Want to replace my TX, but what's out there? - Palmtop

This is a discussion on Want to replace my TX, but what's out there? - Palmtop ; In message Daniel James wrote: >In article news: , Joshua >Baker-LePain wrote: >> The most promising native PIM apps for the n8xx seemed to be >> > >> I refuse to use a WinMo device. > >I'd happily use one ...

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  1. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In message Daniel James
    wrote:

    >In article news:, Joshua
    >Baker-LePain wrote:
    >> The most promising native PIM apps for the n8xx seemed to be
    >>

    >
    >> I refuse to use a WinMo device.

    >
    >I'd happily use one if the platform was even remotely stable and the
    >apps had a basic level of utility. Unfortunately my experience to date
    >is that neither can be expected.


    I'm a long time Palm user who recently jumped ship to WinMo, and I'd put
    my WinMo device up against the Treo 680 for stability. Both devices
    were heads above the Treo 650 and LifeDrive.

  2. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    On Fri, 25 Apr 2008 11:07:30 -0400, Jeffrey Kaplan
    wrote:

    >Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, Mike Koenecke said:
    >
    >> What I cannot figure out is why Palm just... gave up. (Perhaps you
    >> said something similar in your rant.) Like Corel with WordPerfect,
    >> they evidently decided several years ago that making substantive
    >> improvements was not worth bothering with, and settled on the business
    >> model of milking their existing user base for revenue as long as they
    >> could.

    >
    >I think they lost the plot with OS6, and have been treading water ever
    >since. They "finished" OS6, but was never able to sell it to their
    >licensees, and for some reason decided to not use it themselves. This
    >was before the company split into PalmSource (OS) and palmOne
    >(hardware).


    I'm pretty certain that the Cobalt (OS6) drama happened *after* not
    before the PalmOne/PalmSource split. By the time Cobalt shipped,
    PalmOne was also an OS licensee and rejected Cobalt just like Sony and
    everyone else did. Still, even if your chronology is off, you are
    essentially correct. After rejecting Cobalt, Palm spent most of its
    time shoe-horning Cobalt's most useful features like NVFS memory into
    Garnet (PalmOS 5.x) and produced a string of slow, buggy devices. I
    can still see the Frankengarnet legacy whenever my Treo 680 lags on me
    (it doesn't happen often on me to make me ditch it but it does piss me
    off).
    --
    Cause, really, nothing says "I'm a counter culture
    rebel, fighting the establishment" like an Aibo on
    a skateboard.
    - Seen on Slashdot

    Roberto Castillo
    robertocastillo@ameritech.net
    http://mind-grapes.blogspot.com/
    http://zombie-gulch.myminicity.com/

  3. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In article news:, DevilsPGD
    wrote:
    > I'd put my WinMo device up against the Treo 680 for stability.


    Really? I thought the Treo was supposed to be better than that! I know
    it's not the best phone going, but as a phone-cum-PDA it has a
    generally good reputation.

    I have some friends who've been using Palms since the III, and who
    currently use Treos (a mixture of 650s and 680s, IIRC) who swear by
    them. SWMBO used to have a Treo 270 (back when Handspring was a
    separate company and the Treo wasn't a Palm product) and loved it until
    the hinge broke for the second time ...

    OTOH everyone I know who has a WinMo device is always complaining that
    it has reset itself or has hung and had to be reset by hand, and that
    it has lost or dropped calls as a result. That's really not acceptable
    reliability in a business tool.

    I was a Psion user from about 1991 until they stopped making consumer
    handheld devices. I'd evaluated a Palm IIIc and some Pocket PC devices
    at some point during that time (with a view to developing for them,
    which I never did) and felt that the Palm was clearly the only decent
    piece of kit around apart from the Psions.

    When the Tungsten|T1 appeared -- with Bluetooth (which the Psions never
    had) I got one almost as soon as it came out. The T1 is a nice little
    device and carries out all the PIM functions really quite well as well
    as running some handy 3rd-party apps -- but it isn't a patch on the old
    Psions.

    I use my T1 with my Nokia 6310i phone, which is now quite an old design
    but is an excellent phone -- great signal and battery life -- and it
    never crashes or needs resetting. The bluetooth connection through the
    phone to access the internet works quite well with VersaMail but the
    web browser crashes and/or resets on any page more complex than plain
    HTML and maybe some small images ... that's really not good enough --
    the browser is essentially unusable.

    Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be anything better available, at
    the moment.

    Cheers,
    Daniel.








  4. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, DevilsPGD said:

    > I've now switched to the Tilt for voice and PDA (and I can actually do
    > both at once, something I could never trust my Treo to do if there was
    > an important client on the phone), but I still carry the Touch for heavy
    > browsing and music.


    Have you tried Opera Mobile on the Tilt?

    --
    Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
    The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

    Error in operator: add beer

  5. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In message Daniel James
    wrote:

    >In article news:, DevilsPGD
    >wrote:
    >> I'd put my WinMo device up against the Treo 680 for stability.

    >
    >Really? I thought the Treo was supposed to be better than that! I know
    >it's not the best phone going, but as a phone-cum-PDA it has a
    >generally good reputation.
    >
    >I have some friends who've been using Palms since the III, and who
    >currently use Treos (a mixture of 650s and 680s, IIRC) who swear by
    >them. SWMBO used to have a Treo 270 (back when Handspring was a
    >separate company and the Treo wasn't a Palm product) and loved it until
    >the hinge broke for the second time ...


    I used to be in this category, having owned a IIIe, IIIxe, V, m505,
    Zire71, T|E2, T|X, LifeDrive, Treo 650 and 680 (and possibly another one
    or two that I'm forgetting about)

    >OTOH everyone I know who has a WinMo device is always complaining that
    >it has reset itself or has hung and had to be reset by hand, and that
    >it has lost or dropped calls as a result. That's really not acceptable
    >reliability in a business tool.


    That's more or less what I said about the Treo 650. The 680 was better,
    but still not perfect, and I most certainly couldn't go a week without a
    reboot.

    I haven't yet had my WinMo device reset itself or have any call related
    problems at all. I've had some sluggishness that resulted in me
    rebooting rather then being able to figure out the cause, but I haven't
    had an actual OS crash or hang outside of a buggy game that I have since
    uninstalled.

    My current uptime is only four days, but it's been four stable reliable
    days with several applications (PIM, IMAP mail client, PocketIE) open
    virtually the entire time, other applications opened while they are
    being used.

    I did previously own an older Axim (2002-2003 era), it definitely was a
    painful experience. My Tilt, however, has been a rather pleasent
    experience (WM6.0, and now WM6.1)

    Given all of the hardware improvements that Palm just doesn't seem to be
    able to manage on the PalmOS side of things (3G, wifi, GPS, above-1Mp
    camera), it was worth the gamble.

    I was, frankly, shocked that I have actually been enjoying the platform.

  6. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, DevilsPGD said:

    > I used to be in this category, having owned a IIIe, IIIxe, V, m505,
    > Zire71, T|E2, T|X, LifeDrive, Treo 650 and 680 (and possibly another one
    > or two that I'm forgetting about)


    IIIx, three Clies, Kyocera 7135, Treo 650 and Treo 680. And now, I
    just jumped ship to a Tilt.

    > I did previously own an older Axim (2002-2003 era), it definitely was a
    > painful experience. My Tilt, however, has been a rather pleasent
    > experience (WM6.0, and now WM6.1)


    From what I've seen from the sidelines, WM6 is probably the first truly
    usable/stable version. At least, this is the first one I've seen where
    you can actually CLOSE applications with the red X button, and it does
    that by default.

    I need to find a WinMob newsgroup.

    --
    Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
    The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

    "Doesn't matter. If we lived two hundred years, we'd still be human.
    We'd still make the same mistakes." (Lt. Cmdr. Ivanova, B5"Soul
    Hunter")

  7. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In message <7vp9141sdq6qmlpt5jgg46pajmsr9hgh54@gordol.org> Jeffrey
    Kaplan wrote:

    >Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, DevilsPGD said:
    >
    >> I used to be in this category, having owned a IIIe, IIIxe, V, m505,
    >> Zire71, T|E2, T|X, LifeDrive, Treo 650 and 680 (and possibly another one
    >> or two that I'm forgetting about)

    >
    >IIIx, three Clies, Kyocera 7135, Treo 650 and Treo 680. And now, I
    >just jumped ship to a Tilt.


    How is the Tilt treating you so far?

    >> I did previously own an older Axim (2002-2003 era), it definitely was a
    >> painful experience. My Tilt, however, has been a rather pleasent
    >> experience (WM6.0, and now WM6.1)

    >
    >From what I've seen from the sidelines, WM6 is probably the first truly
    >usable/stable version. At least, this is the first one I've seen where
    >you can actually CLOSE applications with the red X button, and it does
    >that by default.


    Not by default, but the AT&T Tilt has an add-in to fix that

    You can tweak it with third party software, I've got my X set to close
    most apps, but leave my mail client, PIM, and chat client open. Press
    and hold for a second and I get a quick list of all open programs, and
    can kill everything from there if needed.

    The WinMo world is customizable like I haven't seen since OS4's hacks.

    >I need to find a WinMob newsgroup.


    Let me know if you find anything good, I'll stalk you there too.

  8. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, DevilsPGD said:

    > >IIIx, three Clies, Kyocera 7135, Treo 650 and Treo 680. And now, I
    > >just jumped ship to a Tilt.

    > How is the Tilt treating you so far?


    I've only had it a few hours so far. I had problems getting it to sync
    at first, and none of the suggested fixes worked. Then, poking around
    the settings on the Tilt, I found one "USB To PC", unchecking the
    option in there seems to have fixed it.

    > >From what I've seen from the sidelines, WM6 is probably the first truly
    > >usable/stable version. At least, this is the first one I've seen where
    > >you can actually CLOSE applications with the red X button, and it does
    > >that by default.

    > Not by default, but the AT&T Tilt has an add-in to fix that


    My new one, fresh out of the new and previously unopened box, the X
    button is set to close the app. Or is that what you meant?

    > You can tweak it with third party software, I've got my X set to close
    > most apps, but leave my mail client, PIM, and chat client open. Press
    > and hold for a second and I get a quick list of all open programs, and
    > can kill everything from there if needed.


    Neat trick, I'll have to remember that. I was just trying out some of
    the games, starting with "Brain Challenge", and closing it and moving
    on to "Jewel Quest 2" restarted "Brain Challenge". I had to kill Java
    to open JQ. Then the same thing happened when I tried to run "Midnight
    Pool". Bleh. None of them are listed in the Remove Programs list.

    > >I need to find a WinMob newsgroup.

    > Let me know if you find anything good, I'll stalk you there too.


    So far, I've only found comp.os.ms-windows.ce, which seems to be crap.

    --
    Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
    The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

    "Doesn't matter. If we lived two hundred years, we'd still be human.
    We'd still make the same mistakes." (Lt. Cmdr. Ivanova, B5"Soul
    Hunter")

  9. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In message Jeffrey
    Kaplan wrote:

    >Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, DevilsPGD said:
    >
    >> How is the Tilt treating you so far?

    >
    >I've only had it a few hours so far. I had problems getting it to sync
    >at first, and none of the suggested fixes worked. Then, poking around
    >the settings on the Tilt, I found one "USB To PC", unchecking the
    >option in there seems to have fixed it.


    Those first few hours can be the most frustrating, or at least they were
    for me, I desperately wanted it to work like my Palm did.

    Once I got over some of the differences and started to understand some
    of the ass-backward design choices, I felt better.

    I'm still grumpy that items in the start menu disappear from the default
    programs list -- It might just be my OCD talking, but I find a few
    oddities like that to be unforgivable.

    >> >From what I've seen from the sidelines, WM6 is probably the first truly
    >> >usable/stable version. At least, this is the first one I've seen where
    >> >you can actually CLOSE applications with the red X button, and it does
    >> >that by default.

    >> Not by default, but the AT&T Tilt has an add-in to fix that

    >
    >My new one, fresh out of the new and previously unopened box, the X
    >button is set to close the app. Or is that what you meant?


    Yeah, that's not a Windows Mobile default, it's an HTC app that does the
    trick.

    >> You can tweak it with third party software, I've got my X set to close
    >> most apps, but leave my mail client, PIM, and chat client open. Press
    >> and hold for a second and I get a quick list of all open programs, and
    >> can kill everything from there if needed.

    >
    >Neat trick, I'll have to remember that. I was just trying out some of
    >the games, starting with "Brain Challenge", and closing it and moving
    >on to "Jewel Quest 2" restarted "Brain Challenge". I had to kill Java
    >to open JQ. Then the same thing happened when I tried to run "Midnight
    >Pool". Bleh. None of them are listed in the Remove Programs list.


    Built-in stuff that existed when you opened the box? If you're brave,
    you can install custom ROMs which have less built-in crap. I haven't
    quite settled on one that I really like, although Q-Mobile (WM6.0) and
    TNT (WM6.1) were my two favourites.

    I spent untold hours reading up on the various ROMs before I even
    attempted one, and managed to break my camera and cause instability in
    some calls -- If you go down this route, note that you need to install a
    matching radio and ROM, and not all ROMs do this automatically.

    >> >I need to find a WinMob newsgroup.

    >> Let me know if you find anything good, I'll stalk you there too.

    >
    >So far, I've only found comp.os.ms-windows.ce, which seems to be crap.


    Yeah. Seems to be all web forums

  10. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In article news:<7em914pvsqrr05npml5d8bo6hshi2a9ss7@4ax.com>, DevilsPGD
    wrote:
    > My current uptime is only four days, but it's been four stable reliable
    > days with several applications (PIM, IMAP mail client, PocketIE) open
    > virtually the entire time, other applications opened while they are
    > being used.


    My Nokia's current uptime is nearly 700 times longer than that
    (approaching 8 YEARS) ... but it is just a phone, so doesn't have to cope
    with a variety of possibly misbehaving apps.

    > My Tilt, however, has been a rather pleasent
    > experience (WM6.0, and now WM6.1)


    I'm not familiar with the "Tilt" what is it and who make it? It probably
    has a different name in the UK.

    > Given all of the hardware improvements that Palm just doesn't seem to be
    > able to manage on the PalmOS side of things (3G, wifi, GPS, above-1Mp
    > camera), it was worth the gamble.


    I understand the temptation ... I have other devices that can do WiFi,
    GPS, and photography, but it does seem slightly last millennium not to
    have them in a contemporary smartphone.

    Personally I'd rather not have a camera at all, as I sometimes work in
    places that don't allow cameras onsite ... but if you're going to have a
    camera at all you should have one that's worth having! I'm rather
    surprised to see 5MPix and more image sizes from in-phone cameras, as I
    wouldn't expect the tiny little lenses to be able to provide the
    resolution to warrant it (I mean, my DSLR is only 10MPix FFS) but I'm
    prepared to be amazed!

    > I was, frankly, shocked that I have actually been enjoying the platform.




    Cheers,
    Daniel.





  11. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, DevilsPGD said:

    > >I've only had it a few hours so far. I had problems getting it to sync

    > Those first few hours can be the most frustrating, or at least they were
    > for me, I desperately wanted it to work like my Palm did.


    Yea, verily.

    > Once I got over some of the differences and started to understand some
    > of the ass-backward design choices, I felt better.


    It's like that with any systems change. I know that, but it hasn't
    stopped from swearing at it.

    > I'm still grumpy that items in the start menu disappear from the default
    > programs list -- It might just be my OCD talking, but I find a few
    > oddities like that to be unforgivable.


    I noticed that, too, when I was swapping back and forth between IE and
    Opera. That's when I actually noticed the wording on the Menus
    selector that said that checking the item will place it on the Start
    menu and everything else will show in the Programs list.

    > >My new one, fresh out of the new and previously unopened box, the X
    > >button is set to close the app. Or is that what you meant?

    > Yeah, that's not a Windows Mobile default, it's an HTC app that does the
    > trick.


    Ah.

    > >> You can tweak it with third party software, I've got my X set to close
    > >> most apps, but leave my mail client, PIM, and chat client open. Press
    > >> and hold for a second and I get a quick list of all open programs, and
    > >> can kill everything from there if needed.

    > >Neat trick, I'll have to remember that. I was just trying out some of


    Ok, how did you do that? Holding the X on mine doesn't do diddly.

    > Built-in stuff that existed when you opened the box? If you're brave,
    > you can install custom ROMs which have less built-in crap. I haven't
    > quite settled on one that I really like, although Q-Mobile (WM6.0) and
    > TNT (WM6.1) were my two favourites.


    I'm not a big fan of custom roms, especially when using something that
    is a) still within the trial period and b) still within the warrantee
    period.

    > >> >I need to find a WinMob newsgroup.
    > >> Let me know if you find anything good, I'll stalk you there too.

    > >
    > >So far, I've only found comp.os.ms-windows.ce, which seems to be crap.

    > Yeah. Seems to be all web forums


    Yeah.

    --
    Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
    The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

    "It would represent a loss of face for me to communicate with an
    inferior race." (Taq/Correlilmurzon, B5 "Acts Of Sacrifice")

  12. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, Jeffrey Kaplan said:

    > > Once I got over some of the differences and started to understand some
    > > of the ass-backward design choices, I felt better.

    > It's like that with any systems change. I know that, but it hasn't
    > stopped from swearing at it.


    Actually, the more I "play" with it, the more I'm not liking it. All
    of the negatives "people" have been saying for years about the WinMob
    interface are true. It's taking me a hell of a lot longer to actually
    get to do things. I'm going to TRY to give it at least a week of
    regular use. But this is way more than just culture shock.

    What I do like about it over the Treo, is equally true with the iPhone.
    In the end, it's the UI that will matter.

    --
    Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
    The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

    Guidelines for Legion of Doom Troops: 3. And while you're pulling
    guard duty, if anyone shows up with a prisoner transfer or maintenance
    job, and you don't know about it, arrest them on the spot.

  13. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In message <438c14d5dggifqfsjn7b7s9d7nvlfheg85@gordol.org> Jeffrey
    Kaplan wrote:

    >Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, Jeffrey Kaplan said:
    >
    >> > Once I got over some of the differences and started to understand some
    >> > of the ass-backward design choices, I felt better.

    >> It's like that with any systems change. I know that, but it hasn't
    >> stopped from swearing at it.

    >
    >Actually, the more I "play" with it, the more I'm not liking it. All
    >of the negatives "people" have been saying for years about the WinMob
    >interface are true. It's taking me a hell of a lot longer to actually
    >get to do things. I'm going to TRY to give it at least a week of
    >regular use. But this is way more than just culture shock.


    What sort of tasks?

    I'm not disagreeing, a lot of the design choices drive me nuts, but I've
    found some tools that have made my life easier, depending on what is
    bothering you, I might be able to make some suggestions.

  14. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In message Daniel James
    wrote:

    >In article news:<7em914pvsqrr05npml5d8bo6hshi2a9ss7@4ax.com>, DevilsPGD
    >wrote:
    >> My current uptime is only four days, but it's been four stable reliable
    >> days with several applications (PIM, IMAP mail client, PocketIE) open
    >> virtually the entire time, other applications opened while they are
    >> being used.

    >
    >My Nokia's current uptime is nearly 700 times longer than that
    >(approaching 8 YEARS) ... but it is just a phone, so doesn't have to cope
    >with a variety of possibly misbehaving apps.


    Yeah, my Razr was similar, it's uptime was limited only by the fact that
    the charger was plugged into a powerbar that had a habit of switching
    off overnight.

    >> My Tilt, however, has been a rather pleasent
    >> experience (WM6.0, and now WM6.1)

    >
    >I'm not familiar with the "Tilt" what is it and who make it? It probably
    >has a different name in the UK.


    Well, itís more like a choose your own adventure, you get to pick a name
    for it. Whichever one you pick will be wrong at least some of the time,
    so go nuts:

    * Kaiser
    * AT&T Tilt
    * AT&T 8925
    * HTC TyTN II
    * HTC P4550
    * SFR v1615
    * Swisscom XPA1615
    * T-Mobile MDA Vario III
    * O2 Xda Stellar
    * Vodafone v1615

    >Personally I'd rather not have a camera at all, as I sometimes work in
    >places that don't allow cameras onsite ... but if you're going to have a
    >camera at all you should have one that's worth having! I'm rather
    >surprised to see 5MPix and more image sizes from in-phone cameras, as I
    >wouldn't expect the tiny little lenses to be able to provide the
    >resolution to warrant it (I mean, my DSLR is only 10MPix FFS) but I'm
    >prepared to be amazed!


    I've really been enjoying having the 3Mp camera, not so much for
    photography's own sake, but simply having a camera with me when I need
    it.

    (This started before my Tilt, but I've been on a first generation Razr
    and Treo 680 for some time, both of which had VGA cameras)

    A quick snapshot of an ad, or a storefront, or whatever else that is
    interesting, but I just can't manage to carry my full sized camera every
    time I leave the house.

    I also refuse to work for any client that doesn't trust me with a
    camera. That's just me though. This phone is available with zero, one
    or two cameras to cover all needs.

  15. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In message Jeffrey
    Kaplan wrote:

    >Ok, how did you do that? Holding the X on mine doesn't do diddly.


    I'm using "Spb Pocket Plus" at the moment, it offers all sorts of
    additional goodies including "X" button functionality, tabbed Today
    screens, a battery indicator that is visible in all apps, tabbed Pocket
    IE browsing, and other toys.

  16. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In article news:<0ljd14lq9ed26ehsceo9ktaaud00eduetv@4ax.com>, DevilsPGD
    wrote:
    > Well, itís more like a choose your own adventure, you get to pick a name
    > for it.


    OK, I know the device. Kaiser, TyTN II, and Xda Stellar are all
    declared identifiers here (v1615 probably should be, too, as I am a
    Vodafone customer ...)

    Thanks for the clarification.

    > This phone is available with zero, one or two cameras to cover all
    > needs.


    That I didn't know. I've only seen it with 2 in the UK.

    Cheers,
    Daniel.



  17. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, DevilsPGD said:

    > >Actually, the more I "play" with it, the more I'm not liking it. All
    > >of the negatives "people" have been saying for years about the WinMob
    > >interface are true. It's taking me a hell of a lot longer to actually
    > >get to do things. I'm going to TRY to give it at least a week of
    > >regular use. But this is way more than just culture shock.

    >
    > What sort of tasks?


    Like running an application not assigned to either a button or the
    Start menu. When WinMob is opening from its base screen, it's showing
    the Agenda. So I have to tap Start, then Programs, then scroll the
    list of unorganized icons looking for the app I want.

    Then, when I find it and launch it, I find that it takes longer to
    launch and run than the PalmOS version of the same thing on the Treo -
    despite the fact that the Tilt has a dual-core processor running at
    three or four times the speed of the single-core processor in the Treo!
    And yes, I had installed the app to the internal storage, not the
    expansion card.

    > I'm not disagreeing, a lot of the design choices drive me nuts, but I've
    > found some tools that have made my life easier, depending on what is
    > bothering you, I might be able to make some suggestions.


    What I dislike about it outweighed what I liked about it. I couldn't
    even go a week with it, I returned the Tilt yesterday evening.

    What I did like about it is true for any device that is not a Treo:
    Better built-in web browser and more efficient use of the data network.
    There is no 3G yet where I live, so the Tilt was using EDGE and it was
    still faster than the Treo. But so is the iPhone. I'm now going to
    impatiently wait for June/July, hoping that Apple will upgrade the
    storage capacity in the next version of the iPhone.

    --
    Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
    The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

    "I think the American people- I hope the American- I don't think, let
    me- I hope the American people trust me." - George W. Bush, Dec. 18,
    2002

  18. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In message Daniel James
    wrote:

    >In article news:<0ljd14lq9ed26ehsceo9ktaaud00eduetv@4ax.com>, DevilsPGD
    >wrote:
    >> Well, itís more like a choose your own adventure, you get to pick a name
    >> for it.

    >
    > OK, I know the device. Kaiser, TyTN II, and Xda Stellar are all
    >declared identifiers here (v1615 probably should be, too, as I am a
    >Vodafone customer ...)
    >
    >Thanks for the clarification.
    >
    >> This phone is available with zero, one or two cameras to cover all
    >> needs.

    >
    >That I didn't know. I've only seen it with 2 in the UK.


    AT&T mainly sells one camera (the good one on the back, no video
    calling), but they do offer a no-camera version to hit the corporate
    market that is paranoid about cameras.

  19. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    In message Jeffrey
    Kaplan wrote:

    >Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, DevilsPGD said:
    >
    >> >Actually, the more I "play" with it, the more I'm not liking it. All
    >> >of the negatives "people" have been saying for years about the WinMob
    >> >interface are true. It's taking me a hell of a lot longer to actually
    >> >get to do things. I'm going to TRY to give it at least a week of
    >> >regular use. But this is way more than just culture shock.

    >>
    >> What sort of tasks?

    >
    >Like running an application not assigned to either a button or the
    >Start menu. When WinMob is opening from its base screen, it's showing
    >the Agenda. So I have to tap Start, then Programs, then scroll the
    >list of unorganized icons looking for the app I want.


    There are alternate launchers available...

    >Then, when I find it and launch it, I find that it takes longer to
    >launch and run than the PalmOS version of the same thing on the Treo -
    >despite the fact that the Tilt has a dual-core processor running at
    >three or four times the speed of the single-core processor in the Treo!
    >And yes, I had installed the app to the internal storage, not the
    >expansion card.


    This is part of why WM tends to leave apps running in the background.
    Part of what I like about the "X" manager that I mentioned to you before
    was that I could leave specific apps open that I use frequently, but
    infrequently used apps that have no background functionality close.

    >> I'm not disagreeing, a lot of the design choices drive me nuts, but I've
    >> found some tools that have made my life easier, depending on what is
    >> bothering you, I might be able to make some suggestions.

    >
    >What I dislike about it outweighed what I liked about it. I couldn't
    >even go a week with it, I returned the Tilt yesterday evening.


    Ahh. Yeah, I'd have done the same at day 2-3, it took me a good week
    before I learned it's quirks and started to enjoy the positives.

    >What I did like about it is true for any device that is not a Treo:
    >Better built-in web browser and more efficient use of the data network.
    >There is no 3G yet where I live, so the Tilt was using EDGE and it was
    >still faster than the Treo. But so is the iPhone. I'm now going to
    >impatiently wait for June/July, hoping that Apple will upgrade the
    >storage capacity in the next version of the iPhone.


    Yeah, even on EDGE it's been decent. Another fun exercise, go for a
    drive through the mountains where coverage goes in and out all day, my
    Treo 680 couldn't make it 4 hours, the Tilt lasted all day.

    Another one I forgot -- The Tilt's clock works. After two weeks without
    access to the cell network or a HotSync, my Treo 680's clock is now a
    good 45 minutes off.

    *sigh*

    I miss PalmOS, but I don't miss my Palm.

  20. Re: Want to replace my TX, but what's out there?

    Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, DevilsPGD said:

    > >Like running an application not assigned to either a button or the
    > >Start menu. When WinMob is opening from its base screen, it's showing
    > >the Agenda. So I have to tap Start, then Programs, then scroll the
    > >list of unorganized icons looking for the app I want.

    >
    > There are alternate launchers available...


    My take on it is that if I have to install an alternate launcher just
    to make it usable, it's not worth the hassle. The alternate launcher I
    use on my Treo doesn't fix the usability, it enhances the usability. I
    can use my Treo just fine without the alternate launcher. I was unable
    to do that with the Tilt.

    > >Then, when I find it and launch it, I find that it takes longer to
    > >launch and run than the PalmOS version of the same thing on the Treo -
    > >despite the fact that the Tilt has a dual-core processor running at
    > >three or four times the speed of the single-core processor in the Treo!
    > >And yes, I had installed the app to the internal storage, not the
    > >expansion card.

    >
    > This is part of why WM tends to leave apps running in the background.


    I'm not about to leave things like my checkbook register software
    running constantly in the background.

    On the other hand, I do recognize that it's better than prior versions
    and as such, would be a worthy upgrade for someone using an older HTC
    slider.

    > >What I dislike about it outweighed what I liked about it. I couldn't
    > >even go a week with it, I returned the Tilt yesterday evening.

    > Ahh. Yeah, I'd have done the same at day 2-3, it took me a good week
    > before I learned it's quirks and started to enjoy the positives.


    Some things I'm willing to do that with, some things I'm not. This is
    one of those "not" items.

    > Yeah, even on EDGE it's been decent. Another fun exercise, go for a
    > drive through the mountains where coverage goes in and out all day, my
    > Treo 680 couldn't make it 4 hours, the Tilt lasted all day.


    Oh, I know. The Treo does not cycle off the phone radio when there is
    no signal, it ramps up the power looking for signal which will drain
    the battery if it's not plugged in.

    > Another one I forgot -- The Tilt's clock works. After two weeks without
    > access to the cell network or a HotSync, my Treo 680's clock is now a
    > good 45 minutes off.


    Stop removing the battery.

    --
    Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
    The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

    Peter's Top 100 Things I'd Do If I Ever Became An Evil Overlord, #86. I
    will make sure that my doomsday device is up to code and properly
    grounded.

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