What's next after Treo? - Palmtop

This is a discussion on What's next after Treo? - Palmtop ; I've been using the Treo phones for three years now, and Palm PDAs since 1999, and frankly I'm ready for something new. Palm devices just don't live up to their promise. The treo is big and fat in my pocket, ...

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Thread: What's next after Treo?

  1. What's next after Treo?

    I've been using the Treo phones for three years now, and Palm PDAs
    since 1999, and frankly I'm ready for something new.

    Palm devices just don't live up to their promise. The treo is big and
    fat in my pocket, the browser is useless for all but the simplest of
    web sites, the phone often freezes or takes ten or fifteen seconds to
    do simple things like start the browser. Several times I've missed
    calls because my Treo froze when I pressed the answer button.

    Palm as a software platform is barely any better today than it was a
    decade ago. There are few brand name software products available for
    Palm OS. If you want Joe's instant messenger, or Bob's mail client,
    fine, but if you prefer Yahoo Messenger or Outlook, you're not going
    to find it on Palm. And why should I have to pay extra for simple
    things like backup utilities?

    All the desktop conduits and licensing schemes are confusing and
    counterproductive. Each time I have upgraded my computer or purchased
    a new Treo, I've lost something that used to work and couldn't figure
    out how to reinstall it. It doesn't help that I have to deal with Joe
    and Bob instead of a real software company for a lot of these things.
    I have no idea what's really happening when I press the sync button.
    Is all my data being backed up? Where is it going? If I needed to
    restore it, could I do it? I guess I could pay (again) for one of
    these "we promise to back up everything" backup programs, but that's
    getting old.

    Now that there are so many other choices on the market, with better
    web browsers, faster connectivity, better cameras, and real web
    browsers, Palm seems like it's getting left in the dust. The only
    question is whether I can upgrade to something that will automatically
    import my contacts and notes from my old Treo. That would be nice, but
    ultimately, I'm not going to let it limit my choice.

    Frank

  2. Re: What's next after Treo?

    flarosa wrote in news:788bc132-3360-406a-89c8-
    ba33fd7e1a4a@s19g2000prg.googlegroups.com:

    > Now that there are so many other choices on the market, with better
    > web browsers, faster connectivity, better cameras, and real web
    > browsers, Palm seems like it's getting left in the dust. The only
    > question is whether I can upgrade to something that will automatically
    > import my contacts and notes from my old Treo. That would be nice, but
    > ultimately, I'm not going to let it limit my choice.


    Good luck. I'd look into the Symbian, Blackberry or Linux phones before
    I'd consider a Windows' one. If you think the Palm locks up too much wait
    till you try Windows Mobile.

    I personally like dealing with "Joe and Bob's" instead of M$. I just
    bought a Centro and have been able to move all the programs I really used
    on my Samsung i500 without problems. I like the simpliciy of the Palm
    (Access) OS. I hope the Centro isn't their last Palm OS phone.

    --
    RonB
    "There's a story there...somewhere"

  3. Re: What's next after Treo?

    flarosa wrote:
    >Palm as a software platform is barely any better today than it was a
    >decade ago. There are few brand name software products available for
    >Palm OS. If you want Joe's instant messenger, or Bob's mail client,
    >fine, but if you prefer Yahoo Messenger or Outlook, you're not going
    >to find it on Palm. And why should I have to pay extra for simple
    >things like backup utilities?
    >
    >All the desktop conduits and licensing schemes are confusing and
    >counterproductive. Each time I have upgraded my computer or purchased
    >a new Treo, I've lost something that used to work and couldn't figure
    >out how to reinstall it. It doesn't help that I have to deal with Joe
    >and Bob instead of a real software company for a lot of these things.
    >I have no idea what's really happening when I press the sync button.
    >Is all my data being backed up? Where is it going? If I needed to
    >restore it, could I do it? I guess I could pay (again) for one of
    >these "we promise to back up everything" backup programs, but that's
    >getting old.


    That's the state of the market for all mobile devices -- it's what you're willing to trade off. No platform has it all. You seem you've reached the end of the line with palm...good luck in your search for what fits you right.

    --

    **Life is too short to wait while I figure out my quirks.**

  4. Re: What's next after Treo?

    In article
    <788bc132-3360-406a-89c8-ba33fd7e1a4a@s19g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
    flarosa wrote:

    > I've been using the Treo phones for three years now, and Palm PDAs
    > since 1999, and frankly I'm ready for something new.


    iPhone.

  5. Re: What's next after Treo?

    Per RonB:
    > I'd look into the Symbian, Blackberry or Linux phones before
    >I'd consider a Windows' one.


    Has anybody got some background information on OpenMoko?

    viz http://tinyurl.com/2nab2d

    Great-sounding idea, but it doesn't seem tb going anywhere.

    If I were them, I'd be hoping for a sugar daddy - like, maybe,
    Google to infuse come $.
    --
    PeteCresswell

  6. Re: What's next after Treo?

    (PeteCresswell) wrote:
    > Per RonB:
    >> I'd look into the Symbian, Blackberry or Linux phones before
    >> I'd consider a Windows' one.

    >
    > Has anybody got some background information on OpenMoko?
    >
    > viz http://tinyurl.com/2nab2d
    >
    > Great-sounding idea, but it doesn't seem tb going anywhere.
    >
    > If I were them, I'd be hoping for a sugar daddy - like, maybe,
    > Google to infuse come $.


    Google has their own Android project, why would they support
    OpenMoko?

  7. Re: What's next after Treo?

    flarosa wrote:
    > I've been using the Treo phones for three years now, and Palm PDAs
    > since 1999, and frankly I'm ready for something new.


    What functionality is it you are missing/need/want?


    > Palm devices just don't live up to their promise. The treo is big and
    > fat in my pocket, the browser is useless for all but the simplest of
    > web sites, the phone often freezes or takes ten or fifteen seconds to
    > do simple things like start the browser. Several times I've missed
    > calls because my Treo froze when I pressed the answer button.


    Which Treo model are you using? And what world are you in?
    The centro model is smaller, but it still runs Palm OS.
    Palm 500v? in europe? runs windows mobile, but i think it
    misses the sound on/off slider key.


    [cuuuuuuut]


    > Now that there are so many other choices on the market, with better
    > web browsers, faster connectivity, better cameras, and real web
    > browsers, Palm seems like it's getting left in the dust. The only
    > question is whether I can upgrade to something that will automatically
    > import my contacts and notes from my old Treo. That would be nice, but
    > ultimately, I'm not going to let it limit my choice.


    I have a palm treo 750v with windows mobile 6. I am not sure
    the windows mobile browser is any better than the 650 it replaced.

    I like the 3G and that windows mobile can send sms in the
    background. Other than that i miss palm os.

  8. Re: What's next after Treo?

    Per Jon Bendtsen:
    >Android


    ?
    --
    PeteCresswell

  9. Re: What's next after Treo?

    In message Shawn
    Hirn wrote:

    >In article
    ><788bc132-3360-406a-89c8-ba33fd7e1a4a@s19g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
    > flarosa wrote:
    >
    >> I've been using the Treo phones for three years now, and Palm PDAs
    >> since 1999, and frankly I'm ready for something new.

    >
    >iPhone.


    If you like the limited set of applications you're provided, it's not a
    bad device. Power browser, but crippled by the lack of 3G support.

    Unfortunately, as a PDA, it's less then steller, many very basic tasks
    take many many more steps to accomplish, and typing is more then a bit
    of a pain if you're accustomed to typing quickly, with two hands,
    without looking at the keyboard.

  10. Re: What's next after Treo?

    In message Jon Bendtsen
    wrote:

    >flarosa wrote:
    >> I've been using the Treo phones for three years now, and Palm PDAs
    >> since 1999, and frankly I'm ready for something new.

    >
    >What functionality is it you are missing/need/want?


    I use my Treo as a data-only device, no voice at all -- I'd love to
    ditch the Razr and go to a single device -- I did it for a few months,
    but the voice quality was sufficiently miserable that it wasn't worth
    sticking with the Treo, and when combined with the number of times the
    680 would lockup when receiving a call and I'd lose the call (and to add
    insult to injury, I'd also lose the number, meaning I couldn't just call
    back unless I happened to recall who was calling and already had their
    number with me. As a solution, I picked up a Razr2 V9 instead)

    With that in mind, for myself, a number of things are causing me to
    debate replacing my Treo 680 -- In no particular order;

    Reliability (especially with regards to networking and phone features)

    Decent battery life (I'd like to be able to be away from a charger for a
    full day without having to worry)

    Substantially slimmer form factor (moto Q, Blackberry Curve, Blackjack)

    Halfway decent audio quality would be nice too, both in the handset and
    bluetooth.

    3G support.

    Wifi (no unlimited data around here, sadly)

    Decent SyncML client, or Windows x64 driver support (would both be too
    much to ask?)

    GPS (I currently use a bluetooth driven solution. Aside from killing
    the battery, this just adds one more device to my already bulging
    pockets)

    Simultaneous voice and data support wouldn't hurt, I can't even count
    how many times I've used my Treo while on the phone on my Razr.

    Probably a few other things that I'm forgetting.

  11. Re: What's next after Treo?

    (PeteCresswell) wrote:
    > Per Jon Bendtsen:
    >> Android

    >
    > ?


    http://www.treocentral.com/content/Stories/1407-1.htm




    JonB

  12. Re: What's next after Treo?

    + "(PeteCresswell)" :

    > Per RonB:
    >> I'd look into the Symbian, Blackberry or Linux phones before
    >>I'd consider a Windows' one.

    >
    > Has anybody got some background information on OpenMoko?
    >
    > viz http://tinyurl.com/2nab2d
    >
    > Great-sounding idea, but it doesn't seem tb going anywhere.


    To me, it looks like they are moving along, but not as fast as one
    could wish: Both software and hardware development is delayed a bit.
    Note that I know nothing that cannot be found out by spending an hour
    or two looking at openmoko.org.

    --
    * Harald Hanche-Olsen
    - It is undesirable to believe a proposition
    when there is no ground whatsoever for supposing it is true.
    -- Bertrand Russell

  13. Re: What's next after Treo?

    flarosa wrote:
    > Now that there are so many other choices on the market, with better
    > web browsers, faster connectivity, better cameras, and real web
    > browsers, Palm seems like it's getting left in the dust. The only
    > question is whether I can upgrade to something that will automatically
    > import my contacts and notes from my old Treo. That would be nice, but
    > ultimately, I'm not going to let it limit my choice.


    Can someone explain the rationale behind this for me? Palm made hardware
    & software... very successfully. The split the software division to a
    separate company called Palm & changed their own (hardware) name to
    PalmOne. Palm was sold to Access. Suddenly PalmOne lost control of the
    software side and the Palm name. PalmOne decided the Palm name was
    important so they bought it back from Access & changed their PalmOne
    name back to Palm Computing. Then Palm Computing realises that control
    of both the hardware & software is important so they are now making
    their own OS from scratch, again.

    Does anyone think this company might have lost its direction?


    --
    Please remove SpamMeNot to reply. I apologise for the necessary use
    of this anti-spammation method.

  14. Re: What's next after Treo?

    In article
    news:<1ia28eb.1r4iy4y1g1qngdN%UseNet@AustOrtho.Com.SpAm. MeN.oT>, Kwan
    Yeoh wrote:
    > ... Then Palm Computing realises that control of both the hardware
    > & software is important so they are now making their own OS from
    > scratch, again.
    >
    > Does anyone think this company might have lost its direction?


    It's clear that they've taken a few wrong turns ... BeOS and PalmOS6,
    linux (or not linux), Windows Mobile ... but it may be that they have
    now found their direction again.

    Of course, they could do worse than license SymbianOS (and write a
    layer on top of that to run existing PalmOS applications, so that the
    vast body of excellent third-party applications won't be wasted).

    Cheers,
    Daniel.







  15. Re: What's next after Treo?

    In article news:,
    (PeteCresswell) wrote:
    > Has anybody got some background information on OpenMoko?


    Linux Journal (Dec'07) has an interview with Sean Moss-Pultz of FIC,
    who seems to be the driving force behind OpenMoko and the FIC Neo1973
    phone.

    http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/9886

    It's an interesting project, and laudably Open Source. I hope it goes
    far.

    > Great-sounding idea, but it doesn't seem tb going anywhere.


    It seems to be making progress. I don't know how fast one should expect
    such a project to move ... nor how exactly one goes about pushing along
    a project that depends so much on Open Source and volunteer developers.

    One answer in that LJ interview says:

    We were going to start selling a version of this phone in October
    2007 -- I think at that point, it will be ready for a technical
    user. [As far as] how much longer it takes before it transitions
    to the typical end user, like my mom or dad, we will keep selling
    it and play that by ear. My gut tells me something like February
    or March 2008.

    I'll certainly be looking out for that with some interest.

    > If I were them, I'd be hoping for a sugar daddy - like, maybe,
    > Google to infuse come $.


    FIC is a fair-sized and well-established company. I'm sure they can
    keep the project going without the need to be swallowed up by others.
    Google is already somewhat involved as their "Summer of Code" has
    sponsored contributions to OpenMoko.

    Cheers,
    Daniel.



  16. Re: What's next after Treo?

    Zombie Elvis wrote:

    > > Palm was sold to Access.

    >
    > *PalmSource* was bought by Access. The Palm name was actually owned by
    > a holding company which was jointly owned by PalmOne and PalmSource.
    > It has been rumored that PalmOne had tried to buy PalmSource but was
    > outbid by Access but we don't know for sure if that is true or not. It
    > was after this deal happened that PalmOne paid PalmSource for the sole
    > rights to the Palm name and a perpetual license to the Garnet OS (AKA
    > PalmOS 5.x).


    Ah, you're right. I forgot about the PalmSource name. I don't understand
    why Palm would spin off PalmSource as a separate company, then try to
    buy it back again.

    --
    Please remove SpamMeNot to reply. I apologise for the necessary use
    of this anti-spammation method.

  17. Re: What's next after Treo?

    Kwan Yeoh wrote:
    > Zombie Elvis wrote:
    >
    >>> Palm was sold to Access.

    >> *PalmSource* was bought by Access. The Palm name was actually owned by
    >> a holding company which was jointly owned by PalmOne and PalmSource.
    >> It has been rumored that PalmOne had tried to buy PalmSource but was
    >> outbid by Access but we don't know for sure if that is true or not. It
    >> was after this deal happened that PalmOne paid PalmSource for the sole
    >> rights to the Palm name and a perpetual license to the Garnet OS (AKA
    >> PalmOS 5.x).

    >
    > Ah, you're right. I forgot about the PalmSource name. I don't understand
    > why Palm would spin off PalmSource as a separate company, then try to
    > buy it back again.


    I do. As a strategy, they wanted PalmOS to be as popular as possible;
    they felt they could compete better as the largest maker of machines
    using the most popular OS, than as one of a handful of companies
    struggling against a dominant Microsoft. And they thought that this
    would be more likely if other PDA/Smartphone makers didn't regard PalmOS
    as Palm's baby.

    Unfortunately, they didn't allow for the number of people in this world
    who are willing to kiss Microsoft's arse.

    When Palm became the only important PalmOS company, it made more sense
    for them to own it again.
    --
    John W. Kennedy
    "The pathetic hope that the White House will turn a Caligula into a
    Marcus Aurelius is as na´ve as the fear that ultimate power inevitably
    corrupts."
    -- James D. Barber (1930-2004)

  18. Re: What's next after Treo?

    On Sat, 5 Jan 2008 23:48:42 +1100, UseNet@AustOrtho.Com.SpAm.MeN.oT
    (Kwan Yeoh) wrote:

    >Zombie Elvis wrote:
    >
    >> > Palm was sold to Access.

    >>
    >> *PalmSource* was bought by Access. The Palm name was actually owned by
    >> a holding company which was jointly owned by PalmOne and PalmSource.
    >> It has been rumored that PalmOne had tried to buy PalmSource but was
    >> outbid by Access but we don't know for sure if that is true or not. It
    >> was after this deal happened that PalmOne paid PalmSource for the sole
    >> rights to the Palm name and a perpetual license to the Garnet OS (AKA
    >> PalmOS 5.x).

    >
    >Ah, you're right. I forgot about the PalmSource name. I don't understand
    >why Palm would spin off PalmSource as a separate company, then try to
    >buy it back again.


    Basically, it was a failed strategy for Palm/PalmOne. The "Palm
    Economy" it wanted to foster stopped growing after Sony stopped
    manufacturing PalmOS PDAs and Palm lost control of its OS at a time
    when it was finding itself more and more under the thumb of US
    cellular phone carriers. Worse yet, PalmSource failed to produce a
    useable replacement OS for Garnet. (They produced a version of PalmOS
    6.0 called "Cobalt" but none of its licensees wanted to use it.) I
    think that this was the main reason why Palm would have wanted to buy
    PalmSource, in order to get back control of its OS.
    --
    "Actually, the Medium Point Bic Round Stick is the preferred
    pen for emergency tracheotomies."
    -- ER doctor from Wonderfalls

    Roberto Castillo
    robertocastillo@ameritech.net

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