Mac Market Share Facts - Microsoft Windows

This is a discussion on Mac Market Share Facts - Microsoft Windows ; "Tim Murray" wrote in message news:R%M_j.50782$7a.49801@bignews1.bellsouth.net > On Mon, 26 May 2008 23:50:11 -0400, Cuphea Ignea wrote: >> You do not know me or my experience. > > Nope. But we *do* know you're still an idiot. Takes one to ...

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Thread: Mac Market Share Facts

  1. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "Tim Murray" wrote in message
    news:R%M_j.50782$7a.49801@bignews1.bellsouth.net
    > On Mon, 26 May 2008 23:50:11 -0400, Cuphea Ignea wrote:
    >> You do not know me or my experience.

    >
    > Nope. But we *do* know you're still an idiot.


    Takes one to know one.


    --
    http://www.as7apcool.com/




  2. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    Rick wrote:
    > On Fri, 23 May 2008 12:53:34 -0500, Sgt. Friday wrote:
    >
    >> Rick wrote:
    >>> On Thu, 22 May 2008 20:33:31 -0700, George Graves wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Thu, 22 May 2008 18:06:37 -0700, Rick wrote (in article
    >>>> ):
    >>>>
    >>>>> On Thu, 22 May 2008 17:58:35 -0700, George Graves wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> On Thu, 22 May 2008 17:38:29 -0700, Tim Smith wrote (in article
    >>>>>> ):
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> In article , 7
    >>>>>>> wrote:
    >>>>>>>> Appil Asstroturfer Tim Smith wrote on behalf of Appil Corporation:
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> In article , 7
    >>>>>>>>> wrote:
    >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2007/04/25results.html fiscal
    >>>>>>>>>>> 2007 second quarter ended March 31, 2007 Apple shipped
    >>>>>>>>>>> 1,517,000 Macintosh® computers
    >>>>>>>>>> While Linux has improved its position to 1 million+ desktop
    >>>>>>>>>> installations per week and sales of 1 million+ embedded Linux
    >>>>>>>>>> gadgets PER DAY.
    >>>>>>>>> 1.5 million actual Mac sales are a lot more interesting than your
    >>>>>>>>> imaginary 13 million Linux desktops.
    >>>>>>>> Doh!
    >>>>>>>> Shows what appil asstroturfer know about counting!!!
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> =====
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> While Linux has improved its position to 1 million+ desktop
    >>>>>>>> installations per week and sales of 1 million+ embedded Linux
    >>>>>>>> gadgets PER DAY.
    >>>>>>> 1 million per week == 13 million per quarter, so your claim is that
    >>>>>>> Linux is beating Mac over 8 to 1 each quarter.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> Yet the Mac users are visible. You can go stand outside an Apple
    >>>>>>> store and see people walking out with Macs. You can go to
    >>>>>>> airports, and see people working on Macs while waiting for their
    >>>>>>> flights. You can go to coffee shops and see people on Macs. They
    >>>>>>> are showing up in web logs. They are buying books about Macs. They
    >>>>>>> are showing up in Mac software sales and downloads. You can go to
    >>>>>>> professional conferences, and see more and more Macs in the
    >>>>>>> audience. You can attend talks by Steve Ballmer, and find Mac
    >>>>>>> users sitting next to egg throwers. :-)
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> Your 13+ million Linux desktops per quarter seem to have fallen
    >>>>>>> into a black hole.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> You could arguably dismiss any one or two of the areas where Macs
    >>>>>>> are showing up as a fluke (e.g., Macs are known to be popular among
    >>>>>>> arty types, and arty types hang out in coffee shops more than
    >>>>>>> average people do, so you might expect more Macs there), but taken
    >>>>>>> all together, there are a lot more Macs out there. Apple reports
    >>>>>>> 1.5 million Macs in a quarter, and we see Macs show up.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> That simply does not happen with Linux. You claim over 8 times the
    >>>>>>> installs each quarter as Macs, yet in nearly everyplace one looks
    >>>>>>> outside of server rooms and embedded devices, there are far more
    >>>>>>> Macs than Linux desktops. Hence, your Linux numbers are clearly a
    >>>>>>> complete fantasy.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>> If Linux was growing as fast as these Linuxheads are fantasizing
    >>>>>> that that it is, you would be seeing announcements in the computer
    >>>>>> press fairly regularly, that Microsoft is porting Office to Linux,
    >>>>>> that Adobe is porting CS3 to linux, that Quicken and Quickbooks were
    >>>>>> being ported to Linux. But you don't. That's because these 13
    >>>>>> million desktops/quarter are imaginary desktops.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Open source software is the reason why the major developers aren't
    >>>>>> porting their software to Linux, you say? Well, much of it is
    >>>>>> available for Mac as well, and I've GIMP installed, Inkscape, and
    >>>>>> Scribus installed and I have Open Office installed. They vary in
    >>>>>> usefulness from not very to merely OK. The best of the lot is OO,
    >>>>>> and it's a decent competitor to MS Office, but it has a way to go
    >>>>>> before its Office's equal. It also needs to maintain 100%
    >>>>>> compatibility with Office to replace it in the enterprise, and
    >>>>>> that's nowhere near "there". Believe me, Linux usage would go up
    >>>>>> considerably if there were some professional grade apps to go with
    >>>>>> it.
    >>>>> It may needs to maintain 100% compatibility with Office to replace it
    >>>>> in the enterprise, but it doesn't need to maintain 100% compatibility
    >>>>> with Office to compete with it.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>> You just repeated what I said.
    >>> I will rephrase: Open Office is a very good replacement for a large
    >>> number of people right now.

    >>
    >> Which people are you going to replace with Open Office?
    >>
    >> ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

    >
    > .. and you think you have any credibility posting from teranews, and with
    > the handle of Sgt. Friday?


    What kind of credibility do you want for me to post a joke?

    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  3. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    On Mon, 26 May 2008 20:50:11 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    (in article ):

    > "George Graves" wrote in message
    > news:0001HW.C460D09300266E1BF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >> On Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:31 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >> (in article ):
    >>
    >>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>> news:0001HW.C46039C3000314EDF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 00:12:33 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>> (in article ):
    >>>>
    >>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> I don't want to start picking apart the feature lists in
    >>>>>>>> question, because they're long. So I'll simply note that in 10
    >>>>>>>> years in various content creation industries, I have never seen
    >>>>>>>> GIMP used as a Photoshop alternative in a professional setting.
    >>>>>>>> Not a single time.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> I tried to ignore the fact that you did not answer my question
    >>>>>>> but I failed. Features. Features. Do you not understand what I
    >>>>>>> mean?
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> It's useless.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I have used it so it can not be useless.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like
    >>>>>> that. Your response to George about CMYK is a perfect example.
    >>>>>> You've found a bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But
    >>>>>> there's a huge difference between outputting CMYK and natively
    >>>>>> supporting it. You don't understand what that difference is,
    >>>>>> because you've barely got a clue what CMYK is for and have
    >>>>>> probably never worked with a CMYK image.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself to
    >>>>> a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> You don't have to say what your experience is. Your posts show that
    >>>> you don't know what you are talking about on this subject.
    >>>
    >>> You have no idea what my experience is or is not.

    >>
    >> Ridiculous. Anyone with even a soupcon of knowledge or experience in
    >> the graphics world would understand that GIMP lacks real CMYK
    >> support, and would understand why that's so important. That you don't
    >> understand tells us all we need know about your experience in that
    >> field, anyway.
    >>
    >>> I have made my point and
    >>> you cannot make yours. I win.
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> You can't even write a coherent sentence, much less win a point. You
    >> have provided no proof of your assertions with regard to GIMP. You
    >> haven't cited one pre-press operation, graphics organization or
    >> publishing house that uses it.
    >>
    >> You "win" only when your adversaries change their mind and concede
    >> your point. No one here has been swayed by your illiterate ramblings
    >> one iota.

    >
    > You have no idea what my experience is.


    I know what it is NOT. That's enough.


    > I am sure mine is far more vaster
    > than yours and would make you cry in your SOUPCAN if you were to compare.


    Far more vaster? I doubt it.

    > Believe me when I say that GIMP does everything PHOTOSHOP does and more


    Except that I DON'T believe you. I have GIMP installed on my Mac (with the
    CMYK plug-in), I have used it, I know what it can and can't do.


    > and is open source which means if I want it to sing the daylights out of you

    it
    > can and WILL. Until I told you about plug-ins you did not even know what
    > they are.


    Bull****. I have GIMP installed and the CMYK plug-in. It outputs CMYK is does
    NOT let one edit a CMYK separation directly. Sorry.

    > The idea that for me to be right and win I have to convince an
    > ignoramous such as yourself is beyond what I have heard of before now.


    You have won nothing. You cannot "win" by assertion, you can only "win" by
    backing-up what you assert and you have failed to do this.



    > I win because I am a professional in the color graphics world where you are
    > not.


    Permit me to doubt you.



    and I have the experience you only read about. Have you seen the new
    > Indiana Jones movie (Crystal Skull).


    No. I do not go to the movies. Modern movies are junk

    > If not go see it and watch the colors there and see if PHOTOSHOP could do

    all that on a shoestring budget or even
    > with millions. You do not know me or my experience.


    I have no interest in seeing another junk bubble-gum movie, and yes,
    Photoshop could do "all that". I've a good buddy who works for IL&M and he
    says that they use Photoshop for single frame touch-up. GIMP could be used in
    that instance because film/video is RGB (which GIMP supports), not CMYK.

    You don't know what you're talking about, OR, you communicate so badly that
    no one else knows what you're talking about. Either way, you lose. BTW, I
    publish a print magazine each month. I know about what GIMP will and will not
    do.


  4. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    On Mon, 26 May 2008 20:46:17 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    (in article ):

    > "George Graves" wrote in message
    > news:0001HW.C460D0BD002677D6F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >> On Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:59 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >> (in article ):
    >>
    >>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>> news:0001HW.C46039350002F39EF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>> On Sun, 25 May 2008 23:42:36 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>> (in article ):
    >>>>
    >>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> ZnU splattered upon for all to feel:
    >>>>>>>> In article <4S_Zj.19789$255.15895@bignews8.bellsouth.net>,
    >>>>>>>> Linonut wrote:
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> * ZnU peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> This is what I've been saying for years. Linux has some decent
    >>>>>>>>>> apps for very common desktop tasks like web browsing, word
    >>>>>>>>>> processing and e-mail. And it has a scattering of high-end
    >>>>>>>>>> apps from markets where Unix used to be popular, like
    >>>>>>>>>> high-end 3D. But that's about it. And that's not enough to
    >>>>>>>>>> make it a viable operating system for demanding users, unless
    >>>>>>>>>> they happen to be in certain very specific fields.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> Get back with us when you've evaluated all of the applications
    >>>>>>>>> in this partial list of commercial applications, circa 2005:
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> http://www.yolinux.com/TUTORIALS/Lin...lications.html
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> Well, I can't speak for everyone in all fields. But I don't see
    >>>>>>>> plausible replacements for Final Cut Pro or Photoshop on that
    >>>>>>>> list.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> [snip]
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> GIMP is more than enough for most people, even professionals.
    >>>>>>> What features of Photoshop do you think GIMP is missing? What is
    >>>>>>> lacking is there are plug ins for plus it is more configurable
    >>>>>>> and scriptable and it is open source so if you like to add a
    >>>>>>> feature or change a feature nothng is stopping you.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Yup, this thread is taking precisely the same course as all the
    >>>>>> other Linux app threads. We've reached the stage where Linux
    >>>>>> advocates who have no idea what they're talking about insist that
    >>>>>> apps are equivalent when essentially no professional user
    >>>>>> considers them so.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I don't want to start picking apart the feature lists in question,
    >>>>>> because they're long. So I'll simply note that in 10 years in
    >>>>>> various content creation industries, I have never seen GIMP used
    >>>>>> as a Photoshop alternative in a professional setting. Not a single
    >>>>>> time.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I tried to ignore the fact that you did not answer my question but
    >>>>> I failed. Features. Features. Do you not understand what I mean?
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> I do, and so, I suspect, does Znu. The main feature is core CMYK
    >>>> support. It doesn't exist in GIMP and it relegates GIMP to home
    >>>> digital photo retouching. Come back an talk to us about this subject
    >>>> when you learn what professional Photoshop users NEED from the
    >>>> program. You clearly don't have a clue.
    >>>
    >>> plug. in.
    >>>
    >>> I win.

    >> Plug-in what?

    >
    > Unbelievable. Use it for a few days and learn a thing or two.
    >
    >


    Use what for a few days? You're not making any sense whatsoever!


  5. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    George Graves writes:

    > On Mon, 26 May 2008 20:50:11 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    > (in article ):
    >
    >> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >> news:0001HW.C460D09300266E1BF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:31 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>> (in article ):
    >>>
    >>>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>>> news:0001HW.C46039C3000314EDF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 00:12:33 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>>> (in article ):
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> I don't want to start picking apart the feature lists in
    >>>>>>>>> question, because they're long. So I'll simply note that in 10
    >>>>>>>>> years in various content creation industries, I have never seen
    >>>>>>>>> GIMP used as a Photoshop alternative in a professional setting.
    >>>>>>>>> Not a single time.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> I tried to ignore the fact that you did not answer my question
    >>>>>>>> but I failed. Features. Features. Do you not understand what I
    >>>>>>>> mean?
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> It's useless.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I have used it so it can not be useless.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like
    >>>>>>> that. Your response to George about CMYK is a perfect example.
    >>>>>>> You've found a bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But
    >>>>>>> there's a huge difference between outputting CMYK and natively
    >>>>>>> supporting it. You don't understand what that difference is,
    >>>>>>> because you've barely got a clue what CMYK is for and have
    >>>>>>> probably never worked with a CMYK image.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself to
    >>>>>> a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> You don't have to say what your experience is. Your posts show that
    >>>>> you don't know what you are talking about on this subject.
    >>>>
    >>>> You have no idea what my experience is or is not.
    >>>
    >>> Ridiculous. Anyone with even a soupcon of knowledge or experience in
    >>> the graphics world would understand that GIMP lacks real CMYK
    >>> support, and would understand why that's so important. That you don't
    >>> understand tells us all we need know about your experience in that
    >>> field, anyway.
    >>>
    >>>> I have made my point and
    >>>> you cannot make yours. I win.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> You can't even write a coherent sentence, much less win a point. You
    >>> have provided no proof of your assertions with regard to GIMP. You
    >>> haven't cited one pre-press operation, graphics organization or
    >>> publishing house that uses it.
    >>>
    >>> You "win" only when your adversaries change their mind and concede
    >>> your point. No one here has been swayed by your illiterate ramblings
    >>> one iota.

    >>
    >> You have no idea what my experience is.

    >
    > I know what it is NOT. That's enough.
    >
    >
    >> I am sure mine is far more vaster
    >> than yours and would make you cry in your SOUPCAN if you were to compare.

    >
    > Far more vaster? I doubt it.
    >
    >> Believe me when I say that GIMP does everything PHOTOSHOP does and more

    >
    > Except that I DON'T believe you. I have GIMP installed on my Mac (with the
    > CMYK plug-in), I have used it, I know what it can and can't do.
    >
    >
    >> and is open source which means if I want it to sing the daylights out of you

    > it
    >> can and WILL. Until I told you about plug-ins you did not even know what
    >> they are.

    >
    > Bull****. I have GIMP installed and the CMYK plug-in. It outputs CMYK is does
    > NOT let one edit a CMYK separation directly. Sorry.
    >
    >> The idea that for me to be right and win I have to convince an
    >> ignoramous such as yourself is beyond what I have heard of before now.

    >
    > You have won nothing. You cannot "win" by assertion, you can only "win" by
    > backing-up what you assert and you have failed to do this.



    It's probably Bill Baka under another nym. All hot air and wild claims
    of years of experience.

  6. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    On 2008-05-26, ZnU wrote:
    > In article ,
    > "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >
    >> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >> > In article , "Cuphea Ignea"
    >> > wrote:
    >> >
    >> >> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >> >> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net

    [deletia]
    >> > You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like that. Your
    >> > response to George about CMYK is a perfect example. You've found a
    >> > bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But there's a huge
    >> > difference between outputting CMYK and natively supporting it. You
    >> > don't understand what that difference is, because you've barely got
    >> > a clue what CMYK is for and have probably never worked with a CMYK
    >> > image.

    >>
    >> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself to a
    >> make beleive artist such as you!

    >
    > In other words, you barely understand what I'm talking about because you
    > have no experience in this field.


    Do you?

    Unless you are ready to say "I am a pre-press professional" then
    you're just talking out your ass. Also, like I implied before. The
    fact that Windows dominates this now, or the Mac dominated this 10
    years ago doesn't say much about Linux in general.

    It's like getting all hot and bothered about Cubase.

    --


    Some people have this nutty idea that in 1997 |||
    reading to a hard disk and writing to a hard disk / | \
    both at the same time was something worth patenting.


    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    http://www.usenet.com

  7. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    On Tue, 27 May 2008 11:24:29 -0700, JEDIDIAH wrote
    (in article ):

    > On 2008-05-26, ZnU wrote:
    >> In article ,
    >> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>
    >>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>> In article , "Cuphea Ignea"
    >>>> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net

    > [deletia]
    >>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like that. Your
    >>>> response to George about CMYK is a perfect example. You've found a
    >>>> bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But there's a huge
    >>>> difference between outputting CMYK and natively supporting it. You
    >>>> don't understand what that difference is, because you've barely got
    >>>> a clue what CMYK is for and have probably never worked with a CMYK
    >>>> image.
    >>>
    >>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself to a
    >>> make beleive artist such as you!

    >>
    >> In other words, you barely understand what I'm talking about because you
    >> have no experience in this field.

    >
    > Do you?
    >
    > Unless you are ready to say "I am a pre-press professional" then
    > you're just talking out your ass. Also, like I implied before. The
    > fact that Windows dominates this now, or the Mac dominated this 10
    > years ago doesn't say much about Linux in general.


    The Mac still dominates pre-press. Where it doesn't dominate any more is in
    the actual press-room. That's because PDF has become the great "leveler".
    None of Windows' problems with typography or color calibration mean anything
    whatsoever when the client provides the print shop with a completely laid-out
    and calibrated PDF file. In that case, all the PC becomes is an output device
    to send fully rasterized page files to the image setter. Winboxes are cheap
    and Acrobat Reader is free :->

    > It's like getting all hot and bothered about Cubase.


    I prefer Audacity, myself. One place where Open Source is actually VERY GOOD.

    But getting back to the GIMP. This "Cuphea Ignea" asserts that GIMP currently
    fully supports CMYK via the CMYK plug-in and he most assuredly does not know
    what he is talking about. Even the GIMP home page is very spexific about the
    fact that The GIMP does not natively support CMYK and that the plug-in filter
    merely outputs an RGB file as a CMYK. One cannot edit the CMYK layers
    directly in GIMP. In Photoshop one can change the entire workspace from RGB
    centric to CMYK centric. Without this ability, the GIMP is practically
    useless as a professional PRINT graphics application. The reason why nobody
    has added this capability to the GIMP is because the entire application would
    have to be rewritten to include the CMYK workspace. It cannot be implemented
    by merely adding a "plug-in".


  8. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "George Graves" wrote in message
    news:0001HW.C461994500065D1CF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    > On Mon, 26 May 2008 20:50:11 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    > (in article ):
    >
    >> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >> news:0001HW.C460D09300266E1BF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:31 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>> (in article ):
    >>>
    >>>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>>> news:0001HW.C46039C3000314EDF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 00:12:33 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>>> (in article ):
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> I don't want to start picking apart the feature lists in
    >>>>>>>>> question, because they're long. So I'll simply note that in 10
    >>>>>>>>> years in various content creation industries, I have never
    >>>>>>>>> seen GIMP used as a Photoshop alternative in a professional
    >>>>>>>>> setting. Not a single time.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> I tried to ignore the fact that you did not answer my question
    >>>>>>>> but I failed. Features. Features. Do you not understand what
    >>>>>>>> I mean?
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> It's useless.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I have used it so it can not be useless.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like
    >>>>>>> that. Your response to George about CMYK is a perfect example.
    >>>>>>> You've found a bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But
    >>>>>>> there's a huge difference between outputting CMYK and natively
    >>>>>>> supporting it. You don't understand what that difference is,
    >>>>>>> because you've barely got a clue what CMYK is for and have
    >>>>>>> probably never worked with a CMYK image.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself
    >>>>>> to a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> You don't have to say what your experience is. Your posts show
    >>>>> that you don't know what you are talking about on this subject.
    >>>>
    >>>> You have no idea what my experience is or is not.
    >>>
    >>> Ridiculous. Anyone with even a soupcon of knowledge or experience in
    >>> the graphics world would understand that GIMP lacks real CMYK
    >>> support, and would understand why that's so important. That you
    >>> don't understand tells us all we need know about your experience in
    >>> that field, anyway.
    >>>
    >>>> I have made my point and
    >>>> you cannot make yours. I win.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> You can't even write a coherent sentence, much less win a point. You
    >>> have provided no proof of your assertions with regard to GIMP. You
    >>> haven't cited one pre-press operation, graphics organization or
    >>> publishing house that uses it.
    >>>
    >>> You "win" only when your adversaries change their mind and concede
    >>> your point. No one here has been swayed by your illiterate ramblings
    >>> one iota.

    >>
    >> You have no idea what my experience is.

    >
    > I know what it is NOT. That's enough.


    You pretend to know about me instead of the issue.

    >> I am sure mine is far more vaster
    >> than yours and would make you cry in your SOUPCAN if you were to
    >> compare.

    >
    > Far more vaster? I doubt it.


    We will not know because the issue is not me or you but GIMP and PHOTOSHOP.

    >> Believe me when I say that GIMP does everything PHOTOSHOP does and
    >> more

    >
    > Except that I DON'T believe you. I have GIMP installed on my Mac
    > (with the CMYK plug-in), I have used it, I know what it can and can't
    > do.


    Three plug-ins. Google is your friend.

    >> and is open source which means if I want it to sing the daylights
    >> out of you it can and WILL. Until I told you about plug-ins you did
    >> not even know what they are.

    >
    > Bull****. I have GIMP installed and the CMYK plug-in. It outputs CMYK
    > is does NOT let one edit a CMYK separation directly. Sorry.


    No need to be sorry for your lack of knowing, just learn! We all start off
    as no nothings.

    >> The idea that for me to be right and win I have to convince an
    >> ignoramous such as yourself is beyond what I have heard of before
    >> now.

    >
    > You have won nothing. You cannot "win" by assertion, you can only
    > "win" by backing-up what you assert and you have failed to do this.


    Are you thinking I must convince you when you do not know how to even use
    the Google engine or CMYK?

    >> I win because I am a professional in the color graphics world where
    >> you are not.

    >
    > Permit me to doubt you.


    You have my permission as if you think you need it.

    > and I have the experience you only read about. Have you seen the new
    >> Indiana Jones movie (Crystal Skull).

    >
    > No. I do not go to the movies. Modern movies are junk


    Why try to offend my person and not talk about GIMP and PHOTOSHOP?

    >> If not go see it and watch the colors there and see if PHOTOSHOP
    >> could do

    > all that on a shoestring budget or even
    >> with millions. You do not know me or my experience.

    >
    > I have no interest in seeing another junk bubble-gum movie, and yes,
    > Photoshop could do "all that". I've a good buddy who works for IL&M
    > and he says that they use Photoshop for single frame touch-up. GIMP
    > could be used in that instance because film/video is RGB (which GIMP
    > supports), not CMYK.


    You have no experience but a "good friend". I have experience and work with
    "good friend". Do you see now why I know more than you?

    > You don't know what you're talking about, OR, you communicate so
    > badly that no one else knows what you're talking about. Either way,
    > you lose. BTW, I publish a print magazine each month. I know about
    > what GIMP will and will not do.


    You do not use it you say so how do you know what it does? Many people
    publish newsletters.

    --
    http://www.as7apcool.com/



  9. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    On Tue, 27 May 2008 23:44:11 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    (in article ):

    > "George Graves" wrote in message
    > news:0001HW.C461994500065D1CF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >> On Mon, 26 May 2008 20:50:11 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >> (in article ):
    >>
    >>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>> news:0001HW.C460D09300266E1BF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:31 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>> (in article ):
    >>>>
    >>>>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>>>> news:0001HW.C46039C3000314EDF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>>>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 00:12:33 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>>>> (in article ):
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> I don't want to start picking apart the feature lists in
    >>>>>>>>>> question, because they're long. So I'll simply note that in 10
    >>>>>>>>>> years in various content creation industries, I have never
    >>>>>>>>>> seen GIMP used as a Photoshop alternative in a professional
    >>>>>>>>>> setting. Not a single time.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> I tried to ignore the fact that you did not answer my question
    >>>>>>>>> but I failed. Features. Features. Do you not understand what
    >>>>>>>>> I mean?
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> It's useless.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> I have used it so it can not be useless.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like
    >>>>>>>> that. Your response to George about CMYK is a perfect example.
    >>>>>>>> You've found a bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But
    >>>>>>>> there's a huge difference between outputting CMYK and natively
    >>>>>>>> supporting it. You don't understand what that difference is,
    >>>>>>>> because you've barely got a clue what CMYK is for and have
    >>>>>>>> probably never worked with a CMYK image.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself
    >>>>>>> to a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> You don't have to say what your experience is. Your posts show
    >>>>>> that you don't know what you are talking about on this subject.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> You have no idea what my experience is or is not.
    >>>>
    >>>> Ridiculous. Anyone with even a soupcon of knowledge or experience in
    >>>> the graphics world would understand that GIMP lacks real CMYK
    >>>> support, and would understand why that's so important. That you
    >>>> don't understand tells us all we need know about your experience in
    >>>> that field, anyway.
    >>>>
    >>>>> I have made my point and
    >>>>> you cannot make yours. I win.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> You can't even write a coherent sentence, much less win a point. You
    >>>> have provided no proof of your assertions with regard to GIMP. You
    >>>> haven't cited one pre-press operation, graphics organization or
    >>>> publishing house that uses it.
    >>>>
    >>>> You "win" only when your adversaries change their mind and concede
    >>>> your point. No one here has been swayed by your illiterate ramblings
    >>>> one iota.
    >>>
    >>> You have no idea what my experience is.

    >>
    >> I know what it is NOT. That's enough.

    >
    > You pretend to know about me instead of the issue.
    >
    >>> I am sure mine is far more vaster
    >>> than yours and would make you cry in your SOUPCAN if you were to
    >>> compare.

    >>
    >> Far more vaster? I doubt it.

    >
    > We will not know because the issue is not me or you but GIMP and PHOTOSHOP.
    >
    >>> Believe me when I say that GIMP does everything PHOTOSHOP does and
    >>> more

    >>
    >> Except that I DON'T believe you. I have GIMP installed on my Mac
    >> (with the CMYK plug-in), I have used it, I know what it can and can't
    >> do.

    >
    > Three plug-ins. Google is your friend.
    >
    >>> and is open source which means if I want it to sing the daylights
    >>> out of you it can and WILL. Until I told you about plug-ins you did
    >>> not even know what they are.

    >>
    >> Bull****. I have GIMP installed and the CMYK plug-in. It outputs CMYK
    >> is does NOT let one edit a CMYK separation directly. Sorry.

    >
    > No need to be sorry for your lack of knowing, just learn! We all start off
    > as no nothings.
    >
    >>> The idea that for me to be right and win I have to convince an
    >>> ignoramous such as yourself is beyond what I have heard of before
    >>> now.

    >>
    >> You have won nothing. You cannot "win" by assertion, you can only
    >> "win" by backing-up what you assert and you have failed to do this.

    >
    > Are you thinking I must convince you when you do not know how to even use
    > the Google engine or CMYK?
    >
    >>> I win because I am a professional in the color graphics world where
    >>> you are not.

    >>
    >> Permit me to doubt you.

    >
    > You have my permission as if you think you need it.
    >
    >> and I have the experience you only read about. Have you seen the new
    >>> Indiana Jones movie (Crystal Skull).

    >>
    >> No. I do not go to the movies. Modern movies are junk

    >
    > Why try to offend my person and not talk about GIMP and PHOTOSHOP?
    >
    >>> If not go see it and watch the colors there and see if PHOTOSHOP
    >>> could do

    >> all that on a shoestring budget or even
    >>> with millions. You do not know me or my experience.

    >>
    >> I have no interest in seeing another junk bubble-gum movie, and yes,
    >> Photoshop could do "all that". I've a good buddy who works for IL&M
    >> and he says that they use Photoshop for single frame touch-up. GIMP
    >> could be used in that instance because film/video is RGB (which GIMP
    >> supports), not CMYK.

    >
    > You have no experience but a "good friend". I have experience and work with
    > "good friend". Do you see now why I know more than you?
    >
    >> You don't know what you're talking about, OR, you communicate so
    >> badly that no one else knows what you're talking about. Either way,
    >> you lose. BTW, I publish a print magazine each month. I know about
    >> what GIMP will and will not do.

    >
    > You do not use it you say so how do you know what it does? Many people
    > publish newsletters.
    >
    >


    I said a color MAGAZINE, knucklehead, not a "news letter".


  10. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    On Wed, 28 May 2008 01:47:45 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    (in article ):

    > "George Graves" wrote in message
    > news:0001HW.C461AD5F000B1346F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >> On Tue, 27 May 2008 11:24:29 -0700, JEDIDIAH wrote
    >> (in article ):
    >>
    >>> On 2008-05-26, ZnU wrote:
    >>>> In article ,
    >>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>> In article , "Cuphea
    >>>>>> Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>> [deletia]
    >>>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like that. Your
    >>>>>> response to George about CMYK is a perfect example. You've found a
    >>>>>> bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But there's a huge
    >>>>>> difference between outputting CMYK and natively supporting it. You
    >>>>>> don't understand what that difference is, because you've barely
    >>>>>> got a clue what CMYK is for and have probably never worked with a
    >>>>>> CMYK image.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself to
    >>>>> a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>>
    >>>> In other words, you barely understand what I'm talking about
    >>>> because you have no experience in this field.
    >>>
    >>> Do you?
    >>>
    >>> Unless you are ready to say "I am a pre-press professional" then
    >>> you're just talking out your ass. Also, like I implied before. The
    >>> fact that Windows dominates this now, or the Mac dominated this 10
    >>> years ago doesn't say much about Linux in general.

    >>
    >> The Mac still dominates pre-press. Where it doesn't dominate any more
    >> is in the actual press-room. That's because PDF has become the great
    >> "leveler". None of Windows' problems with typography or color
    >> calibration mean anything whatsoever when the client provides the
    >> print shop with a completely laid-out and calibrated PDF file. In
    >> that case, all the PC becomes is an output device to send fully
    >> rasterized page files to the image setter. Winboxes are cheap and
    >> Acrobat Reader is free :->
    >>
    >>> It's like getting all hot and bothered about Cubase.

    >>
    >> I prefer Audacity, myself. One place where Open Source is actually
    >> VERY GOOD.
    >>
    >> But getting back to the GIMP. This "Cuphea Ignea" asserts that GIMP
    >> currently fully supports CMYK via the CMYK plug-in and he most
    >> assuredly does not know what he is talking about. Even the GIMP home
    >> page is very spexific about the fact that The GIMP does not natively
    >> support CMYK and that the plug-in filter merely outputs an RGB file
    >> as a CMYK. One cannot edit the CMYK layers directly in GIMP. In
    >> Photoshop one can change the entire workspace from RGB centric to
    >> CMYK centric. Without this ability, the GIMP is practically useless
    >> as a professional PRINT graphics application. The reason why nobody
    >> has added this capability to the GIMP is because the entire
    >> application would have to be rewritten to include the CMYK workspace.
    >> It cannot be implemented by merely adding a "plug-in".

    >
    > There are plug ins and you have not seen Crystal Skull to know what you are
    > talking about.
    >
    >


    Idiot. Crystal Skull is IRRELEVANT to the print and pre-press world. I don't
    care What GIMP can do in the RGB color space. I don't use the RGB color
    space, I use CMYK and The GIMP doesn't support it directly. Jeeze, how many
    times to I have to repeat that?


  11. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    On Wed, 28 May 2008 01:45:03 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    (in article ):

    > "George Graves" wrote in message
    > news:0001HW.C461998E00066E3DF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >> On Mon, 26 May 2008 20:46:17 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >> (in article ):
    >>
    >>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>> news:0001HW.C460D0BD002677D6F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:59 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>> (in article ):
    >>>>
    >>>>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>>>> news:0001HW.C46039350002F39EF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>>>> On Sun, 25 May 2008 23:42:36 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>>>> (in article ):
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> ZnU splattered upon for all to feel:
    >>>>>>>>>> In article <4S_Zj.19789$255.15895@bignews8.bellsouth.net>,
    >>>>>>>>>> Linonut wrote:
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> * ZnU peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>>> This is what I've been saying for years. Linux has some
    >>>>>>>>>>>> decent apps for very common desktop tasks like web
    >>>>>>>>>>>> browsing, word processing and e-mail. And it has a
    >>>>>>>>>>>> scattering of high-end apps from markets where Unix used to
    >>>>>>>>>>>> be popular, like high-end 3D. But that's about it. And
    >>>>>>>>>>>> that's not enough to make it a viable operating system for
    >>>>>>>>>>>> demanding users, unless they happen to be in certain very
    >>>>>>>>>>>> specific fields.
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> Get back with us when you've evaluated all of the
    >>>>>>>>>>> applications in this partial list of commercial
    >>>>>>>>>>> applications, circa 2005:
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.yolinux.com/TUTORIALS/Lin...lications.html
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> Well, I can't speak for everyone in all fields. But I don't
    >>>>>>>>>> see plausible replacements for Final Cut Pro or Photoshop on
    >>>>>>>>>> that list.
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> [snip]
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> GIMP is more than enough for most people, even professionals.
    >>>>>>>>> What features of Photoshop do you think GIMP is missing? What
    >>>>>>>>> is lacking is there are plug ins for plus it is more
    >>>>>>>>> configurable and scriptable and it is open source so if you
    >>>>>>>>> like to add a feature or change a feature nothng is stopping
    >>>>>>>>> you.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> Yup, this thread is taking precisely the same course as all the
    >>>>>>>> other Linux app threads. We've reached the stage where Linux
    >>>>>>>> advocates who have no idea what they're talking about insist
    >>>>>>>> that apps are equivalent when essentially no professional user
    >>>>>>>> considers them so.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> I don't want to start picking apart the feature lists in
    >>>>>>>> question, because they're long. So I'll simply note that in 10
    >>>>>>>> years in various content creation industries, I have never seen
    >>>>>>>> GIMP used as a Photoshop alternative in a professional setting.
    >>>>>>>> Not a single time.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> I tried to ignore the fact that you did not answer my question
    >>>>>>> but I failed. Features. Features. Do you not understand what I
    >>>>>>> mean?
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I do, and so, I suspect, does Znu. The main feature is core CMYK
    >>>>>> support. It doesn't exist in GIMP and it relegates GIMP to home
    >>>>>> digital photo retouching. Come back an talk to us about this
    >>>>>> subject when you learn what professional Photoshop users NEED
    >>>>>> from the program. You clearly don't have a clue.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> plug. in.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I win.
    >>>> Plug-in what?
    >>>
    >>> Unbelievable. Use it for a few days and learn a thing or two.
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> Use what for a few days? You're not making any sense whatsoever!

    >
    > If you have not even used it for a few days then how do you know why it does
    > not have what you think it does?
    >
    >


    USED WHAT????!!!!!!!!!


  12. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    On Wed, 28 May 2008 01:45:03 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote:


    > If you have not even used it for a few days then how do you know why it does
    > not have what you think it does?


    It only takes a few hours for the average person to learn that Linux sucks
    on the desktop.
    I've seen it many times.


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  13. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "Moshe, Goldfarb." wrote in message
    news:ujoamcbzme8d$.11hbkuq3t65gj.dlg@40tude.net
    > On Wed, 28 May 2008 01:45:03 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote:
    >
    >
    >> If you have not even used it for a few days then how do you know why
    >> it does not have what you think it does?

    >
    > It only takes a few hours for the average person to learn that Linux
    > sucks on the desktop.
    > I've seen it many times.


    What about it "sucks" to you? How long have you used OS X or Windows? I
    bet longer? You are using what you know and not what is best for you like
    so many others.

    --
    http://www.as7apcool.com/



  14. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "George Graves" wrote in message
    news:0001HW.C461998E00066E3DF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    > On Mon, 26 May 2008 20:46:17 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    > (in article ):
    >
    >> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >> news:0001HW.C460D0BD002677D6F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:59 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>> (in article ):
    >>>
    >>>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>>> news:0001HW.C46039350002F39EF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>>> On Sun, 25 May 2008 23:42:36 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>>> (in article ):
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> ZnU splattered upon for all to feel:
    >>>>>>>>> In article <4S_Zj.19789$255.15895@bignews8.bellsouth.net>,
    >>>>>>>>> Linonut wrote:
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> * ZnU peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> This is what I've been saying for years. Linux has some
    >>>>>>>>>>> decent apps for very common desktop tasks like web
    >>>>>>>>>>> browsing, word processing and e-mail. And it has a
    >>>>>>>>>>> scattering of high-end apps from markets where Unix used to
    >>>>>>>>>>> be popular, like high-end 3D. But that's about it. And
    >>>>>>>>>>> that's not enough to make it a viable operating system for
    >>>>>>>>>>> demanding users, unless they happen to be in certain very
    >>>>>>>>>>> specific fields.
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> Get back with us when you've evaluated all of the
    >>>>>>>>>> applications in this partial list of commercial
    >>>>>>>>>> applications, circa 2005:
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> http://www.yolinux.com/TUTORIALS/Lin...lications.html
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> Well, I can't speak for everyone in all fields. But I don't
    >>>>>>>>> see plausible replacements for Final Cut Pro or Photoshop on
    >>>>>>>>> that list.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> [snip]
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> GIMP is more than enough for most people, even professionals.
    >>>>>>>> What features of Photoshop do you think GIMP is missing? What
    >>>>>>>> is lacking is there are plug ins for plus it is more
    >>>>>>>> configurable and scriptable and it is open source so if you
    >>>>>>>> like to add a feature or change a feature nothng is stopping
    >>>>>>>> you.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> Yup, this thread is taking precisely the same course as all the
    >>>>>>> other Linux app threads. We've reached the stage where Linux
    >>>>>>> advocates who have no idea what they're talking about insist
    >>>>>>> that apps are equivalent when essentially no professional user
    >>>>>>> considers them so.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> I don't want to start picking apart the feature lists in
    >>>>>>> question, because they're long. So I'll simply note that in 10
    >>>>>>> years in various content creation industries, I have never seen
    >>>>>>> GIMP used as a Photoshop alternative in a professional setting.
    >>>>>>> Not a single time.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I tried to ignore the fact that you did not answer my question
    >>>>>> but I failed. Features. Features. Do you not understand what I
    >>>>>> mean?
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I do, and so, I suspect, does Znu. The main feature is core CMYK
    >>>>> support. It doesn't exist in GIMP and it relegates GIMP to home
    >>>>> digital photo retouching. Come back an talk to us about this
    >>>>> subject when you learn what professional Photoshop users NEED
    >>>>> from the program. You clearly don't have a clue.
    >>>>
    >>>> plug. in.
    >>>>
    >>>> I win.
    >>> Plug-in what?

    >>
    >> Unbelievable. Use it for a few days and learn a thing or two.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Use what for a few days? You're not making any sense whatsoever!


    If you have not even used it for a few days then how do you know why it does
    not have what you think it does?

    --
    http://www.as7apcool.com/



  15. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "George Graves" wrote in message
    news:0001HW.C461AD5F000B1346F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    > On Tue, 27 May 2008 11:24:29 -0700, JEDIDIAH wrote
    > (in article ):
    >
    >> On 2008-05-26, ZnU wrote:
    >>> In article ,
    >>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>> In article , "Cuphea
    >>>>> Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net

    >> [deletia]
    >>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like that. Your
    >>>>> response to George about CMYK is a perfect example. You've found a
    >>>>> bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But there's a huge
    >>>>> difference between outputting CMYK and natively supporting it. You
    >>>>> don't understand what that difference is, because you've barely
    >>>>> got a clue what CMYK is for and have probably never worked with a
    >>>>> CMYK image.
    >>>>
    >>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself to
    >>>> a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>
    >>> In other words, you barely understand what I'm talking about
    >>> because you have no experience in this field.

    >>
    >> Do you?
    >>
    >> Unless you are ready to say "I am a pre-press professional" then
    >> you're just talking out your ass. Also, like I implied before. The
    >> fact that Windows dominates this now, or the Mac dominated this 10
    >> years ago doesn't say much about Linux in general.

    >
    > The Mac still dominates pre-press. Where it doesn't dominate any more
    > is in the actual press-room. That's because PDF has become the great
    > "leveler". None of Windows' problems with typography or color
    > calibration mean anything whatsoever when the client provides the
    > print shop with a completely laid-out and calibrated PDF file. In
    > that case, all the PC becomes is an output device to send fully
    > rasterized page files to the image setter. Winboxes are cheap and
    > Acrobat Reader is free :->
    >
    >> It's like getting all hot and bothered about Cubase.

    >
    > I prefer Audacity, myself. One place where Open Source is actually
    > VERY GOOD.
    >
    > But getting back to the GIMP. This "Cuphea Ignea" asserts that GIMP
    > currently fully supports CMYK via the CMYK plug-in and he most
    > assuredly does not know what he is talking about. Even the GIMP home
    > page is very spexific about the fact that The GIMP does not natively
    > support CMYK and that the plug-in filter merely outputs an RGB file
    > as a CMYK. One cannot edit the CMYK layers directly in GIMP. In
    > Photoshop one can change the entire workspace from RGB centric to
    > CMYK centric. Without this ability, the GIMP is practically useless
    > as a professional PRINT graphics application. The reason why nobody
    > has added this capability to the GIMP is because the entire
    > application would have to be rewritten to include the CMYK workspace.
    > It cannot be implemented by merely adding a "plug-in".


    There are plug ins and you have not seen Crystal Skull to know what you are
    talking about.

    --
    http://www.as7apcool.com/



  16. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "George Graves" wrote in message
    news:0001HW.C461AD5F000B1346F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    > On Tue, 27 May 2008 11:24:29 -0700, JEDIDIAH wrote
    > (in article ):
    >
    >> On 2008-05-26, ZnU wrote:
    >>> In article ,
    >>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>> In article , "Cuphea
    >>>>> Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net

    >> [deletia]
    >>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like that. Your
    >>>>> response to George about CMYK is a perfect example. You've found a
    >>>>> bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But there's a huge
    >>>>> difference between outputting CMYK and natively supporting it. You
    >>>>> don't understand what that difference is, because you've barely
    >>>>> got a clue what CMYK is for and have probably never worked with a
    >>>>> CMYK image.
    >>>>
    >>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself to
    >>>> a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>
    >>> In other words, you barely understand what I'm talking about
    >>> because you have no experience in this field.

    >>
    >> Do you?
    >>
    >> Unless you are ready to say "I am a pre-press professional" then
    >> you're just talking out your ass. Also, like I implied before. The
    >> fact that Windows dominates this now, or the Mac dominated this 10
    >> years ago doesn't say much about Linux in general.

    >
    > The Mac still dominates pre-press. Where it doesn't dominate any more
    > is in the actual press-room. That's because PDF has become the great
    > "leveler". None of Windows' problems with typography or color
    > calibration mean anything whatsoever when the client provides the
    > print shop with a completely laid-out and calibrated PDF file. In
    > that case, all the PC becomes is an output device to send fully
    > rasterized page files to the image setter. Winboxes are cheap and
    > Acrobat Reader is free :->
    >
    >> It's like getting all hot and bothered about Cubase.

    >
    > I prefer Audacity, myself. One place where Open Source is actually
    > VERY GOOD.
    >
    > But getting back to the GIMP. This "Cuphea Ignea" asserts that GIMP
    > currently fully supports CMYK via the CMYK plug-in and he most
    > assuredly does not know what he is talking about. Even the GIMP home
    > page is very spexific about the fact that The GIMP does not natively
    > support CMYK and that the plug-in filter merely outputs an RGB file
    > as a CMYK. One cannot edit the CMYK layers directly in GIMP. In
    > Photoshop one can change the entire workspace from RGB centric to
    > CMYK centric. Without this ability, the GIMP is practically useless
    > as a professional PRINT graphics application. The reason why nobody
    > has added this capability to the GIMP is because the entire
    > application would have to be rewritten to include the CMYK workspace.
    > It cannot be implemented by merely adding a "plug-in".


    You would not last one day in the bull pen of Hollywood.

    --
    http://www.as7apcool.com/



  17. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "George Graves" wrote in message
    news:0001HW.C462502800313AA0F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    > On Tue, 27 May 2008 23:44:11 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    > (in article ):
    >
    >> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >> news:0001HW.C461994500065D1CF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 20:50:11 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>> (in article ):
    >>>
    >>>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>>> news:0001HW.C460D09300266E1BF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:31 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>>> (in article ):
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>>>>> news:0001HW.C46039C3000314EDF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>>>>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 00:12:33 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>>>>> (in article ):
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> I don't want to start picking apart the feature lists in
    >>>>>>>>>>> question, because they're long. So I'll simply note that in
    >>>>>>>>>>> 10 years in various content creation industries, I have
    >>>>>>>>>>> never seen GIMP used as a Photoshop alternative in a
    >>>>>>>>>>> professional setting. Not a single time.
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> I tried to ignore the fact that you did not answer my
    >>>>>>>>>> question but I failed. Features. Features. Do you not
    >>>>>>>>>> understand what I mean?
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> It's useless.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> I have used it so it can not be useless.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like
    >>>>>>>>> that. Your response to George about CMYK is a perfect example.
    >>>>>>>>> You've found a bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But
    >>>>>>>>> there's a huge difference between outputting CMYK and natively
    >>>>>>>>> supporting it. You don't understand what that difference is,
    >>>>>>>>> because you've barely got a clue what CMYK is for and have
    >>>>>>>>> probably never worked with a CMYK image.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself
    >>>>>>>> to a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> You don't have to say what your experience is. Your posts show
    >>>>>>> that you don't know what you are talking about on this subject.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> You have no idea what my experience is or is not.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Ridiculous. Anyone with even a soupcon of knowledge or experience
    >>>>> in the graphics world would understand that GIMP lacks real CMYK
    >>>>> support, and would understand why that's so important. That you
    >>>>> don't understand tells us all we need know about your experience
    >>>>> in that field, anyway.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> I have made my point and
    >>>>>> you cannot make yours. I win.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> You can't even write a coherent sentence, much less win a point.
    >>>>> You have provided no proof of your assertions with regard to
    >>>>> GIMP. You haven't cited one pre-press operation, graphics
    >>>>> organization or publishing house that uses it.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> You "win" only when your adversaries change their mind and concede
    >>>>> your point. No one here has been swayed by your illiterate
    >>>>> ramblings one iota.
    >>>>
    >>>> You have no idea what my experience is.
    >>>
    >>> I know what it is NOT. That's enough.

    >>
    >> You pretend to know about me instead of the issue.
    >>
    >>>> I am sure mine is far more vaster
    >>>> than yours and would make you cry in your SOUPCAN if you were to
    >>>> compare.
    >>>
    >>> Far more vaster? I doubt it.

    >>
    >> We will not know because the issue is not me or you but GIMP and
    >> PHOTOSHOP.
    >>
    >>>> Believe me when I say that GIMP does everything PHOTOSHOP does and
    >>>> more
    >>>
    >>> Except that I DON'T believe you. I have GIMP installed on my Mac
    >>> (with the CMYK plug-in), I have used it, I know what it can and
    >>> can't do.

    >>
    >> Three plug-ins. Google is your friend.
    >>
    >>>> and is open source which means if I want it to sing the daylights
    >>>> out of you it can and WILL. Until I told you about plug-ins you
    >>>> did not even know what they are.
    >>>
    >>> Bull****. I have GIMP installed and the CMYK plug-in. It outputs
    >>> CMYK is does NOT let one edit a CMYK separation directly. Sorry.

    >>
    >> No need to be sorry for your lack of knowing, just learn! We all
    >> start off as no nothings.
    >>
    >>>> The idea that for me to be right and win I have to convince an
    >>>> ignoramous such as yourself is beyond what I have heard of before
    >>>> now.
    >>>
    >>> You have won nothing. You cannot "win" by assertion, you can only
    >>> "win" by backing-up what you assert and you have failed to do this.

    >>
    >> Are you thinking I must convince you when you do not know how to
    >> even use the Google engine or CMYK?
    >>
    >>>> I win because I am a professional in the color graphics world where
    >>>> you are not.
    >>>
    >>> Permit me to doubt you.

    >>
    >> You have my permission as if you think you need it.
    >>
    >>> and I have the experience you only read about. Have you seen the
    >>> new
    >>>> Indiana Jones movie (Crystal Skull).
    >>>
    >>> No. I do not go to the movies. Modern movies are junk

    >>
    >> Why try to offend my person and not talk about GIMP and PHOTOSHOP?
    >>
    >>>> If not go see it and watch the colors there and see if PHOTOSHOP
    >>>> could do
    >>> all that on a shoestring budget or even
    >>>> with millions. You do not know me or my experience.
    >>>
    >>> I have no interest in seeing another junk bubble-gum movie, and yes,
    >>> Photoshop could do "all that". I've a good buddy who works for IL&M
    >>> and he says that they use Photoshop for single frame touch-up. GIMP
    >>> could be used in that instance because film/video is RGB (which GIMP
    >>> supports), not CMYK.

    >>
    >> You have no experience but a "good friend". I have experience and
    >> work with "good friend". Do you see now why I know more than you?
    >>
    >>> You don't know what you're talking about, OR, you communicate so
    >>> badly that no one else knows what you're talking about. Either way,
    >>> you lose. BTW, I publish a print magazine each month. I know about
    >>> what GIMP will and will not do.

    >>
    >> You do not use it you say so how do you know what it does? Many
    >> people publish newsletters.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > I said a color MAGAZINE, knucklehead, not a "news letter".


    GIMP and PHOTOSHOP are the topic.

    --
    http://www.as7apcool.com/



  18. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "George Graves" wrote in message
    news:0001HW.C46250C000315E4EF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    > On Wed, 28 May 2008 01:47:45 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    > (in article ):
    >
    >> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >> news:0001HW.C461AD5F000B1346F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>> On Tue, 27 May 2008 11:24:29 -0700, JEDIDIAH wrote
    >>> (in article ):
    >>>
    >>>> On 2008-05-26, ZnU wrote:
    >>>>> In article ,
    >>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>> In article , "Cuphea
    >>>>>>> Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>> [deletia]
    >>>>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like that.
    >>>>>>> Your response to George about CMYK is a perfect example. You've
    >>>>>>> found a bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But there's
    >>>>>>> a huge difference between outputting CMYK and natively
    >>>>>>> supporting it. You don't understand what that difference is,
    >>>>>>> because you've barely got a clue what CMYK is for and have
    >>>>>>> probably never worked with a CMYK image.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself
    >>>>>> to a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>>>
    >>>>> In other words, you barely understand what I'm talking about
    >>>>> because you have no experience in this field.
    >>>>
    >>>> Do you?
    >>>>
    >>>> Unless you are ready to say "I am a pre-press professional" then
    >>>> you're just talking out your ass. Also, like I implied before. The
    >>>> fact that Windows dominates this now, or the Mac dominated this 10
    >>>> years ago doesn't say much about Linux in general.
    >>>
    >>> The Mac still dominates pre-press. Where it doesn't dominate any
    >>> more is in the actual press-room. That's because PDF has become the
    >>> great "leveler". None of Windows' problems with typography or color
    >>> calibration mean anything whatsoever when the client provides the
    >>> print shop with a completely laid-out and calibrated PDF file. In
    >>> that case, all the PC becomes is an output device to send fully
    >>> rasterized page files to the image setter. Winboxes are cheap and
    >>> Acrobat Reader is free :->
    >>>
    >>>> It's like getting all hot and bothered about Cubase.
    >>>
    >>> I prefer Audacity, myself. One place where Open Source is actually
    >>> VERY GOOD.
    >>>
    >>> But getting back to the GIMP. This "Cuphea Ignea" asserts that GIMP
    >>> currently fully supports CMYK via the CMYK plug-in and he most
    >>> assuredly does not know what he is talking about. Even the GIMP home
    >>> page is very spexific about the fact that The GIMP does not natively
    >>> support CMYK and that the plug-in filter merely outputs an RGB file
    >>> as a CMYK. One cannot edit the CMYK layers directly in GIMP. In
    >>> Photoshop one can change the entire workspace from RGB centric to
    >>> CMYK centric. Without this ability, the GIMP is practically useless
    >>> as a professional PRINT graphics application. The reason why nobody
    >>> has added this capability to the GIMP is because the entire
    >>> application would have to be rewritten to include the CMYK
    >>> workspace. It cannot be implemented by merely adding a "plug-in".

    >>
    >> There are plug ins and you have not seen Crystal Skull to know what
    >> you are talking about.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Idiot. Crystal Skull is IRRELEVANT to the print and pre-press world.
    > I don't care What GIMP can do in the RGB color space. I don't use the
    > RGB color space, I use CMYK and The GIMP doesn't support it directly.
    > Jeeze, how many times to I have to repeat that?


    Why do you think repeating yourself makes your views stronger? I have told
    you the TRUTH based on EXPERIENCE and KNWOLEDGE. You make a newsletter and
    read the GIMP website and think you are in the know. I do not mean to
    offensive with you but that makes no sense.

    --
    http://www.as7apcool.com/



  19. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "George Graves" wrote in message
    news:0001HW.C46250DD0031650CF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    > On Wed, 28 May 2008 01:45:03 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    > (in article ):
    >
    >> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >> news:0001HW.C461998E00066E3DF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 20:46:17 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>> (in article ):
    >>>
    >>>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>>> news:0001HW.C460D0BD002677D6F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>>> On Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:59 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>>> (in article ):
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>>>>> news:0001HW.C46039350002F39EF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>>>>> On Sun, 25 May 2008 23:42:36 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >>>>>>> (in article ):
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> ZnU splattered upon for all to feel:
    >>>>>>>>>>> In article <4S_Zj.19789$255.15895@bignews8.bellsouth.net>,
    >>>>>>>>>>> Linonut wrote:
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>>> * ZnU peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>>>> This is what I've been saying for years. Linux has some
    >>>>>>>>>>>>> decent apps for very common desktop tasks like web
    >>>>>>>>>>>>> browsing, word processing and e-mail. And it has a
    >>>>>>>>>>>>> scattering of high-end apps from markets where Unix used
    >>>>>>>>>>>>> to be popular, like high-end 3D. But that's about it. And
    >>>>>>>>>>>>> that's not enough to make it a viable operating system for
    >>>>>>>>>>>>> demanding users, unless they happen to be in certain very
    >>>>>>>>>>>>> specific fields.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>>> Get back with us when you've evaluated all of the
    >>>>>>>>>>>> applications in this partial list of commercial
    >>>>>>>>>>>> applications, circa 2005:
    >>>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.yolinux.com/TUTORIALS/Lin...lications.html
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> Well, I can't speak for everyone in all fields. But I don't
    >>>>>>>>>>> see plausible replacements for Final Cut Pro or Photoshop on
    >>>>>>>>>>> that list.
    >>>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>>> [snip]
    >>>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>>> GIMP is more than enough for most people, even professionals.
    >>>>>>>>>> What features of Photoshop do you think GIMP is missing?
    >>>>>>>>>> What is lacking is there are plug ins for plus it is more
    >>>>>>>>>> configurable and scriptable and it is open source so if you
    >>>>>>>>>> like to add a feature or change a feature nothng is stopping
    >>>>>>>>>> you.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> Yup, this thread is taking precisely the same course as all
    >>>>>>>>> the other Linux app threads. We've reached the stage where
    >>>>>>>>> Linux advocates who have no idea what they're talking about
    >>>>>>>>> insist that apps are equivalent when essentially no
    >>>>>>>>> professional user considers them so.
    >>>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> I don't want to start picking apart the feature lists in
    >>>>>>>>> question, because they're long. So I'll simply note that in 10
    >>>>>>>>> years in various content creation industries, I have never
    >>>>>>>>> seen GIMP used as a Photoshop alternative in a professional
    >>>>>>>>> setting. Not a single time.
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>> I tried to ignore the fact that you did not answer my question
    >>>>>>>> but I failed. Features. Features. Do you not understand what
    >>>>>>>> I mean?
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> I do, and so, I suspect, does Znu. The main feature is core CMYK
    >>>>>>> support. It doesn't exist in GIMP and it relegates GIMP to home
    >>>>>>> digital photo retouching. Come back an talk to us about this
    >>>>>>> subject when you learn what professional Photoshop users NEED
    >>>>>>> from the program. You clearly don't have a clue.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> plug. in.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I win.
    >>>>> Plug-in what?
    >>>>
    >>>> Unbelievable. Use it for a few days and learn a thing or two.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Use what for a few days? You're not making any sense whatsoever!

    >>
    >> If you have not even used it for a few days then how do you know why
    >> it does not have what you think it does?
    >>
    >>

    >
    > USED WHAT????!!!!!!!!!


    The issue is GIMP and PHOTOSHOP. I like you punctutation to be less so you
    can say more if you know what I mean.

    --
    http://www.as7apcool.com/



  20. Re: Linux Market Share Facts

    "Cuphea Ignea" writes:

    > "George Graves" wrote in message
    > news:0001HW.C46250C000315E4EF01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >> On Wed, 28 May 2008 01:47:45 -0700, Cuphea Ignea wrote
    >> (in article ):
    >>
    >>> "George Graves" wrote in message
    >>> news:0001HW.C461AD5F000B1346F01846D8@news.comcast. net
    >>>> On Tue, 27 May 2008 11:24:29 -0700, JEDIDIAH wrote
    >>>> (in article ):
    >>>>
    >>>>> On 2008-05-26, ZnU wrote:
    >>>>>> In article ,
    >>>>>> "Cuphea Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>> news:znu-2BA00B.03014926052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>>>>> In article , "Cuphea
    >>>>>>>> Ignea" wrote:
    >>>>>>>>
    >>>>>>>>> "ZnU" wrote in message
    >>>>>>>>> news:znu-C515AD.02305726052008@news.individual.net
    >>>>> [deletia]
    >>>>>>>> You want to compare bullet points. It doesn't work like that.
    >>>>>>>> Your response to George about CMYK is a perfect example. You've
    >>>>>>>> found a bullet point that says GIMP supports CMYK. But there's
    >>>>>>>> a huge difference between outputting CMYK and natively
    >>>>>>>> supporting it. You don't understand what that difference is,
    >>>>>>>> because you've barely got a clue what CMYK is for and have
    >>>>>>>> probably never worked with a CMYK image.
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> I have not said what my experience is nor shall I defend myself
    >>>>>>> to a make beleive artist such as you!
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> In other words, you barely understand what I'm talking about
    >>>>>> because you have no experience in this field.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Do you?
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Unless you are ready to say "I am a pre-press professional" then
    >>>>> you're just talking out your ass. Also, like I implied before. The
    >>>>> fact that Windows dominates this now, or the Mac dominated this 10
    >>>>> years ago doesn't say much about Linux in general.
    >>>>
    >>>> The Mac still dominates pre-press. Where it doesn't dominate any
    >>>> more is in the actual press-room. That's because PDF has become the
    >>>> great "leveler". None of Windows' problems with typography or color
    >>>> calibration mean anything whatsoever when the client provides the
    >>>> print shop with a completely laid-out and calibrated PDF file. In
    >>>> that case, all the PC becomes is an output device to send fully
    >>>> rasterized page files to the image setter. Winboxes are cheap and
    >>>> Acrobat Reader is free :->
    >>>>
    >>>>> It's like getting all hot and bothered about Cubase.
    >>>>
    >>>> I prefer Audacity, myself. One place where Open Source is actually
    >>>> VERY GOOD.
    >>>>
    >>>> But getting back to the GIMP. This "Cuphea Ignea" asserts that GIMP
    >>>> currently fully supports CMYK via the CMYK plug-in and he most
    >>>> assuredly does not know what he is talking about. Even the GIMP home
    >>>> page is very spexific about the fact that The GIMP does not natively
    >>>> support CMYK and that the plug-in filter merely outputs an RGB file
    >>>> as a CMYK. One cannot edit the CMYK layers directly in GIMP. In
    >>>> Photoshop one can change the entire workspace from RGB centric to
    >>>> CMYK centric. Without this ability, the GIMP is practically useless
    >>>> as a professional PRINT graphics application. The reason why nobody
    >>>> has added this capability to the GIMP is because the entire
    >>>> application would have to be rewritten to include the CMYK
    >>>> workspace. It cannot be implemented by merely adding a "plug-in".
    >>>
    >>> There are plug ins and you have not seen Crystal Skull to know what
    >>> you are talking about.
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> Idiot. Crystal Skull is IRRELEVANT to the print and pre-press world.
    >> I don't care What GIMP can do in the RGB color space. I don't use the
    >> RGB color space, I use CMYK and The GIMP doesn't support it directly.
    >> Jeeze, how many times to I have to repeat that?

    >
    > Why do you think repeating yourself makes your views stronger? I have told
    > you the TRUTH based on EXPERIENCE and KNWOLEDGE. You make a newsletter and
    > read the GIMP website and think you are in the know. I do not mean to
    > offensive with you but that makes no sense.


    *blink*

    I think we have found someone dumber than Rick and HPT.

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