Apple's OSX Wins Platform of the Year at CES - Microsoft Windows

This is a discussion on Apple's OSX Wins Platform of the Year at CES - Microsoft Windows ; On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 22:10:28 -0600, Lloyd Parsons wrote: > In article , Rick > wrote: > >> On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 20:41:34 -0600, Lloyd Parsons wrote: >> >> > In article , Rick >> > wrote: >> ...

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Thread: Apple's OSX Wins Platform of the Year at CES

  1. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 22:10:28 -0600, Lloyd Parsons wrote:

    > In article <13o5tig3eleogd9@news.supernews.com>, Rick
    > wrote:
    >
    >> On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 20:41:34 -0600, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
    >>
    >> > In article <13o5nqtf2bl5f5f@news.supernews.com>, Rick
    >> > wrote:
    >> >
    >> >> On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 18:24:56 -0600, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
    >> >>
    >> >> > In article <13o5gaj23tajm15@news.supernews.com>, Rick
    >> >> > wrote:
    >> >> >
    >> >> >> On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 15:58:37 -0800, George Graves wrote:
    >> >> >>
    >> >> >> > On Mon, 7 Jan 2008 14:55:11 -0800, Tommy Tickler wrote (in
    >> >> >> > article ):
    >> >> >> >
    >> >> >> >> O x f o r d wrote:
    >> >> >> >>> 7 wrote:
    >> >> >> >>>
    >> >> >> >>>
    >> >> >> >>> OSX is faster than Linux, that has been proven over and over.
    >> >> >> >>> Linux was a flash in the pan before Linus moved to OSX in the
    >> >> >> >>> late 00's.
    >> >> >> >>>
    >> >> >> >>>
    >> >> >> >> There are also a damn side larger number of decent apps that
    >> >> >> >> have professional polish for OS X compared to Linux. It is
    >> >> >> >> all well and good to run an OS, but that OS also needs quality
    >> >> >> >> apps to run on it. Linux might have a gazillion apps, but that
    >> >> >> >> significant majority are amateur hour by comparison to the
    >> >> >> >> apps designed to run on OS X
    >> >> >> >
    >> >> >> > That's true. Funny thing though, out of the box, a Mac can run
    >> >> >> > just about anything that Linux can run (as long as you install
    >> >> >> > X11 too).
    >> >> >>
    >> >> >> ... as long as you install X11 too is not the same as out of the
    >> >> >> box.
    >> >> >
    >> >> > Uh, with Leopard, the default install is with X11...
    >> >>
    >> >> So, X11 is installed on all new Macs now?
    >> >
    >> > Well, I won't say all new macs, but it is on my new mini.

    >>
    >> I am thinking that if it came on your mini with a default install, it's
    >> probably on all new Macs. interesting.

    >
    > I would assume the same thing. I haven't installed any software to this
    > mini since I bought it. Activated iWork, set up my .mac syncing and
    > waited a bit and all was good. Because X11 is on my machine and I
    > didn't do anything to put it there, I assume that all new macs come with
    > X11 installed.
    >
    > There is no apps though, or at least I'm not aware of any.
    >
    > This mac is an all Apple box.


    I can still remember installing X11, gtk and then compiling some of the
    apps I used under LinuxPPC so they would run under OS X. A friend of mine
    just bid on a pallet of old gumdrop shape iMacs. I might get one and muck
    around with X11 on it again.

    --
    Rick

  2. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    In article <13o5udstchco2c8@news.supernews.com>, Rick
    wrote:

    > On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 22:10:28 -0600, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
    >
    > > In article <13o5tig3eleogd9@news.supernews.com>, Rick
    > > wrote:
    > >
    > >> On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 20:41:34 -0600, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
    > >>
    > >> > In article <13o5nqtf2bl5f5f@news.supernews.com>, Rick
    > >> > wrote:
    > >> >
    > >> >> On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 18:24:56 -0600, Lloyd Parsons wrote:
    > >> >>
    > >> >> > In article <13o5gaj23tajm15@news.supernews.com>, Rick
    > >> >> > wrote:
    > >> >> >
    > >> >> >> On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 15:58:37 -0800, George Graves wrote:
    > >> >> >>
    > >> >> >> > On Mon, 7 Jan 2008 14:55:11 -0800, Tommy Tickler wrote (in
    > >> >> >> > article ):
    > >> >> >> >
    > >> >> >> >> O x f o r d wrote:
    > >> >> >> >>> 7 wrote:
    > >> >> >> >>>
    > >> >> >> >>>
    > >> >> >> >>> OSX is faster than Linux, that has been proven over and over.
    > >> >> >> >>> Linux was a flash in the pan before Linus moved to OSX in the
    > >> >> >> >>> late 00's.
    > >> >> >> >>>
    > >> >> >> >>>
    > >> >> >> >> There are also a damn side larger number of decent apps that
    > >> >> >> >> have professional polish for OS X compared to Linux. It is
    > >> >> >> >> all well and good to run an OS, but that OS also needs quality
    > >> >> >> >> apps to run on it. Linux might have a gazillion apps, but that
    > >> >> >> >> significant majority are amateur hour by comparison to the
    > >> >> >> >> apps designed to run on OS X
    > >> >> >> >
    > >> >> >> > That's true. Funny thing though, out of the box, a Mac can run
    > >> >> >> > just about anything that Linux can run (as long as you install
    > >> >> >> > X11 too).
    > >> >> >>
    > >> >> >> ... as long as you install X11 too is not the same as out of the
    > >> >> >> box.
    > >> >> >
    > >> >> > Uh, with Leopard, the default install is with X11...
    > >> >>
    > >> >> So, X11 is installed on all new Macs now?
    > >> >
    > >> > Well, I won't say all new macs, but it is on my new mini.
    > >>
    > >> I am thinking that if it came on your mini with a default install, it's
    > >> probably on all new Macs. interesting.

    > >
    > > I would assume the same thing. I haven't installed any software to this
    > > mini since I bought it. Activated iWork, set up my .mac syncing and
    > > waited a bit and all was good. Because X11 is on my machine and I
    > > didn't do anything to put it there, I assume that all new macs come with
    > > X11 installed.
    > >
    > > There is no apps though, or at least I'm not aware of any.
    > >
    > > This mac is an all Apple box.

    >
    > I can still remember installing X11, gtk and then compiling some of the
    > apps I used under LinuxPPC so they would run under OS X. A friend of mine
    > just bid on a pallet of old gumdrop shape iMacs. I might get one and muck
    > around with X11 on it again.


    Heh, heh....

    They won't run Leopard!!

  3. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    In article ,
    Little Gorm wrote:

    > > There are also a damn side larger number of decent apps that have
    > > professional polish for OS X compared to Linux. It is all well and good
    > > to run an OS, but that OS also needs quality apps to run on it. Linux
    > > might have a gazillion apps, but that significant majority are amateur
    > > hour by comparison to the apps designed to run on OS X

    >
    > I will admit that many of the apps running in Linux are not as well
    > polished as those of MS or Apple, but given time they will improve. Apple
    > and MS spend literally millions in research in fine tuning their GUIs for
    > the average user, while apps in the Linux community are built by
    > relavtively small groups who are far more intent on ensuring a stable and
    > secure core. As Linux distros mature, the interfaces for the apps will also
    > greatly improve. At the present, you have various distros that appeal to
    > different sets of users. With MS and Apple you take it the way they want
    > you to have it.


    I'm a lurker and only occasionally say anything, because I'm simply a
    user of a Mac. I don't have any technical knowledge with computers. I
    can see all the sneers by the Mac/Windows/Linux self gurus, please
    restrain yourself until you finish reading this note.

    As a self-admitted mechanical klutz, the reason I've chosen to use the
    Mac is that it's the easiest OS for _me_ to use. I've had some dealings
    with Windows, from the time of Win3.1. MS tries to be as elegant as
    OSX, both in appearance and usability, and I will say that it's better
    better, so it's maybe like 75% toward being as good as a Mac. I don't
    I can't wait for the rest of the 25%. So **** it!

    Linux on the other hand, I wish that there was a version of open source
    operating system that approached the user-friendliness of the Mac with
    OSX. Every so often I look at Linux and each time I find myself in a
    software jungle with no sign posts. It seems to me that Linux acolytes
    are into tinkering with the hardware and the software, as opposed to
    being productive. And there is nothing wrong with that, but it's not to
    my taste.

    Here's the thing -- If I want to make toast, I get a toaster. I get to
    do the task do it quickly without any problems. That's my feeling about
    the Mac. On the other hand Linux promises me the dream of open source
    toasting, but in the meantime I have to build the toaster, choose the
    version of power that I need, etc. Hey I'm impressed with all I that I
    could potentially do, but all I want is have a toast.

    I really, really want there to be a useful Linux, for me, but again I'm
    tired of waiting. When you Linux guys finally come out with a distro
    that's ready for showtime, I'll be right there checking it out!

  4. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    Rick wrote:

    > On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 19:24:04 -0700, O x f o r d wrote:
    >
    >> George Graves wrote:
    >>
    >>> > Its all free.
    >>> > Time you got a decent PC and installed Linux and enjoyed the power of
    >>> > Linux flowing through your computer. For speed, performance and bang
    >>> > for buck there is nothing that beats it.
    >>> >
    >>> > http://www.livecdlist.com
    >>> > http://www.distrowatch.com
    >>> >
    >>> >
    >>> Just one question. What does one do if one needs actual
    >>> professional-level software with which to do real work? Linux is out,
    >>> that's what happens.

    >>
    >> correct george.
    >>
    >> why hasn't there yet been a single professional level app on Linux?
    >>
    >> everyone keeps waiting, but nothing even remotely close to high end UNIX
    >> apps like these... are available...
    >>
    >> http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/index.html
    >>

    >
    > Yeah. right. the majority of those are professional apps. Sheesh.
    >
    > Here Oxford:
    > http://www.cinepaint.org/
    > http://www.linuxmovies.org/software.html
    >
    > Let's see... Mathematica runs on Linux. So does Mathworks. LabView.
    >
    >
    >> what is the hold up I wonder?
    >>
    >> it's like linux users gave up programming against the intense tide of
    >> 18,000 OSX apps some 5 years ago.
    >>

    > How did you get to be such a dishonest idiot?
    >
    > BTW, how where do the XServes rate on the super computer cluster lists?
    >
    >
    >

    And when is Google going to move its 450,000 servers off of Linux and over
    to OSX?

    Cheers.

    --
    Boot It Up!
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=-kql8cWqiv8


  5. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    NoStop wrote:

    > >>> Just one question. What does one do if one needs actual
    > >>> professional-level software with which to do real work? Linux is out,
    > >>> that's what happens.
    > >>
    > >> correct george.
    > >>
    > >> why hasn't there yet been a single professional level app on Linux?
    > >>
    > >> everyone keeps waiting, but nothing even remotely close to high end UNIX
    > >> apps like these... are available...
    > >>
    > >> http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/index.html

    > >
    > > Yeah. right. the majority of those are professional apps. Sheesh.
    > >
    > > Here Oxford:
    > > http://www.cinepaint.org/


    cinepaint is for hobbyist compared to this...

    http://www.apple.com/shake/

    > > http://www.linuxmovies.org/software.html


    what a dumb link, nobody uses Linux for movie making.

    look at the real deal here:

    http://www.apple.com/pro/profiles/

    > > Let's see... Mathematica runs on Linux. So does Mathworks. LabView.
    > >
    > >
    > >> what is the hold up I wonder?
    > >>
    > >> it's like linux users gave up programming against the intense tide of
    > >> 18,000 OSX apps some 5 years ago.
    > >>

    > > How did you get to be such a dishonest idiot?
    > >
    > > BTW, how where do the XServes rate on the super computer cluster lists?
    > >

    > And when is Google going to move its 450,000 servers off of Linux and over
    > to OSX?


    why would anyone use high end OSX Servers for such mundane tasks?

    apple is better than that.

    http://www.apple.com/server/macosx/features/

    -

  6. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    Red Henk wrote:

    > > I will admit that many of the apps running in Linux are not as well
    > > polished as those of MS or Apple, but given time they will improve. Apple
    > > and MS spend literally millions in research in fine tuning their GUIs for
    > > the average user, while apps in the Linux community are built by
    > > relavtively small groups who are far more intent on ensuring a stable and
    > > secure core. As Linux distros mature, the interfaces for the apps will also
    > > greatly improve. At the present, you have various distros that appeal to
    > > different sets of users. With MS and Apple you take it the way they want
    > > you to have it.

    >
    > I'm a lurker and only occasionally say anything, because I'm simply a
    > user of a Mac. I don't have any technical knowledge with computers. I
    > can see all the sneers by the Mac/Windows/Linux self gurus, please
    > restrain yourself until you finish reading this note.
    >
    > As a self-admitted mechanical klutz, the reason I've chosen to use the
    > Mac is that it's the easiest OS for _me_ to use. I've had some dealings
    > with Windows, from the time of Win3.1. MS tries to be as elegant as
    > OSX, both in appearance and usability, and I will say that it's better
    > better, so it's maybe like 75% toward being as good as a Mac. I don't
    > I can't wait for the rest of the 25%. So **** it!
    >
    > Linux on the other hand, I wish that there was a version of open source
    > operating system that approached the user-friendliness of the Mac with
    > OSX. Every so often I look at Linux and each time I find myself in a
    > software jungle with no sign posts. It seems to me that Linux acolytes
    > are into tinkering with the hardware and the software, as opposed to
    > being productive. And there is nothing wrong with that, but it's not to
    > my taste.
    >
    > Here's the thing -- If I want to make toast, I get a toaster. I get to
    > do the task do it quickly without any problems. That's my feeling about
    > the Mac. On the other hand Linux promises me the dream of open source
    > toasting, but in the meantime I have to build the toaster, choose the
    > version of power that I need, etc. Hey I'm impressed with all I that I
    > could potentially do, but all I want is have a toast.
    >
    > I really, really want there to be a useful Linux, for me, but again I'm
    > tired of waiting. When you Linux guys finally come out with a distro
    > that's ready for showtime, I'll be right there checking it out!


    Good post Red, you see the bigger picture, not lost in the details like
    Peter and so many Linux users are. Linux really has no "focus", thus
    it's never going to be successful... the same reasons Windows will never
    be successful.

    Only Apple and OSX "gets it"... they are extreme perfectionists, and
    won't stop until the user's experience is ideal.

    I feel sorry for Linux and Windows, they just can't compete, and don't
    seem to be wanting to learn from the biggest fish in the pond.

    http://www.apple.com/macosx/

    -

  7. Re: Apple's OSX Wins Platform of the Year at CES

    O x f o r d wrote:

    > the big boys never even consider linux at this point in the game.


    My *big* server won't "run" OSX (or Windows, come to that). It can
    pre-installed with Red Hat Linux (or AIX as an alternative). The *BIG*
    boys all run *proper* operating systems, rather than the silly cartoon game
    that you profess to support.

    C.

  8. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    Lloyd Parsons wrote:

    > Tell me, Oxford, do you wear a skirt and wave pom-poms when you do all
    > this cheerleading?


    Not sure what you mean?

    Why do you dislike honesty?

    Oxford

    -

  9. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    "O x f o r d" stated in post
    iphone-239C62.23343407012008@mpls-nn...inet.qwest.net on 1/7/08 11:34 PM:

    > Red Henk wrote:
    >
    >>> I will admit that many of the apps running in Linux are not as well
    >>> polished as those of MS or Apple, but given time they will improve. Apple
    >>> and MS spend literally millions in research in fine tuning their GUIs for
    >>> the average user, while apps in the Linux community are built by
    >>> relavtively small groups who are far more intent on ensuring a stable and
    >>> secure core. As Linux distros mature, the interfaces for the apps will also
    >>> greatly improve. At the present, you have various distros that appeal to
    >>> different sets of users. With MS and Apple you take it the way they want
    >>> you to have it.

    >>
    >> I'm a lurker and only occasionally say anything, because I'm simply a
    >> user of a Mac. I don't have any technical knowledge with computers. I
    >> can see all the sneers by the Mac/Windows/Linux self gurus, please
    >> restrain yourself until you finish reading this note.
    >>
    >> As a self-admitted mechanical klutz, the reason I've chosen to use the
    >> Mac is that it's the easiest OS for _me_ to use. I've had some dealings
    >> with Windows, from the time of Win3.1. MS tries to be as elegant as
    >> OSX, both in appearance and usability, and I will say that it's better
    >> better, so it's maybe like 75% toward being as good as a Mac. I don't
    >> I can't wait for the rest of the 25%. So **** it!
    >>
    >> Linux on the other hand, I wish that there was a version of open source
    >> operating system that approached the user-friendliness of the Mac with
    >> OSX. Every so often I look at Linux and each time I find myself in a
    >> software jungle with no sign posts. It seems to me that Linux acolytes
    >> are into tinkering with the hardware and the software, as opposed to
    >> being productive. And there is nothing wrong with that, but it's not to
    >> my taste.
    >>
    >> Here's the thing -- If I want to make toast, I get a toaster. I get to
    >> do the task do it quickly without any problems. That's my feeling about
    >> the Mac. On the other hand Linux promises me the dream of open source
    >> toasting, but in the meantime I have to build the toaster, choose the
    >> version of power that I need, etc. Hey I'm impressed with all I that I
    >> could potentially do, but all I want is have a toast.
    >>
    >> I really, really want there to be a useful Linux, for me, but again I'm
    >> tired of waiting. When you Linux guys finally come out with a distro
    >> that's ready for showtime, I'll be right there checking it out!

    >
    > Good post Red, you see the bigger picture, not lost in the details like
    > Peter and so many Linux users are. Linux really has no "focus", thus
    > it's never going to be successful... the same reasons Windows will never
    > be successful.
    >
    > Only Apple and OSX "gets it"... they are extreme perfectionists, and
    > won't stop until the user's experience is ideal.


    If it is ideal then why do you think there are those who are complaining
    that Leopard, for *them*, started having severe problems with CD burning,
    keyboard's generating characters, caps locks getting messed up, batteries no
    longer working, Time Machine backups not working, and on and on...




    --
    If A = B and B = C, then A = C, except where void or prohibited by law.
    Roy Santoro, Psycho Proverb Zone (http://snipurl.com/BurdenOfProof)






  10. Re: Apple's OSX Wins Platform of the Year at CES

    Christopher Hunter wrote:

    > My *big* server won't "run" OSX (or Windows, come to that). It can
    > pre-installed with Red Hat Linux (or AIX as an alternative). The *BIG*
    > boys all run *proper* operating systems, rather than the silly cartoon game
    > that you profess to support.


    sure it will, you just don't know how.

    osx server is high end BSD UNIX, linux is only a "Pseudo Unix" built and
    maintained by teenagers.

    it's time for you to grow up...

    http://www.apple.com/macosx/technology/unix.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_Server

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSD_UNIX

  11. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 23:34:34 -0700, O x f o r d wrote:

    > Red Henk wrote:
    >
    >> > I will admit that many of the apps running in Linux are not as well
    >> > polished as those of MS or Apple, but given time they will improve.
    >> > Apple and MS spend literally millions in research in fine tuning
    >> > their GUIs for the average user, while apps in the Linux community
    >> > are built by relavtively small groups who are far more intent on
    >> > ensuring a stable and secure core. As Linux distros mature, the
    >> > interfaces for the apps will also greatly improve. At the present,
    >> > you have various distros that appeal to different sets of users. With
    >> > MS and Apple you take it the way they want you to have it.

    >>
    >> I'm a lurker and only occasionally say anything, because I'm simply a
    >> user of a Mac. I don't have any technical knowledge with computers. I
    >> can see all the sneers by the Mac/Windows/Linux self gurus, please
    >> restrain yourself until you finish reading this note.
    >>
    >> As a self-admitted mechanical klutz, the reason I've chosen to use the
    >> Mac is that it's the easiest OS for _me_ to use. I've had some dealings
    >> with Windows, from the time of Win3.1. MS tries to be as elegant as
    >> OSX, both in appearance and usability, and I will say that it's better
    >> better, so it's maybe like 75% toward being as good as a Mac. I
    >> don't I can't wait for the rest of the 25%. So **** it!
    >>
    >> Linux on the other hand, I wish that there was a version of open source
    >> operating system that approached the user-friendliness of the Mac with
    >> OSX. Every so often I look at Linux and each time I find myself in a
    >> software jungle with no sign posts. It seems to me that Linux acolytes
    >> are into tinkering with the hardware and the software, as opposed to
    >> being productive. And there is nothing wrong with that, but it's not to
    >> my taste.
    >>
    >> Here's the thing -- If I want to make toast, I get a toaster. I get to
    >> do the task do it quickly without any problems. That's my feeling about
    >> the Mac. On the other hand Linux promises me the dream of open source
    >> toasting, but in the meantime I have to build the toaster, choose the
    >> version of power that I need, etc. Hey I'm impressed with all I that I
    >> could potentially do, but all I want is have a toast.
    >>
    >> I really, really want there to be a useful Linux, for me, but again I'm
    >> tired of waiting. When you Linux guys finally come out with a distro
    >> that's ready for showtime, I'll be right there checking it out!

    >
    > Good post Red, you see the bigger picture, not lost in the details like
    > Peter and so many Linux users are. Linux really has no "focus", thus
    > it's never going to be successful... the same reasons Windows will never
    > be successful.


    Of course "Linux" has no focus. It is a kernel.

    Red HAt has a focus. Novell Has a focus.

    >
    > Only Apple and OSX "gets it"... they are extreme perfectionists, and
    > won't stop until the user's experience is ideal.
    >
    > I feel sorry for Linux and Windows, they just can't compete, and don't
    > seem to be wanting to learn from the biggest fish in the pond.
    >
    > http://www.apple.com/macosx/
    >
    > -

    Microsoft can't compete? It has 90%+ of the market.


    --
    Rick

  12. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 23:27:29 -0700, O x f o r d wrote:

    > NoStop wrote:
    >
    >> >>> Just one question. What does one do if one needs actual
    >> >>> professional-level software with which to do real work? Linux is
    >> >>> out, that's what happens.
    >> >>
    >> >> correct george.
    >> >>
    >> >> why hasn't there yet been a single professional level app on Linux?
    >> >>
    >> >> everyone keeps waiting, but nothing even remotely close to high end
    >> >> UNIX apps like these... are available...
    >> >>
    >> >> http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/index.html
    >> >
    >> > Yeah. right. the majority of those are professional apps. Sheesh.
    >> >
    >> > Here Oxford:
    >> > http://www.cinepaint.org/

    >
    > cinepaint is for hobbyist compared to this...
    >
    > http://www.apple.com/shake/
    >
    >> > http://www.linuxmovies.org/software.html

    >
    > what a dumb link, nobody uses Linux for movie making.


    Users of Cinepaint:
    * Amalgamated Pixels
    Elf, Looney Tunes
    * Computer Cafe
    League of Extraordinary Gentlemen
    * Flash Film Works
    Duplex, The Last Samurai
    * Hammerhead
    Showtime, Blue Crush, 2 Fast, 2 Furious
    * Rhythm & Hues
    Harry Potter, Cats & Dogs, Dr. Dolittle 2, Little Nicky, Grinch, Sixth
    Day, Stuart Little, Planet of the Apes
    * Sony Pictures Imageworks
    Stuart Little II, Spider-Man

    >
    > look at the real deal here:
    >
    > http://www.apple.com/pro/profiles/
    >
    >> > Let's see... Mathematica runs on Linux. So does Mathworks. LabView.
    >> >
    >> >
    >> >> what is the hold up I wonder?
    >> >>
    >> >> it's like linux users gave up programming against the intense tide
    >> >> of 18,000 OSX apps some 5 years ago.
    >> >>
    >> > How did you get to be such a dishonest idiot?
    >> >
    >> > BTW, how where do the XServes rate on the super computer cluster
    >> > lists?
    >> >

    >> And when is Google going to move its 450,000 servers off of Linux and
    >> over to OSX?

    >
    > why would anyone use high end OSX Servers for such mundane tasks?


    You really are an idiot.

    >
    > apple is better than that.
    >
    > http://www.apple.com/server/macosx/features/
    >
    > -




    --
    Rick

  13. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    Appil Corporation Asstroturfer O x f o r d retard wrote on behalf of Appil
    Corporation:

    > George Graves wrote:
    >
    >> > Its all free.
    >> > Time you got a decent PC and installed Linux
    >> > and enjoyed the power of Linux flowing through your computer.
    >> > For speed, performance and bang for buck there is nothing
    >> > that beats it.
    >> >
    >> > http://www.livecdlist.com
    >> > http://www.distrowatch.com
    >> >

    >>
    >> Just one question. What does one do if one needs actual
    >> professional-level software with which to do real work? Linux is out,
    >> that's what happens.

    >
    > correct george.
    >
    > why hasn't there yet been a single professional level app on Linux?


    There are lots of professional applications - from Open Office to
    Pro-Engineer that run supported on Linux.


    > everyone keeps waiting, but nothing even remotely close to high end UNIX
    > apps like these... are available...


    Pro-Engineer is high end. So are most of the world's
    major supercomputers that use Linux as the preferred OS.
    So is Apache, PHP, MySQL, PostgreSQL,.. what is that you
    tried to do that you claim coudn't be done with Linux?
    And you sure others are not doing it already and perhaps
    doing it better than your knowlege and abilities?


    > h
    >
    > what is the hold up I wonder?


    It must be you not looking hard enough?
    http://www.livecdlist.com
    http://www.distrowatch.com

    > it's like linux users gave up programming against the intense tide of
    > 18,000 OSX apps some 5 years ago.


    Doubt it, there are 20,000+ Open source applications
    And in any case, it is being deployed at the rate
    of 1 million embedded Linux applications PER DAY.

    > so sad...


    Incredibly sad day for Appil Corporaton Asstroturfers and their
    Asstroturfing means to market crappy over priced products.






  14. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    On Mon, 7 Jan 2008 21:47:20 -0800, Red Henk wrote
    (in article ):

    > In article ,
    > Little Gorm wrote:
    >
    >>> There are also a damn side larger number of decent apps that have
    >>> professional polish for OS X compared to Linux. It is all well and good
    >>> to run an OS, but that OS also needs quality apps to run on it. Linux
    >>> might have a gazillion apps, but that significant majority are amateur
    >>> hour by comparison to the apps designed to run on OS X

    >>
    >> I will admit that many of the apps running in Linux are not as well
    >> polished as those of MS or Apple, but given time they will improve. Apple
    >> and MS spend literally millions in research in fine tuning their GUIs for
    >> the average user, while apps in the Linux community are built by
    >> relavtively small groups who are far more intent on ensuring a stable and
    >> secure core. As Linux distros mature, the interfaces for the apps will also
    >> greatly improve. At the present, you have various distros that appeal to
    >> different sets of users. With MS and Apple you take it the way they want
    >> you to have it.

    >
    > I'm a lurker and only occasionally say anything, because I'm simply a
    > user of a Mac. I don't have any technical knowledge with computers. I
    > can see all the sneers by the Mac/Windows/Linux self gurus, please
    > restrain yourself until you finish reading this note.
    >
    > As a self-admitted mechanical klutz, the reason I've chosen to use the
    > Mac is that it's the easiest OS for _me_ to use. I've had some dealings
    > with Windows, from the time of Win3.1. MS tries to be as elegant as
    > OSX, both in appearance and usability, and I will say that it's better
    > better, so it's maybe like 75% toward being as good as a Mac. I don't
    > I can't wait for the rest of the 25%. So **** it!
    >
    > Linux on the other hand, I wish that there was a version of open source
    > operating system that approached the user-friendliness of the Mac with
    > OSX. Every so often I look at Linux and each time I find myself in a
    > software jungle with no sign posts. It seems to me that Linux acolytes
    > are into tinkering with the hardware and the software, as opposed to
    > being productive. And there is nothing wrong with that, but it's not to
    > my taste.
    >
    > Here's the thing -- If I want to make toast, I get a toaster. I get to
    > do the task do it quickly without any problems. That's my feeling about
    > the Mac. On the other hand Linux promises me the dream of open source
    > toasting, but in the meantime I have to build the toaster, choose the
    > version of power that I need, etc. Hey I'm impressed with all I that I
    > could potentially do, but all I want is have a toast.
    >
    > I really, really want there to be a useful Linux, for me, but again I'm
    > tired of waiting. When you Linux guys finally come out with a distro
    > that's ready for showtime, I'll be right there checking it out!


    Well said, typos and all :-)

    --
    How come every time we get a "Major Tax Cut" I get maybe $0.30 more returned
    to me, but every time there's a "Minor Tax Increase" it costs me $300.00?


  15. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    On Mon, 7 Jan 2008 22:34:34 -0800, O x f o r d wrote
    (in article ):

    > Red Henk wrote:
    >
    >>> I will admit that many of the apps running in Linux are not as well
    >>> polished as those of MS or Apple, but given time they will improve. Apple
    >>> and MS spend literally millions in research in fine tuning their GUIs for
    >>> the average user, while apps in the Linux community are built by
    >>> relavtively small groups who are far more intent on ensuring a stable and
    >>> secure core. As Linux distros mature, the interfaces for the apps will
    >>> also
    >>> greatly improve. At the present, you have various distros that appeal to
    >>> different sets of users. With MS and Apple you take it the way they want
    >>> you to have it.

    >>
    >> I'm a lurker and only occasionally say anything, because I'm simply a
    >> user of a Mac. I don't have any technical knowledge with computers. I
    >> can see all the sneers by the Mac/Windows/Linux self gurus, please
    >> restrain yourself until you finish reading this note.
    >>
    >> As a self-admitted mechanical klutz, the reason I've chosen to use the
    >> Mac is that it's the easiest OS for _me_ to use. I've had some dealings
    >> with Windows, from the time of Win3.1. MS tries to be as elegant as
    >> OSX, both in appearance and usability, and I will say that it's better
    >> better, so it's maybe like 75% toward being as good as a Mac. I don't
    >> I can't wait for the rest of the 25%. So **** it!
    >>
    >> Linux on the other hand, I wish that there was a version of open source
    >> operating system that approached the user-friendliness of the Mac with
    >> OSX. Every so often I look at Linux and each time I find myself in a
    >> software jungle with no sign posts. It seems to me that Linux acolytes
    >> are into tinkering with the hardware and the software, as opposed to
    >> being productive. And there is nothing wrong with that, but it's not to
    >> my taste.
    >>
    >> Here's the thing -- If I want to make toast, I get a toaster. I get to
    >> do the task do it quickly without any problems. That's my feeling about
    >> the Mac. On the other hand Linux promises me the dream of open source
    >> toasting, but in the meantime I have to build the toaster, choose the
    >> version of power that I need, etc. Hey I'm impressed with all I that I
    >> could potentially do, but all I want is have a toast.
    >>
    >> I really, really want there to be a useful Linux, for me, but again I'm
    >> tired of waiting. When you Linux guys finally come out with a distro
    >> that's ready for showtime, I'll be right there checking it out!

    >
    > Good post Red, you see the bigger picture, not lost in the details like
    > Peter and so many Linux users are. Linux really has no "focus", thus
    > it's never going to be successful... the same reasons Windows will never
    > be successful.
    >
    > Only Apple and OSX "gets it"... they are extreme perfectionists, and
    > won't stop until the user's experience is ideal.
    >
    > I feel sorry for Linux and Windows, they just can't compete, and don't
    > seem to be wanting to learn from the biggest fish in the pond.
    >
    > http://www.apple.com/macosx/
    >
    > -


    To be fair, Windows doesn't have to "get it". They are king of the hill, top
    of the heap. As long as there are cadres of IT "professionals" who know
    nothing else but Windows, and more so, COUNT on Windows being lousy for their
    very livelihoods, Microsoft isn't about to improve it in the manner we Mac
    users would like to see it improved. You gotta know that an OS is overly
    complex and poorly designed when they have to make half a dozen or so
    different versions just cover all the bases.

    --
    How come every time we get a "Major Tax Cut" I get maybe $0.30 more returned
    to me, but every time there's a "Minor Tax Increase" it costs me $300.00?


  16. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    George Graves wrote:

    >Little Gorm wrote
    >>
    >> With MS and Apple you take it the way they want you to have it.

    >
    >And for most users, that's FAR better.


    Maybe it is best for you Mac Morons, "digital music expert" George
    Graves.

    However, if I were you, I would not be so proud of my limited mental
    capacity.


  17. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    On Tue, 8 Jan 2008 04:51:38 -0800, 7 wrote
    (in article ):

    > Appil Corporation Asstroturfer O x f o r d retard wrote on behalf of Appil
    > Corporation:
    >
    >> George Graves wrote:
    >>
    >>>> Its all free.
    >>>> Time you got a decent PC and installed Linux
    >>>> and enjoyed the power of Linux flowing through your computer.
    >>>> For speed, performance and bang for buck there is nothing
    >>>> that beats it.
    >>>>
    >>>> http://www.livecdlist.com
    >>>> http://www.distrowatch.com
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Just one question. What does one do if one needs actual
    >>> professional-level software with which to do real work? Linux is out,
    >>> that's what happens.

    >>
    >> correct george.
    >>
    >> why hasn't there yet been a single professional level app on Linux?

    >
    > There are lots of professional applications - from Open Office to
    > Pro-Engineer that run supported on Linux.
    >
    >
    >> everyone keeps waiting, but nothing even remotely close to high end UNIX
    >> apps like these... are available...

    >
    > Pro-Engineer is high end. So are most of the world's
    > major supercomputers that use Linux as the preferred OS.
    > So is Apache, PHP, MySQL, PostgreSQL,.. what is that you
    > tried to do that you claim coudn't be done with Linux?
    > And you sure others are not doing it already and perhaps
    > doing it better than your knowlege and abilities?
    >
    >
    >> h
    >>
    >> what is the hold up I wonder?

    >
    > It must be you not looking hard enough?
    > http://www.livecdlist.com
    > http://www.distrowatch.com
    >
    >> it's like linux users gave up programming against the intense tide of
    >> 18,000 OSX apps some 5 years ago.

    >
    > Doubt it, there are 20,000+ Open source applications
    > And in any case, it is being deployed at the rate
    > of 1 million embedded Linux applications PER DAY.


    You are aware that embedded applications are irrelevant to this discussion
    are you not? DVRs, smart refrigerators, cable boxes, home security systems,
    environmental control systems, and other single-purpose devices, are simply
    not the same thing as a desktop computer.


    -
    How come every time we get a "Major Tax Cut" I get maybe $0.30 more returned
    to me, but every time there's a "Minor Tax Increase" it costs me $300.00?


  18. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    In article ,
    Snit wrote:

    > "O x f o r d" stated in post
    > iphone-239C62.23343407012008@mpls-nn...inet.qwest.net on 1/7/08 11:34 PM:
    >
    > > Red Henk wrote:
    > >
    > >>> I will admit that many of the apps running in Linux are not as well
    > >>> polished as those of MS or Apple, but given time they will improve. Apple
    > >>> and MS spend literally millions in research in fine tuning their GUIs for
    > >>> the average user, while apps in the Linux community are built by
    > >>> relavtively small groups who are far more intent on ensuring a stable and
    > >>> secure core. As Linux distros mature, the interfaces for the apps will
    > >>> also
    > >>> greatly improve. At the present, you have various distros that appeal to
    > >>> different sets of users. With MS and Apple you take it the way they want
    > >>> you to have it.
    > >>
    > >> I'm a lurker and only occasionally say anything, because I'm simply a
    > >> user of a Mac. I don't have any technical knowledge with computers. I
    > >> can see all the sneers by the Mac/Windows/Linux self gurus, please
    > >> restrain yourself until you finish reading this note.
    > >>
    > >> As a self-admitted mechanical klutz, the reason I've chosen to use the
    > >> Mac is that it's the easiest OS for _me_ to use. I've had some dealings
    > >> with Windows, from the time of Win3.1. MS tries to be as elegant as
    > >> OSX, both in appearance and usability, and I will say that it's better
    > >> better, so it's maybe like 75% toward being as good as a Mac. I don't
    > >> I can't wait for the rest of the 25%. So **** it!
    > >>
    > >> Linux on the other hand, I wish that there was a version of open source
    > >> operating system that approached the user-friendliness of the Mac with
    > >> OSX. Every so often I look at Linux and each time I find myself in a
    > >> software jungle with no sign posts. It seems to me that Linux acolytes
    > >> are into tinkering with the hardware and the software, as opposed to
    > >> being productive. And there is nothing wrong with that, but it's not to
    > >> my taste.
    > >>
    > >> Here's the thing -- If I want to make toast, I get a toaster. I get to
    > >> do the task do it quickly without any problems. That's my feeling about
    > >> the Mac. On the other hand Linux promises me the dream of open source
    > >> toasting, but in the meantime I have to build the toaster, choose the
    > >> version of power that I need, etc. Hey I'm impressed with all I that I
    > >> could potentially do, but all I want is have a toast.
    > >>
    > >> I really, really want there to be a useful Linux, for me, but again I'm
    > >> tired of waiting. When you Linux guys finally come out with a distro
    > >> that's ready for showtime, I'll be right there checking it out!

    > >
    > > Good post Red, you see the bigger picture, not lost in the details like
    > > Peter and so many Linux users are. Linux really has no "focus", thus
    > > it's never going to be successful... the same reasons Windows will never
    > > be successful.
    > >
    > > Only Apple and OSX "gets it"... they are extreme perfectionists, and
    > > won't stop until the user's experience is ideal.

    >
    > If it is ideal then why do you think there are those who are complaining
    > that Leopard, for *them*, started having severe problems with CD burning,
    > keyboard's generating characters, caps locks getting messed up, batteries no
    > longer working, Time Machine backups not working, and on and on...



    Good point... the net is loaded with people complaining about problems
    they are having running Leopard. I won't put it on my mission critical
    hardware yet.

    --
    --
    Steve C

  19. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    In article ,
    Lloyd Parsons wrote:

    > In article ,
    > O x f o r d wrote:
    >
    > > In article ,
    > > Little Gorm wrote:
    > >
    > > > I will admit that many of the apps running in Linux are not as well
    > > > polished as those of MS or Apple, but given time they will improve. Apple
    > > > and MS spend literally millions in research in fine tuning their GUIs for
    > > > the average user, while apps in the Linux community are built by
    > > > relavtively small groups who are far more intent on ensuring a stable and
    > > > secure core. As Linux distros mature, the interfaces for the apps will
    > > > also
    > > > greatly improve. At the present, you have various distros that appeal to
    > > > different sets of users. With MS and Apple you take it the way they want
    > > > you to have it.

    > >
    > > millions? certainly not in the case of apple...
    > >
    > > OSX relies on Aqua to make all apps consistent without any cost to the
    > > developer. Windows and Linux don't have this type of free foundation so
    > > their apps always seem haphazard compared to OSX apps.
    > >
    > > apple/next did most of this work 5-20 years ago, now everyone that
    > > develops for OSX joins in the party.
    > >
    > > every Mac app "just works" since Apple did all the hard work years ago...
    > >
    > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aqua_(user_interface)
    > >
    > > the rest is just gravy... making an OSX app takes less than 4 minutes,
    > > which is shocking compared to Linux or Windows.
    > >
    > > so developing on OSX is the easiest of any platform... to get started,
    > > go here:
    > >
    > > it's all free, so no wonder OSX has far better apps than Windows and
    > > Linux combined!
    > >
    > > http://developer.apple.com/tools/xcode/
    > >
    > > it's the world's best development environment bar none.
    > >
    > > http://developer.apple.com/
    > >
    > > enjoy!
    > >
    > > -

    >
    > Tell me, Oxford, do you wear a skirt and wave pom-poms when you do all
    > this cheerleading?


    LOL! He probably even wears 'em on the way to the bank to cash those
    Apple checks

    --
    --
    Steve C

  20. Re: Apple's OSX crap compared to Linux

    In article <7ev6o31l922oot7n5abshbh69ha3duf8i8@4ax.com>,
    chrisv wrote:

    > George Graves wrote:
    >
    > >Little Gorm wrote
    > >>
    > >> With MS and Apple you take it the way they want you to have it.

    > >
    > >And for most users, that's FAR better.

    >
    > Maybe it is best for you Mac Morons, "digital music expert" George
    > Graves.
    >
    > However, if I were you, I would not be so proud of my limited mental
    > capacity.


    Said the guy who kf's any view contrary to his own.

    --
    --
    Steve C

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