Firefox/TB getting unstable - Mozilla

This is a discussion on Firefox/TB getting unstable - Mozilla ; Terry R. wrote: > The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion > (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard: > >> Terry R. wrote: >>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was ...

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Thread: Firefox/TB getting unstable

  1. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    Terry R. wrote:
    > The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    > (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >
    >> Terry R. wrote:
    >>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was the case with v2x). FF3
    >>> has crashed three times today, and has been doing so at least once
    >>> per day for a while now. My daily routine of web pages open hasn't
    >>> changed in months. It wasn't until today that it dawned on me what I
    >>> have been doing lately, restarting FF.
    >>>
    >>> Having the same issue with TB.
    >>>
    >>> I suppose it could be attributed to Add-ons, but I don't use all that
    >>> many.
    >>>
    >>> Starting to lose my faith in Mozilla here...

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> Please remember to add a notification line as to where the discussion
    >> is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.

    >
    > Your "Welcome and FAQ 29 Aug" under "What subject line should I use?"
    > makes it clear. I didn't feel it was necessary to add anything extra.
    >
    > Are you saying you want, a notification line like, "discussion located
    > in mozilla.support.firefox & mozilla.support.thunderbird"? I would
    > think if the subject is clear, it would be obvious. But if you want it
    > regardless, I will try to remember next time.
    >



    The FAQ in the newsgroup dated 29 August says this

    Are there any remarks or notations I should make in the post?

    Please provide a note as to where the discussion for the specific
    screenshot is, i.e. mozilla.support.firefox or
    mozilla.support.seamonkey or some such. You can mark the post with a
    'Follow-up' header if you wish, but it is not necessary. Discussion
    posts will not be allowed in the screenshot newsgroup. Please put the
    notation in the body of the message.

    I thought that was sufficiently clear




  2. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    > Terry R. wrote:
    >> The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    >> (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >>
    >>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was the case with v2x). FF3
    >>>> has crashed three times today, and has been doing so at least once
    >>>> per day for a while now. My daily routine of web pages open hasn't
    >>>> changed in months. It wasn't until today that it dawned on me what
    >>>> I have been doing lately, restarting FF.
    >>>>
    >>>> Having the same issue with TB.
    >>>>
    >>>> I suppose it could be attributed to Add-ons, but I don't use all
    >>>> that many.
    >>>>
    >>>> Starting to lose my faith in Mozilla here...
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> Please remember to add a notification line as to where the discussion
    >>> is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.

    >>
    >> Your "Welcome and FAQ 29 Aug" under "What subject line should I use?"
    >> makes it clear. I didn't feel it was necessary to add anything extra.
    >>
    >> Are you saying you want, a notification line like, "discussion located
    >> in mozilla.support.firefox & mozilla.support.thunderbird"? I would
    >> think if the subject is clear, it would be obvious. But if you want
    >> it regardless, I will try to remember next time.
    >>

    >
    >
    > The FAQ in the newsgroup dated 29 August says this
    >
    > Are there any remarks or notations I should make in the post?
    >
    > Please provide a note as to where the discussion for the specific
    > screenshot is, i.e. mozilla.support.firefox or
    > mozilla.support.seamonkey or some such. You can mark the post with a
    > 'Follow-up' header if you wish, but it is not necessary. Discussion
    > posts will not be allowed in the screenshot newsgroup. Please put the
    > notation in the body of the message.
    >
    > I thought that was sufficiently clear
    >
    >
    >



    Welcome & FAQ update as of 30 Sep no changes

  3. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    The date and time was 9/30/2008 6:09 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:

    > Terry R. wrote:
    >> The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    >> (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >>
    >>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was the case with v2x). FF3
    >>>> has crashed three times today, and has been doing so at least once
    >>>> per day for a while now. My daily routine of web pages open hasn't
    >>>> changed in months. It wasn't until today that it dawned on me what I
    >>>> have been doing lately, restarting FF.
    >>>>
    >>>> Having the same issue with TB.
    >>>>
    >>>> I suppose it could be attributed to Add-ons, but I don't use all that
    >>>> many.
    >>>>
    >>>> Starting to lose my faith in Mozilla here...
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> Please remember to add a notification line as to where the discussion
    >>> is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.

    >> Your "Welcome and FAQ 29 Aug" under "What subject line should I use?"
    >> makes it clear. I didn't feel it was necessary to add anything extra.
    >>
    >> Are you saying you want, a notification line like, "discussion located
    >> in mozilla.support.firefox & mozilla.support.thunderbird"? I would
    >> think if the subject is clear, it would be obvious. But if you want it
    >> regardless, I will try to remember next time.
    >>

    >
    >
    > The FAQ in the newsgroup dated 29 August says this
    >
    > Are there any remarks or notations I should make in the post?
    >
    > Please provide a note as to where the discussion for the specific
    > screenshot is, i.e. mozilla.support.firefox or
    > mozilla.support.seamonkey or some such. You can mark the post with a
    > 'Follow-up' header if you wish, but it is not necessary. Discussion
    > posts will not be allowed in the screenshot newsgroup. Please put the
    > notation in the body of the message.
    >
    > I thought that was sufficiently clear
    >
    >
    >


    Once again, the Subject was clear, so I would think everyone would know
    where to go.

    follow up set to mozilla.general

    --
    Terry R.
    Anti-spam measures are included in my email address.
    Delete NOSPAM from the email address after clicking Reply.

  4. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    Terry R. wrote:
    > The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:41 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    > (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >
    >> Terry R. wrote:
    >>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was the case with v2x). FF3
    >>> has crashed three times today, and has been doing so at least once
    >>> per day for a while now. My daily routine of web pages open hasn't
    >>> changed in months. It wasn't until today that it dawned on me what I
    >>> have been doing lately, restarting FF.
    >>>
    >>> Having the same issue with TB.
    >>>
    >>> I suppose it could be attributed to Add-ons, but I don't use all that
    >>> many.
    >>>
    >>> Starting to lose my faith in Mozilla here...

    >>
    >>
    >> crosspost snipped, please do no crosspost

    >
    > Please do NOT remove the crosspost. You are NOT a moderator here. I
    > referenced both groups because the issue is on both. I do not want to
    > have to reply twice to any comments.
    >
    > But here's a question for you. Why do you use "Moz Champion" when
    > Mozilla does not recognize the "Champions" as such? Sure there's
    > reference on ufaq, for obvious reasons when secnews was hosting mozilla
    > groups. And even Chris I.'s site is clearly talking about secnews. But
    > since Mozilla no longer uses secnews, your identifier is confusing at
    > best. You do not have the power you had in secnews (except what has
    > been possibly given to you in the screenshots group), and clearly only
    > Chris, Nir & Q are overseeing these groups.
    >
    > And when you try to impose authority like you've done here, others may
    > think you are directly connected with Mozilla, which you're not. I
    > seriously doubt any users except those who've been in secnews even know
    > what a Champion reference is all about.
    >
    > follow up set to mozilla.general
    >



    Mozilla org has recognized the Mozilla Champions
    quoted from

    https://mail.mozilla.org/pipermail/n...03/000007.html

    The Mozilla Champions is a group of volunteers with the self assumed
    mission of providing support for Mozilla products to end users. It is
    a spin-off of the Netscape Champions group, founded in 1995 by Chuck
    Simmons, Howard Beckerman, John Oliver and a handful of others.

    After the creation of the Mozilla Foundation, earlier this year,
    Netscape Champions were warmly welcome to champion for Mozilla.
    As stated in the Mozilla Champiosns website
    (http://mozillachampions.mozdev.org), membership in the Champions
    program is for those who demonstrate an ongoing commitment to aid
    others using Mozilla products and get to be invited to the program.

    Mozilla Champions attend as much as 1000 questions a month, from basic
    to very advanced ones. Much of them within minutes and hardly within
    more than 24 hours.

    On
    http://www.mozilla.org/community/other-forums.html

    We are listed alongside Mozillazine, Mozilla Lab and other forums


    I will continue to remove crossposts from messages I reply to.
    Simply because you feel it is your best interest to ignore guidelines
    does not mean I can ignore them as well.

    Regardlesss if users 'know' what a champion is all about or not is not
    important to the task.

  5. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 16:27:51 -0700
    "Terry R." wrote:

    > The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    > (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >
    > > crosspost removed Please do not crosspost thankyou
    > >
    > > Please remember to add a notification line as to where the
    > > discussion is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.

    >
    > I'm sorry, I made reference to both, so please don't take the liberty
    > to remove the crosspost. That way no one has to reply twice.
    >
    > Thank you for understanding,


    Crossposting to this server doesn't work well because these groups are
    also mailing lists. It's better not to do it at all, but if you do you
    should set a followup to a single group.

    I'm setting followup to m.general.

  6. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 16:27:51 -0700
    "Terry R." wrote:

    > The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    > (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >
    > > crosspost removed Please do not crosspost thankyou
    > >
    > > Please remember to add a notification line as to where the
    > > discussion is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.

    >
    > I'm sorry, I made reference to both, so please don't take the liberty
    > to remove the crosspost. That way no one has to reply twice.
    >
    > Thank you for understanding,


    Crossposting to this server doesn't work well because these groups are
    also mailing lists. It's better not to do it at all, but if you do you
    should set a followup to a single group.

    I'm setting followup to m.general.

  7. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 16:27:51 -0700
    "Terry R." wrote:

    > The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    > (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >
    > > crosspost removed Please do not crosspost thankyou
    > >
    > > Please remember to add a notification line as to where the
    > > discussion is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.

    >
    > I'm sorry, I made reference to both, so please don't take the liberty
    > to remove the crosspost. That way no one has to reply twice.
    >
    > Thank you for understanding,


    Crossposting to this server doesn't work well because these groups are
    also mailing lists. It's better not to do it at all, but if you do you
    should set a followup to a single group.

    I'm setting followup to m.general.

  8. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    David E. Ross wrote:
    > On 9/30/2008 4:44 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    >> Terry R. wrote:
    >>> The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    >>> (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >>>
    >>>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was the case with v2x). FF3
    >>>>> has crashed three times today, and has been doing so at least once
    >>>>> per day for a while now. My daily routine of web pages open hasn't
    >>>>> changed in months. It wasn't until today that it dawned on me what I
    >>>>> have been doing lately, restarting FF.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Having the same issue with TB.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I suppose it could be attributed to Add-ons, but I don't use all that
    >>>>> many.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Starting to lose my faith in Mozilla here...
    >>>> crosspost removed Please do not crosspost thankyou
    >>>>
    >>>> Please remember to add a notification line as to where the discussion
    >>>> is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.
    >>> I'm sorry, I made reference to both, so please don't take the liberty to
    >>> remove the crosspost. That way no one has to reply twice.
    >>>
    >>> Thank you for understanding,
    >>>

    >>
    >> Guidelines are here
    >>
    >> http://www.mozilla.org/community/etiquette.html
    >>
    >> guideline regarding crossposts reprinted here for your edification
    >>
    >> No crossposting.
    >>
    >> It is almost never appropriate to send the same message to two
    >> mailing lists or newsgroups. Please don't do it. Or, if you must, make
    >> sure you set the Followup-To and Reply-To fields to ensure that replies
    >> go only to one, not to both.
    >> example: Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.seamonkey
    >> Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    >> FollowUp-To: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    >> Reply-To: dev-apps-firefox@lists.mozilla.org
    >> Subject: XPFE browser?
    >>
    >> It is never appropriate to send the same message to two forums when
    >> one of those forums has "general" in its name.
    >>

    >
    > What then do we do if we have a question about the interface between two
    > different Mozilla elements? I thought reposting the same message
    > separately to two newsgroups was a worse offence than cross-posting.
    >
    >


    Different elements in what? Differing elements in Firefox can be
    discussed in the Firefox group.

    Different programs? The 'solution' in one program (say Firefox) may or
    may not be the same as in Thunderbird, or even SeaMonkey.

    My suggestion is NOT to use 'shotgun' techniques when you are reporting
    a problem, looking for a solution. Post to ONE group, and get what
    answers you can, and then, if not satisfactory, post to another.

    Regardless, the guidelines state "No Crossposting"
    If you feel that you yourself can ignore the guidelines in your own best
    interest, that is no reason for others to ignore them as well. I will
    continue to delete crossposts in messages that I respond to, and will
    duly note such in the message body


  9. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 16:49:53 -0700
    "David E. Ross" wrote:

    > On 9/30/2008 4:44 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    >
    > > Guidelines are here
    > >
    > > http://www.mozilla.org/community/etiquette.html
    > >
    > > guideline regarding crossposts reprinted here for your edification
    > >
    > > No crossposting.
    > >
    > > It is almost never appropriate to send the same message to two
    > > mailing lists or newsgroups. Please don't do it. Or, if you must,
    > > make sure you set the Followup-To and Reply-To fields to ensure
    > > that replies go only to one, not to both.
    > > example: Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.seamonkey
    > > Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    > > FollowUp-To: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    > > Reply-To: dev-apps-firefox@lists.mozilla.org
    > > Subject: XPFE browser?
    > >
    > > It is never appropriate to send the same message to two forums
    > > when one of those forums has "general" in its name.

    >
    > What then do we do if we have a question about the interface between
    > two different Mozilla elements?


    There's not a great solution to that, but I'd suggest an initial
    crosspost to let everyone in both lists know about the issue/topic, but
    with the followup set to whichever single group you feel is more
    appropriate. And the followup should be mentioned in the body of the
    OP so that people who'd need to switch lists (and are interested
    enough to do so) know where they can follow the issue.

    > I thought reposting the same message separately to two newsgroups was
    > a worse offence than cross-posting.


    Multiposting isn't a good idea either. But crossposting here is pretty
    bad, mostly because these groups are also mailing lists. ml
    subscribers will get multiposts anyway, and then they have to decide
    which list to reply to. So anyone hoping to see all replies has to
    read both groups/lists anyway. It's more complicated than that,
    because of the limitations of mailing lists and because of limitations
    of the specific mail-news gateway used here, but hopefully that's
    enough to talk you out of crossposting threads.

    I've set the followup to mozilla.general.

  10. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 16:49:53 -0700
    "David E. Ross" wrote:

    > On 9/30/2008 4:44 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    >
    > > Guidelines are here
    > >
    > > http://www.mozilla.org/community/etiquette.html
    > >
    > > guideline regarding crossposts reprinted here for your edification
    > >
    > > No crossposting.
    > >
    > > It is almost never appropriate to send the same message to two
    > > mailing lists or newsgroups. Please don't do it. Or, if you must,
    > > make sure you set the Followup-To and Reply-To fields to ensure
    > > that replies go only to one, not to both.
    > > example: Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.seamonkey
    > > Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    > > FollowUp-To: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    > > Reply-To: dev-apps-firefox@lists.mozilla.org
    > > Subject: XPFE browser?
    > >
    > > It is never appropriate to send the same message to two forums
    > > when one of those forums has "general" in its name.

    >
    > What then do we do if we have a question about the interface between
    > two different Mozilla elements?


    There's not a great solution to that, but I'd suggest an initial
    crosspost to let everyone in both lists know about the issue/topic, but
    with the followup set to whichever single group you feel is more
    appropriate. And the followup should be mentioned in the body of the
    OP so that people who'd need to switch lists (and are interested
    enough to do so) know where they can follow the issue.

    > I thought reposting the same message separately to two newsgroups was
    > a worse offence than cross-posting.


    Multiposting isn't a good idea either. But crossposting here is pretty
    bad, mostly because these groups are also mailing lists. ml
    subscribers will get multiposts anyway, and then they have to decide
    which list to reply to. So anyone hoping to see all replies has to
    read both groups/lists anyway. It's more complicated than that,
    because of the limitations of mailing lists and because of limitations
    of the specific mail-news gateway used here, but hopefully that's
    enough to talk you out of crossposting threads.

    I've set the followup to mozilla.general.

  11. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On 9/30/08 7:49 PM, _David E. Ross_ spoke thusly:
    > What then do we do if we have a question about the interface between two
    > different Mozilla elements?


    Ignore Dan; and go back to what I told you two years ago. :-)


    --
    Chris Ilias
    List-owner: support-firefox, support-thunderbird, test-multimedia

  12. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    The date and time was 9/30/2008 6:47 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:

    > David E. Ross wrote:
    >> On 9/30/2008 4:44 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    >>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>> The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    >>>> (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >>>>
    >>>>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>>>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was the case with v2x). FF3
    >>>>>> has crashed three times today, and has been doing so at least once
    >>>>>> per day for a while now. My daily routine of web pages open hasn't
    >>>>>> changed in months. It wasn't until today that it dawned on me what I
    >>>>>> have been doing lately, restarting FF.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Having the same issue with TB.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I suppose it could be attributed to Add-ons, but I don't use all that
    >>>>>> many.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Starting to lose my faith in Mozilla here...
    >>>>> crosspost removed Please do not crosspost thankyou
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Please remember to add a notification line as to where the discussion
    >>>>> is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.
    >>>> I'm sorry, I made reference to both, so please don't take the liberty to
    >>>> remove the crosspost. That way no one has to reply twice.
    >>>>
    >>>> Thank you for understanding,
    >>>>
    >>> Guidelines are here
    >>>
    >>> http://www.mozilla.org/community/etiquette.html
    >>>
    >>> guideline regarding crossposts reprinted here for your edification
    >>>
    >>> No crossposting.
    >>>
    >>> It is almost never appropriate to send the same message to two
    >>> mailing lists or newsgroups. Please don't do it. Or, if you must, make
    >>> sure you set the Followup-To and Reply-To fields to ensure that replies
    >>> go only to one, not to both.
    >>> example: Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.seamonkey
    >>> Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    >>> FollowUp-To: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    >>> Reply-To: dev-apps-firefox@lists.mozilla.org
    >>> Subject: XPFE browser?
    >>>
    >>> It is never appropriate to send the same message to two forums when
    >>> one of those forums has "general" in its name.
    >>>

    >> What then do we do if we have a question about the interface between two
    >> different Mozilla elements? I thought reposting the same message
    >> separately to two newsgroups was a worse offence than cross-posting.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Different elements in what? Differing elements in Firefox can be
    > discussed in the Firefox group.
    >
    > Different programs? The 'solution' in one program (say Firefox) may or
    > may not be the same as in Thunderbird, or even SeaMonkey.
    >
    > My suggestion is NOT to use 'shotgun' techniques when you are reporting
    > a problem, looking for a solution. Post to ONE group, and get what
    > answers you can, and then, if not satisfactory, post to another.
    >


    That is "just your suggestion", nothing else.


    > Regardless, the guidelines state "No Crossposting"


    Don't forget, "if you must...".

    > If you feel that you yourself can ignore the guidelines in your own best
    > interest, that is no reason for others to ignore them as well. I will
    > continue to delete crossposts in messages that I respond to, and will
    > duly note such in the message body
    >


    You have completely hijacked this thread and made it something that is
    not doing ANYTHING to resolve the Subject issue. If you have nothing to
    add, please stay OUT of this thread.

    You are acting in a manner that you have no authority to act in. Who
    made you a moderator in this group? If you have any power at all,
    cancel the post, don't just do what anyone else can do! Let me see, oh
    that's right, you don't have that authority! Come on Dan. Stick with
    the issues and stop being an old lady.

    follow up set to mozilla.general
    --
    Terry R.
    Anti-spam measures are included in my email address.
    Delete NOSPAM from the email address after clicking Reply.

  13. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    The date and time was 9/30/2008 6:33 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:

    > Terry R. wrote:
    >> The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:41 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    >> (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >>
    >>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was the case with v2x). FF3
    >>>> has crashed three times today, and has been doing so at least once
    >>>> per day for a while now. My daily routine of web pages open hasn't
    >>>> changed in months. It wasn't until today that it dawned on me what I
    >>>> have been doing lately, restarting FF.
    >>>>
    >>>> Having the same issue with TB.
    >>>>
    >>>> I suppose it could be attributed to Add-ons, but I don't use all that
    >>>> many.
    >>>>
    >>>> Starting to lose my faith in Mozilla here...
    >>>
    >>> crosspost snipped, please do no crosspost

    >> Please do NOT remove the crosspost. You are NOT a moderator here. I
    >> referenced both groups because the issue is on both. I do not want to
    >> have to reply twice to any comments.
    >>
    >> But here's a question for you. Why do you use "Moz Champion" when
    >> Mozilla does not recognize the "Champions" as such? Sure there's
    >> reference on ufaq, for obvious reasons when secnews was hosting mozilla
    >> groups. And even Chris I.'s site is clearly talking about secnews. But
    >> since Mozilla no longer uses secnews, your identifier is confusing at
    >> best. You do not have the power you had in secnews (except what has
    >> been possibly given to you in the screenshots group), and clearly only
    >> Chris, Nir & Q are overseeing these groups.
    >>
    >> And when you try to impose authority like you've done here, others may
    >> think you are directly connected with Mozilla, which you're not. I
    >> seriously doubt any users except those who've been in secnews even know
    >> what a Champion reference is all about.
    >>
    >> follow up set to mozilla.general
    >>

    >
    >
    > Mozilla org has recognized the Mozilla Champions
    > quoted from
    >
    > https://mail.mozilla.org/pipermail/n...03/000007.html
    >
    > The Mozilla Champions is a group of volunteers with the self assumed
    > mission of providing support for Mozilla products to end users. It is
    > a spin-off of the Netscape Champions group, founded in 1995 by Chuck
    > Simmons, Howard Beckerman, John Oliver and a handful of others.
    >
    > After the creation of the Mozilla Foundation, earlier this year,
    > Netscape Champions were warmly welcome to champion for Mozilla.
    > As stated in the Mozilla Champiosns website
    > (http://mozillachampions.mozdev.org), membership in the Champions
    > program is for those who demonstrate an ongoing commitment to aid
    > others using Mozilla products and get to be invited to the program.
    >


    Sorry. The link specifically states "Netscape Champions". Please show
    me specifically where the "Mozilla Champions" are recognized on this server.

    I demonstrate an ongoing commitment to aid others using Mozilla
    products. As do many others here. No one has been invited to "the
    program" since the move off of secnews. That's because "the program"
    doesn't exist.

    > Mozilla Champions attend as much as 1000 questions a month, from basic
    > to very advanced ones. Much of them within minutes and hardly within
    > more than 24 hours.


    Sure. Many here "attend" more questions than ANY "Mozilla Champions".
    Unless you want to count your posts that are just accusing someone of
    posting or doing something incorrectly.

    >
    > On
    > http://www.mozilla.org/community/other-forums.html
    >
    > We are listed alongside Mozillazine, Mozilla Lab and other forums
    >


    Sure #2.

    >
    > I will continue to remove crossposts from messages I reply to.
    > Simply because you feel it is your best interest to ignore guidelines
    > does not mean I can ignore them as well.


    And you will continue to be a pest in that regard. You are NOT a
    moderator. You have NOT been assigned to monitor the support groups,
    other than screenshots. Simply because you feel you are dogmatically
    enforcing guidelines does NOT make you right in your actions.


    >
    > Regardlesss if users 'know' what a champion is all about or not is not
    > important to the task.


    If your actions are reflecting what a "champion" is, then you should
    stick to using secnews as your stomping ground.

    --
    Terry R.
    Anti-spam measures are included in my email address.
    Delete NOSPAM from the email address after clicking Reply.

  14. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    Q wrote:
    > On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 16:49:53 -0700
    > "David E. Ross" wrote:
    >
    >> On 9/30/2008 4:44 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    >>




    > So anyone hoping to see all replies has to
    > read both groups/lists anyway.




    > I've set the followup to mozilla.general.


    If the TB/SM developers could re-instigate the old NN function where, if
    you read a message thats cross/multi-posted to several groups, the
    message is marked as read in ALL the groups, that would be great.

    See bugzilla id=43278

    Daniel

  15. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 21:28:34 -0700
    "Terry R." wrote:

    > The date and time was 9/30/2008 6:33 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    > (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >
    > > I will continue to remove crossposts from messages I reply to.
    > > Simply because you feel it is your best interest to ignore
    > > guidelines does not mean I can ignore them as well.

    >
    > And you will continue to be a pest in that regard. You are NOT a
    > moderator. You have NOT been assigned to monitor the support groups,
    > other than screenshots. Simply because you feel you are dogmatically
    > enforcing guidelines does NOT make you right in your actions.


    He's right to follow the etiquette guidelines and to encourage you to
    follow them. It doesn't have anything to do with whether or not he's a
    Mozilla Champion or a moderator -- everyone should follow the guidelines
    and encourage others to.

  16. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On 01.10.2008 10:11, CET - what odd quirk of fate caused Daniel to
    generate the following:? :
    > Q wrote:
    >
    >> On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 16:49:53 -0700
    >> "David E. Ross" wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>> On 9/30/2008 4:44 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    >>>
    >>>

    >
    >
    >
    >
    >> So anyone hoping to see all replies has to
    >> read both groups/lists anyway.
    >>

    >
    >
    >
    >
    >> I've set the followup to mozilla.general.
    >>

    >
    > If the TB/SM developers could re-instigate the old NN function where, if
    > you read a message thats cross/multi-posted to several groups, the
    > message is marked as read in ALL the groups, that would be great.
    >
    > See bugzilla id=43278
    >
    > Daniel
    >


    hey, Daniel - that's "functionability" you are asking for.... akin to
    mutiny!
    Ask for bells-and-whistles and see them in the next update - mutineers
    *WILL* be ignored!

    reg

  17. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On 9/30/2008 6:47 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    > David E. Ross wrote:
    >> On 9/30/2008 4:44 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    >>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>> The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    >>>> (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >>>>
    >>>>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>>>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was the case with v2x). FF3
    >>>>>> has crashed three times today, and has been doing so at least once
    >>>>>> per day for a while now. My daily routine of web pages open hasn't
    >>>>>> changed in months. It wasn't until today that it dawned on me what I
    >>>>>> have been doing lately, restarting FF.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Having the same issue with TB.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I suppose it could be attributed to Add-ons, but I don't use all that
    >>>>>> many.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Starting to lose my faith in Mozilla here...
    >>>>> crosspost removed Please do not crosspost thankyou
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Please remember to add a notification line as to where the discussion
    >>>>> is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.
    >>>> I'm sorry, I made reference to both, so please don't take the liberty to
    >>>> remove the crosspost. That way no one has to reply twice.
    >>>>
    >>>> Thank you for understanding,
    >>>>
    >>> Guidelines are here
    >>>
    >>> http://www.mozilla.org/community/etiquette.html
    >>>
    >>> guideline regarding crossposts reprinted here for your edification
    >>>
    >>> No crossposting.
    >>>
    >>> It is almost never appropriate to send the same message to two
    >>> mailing lists or newsgroups. Please don't do it. Or, if you must, make
    >>> sure you set the Followup-To and Reply-To fields to ensure that replies
    >>> go only to one, not to both.
    >>> example: Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.seamonkey
    >>> Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    >>> FollowUp-To: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    >>> Reply-To: dev-apps-firefox@lists.mozilla.org
    >>> Subject: XPFE browser?
    >>>
    >>> It is never appropriate to send the same message to two forums when
    >>> one of those forums has "general" in its name.
    >>>

    >> What then do we do if we have a question about the interface between two
    >> different Mozilla elements? I thought reposting the same message
    >> separately to two newsgroups was a worse offence than cross-posting.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Different elements in what? Differing elements in Firefox can be
    > discussed in the Firefox group.
    >
    > Different programs? The 'solution' in one program (say Firefox) may or
    > may not be the same as in Thunderbird, or even SeaMonkey.
    >
    > My suggestion is NOT to use 'shotgun' techniques when you are reporting
    > a problem, looking for a solution. Post to ONE group, and get what
    > answers you can, and then, if not satisfactory, post to another.
    >
    > Regardless, the guidelines state "No Crossposting"
    > If you feel that you yourself can ignore the guidelines in your own best
    > interest, that is no reason for others to ignore them as well. I will
    > continue to delete crossposts in messages that I respond to, and will
    > duly note such in the message body
    >


    I recently observed a problem in using SeaMonkey to view a Bugzilla bug
    report. I did not know whether it was a SeaMonkey problem or a Bugzilla
    problem. I cross-posted to both mozilla.support.seamonkey and
    mozilla.support.bugzilla. No one there objected.

    --
    David E. Ross


    Go to Mozdev at for quick access to
    extensions for Firefox, Thunderbird, SeaMonkey, and other
    Mozilla-related applications. You can access Mozdev much
    more quickly than you can Mozilla Add-Ons.

  18. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    Daniel wrote:
    > Q wrote:
    >> On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 16:49:53 -0700
    >> "David E. Ross" wrote:
    >>
    >>> On 9/30/2008 4:44 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    >>>

    >
    >
    >
    >> So anyone hoping to see all replies has to
    >> read both groups/lists anyway.

    >
    >
    >
    >> I've set the followup to mozilla.general.

    >
    > If the TB/SM developers could re-instigate the old NN function where, if
    > you read a message thats cross/multi-posted to several groups, the
    > message is marked as read in ALL the groups, that would be great.
    >
    > See bugzilla id=43278
    >
    > Daniel


    how can you "re-instigate" it when it was never there
    in SM/TB in the first place? :-)

    --
    *IMPORTANT*: Sorry folks, but I cannot provide email
    help!!!! Emails to me may become public

    Notice: This posting is protected under the Free Speech
    Laws, which applies everywhere in the FREE world,
    except for some strange reason, not to the mozilla.org
    newsgroup servers, where your posting may get you banned.

    Peter Potamus & His Magic Flying Balloon:
    http://melaman2.com/cartoons/singles/mp3/p-potamus.mp3
    http://www.toonopedia.com/potamus.htm

  19. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    Jay Garcia wrote:
    > On 30.09.2008 23:15, Terry R. wrote:
    >
    > --- Original Message ---
    >
    >> The date and time was 9/30/2008 6:47 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    >> (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >>
    >>> David E. Ross wrote:
    >>>> On 9/30/2008 4:44 PM, Moz Champion (Dan) wrote:
    >>>>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>>>> The date and time was 9/30/2008 4:19 PM, and on a whim, Moz Champion
    >>>>>> (Dan) pounded out on the keyboard:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> Terry R. wrote:
    >>>>>>>> It used to be FF/TB NEVER crashed (this was the case with v2x). FF3
    >>>>>>>> has crashed three times today, and has been doing so at least once
    >>>>>>>> per day for a while now. My daily routine of web pages open hasn't
    >>>>>>>> changed in months. It wasn't until today that it dawned on me what I
    >>>>>>>> have been doing lately, restarting FF.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> Having the same issue with TB.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> I suppose it could be attributed to Add-ons, but I don't use all that
    >>>>>>>> many.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> Starting to lose my faith in Mozilla here...
    >>>>>>> crosspost removed Please do not crosspost thankyou
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> Please remember to add a notification line as to where the discussion
    >>>>>>> is, when you submit screen shots thankyou.
    >>>>>> I'm sorry, I made reference to both, so please don't take the liberty to
    >>>>>> remove the crosspost. That way no one has to reply twice.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Thank you for understanding,
    >>>>>>
    >>>>> Guidelines are here
    >>>>>
    >>>>> http://www.mozilla.org/community/etiquette.html
    >>>>>
    >>>>> guideline regarding crossposts reprinted here for your edification
    >>>>>
    >>>>> No crossposting.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> It is almost never appropriate to send the same message to two
    >>>>> mailing lists or newsgroups. Please don't do it. Or, if you must, make
    >>>>> sure you set the Followup-To and Reply-To fields to ensure that replies
    >>>>> go only to one, not to both.
    >>>>> example: Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.seamonkey
    >>>>> Newsgroup: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    >>>>> FollowUp-To: mozilla.dev.apps.firefox
    >>>>> Reply-To: dev-apps-firefox@lists.mozilla.org
    >>>>> Subject: XPFE browser?
    >>>>>
    >>>>> It is never appropriate to send the same message to two forums when
    >>>>> one of those forums has "general" in its name.
    >>>>>
    >>>> What then do we do if we have a question about the interface between two
    >>>> different Mozilla elements? I thought reposting the same message
    >>>> separately to two newsgroups was a worse offence than cross-posting.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>> Different elements in what? Differing elements in Firefox can be
    >>> discussed in the Firefox group.
    >>>
    >>> Different programs? The 'solution' in one program (say Firefox) may or
    >>> may not be the same as in Thunderbird, or even SeaMonkey.
    >>>
    >>> My suggestion is NOT to use 'shotgun' techniques when you are reporting
    >>> a problem, looking for a solution. Post to ONE group, and get what
    >>> answers you can, and then, if not satisfactory, post to another.
    >>>

    >> That is "just your suggestion", nothing else.
    >>
    >>
    >>> Regardless, the guidelines state "No Crossposting"

    >> Don't forget, "if you must...".
    >>
    >>> If you feel that you yourself can ignore the guidelines in your own best
    >>> interest, that is no reason for others to ignore them as well. I will
    >>> continue to delete crossposts in messages that I respond to, and will
    >>> duly note such in the message body
    >>>

    >> You have completely hijacked this thread and made it something that is
    >> not doing ANYTHING to resolve the Subject issue. If you have nothing to
    >> add, please stay OUT of this thread.
    >>
    >> You are acting in a manner that you have no authority to act in. Who
    >> made you a moderator in this group? If you have any power at all,
    >> cancel the post, don't just do what anyone else can do! Let me see, oh
    >> that's right, you don't have that authority! Come on Dan. Stick with
    >> the issues and stop being an old lady.
    >>
    >> follow up set to mozilla.general

    >
    >
    > In defense of nobody ...
    >
    > If I were to remove the crosspost in one of MY replies it doesn't remove
    > the original or subsequent cross posted replies, just mine .. and I
    > don't need any extra authority to do that. However .... doing so breaks
    > the thread insofar as any information I may have contributed and any
    > subsequent replies under MY reply will also not be crossposted. What
    > should be done is to set a follow up.
    >


    I'm infavor of cross-posting without followups. Here's
    why:

    Lets say you post it to the TB, FF, and SM group, with
    a followup to the SM group. So, you're forcing me to
    go to the SM group to find out the replies.

    Its the same with just TB and FF, with a followup to
    TB. If I viewed the posting in FF, and I don't have
    TB, then you're now forcing me to visit a group that I
    don't use, to see . . . what, 2 replies.

    Counter productive if I say so.

    --
    *IMPORTANT*: Sorry folks, but I cannot provide email
    help!!!! Emails to me may become public

    Notice: This posting is protected under the Free Speech
    Laws, which applies everywhere in the FREE world,
    except for some strange reason, not to the mozilla.org
    newsgroup servers, where your posting may get you banned.

    Peter Potamus & His Magic Flying Balloon:
    http://melaman2.com/cartoons/singles/mp3/p-potamus.mp3
    http://www.toonopedia.com/potamus.htm

  20. Re: Firefox/TB getting unstable

    On Wed, 01 Oct 2008 08:35:31 -0700
    Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo
    wrote:

    > I'm infavor of cross-posting without followups. Here's
    > why:
    >
    > Lets say you post it to the TB, FF, and SM group, with
    > a followup to the SM group. So, you're forcing me to
    > go to the SM group to find out the replies.


    Not forcing -- you can go read the replies or not, as you wish. If
    followup is not set, you have to read *all three* groups if you want
    to be sure to see all replies, since mailing list users cannot
    crosspost their replies; with followup set, at least you know where
    to expect the rest of the thread to be.

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