On Mon, 04 Jul 2005 12:48:48 +0000, Julian Thomas wrote:

> Also, best to keep an XP partition - their [offshore] support people
> may not give you the time of day if you can't demo the problem in
> XP.

That was my intent anyway. Of course, I've been known to lie to tech
support people if I knew the problem was not OS-related.

--
Michael DeBusk, Co-Conspirator to Make the World a Better Place
Did he update http://home.earthlink.net/~debu4335/ yet?

On Mon, 04 Jul 2005 12:48:48 +0000, Julian Thomas wrote:

>
>I've heard that Dell uses non-standard power supplies, so that if the PS
>dies out of warranty, you are at their mercy for a replacement.

Interesting about the PS. Sort of like the problem I had putting in a
floppy, I couldn't find a cage that worked w/o going back to Dell.

The PS is one point I forgot to mention in my post about using a Dimension
3000. The power supply is a piece of junk. I use the Dell on a ship and
it's power does not run a true 60 cycles. It is close, usually within less
than 1 cycle. I run it at 220vac. It loses an unbelievable amount of time,
I presume this is due to some kind of switching used in the power supply. I
have the Relish scheduler go to the server and correct the time every 6 hours
just to keep it within a few minutes of the correct time.

Since I am not where that machine is located at this time I don't have the
specifics but ISTR that the time was losing as much as 18 minutes a day! The
Compaq that sits right next to it is rock solid (running w2k) with it's
timekeeping.

Jon

Power source has nothing to do with it as the only timer used is from
the CMOS clock chip on the mobo. There is no referencing the line freq
to the clock.
If the problem happens running other OS's - even just DOS booted from a
floppy the clock chip is off. Possibly just the CMOS battery is dying,
but usually the clock chip has its own "10-year" battery in it..
If you're lucky there might a timer "calibration" prog out there. Check
the Dell site or Google for it.

Jon wrote:
> On Mon, 04 Jul 2005 12:48:48 +0000, Julian Thomas wrote:
>
>
>>I've heard that Dell uses non-standard power supplies, so that if the PS
>>dies out of warranty, you are at their mercy for a replacement.
>
>
> Interesting about the PS. Sort of like the problem I had putting in a
> floppy, I couldn't find a cage that worked w/o going back to Dell.
>
> The PS is one point I forgot to mention in my post about using a Dimension
> 3000. The power supply is a piece of junk. I use the Dell on a ship and
> it's power does not run a true 60 cycles. It is close, usually within less
> than 1 cycle. I run it at 220vac. It loses an unbelievable amount of time,
> I presume this is due to some kind of switching used in the power supply. I
> have the Relish scheduler go to the server and correct the time every 6 hours
> just to keep it within a few minutes of the correct time.
>
> Since I am not where that machine is located at this time I don't have the
> specifics but ISTR that the time was losing as much as 18 minutes a day! The
> Compaq that sits right next to it is rock solid (running w2k) with it's
> timekeeping.
>
> Jon
>
>

--
Richard W. Budd
Synchron Laser Service, Inc.
USA
-Sales and general information-
ph# 248-486-0402
fax# 248-486-6460
email: rbudd@attglobal.net
www.synchronlaser.com

On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 12:58:42 -0400, Richard W. Budd wrote:

>Power source has nothing to do with it as the only timer used is from
>the CMOS clock chip on the mobo. There is no referencing the line freq
>to the clock.

It ran fine when I had it at home for 2 weeks. I do have a partition with
Suse on that computer but I am seldom booted into it long enough to notice.
Next time I will watch it.

You would have to experience the power source to believe it. As an example,
a typical electric alarm clock will not keep accurate time (as they are
designed for 60 cycles, not 59, or 61 or spikes). But if you can find a
crystal controlled one then it keeps perfect time.

Jon

On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 23:01:42 -0700 (PDT), Jon
wrote:

> You would have to experience the power source to believe it.

Would a UPS be useful in this situation? One of the things they do is
to "condition" the power coming in so as to provide a more stable
stream of electricity to the PC.

--
Michael DeBusk, Co-Conspirator to Make the World a Better Place
Did he update http://home.earthlink.net/~debu4335/ yet?

Sir:

Michael DeBusk wrote:
> On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 23:01:42 -0700 (PDT), Jon
> wrote:
>
>> You would have to experience the power source to believe it.
>
> Would a UPS be useful in this situation? One of the things they do is
> to "condition" the power coming in so as to provide a more stable
> stream of electricity to the PC.
>
Very few UPS control the frequency unless they are providing the power.
To provide that level of service you would need a always-on
motor/generator pair (rectifier/alternator).
--
Bill
Thanks a Million!

William L. Hartzell wrote:

> Michael DeBusk wrote:
>
>> Would a UPS be useful in this situation? One of the things they do is
>> to "condition" the power coming in so as to provide a more stable
>> stream of electricity to the PC.
>>
> Very few UPS control the frequency unless they are providing the power.
> To provide that level of service you would need a always-on
> motor/generator pair (rectifier/alternator).

Not true. A basic UPS does nothing at all while mains power is on, but
"always on" units are only a little higher up the food chain -- and they
always condition the power, including (IIRC) controlling the frequency.
(They essentially run from their battery all the time, using mains
power only to keep the battery charged.) An M/G set would be gross
overkill for this purpose.

Dave

Sir:

Dave Anderson wrote:
> William L. Hartzell wrote:
>
>> Michael DeBusk wrote:
>>
>>> Would a UPS be useful in this situation? One of the things they do is
>>> to "condition" the power coming in so as to provide a more stable
>>> stream of electricity to the PC.
>>>
>> Very few UPS control the frequency unless they are providing the
>> power. To provide that level of service you would need a always-on
>> motor/generator pair (rectifier/alternator).
>
> Not true. A basic UPS does nothing at all while mains power is on, but
> "always on" units are only a little higher up the food chain -- and they
> always condition the power, including (IIRC) controlling the frequency.
> (They essentially run from their battery all the time, using mains
> power only to keep the battery charged.) An M/G set would be gross
> overkill for this purpose.
>
> Dave
>
I have a Smart UPS and Back UPS by APC. I did not see that claimed in
the Smart UPS documentation. They claimed everything but Frequency
control. The only mentioning of Frequency is a statement that the device
would synchronize to line upon restore of power.
--
Bill
Thanks a Million!

Dell advertises servers with a Xeon processor (second is an extra-cost
option) and no OS for only $500 or so. Since they come without an OS,
isn't it reasonable to assume that they ought to operate with *any* OS
and that they shoudl be prepared to honor the warranty even if you
aren't using WinJunk?

Perce


On 07/04/05 08:48 am Julian Thomas tossed the following ingredients into
the ever-growing pot of cybersoup:

>>> The only problem with Dell or other mass producters is you don't
>>> know what parts they'll put inside.

>> This was my major concern. I've built the bulk of the PCs I've owned
>> for this very reason.

> I've heard that Dell uses non-standard power supplies, so that if the PS
> dies out of warranty, you are at their mercy for a replacement.
>
> Also, best to keep an XP partition - their [offshore] support people may
> not give you the time of day if you can't demo the problem in XP.