Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux! - Linux

This is a discussion on Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux! - Linux ; I once saw a very clever way to find out what kind of job a child would like to do when they 'grew up'. It was a book with pictures of different people in their work clothes or uniform. A ...

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Thread: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

  1. Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    I once saw a very clever way to find out what kind of job a child would
    like to do when they 'grew up'.

    It was a book with pictures of different people in their work clothes or
    uniform. A fireman, a policeman, a soldier, electrician, mountain
    climber, nurse etc.

    Hundreds of pictures.

    One gave it to a child to read and discreetly watched their reaction, did
    they spend a lot of time on the policeman or just turn the page, showing
    no interest ?

    Perhaps they kept going back to the airline pilot ?

    A computer isn't that different to the book, whether it's at home or at
    school and the software could well decide the future of your child.

    Lets look at a Linux computer owned by a 'typical' family. They don't
    have a lot of money to spend on a PC and software, and have chosen Linux.

    All the software was easily chosen from the package manager and installed
    by mum or dad over the Internet, and it didn't cost them anything.

    This Linux box caters for children interested in :-
    accounting, electronics, software design, chemistry, cad drawing, art,
    photography, word processing, language, databases, astronomy,networking,
    spreadsheets, desktop publishing, geometry, mathematics, etc, etc, etc
    just to name a very few.

    Software for almost every discipline, is available for free and installed
    via an on-line Linux box with a command no more complex than "apt-get
    install celestia" (astronomy) in the case of Gnu/Debian/Linux. There are
    over 30,000 Free high quality applications available.


    Lets look at a Windows Vista computer owned by a 'typical' family. They
    don't have a lot of money to spend on a PC and software, but have chosen
    Windows.

    Traditionally Windows, being proprietary, comes with little other than a
    card game, a crippled 'word processor, spreadsheet' application like
    MSWorks and a bundle of crap-ware.

    Ok, your kids are now equipped to become card sharks, receptionists and
    clerks. But what if they were a future engineer, or a pilot, or a
    chemist ?

    Before the Wintrolls start shouting that all the applications for Linux
    are also available for Windows, you should be aware that this claim is
    only half true.

    FwBuilder (www.fwbuilder.org) is one example of a Linux application NOT
    available for Windows, much to Erik Wintrolls distress.

    Many Linux programs that are 'available for Windows' are not trivial to
    install, they require libraries to be downloaded and installed, and
    configuration changes many of which are probably beyond most casual
    Windows users.

    Available yes, obtainable, ... probably not.



    Windows ... card shark, receptionist or clerk job for your kids tomorrow ?

    --
    Linux full time, on the desktop, since August 1997

  2. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    After takin' a swig o' grog, High Plains Thumper belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > Hadron wrote:
    >>
    >> Do what I do when adovcating Linux : concentrate on "virus
    >> free, stable and does most of what I want". Dont make out the
    >> choice is better. Its not.


    Spoken like a "true Linux advocate".

    > Mr. Porter started out comparing the cost effectiveness and
    > abundance of free/low cost applications that are available with a
    > Linux computer, (incidently, many of which are installed up front
    > or are available on the distro media for installation). Then
    > compares a similar computer with Microsoft Vista installed, but
    > little else. Then one is left to downloading or purchase at
    > additional cost, external to the PC.
    >
    > What is truly sad is this troll's entire discourse herein are
    > examples of ad hominem attacks, attacking the poster rather than
    > participate in the discussion and counter his arguments. This
    > awful trolling technique is described in:
    >
    > http://tantek.pbwiki.com/TrollTaxonomy
    >
    >
    > Ad hominem troll
    >
    > Ad hominem troll at its simplest, will attack people personally,
    > rather than the merits of their statements or methodologies.
    >


    I'm wondering how long it is until Hadron and Hadron II start
    mutually masturbating with each other, a la flatfish and his socks.

    --
    LOOK!! Sullen American teens wearing MADRAS shorts and "Flock of
    Seagulls" HAIRCUTS!

  3. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!


    "Terry Porter" wrote in message
    newssqdnXFnKOzWqIjUnZ2dnUVZ_j2dnZ2d@netspace.net.au...
    >
    > Before the Wintrolls start shouting that all the applications for Linux
    > are also available for Windows, you should be aware that this claim is
    > only half true.
    >
    > FwBuilder (www.fwbuilder.org) is one example of a Linux application NOT
    > available for Windows, much to Erik Wintrolls distress.
    >

    Are you suspecting that your child will want to grow up to be a firewall
    builder? That is truly odd.

    Another odd thing is that this application is available for Windows also, in
    spite of the claim made here. Are you another Ballard who doesn't expect
    the reader to check the validity of one's claim? Shame on you, too.

    >
    >
    > Windows ... card shark, receptionist or clerk job for your kids tomorrow ?
    >

    Better a firewall builder, eh?


  4. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

    > After takin' a swig o' grog, High Plains Thumper belched out
    > this bit o' wisdom:
    >
    >> Hadron wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Do what I do when adovcating Linux : concentrate on "virus
    >>> free, stable and does most of what I want". Dont make out the
    >>> choice is better. Its not.

    >
    > Spoken like a "true Linux advocate".
    >
    >> Mr. Porter started out comparing the cost effectiveness and
    >> abundance of free/low cost applications that are available with a
    >> Linux computer, (incidently, many of which are installed up front
    >> or are available on the distro media for installation). Then
    >> compares a similar computer with Microsoft Vista installed, but
    >> little else. Then one is left to downloading or purchase at
    >> additional cost, external to the PC.
    >>
    >> What is truly sad is this troll's entire discourse herein are
    >> examples of ad hominem attacks, attacking the poster rather than
    >> participate in the discussion and counter his arguments. This
    >> awful trolling technique is described in:
    >>
    >> http://tantek.pbwiki.com/TrollTaxonomy
    >>
    >>
    >> Ad hominem troll
    >>
    >> Ad hominem troll at its simplest, will attack people personally,
    >> rather than the merits of their statements or methodologies.
    >>

    >
    > I'm wondering how long it is until Hadron and Hadron II start
    > mutually masturbating with each other, a la flatfish and his socks.
    >


    No need. They are the same person. Hadron is incompetent at nymshifting
    --
    Microsoft's Guide To System Design:
    It could be worse, but it'll take time.


  5. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Peter Köhlmann belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    >>
    >> I'm wondering how long it is until Hadron and Hadron II start
    >> mutually masturbating with each other, a la flatfish and his socks.

    >
    > No need. They are the same person. Hadron is incompetent at nymshifting


    Pedant point: Isn't a sock, by definition, provided by the same person?

    Check out "Ubuntu King", too.

    --
    A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular.
    -- Adlai Stevenson

  6. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    On Sat, 08 Nov 2008 00:44:27 -0600, Terry Porter wrote:

    [snipped]

    Excellent Linux advocacy post Terry. Your posts are a breath of fresh
    air in this windows trolls infected newsgroup. Kepp up the good work.

  7. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    In article ,
    Terry Porter wrote:
    > Traditionally Windows, being proprietary, comes with little other than a
    > card game, a crippled 'word processor, spreadsheet' application like
    > MSWorks and a bundle of crap-ware.
    >
    > Ok, your kids are now equipped to become card sharks, receptionists and
    > clerks. But what if they were a future engineer, or a pilot, or a
    > chemist ?


    So, how do you explain that fact that when engineers and scientists are
    interviewed on the TV news in their offices or labs, or when they are
    featured in documentaries on TV networks such as Discovery, National
    Geographic, or History, and you can get a clear enough view of their
    computers to see what OS they are running, Windows is by far the most
    common?

    >
    > Before the Wintrolls start shouting that all the applications for Linux
    > are also available for Windows, you should be aware that this claim is
    > only half true.
    >
    > FwBuilder (www.fwbuilder.org) is one example of a Linux application NOT
    > available for Windows, much to Erik Wintrolls distress.


    Really? Then what do you think this is?



    which you find by clicking the link *on* *the* *front* *page* *of* *the*
    *site* for Windows and OS X versions, and then clicking the big
    "DOWNLOAD FIREWALL BUILDER 3 for Windows" button.

    --
    --Tim Smith

  8. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    In article ,
    Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    > > Mr. Porter started out comparing the cost effectiveness and
    > > abundance of free/low cost applications that are available with a
    > > Linux computer, (incidently, many of which are installed up front
    > > or are available on the distro media for installation). Then
    > > compares a similar computer with Microsoft Vista installed, but
    > > little else. Then one is left to downloading or purchase at
    > > additional cost, external to the PC.
    > >
    > > What is truly sad is this troll's entire discourse herein are
    > > examples of ad hominem attacks, attacking the poster rather than
    > > participate in the discussion and counter his arguments. This
    > > awful trolling technique is described in:
    > >
    > > http://tantek.pbwiki.com/TrollTaxonomy
    > >
    > >
    > > Ad hominem troll
    > >
    > > Ad hominem troll at its simplest, will attack people personally,
    > > rather than the merits of their statements or methodologies.
    > >

    >
    > I'm wondering how long it is until Hadron and Hadron II start
    > mutually masturbating with each other, a la flatfish and his socks.


    You are being too subtle for HPT, Chris. He's not going to figure out
    that your post was meant as an example of an ad hominem, offered as
    contrast to his continued incorrect usage of the term. Nice try, though.

    --
    --Tim Smith

  9. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    Tim Smith wrote:

    > In article ,
    > Terry Porter wrote:
    >> Traditionally Windows, being proprietary, comes with little other than a
    >> card game, a crippled 'word processor, spreadsheet' application like
    >> MSWorks and a bundle of crap-ware.
    >>
    >> Ok, your kids are now equipped to become card sharks, receptionists and
    >> clerks. But what if they were a future engineer, or a pilot, or a
    >> chemist ?

    >
    > So, how do you explain that fact that when engineers and scientists are
    > interviewed on the TV news in their offices or labs, or when they are
    > featured in documentaries on TV networks such as Discovery, National
    > Geographic, or History, and you can get a clear enough view of their
    > computers to see what OS they are running, Windows is by far the most
    > common?
    >
    >>
    >> Before the Wintrolls start shouting that all the applications for Linux
    >> are also available for Windows, you should be aware that this claim is
    >> only half true.
    >>
    >> FwBuilder (www.fwbuilder.org) is one example of a Linux application NOT
    >> available for Windows, much to Erik Wintrolls distress.

    >
    > Really? Then what do you think this is?
    >
    >
    >
    > which you find by clicking the link *on* *the* *front* *page* *of* *the*
    > *site* for Windows and OS X versions, and then clicking the big
    > "DOWNLOAD FIREWALL BUILDER 3 for Windows" button.
    >


    /quote
    Here you can download binary packages for Windows 2000, Windows XP and Mac
    OS X. These packages work in evaluation mode for 30 days and can be
    unlocked with a license file
    /unquote

    Additionally, you can't configure any windows firewall with it.
    Just linux, BSD and Cisco

    But yes, thanks to QT it is a crossplatform app, running on linux, windows
    and OSX
    --
    Hardware, n.:
    The parts of a computer system that can be kicked.


  10. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    Tim Smith wrote:
    > Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    >> High Plains Thumper wrote:
    >>
    >>> Mr. Porter started out comparing the cost effectiveness
    >>> and abundance of free/low cost applications that are
    >>> available with a Linux computer, (incidently, many of
    >>> which are installed up front or are available on the
    >>> distro media for installation). Then compares a similar
    >>> computer with Microsoft Vista installed, but little else.
    >>> Then one is left to downloading or purchase at additional
    >>> cost, external to the PC.
    >>>
    >>> What is truly sad is this troll's entire discourse herein
    >>> are examples of ad hominem attacks, attacking the poster
    >>> rather than participate in the discussion and counter his
    >>> arguments. This awful trolling technique is described in:
    >>>
    >>> http://tantek.pbwiki.com/TrollTaxonomy
    >>>
    >>>
    Ad hominem troll
    >>>
    >>> Ad hominem troll at its simplest, will attack people
    >>> personally, rather than the merits of their statements or
    >>> methodologies.

    >>
    >> I'm wondering how long it is until Hadron and Hadron II
    >> start mutually masturbating with each other, a la flatfish
    >> and his socks.

    >
    > You are being too subtle for HPT, Chris. He's not going to
    > figure out that your post was meant as an example of an ad
    > hominem, offered as contrast to his continued incorrect usage
    > of the term. Nice try, though.


    I don't have to figure out Chris', but have figured out this one:

    http://www.faqs.org/faqs/linux/advocacy/faq-and-primer/

    7.6 Trespasser Disinformation Tactics

    12. Blame your stupidity and lies on your opponent.
    Blame your own stupidity on the Linux advocate you are dealing
    with. Such as when you have made an unsupportable claim that
    suggest a list of details and your are asked to present your
    non-existent list reply with, "I don't have to list them for you;
    you aren't bright enough to know what you're missing by using X
    instead of a real Y, I'm not going to explain it to you." Then
    hope that nobody reading the thread realizes that your statement
    translates as, "I lack the knowledge or facts needed to counter
    your position or your position is too complete and accurate to be
    refuted. So, I will say things to sound superior to avoid
    admitting you are right."
    --
    HPT

  11. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    Hadron wrote:
    >
    >
    > But thousands of free programs are available from the Internet. Sound
    > familiar?
    >
    > Including Celestia .....
    >
    > Including OO, Firefox, Apache, MySQL etc etc etc etc.
    >
    > And then the thousands of non free titles including entertainment and
    > business.


    Windoze. Squeezing a universe of software onto one desktop.
    "Which two or three apps would you like to run today?"


  12. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    On Sat, 08 Nov 2008 09:27:32 -0500, amicus_curious wrote:

    > "Terry Porter" wrote in message
    > newssqdnXFnKOzWqIjUnZ2dnUVZ_j2dnZ2d@netspace.net.au...
    >>
    >> Before the Wintrolls start shouting that all the applications for Linux
    >> are also available for Windows, you should be aware that this claim is
    >> only half true.
    >>
    >> FwBuilder (www.fwbuilder.org) is one example of a Linux application NOT
    >> available for Windows, much to Erik Wintrolls distress.
    >>

    > Are you suspecting that your child will want to grow up to be a firewall
    > builder?


    Your mate, little Erik Wintroll could have benefited enormously with
    FwBuilder, perhaps even saved a business from his incompetence.

    > That is truly odd.


    Only to a Wintroll. Go back to your card game, or write a nice memo to
    Erik on Msworks.

    >
    > Another odd thing is that this application is available for Windows
    > also, in spite of the claim made here.


    Nebulous claims with no supporting evidence, why am I not surprised with
    you Flatfish Wintroll ?


    --
    Linux full time, on the desktop, since August 1997

  13. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    On Sat, 08 Nov 2008 17:00:34 +0000, Rob Schwenk wrote:

    > On Sat, 08 Nov 2008 00:44:27 -0600, Terry Porter wrote:
    >
    > [snipped]
    >
    > Excellent Linux advocacy post Terry. Your posts are a breath of fresh
    > air in this windows trolls infected newsgroup. Keep up the good work.


    Thanks Rob!

    I used to post real accounts of my Linux use back in the old days but the
    Wintroll noise was huge.These days with Roy S posting his news articles,
    the Wintroll to noise ratio is so low, it's a walk in the park, and I
    feel I'm getting the Linux advocacy messages thru.

    The Wintroll responses to my articles are proof of that.

    This is how it works, the more they hate your Linux advocacy, the 'worse'
    their attacks.

    Personally I love it, every attack just gives me a good laugh, these
    morons couldn't organise a fight in a pub.


    Cheers
    Terry



    --
    Linux full time, on the desktop, since August 1997

  14. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Tim Smith belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > In article ,
    > Terry Porter wrote:
    >> Traditionally Windows, being proprietary, comes with little other than a
    >> card game, a crippled 'word processor, spreadsheet' application like
    >> MSWorks and a bundle of crap-ware.
    >>
    >> Ok, your kids are now equipped to become card sharks, receptionists and
    >> clerks. But what if they were a future engineer, or a pilot, or a
    >> chemist ?

    >
    > So, how do you explain that fact that when engineers and scientists are
    > interviewed on the TV news in their offices or labs, or when they are
    > featured in documentaries on TV networks such as Discovery, National
    > Geographic, or History, and you can get a clear enough view of their
    > computers to see what OS they are running, Windows is by far the most
    > common?


    Huh? I see a mix of Windows, various UNIXen, and even some Macs.

    Maybe 50% Windows.

    >> FwBuilder (www.fwbuilder.org) is one example of a Linux application NOT
    >> available for Windows, much to Erik Wintrolls distress.

    >
    > Really? Then what do you think this is?
    >
    >
    >
    > which you find by clicking the link *on* *the* *front* *page* *of* *the*
    > *site* for Windows and OS X versions, and then clicking the big
    > "DOWNLOAD FIREWALL BUILDER 3 for Windows" button.


    Hell, it even mentions Mac and Windows binaries on the front page.

    The licensing is a little odd, though:

    http://www.fwbuilder.org/docs/firewa...licensing.html

    Packages of Firewall Builder for commerical OS are distributed under the
    terms of NetCitadel End User License Agreement.

    . . .

    You can purchase license online.

    http://www.fwbuilder.org/docs/firewa...r_license.html

    No copying?

    Somethings rotten in Denmark.

    Looks like Terry's half-right, after all. You /can/ get fwbuilder for
    Windows or other /commercial/ operating systems, but for them you have to
    buy a license, and you don't get the GPL rights.

    Bleh.

    --
    Ever wonder if taxation without representation might have been cheaper?

  15. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Tim Smith belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > In article ,
    > Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    >> >
    >> > Ad hominem troll at its simplest, will attack people personally,
    >> > rather than the merits of their statements or methodologies.
    >> > [/quote]

    >>
    >> I'm wondering how long it is until Hadron and Hadron II start
    >> mutually masturbating with each other, a la flatfish and his socks.

    >
    > You are being too subtle for HPT, Chris. He's not going to figure out
    > that your post was meant as an example of an ad hominem, offered as
    > contrast to his continued incorrect usage of the term. Nice try, though.


    Well, it would be an ad hominem, if the two Hadrons were actually hominem.

    But they're not. They uncivil, insulting in fact, and deserve far more than
    the mild epithet I used above for Hadron's behavior with DFS and Moshe that
    I suspect could occur with "Steve Townsend" (Hadron II), should he have the
    wherewithal to manage two identities at once.

    I tend to believe there is a difference between a provoked attack and an
    unprovoked attack, in any case.

    --
    I went to my first computer conference at the New York Hilton about 20
    years ago. When somebody there predicted the market for microprocessors
    would eventually be in the millions, someone else said, "Where are they
    all going to go? It's not like you need a computer in every doorknob!"

    Years later, I went back to the same hotel. I noticed the room keys had
    been replaced by electronic cards you slide into slots in the doors.

    There was a computer in every doorknob.
    -- Danny Hillis

  16. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Hadron belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > Do what I do when adovcating Linux : concentrate on "virus free, stable
    > and does most of what I want". Dont make out the choice is better. Its
    > not.


    (Heh. Sounds like the very definition of "better" for a rather large
    category of user, to me.)

    --
    Life is like a 10 speed bicycle. Most of us have gears we never use.
    -- C. Schultz

  17. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    On 2008-11-08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    > After takin' a swig o' grog, High Plains Thumper belched out
    > this bit o' wisdom:
    >
    >> Hadron wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Do what I do when adovcating Linux : concentrate on "virus
    >>> free, stable and does most of what I want". Dont make out the
    >>> choice is better. Its not.

    >
    > Spoken like a "true Linux advocate".
    >
    >> Mr. Porter started out comparing the cost effectiveness and
    >> abundance of free/low cost applications that are available with a
    >> Linux computer, (incidently, many of which are installed up front
    >> or are available on the distro media for installation). Then
    >> compares a similar computer with Microsoft Vista installed, but
    >> little else. Then one is left to downloading or purchase at
    >> additional cost, external to the PC.
    >>
    >> What is truly sad is this troll's entire discourse herein are
    >> examples of ad hominem attacks, attacking the poster rather than
    >> participate in the discussion and counter his arguments. This
    >> awful trolling technique is described in:
    >>
    >> http://tantek.pbwiki.com/TrollTaxonomy
    >>
    >>
    >> Ad hominem troll
    >>
    >> Ad hominem troll at its simplest, will attack people personally,
    >> rather than the merits of their statements or methodologies.
    >>

    >
    > I'm wondering how long it is until Hadron and Hadron II start
    > mutually masturbating with each other, a la flatfish and his socks.


    Oh please no... I'm having afternoon coffee and friand after a hard
    day's work...

    I think I just threw up a little in my mouth...

    --
    Regards,

    Gregory.
    Gentoo Linux - Penguin Power

  18. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    In article ,
    Terry Porter wrote:
    > > Another odd thing is that this application is available for Windows
    > > also, in spite of the claim made here.

    >
    > Nebulous claims with no supporting evidence, why am I not surprised with
    > you Flatfish Wintroll ?


    Evidence for you:




    --
    --Tim Smith

  19. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    Terry Porter wrote:

    > Nebulous claims with no supporting evidence, why am I not
    > surprised with you Flatfish Wintroll ?


    See http://colatrolls.blogspot.com/2007/...lwg-troll.html

    Home page link mentioned doesn't work, but if one goes to URL
    root, then faculty will find it there.

    --
    HPT
    Quando omni flunkus moritati
    (If all else fails, play dead)
    - "Red" Green

  20. Re: Give your kids more than three employment options with Linux!

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Gregory Shearman belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > On 2008-11-08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    >>
    >> I'm wondering how long it is until Hadron and Hadron II start
    >> mutually masturbating with each other, a la flatfish and his socks.

    >
    > Oh please no... I'm having afternoon coffee and friand after a hard
    > day's work...
    >
    > I think I just threw up a little in my mouth...


    Serves you right! All that talk of food preparation!

    --
    Is it clean in other dimensions?

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