Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2 - Protocols

This is a discussion on Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2 - Protocols ; We have a requirment an FTP connection over SSL from our system to an external provider. I pulled the latest daily build kit down and rebuilt using the SSL option. @ckvker.com s D "CK_SSL, NODEBUG" Which resulted in this version ...

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Thread: Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2

  1. Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2

    We have a requirment an FTP connection over SSL from our system to an
    external provider. I pulled the latest daily build kit down and
    rebuilt using the SSL option.

    @ckvker.com s D "CK_SSL, NODEBUG"

    Which resulted in this version of kermit:

    C-Kermit 8.0.212 Dev.13, 9 Feb 2006, for OpenVMS Alpha
    Copyright (C) 1985, 2006,
    Trustees of Columbia University in the City of New York.
    Type ? or HELP for help.
    UTILITY:[KERMIT.SOURCE] C-Kermit>

    Following the examples in the security guide, I am running into
    problems. The SET FTP commands do not seem to exist in this
    executable I built.

    UTILITY:[KERMIT.SOURCE] C-Kermit>set ftp ?No keywords match - ftp
    UTILITY:[KERMIT.SOURCE] C-Kermit>set

    So, can anyone help me get past this problem?

    Thanks,

    Dave Harrold

    .................................................. .............................
    David Harrold E-Mail: David.Harrold@aurora.org
    Lead Software Systems Engineer Phone: (414) 647-6204
    Pager: (414) 941-4634
    Aurora Health Care Fax: (414) 647-4999
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  2. Re: Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2

    On 2006-02-24, Dave Harrold wrote:

    (Referring to the latest C-Kermit build

    http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/ckdaily.html

    : We have a requirment an FTP connection over SSL from our system to an
    : external provider. I pulled the latest daily build kit down and
    : rebuilt using the SSL option.
    :
    : @ckvker.com s D "CK_SSL, NODEBUG"
    :
    : Which resulted in this version of kermit:
    :
    : C-Kermit 8.0.212 Dev.13, 9 Feb 2006, for OpenVMS Alpha
    : Copyright (C) 1985, 2006,
    : Trustees of Columbia University in the City of New York.
    : Type ? or HELP for help.
    : UTILITY:[KERMIT.SOURCE] C-Kermit>
    :
    : Following the examples in the security guide, I am running into
    : problems. The SET FTP commands do not seem to exist in this
    : executable I built.
    :
    Right, as noted on the website the FTP client is available only in
    the Unix version of C-Kermit and in Kermit 95.

    : UTILITY:[KERMIT.SOURCE] C-Kermit>set ftp ?No keywords match - ftp
    : UTILITY:[KERMIT.SOURCE] C-Kermit>set
    :
    : So, can anyone help me get past this problem?
    :
    Only by adapting the FTP module (ckcftp.c) to VMS. This would be a
    rather major undertaking, even by someone who would know how to do it:

    . DEC C programmer
    . RMS programming for accessing the local file system
    . Familiarity with the various TCP/IP stacks used in VMS
    . Familiarity with FTP and security protocols
    . Familiarity with VMS-specific FTP protocols

    Over the last few years I've spoken to almost everyone who has this set of
    skills, but none of them has time to work on it, although everyone agrees it
    would be a great addition to the VMS toolbag, if it were done: a secure,
    scriptable FTP client for VMS.

    - Frank

  3. Re: Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2

    Frank da Cruz wrote:
    >
    > On 2006-02-24, Dave Harrold wrote:
    >
    > (Referring to the latest C-Kermit build
    >
    > http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/ckdaily.html
    >
    > : We have a requirment an FTP connection over SSL from our system to an
    > : external provider. I pulled the latest daily build kit down and
    > : rebuilt using the SSL option.
    > :
    > : @ckvker.com s D "CK_SSL, NODEBUG"
    > :
    > : Which resulted in this version of kermit:
    > :
    > : C-Kermit 8.0.212 Dev.13, 9 Feb 2006, for OpenVMS Alpha
    > : Copyright (C) 1985, 2006,
    > : Trustees of Columbia University in the City of New York.
    > : Type ? or HELP for help.
    > : UTILITY:[KERMIT.SOURCE] C-Kermit>
    > :
    > : Following the examples in the security guide, I am running into
    > : problems. The SET FTP commands do not seem to exist in this
    > : executable I built.
    > :
    > Right, as noted on the website the FTP client is available only in
    > the Unix version of C-Kermit and in Kermit 95.
    >
    > : UTILITY:[KERMIT.SOURCE] C-Kermit>set ftp ?No keywords match - ftp
    > : UTILITY:[KERMIT.SOURCE] C-Kermit>set
    > :
    > : So, can anyone help me get past this problem?
    > :
    > Only by adapting the FTP module (ckcftp.c) to VMS. This would be a
    > rather major undertaking, even by someone who would know how to do it:
    >
    > . DEC C programmer


    I thought those were fairly common.

    > . RMS programming for accessing the local file system


    Use the C built-ins?

    > . Familiarity with the various TCP/IP stacks used in VMS


    Use the UCX specifications. PSC products provide "UCX emulation", if I'm
    not too badly mistaken.

    > . Familiarity with FTP and security protocols


    I thought those were fairly common.

    > . Familiarity with VMS-specific FTP protocols


    I wasn't aware there were any, since TCP/IP is a layered product and not
    so much "built into" the kernel, as in UN*X-land. ...unless, of course,
    you're talking about file naming conventions and trying to translate
    between VMS and platforms where filespecs are more "free form".

    (DBT: Please relate this to my off-group e-mail.)

    --
    David J Dachtera
    dba DJE Systems
    http://www.djesys.com/

    Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/

    Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:
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    http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/

    Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/

  4. Re: Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2

    David J Dachtera wrote:
    > Frank da Cruz wrote:
    >
    >>On 2006-02-24, Dave Harrold wrote:
    >>


    >
    >> . RMS programming for accessing the local file system

    >
    >
    > Use the C built-ins?


    I don't think these are very versitile in handling all
    the attributes VMS files have. Especially with Indexed
    files.

    >
    >> . Familiarity with VMS-specific FTP protocols

    >
    >
    > I wasn't aware there were any, since TCP/IP is a layered product and not
    > so much "built into" the kernel, as in UN*X-land. ...unless, of course,
    > you're talking about file naming conventions and trying to translate
    > between VMS and platforms where filespecs are more "free form".


    Don't VMS FTP products usually have some "extra" stuff for
    transferring RMS attributes, such as Indexes, block sizes,
    etc. These don't usually survive a trip through non-VMS
    machines, and are often necessary to make a file usable on
    VMS.

    You could ignore the attributes, but then you'd be stuck
    with transferring text files or binaty files only.

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  5. Re: Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2

    Kevin Handy wrote:
    >
    > David J Dachtera wrote:
    > > Frank da Cruz wrote:
    > >
    > >>On 2006-02-24, Dave Harrold wrote:
    > >>

    >
    > >
    > >> . RMS programming for accessing the local file system

    > >
    > >
    > > Use the C built-ins?

    >
    > I don't think these are very versitile in handling all
    > the attributes VMS files have. Especially with Indexed
    > files.


    Indexed files are inappropriate candidates for FTP, in many cases.

    > >
    > >> . Familiarity with VMS-specific FTP protocols

    > >
    > >
    > > I wasn't aware there were any, since TCP/IP is a layered product and not
    > > so much "built into" the kernel, as in UN*X-land. ...unless, of course,
    > > you're talking about file naming conventions and trying to translate
    > > between VMS and platforms where filespecs are more "free form".

    >
    > Don't VMS FTP products usually have some "extra" stuff for
    > transferring RMS attributes, such as Indexes, block sizes,
    > etc.


    Depends.

    Multinet transfers RMS files to Multinet successfully, but not to UCX.

    Can't say about TCPware.

    UCX transfers RMS files to UCX successfully (according to the doc.'s -
    I've yet to see it work as late as V5.4 ECO-4), but not to Multinet.

    > These don't usually


    ....try "never"...

    > survive a trip through non-VMS
    > machines, and are often necessary to make a file usable on
    > VMS.


    --
    David J Dachtera
    dba DJE Systems
    http://www.djesys.com/

    Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/

    Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/

    Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/

    Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/

  6. Re: Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2

    David J Dachtera wrote:
    >
    > Multinet transfers RMS files to Multinet successfully, but not to UCX.
    >
    > Can't say about TCPware.
    >
    > UCX transfers RMS files to UCX successfully (according to the doc.'s -
    > I've yet to see it work as late as V5.4 ECO-4), but not to Multinet.
    >

    Both MultiNet and TCPware support UCX's FDL method of transferring
    files and preserving attributes. When a file is transferred in FDL
    mode, an .FDL file is created and transferred to (using PUT/FDL
    and GET/FDL).

    MultiNet, TCPware, and HGFTP all support STRU O VMS, which is a
    cleaner method for preserving attributes, as no external FDL file
    is required. The FDL method has the benefit of preserving attributes
    when an interim, non-VMS system is used. UCX has never implemented
    support for STRU O VMS (which was a protocol designed by TGV).

    Hunter
    ------
    Hunter Goatley, Process Software, http://www.process.com/
    PreciseMail Anti-Spam Gateway for OpenVMS, Tru64, Solaris, & Linux
    goathunter@goatley.com

  7. Re: Building SSL support on VMS V7.3-2

    Hunter Goatley wrote:
    >
    > David J Dachtera wrote:
    > >
    > > Multinet transfers RMS files to Multinet successfully, but not to UCX.
    > >
    > > Can't say about TCPware.
    > >
    > > UCX transfers RMS files to UCX successfully (according to the doc.'s -
    > > I've yet to see it work as late as V5.4 ECO-4), but not to Multinet.
    > >

    > Both MultiNet and TCPware support UCX's FDL method of transferring
    > files and preserving attributes. When a file is transferred in FDL
    > mode, an .FDL file is created and transferred to (using PUT/FDL
    > and GET/FDL).
    >
    > MultiNet, TCPware, and HGFTP all support STRU O VMS, which is a
    > cleaner method for preserving attributes, as no external FDL file
    > is required. The FDL method has the benefit of preserving attributes
    > when an interim, non-VMS system is used. UCX has never implemented
    > support for STRU O VMS (which was a protocol designed by TGV).


    AH! Much thanx for that bit of enlightenment, Hunter!

    --
    David J Dachtera
    dba DJE Systems
    http://www.djesys.com/

    Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/

    Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/

    Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/

    Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/

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