CD images, ISO - Powerpc

This is a discussion on CD images, ISO - Powerpc ; Keith Krehbiel wrote: > Rod Smith wrote: > >> In article , >> Keith Krehbiel writes: >> >>> Yes I have a floppy, and also a router that I can hook up to. That >>> still doesn't solve the problem ...

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Thread: CD images, ISO

  1. Re: CD images, ISO

    Keith Krehbiel wrote:
    > Rod Smith wrote:
    >
    >> In article <10or2463bkdlf01@corp.supernews.com>,
    >> Keith Krehbiel writes:
    >>
    >>> Yes I have a floppy, and also a router that I can hook up to. That
    >>> still doesn't solve the problem of not being able to find any of
    >>> those devices from within the OS.

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> Try putting a pre-formatted FAT floppy disk in the floppy drive and then
    >> issuing these commands AS ROOT:
    >>
    >> mkdir -p /mnt/floppy
    >> mount /dev/fd0 /mnt/floppy
    >>
    >> (After the first time, you won't need the first command; it just creates
    >> the /mnt/floppy directory, which is where the floppy disk is mounted --
    >> that is, where it's grafted into the Linux directory tree.) The result
    >> SHOULD BE that the floppy disk's contents appear at /mnt/floppy. If it's
    >> got files, you should be able to see them with ls. You can then copy files
    >> to the floppy:
    >>
    >> cp /etc/fstab /mnt/floppy
    >>
    >> When you've copied all the files you need, unmount the floppy:
    >>
    >> umount /mnt/floppy
    >>
    >> Note that "umount" has just one "n" in it.
    >>
    >> If this procedure doesn't work, you could try the mtools package:
    >>
    >> apt-get install mtools
    >> mcopy /etc/fstab a:
    >>
    >> The apt-get command installs the mtools package on Debian systems. (You
    >> mentioned dselect later, so I assume you're using Debian or one of its
    >> derivatives. Thus, apt-get should be available to you. This command may
    >> ask you to insert a CD-ROM; or it might tell you that mtools is already
    >> installed.) You must type the apt-get command as root. The mcopy command
    >> is part of the mtools package, and it works very much like COPY under
    >> DOS. It lets you move files between the hard disk and a FAT floppy
    >> without actually mounting the floppy. You might or might not need to be
    >> root to use mcopy, depending on your device permissions -- but that's an
    >> fairly advanced topic, so if you try it as an ordinary user and it
    >> doesn't work, just try it as root, at least for the moment.
    >>

    >
    > Thanks. That sounds like something to try.
    > I have Debian woody. Slowly I am learning my way around it. It goes
    > much better with the help of all on here.
    > Keith
    >


    I haven't yet gotten a floppy to mount but I did get the hfs partition
    on my Linux disk to mount and copied some files to it.
    fstab is as follows:

    # /etc/fstab: static file system information.
    #
    #
    /dev/hda6 / ext2 errors=remount-ro 0 1
    /dev/hda7 none swap sw 0 0
    proc /proc proc defaults 0 0
    /dev/fd0 /floppy auto user,noauto 0 0
    /dev/cdrom /cdrom iso9660 ro,user,noauto 0 0
    Hmmm. That doesn't show hda5, my hfs partition.

    mtab:

    /dev/hda6 / ext2 rw,errors=remount-ro 0 0
    proc /proc proc rw 0 0
    devpts /dev/pts devpts rw,gid=5,mode=620 0 0
    /dev/hda5 /mnt/hd hfs rw 0 0

    Ahh! there it is.

    I was having so much fun that I copied XftConfig too:

    # $XFree86: xc/lib/Xft/XftConfig.cpp,v 1.5 2000/12/14 23:03:53 keithp Exp $

    dir "/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/Type1"
    dir "/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/TrueType"

    #
    # alias 'fixed' for 'mono'
    #
    match any family == "fixed" edit family =+ "mono";

    #
    # Check users config file
    #
    includeif "~/.xftconfig"

    #
    # Alias between XLFD families and font file family name, prefer local
    # fonts
    #
    match any family == "charter" edit family += "bitstream charter";
    match any family == "bitstream charter" edit family =+ "charter";

    I tried to install mtools but that seems to want a desktop environment,
    another thing that I have not yet gotten to work.

    Thanks again for all your help
    Keith


  2. Re: CD images, ISO

    In article <10p47i1p2cu1oc2@corp.supernews.com>,
    Keith Krehbiel writes:
    >
    > I haven't yet gotten a floppy to mount but I did get the hfs partition
    > on my Linux disk to mount and copied some files to it.
    > fstab is as follows:
    >
    > # /etc/fstab: static file system information.
    > #
    > #
    > /dev/hda6 / ext2 errors=remount-ro 0 1
    > /dev/hda7 none swap sw 0 0
    > proc /proc proc defaults 0 0
    > /dev/fd0 /floppy auto user,noauto 0 0
    > /dev/cdrom /cdrom iso9660 ro,user,noauto 0 0


    With this information, I can say that you SHOULD be able to mount a floppy
    as either root or an ordinary user by typing:

    mount /floppy

    If that doesn't work, try reporting the error message, along with
    information on the disk (was it FAT or HFS, for instance).

    > Hmmm. That doesn't show hda5, my hfs partition.


    Try adding this line:

    /dev/hda5 /mnt/hd hfs defaults,umask=0 0 0

    This will mount your HFS partition automatically whenever the computer
    boots. Alternatively, you could replace "defaults" with "user,noauto" to
    have the system not mount it automatically, but to enable ordinary users
    to mount the partition. The last I checked (quite a while ago), Linux's
    HFS support was good, but still posed some risk of disk corruption. Thus,
    I'd recommend using it sparingly, unless this is a "scratch" partition
    that doesn't hold any really vital data.

    The "umask=0" part of the above configuration line gives all files 777
    (rwxrwxrwx) permissions, which enables anybody to read or write files on
    the partition. You can specify other umask values to give more
    restrictive permissions, but you'd probably then want to add "uid=aaa",
    where "aaa" is a UID number, and possibly "gid=bbb", where "bbb" is a GID
    number, to assign ownership of all files to something appropriate.

    > mtab:
    >
    > /dev/hda6 / ext2 rw,errors=remount-ro 0 0
    > proc /proc proc rw 0 0
    > devpts /dev/pts devpts rw,gid=5,mode=620 0 0
    > /dev/hda5 /mnt/hd hfs rw 0 0
    >
    > Ahh! there it is.


    /etc/mtab shows the currently mounted filesystems. /etc/fstab shows the
    filesystems that are mounted automatically or that are defined for easier
    manual mounting. You edit /etc/fstab to change how the system behaves,
    but you don't normally edit /etc/mtab; it's maintained automatically by
    the system.

    > I tried to install mtools but that seems to want a desktop environment,
    > another thing that I have not yet gotten to work.


    You could just let it go ahead and install the desktop environment. It
    really shouldn't be necessary, though; I suspect this is an unnecessary
    dependency -- or perhaps you're interpreting the name of some dependency
    as a desktop environment when in fact it's something else.

    --
    Rod Smith, rodsmith@rodsbooks.com
    http://www.rodsbooks.com
    Author of books on Linux, FreeBSD, and networking

  3. Re: CD images, ISO

    Rod Smith wrote:
    > In article <10p47i1p2cu1oc2@corp.supernews.com>,
    > Keith Krehbiel writes:
    >
    >>I haven't yet gotten a floppy to mount but I did get the hfs partition
    >>on my Linux disk to mount and copied some files to it.
    >>fstab is as follows:
    >>
    >># /etc/fstab: static file system information.
    >>#
    >>#
    >>/dev/hda6 / ext2 errors=remount-ro 0 1
    >>/dev/hda7 none swap sw 0 0
    >>proc /proc proc defaults 0 0
    >>/dev/fd0 /floppy auto user,noauto 0 0
    >>/dev/cdrom /cdrom iso9660 ro,user,noauto 0 0

    >
    >
    > With this information, I can say that you SHOULD be able to mount a floppy
    > as either root or an ordinary user by typing:
    >
    > mount /floppy
    >
    > If that doesn't work, try reporting the error message, along with
    > information on the disk (was it FAT or HFS, for instance).
    >
    >
    >>Hmmm. That doesn't show hda5, my hfs partition.

    >
    >
    > Try adding this line:
    >
    > /dev/hda5 /mnt/hd hfs defaults,umask=0 0 0
    >
    > This will mount your HFS partition automatically whenever the computer
    > boots. Alternatively, you could replace "defaults" with "user,noauto" to
    > have the system not mount it automatically, but to enable ordinary users
    > to mount the partition. The last I checked (quite a while ago), Linux's
    > HFS support was good, but still posed some risk of disk corruption. Thus,
    > I'd recommend using it sparingly, unless this is a "scratch" partition
    > that doesn't hold any really vital data.
    >
    > The "umask=0" part of the above configuration line gives all files 777
    > (rwxrwxrwx) permissions, which enables anybody to read or write files on
    > the partition. You can specify other umask values to give more
    > restrictive permissions, but you'd probably then want to add "uid=aaa",
    > where "aaa" is a UID number, and possibly "gid=bbb", where "bbb" is a GID
    > number, to assign ownership of all files to something appropriate.
    >


    My reasons for having the hfs partition was to allow installation of
    MacOS if I decided to do it that way and to provide space for file
    exchanges such as these. I really don't intend to use it for any
    important storage. So far no real work has been done from linux anyway.

    >
    >>mtab:
    >>
    >>/dev/hda6 / ext2 rw,errors=remount-ro 0 0
    >>proc /proc proc rw 0 0
    >>devpts /dev/pts devpts rw,gid=5,mode=620 0 0
    >>/dev/hda5 /mnt/hd hfs rw 0 0
    >>
    >>Ahh! there it is.

    >
    >
    > /etc/mtab shows the currently mounted filesystems. /etc/fstab shows the
    > filesystems that are mounted automatically or that are defined for easier
    > manual mounting. You edit /etc/fstab to change how the system behaves,
    > but you don't normally edit /etc/mtab; it's maintained automatically by
    > the system.
    >
    >
    >>I tried to install mtools but that seems to want a desktop environment,
    >>another thing that I have not yet gotten to work.

    >
    >
    > You could just let it go ahead and install the desktop environment. It
    > really shouldn't be necessary, though; I suspect this is an unnecessary
    > dependency -- or perhaps you're interpreting the name of some dependency
    > as a desktop environment when in fact it's something else.
    >


    I think I have most of Gnome installed but it fails to find my screen.
    I am hoping to eventually work through those issues. In the course of
    doing that I have ruined a couple installations of linux and had to
    start over, hence the wear and tear on my installation cd that started
    all this thread. Before I think I had parts of several desktops
    installed at once and I suspect they were fighting among themselves.
    This time I tried to limit it to Gnome since that seemed to match better
    with Debian. It doesn't cry as loud on startup as it did before.
    One of the things I discovered is that the /x directory in /pool on the
    cd is one that is corrupted so that may have underlain some of my
    problems with x-windows. I want to try it again when I can get linux to
    access a healthy copy of the software.
    Keith


  4. Re: CD images, ISO

    In article <10p4n5ojnj49f01@corp.supernews.com>,
    Keith Krehbiel writes:
    >
    > I think I have most of Gnome installed but it fails to find my screen.


    GNOME sits atop X, which is what directly accesses the video hardware. I
    suspect you're having X problems, not GNOME problems. All of this is
    unrelated to INSTALLATION issues for the mtools package, though, which is
    what started this sub-thread -- you can INSTALL most packages without
    actually USING them.

    > I am hoping to eventually work through those issues. In the course of
    > doing that I have ruined a couple installations of linux and had to
    > start over, hence the wear and tear on my installation cd that started
    > all this thread.


    As I said before, re-installing Linux is usually overkill. I *STRONGLY*
    recommend that you look up and read some basic Linux documentation -- some
    of the stuff at http://tldp.org, a basic Linux book, or something else. As
    it is, you're groping around in the dark, with an occasional nudge from a
    newsgroup post. Reading some basic documentation will be like turning on
    the lights.

    > Before I think I had parts of several desktops
    > installed at once and I suspect they were fighting among themselves.


    Unlikely. You can INSTALL GNOME, KDE, XFce, and other desktop
    environments on a single computer and the fact that they're installed on
    one system won't cause problems. In fact, you can even run several of
    them simultaneously on different virtual terminals, over network logins,
    or whatnot, without problems. I'm not aware of any desktop environments
    that will conflict with any other desktop environment, although sometimes
    desktop environment CONFIGURATIONS from different distributions will
    conflict with one another because they make assumptions about where files
    are stored. If you're repeatedly re-installing a single distribution
    (Debian), though, this shouldn't be a problem.

    > One of the things I discovered is that the /x directory in /pool on the
    > cd is one that is corrupted so that may have underlain some of my
    > problems with x-windows.


    That's entirely possible; if the installer couldn't read certain files,
    that means that some packages probably weren't installed properly.

    Incidentally, "x-windows" is incorrect terminology, albeit a commonly used
    incorrect terminology. It's "The X Window System" or "X" for short.

    --
    Rod Smith, rodsmith@rodsbooks.com
    http://www.rodsbooks.com
    Author of books on Linux, FreeBSD, and networking

  5. Re: CD images, ISO

    Rod Smith wrote:
    > In article <10p4n5ojnj49f01@corp.supernews.com>,
    > Keith Krehbiel writes:
    >
    >>I think I have most of Gnome installed but it fails to find my screen.

    >
    >
    > GNOME sits atop X, which is what directly accesses the video hardware. I
    > suspect you're having X problems, not GNOME problems. All of this is
    > unrelated to INSTALLATION issues for the mtools package, though, which is
    > what started this sub-thread -- you can INSTALL most packages without
    > actually USING them.
    >
    >
    >>I am hoping to eventually work through those issues. In the course of
    >>doing that I have ruined a couple installations of linux and had to
    >>start over, hence the wear and tear on my installation cd that started
    >>all this thread.

    >
    >
    > As I said before, re-installing Linux is usually overkill. I *STRONGLY*
    > recommend that you look up and read some basic Linux documentation -- some
    > of the stuff at http://tldp.org, a basic Linux book, or something else. As
    > it is, you're groping around in the dark, with an occasional nudge from a
    > newsgroup post. Reading some basic documentation will be like turning on
    > the lights.
    >
    >
    >>Before I think I had parts of several desktops
    >>installed at once and I suspect they were fighting among themselves.

    >
    >
    > Unlikely. You can INSTALL GNOME, KDE, XFce, and other desktop
    > environments on a single computer and the fact that they're installed on
    > one system won't cause problems. In fact, you can even run several of
    > them simultaneously on different virtual terminals, over network logins,
    > or whatnot, without problems. I'm not aware of any desktop environments
    > that will conflict with any other desktop environment, although sometimes
    > desktop environment CONFIGURATIONS from different distributions will
    > conflict with one another because they make assumptions about where files
    > are stored. If you're repeatedly re-installing a single distribution
    > (Debian), though, this shouldn't be a problem.
    >
    >
    >>One of the things I discovered is that the /x directory in /pool on the
    >>cd is one that is corrupted so that may have underlain some of my
    >>problems with x-windows.

    >
    >
    > That's entirely possible; if the installer couldn't read certain files,
    > that means that some packages probably weren't installed properly.
    >
    > Incidentally, "x-windows" is incorrect terminology, albeit a commonly used
    > incorrect terminology. It's "The X Window System" or "X" for short.
    >


    X it is then, we live and learn. There have been some threads on here
    and elsewhere concerning the proper installation/configuration of X on
    some Macs. I have read them all with interest since the symptoms seem
    similar to the ones I experience. There have been config files posted
    that are supposed to remedy the various ailments but none have been for
    my specific machine (Umax C600). When Linux boots the way I have it now
    it is much more civilized than it had been before. It used to try at
    least 3 times to start X and finally give up. Now it calls it quits
    after one try. Seems like an improvement to me: shorter boot time.
    When X fails I get a message asking if I want to view the configuration
    file. If I answer yes I get a blank window with 100% in the lower right
    corner so I usually answer no. I have burnt a copy of the first cd but
    have yet to try it.
    One other dumb question. Is it possible to get on the internet without
    a GUI? That is something I have never tried or even heard of really.


  6. Re: CD images, ISO

    In article <10p82144i15qv38@corp.supernews.com>,
    Keith Krehbiel writes:
    >
    > When Linux boots the way I have it now
    > it is much more civilized than it had been before. It used to try at
    > least 3 times to start X and finally give up. Now it calls it quits
    > after one try. Seems like an improvement to me: shorter boot time.


    Debian starts X via a SysV startup script. No doubt this is Greek to you,
    but it basically means that there's a script in /etc/init.d that starts
    X, and a link to that script in /etc/rc3.d (or possibly /etc/rc5.d). The
    link is called S99gdm, S99kdm, or S99xdm, depending on how your system is
    configured. Delete it or rename it to K01gdm, K01kdm, or K01xdm
    (depending on the original name) and X will no longer start. (Your system
    may have all three files and links, so you may need to do this for all
    three of them.) You can subsequently restore the original name to have X
    start when the system boots, if you get X running.

    After doing this, you can test X by typing "startx" at a command prompt. A
    log file called /var/log/XFree86.0.log should appear (or maybe
    /var/log/Xorg.0.log, if you're using X.org-X11 rather than XFree86).
    That'll have hints to what's going wrong.

    > One other dumb question. Is it possible to get on the internet without
    > a GUI? That is something I have never tried or even heard of really.


    Yes, but precisely how you do this depends on your network connection
    type -- PPP dial-up modem, ADSL, cable modem, etc. You might want to
    check http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/ISP-Connectivity.html and
    http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/PPP-HOWTO/index.html for information on PPP,
    http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/DSL-HOWTO/ for Linux DSL information, and
    http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Cable-Modem/index.html for cable modem
    information.

    --
    Rod Smith, rodsmith@rodsbooks.com
    http://www.rodsbooks.com
    Author of books on Linux, FreeBSD, and networking

  7. Re: CD images, ISO

    Rod Smith wrote:
    > In article <10p82144i15qv38@corp.supernews.com>,
    > Keith Krehbiel writes:
    >
    >>When Linux boots the way I have it now
    >>it is much more civilized than it had been before. It used to try at
    >>least 3 times to start X and finally give up. Now it calls it quits
    >>after one try. Seems like an improvement to me: shorter boot time.

    >
    >
    > Debian starts X via a SysV startup script. No doubt this is Greek to you,
    > but it basically means that there's a script in /etc/init.d that starts
    > X, and a link to that script in /etc/rc3.d (or possibly /etc/rc5.d). The
    > link is called S99gdm, S99kdm, or S99xdm, depending on how your system is
    > configured. Delete it or rename it to K01gdm, K01kdm, or K01xdm
    > (depending on the original name) and X will no longer start. (Your system
    > may have all three files and links, so you may need to do this for all
    > three of them.) You can subsequently restore the original name to have X
    > start when the system boots, if you get X running.
    >
    > After doing this, you can test X by typing "startx" at a command prompt. A
    > log file called /var/log/XFree86.0.log should appear (or maybe
    > /var/log/Xorg.0.log, if you're using X.org-X11 rather than XFree86).
    > That'll have hints to what's going wrong.
    >
    >
    >>One other dumb question. Is it possible to get on the internet without
    >>a GUI? That is something I have never tried or even heard of really.

    >
    >
    > Yes, but precisely how you do this depends on your network connection
    > type -- PPP dial-up modem, ADSL, cable modem, etc. You might want to
    > check http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/ISP-Connectivity.html and
    > http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/PPP-HOWTO/index.html for information on PPP,
    > http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/DSL-HOWTO/ for Linux DSL information, and
    > http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Cable-Modem/index.html for cable modem
    > information.
    >

    One more dumb question: What sort of browser or other software should
    be used? Will Mozilla work without X?


  8. Re: CD images, ISO

    Keith Krehbiel writes:

    ]Rod Smith wrote:
    ]> In article <10p82144i15qv38@corp.supernews.com>,
    ]> Keith Krehbiel writes:
    ]>
    ]>>When Linux boots the way I have it now
    ]>>it is much more civilized than it had been before. It used to try at
    ]>>least 3 times to start X and finally give up. Now it calls it quits
    ]>>after one try. Seems like an improvement to me: shorter boot time.
    ]>
    ]>
    ]> Debian starts X via a SysV startup script. No doubt this is Greek to you,
    ]> but it basically means that there's a script in /etc/init.d that starts
    ]> X, and a link to that script in /etc/rc3.d (or possibly /etc/rc5.d). The
    ]> link is called S99gdm, S99kdm, or S99xdm, depending on how your system is
    ]> configured. Delete it or rename it to K01gdm, K01kdm, or K01xdm
    ]> (depending on the original name) and X will no longer start. (Your system
    ]> may have all three files and links, so you may need to do this for all
    ]> three of them.) You can subsequently restore the original name to have X
    ]> start when the system boots, if you get X running.
    ]>
    ]> After doing this, you can test X by typing "startx" at a command prompt. A
    ]> log file called /var/log/XFree86.0.log should appear (or maybe
    ]> /var/log/Xorg.0.log, if you're using X.org-X11 rather than XFree86).
    ]> That'll have hints to what's going wrong.
    ]>
    ]>
    ]>>One other dumb question. Is it possible to get on the internet without
    ]>>a GUI? That is something I have never tried or even heard of really.
    ]>
    ]>
    ]> Yes, but precisely how you do this depends on your network connection
    ]> type -- PPP dial-up modem, ADSL, cable modem, etc. You might want to
    ]> check http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/ISP-Connectivity.html and
    ]> http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/PPP-HOWTO/index.html for information on PPP,
    ]> http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/DSL-HOWTO/ for Linux DSL information, and
    ]> http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Cable-Modem/index.html for cable modem
    ]> information.
    ]>
    ]One more dumb question: What sort of browser or other software should
    ]be used? Will Mozilla work without X?

    No. It uses the gui. If you want to use a browser without X use lynx. Note
    you will not be able to see any of the images-- just the text-- if you use
    lynx.



  9. Re: CD images, ISO

    Bill Unruh wrote:
    > Keith Krehbiel writes:
    >
    > ]Rod Smith wrote:
    > ]> In article <10p82144i15qv38@corp.supernews.com>,
    > ]> Keith Krehbiel writes:
    > ]> ]>>When Linux boots the way I have it now
    > ]>>it is much more civilized than it had been before. It used to try at
    > ]>>least 3 times to start X and finally give up. Now it calls it quits
    > ]>>after one try. Seems like an improvement to me: shorter boot time.
    > ]> ]> ]> Debian starts X via a SysV startup script. No doubt this is Greek to you,
    > ]> but it basically means that there's a script in /etc/init.d that starts
    > ]> X, and a link to that script in /etc/rc3.d (or possibly /etc/rc5.d). The
    > ]> link is called S99gdm, S99kdm, or S99xdm, depending on how your system is
    > ]> configured. Delete it or rename it to K01gdm, K01kdm, or K01xdm
    > ]> (depending on the original name) and X will no longer start. (Your system
    > ]> may have all three files and links, so you may need to do this for all
    > ]> three of them.) You can subsequently restore the original name to have X
    > ]> start when the system boots, if you get X running.
    > ]> ]> After doing this, you can test X by typing "startx" at a command prompt. A
    > ]> log file called /var/log/XFree86.0.log should appear (or maybe
    > ]> /var/log/Xorg.0.log, if you're using X.org-X11 rather than XFree86).
    > ]> That'll have hints to what's going wrong.
    > ]> ]> ]>>One other dumb question. Is it possible to get on the internet without
    > ]>>a GUI? That is something I have never tried or even heard of really.
    > ]> ]> ]> Yes, but precisely how you do this depends on your network connection
    > ]> type -- PPP dial-up modem, ADSL, cable modem, etc. You might want to
    > ]> check http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/ISP-Connectivity.html and
    > ]> http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/PPP-HOWTO/index.html for information on PPP,
    > ]> http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/DSL-HOWTO/ for Linux DSL information, and
    > ]> http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Cable-Modem/index.html for cable modem
    > ]> information.
    > ]> ]One more dumb question: What sort of browser or other software should
    > ]be used? Will Mozilla work without X?
    >
    > No. It uses the gui. If you want to use a browser without X use lynx. Note
    > you will not be able to see any of the images-- just the text-- if you use
    > lynx.
    >
    >

    That's ok if the images don't show. At this point it would mostly be to
    retrieve software. Thanks for the suggestion. I didn't know what to
    look for
    Keith


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