux version that will recognize NTFS, and read/write to
    it? Is one better than another? Would FAT32 be a better choice (not
    what I want to do, since FAT32 does not have file access permissions)?

    2) Does anyone have any experience with "Mount Everything", and can you
    give me a clue why it might not be working on Win2K Pro (their web site
    says it should work).

    Thanks for your time and brainpower on my behalf.

    Mark Danehy
    nospam*markdanehy@verizon.net*nospam


  2. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    Mark Danehy wrote:

    > Questions (my most humble thanks in advance):
    > 1) Is there a Linux version that will recognize NTFS, and read/write to
    > it? Is one better than another? Would FAT32 be a better choice (not
    > what I want to do, since FAT32 does not have file access permissions)?

    Kernel 2.6.0 and up supports read/write to ntfs. Kernel 2.4 supports
    ntfs read access and has experimental support for writing to ntfs. If I
    were you, I'd grab the new version of the linux kernel (www.kernel.org),
    compile it with ntfs read/write support and see what happens. ntfs write
    support is pretty new so you might want to make a separate partition
    where you can put the files you want to transfer between systems, but
    that would just to be on the safe side.

    > 2) Does anyone have any experience with "Mount Everything", and can you
    > give me a clue why it might not be working on Win2K Pro (their web site
    > says it should work).

    I don't have experience with "Mount Everything" so I can't say.

    Good luck!

  3. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    On Tue, 20 Jan 2004 23:17:56 -0800, Big Toe
    wrote:

    >Mark Danehy wrote:
    >
    >> Questions (my most humble thanks in advance):
    >> 1) Is there a Linux version that will recognize NTFS, and read/write to
    >> it? Is one better than another? Would FAT32 be a better choice (not
    >> what I want to do, since FAT32 does not have file access permissions)?

    >Kernel 2.6.0 and up supports read/write to ntfs. Kernel 2.4 supports
    >ntfs read access and has experimental support for writing to ntfs. If I
    >were you, I'd grab the new version of the linux kernel (www.kernel.org),
    >compile it with ntfs read/write support and see what happens. ntfs write
    >support is pretty new so you might want to make a separate partition
    >where you can put the files you want to transfer between systems, but
    >that would just to be on the safe side.
    >
    >> 2) Does anyone have any experience with "Mount Everything", and can you
    >> give me a clue why it might not be working on Win2K Pro (their web site
    >> says it should work).

    >I don't have experience with "Mount Everything" so I can't say.
    >
    >Good luck!


    I bought mount everything. It's crap. Won't install, the docs refer
    to things that don't exist, and tech support never replies to you.

    Would the OP please google:groups 'linux NTFS R/W' - this has been a
    long term ongoing discussion in several places, and I don't feel like
    recapping for someone who hasn't mastered a search engine.

    There are several approaches to doing what you want to do.

    Mike-

    Mornings: Evolution in action. Only the grumpy will survive.
    -----------------------------------------------------

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    installed site-wide spam filters at catherders.com. If
    email from you bounces, try non-HTML, non-encoded,
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  4. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    Mark Danehy commented:

    > Gentlefolk,
    >
    > I am running a dual boot Win2K/Linux system. I have a Windows partition
    > that contains the OS and programs, my Linux partitions, and a 20GB User
    > partition where I store files, pictures, MP3s etc. I have been running
    > Paragon's Mount Anything 3.0 on Win98, and it has worked fine in
    > allowing Win98 (old OS) to access the Ext3 User partition (/dev/hda8).
    > I tried formatting the 20GB partition as FAT32 (which Win98 was fine
    > with), but Red hat would tell me that the partition was too large (I am
    > assuming that was because it was larger than 2GB).
    >
    > I have moved one machine to Win2K Pro, beginning to migrate 3 of my
    > systems off 98/Me. Win2K won't recognize Ext 2 or 3 natively, and Mount
    > Anything does not appear to allow partition access, either (tells me
    > that the partition needs to be formatted).
    >
    > I have been running Red Hat 8 (which Red Hat has stopped supporting),
    > and have downloaded Fedora as a replacement. I also have a Knoppix disk
    > that I use for emergency access. Knoppix allows access to an NTFS
    > partition natively. Fedora does not.
    >
    > I seem to be stuck. If I format the User partition as Ext3, I can't
    > access it from Win2K. If I format as NTFS, I can't access from
    > Fedora/Linux.
    >
    > Questions (my most humble thanks in advance):
    > 1) Is there a Linux version that will recognize NTFS, and read/write to
    > it? Is one better than another? Would FAT32 be a better choice (not
    > what I want to do, since FAT32 does not have file access permissions)?
    >
    > 2) Does anyone have any experience with "Mount Everything", and can you
    > give me a clue why it might not be working on Win2K Pro (their web site
    > says it should work).
    >
    > Thanks for your time and brainpower on my behalf.
    >
    > Mark Danehy
    > nospam*markdanehy@verizon.net*nospam


    Redhat (and Fedora) are the only distros I know of that do not support NTFS
    from a default install. Most others atleast read NTFS.

    If you want something universal, try vfat. Although it doesn't have any
    security or journaling and is pretty old. Atleast both Win and Lin
    read/write to it.

    --
    ---
    Dark Forest Mud
    http://www.darkforestmud.net

  5. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    Jason wrote:


    >
    > Redhat (and Fedora) are the only distros I know of that do not support NTFS
    > from a default install. Most others atleast read NTFS.
    >
    > If you want something universal, try vfat. Although it doesn't have any
    > security or journaling and is pretty old. Atleast both Win and Lin
    > read/write to it.
    >


    I did try vfat, but got an error message stating that the partition was
    too large (20GB). If I understood correctly, Linux will only format a
    2GB vfat partition.


  6. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    Mark Danehy wrote:

    > I did try vfat, but got an error message stating that the partition was
    > too large (20GB). If I understood correctly, Linux will only format a
    > 2GB vfat partition.


    A FAT partition will only support up to 2GB in size because the file
    allocation table is only 16 bits. You want to create a FAT32 partition
    and that will allow you to create a 20GB partition.

  7. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    Big Toe wrote:
    > Mark Danehy wrote:
    >
    >
    >> I did try vfat, but got an error message stating that the partition
    >> was too large (20GB). If I understood correctly, Linux will only
    >> format a 2GB vfat partition.

    >
    >
    > A FAT partition will only support up to 2GB in size because the file
    > allocation table is only 16 bits. You want to create a FAT32 partition
    > and that will allow you to create a 20GB partition.


    Formatted using win95 format (as fat32). Red Hat 8 would not accept a
    20GB fat32 partition. Told me partition was too large.

    Thanks for the thought, though.

    Mark


  8. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 01:05:28 GMT, Jason
    wrote:

    >Mark Danehy commented:
    >
    >> 1) Is there a Linux version that will recognize NTFS, and read/write to
    >> it? Is one better than another? Would FAT32 be a better choice (not
    >> what I want to do, since FAT32 does not have file access permissions)?


    The OP has two options to access NTFS under Linux.

    1) NTFS Tools - This allows READ-ONLY access, but also allows
    creating/resizing partitions and the like. Found here:
    http://linux-ntfs.sourceforge.net/

    BTW, they now have a Fedora rpm.

    2) Captive - This utility wraps the native Windows NTFS driver a la
    WINE and allows full read/write access - but only file access, nothing
    else (i.e., partition creation, etc.). However it does apparently
    work (i.e., both installed) with NTFS tools. Found here:
    http://www.jankratochvil.net/project/captive/

    That said, FAT32 is a better choice as it is completely and safely
    read-write accessible from Linux.


    --
    Richard Steven Hack
    "Whatever does not kill me makes me stronger" -
    and YOU have not killed me!

  9. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 06:05:19 +0000, Mark Danehy wrote:

    > 1) Is there a Linux version that will recognize NTFS, and read/write to
    > it? Is one better than another? Would FAT32 be a better choice (not
    > what I want to do, since FAT32 does not have file access permissions)?


    The raw kernel from kernel.org has supported NTFS for some time now,
    though it wasn't stable even in read-only mode until rougnly 2.4.17ish.
    The folks at the linux-NTFS project have since rewritten the NTFS support
    from scratch, providing better read performance and EXTREMELY LIMITED
    write access. You can not have full write access to NTFS at this time,
    but read support is perfectly stable. The newer modules have been
    backported by many distros into the 2.4 kernel, and is also provided as a
    kernel patch at linux-ntfs.sourceforge.net

    If you're going to use Fedora or RedHat, you must either (a) recompile
    your kernel to support NTFS, or (b) install the provided RPMs at the same
    website mentioned above. RedHat doesn't support NTFS in their kernels
    because they fear it may violate patent or copyright laws, for the same
    reason they don't provide .mp3 support.

    Now, in regards to your fat32 partition, I just formatted a 30GB partition
    in RedHat 9 without any problems. All you need to do is format the
    command as follows:

    mkfs.msdos /dev/hd(whatever) -F 32

    specifying "-F 32" informs the program to use a 32-bit file allocation
    table, thereby supporting large partitions.

    I hope this helps!

    -Matthew

  10. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    Kernel 2.6 NTFS write access is still experimental. It says it allows write
    access only if the file size doesn't change or something like that. I
    wouldn't recommend that as a solution. You would think someone out there
    would have written a proper driver to access the ext2 or 3 file system from
    Windows. After all, that source code isn't locked away in a vault with a
    Fort Knox security system.

    "Big Toe" wrote in message
    news:2_mdnUT4Tf47upPdRVn-hg@comcast.com...
    > Mark Danehy wrote:
    >
    > > Questions (my most humble thanks in advance):
    > > 1) Is there a Linux version that will recognize NTFS, and read/write to
    > > it? Is one better than another? Would FAT32 be a better choice (not
    > > what I want to do, since FAT32 does not have file access permissions)?

    > Kernel 2.6.0 and up supports read/write to ntfs. Kernel 2.4 supports
    > ntfs read access and has experimental support for writing to ntfs. If I
    > were you, I'd grab the new version of the linux kernel (www.kernel.org),
    > compile it with ntfs read/write support and see what happens. ntfs write
    > support is pretty new so you might want to make a separate partition
    > where you can put the files you want to transfer between systems, but
    > that would just to be on the safe side.
    >
    > > 2) Does anyone have any experience with "Mount Everything", and can you
    > > give me a clue why it might not be working on Win2K Pro (their web site
    > > says it should work).

    > I don't have experience with "Mount Everything" so I can't say.
    >
    > Good luck!




  11. Re: NTFS access in Linux

    On Mon, 16 Feb 2004 17:42:10 GMT, "Infopackrat"
    wrote:

    >Kernel 2.6 NTFS write access is still experimental. It says it allows write
    >access only if the file size doesn't change or something like that. I
    >wouldn't recommend that as a solution. You would think someone out there
    >would have written a proper driver to access the ext2 or 3 file system from
    >Windows. After all, that source code isn't locked away in a vault with a
    >Fort Knox security system.
    >
    >"Big Toe" wrote in message
    >news:2_mdnUT4Tf47upPdRVn-hg@comcast.com...
    >> Mark Danehy wrote:
    >>
    >> > Questions (my most humble thanks in advance):
    >> > 1) Is there a Linux version that will recognize NTFS, and read/write to
    >> > it? Is one better than another? Would FAT32 be a better choice (not
    >> > what I want to do, since FAT32 does not have file access permissions)?

    >> Kernel 2.6.0 and up supports read/write to ntfs. Kernel 2.4 supports
    >> ntfs read access and has experimental support for writing to ntfs. If I
    >> were you, I'd grab the new version of the linux kernel (www.kernel.org),
    >> compile it with ntfs read/write support and see what happens. ntfs write
    >> support is pretty new so you might want to make a separate partition
    >> where you can put the files you want to transfer between systems, but
    >> that would just to be on the safe side.
    >>
    >> > 2) Does anyone have any experience with "Mount Everything", and can you
    >> > give me a clue why it might not be working on Win2K Pro (their web site
    >> > says it should work).

    >> I don't have experience with "Mount Everything" so I can't say.
    >>
    >> Good luck!

    >


    If you looked at google (either web sites or groups - there have been
    at least 5 other threads on this subject within the last 2 months)
    you'd learn more than you ever want to on the subject, including that
    mount everything doesn't work and that there's a perfectly good,
    distro agnostic, free method of doing NTFS-RW from linux.

    Mike-

    Mornings: Evolution in action. Only the grumpy will survive.
    -----------------------------------------------------

    Please note - Due to the intense volume of spam, we have
    installed site-wide spam filters at catherders.com. If
    email from you bounces, try non-HTML, non-encoded,
    non-attachments.


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