This is a discussion on Re: [9fans] store 9p session-only values using lib9p - Plan9 ; FTS, http://lsub.org/magic/man2html/1/mails is the manual page for the mail program I refer to in the previous mail. > From: firstname.lastname@example.org > To: email@example.com > Reply-To: firstname.lastname@example.org > Date: Thu Jun 12 12:24:45 CET 2008 > Subject: Re: [9fans] store 9p ...
is the manual page for the mail program I refer to in the previous mail.
> From: email@example.com
> To: firstname.lastname@example.org
> Reply-To: email@example.com
> Date: Thu Jun 12 12:24:45 CET 2008
> Subject: Re: [9fans] store 9p session-only values using lib9p
> Funny, I've done the same in a different way.
> see mail2fs in contrib/nemo.
> Also, I have some proposal, skip to the end of the mail and let me know
> what you think
> In any case, I'd love to see/try your version of upas/fs et al.
> Instead of adapting upas/fs, I use a mail2fs program that uses
> upas to convert mail into an "unpacked" form. Each mail is a directory.
> A "text" file contains the message text right as you would see it in a mail
> reader (including relative paths for attachments). Each attach is decoded
> and kept in the mail's directory ready to be copied, printed, etc.; if possible,
> using the same file name reported by the attachment.
> I use the very same approach for sending mail. A directory /mail/box/nemo/out
> is spooled to send whichever file is placed on it as a mail. The format for the
> outgoing messages is again similar to what you'd type in a mail writer.
> The whole point is that now you editor (plus couple of scripts) becomes a mail
> reader/writer without understanding anything about mail.
> My proposal:
> Why don't we reach an agreement and start using the very
> same format. I suggest keeping my mbox format but adapting upas/fs to
> understand it, which is a good idea. But I'm open to suggestions.
> > From: firstname.lastname@example.org
> > To: email@example.com
> > Reply-To: firstname.lastname@example.org
> > Date: Thu Jun 12 12:10:32 CET 2008
> > Subject: Re: [9fans] store 9p session-only values using lib9p
> > > at the moment i'm playing only with mbox not imap or pop, i have a version with cache per message that 'works', upas/nedmail and acme/mail are able to read messages 'nicely', but attachments are not decoded.
> > i have a couple of reservations about mbox format. first, a majority
> > of users that i need to support have inboxes >10mb and some
> > have mailboxes >100mb. thus deleting an older message will require
> > rewriting the whole file, and if it's not the last message, will take
> > up quite a bit of storage, even on venti.
> > second, it's very difficult to cache. for example, suppose i have two
> > instances of my mail fs interpreting the same mbox at the same time.
> > suppose that i delete the 5th out of 500 messages with the first. the
> > second will then have to reread the entire mbox to get its pointers
> > right. even if i write an index with the first, the entire index
> > needs to be reread.
> > third, since large messages tend to be really stinking huge, it is not
> > efficient to read entire messages to deduce the mime structure. (ned
> > reads the mime structure of each doc on startup.) that last mime part
> > may be tens of mb into the
> > you'll notice that if one uses email in the way it was used
> > traditionally in unix environments, that a 500 message, inbox or 15mb
> > message is unreasonable. for traditional uses, mbox format and
> > loading the whole stinking thing into memory is a great idea.
> > unfortunately, that's now how people use email these days.
> > our two machines running upas/fs burn up to 5gb of ram.
> > old rewritten mail adds several hundred mb/day to the dump.
> > > also file lengths is going to be a problem if i'm going to decode files within the fs.
> > >
> > > i've put what i have in /n/sources/contrib/gabidiaz/wip/mboxfs
> > i've adapted upas/fs to use a directory for mailboxes (mdir) by default.
> > mailbox types that support caching (mdir and imap4) keep their cache
> > below Maxcache or Σ of (actively) referenced messages, whichever is bigger.
> > i've also adapted the rest of upas, including deliver and marshal to
> > understand mdir format. imap4d should be done soon.
> > this upas/fs keeps an index, so in most cases, emails are not reread unless they are
> > viewed. the index contains some information -- like flags -- not recorded
> > in the mail.
> > i'd be happy to share a working copy to those interested. but it's
> > not ready to be inflicted on the world yet. the "From " line date is
> > unresolved and imap4d still thinks it knows how to append a message
> > to a mailbox.
> > > about the From line, qmail man page about mbox format says it is composedof From space sender@... space current date, and it is generated by the delivery agent, but moving one message from a box to another doesn't use the delivery agent :-?
> > why not? this seems an arbitrary distinction between the inbox and
> > every other mailbox.
> > - erik