How do I "see" a hard drive? - Powerpc

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Thread: How do I "see" a hard drive?

  1. How do I "see" a hard drive?

    I have a problem with my MacMini that I have a feeling is actually a dead
    hard drive but before I send it away for repair (it's still under warranty
    so I don't want to try to crack it open myself) I want to try to recover as
    much data from it as possible (I've been using it as a "media" computer and
    there are quite a few radio recordings on there that I haven't listened to
    yet and that are now completely unavailable).

    I have one more test I want to run that I don't have enough knowledge to
    do - hopefully somebody can help.

    My first hope was to try to reinstall OSX but I get halfway through the
    setup procedure and it fails to list any possible destinations to install it
    to. I also ran the Hardware test (on the Mac Install CD) which reported that
    all hardware is working correctly!

    I thought I'd try to run a Live Linux CD (ROCK Linux) which is successful
    and have got KDE going but I still can't "see" any hard drives (the file
    manager program lists a "hard drive" but that appears to be the CD that I've
    booted from. This is roughly where my Linux knowledge ends!

    The questions are these:

    1. Having booted the Mac with Linux, should I be able to "see" the Mac hard
    drive?

    2. If I should be able to "see" it, how do I go about that? ie do I need to
    mount it from the command prompt before starting Xwindows? If so, exactly
    what should I type in?







  2. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    "JohnW" writes:
    >1. Having booted the Mac with Linux, should I be able to "see" the Mac hard
    >drive?


    Just type

    fdisk /dev/hda

    at a shell command line. By pressing "p", you can see the partitions.

    >2. If I should be able to "see" it, how do I go about that? ie do I need to
    >mount it from the command prompt before starting Xwindows? If so, exactly
    >what should I type in?


    If your CD does not mount the partitions automatically, you can mount
    them manually with

    mkdir /mnt/hda2 #make a mount point
    mount /dev/hda2 -t ext3 -o ro /mnt/hda2

    That's assuming you have an ext3 file system on the partition hda2,
    and you want to mount it read-only.

    However, what I would do is to get an USB disk of at least the size of
    the internal disk, and then just copy it over as a whole, like this:

    dd if=/dev/hda of=/dev/sda

    Assuming the USB disk is known to Linux as sda (you can check this
    with dmesg). After you get your new disk, just dump the data back on
    the internal disk with

    dd if=/dev/sda of=/dev/hda

    Or you could just take the drive from the USB enclosure and put it in
    the Mac Mini.

    Alternatively, if you have a file system on the USB drive that can
    deal with large files, you can mount the file system like this:

    mount /dev/sda1 -t ext3 /mnt

    and then copy the contents of the internal disk on a file:

    dd if=/dev/hda of=/mnt/copy-of-hda

    In this case you cannot just put the drive in your Mac Mini.

    - anton
    --
    M. Anton Ertl Some things have to be seen to be believed
    anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at Most things have to be believed to be seen
    http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/home.html

  3. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    On 2006-04-24, Anton Ertl wrote:
    > "JohnW" writes:
    >>1. Having booted the Mac with Linux, should I be able to "see" the Mac hard
    >>drive?

    >
    > Just type
    >
    > fdisk /dev/hda
    >
    > at a shell command line. By pressing "p", you can see the partitions.


    This might not work if the Mini is PPC. Try

    mac-fdisk -l /dev/hda

    >>2. If I should be able to "see" it, how do I go about that? ie do I need to
    >>mount it from the command prompt before starting Xwindows? If so, exactly
    >>what should I type in?

    >
    > If your CD does not mount the partitions automatically, you can mount
    > them manually with
    >
    > mkdir /mnt/hda2 #make a mount point
    > mount /dev/hda2 -t ext3 -o ro /mnt/hda2
    >
    > That's assuming you have an ext3 file system on the partition hda2,
    > and you want to mount it read-only.


    The OP mentioned that there's at least one OS X install on the disk.
    It's probably HFS+, so -t hfs or -t hfs+ may or may not work. The
    hfstools utilities might work for plain HFS, or his live CD might
    include hfs+tools.

    > However, what I would do is to get an USB disk of at least the size of
    > the internal disk, and then just copy it over as a whole, like this:
    >
    > dd if=/dev/hda of=/dev/sda
    >
    > Assuming the USB disk is known to Linux as sda (you can check this
    > with dmesg). After you get your new disk, just dump the data back on
    > the internal disk with
    >
    > dd if=/dev/sda of=/dev/hda


    This isn't a bad idea. If the OP has a spare OS X box lying around, he
    can verify that the dd worked by trying to mount the USB disk on that
    machine.

    --keith

    --
    kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us
    (try just my userid to email me)
    AOLSFAQ=http://wombat.san-francisco.ca.us/cgi-bin/fom
    see X- headers for PGP signature information


  4. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    Hash: SHA1

    Anton Ertl wrote:
    > "JohnW" writes:
    >> 1. Having booted the Mac with Linux, should I be able to "see" the Mac hard
    >> drive?

    >
    > Just type
    >
    > fdisk /dev/hda
    >
    > at a shell command line. By pressing "p", you can see the partitions.


    Safer would be to
    cat /proc/partitions

    but if you /must/ use fdisk to see partitions, use
    fdisk -l /dev/hda

    which lists the partitions, and does not drop you into the fdisk command
    interpreter. This is safer because it ensures that you don't
    inadvertently repartition or reformat your hard disk.


    >> 2. If I should be able to "see" it, how do I go about that? ie do I need to
    >> mount it from the command prompt before starting Xwindows? If so, exactly
    >> what should I type in?

    >
    > If your CD does not mount the partitions automatically, you can mount
    > them manually with
    >
    > mkdir /mnt/hda2 #make a mount point
    > mount /dev/hda2 -t ext3 -o ro /mnt/hda2


    For Mac OSX filesystems, you likely should use hfs rather than ext3

    [snip]



    - --

    Lew Pitcher, IT Specialist, Corporate Technology Solutions,
    Enterprise Technology Solutions, TD Bank Financial Group

    (Opinions expressed here are my own, not my employer's)
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  5. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    Keith Keller writes:
    >On 2006-04-24, Anton Ertl wrote:
    >> "JohnW" writes:
    >>>1. Having booted the Mac with Linux, should I be able to "see" the Mac hard
    >>>drive?

    >>
    >> Just type
    >>
    >> fdisk /dev/hda
    >>
    >> at a shell command line. By pressing "p", you can see the partitions.

    >
    >This might not work if the Mini is PPC.


    Hmm, it works with my iBook, which has a PPC (and I guess the OP has
    one, too, given the newsgroup we are posting in. Ah, I see:

    [b6:/etc:971]# ls -l /sbin/fdisk
    lrwxr-xr-x 1 root root 9 Nov 12 2004 /sbin/fdisk -> mac-fdisk*

    This might be a Debian specialty, so mac-fdisk is probably the generic
    solution.

    - anton
    --
    M. Anton Ertl Some things have to be seen to be believed
    anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at Most things have to be believed to be seen
    http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/home.html

  6. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    Anton Ertl wrote:
    > Keith Keller writes:
    >
    >>On 2006-04-24, Anton Ertl wrote:
    >>
    >>>"JohnW" writes:
    >>>
    >>>>1. Having booted the Mac with Linux, should I be able to "see" the Mac hard
    >>>>drive?
    >>>
    >>>Just type
    >>>
    >>>fdisk /dev/hda
    >>>
    >>>at a shell command line. By pressing "p", you can see the partitions.

    >>
    >>This might not work if the Mini is PPC.

    >
    >
    > Hmm, it works with my iBook, which has a PPC (and I guess the OP has
    > one, too, given the newsgroup we are posting in. Ah, I see:
    >
    > [b6:/etc:971]# ls -l /sbin/fdisk
    > lrwxr-xr-x 1 root root 9 Nov 12 2004 /sbin/fdisk -> mac-fdisk*
    >
    > This might be a Debian specialty, so mac-fdisk is probably the generic
    > solution.
    >
    > - anton

    You would be better off using Disk Utility from an Install CD and
    repairing permissions or verifying the disk.

  7. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    On 2006-04-24, Lew Pitcher wrote:
    >
    > Safer would be to
    > cat /proc/partitions
    >
    > but if you /must/ use fdisk to see partitions, use
    > fdisk -l /dev/hda


    Catting /proc/partitions might be safer, but fdisk -l seems more
    informative to me e.g. fdisk -l will show you partition types, which
    might help determine the filesystem currently on the partition, and also
    shows the actual start and end of the partition.

    --keith

    --
    kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us
    (try just my userid to email me)
    AOLSFAQ=http://wombat.san-francisco.ca.us/cgi-bin/fom
    see X- headers for PGP signature information


  8. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?


    "Keith Keller" wrote in message
    news:7dtvh3xoue.ln2@goaway.wombat.san-francisco.ca.us...
    > On 2006-04-24, Lew Pitcher wrote:
    >>
    >> Safer would be to
    >> cat /proc/partitions
    >>
    >> but if you /must/ use fdisk to see partitions, use
    >> fdisk -l /dev/hda

    >
    > Catting /proc/partitions might be safer, but fdisk -l seems more
    > informative to me e.g. fdisk -l will show you partition types, which
    > might help determine the filesystem currently on the partition, and also
    > shows the actual start and end of the partition.
    >
    > --keith


    Thanks - I'm a bit more hopeful of recovering my data - the longer it takes
    and the harder it is the more I learn so as far as I'm concerned, every
    cloud has a silver lining!

    Here's what I've managed-
    If try to run fdisk in any of the forms that anyone has mentioned so far I
    simply get "bash: fdisk: command not found"
    The most useful thing I've managedso far is catting /proc/partitions to
    which I get the following:

    Major minor blocks name
    7 0 425552 loop0
    3 0 78150744 hda
    3 1 31 hda1
    3 2 131072 hda2
    3 3 78019635 hda3
    3 4 5 hda4

    I assume that loop0 is the bytes on the CDROM and, the 78150744 is the size
    of the hard drive (its an 80G drive)

    now I think I have two more questions:
    1. Can I actually get a directory listing? I've tried most of the "mount"
    options you've all suggested here's a few of the results:-
    I type: mount /dev/hda3
    response: mount: can't find /dev/hda3 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab
    I type: mkdir /mnt/hda2
    response: mkdir: cannot create directory '/mnt/hda2': Permission Denied
    2. Anton suggested using dd if=/dev/hda of=/dev/sda to copy the whole lot to
    an external hard drive. I have a big enough drive with plenty of space on it
    but it's not empty. This is my backup disk - will I be able to do what I
    need to without destroying the data that's already on there? Do I need any
    more switches? The USB drive is formatted as FAT32 (so that I can use it on
    a variety of computers in the house) is this a problem?



  9. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    "JohnW" writes:


    >"Keith Keller" wrote in message
    >news:7dtvh3xoue.ln2@goaway.wombat.san-francisco.ca.us...
    >> On 2006-04-24, Lew Pitcher wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Safer would be to
    >>> cat /proc/partitions
    >>>
    >>> but if you /must/ use fdisk to see partitions, use
    >>> fdisk -l /dev/hda

    >>
    >> Catting /proc/partitions might be safer, but fdisk -l seems more
    >> informative to me e.g. fdisk -l will show you partition types, which
    >> might help determine the filesystem currently on the partition, and also
    >> shows the actual start and end of the partition.
    >>
    >> --keith


    >Thanks - I'm a bit more hopeful of recovering my data - the longer it takes
    >and the harder it is the more I learn so as far as I'm concerned, every
    >cloud has a silver lining!


    >Here's what I've managed-
    >If try to run fdisk in any of the forms that anyone has mentioned so far I
    >simply get "bash: fdisk: command not found"


    Run as root, not as user.
    It is in /sbin/fdisk

    >The most useful thing I've managedso far is catting /proc/partitions to
    >which I get the following:


    >Major minor blocks name
    >7 0 425552 loop0
    >3 0 78150744 hda
    >3 1 31 hda1
    >3 2 131072 hda2
    >3 3 78019635 hda3
    >3 4 5 hda4


    >I assume that loop0 is the bytes on the CDROM and, the 78150744 is the size
    >of the hard drive (its an 80G drive)


    >now I think I have two more questions:
    >1. Can I actually get a directory listing? I've tried most of the "mount"
    >options you've all suggested here's a few of the results:-
    >I type: mount /dev/hda3
    >response: mount: can't find /dev/hda3 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab


    So you have to tell it where to mount the stuff.

    mkdir /mnt/hda
    mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda


    >I type: mkdir /mnt/hda2
    >response: mkdir: cannot create directory '/mnt/hda2': Permission Denied


    YOU ARE NOT RUNNING AS ROOT!!!
    Do so.

    >2. Anton suggested using dd if=/dev/hda of=/dev/sda to copy the whole lot to
    >an external hard drive. I have a big enough drive with plenty of space on it
    >but it's not empty. This is my backup disk - will I be able to do what I


    Then that would be a complete disaster. Buy a new hard drive with the same
    size as the old one and do that. But do not do it to a hard drive with
    content, or that content will be lost.

    That is the way forensic auditors do it, to make sure then do not damage or
    alter the original.


    >need to without destroying the data that's already on there? Do I need any
    >more switches? The USB drive is formatted as FAT32 (so that I can use it on
    >a variety of computers in the house) is this a problem?


    What usb drive?



  10. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?


    "Unruh" wrote in message
    news:e2ls7a$g$2@nntp.itservices.ubc.ca...
    > "JohnW" writes:
    >
    >
    >>"Keith Keller" wrote in
    >>message
    >>news:7dtvh3xoue.ln2@goaway.wombat.san-francisco.ca.us...
    >>> On 2006-04-24, Lew Pitcher wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>> Safer would be to
    >>>> cat /proc/partitions
    >>>>
    >>>> but if you /must/ use fdisk to see partitions, use
    >>>> fdisk -l /dev/hda
    >>>
    >>> Catting /proc/partitions might be safer, but fdisk -l seems more
    >>> informative to me e.g. fdisk -l will show you partition types, which
    >>> might help determine the filesystem currently on the partition, and also
    >>> shows the actual start and end of the partition.
    >>>
    >>> --keith

    >
    >>Thanks - I'm a bit more hopeful of recovering my data - the longer it
    >>takes
    >>and the harder it is the more I learn so as far as I'm concerned, every
    >>cloud has a silver lining!

    >
    >>Here's what I've managed-
    >>If try to run fdisk in any of the forms that anyone has mentioned so far I
    >>simply get "bash: fdisk: command not found"

    >
    > Run as root, not as user.
    > It is in /sbin/fdisk
    >
    >>The most useful thing I've managedso far is catting /proc/partitions to
    >>which I get the following:

    >
    >>Major minor blocks name
    >>7 0 425552 loop0
    >>3 0 78150744 hda
    >>3 1 31 hda1
    >>3 2 131072 hda2
    >>3 3 78019635 hda3
    >>3 4 5 hda4

    >
    >>I assume that loop0 is the bytes on the CDROM and, the 78150744 is the
    >>size
    >>of the hard drive (its an 80G drive)

    >
    >>now I think I have two more questions:
    >>1. Can I actually get a directory listing? I've tried most of the "mount"
    >>options you've all suggested here's a few of the results:-
    >>I type: mount /dev/hda3
    >>response: mount: can't find /dev/hda3 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab

    >
    > So you have to tell it where to mount the stuff.
    >
    > mkdir /mnt/hda
    > mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda
    >
    >
    >>I type: mkdir /mnt/hda2
    >>response: mkdir: cannot create directory '/mnt/hda2': Permission Denied

    >
    > YOU ARE NOT RUNNING AS ROOT!!!
    > Do so.


    I thought I might have to do that - my Linux experience is limited to
    setting up a web server about 10 years ago and I've forgotton most of what I
    learnt then. As I said above - the more I have to do now - the more I will
    (re)learn.

    >>2. Anton suggested using dd if=/dev/hda of=/dev/sda to copy the whole lot
    >>to
    >>an external hard drive. I have a big enough drive with plenty of space on
    >>it
    >>but it's not empty. This is my backup disk - will I be able to do what I

    >
    > Then that would be a complete disaster. Buy a new hard drive with the same
    > size as the old one and do that. But do not do it to a hard drive with
    > content, or that content will be lost.
    >
    > That is the way forensic auditors do it, to make sure then do not damage
    > or
    > alter the original.
    >
    >
    >>need to without destroying the data that's already on there? Do I need any
    >>more switches? The USB drive is formatted as FAT32 (so that I can use it
    >>on
    >>a variety of computers in the house) is this a problem?

    >
    > What usb drive?


    The external drive that I'm hoping I can copy the data onto is USB. Do I
    really have to copy everything across or can I select certain directories. I
    have most stuff already backed up - I've just been a bit slack in backing up
    certain other bits.



  11. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    "JohnW" writes:
    >If try to run fdisk in any of the forms that anyone has mentioned so far I
    >simply get "bash: fdisk: command not found"


    Maybe it's not in the path. On my Debian box I have "/sbin/mac-fdisk".

    >1. Can I actually get a directory listing?


    You would have to mount the partition first.

    >I've tried most of the "mount"
    >options you've all suggested here's a few of the results:-
    >I type: mount /dev/hda3
    >response: mount: can't find /dev/hda3 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab


    Then you have to specify at least also the mount point (e.g.,
    /mnt/hda3), i.e.,

    mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda3

    Add -t and -o ro as appropriate.

    >I type: mkdir /mnt/hda2
    >response: mkdir: cannot create directory '/mnt/hda2': Permission Denied


    You probably need to be root to do this, and to mount the partition.

    >2. Anton suggested using dd if=/dev/hda of=/dev/sda to copy the whole lot to
    >an external hard drive. I have a big enough drive with plenty of space on it
    >but it's not empty.


    That command will destroy what's on the drive.

    > This is my backup disk - will I be able to do what I
    >need to without destroying the data that's already on there?


    You can do that by mounting a partition from the backup drive with
    enough free space, and then copying the hard disk contents to a file.

    If you want compression, you can do it with

    dd if=/dev/hda|gzip -c >/mnt/sda1/hda-image.gz

    > The USB drive is formatted as FAT32 (so that I can use it on
    >a variety of computers in the house) is this a problem?


    I believe that FAT32 does not support files >2GB (not sure, though),
    so you may want to split the file into, say, 1GB chunks, with
    something like:

    dd if=/dev/hda|gzip -c|split -b 1024m - /mnt/sda1/hda-image.gz.

    The reverse operation is:

    cat /mnt/sda1/hda-image.gz.*|gzip -cd|dd of=/dev/hda

    You might want to check that it works while you still have the old disk:

    cat /mnt/sda1/hda-image.gz.*|gzip -cd|diff --report-identical-files - /dev/hda

    Caution: all untested.

    - anton
    --
    M. Anton Ertl Some things have to be seen to be believed
    anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at Most things have to be believed to be seen
    http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/home.html

  12. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    "JohnW" writes:


    >"Unruh" wrote in message
    >news:e2ls7a$g$2@nntp.itservices.ubc.ca...
    >> "JohnW" writes:
    >>
    >>
    >>>"Keith Keller" wrote in
    >>>message
    >>>news:7dtvh3xoue.ln2@goaway.wombat.san-francisco.ca.us...
    >>>> On 2006-04-24, Lew Pitcher wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Safer would be to
    >>>>> cat /proc/partitions
    >>>>>
    >>>>> but if you /must/ use fdisk to see partitions, use
    >>>>> fdisk -l /dev/hda
    >>>>
    >>>> Catting /proc/partitions might be safer, but fdisk -l seems more
    >>>> informative to me e.g. fdisk -l will show you partition types, which
    >>>> might help determine the filesystem currently on the partition, and also
    >>>> shows the actual start and end of the partition.
    >>>>
    >>>> --keith

    >>
    >>>Thanks - I'm a bit more hopeful of recovering my data - the longer it
    >>>takes
    >>>and the harder it is the more I learn so as far as I'm concerned, every
    >>>cloud has a silver lining!

    >>
    >>>Here's what I've managed-
    >>>If try to run fdisk in any of the forms that anyone has mentioned so far I
    >>>simply get "bash: fdisk: command not found"

    >>
    >> Run as root, not as user.
    >> It is in /sbin/fdisk
    >>
    >>>The most useful thing I've managedso far is catting /proc/partitions to
    >>>which I get the following:

    >>
    >>>Major minor blocks name
    >>>7 0 425552 loop0
    >>>3 0 78150744 hda
    >>>3 1 31 hda1
    >>>3 2 131072 hda2
    >>>3 3 78019635 hda3
    >>>3 4 5 hda4

    >>
    >>>I assume that loop0 is the bytes on the CDROM and, the 78150744 is the
    >>>size
    >>>of the hard drive (its an 80G drive)

    >>
    >>>now I think I have two more questions:
    >>>1. Can I actually get a directory listing? I've tried most of the "mount"
    >>>options you've all suggested here's a few of the results:-
    >>>I type: mount /dev/hda3
    >>>response: mount: can't find /dev/hda3 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab

    >>
    >> So you have to tell it where to mount the stuff.
    >>
    >> mkdir /mnt/hda
    >> mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda
    >>
    >>
    >>>I type: mkdir /mnt/hda2
    >>>response: mkdir: cannot create directory '/mnt/hda2': Permission Denied

    >>
    >> YOU ARE NOT RUNNING AS ROOT!!!
    >> Do so.


    >I thought I might have to do that - my Linux experience is limited to
    >setting up a web server about 10 years ago and I've forgotton most of what I
    >learnt then. As I said above - the more I have to do now - the more I will
    >(re)learn.


    When you are doing sysadmin stuff you almost always have to log on as root.
    The system is protected from ordinary users doing things to the system and
    messing everything up.
    Everything you want to do is a system admin thing, so you need to be root.



    >>>2. Anton suggested using dd if=/dev/hda of=/dev/sda to copy the whole lot
    >>>to
    >>>an external hard drive. I have a big enough drive with plenty of space on
    >>>it
    >>>but it's not empty. This is my backup disk - will I be able to do what I

    >>
    >> Then that would be a complete disaster. Buy a new hard drive with the same
    >> size as the old one and do that. But do not do it to a hard drive with
    >> content, or that content will be lost.
    >>
    >> That is the way forensic auditors do it, to make sure then do not damage
    >> or
    >> alter the original.
    >>
    >>
    >>>need to without destroying the data that's already on there? Do I need any
    >>>more switches? The USB drive is formatted as FAT32 (so that I can use it
    >>>on
    >>>a variety of computers in the house) is this a problem?

    >>
    >> What usb drive?


    >The external drive that I'm hoping I can copy the data onto is USB. Do I
    >really have to copy everything across or can I select certain directories. I
    >have most stuff already backed up - I've just been a bit slack in backing up
    >certain other bits.


    Ah. Well, I am not sure at all what you would hope to gain by copying over.
    That is generally done so that you cannot mess up the original. But then
    you really need to do it properly and go out and buy another drive, install
    it into the machine and then make a clone.

    But first do what was suggested. ( And do not use dd for anything)

    post here
    cat /etc/fstab
    and the output of
    fdisk -l /dev/hda
    Then we can see what you have and tailor the advice to what you have,
    instead of having to guess.






  13. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    "JohnW" writes:
    >Do I
    >really have to copy everything across or can I select certain directories.


    You can certainly try to copy individual directories (mount the
    partition, and use an appropriate tool; I usually use tar, but I don't
    back up MacOS stuff), but:

    - MacOS files can have resource forks, that Unix tools like tar do not
    necessarily see (and back up), so I consider it safer to work on the
    raw disk or raw partition.

    - It's more work, and there's more risk of you forgetting something.
    If you don't have enough space on your USB drive, I would
    buy another drive for this reason alone.

    On the other hand, working with files instead of raw disk/partition
    data allows you to change the partition sizes.

    BTW, for the raw-partition approach, it's better not to mount the file
    system (or at least only read-only) while copying it.



    - anton
    --
    M. Anton Ertl Some things have to be seen to be believed
    anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at Most things have to be believed to be seen
    http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/home.html

  14. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?


    "JohnW" wrote in message
    news:tF73g.11885$4k5.11524@newsfe4-gui.ntli.net...
    >I have a problem with my MacMini that I have a feeling is actually a dead
    >hard drive but before I send it away for repair (it's still under warranty
    >so I don't want to try to crack it open myself) I want to try to recover as
    >much data from it as possible (I've been using it as a "media" computer and
    >there are quite a few radio recordings on there that I haven't listened to
    >yet and that are now completely unavailable).
    >
    > I have one more test I want to run that I don't have enough knowledge to
    > do - hopefully somebody can help.
    >
    > My first hope was to try to reinstall OSX but I get halfway through the
    > setup procedure and it fails to list any possible destinations to install
    > it to. I also ran the Hardware test (on the Mac Install CD) which reported
    > that all hardware is working correctly!
    >
    > I thought I'd try to run a Live Linux CD (ROCK Linux) which is successful
    > and have got KDE going but I still can't "see" any hard drives (the file
    > manager program lists a "hard drive" but that appears to be the CD that
    > I've booted from. This is roughly where my Linux knowledge ends!
    >
    > The questions are these:
    >
    > 1. Having booted the Mac with Linux, should I be able to "see" the Mac
    > hard drive?
    >
    > 2. If I should be able to "see" it, how do I go about that? ie do I need
    > to mount it from the command prompt before starting Xwindows? If so,
    > exactly what should I type in?
    >
    >


    Thanks for all your help so far - I've only just managed to get enough time
    to have another shot at this...
    I've now logged in as root so there's no need for anyone to shout at me
    anymore;-)

    Having now successfully entered many of the suggestions I think I know where
    this is heading but I'll add here the results of what I've done.
    I type: mkdir /mnt/hda2
    I simply get another command prompt
    I type: mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda
    response: mount point /mnt/hda does not exist
    I type: cat /etc/fstab
    response:
    /dev/root / auto defaults 0 1
    none /proc proc defaults 0 1
    none /dev devfs defaults 0 1
    none /dev/pts devpts defaults 0 1
    none /dev/shm ramfs defaults 0 1
    none /sys sysfs defaults 0 1
    none /tmp tmpfs defaults 0 1

    I type: mount /dev/hda2 -t ext3 -o ro /mnt/hda2
    response: special device /dev/hda2 does not exist
    I type: mount dev/hda2
    response:
    mount: can't find /dev/hda3 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab
    I type: mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda3
    response:
    mount point /mnt/hda3 does not exist

    As I previously said, if I run cat /proc/partitions it appears that I can
    actually see the drive.

    Have I done all I can? If so, am I likely to have any utilities on my Linux
    CD that might attempt some sort of disk repair? I don't need to get at
    everything from the drive just a couple of folders that I don't back up as
    often as I clearly should!

    Thanks again



  15. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    "JohnW" writes:
    >> I thought I'd try to run a Live Linux CD (ROCK Linux) which is successful
    >> and have got KDE going but I still can't "see" any hard drives (the file
    >> manager program lists a "hard drive" but that appears to be the CD that
    >> I've booted from. This is roughly where my Linux knowledge ends!
    >>
    >> The questions are these:
    >>
    >> 1. Having booted the Mac with Linux, should I be able to "see" the Mac
    >> hard drive?


    You should certainly be able to see it with fdisk and
    /proc/partitions. I don't know enough about Rock Linux and its KDE
    setup to tell you if you should be able to see the hard drive there.

    >I type: mkdir /mnt/hda2
    >I simply get another command prompt


    That means it worked.

    >I type: mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda
    >response: mount point /mnt/hda does not exist


    Well, you have created /mnt/hda2, not /mnt/hda

    >I type: cat /etc/fstab
    >response:

    ....
    >none /dev devfs defaults 0 1

    ....
    >I type: mount /dev/hda2 -t ext3 -o ro /mnt/hda2
    >response: special device /dev/hda2 does not exist


    Hmm, your system seems to be using devfs, so it should exist or be
    created on demand or somesuch. Also, AFAIK your file system is not
    ext3, so you should not try to mount it as ext3.

    Well, since that does not appear to work, you can also do

    mknod /tmp/hda3 b 3 3
    mkdir /mnt/hda3
    mount /tmp/hda3 -t hfs -o ro /mnt/hda3

    This assumes that your file system is HFS (doesn't MacOS X also use a
    variant of UFS?).

    >I type: mount dev/hda2
    >response:
    >mount: can't find /dev/hda3 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab


    You would have to put an entry into /etc/fstab for that to work.

    >I type: mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda3
    >response:
    >mount point /mnt/hda3 does not exist


    You have to create it first with mkdir.

    >If so, am I likely to have any utilities on my Linux
    >CD that might attempt some sort of disk repair?


    If the drive hardware is broken, the fix is to replace the drive. If
    the hardware is ok, but the file system is corrupted for some reason,
    the only way Linux could be used for repair is to back up the files
    that you can access, reformat the drive, and play them back. However,
    I would not use Linux to do this for MacOS file systems. BTW, if the
    file system is corrupted, my suggestion of copying the raw partition
    and playing it back won't help you.

    >I don't need to get at
    >everything from the drive just a couple of folders that I don't back up as
    >often as I clearly should!


    You may be able to do that, but you should try to understand what you
    are doing (which apparently you did not for the commands that you
    tried above), e.g., by reading the man pages about the commands (e.g.,
    type "man mount"). We probably won't have the patience to give you
    all the commands you need with all the arguments for your specific
    case; plus, consider the possibility of someone giving you malicious
    "advice".

    - anton
    --
    M. Anton Ertl Some things have to be seen to be believed
    anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at Most things have to be believed to be seen
    http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/home.html

  16. Re: How do I "see" a hard drive?

    "JohnW" writes:


    >"JohnW" wrote in message
    >news:tF73g.11885$4k5.11524@newsfe4-gui.ntli.net...
    >>I have a problem with my MacMini that I have a feeling is actually a dead
    >>hard drive but before I send it away for repair (it's still under warranty
    >>so I don't want to try to crack it open myself) I want to try to recover as
    >>much data from it as possible (I've been using it as a "media" computer and
    >>there are quite a few radio recordings on there that I haven't listened to
    >>yet and that are now completely unavailable).
    >>
    >> I have one more test I want to run that I don't have enough knowledge to
    >> do - hopefully somebody can help.
    >>
    >> My first hope was to try to reinstall OSX but I get halfway through the
    >> setup procedure and it fails to list any possible destinations to install
    >> it to. I also ran the Hardware test (on the Mac Install CD) which reported
    >> that all hardware is working correctly!
    >>
    >> I thought I'd try to run a Live Linux CD (ROCK Linux) which is successful
    >> and have got KDE going but I still can't "see" any hard drives (the file
    >> manager program lists a "hard drive" but that appears to be the CD that
    >> I've booted from. This is roughly where my Linux knowledge ends!
    >>
    >> The questions are these:
    >>
    >> 1. Having booted the Mac with Linux, should I be able to "see" the Mac
    >> hard drive?
    >>
    >> 2. If I should be able to "see" it, how do I go about that? ie do I need
    >> to mount it from the command prompt before starting Xwindows? If so,
    >> exactly what should I type in?
    >>
    >>


    >Thanks for all your help so far - I've only just managed to get enough time
    >to have another shot at this...
    >I've now logged in as root so there's no need for anyone to shout at me
    >anymore;-)


    >Having now successfully entered many of the suggestions I think I know where
    >this is heading but I'll add here the results of what I've done.
    >I type: mkdir /mnt/hda2


    You should have typed
    mkdir /mnt/hda

    >I simply get another command prompt
    >I type: mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda
    >response: mount point /mnt/hda does not exist


    Because you did not create the mount point /mnt/hda in the previous
    command.


    >I type: cat /etc/fstab
    >response:
    >/dev/root / auto defaults 0 1
    >none /proc proc defaults 0 1
    >none /dev devfs defaults 0 1
    >none /dev/pts devpts defaults 0 1
    >none /dev/shm ramfs defaults 0 1
    >none /sys sysfs defaults 0 1
    >none /tmp tmpfs defaults 0 1


    You have no hard disk in the /etc/fstab. This is celarly a Live
    distribution.



    >I type: mount /dev/hda2 -t ext3 -o ro /mnt/hda2
    >response: special device /dev/hda2 does not exist


    ls /dev/hda*
    If you see something then the system "knows" about your hard drive. If not,
    then not.

    fdisk -l /dev/hda
    to see if the partition table can be read.

    >I type: mount dev/hda2


    you need the leading / and there is no entry for dev/hda2 in /etc/fstab so
    mount has no idea what you want it to do.

    >response:
    >mount: can't find /dev/hda3 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab


    And now you are mistyping, since it would have said
    can't fine dev/hda2 in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab


    >I type: mount /dev/hda3 /mnt/hda3
    >response:
    >mount point /mnt/hda3 does not exist


    >As I previously said, if I run cat /proc/partitions it appears that I can
    >actually see the drive.


    And what is the ouput of this command? We need information to help you.

    Again, you make it very hard for us to help you, but withholding
    information, by mistyping, etc. What you type here is the only insight we
    have to your machine. Believe me, none of us can see into your machine from
    afar.


    >Have I done all I can? If so, am I likely to have any utilities on my Linux


    No, post the above information.

    >CD that might attempt some sort of disk repair? I don't need to get at
    >everything from the drive just a couple of folders that I don't back up as
    >often as I clearly should!


    Yes, it is still possible especially if you say cat /proc/partitions gives
    results.





    >Thanks again




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