Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages - Microsoft Windows

This is a discussion on Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages - Microsoft Windows ; I am using I.E 6 on a P4 machine.We have a broadband connection terminating on our Windows NT server.Here we run the Winroute 4.1 engine to distribute the internet connections to our local network. Recently the results of an exam ...

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Thread: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages

  1. Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages

    I am using I.E 6 on a P4 machine.We have a broadband connection
    terminating on our Windows NT server.Here we run the Winroute 4.1
    engine to distribute the internet connections to our local network.
    Recently the results of an exam were declared on the net at 4.00 p.m.
    We were looking at this site from morning and continued to get the same
    screen saying results are expected till late into the night.In the
    meanwhile the results were declared at 3.30 p.m. and others were able
    to see the results on their dialup connection.
    We deleted all temperory internet files, tried restarting the computer
    but to no avail.It is only the next day after several attempts that we
    could see the results.
    Is there a way to avoid this problem? How do we ensure that we always
    get the latest updated pages?
    regards
    P.Venugopal


  2. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages

    gcl@vsnl.com writes:
    > I am using I.E 6 on a P4 machine.We have a broadband connection
    > terminating on our Windows NT server.Here we run the Winroute 4.1
    > engine to distribute the internet connections to our local network.
    > Recently the results of an exam were declared on the net at 4.00 p.m.
    > We were looking at this site from morning and continued to get the same
    > screen saying results are expected till late into the night.In the
    > meanwhile the results were declared at 3.30 p.m. and others were able
    > to see the results on their dialup connection.
    > We deleted all temperory internet files, tried restarting the computer
    > but to no avail.It is only the next day after several attempts that we
    > could see the results.
    > Is there a way to avoid this problem? How do we ensure that we always
    > get the latest updated pages?


    Press shift while clicking the reload button. Or use the control-r
    keyboard shortcut. This bypasses the browser's RAM and disk cache.


    --
    Todd H.
    http://www.toddh.net/

  3. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages


    Todd H. wrote:
    >
    > Press shift while clicking the reload button. Or use the control-r
    > keyboard shortcut. This bypasses the browser's RAM and disk cache.



    I tried both these methods with no change.There is a site
    jamnabaischool.org which has a blinking ICSE RESULTS on the right
    side.This was updated on 18/5/2005.However I still get the earlier page
    which has OPEN HOUSE on the right side.

    regards

    P.Venugopal


  4. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updatingits pages

    gcl@vsnl.com wrote:
    > Todd H. wrote:
    >
    >>Press shift while clicking the reload button. Or use the control-r
    >>keyboard shortcut. This bypasses the browser's RAM and disk cache.

    >
    > I tried both these methods with no change.There is a site
    > jamnabaischool.org which has a blinking ICSE RESULTS on the right
    > side.This was updated on 18/5/2005.However I still get the earlier page
    > which has OPEN HOUSE on the right side.


    If you're surfing via a proxy, don't. Proxies cause more problems than
    they solve, IME.

    --
    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
    "One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
    One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."


  5. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages

    Twisted One writes:

    > gcl@vsnl.com wrote:
    > > Todd H. wrote:
    > >
    > >>Press shift while clicking the reload button. Or use the control-r
    > >>keyboard shortcut. This bypasses the browser's RAM and disk cache.

    > > I tried both these methods with no change.There is a site
    > > jamnabaischool.org which has a blinking ICSE RESULTS on the right
    > > side.This was updated on 18/5/2005.However I still get the earlier page
    > > which has OPEN HOUSE on the right side.

    >
    > If you're surfing via a proxy, don't. Proxies cause more problems than
    > they solve, IME.


    Actually, this brings up a good point.

    gcl, check with your network administrator and see if the load
    balancing device that you mention in your original post, see if maybe
    it implements a caching web proxy. That may be the culprit resulting
    in you seeing "old" pages. It'd also be useful to see if you have the
    same issues from other computers on the network.

    A caching proxy, by its nature, keeps hold of web pages retrieved within
    a given time window. It wouldn't be unheard of for a school to
    implement one on the network level to keep their WAN bandwidth costs
    down.

    Caching proxies can be implemented as network devices, or also as
    software proxies on individual workstations. IE and Mozilla have
    their own caches built into them--the control-R trick, as Twisty
    mentions only freshens from that internal web browser cache, but it
    won't necessarily tell another caching proxy (be it in software or
    network hardware) to go and fetch a fresh copy of a page.

    Best Regards,
    --
    Todd H.
    http://www.toddh.net/

  6. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updatingits pages

    Todd H. wrote:
    > Caching proxies can be implemented as network devices, or also as
    > software proxies on individual workstations. IE and Mozilla have
    > their own caches built into them--the control-R trick, as Twisty
    > mentions only freshens from that internal web browser cache, but it
    > won't necessarily tell another caching proxy (be it in software or
    > network hardware) to go and fetch a fresh copy of a page.


    The remote page's last modification date header changing is supposed to
    tell any cache to flush that page, but broken clocks on remote hosts or
    broken cache software that doesn't fetch and check the headers to see if
    a cached page is stale have been known to occur.

    --
    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
    "One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
    One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."


  7. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages

    Twisted One writes:

    > Todd H. wrote:
    > > Caching proxies can be implemented as network devices, or also as
    > > software proxies on individual workstations. IE and Mozilla have
    > > their own caches built into them--the control-R trick, as Twisty
    > > mentions only freshens from that internal web browser cache, but it
    > > won't necessarily tell another caching proxy (be it in software or
    > > network hardware) to go and fetch a fresh copy of a page.

    >
    > The remote page's last modification date header changing is supposed
    > to tell any cache to flush that page, but broken clocks on remote
    > hosts or broken cache software that doesn't fetch and check the
    > headers to see if a cached page is stale have been known to occur.


    Indeed.

    --
    Todd H.
    http://www.toddh.net/

  8. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updatingits pages

    Todd H. wrote:
    > Twisted One writes:
    >>Todd H. wrote:
    >>
    >>>Caching proxies can be implemented as network devices, or also as
    >>>software proxies on individual workstations. IE and Mozilla have
    >>>their own caches built into them--the control-R trick, as Twisty
    >>>mentions only freshens from that internal web browser cache, but it
    >>>won't necessarily tell another caching proxy (be it in software or
    >>>network hardware) to go and fetch a fresh copy of a page.

    >>
    >>The remote page's last modification date header changing is supposed
    >>to tell any cache to flush that page, but broken clocks on remote
    >>hosts or broken cache software that doesn't fetch and check the
    >>headers to see if a cached page is stale have been known to occur.

    >
    > Indeed.


    Browser caches are, at least, under the user's control. A remote cache
    isn't, and minimizing points of failure outside a user's control is
    generally a good thing. Thus my "cause more problems than they solve"
    comment. This is exacerbated by the danger of the cache operator
    deciding to stop merely proxying and start exercising editorial control,
    or to put it more bluntly, censoring your Web access from stuff he
    thinks you shouldn't want to see. It's not even necessarily just porn
    sites. Sex education sites. Competing service providers. Political
    speech the operator of the proxy disagrees with. The possibilities are
    endless, depending on what sort of politics, prudism, or other warped
    notions a busybody or plain old crooked proxy operator might happen to
    possess. So there's an additional human-factors point of failure as well
    as an additional technological point of failure being added...

    The only real reason for using a proxy I can think of for an end user is
    if it's an anonymizing proxy, and they trust the operator.

    Of course, ISPs and such may have their own reasons to try to force
    their end users to use a proxy; a perceived need for
    protecting-the-newbies-from-some-evil-spam-and-viruses is the least
    worst; being bandwidth cheapskates is the most common; and then there
    are the darker motives...

    --
    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
    "One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
    One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."


  9. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages

    Todd H. wrote

    >It'd also be useful to see if you have the
    >same issues from other computers on the network.


    No.The other computers are now showing the correct page.My computer
    still shows the old page?
    regards
    P.Venugopal


  10. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updatingits pages

    gcl@vsnl.com wrote:
    > Todd H. wrote
    >
    >>It'd also be useful to see if you have the
    >>same issues from other computers on the network.

    >
    > No.The other computers are now showing the correct page.My computer
    > still shows the old page?
    > regards
    > P.Venugopal


    Are they connected up differently to the network? Check especially any
    proxy/routing/etc. settings.

    --
    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
    "One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
    One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."


  11. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages



    Twisted One wrote:

    > Are they connected up differently to the network? Check especially any
    > proxy/routing/etc. settings.



    No. They all have lan settings as "automatically detect settings"
    P.Venugopal


  12. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updating its pages

    gcl@vsnl.com writes:

    > Twisted One wrote:
    >
    > > Are they connected up differently to the network? Check especially any
    > > proxy/routing/etc. settings.

    >
    >
    > No. They all have lan settings as "automatically detect settings"
    > P.Venugopal


    Then that's officially Really Weird. Something must be horked in the
    caching on your particular computer. I trust you've deleted all
    offline content and cleared both memory and disk caches. Is there
    other software running on your machine that might be in between the
    web browser and the TCP/IP stack?


    --
    Todd H.
    http://www.toddh.net/

  13. Re: Getting current page from a site which is frequently updatingits pages

    gcl@vsnl.com wrote:
    >
    > Twisted One wrote:
    >
    >>Are they connected up differently to the network? Check especially any
    >>proxy/routing/etc. settings.

    >
    > No. They all have lan settings as "automatically detect settings"
    > P.Venugopal


    That explains it. Windows does damned strange things when told to
    automatically detect anything. Set them to "no proxy" instead of
    autodetect and see if the problem goes away. (Or set the problem machine
    to no proxy, anyway.)

    --
    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
    "One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
    One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."


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