Ubuntu sucks - OS2

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  1. Ubuntu sucks

    I've played around a little with SUSE which I thought was alright, but
    figured with all I hear about Ubuntu, it was worth a shot. so I
    downloaded 7.04, burned a CD and booted it from my main desktop box.

    after going through the first series of questions, the disk
    partitioning chapter came up, defaulted to managing the entire disk,
    rather than the freespace at the end, which I didn't appreciate.

    eventually I got it to offer me a swap partition and another for
    installation -- but even then I had a hard time getting the radio
    button to format the new partitions.

    the installation started, then aborted in five minutes with a cryptic
    message about setting up the disks. I yanked the CD & when I tried to
    reboot, the system hung, looking for a CD from which to boot. when I
    rebooted from a DFSee CD (thank goodness for DFSee) I saw that Ubuntu
    had wiped away the Boot Manager contents.

    say what you will about SUSE, it never did anything close to that.
    any recommendations? for another distro?


  2. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    rafe wrote:
    > I've played around a little with SUSE which I thought was alright, but
    > figured with all I hear about Ubuntu, it was worth a shot. so I
    > downloaded 7.04, burned a CD and booted it from my main desktop box.
    >
    > after going through the first series of questions, the disk
    > partitioning chapter came up, defaulted to managing the entire disk,
    > rather than the freespace at the end, which I didn't appreciate.
    >
    > eventually I got it to offer me a swap partition and another for
    > installation -- but even then I had a hard time getting the radio
    > button to format the new partitions.
    >
    > the installation started, then aborted in five minutes with a cryptic
    > message about setting up the disks. I yanked the CD & when I tried to
    > reboot, the system hung, looking for a CD from which to boot. when I
    > rebooted from a DFSee CD (thank goodness for DFSee) I saw that Ubuntu
    > had wiped away the Boot Manager contents.
    >
    > say what you will about SUSE, it never did anything close to that.
    > any recommendations? for another distro?
    >

    you just do not like the defaults. A chacun son gout. If you follow the
    advanced route (ie hot shots) is goes pretty well.

  3. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    On Tue, 22 May 2007 13:08:01 UTC, rafe wrote:

    > I've played around a little with SUSE which I thought was alright, but
    > figured with all I hear about Ubuntu, it was worth a shot. so I
    > downloaded 7.04, burned a CD and booted it from my main desktop box.
    >
    > after going through the first series of questions, the disk
    > partitioning chapter came up, defaulted to managing the entire disk,
    > rather than the freespace at the end, which I didn't appreciate.
    >
    > eventually I got it to offer me a swap partition and another for
    > installation -- but even then I had a hard time getting the radio
    > button to format the new partitions.
    >
    > the installation started, then aborted in five minutes with a cryptic
    > message about setting up the disks. I yanked the CD & when I tried to
    > reboot, the system hung, looking for a CD from which to boot. when I
    > rebooted from a DFSee CD (thank goodness for DFSee) I saw that Ubuntu
    > had wiped away the Boot Manager contents.
    >
    > say what you will about SUSE, it never did anything close to that.
    > any recommendations? for another distro?
    >


    Xandros plays pretty well with OS/2 and boot manager. However, I am not
    impressed with their support. They don't seem to update the common
    applications like Firefox, Thunderbird, Open Office, etc. as new
    releases come out..

    --
    Chuck McKinnis
    mckinnis@sandia.net
    Covenant Solutions
    http://7cities.net/~mckinnis/

  4. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    rafe wrote:

    > I've played around a little with SUSE which I thought was alright, but
    > figured with all I hear about Ubuntu, it was worth a shot. so I
    > downloaded 7.04, burned a CD and booted it from my main desktop box.
    >
    > after going through the first series of questions, the disk
    > partitioning chapter came up, defaulted to managing the entire disk,
    > rather than the freespace at the end, which I didn't appreciate.
    >
    > eventually I got it to offer me a swap partition and another for
    > installation -- but even then I had a hard time getting the radio
    > button to format the new partitions.
    >
    > the installation started, then aborted in five minutes with a cryptic
    > message about setting up the disks. I yanked the CD & when I tried to
    > reboot, the system hung, looking for a CD from which to boot. when I
    > rebooted from a DFSee CD (thank goodness for DFSee) I saw that Ubuntu
    > had wiped away the Boot Manager contents.
    >
    > say what you will about SUSE, it never did anything close to that.
    > any recommendations? for another distro?


    I've tried several - Ubuntu, openSUSE, Red Hat, Mandriva, Gentoo - and
    basically decided that openSUSE was the least hassle and the easiest
    install to control (I run at least 4 OSs on the sandbox machine). I did
    manage to convince Ubuntu to leave the @#$%^ MBR alone, but it's a fight
    and I am not impressed by the result anyway.

    --
    Will Honea

  5. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    Am 22.05.07 08.08 schrieb rafe:
    > I've played around a little with SUSE which I thought was alright, but
    > figured with all I hear about Ubuntu, it was worth a shot. so I
    > downloaded 7.04, burned a CD and booted it from my main desktop box.
    >
    > after going through the first series of questions, the disk
    > partitioning chapter came up, defaulted to managing the entire disk,
    > rather than the freespace at the end, which I didn't appreciate.
    >
    > eventually I got it to offer me a swap partition and another for
    > installation -- but even then I had a hard time getting the radio
    > button to format the new partitions.
    >
    > the installation started, then aborted in five minutes with a cryptic
    > message about setting up the disks. I yanked the CD & when I tried to
    > reboot, the system hung, looking for a CD from which to boot. when I
    > rebooted from a DFSee CD (thank goodness for DFSee) I saw that Ubuntu
    > had wiped away the Boot Manager contents.


    Did you use the Live/Desktop CD?

    AFAIK the Live/Desktop version still installs straight into your MBR and is
    mainly targeted for Windows users, gotten curious about Linux.

    In order to do a more customised installation, as it most likely would be the
    case for most of us here, one has to use the Alternate CD, which offers more
    options and allows for the boot loader to be installed into the target
    partition's boot record, from where it can be started by the OS/2 Boot Manager.


  6. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    On May 22, 3:55 pm, Will Honea wrote:

    > I've tried several - Ubuntu, openSUSE, Red Hat, Mandriva, Gentoo - and
    > basically decided that openSUSE was the least hassle and the easiest
    > install to control (I run at least 4 OSs on the sandbox machine). I did
    > manage to convince Ubuntu to leave the @#$%^ MBR alone, but it's a fight
    > and I am not impressed by the result anyway.
    >
    > --
    > Will Honea


    yeah, I guess I wanted to experiment, too. just wish the result had
    been more encouraging.

    I had a few beefs with SUSE -- apart from my lack of expertise about
    Linux in general -- 1) installing mp3 support was a nuisance; 2) I
    have Nvidia cards, and getting drivers installed as of the last couple
    of versions was also somewhat of a nuisance -- yes, I know I should be
    able to recompile, and it would even be fun, but I don't really have
    the time, and 3) I'm not sure about the HPFS support -- though
    admittedly the FSTAB stuff gives me a headache, which yeah I know is
    my fault. well, now that I'm at it, RPMs and Yast seemed to go
    haywire on my secondary box , causing me to go to a thirdparty
    application which actually seemed to work alright.

    DOSEMU would be very big for me. but getting it running is also a
    chore -- really , OS/2 is all I need or want. but shopping for a new
    NIC was a little alarming .

    but the SUSE installation into my Thinkpad went very smoothly, I will
    say that, and looks quite handsome as well.


  7. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    rafe wrote:

    > I had a few beefs with SUSE -- apart from my lack of expertise about
    > Linux in general -- 1) installing mp3 support was a nuisance; 2) I
    > have Nvidia cards, and getting drivers installed as of the last couple
    > of versions was also somewhat of a nuisance -- yes, I know I should be
    > able to recompile, and it would even be fun, but I don't really have
    > the time, and *3) I'm not sure about the HPFS support -- though
    > admittedly the FSTAB stuff gives me a headache, which yeah I know is
    > my fault. *well, now that I'm at it, RPMs and Yast seemed to go
    > haywire on my secondary box , causing me to go to a thirdparty
    > application which actually seemed to work alright.
    >


    HPFS support is working quite well here - except for chkdsk to clear a dirty
    flag after a bad shutdown - but DFSEE takes care of that for me.

    The fstab line I use is:
    /dev/hda6 /os2/E hpfs users,gid=users,umask=0000 0 0

    One fstab entry per OS/2 drive letter.

    --
    Will Honea

  8. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    in 227545 20070522 232918 Wolfi wrote:

    >Did you use the Live/Desktop CD?
    >
    >AFAIK the Live/Desktop version still installs straight into your MBR and is
    >mainly targeted for Windows users, gotten curious about Linux.


    No, that's not true. I've installed the last 4 releases of Ubuntu from the L/D
    CD onto multi-boot OS/2 systems without problems (though I do use Airboot
    in preference to BM).

  9. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    rafe wrote:
    > On May 22, 3:55 pm, Will Honea wrote:
    >
    >
    >>I've tried several - Ubuntu, openSUSE, Red Hat, Mandriva, Gentoo - and
    >>basically decided that openSUSE was the least hassle and the easiest
    >>install to control (I run at least 4 OSs on the sandbox machine). I did
    >>manage to convince Ubuntu to leave the @#$%^ MBR alone, but it's a fight
    >>and I am not impressed by the result anyway.
    >>
    >>--
    >>Will Honea

    >
    >
    > yeah, I guess I wanted to experiment, too. just wish the result had
    > been more encouraging.
    >
    > I had a few beefs with SUSE -- apart from my lack of expertise about
    > Linux in general -- 1) installing mp3 support was a nuisance;


    It may be harder in OpenSuse (I have 9.3 installed) but I don't remember
    doing anything special to get it up. I use XMMS or MPlayer.

    > 2) I
    > have Nvidia cards, and getting drivers installed as of the last couple
    > of versions was also somewhat of a nuisance -- yes, I know I should be
    > able to recompile, and it would even be fun, but I don't really have
    > the time,


    Have you used NVidia's self-installer scripts? You do have to come all
    the way out of X to use them ("init 3" as root), but once you do, they
    are really easy. Just a couple of Yes/No questions and it will build
    the kernel interface for the driver for you automatically. It is more
    of a pain than most drivers because you have to do this for every kernel
    revision, but it's relatively painless. Don't even really have to
    reboot. Just "init 5" and you're back up in X using your new driver.

    > and 3) I'm not sure about the HPFS support -- though
    > admittedly the FSTAB stuff gives me a headache, which yeah I know is
    > my fault. well, now that I'm at it, RPMs and Yast seemed to go
    > haywire on my secondary box , causing me to go to a thirdparty
    > application which actually seemed to work alright.


    Do you have all of the right keys installed in your RPM keychain? I had
    some problems with that initially which really plagued me.

    > DOSEMU would be very big for me. but getting it running is also a
    > chore -- really , OS/2 is all I need or want. but shopping for a new
    > NIC was a little alarming .


    OS/2 definitely had better DOS support than you can get with DOSEmu,
    even set up and running perfectly. Bochs can get you closer, but it is
    that much harder to set up.

    > but the SUSE installation into my Thinkpad went very smoothly, I will
    > say that, and looks quite handsome as well.


    I'm definitely enjoying Suse on my system.

    --
    [Reverse the parts of the e-mail address to reply.]

  10. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    On 22 May 2007 06:08:01 -0700, rafe wrote:

    :>I've played around a little with SUSE which I thought was alright, but
    :>figured with all I hear about Ubuntu, it was worth a shot. so I
    :>downloaded 7.04, burned a CD and booted it from my main desktop box.
    :>
    :>after going through the first series of questions, the disk
    :>partitioning chapter came up, defaulted to managing the entire disk,
    :>rather than the freespace at the end, which I didn't appreciate.
    :>
    :>eventually I got it to offer me a swap partition and another for
    :>installation -- but even then I had a hard time getting the radio
    :>button to format the new partitions.
    :>
    :>the installation started, then aborted in five minutes with a cryptic
    :>message about setting up the disks. I yanked the CD & when I tried to
    :>reboot, the system hung, looking for a CD from which to boot. when I
    :>rebooted from a DFSee CD (thank goodness for DFSee) I saw that Ubuntu
    :>had wiped away the Boot Manager contents.
    :>
    :>say what you will about SUSE, it never did anything close to that.
    :>any recommendations? for another distro?

    I'm reasonably happy with Mandriva, but always installed the real thing, not
    from the live CD, so I'm not sure how the 'live cd' install would go. All my
    machine are multiboot (using airboot now).

    Mat Nieuwenhoven



  11. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    On Wed, 23 May 2007 11:36:18 -0700, Marty wrote:

    > I'm definitely enjoying Suse on my system.


    Another one adding to the problem! At least give it its full name:

    "Microsoft Suse"

    http://boycottnovell.com/

    Wayne
    --
    Registered Linux user #375994
    http://www.geocities.jp/rondonko/

  12. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    rafe wrote:

    > say what you will about SUSE, it never did anything close to that.
    > any recommendations? for another distro?


    I gave once Fedora a shot and I liked it pretty much.




  13. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    Wayne wrote:
    > On Thu, 24 May 2007 12:28:19 +0200, Riccardo Rubini wrote:
    >
    >
    >>rafe wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>say what you will about SUSE, it never did anything close to that. any
    >>>recommendations? for another distro?

    >>
    >>I gave once Fedora a shot and I liked it pretty much.

    >
    >
    > At least it isn't owned by Microsucks like Novell/Suse
    >
    > Wayne


    I installed Slacware on a machine 1ith 32MB [note] a year or so ago and
    liked it. I upgraded to 64MB and found that current versions of Ubuntu
    and RedHat require lots more memory just to install.

    [note] may be 16MB and 32MB, I can't recall just now, but anyhow the
    bloat is amazing.


  14. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    On Thu, 24 May 2007 17:56:36 -0500, Peter Flass wrote:

    > I installed Slacware on a machine 1ith 32MB [note] a year or so ago and
    > liked it. I upgraded to 64MB and found that current versions of Ubuntu
    > and RedHat require lots more memory just to install.
    >
    > [note] may be 16MB and 32MB, I can't recall just now, but anyhow the
    > bloat is amazing.


    I hear noises of satisfaction coming from people using Debian Etch.
    I had trouble installing Xubuntu on a machine with limited memory,
    even though it was the minimum required it still would stop when
    coming to the partitioner. Had to use the alternative CD. I
    recently installed Ubuntu on another machine and it went with no
    problem. That version is a Japanese customised version and the
    DBCS fonts are a million times better looking than installing
    the English version with Japanese language support. Once I had
    it installed I just switched the default language to UK English.

    Wayne
    --
    Registered Linux user #375994
    http://www.geocities.jp/rondonko/

  15. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    rafe schrieb:
    >
    >
    > I had a few beefs with SUSE -- apart from my lack of expertise about
    > Linux in general --

    ....
    > 3) I'm not sure about the HPFS support -- though
    > admittedly the FSTAB stuff gives me a headache, which yeah I know is
    > my fault.


    What is your problem with HPFS ?

    Hendrik

  16. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    Wayne wrote:
    > I hear noises of satisfaction coming from people using Debian Etch.


    I tried the latest Ubuntu - Grizzley Gnat? - but then happened upon
    PCLinuxOS 2007, aka 'PCLOS' and 'PCLOS07'. Mostly Mandriva-based, but
    with Debian's excellent Synaptic apt-get front end. The distro has a
    user-friendly installer (it does NOT assume that you want the bootloader
    in the MBR) and really 'just works'. MP3, streaming of all kinds,
    whatever, out of the box or repository. Save for weak
    internationalization and the absence of some 'WPS' functionality, I
    don't miss a thing. A nearly perfect solution for non-geeks. Of course,
    Bluewhite64 is more fun if you own an AMD system and like to be forced
    to learn some Linux...

  17. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    On Jun 12, 8:42 am, Felix Miata
    wrote:
    > On 2007/05/27 08:24 (GMT-0700) rafe apparently typed:
    >
    > > this OS/2 setup has been giving me some trouble (hopefully resolved)
    > > but in an attempt to check out the HW I booted the SUSE 10.1 DVD and
    > > tried to install. it told me I have too many partitions (I do, about
    > > 15 or so) and I couldn't figure out a way to install without it
    > > wanting to delete a bunch. is there a workaround?

    >
    > Not if you're trying to install to SATA. This problem is a kernel problem, not a SUSE problem. All recent distros that don't already have it soon will.
    >
    > I don't remember what the story was in 10.1, but in 10.2 to install to PATA you provide to the kernel during installation boot the following:
    >
    > brokenmodules=ata_piix
    >
    > https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=214992
    > --
    > "Respect everyone." I Peter 2:17 NIV
    >
    > Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409
    >
    > Felix Miata *** http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/




    just as a side note: as it happens, the drive is scsi, with 20 logical
    partitions on it. the last day or two I've made a few attempts with
    the Alternate CD but I can't seem to find a way to get it to partition
    it successfully: I've put a 1MB swap partition, a 10MB partition for
    \, and a 7MB Home partition, but it keeps reporting "the ext3 file
    system creation in partition #20 of scsi1 (0,0,0) (sda) failed"

    but -- that's actually not why I'm posting: I'm about to take delivery
    of a new little box

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16856110057

    on which I plan to install some flavor of Linux, plus XP, and might
    even someday take a crack at with ecs 1.2. I'll partition with DFSee,
    then install ubuntu (hopefully), then XP.

    what I can't seem to grasp is, at what point in the ubuntu
    installation process do I specify that the boot loader be installed
    into the ubuntu partition's boot record?

    & I don't know if it's realated, but the ubuntu install routine wipes
    out Boot Manager every time.

    -rafe


  18. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 16:33:00 UTC, rafe wrote:

    > On Jun 12, 8:42 am, Felix Miata


    --snip--

    Looked at ubuntu by running it off the CD but was never impressed enough
    to install it.

    > but -- that's actually not why I'm posting: I'm about to take delivery
    > of a new little box
    >
    > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16856110057
    >
    > on which I plan to install some flavor of Linux, plus XP, and might
    > even someday take a crack at with ecs 1.2. I'll partition with DFSee,
    > then install ubuntu (hopefully), then XP.


    --snip--

    Having set up a couple of boxes with OS2, DOS6.22, W98, XP, and Linux
    (one of then with both red hat and suse), I recommend creating all the
    partitions you're going to need at the outset because creating them
    later can render XP incapable of booting on account of teh resulting
    changes the partioning enumeration within XP. It's possible to fix this
    by editing boot.ini manually, but it can be a pain. Use IBM's Boot
    Manager, GRUB (not lilo), and put GRUB in the linux /boot directory.
    Don't let any partitioning tools other than DFSee tinker with the MBR
    and partition tables.

    HTH,
    Pete

    --


  19. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    On Aug 8, 2:40 pm, "Pete" wrote:
    > On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 16:33:00 UTC, rafe wrote:
    > > On Jun 12, 8:42 am, Felix Miata

    >
    > --snip--
    >
    > Looked at ubuntu by running it off the CD but was never impressed enough
    > to install it.
    >
    > > but -- that's actually not why I'm posting: I'm about to take delivery
    > > of a new little box

    >
    > >http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16856110057

    >
    > > on which I plan to install some flavor of Linux, plus XP, and might
    > > even someday take a crack at with ecs 1.2. I'll partition with DFSee,
    > > then install ubuntu (hopefully), then XP.

    >
    > --snip--
    >
    > Having set up a couple of boxes with OS2, DOS6.22, W98, XP, and Linux
    > (one of then with both red hat and suse), I recommend creating all the
    > partitions you're going to need at the outset because creating them
    > later can render XP incapable of booting on account of teh resulting
    > changes the partioning enumeration within XP. It's possible to fix this
    > by editing boot.ini manually, but it can be a pain. Use IBM's Boot
    > Manager, GRUB (not lilo), and put GRUB in the linux /boot directory.
    > Don't let any partitioning tools other than DFSee tinker with the MBR
    > and partition tables.
    >
    > HTH,
    > Pete
    >
    > --



    I think it used grub. unfortunately after I selected guided
    partitioning, it more or less took off and that was that, so I don't
    really know. it's my secondary machine that I use mostly for the
    iPod, archiving photos (I have to use the Nikon s/w as well as
    Photoshop), and burning CDs.

    I just put ubuntu on yesterday, and after an hour I couldn't say I
    prefer it to SUSE, not by a long shot -- though YAST sometimes takes
    my lifetime, in fact none of the package handlers people have put
    together for SUSE has really does everything right. I wanted to try
    ubuntu out, see if someday I could make it do, but I haven't seen how
    yet. (have never figured out how to get decent screen resolution out
    of either distro, maybe I'm missing something.) haven't seen anything
    to impel me off OS/2, really, and won't look much harder unless Dosbox
    gets much better.

    if someone would buy Snap, that would be pretty good. this is really
    quite a nifty little system, I wish I could get OS/2 running on it.


  20. Re: Ubuntu sucks

    On Aug 10, 11:30 am, rafe wrote:
    > On Aug 8, 2:40 pm, "Pete" wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > > On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 16:33:00 UTC, rafe wrote:
    > > > On Jun 12, 8:42 am, Felix Miata

    >
    > > --snip--

    >
    > > Looked at ubuntu by running it off the CD but was never impressed enough
    > > to install it.

    >
    > > > but -- that's actually not why I'm posting: I'm about to take delivery
    > > > of a new little box

    >
    > > >http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16856110057

    >
    > > > on which I plan to install some flavor of Linux, plus XP, and might
    > > > even someday take a crack at with ecs 1.2. I'll partition with DFSee,
    > > > then install ubuntu (hopefully), then XP.

    >
    > > --snip--

    >
    > > Having set up a couple of boxes with OS2, DOS6.22, W98, XP, and Linux
    > > (one of then with both red hat and suse), I recommend creating all the
    > > partitions you're going to need at the outset because creating them
    > > later can render XP incapable of booting on account of teh resulting
    > > changes the partioning enumeration within XP. It's possible to fix this
    > > by editing boot.ini manually, but it can be a pain. Use IBM's Boot
    > > Manager, GRUB (not lilo), and put GRUB in the linux /boot directory.
    > > Don't let any partitioning tools other than DFSee tinker with the MBR
    > > and partition tables.

    >
    > > HTH,
    > > Pete

    >
    > > --

    >
    > I think it used grub. unfortunately after I selected guided
    > partitioning, it more or less took off and that was that, so I don't
    > really know. it's my secondary machine that I use mostly for the
    > iPod, archiving photos (I have to use the Nikon s/w as well as
    > Photoshop), and burning CDs.
    >
    > I just put ubuntu on yesterday, and after an hour I couldn't say I
    > prefer it to SUSE, not by a long shot -- though YAST sometimes takes
    > my lifetime, in fact none of the package handlers people have put
    > together for SUSE has really does everything right. I wanted to try
    > ubuntu out, see if someday I could make it do, but I haven't seen how
    > yet. (have never figured out how to get decent screen resolution out
    > of either distro, maybe I'm missing something.) haven't seen anything
    > to impel me off OS/2, really, and won't look much harder unless Dosbox
    > gets much better.
    >
    > if someone would buy Snap, that would be pretty good. this is really
    > quite a nifty little system, I wish I could get OS/2 running on it.



    to return to the thread subject: I ended up blowing away ubuntu in
    favor of SUSE 10.2. maybe I am a MS patsy, but SUSE seems light-years
    ahead, and ZEN seems to work a little better.


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