Slew mode check for XNTP - NTP

This is a discussion on Slew mode check for XNTP - NTP ; Hi, I have using Windows 2000 box which has ntp.conf file for xntp configuration. I would like to confirm that "slewalways yes" is working as configured in the ntp.conf file. Could you help me out to verify this? What is ...

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Thread: Slew mode check for XNTP

  1. Slew mode check for XNTP

    Hi,

    I have using Windows 2000 box which has ntp.conf file for xntp
    configuration. I would like to confirm that "slewalways yes" is working as
    configured in the ntp.conf file. Could you help me out to verify this?

    What is the best way to confirm that slewalways is configured and working
    fine.

    I have another Windows 2000 box in which there is I haven't done the
    slewalways yes configuration. I could see some difference in the offset. But
    I would like to hear from you folks.

    Appreciate your help.


    Thanks,
    Sasi.
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  2. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    In article ,
    sasi05@gmail.com (Sasikumar Jayaraman) wrote:

    > I have using Windows 2000 box which has ntp.conf file for xntp


    xntpd is obsolete.

    > configuration. I would like to confirm that "slewalways yes" is working as
    > configured in the ntp.conf file. Could you help me out to verify this?


    There is no such option in ntpd version 4.2.0. I'm fairly sure that
    it isn't in any later version. The NTP developers generally consider
    the use of this feature (from the command line "-x") as undesirable.
    I don't believe it existed in version 3 either, but I don't have such
    old source close to hand.

    As far as I know, even the general syntax KEYWORD yes is not used for
    any option.

    > What is the best way to confirm that slewalways is configured and working
    > fine.


    Firstly, identify the exact version of the software. There are also
    Windows ports of the Unix strings utility, that you can use to see if
    the string slewalways appears anywhere in the binary.

  3. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    david@djwhome.demon.co.uk (David Woolley) wrote:

    > sasi05@gmail.com (Sasikumar Jayaraman) wrote:
    >
    > > I have using Windows 2000 box which has ntp.conf file for xntp

    >
    > xntpd is obsolete.
    >
    > > configuration. I would like to confirm that "slewalways yes" is working as
    > > configured in the ntp.conf file. Could you help me out to verify this?

    >
    > There is no such option in ntpd version 4.2.0. I'm fairly sure that
    > it isn't in any later version. The NTP developers generally consider
    > the use of this feature (from the command line "-x") as undesirable.
    > I don't believe it existed in version 3 either, but I don't have such
    > old source close to hand.


    I think "slewalways" was a Sun addition in the xntpd supplied with Solaris.

    --
    Ronan Flood
    working for but not speaking for
    Network Services, University of London Computer Centre
    (which means: don't bother ULCC if I've said something you don't like)

  4. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    Thanks much for the info David.

    Here is my comments.

    I am running XNTP version 4.2.0 as per ntpdc -c version output.
    -------------------------------------------------------------
    C:\>ntpdc -c version
    ntpdc 4.2.0 fr Oct 17 8:50:07 2003 (1)
    -------------------------------------------------------------

    To confirm that slew mode is not supported in NT, I did the following check.


    I changed the system clock ahead of 5 minutes and stoped the NTP Servcie.

    Then executed the following commant.

    *ntpdate -B ntp01-ams (This would slew the clock instead of default step
    option)*

    I got the clear message saying -b option is required for Windows NT version
    of ntpdate.

    ----------------------------------------------

    C:\>ntpdate -B ntp01-ams
    Looking for host ntp01-ams and service ntp
    host found : ntp01-ams.lab.net

    The -b option is required by ntpdate on Windows NT platforms

    C:\>
    ----------------------------------------------

    Also I tried changing the registry setting to include -x and -g option.
    After to that I changed the system timing and started the ntp service. What
    I saw is withing 10 minutes system clock is changed to ntp server clock in
    one shot. This is not how slew mode would operate?. Slew mode would take
    many hrs to correct simple 3 minutes change. Am I correct?

    Can I conclude that slew mode operation is not available for Windows version
    of XNTP?



    Thanks,

    Sasi.

    On 7/26/06, David Woolley wrote:
    >
    > In article ,
    > sasi05@gmail.com (Sasikumar Jayaraman) wrote:
    >
    > > I have using Windows 2000 box which has ntp.conf file for xntp

    >
    > xntpd is obsolete.
    >
    > > configuration. I would like to confirm that "slewalways yes" is working

    > as
    > > configured in the ntp.conf file. Could you help me out to verify this?

    >
    > There is no such option in ntpd version 4.2.0. I'm fairly sure that
    > it isn't in any later version. The NTP developers generally consider
    > the use of this feature (from the command line "-x") as undesirable.
    > I don't believe it existed in version 3 either, but I don't have such
    > old source close to hand.
    >
    > As far as I know, even the general syntax KEYWORD yes is not used for
    > any option.
    >
    > > What is the best way to confirm that slewalways is configured and

    > working
    > > fine.

    >
    > Firstly, identify the exact version of the software. There are also
    > Windows ports of the Unix strings utility, that you can use to see if
    > the string slewalways appears anywhere in the binary.
    >
    > _______________________________________________
    > questions mailing list
    > questions@lists.ntp.isc.org
    > https://lists.ntp.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/questions
    >

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  5. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    In article ,
    sasi05@gmail.com (Sasikumar Jayaraman) wrote:

    > I am running XNTP version 4.2.0 as per ntpdc -c version output.


    There's no such version. However the other information suggests
    that you are actually running version 4.2.0 of *ntpd*.

    > C:\>ntpdc -c version


    This gives the version of the ntpdc program. To get the version of ntpd,
    you would need to use ntpq to issue an rv 0 command.

    > C:\>ntpdate -B ntp01-ams


    ntpdate is not ntpd.

    > Looking for host ntp01-ams and service ntp
    > host found : ntp01-ams.lab.net
    >
    > The -b option is required by ntpdate on Windows NT platforms


    I believe this is because Unix has a system call which says slew the
    clock until you have accumulated this many ticks of correction, whereas
    there is no equivalent system call on Windows. Windows does have a
    system call to change the effective clock frequency, which is available
    to nptd, and, in fact must be used when it is not in error recovery
    mode, but is not suitable for ntpdate, as it would mean that ntpdate
    couldn't exit until the slew completed.

    > Also I tried changing the registry setting to include -x and -g option.


    For ntpd version 4.2.0, -x increases the step threshold from 128ms to
    10 minutes. If your time error was more than 10 minutes, you would still
    get a step.

    case 'x':
    clock_max = 600;
    break;

    You would need to use a tinker command to completely disable stepping.

    > Can I conclude that slew mode operation is not available for Windows version
    > of XNTP?


    No, and given that stepping is the special case of clock adjustment, I don't
    think a more detailed examination of the NT specific parts of the code will
    indicate any special handling for NT, but without the time to read all
    the code, or an NT to try it on, I can't be 100% sure.

  6. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    After changing the image path in registry as ntpd.exe -x -g, I haved changed
    the time of 2 systems ahead of clock source. But both had sycn with clock
    source withing 20 minutes.

    System A - 3 minutes ahead of source

    System B - 8 minutes ahead of source.

    The default option is that if the offset is less than 128 seconds, it should
    slew the clock. I tried changing the timing difference as 2 minutes. But I
    could see clock is changed in one shot to clock source.

    Not that it took hours together to complete the sync up.


    Last try I would do this instead of ntpdate. ntpd.exe -x -g -q with 5
    minutes time ahead of clock source.

    I am getting a feeling that XNTP for Windows slew options doesn't work well.
    I know W32Time works well. 3 minutes time change took 1 week for correction.



    Thanks,
    Sasi.




    On 7/27/06, David Woolley wrote:
    >
    > In article ,
    > sasi05@gmail.com (Sasikumar Jayaraman) wrote:
    >
    > > I am running XNTP version 4.2.0 as per ntpdc -c version output.

    >
    > There's no such version. However the other information suggests
    > that you are actually running version 4.2.0 of *ntpd*.
    >
    > > C:\>ntpdc -c version

    >
    > This gives the version of the ntpdc program. To get the version of ntpd,
    > you would need to use ntpq to issue an rv 0 command.
    >
    > > C:\>ntpdate -B ntp01-ams

    >
    > ntpdate is not ntpd.
    >
    > > Looking for host ntp01-ams and service ntp
    > > host found : ntp01-ams.lab.net
    > >
    > > The -b option is required by ntpdate on Windows NT platforms

    >
    > I believe this is because Unix has a system call which says slew the
    > clock until you have accumulated this many ticks of correction, whereas
    > there is no equivalent system call on Windows. Windows does have a
    > system call to change the effective clock frequency, which is available
    > to nptd, and, in fact must be used when it is not in error recovery
    > mode, but is not suitable for ntpdate, as it would mean that ntpdate
    > couldn't exit until the slew completed.
    >
    > > Also I tried changing the registry setting to include -x and -g option.

    >
    > For ntpd version 4.2.0, -x increases the step threshold from 128ms to
    > 10 minutes. If your time error was more than 10 minutes, you would still
    > get a step.
    >
    > case 'x':
    > clock_max = 600;
    > break;
    >
    > You would need to use a tinker command to completely disable stepping.
    >
    > > Can I conclude that slew mode operation is not available for Windows

    > version
    > > of XNTP?

    >
    > No, and given that stepping is the special case of clock adjustment, I
    > don't
    > think a more detailed examination of the NT specific parts of the code
    > will
    > indicate any special handling for NT, but without the time to read all
    > the code, or an NT to try it on, I can't be 100% sure.
    >
    > _______________________________________________
    > questions mailing list
    > questions@lists.ntp.isc.org
    > https://lists.ntp.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/questions
    >

    _______________________________________________
    questions mailing list
    questions@lists.ntp.isc.org
    https://lists.ntp.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/questions


  7. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    Sasikumar Jayaraman wrote:
    > Thanks much for the info David.
    >
    > Here is my comments.
    >
    > I am running XNTP version 4.2.0 as per ntpdc -c version output.
    > -------------------------------------------------------------
    > C:\>ntpdc -c version
    > ntpdc 4.2.0 fr Oct 17 8:50:07 2003 (1)
    > -------------------------------------------------------------
    >


    This shows the version of ntpdc and not ntpd.

    > To confirm that slew mode is not supported in NT, I did the following
    > check.
    >
    >
    > I changed the system clock ahead of 5 minutes and stoped the NTP Servcie.
    >
    > Then executed the following commant.
    >
    > *ntpdate -B ntp01-ams (This would slew the clock instead of default step
    > option)*
    >


    ntpdate != ntpd so this means nothing

    > ----------------------------------------------
    >
    > Also I tried changing the registry setting to include -x and -g option.


    You need to be running 4.2.2 at least for this to work.

    > After to that I changed the system timing and started the ntp service. What
    > I saw is withing 10 minutes system clock is changed to ntp server clock in
    > one shot. This is not how slew mode would operate?. Slew mode would take
    > many hrs to correct simple 3 minutes change. Am I correct?
    >


    Right, but you need the right version of ntpd first.
    > Can I conclude that slew mode operation is not available for Windows
    > version
    > of XNTP?
    >


    No, you cannot. Upgrade to 4.2.2 and then add the options to the service
    command line.

    You haven't said why slewalways is a requirement for you. Can you explain?

    Danny
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  8. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    Hi Danny,

    I feel i am close to the resolution. Thanks much for your time !

    Let me answer your question "Why I need slewalways?"

    Well, customer is asking for slew mode operation and also slew mode is good
    for system which runs database I learnt. So when XNTP has option of slewing
    the clock, "why not test it?" out per customer.

    I know W32Time slew works well. But I prefer XNTP also XNTP has many merits
    too.

    As you said, my last option is to download 4.2.2 and check it out with ntpd
    -x -g -q option instead of ntpdate.

    But I have tough time in finding Windows binaries for XNTP 4.2.2

    Let me dig on internet for somemore time.

    Appreciate if anyone could help me on Windows binary for XNTP 4.2.2


    Thanks,
    Sasi.


    On 7/27/06, Danny Mayer wrote:
    >
    > Sasikumar Jayaraman wrote:
    > > Thanks much for the info David.
    > >
    > > Here is my comments.
    > >
    > > I am running XNTP version 4.2.0 as per ntpdc -c version output.
    > > -------------------------------------------------------------
    > > C:\>ntpdc -c version
    > > ntpdc 4.2.0 fr Oct 17 8:50:07 2003 (1)
    > > -------------------------------------------------------------
    > >

    >
    > This shows the version of ntpdc and not ntpd.
    >
    > > To confirm that slew mode is not supported in NT, I did the following
    > > check.
    > >
    > >
    > > I changed the system clock ahead of 5 minutes and stoped the NTP

    > Servcie.
    > >
    > > Then executed the following commant.
    > >
    > > *ntpdate -B ntp01-ams (This would slew the clock instead of default

    > step
    > > option)*
    > >

    >
    > ntpdate != ntpd so this means nothing
    >
    > > ----------------------------------------------
    > >
    > > Also I tried changing the registry setting to include -x and -g option.

    >
    > You need to be running 4.2.2 at least for this to work.
    >
    > > After to that I changed the system timing and started the ntp service.

    > What
    > > I saw is withing 10 minutes system clock is changed to ntp server clock

    > in
    > > one shot. This is not how slew mode would operate?. Slew mode would take
    > > many hrs to correct simple 3 minutes change. Am I correct?
    > >

    >
    > Right, but you need the right version of ntpd first.
    > > Can I conclude that slew mode operation is not available for Windows
    > > version
    > > of XNTP?
    > >

    >
    > No, you cannot. Upgrade to 4.2.2 and then add the options to the service
    > command line.
    >
    > You haven't said why slewalways is a requirement for you. Can you explain?
    >
    > Danny
    >

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  9. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    Sasikumar Jayaraman wrote:
    > Hi Danny,
    >
    > Let me answer your question "Why I need slewalways?"
    >
    > Well, customer is asking for slew mode operation and also slew mode is
    > good for system which runs database I learnt. So when XNTP has option of
    > slewing the clock, "why not test it?" out per customer.
    >


    First, the name is ntpd and not xntp. There was an xntp for version 3
    but not for version 4. Second, if you start ntpd at boot time with the
    -g option you don't need to use the slewalways option since it will be
    synchronized before the database is ready for use.

    > I know W32Time slew works well. But I prefer XNTP also XNTP has many
    > merits too.
    >
    > As you said, my last option is to download 4.2.2 and check it out with
    > ntpd -x -g -q option instead of ntpdate.
    >


    If you start ntpd at startup the -g should be sufficient along with the
    iburst to give you good time in seconds as long as the remote servers
    are reachable.

    > But I have tough time in finding Windows binaries for XNTP 4.2.2
    >


    Just go to Meinberg for a good set of releases. I don't think it's 4.2.2
    yet, but that doesn't matter in this case, it's recent enough and there
    are a few additional features that are not yet in the base code (My fault).

    > Let me dig on internet for somemore time.
    >
    > Appreciate if anyone could help me on Windows binary for XNTP 4.2.2
    >


    I generally don't release the binaries I build since they normally are
    development builds and I have more work to do on the installer.

    Danny
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  10. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    On 2006-07-27, Sasikumar Jayaraman wrote:

    > The default option is that if the offset is less than 128 seconds, it
    > should slew the clock.


    The default step threshold is 128 MILLI-seconds. If the offset is below
    128 milliseconds ntpd will slew the clock. If the offset is above 128
    milliseconds ntpd will step the clock.

    > I tried changing the timing difference as 2 minutes. But I
    > could see clock is changed in one shot to clock source.


    2 minutes is considerably larger than 128 milliseconds.

    --
    Steve Kostecke
    NTP Public Services Project - http://ntp.isc.org/

  11. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    On 2006-07-27, Sasikumar Jayaraman wrote:

    > But I have tough time in finding Windows binaries for XNTP 4.2.2


    There is no such thing as XNTP 4.2.2; it's NTP 4.2.2

    There are some pre-compiled Windows binaries of NTP listed in the ports
    section at http://ntp.isc.org/links

    --
    Steve Kostecke
    NTP Public Services Project - http://ntp.isc.org/

  12. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    Sasikumar Jayaraman wrote:
    []
    > But I have tough time in finding Windows binaries for XNTP 4.2.2
    >
    > Let me dig on internet for somemore time.
    >
    > Appreciate if anyone could help me on Windows binary for XNTP 4.2.2
    >
    >
    > Thanks,
    >


    Sasi,

    I have found that NTP works well on Windows systems. Some of my results
    are here:

    http://www.david-taylor.myby.co.uk/mrtg/daily_ntp.html

    and I would recommend the Meinberg build and installable package:

    http://www.meinberg.de/english/sw/ntp.htm

    They have NTP v4.2.0b which works fine. BTW: it's not XNTP, as you keep
    writing.

    David



  13. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    Steve,

    I tried few samples and one of which is 2 minutes without -x.

    The other samples are 3,5 and 10 minutes with ntpd -x.

    I see the time changed in one shot for all test.


    Thanks,
    Sasi.


    On 27 Jul 2006 02:47:04 GMT, Steve Kostecke wrote:
    >
    > On 2006-07-27, Sasikumar Jayaraman wrote:
    >
    > > The default option is that if the offset is less than 128 seconds, it
    > > should slew the clock.

    >
    > The default step threshold is 128 MILLI-seconds. If the offset is below
    > 128 milliseconds ntpd will slew the clock. If the offset is above 128
    > milliseconds ntpd will step the clock.
    >
    > > I tried changing the timing difference as 2 minutes. But I
    > > could see clock is changed in one shot to clock source.

    >
    > 2 minutes is considerably larger than 128 milliseconds.
    >
    > --
    > Steve Kostecke
    > NTP Public Services Project - http://ntp.isc.org/
    >
    > _______________________________________________
    > questions mailing list
    > questions@lists.ntp.isc.org
    > https://lists.ntp.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/questions
    >

    _______________________________________________
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  14. Re: Slew mode check for XNTP

    "Sasikumar Jayaraman" wrote in message
    news:a8e7dcda0607261757r44c412c8ha46fe44366b9f24a@ mail.gmail.com...
    [...]
    > I know W32Time works well. 3 minutes time change took 1 week for
    > correction.


    That may have been due to its only kicking in once a week.

    In how far this amounts to 'working well' is left as an exercise to
    the reader.

    Groetjes,
    Maarten Wiltink



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