[News] Why Microsoft Fears Linux - Linux

This is a discussion on [News] Why Microsoft Fears Linux - Linux ; http://blogs.computerworld.com/why_m...ft_fears_linux Preston Gralla Seeing Through Windows November 6, 2008 - 4:39 P.M. Why Microsoft fears Linux What I didn't write about in detail, though, was why Microsoft felt it was so important to make Windows 7 lean in the first ...

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  1. [News] Why Microsoft Fears Linux

    http://blogs.computerworld.com/why_m...ft_fears_linux

    Preston Gralla
    Seeing Through Windows
    November 6, 2008 - 4:39 P.M.
    Why Microsoft fears Linux

    What I didn't write about in detail, though, was why Microsoft
    felt it was so important to make Windows 7 lean in the first
    place: The skyrocketing growth of Linux on netbooks.

    An article by Bloomberg does a great job of digging up statistics
    about Linux versus Windows on netbook, and it's sobering for
    Microsoft. It finds that:

    Acer Inc. and Asustek Computer Inc., which together account
    for 90 percent of the netbook market, are using the rival Linux
    software on about 30 percent of their low-cost notebooks.

    More disturbing still, the article says, is that

    Netbooks will account for about a third of PC growth this
    year, according to Citigroup Inc. Shipments will climb at an
    annual average growth rate of 60 percent and reach 29 million
    units in 2010, compared with 18 percent growth for standard
    notebooks, according to a September BNP Paribas SA report.

    Microsoft isn't just worried about ceding 30 percent of the
    netbook market to Linux. It's also worried that if people get
    used to Linux on netbooks, they'll consider buying Linux on
    desktop PCs. Here's what Dickie Chang, an analyst at research
    firm IDC in Taipei, told Bloomberg about that:

    It's a real threat to Microsoft. It gives users a chance to
    see and try something new, showing them there is an alternative.

    It's clear, then, that Microsoft sees Linux on netbooks not just
    as a niche market, but as a threat to Microsoft's desktop share
    as well.

    That's why when Windows 7 is released, Microsoft will spend
    substantial amounts of marketing muscle pushing Windows 7 on
    netbooks. Expect it to go well beyond mere advertising. Expect
    price cuts and rebates for Windows 7 netbooks, special hardware
    on them, and more.
    Also expect increased anti-Linux FUD being spread in this
    newsgroup as well as all other Linux channels. AFAIK, it has
    been traditional upon the eve of a new Microsoft product on the
    horizon.

    --
    HPT
    Quando omni flunkus moritati
    (If all else fails, play dead)
    - "Red" Green

  2. Re: [News] Why Microsoft Fears Linux


    "High Plains Thumper" wrote in message
    news:491816e7$0$17066$6e1ede2f@read.cnntp.org...
    >
    > Also expect increased anti-Linux FUD being spread in this newsgroup as
    > well as all other Linux channels. AFAIK, it has been traditional upon the
    > eve of a new Microsoft product on the horizon.
    >

    Tut. You cite a no-name blogger who apparently cannot find a real job who
    is citing a third hand account uttered by a low-level functionary in Asia.
    From that he comes to a sage conclusion about the US markets and suggests
    that this is causing the largest software supplier for PCs in the world to
    drastically alter their go to market strategy? Please.

    Even so, what do you suppose will happen to the netbook market when a
    targeted version of Windows 7 is actually available for it? And what if it
    were predatorially priced to meet any perceived challenge from Linux? Right
    now, with no such product, the best claim that anyone can make is that Linux
    is ekeing out 30% of the business and even that is suspect. A cursory
    glance at Amazon shows that 8 out of the top 10 selling notebooks there use
    XP and that includes the top 6 models. The return rate on Linux netbooks
    from people disillusioned with their purchases have been significantly high
    compared to returns of XP models as well.

    The intial use of Linux on these machines seems to be a flash in the pan
    that the market is quickly moving to set right.


  3. Re: [News] Why Microsoft Fears Linux

    amicus_curious wrote:
    > High Plains Thumper wrote:
    >
    >> http://blogs.computerworld.com/why_m...ft_fears_linux
    >>
    >> Preston Gralla
    >> Seeing Through Windows
    >> November 6, 2008 - 4:39 P.M.
    >> Why Microsoft fears Linux
    >>
    >>
    What I didn't write about in detail, though, was why
    >> Microsoft felt it was so important to make Windows 7 lean in
    >> the first place: The skyrocketing growth of Linux on
    >> netbooks.
    >>
    >> An article by Bloomberg does a great job of digging up
    >> statistics about Linux versus Windows on netbook, and it's
    >> sobering for Microsoft. It finds that:
    >>
    >> Acer Inc. and Asustek Computer Inc., which together account
    >> for 90 percent of the netbook market, are using the rival
    >> Linux software on about 30 percent of their low-cost
    >> notebooks.
    >>
    >> More disturbing still, the article says, is that
    >>
    >> Netbooks will account for about a third of PC growth this
    >> year, according to Citigroup Inc. Shipments will climb at an
    >> annual average growth rate of 60 percent and reach 29
    >> million units in 2010, compared with 18 percent growth for
    >> standard notebooks, according to a September BNP Paribas SA
    >> report.
    >>
    >> Microsoft isn't just worried about ceding 30 percent of the
    >> netbook market to Linux. It's also worried that if people
    >> get used to Linux on netbooks, they'll consider buying Linux
    >> on desktop PCs. Here's what Dickie Chang, an analyst at
    >> research firm IDC in Taipei, told Bloomberg about that:
    >>
    >> It's a real threat to Microsoft. It gives users a chance to
    >> see and try something new, showing them there is an
    >> alternative.
    >>
    >> It's clear, then, that Microsoft sees Linux on netbooks not
    >> just as a niche market, but as a threat to Microsoft's
    >> desktop share as well.
    >>
    >> That's why when Windows 7 is released, Microsoft will spend
    >> substantial amounts of marketing muscle pushing Windows 7 on
    >> netbooks. Expect it to go well beyond mere advertising.
    >> Expect price cuts and rebates for Windows 7 netbooks,
    >> special hardware on them, and more.
    >>
    >> Also expect increased anti-Linux FUD being spread in this
    >> newsgroup as well as all other Linux channels. AFAIK, it
    >> has been traditional upon the eve of a new Microsoft product
    >> on the horizon.

    >
    > Tut. You cite a no-name blogger who apparently cannot find a
    > real job who is citing a third hand account uttered by a
    > low-level functionary in Asia. From that he comes to a sage
    > conclusion about the US markets and suggests that this is
    > causing the largest software supplier for PCs in the world to
    > drastically alter their go to market strategy? Please.


    This is an example of an ad hominem attack, attacking the writer
    rather than addressing the points brought up with the writer.

    Linux has always been considered a threat to the Microsoft
    Corporation:

    http://www.informationweek.com/news/...cleID=12800942

    or http://tinyurl.com/3uhbpt

    [quote]
    Linux Ranks No. 2 On Microsoft Risk List

    The open-source operating system trailed only the economic
    environment in the biggest risks outlined by CFO John Connors.

    By Gregg Keizer, TechWeb News
    InformationWeek
    July 18, 2003 03:00 PM

    Microsoft (NSDQ: MSFT) is taking the Linux threat seriously. So
    seriously, in fact, that open-source software comes in at the No.
    2 spot on the company's top five list of risks.

    In a teleconference to go over the Redmond, Wash.-based
    developer's fourth quarter and fiscal 2003 results on Thursday,
    CFO John Connors detailed the five biggest risks to his company's
    business.

    "The general economic environment is risk and driver No. 1," he
    said. "Linux and non-commercial software is risk No. 2." [...]

    Microsoft has been making noise this year about how serious it
    takes the threat from open-source software. Microsoft chairman
    Bill Gates said in February that he took Linux and its threat to
    his company seriously, saying the operating system is "out there
    and very pervasive." And in June, CEO Steve Ballmer identified
    open-source products a major competitive threat in an E-mail sent
    to all Microsoft employees.

    More recently, the company has been stepping up its efforts to
    convince potential European clients that they should steer away
    from Linux and towards its products. But even though Ballmer
    intervened in the attempt to win over the city of Munich, Linux
    won out.

    "When you see these big losses escalating as high as Ballmer,"
    Cherry said, "you know that Linux has caught their attention."
    [quote]

    http://articles.techrepublic.com.com...1-5232985.html

    Microsoft: Linux threat is rising
    Jun 14, 2004 1:34:00 PM
    By Graeme Wearden
    CNET News.com

    More companies are using the threat of Linux when negotiating
    deals with Microsoft, one of the company's senior executives has
    admitted.

    A year after a letter from Microsoft CEO Steve Balmer to his
    employees acknowledged the Linux threat looming on the horizon,
    Microsoft remains adamant that open-source software isn't a
    serious competitor on the desktop today. However, it may well be
    forcing Microsoft's prices down.

    "It's definitely more of a threat than it was," said Nick Barley,
    director of marketing at Microsoft, when asked whether more
    businesses are telling Microsoft that they're planning to migrate
    to Linux rather than to one of its own operating systems or
    applications in the hope of getting a better deal. [...]

    McGrath also cited a series of recent customer wins, including
    the London borough of Newham's decision to go with Microsoft
    rather than open-source options. McGrath claimed that Newham can
    look forward to potentially twice the productivity-associated
    cost savings than if they had gone down the open-source road.

    Those familiar with the Newham case, though, say it is actually a
    prime example of Microsoft cutting its prices when facing the
    threat of Linux.
    Problem is the Wintrolls herein see it in American eyes, not in
    the language or settings of another culture.

    http://www.ameinfo.com/46391.html

    Is Linux a threat to Microsoft?
    In the Middle East, the answer depends upon who gets asked the
    question. But many are now asking such questions about Linux.
    United Arab Emirates: Saturday, October 02 - 2004 at 13:57

    In his wildest dreams, Microsoft founder Bill Gates could not
    have foreseen that the greatest challenge to his software empire
    would come from a friendly looking penguin named Tux, the mascot
    for the open-source operating system Linux.

    Named after its originator, Linus Torvalds, Linux is the standard
    bearer of the open-source software movement. In brief, this means
    that the code for the operating system - which acts as the layer
    between the hardware of a computer such as a PC and the
    applications such as word processing - is not owned by any
    corporation, but rather belongs to the worldwide community of
    developers.

    This provides tremendous energy and flexibility but does raise
    issues of support and required in-house technical skills, which
    have delayed a widespread adoption of Linux. Not any more Linux
    is now mainstream. [...] At present, there are dozens of
    ongoing projects for porting Linux to various hardware
    configurations and purposes.

    Ah, but Linux is profitable:

    As for HP, its Linux-based revenue for the 2003 fiscal year was
    over $2.5 billion. Following an earlier, similar conversion to
    the wonders of Java, the big boys see Linux as a key weapon in an
    ongoing battle for the heart and soul of the IT industry between
    Microsoft and other key players.
    ..... and the remarkable stability of Linux:

    Linux is inherently a more stable and secure platform than
    Windows. This is partly because the viruses do not run on Linux,
    thus security is more robust. Enigmatis recently installed a
    Windows server that was riddled with viruses and worms within a week.

    In sharp contrast, he adds, our Linux server has sat there for
    over a year without a problem.
    Ah, then there is the TCO FUD report. It is interesting to note
    that Forrester no longer does this type of market research:

    These are areas in which Microsoft can, and has, taken the fight
    back to the Linux camp. One argument that has left many potential
    users confused is the issue of total cost of ownership.

    Yes, says Microsoft, Linux may be free, but when you factor in
    other costs such as necessary staff training, rewriting software
    and so on, then Windows is a better alternative. There is some
    truth to this, but Microsoft's case was badly hurt by an
    independent TCO report by leading analysts Forrester that was, it
    later turned out, funded by the software giant. (Worth noting:
    Forrester has also now withdrawn from future commercial research
    of this kind.)
    Mid-East is heavier into Linux than the Wintrolls would like to
    admit:

    Sun shines on Linux

    However, not all vendors agree with the cost issue. Mehmet
    Iyimen, managing director of Sun Microsystems MENA, claims that
    Linux is proving itself to be a key low-cost computing platform
    for Middle East enterprises.

    Regional customers are using Linux to manage IT infrastructures
    by matching the right platform to the right task while managing
    complexity, reducing cost and keeping an open standards focus.
    Microsoft is also working hard on the security issues that have
    been bedeviling it; although, to be fair, if users were more
    scrupulous about applying security patches and system updates,
    then the problems would not be so great.

    According to Torvalds, Microsoft is not in trouble. I think they
    are struggling to deal with Linux partly because Linux is
    undermining them the same way they undercut their competition. If
    you look at DOS, or maybe compilers, one thing that happened with
    Microsoft was that these upstarts came out and had cheaper compilers.

    DOS was also cheap and it undercut the competition, he points
    out. They never had a competitor like themselves. Then along
    comes somebody who undercuts them and they start acting exactly
    how all of their competitors acted.
    Ah, the clincher, Microsoft is an American company. (Not only
    the Arabs, but the EU wants to establish its software
    industries.) The Arabs want independence from Microsoft.

    However, specifically in this region, Microsoft faces a major
    challenge: it is an American company. It can make Arabic a
    tier-one language for new software releases, but it can't
    disguise its origins. That's a problem when there is a general
    upswing of anti-American feeling in this part of the world; fatal
    in countries where the US government has sanctions in place.

    Want legitimate and supported Microsoft software in territories
    like Syria, Libya and other non- players of the US game? Good
    luck. Growth forecasts. That's why homegrown support services,
    based on Linux user groups are mushrooming across the region.

    That's why new Linux training and implementation vendors are
    forecasting a good year ahead. That's why homegrown Arabization
    initiatives - both in IBM's Cairo laboratory and at Riyadh's King
    Abdul Aziz University for Science and Technology are blossoming.

    And that's why, most importantly, a whole region-wide community
    of Linux developers is spreading across the Middle East, able to
    use the openness of the operating system to adapt to local
    demands and to help roll out lower-cost solutions to enterprises
    and governments who have traditionally used the Unix operating
    system.

    Across the region, enterprises of all sizes and in all market
    sectors are adopting Linux. The Al Ghurair Group in the UAE is
    running Oracle applications, as is the Habib AG Zurich Bank,
    Dubai, which is running core-banking applications with Linux.

    Other regional Linux users are the Bahraini government, Saudi
    Aramco and Emirates Industrial Gases, to name just a few big
    players making the switch from Microsoft. According to Samer
    Karawi, HP Middle East's marketing manager, Enterprise Systems
    Group, Linux will take Unix's market share. Adds Hatem Al-Sibai,
    group IT manager for the Al Ghurair Group, Our decision to
    migrate from Windows to Linux was driven by the need to achieve
    higher uptime for our business while improving information
    security and reducing cost of ownership.

    > Even so, what do you suppose will happen to the netbook market
    > when a targeted version of Windows 7 is actually available for
    > it? And what if it were predatorially priced to meet any
    > perceived challenge from Linux? Right now, with no such
    > product, the best claim that anyone can make is that Linux is
    > ekeing out 30% of the business and even that is suspect. A
    > cursory glance at Amazon shows that 8 out of the top 10
    > selling notebooks there use XP and that includes the top 6
    > models. The return rate on Linux netbooks from people
    > disillusioned with their purchases have been significantly
    > high compared to returns of XP models as well.
    >
    > The intial use of Linux on these machines seems to be a flash
    > in the pan that the market is quickly moving to set right.


    Ah, so people are so disillusioned that 4 years after the above
    observations were made, Linux is gaining greater presence even in
    the US market? Look again:

    http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicati...c.asp?Sort=3D=
    4&Nav=3D|c:2814|&Recs=3D30

    PC's configured with Linux:

    1. Everex CloudBook CE1200V Refurbished Netbook - VIA C7-M ULV
    1.2GHz, 802.11b/g Wireless, 512MB DDR2, 30GB HDD, 7" WVGA,
    Integrated Webcam, gOS V2
    Item #: E80-7001 RB
    Sporting a 7-inch WVGA display, this light as a cloud computer
    weighs a scant 2 pounds, and offers as much as 5 hours of battery
    life.
    $289.99

    2. Sylvania G Netbook - VIA C7-M ULV Processor 1.2GHz, 802.11b/g
    Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 30GB HDD, 7" WVGA, Integrated Webcam, Linux
    Based gOS Operating System
    Item #: D516-7001
    At just under two pounds, the netbook by Sylvania brings you
    ultra light portability and wireless Internet connectivity built
    right in.
    $299.96

    3. Acer Aspire One AOA110-1295 Netbook - Intel Atom=99 Processor
    N270 1.60GHz, 802.11b/g Wireless, 512MB DDR2, 8GB SSD, 8.9"
    WSVGA, Integrated Webcam, Linpus Linux Lite
    Item #: A180-8001
    Empower yourself with the incredibly light yet remarkably
    productive Acer Aspire One =96 the new thin & light notebook that
    weighs only 2.19 pounds.
    $349.96

    4. Acer Aspire One AOA110-1295 Netbook - Intel Atom=99 Processor
    N270 1.60GHz, 802.11b/g Wireless, 512MB DDR2, 8GB SSD, 8.9"
    WSVGA, Integrated Webcam, Linpus Linux Lite
    Item #: S445-8001
    Empower yourself with the incredibly light yet remarkably
    productive Acer Aspire One =96 the new thin & light netbook that
    weighs only 2.19 pounds.
    $349.99

    7. Asus Eee PC 4G Netbook - Intel Mobile CPU, 802.11b/g Wireless,
    512MB DDR2, 4GB SSD, 7" WVGA, Webcam, Linux, Pearl White
    Item #: A455-7212
    The new Asus Eee PC 4G brings portable computing to the next
    level. At 7-inches and weighing only 2 pounds, you can take the
    Eee PC anywhere.
    $369.99

    9. Acer Aspire One AOA110-1626 Netbook - Intel Atom=99 Processor
    N270 1.60GHz, 802.11b/g Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 16GB SSD, 8.9" WSVGA,
    Integrated Webcam, Linpus Linux Lite (Onyx Black)
    Item #: A180-8002
    Empower yourself with the incredibly light yet remarkably
    productive Acer Aspire One =96 the new thin & light netbook that
    weighs only 2.19 pounds.
    $369.99

    10. Sylvania G Netbook Meso - Intel Atom Processor 1.60GHz,
    802.11b/g Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 80GB HDD, 8.9" WSVGA, Integrated
    Webcam, Ubuntu Netbook Remix (Onyx)
    Item #: D516-7003
    Free yourself from clumsy electronics and enjoy uncompromising
    mobility with the g netbook.
    $379.99

    11. Sylvania G Netbook Meso - Intel Atom Processor 1.60GHz,
    802.11b/g Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 80GB HDD, 8.9" WSVGA, Integrated
    Webcam, Ubuntu Netbook Remix (Solar)
    Item #: D516-7004
    Free yourself from clumsy electronics and enjoy uncompromising
    mobility with the g netbook.
    $379.99

    12. Sylvania G Netbook Meso - Intel Atom Processor 1.60GHz,
    802.11b/g Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 80GB HDD, 8.9" WSVGA, Integrated
    Webcam, Ubuntu Netbook Remix (Snow)
    Item #: D516-7006
    Free yourself from clumsy electronics and enjoy uncompromising
    mobility with the g netbook.
    $379.99

    18. Asus Eee PC 900 Netbook - Intel Mobile CPU, 802.11b/g
    Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 20GB SSD, 8.9" WSVGA, Integrated Webcam,
    Linux (Galaxy Black)
    Item #: A455-9504
    You demanded it. We have it! The new 8.9-inch, 2.18-pound Asus
    Eee PC 900. It=92s easy to learn, work and play when you own an
    Asus Eee PC 900.
    $429.99

    26. Asus Eee PC 901 Netbook - Intel Mobile Atom Processor,
    Bluetooth, 802.11b/g/n Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 20GB SSD, 8.9" WSVGA,
    Webcam, Linux (Fine Ebony)
    Item #: A455-8001
    While plenty of PCs promise a revolutionary impact, few deliver
    the goods. That=92s not the case with our new Asus Eee PC 901.
    $519.99

    27. Asus Eee PC 900 Netbook - Intel Mobile CPU, 802.11b/g
    Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 20GB SSD, 8.9" WSVGA, Integrated Webcam,
    Linux (Pearl White)
    Item #: A455-9500
    You demanded it. We have it! The new 8.9-inch, 2.18-pound Asus
    Eee PC 900. It=92s easy to learn, work and play when you own an
    Asus Eee PC 900.
    $564.99

    28. Asus Eee PC 1000 Netbook - Intel Mobile Atom Processor,
    Bluetooth, 802.11b/g/n Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 40GB SSD, 10" WSVGA,
    Webcam, Linux (Fine Ebony)
    Item #: A455-10002
    While plenty of PCs promise a revolutionary impact, few deliver
    the goods. That=92s not the case with our new Asus Eee PC 1000.
    $599.99

    29. Asus Eee PC 1000 Netbook - Intel Atom Processor, Bluetooth,
    802.11b/g/n Wireless, 1GB DDR2, 40GB SSD, 10" WSVGA, Webcam,
    Linux (Pearl White)
    Item #: A455-10001
    While plenty of PCs promise a revolutionary impact, few deliver
    the goods. That=92s not the case with our new Asus Eee PC 1000.
    $629.99

    Page 1 of 2
    --
    HPT
    Quando omni flunkus moritati
    (If all else fails, play dead)
    - "Red" Green


  4. Re: [News] Why Microsoft Fears Linux


    "High Plains Thumper" wrote in message
    news:49196416$0$17069$6e1ede2f@read.cnntp.org...
    >
    > This is an example of an ad hominem attack, attacking the writer
    > rather than addressing the points brought up with the writer.
    >
    > Linux has always been considered a threat to the Microsoft
    > Corporation:
    >

    Are you for real? Consider this:

    1. Your cite is some 5 years old.

    2. In the past 5 years, in the face of this terrible threat to their
    well-being, Windows has prospered.

    3. Revenues for Windows client software has more than doubled.

    4. Windows server products have moved to a leadership position, eclipsing
    Unix and IBM operating system based servers, going from virtually no server
    presence in 2000 to a 41% share today. Linux has managed to steal the
    low-end business from Unix vendors and is a distant third place in small
    servers, and fourth place overall.

    If it is the worst threat faced by Microsoft, you had better invest heavily
    in Mr. Softee for the future.



  5. Re: [News] Why Microsoft Fears Linux


    "High Plains Thumper" wrote in message
    news:4919b34f$0$17069$6e1ede2f@read.cnntp.org...
    > amicus_curious wrote:
    >> "High Plains Thumper" wrote...
    >>>
    >>> This is an example of an ad hominem attack, attacking the writer rather
    >>> than addressing the points brought up with the
    >>> writer.
    >>>
    >>> Linux has always been considered a threat to the Microsoft Corporation:


    >> Are you for real? Consider this:
    >>
    >> 1. Your cite is some 5 years old.
    >>
    >> 2. In the past 5 years, in the face of this terrible threat to their
    >> well-being, Windows has prospered.
    >>
    >> 3. Revenues for Windows client software has more than doubled.
    >>
    >> 4. Windows server products have moved to a leadership position,
    >> eclipsing Unix and IBM operating system based servers, going from
    >> virtually no server presence in 2000 to a 41% share today. Linux has
    >> managed to steal the low-end business from Unix vendors and is a distant
    >> third place in small servers, and fourth place overall.
    >>
    >> If it is the worst threat faced by Microsoft, you had better invest
    >> heavily in Mr. Softee for the future.

    >


    > Following is a continuation of this ad hominem anti-Linux troll.
    > Selective snippages, to remove the context, so it can continue
    > its anti-Linux and ad hominem rants. This is an example of:




    This is an example of the High Plains Moron nymshifting fool getting his
    arse handed to him so he runs away from the *FACTS* like a little child that
    doesn't want to play ball anymore.






  6. Re: [News] Why Microsoft Fears Linux

    Ezekiel wrote:
    > "High Plains Thumper" wrote...
    >
    >> Following is a continuation of this ad hominem anti-Linux
    >> troll. Selective snippages, to remove the context, so it can
    >> continue its anti-Linux and ad hominem rants. This is an
    >> example of:

    >
    >
    >
    > This is an example of the High Plains Moron nymshifting fool
    > getting his arse handed to him so he runs away from the
    > *FACTS* like a little child that doesn't want to play ball
    > anymore.


    No, rather this is the Ezekiel troll following in the footsteps
    of Hadron:

    http://tinyurl.com/5fyhev

    Hadron wrote:
    > It IS because of him and two other useless people in
    > particular (CBFalconer and Harold "old school" Stevens
    > (probably both Willy nyms) that I started to drift from the
    > Ubuntu fan boy zone.


    "I got my ass kicked up around my shoulders in AOLU, so in a lame
    attempt to hide the ass-kicking I received and deserved, I puffed
    out my hollow chest, chortled 'victory' and acted like I walked
    away from the group."

    --
    HPT

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