My employer completed migration of apps to Linux - Linux

This is a discussion on My employer completed migration of apps to Linux - Linux ; Verily I say unto thee, that Erik Funkenbusch spake thusly: > On Thu, 06 Nov 2008 12:10:06 -0800, Tim Smith wrote: >> Consoles usually have an advantage at launch, but then PC graphics >> cards catch up and surpass the ...

+ Reply to Thread
Page 11 of 13 FirstFirst ... 9 10 11 12 13 LastLast
Results 201 to 220 of 250

Thread: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

  1. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    Verily I say unto thee, that Erik Funkenbusch spake thusly:
    > On Thu, 06 Nov 2008 12:10:06 -0800, Tim Smith wrote:


    >> Consoles usually have an advantage at launch, but then PC graphics
    >> cards catch up and surpass the consoles.

    >
    > Not to mention that a PC typically has more CPU power, more memory


    Unfortunately the exponential increase in Windows' bloat, with each
    successive release, negates and actually surpasses any increases in
    hardware resources. A PC may have more, but it also has to do more,
    and all of those background tasks and services are entirely surplus
    to the requirements of a gaming console, especially given the bloat
    and number of such tasks that Windows apparently needs to operate.

    > Many kinds of games are difficult to play on a gamepad


    You mean /you/ have difficulty.

    Then why not just connect a keyboard and mouse to the console?

    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "At the time, I thought C was the most elegant language and Java
    | the most practical one. That point of view lasted for maybe two
    | weeks after initial exposure to Lisp." ~ Constantine Vetoshev
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
    01:33:08 up 1 day, 9:16, 3 users, load average: 0.07, 0.16, 0.12

  2. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    Verily I say unto thee, that Erik Funkenbusch spake thusly:
    > On Thu, 6 Nov 2008 18:24:22 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:


    >>> When someone says there is a lack of apps for a platform, they do
    >>> not mean there are *no* apps for that platform.

    >>
    >> True. They mean to present the fiction that Linux doesn't have
    >> enough apps to be useful.

    >
    > No, they mean to present the opinion that it doesn't have enough of
    > the kind of apps they want


    Given that the only "apps" the vast majority of people run is a Web
    browser; an Email client (actually Web mail seems more popular these
    days); a messaging client; and an office suite, I'd say that such an
    "opinion" (if indeed it is a widely held one) is thoroughly misguided,
    and no doubt instigated and perpetuated by FUDsters like you.

    So tell me Erik, what "kind of apps" do the good people supposedly want,
    that Linux does not have? Can you honestly come up with anything more
    than a few obscure corner cases (most of which can probably be done on
    Linux is other ways)?

    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "At the time, I thought C was the most elegant language and Java
    | the most practical one. That point of view lasted for maybe two
    | weeks after initial exposure to Lisp." ~ Constantine Vetoshev
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
    01:52:25 up 1 day, 9:35, 3 users, load average: 0.01, 0.05, 0.08

  3. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    On Fri, 07 Nov 2008 01:52:46 +0000, Homer wrote:

    > Verily I say unto thee, that Erik Funkenbusch spake thusly:
    >> On Thu, 6 Nov 2008 18:24:22 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

    >
    >>>> When someone says there is a lack of apps for a platform, they do
    >>>> not mean there are *no* apps for that platform.
    >>>
    >>> True. They mean to present the fiction that Linux doesn't have
    >>> enough apps to be useful.

    >>
    >> No, they mean to present the opinion that it doesn't have enough of
    >> the kind of apps they want

    >
    > Given that the only "apps" the vast majority of people run is a Web
    > browser; an Email client (actually Web mail seems more popular these
    > days); a messaging client; and an office suite...


    A personal finance program that ocnnects to their bank, a tax program that
    lets them file their taxes electronically, greeting card makers from major
    greeting card companies, various games, Resume makers, business card
    makers, blah blah blah

    You really have little idea of what real people use their compters for, do
    you?

    >, I'd say that such an
    > "opinion" (if indeed it is a widely held one) is thoroughly misguided,
    > and no doubt instigated and perpetuated by FUDsters like you.


    I guess that's why return rates of Linux net pc's are 4x higher than their
    Windows counterparts...

    > So tell me Erik, what "kind of apps" do the good people supposedly want,
    > that Linux does not have? Can you honestly come up with anything more
    > than a few obscure corner cases (most of which can probably be done on
    > Linux is other ways)?


    People don't want "other ways". Sure, you can create a greeting card in
    the gimp, but who wants to when a specialized program with content from a
    major greeting card company makes it much easier.

  4. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    So anyway, it was like, 18:22 CET Nov 06 2008, you know? Oh, and, yeah,
    JEDIDIAH was all like, "Dude,
    > On 2008-11-06, Johan Lindquist wrote:
    >> So anyway, it was like, 09:50 CET Nov 06 2008, you know? Oh, and, yeah,
    >> Christopher Hunter was all like, "Dude,
    >>> Johan Lindquist wrote:
    >>>> So anyway, it was like, 09:14 CET Nov 06 2008, you know? Oh, and, yeah,
    >>>> Christopher Hunter was all like, "Dude,


    >>>>> a) Games are best played on a dedicated games console.
    >>>>
    >>>> Do you play any computer games yourself?
    >>>
    >>> Not any more - I have better things to do with my time.

    >>
    >> This is the other common trait of non-gamers. Beside the "games are
    >> better played on a console" mantra, they all seem to share this
    >> condescending attitude that computer games are pointless and a
    >> waste

    >
    > I would say that actual game programmers give consoles far
    > more credit than "PC gaming snobs" do. They are also in a much
    > better position to give a sound informed evaluation of what is being
    > discussed here.


    I honestly don't know what you're trying to say in regard to my often
    validated prejudice against people who do not play computer games by
    bringing game programmers into the discussion.

    If you're referring to me as a "PC gaming snob", then I would like to
    point out that I enjoy consoles too, I just don't find the statement
    "games are better played on a dedicated games console" to be true for
    all games. I'll accept the title since I do prefer PC gaming, though,
    if I were to choose one of the two platforms. (Fortunately I don't
    have to!)

    > [deletia]


    > I mainly play Starcraft (eagerly waiting for Starcraft II right
    > now), and I can simply not see how it would even be playable on a
    > regular console, given that you have neither mouse nor keyboard to
    > control gameplay.


    > [deltia]


    Nor do I understand your selective quoting and what it implies. Is
    there a hint I missed in what I wrote about Starcraft in particular?

    I haven't seen any strategy games of that caliber released on the
    console market, but maybe I'm just not looking hard enough for it.

    --
    Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana. Perth ---> *
    09:32:34 up 14 days, 22:20, 3 users, load average: 2.25, 1.30, 0.60
    Linux 2.6.27.2 x86_64 GNU/Linux Registered Linux user #261729

  5. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux



    "Maxwell Lol" wrote in message
    news:878wrw8ijf.fsf@com.invalid...
    > "dennis@home" writes:
    >
    >> I don't need to see it.
    >> If it does what he states it will make the data order somewhat mixed.
    >> If he wants it debugged then he will have to post the code and agree
    >> the fees.

    >
    > If he's doing select(), then he can handle several input and output
    > files simultaneously.


    He could but that isn't what he said.
    He said he could make his application simulate AIO by using several threads
    to do whatever the application was doing before. A sure way to screw up the
    order. Which as I said may or may not matter. If its a file or a TCP
    connection it will matter.

    I have had to fix the problem before even though the group insisted it
    worked fine, yes it works fine on some systems with certain apps running but
    fails miserably if something alters the scheduling, like using a TCP
    connection on two machines rather than one. The performance can be abysmal
    too with all the extra context switching (though no where near as bad as it
    used to be in Unix's infancy when I was telling Unix developers how to fix
    the queues. (Why would anyone have thought it was OK to wake all processes
    waiting on an event rather than putting them in a queue and only waking
    one?) ;-) )


  6. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    On Thu, 06 Nov 2008 17:13:13 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

    > dennis@home wrote:
    >>
    >> I don't need to see it.
    >> If it does what he states it will make the data order somewhat mixed.
    >> If he wants it debugged then he will have to post the code and agree
    >> the fees.
    >>
    >>> Say! You might be /just/ the guy to explain the ins and outs of MD5
    >>> sums!

    >>

    > Well mind if i don't take you up on that. You are the second person who
    > appears to be talking out of their arses.


    Dennis, is it true? You have more than one arse?

    --
    Lionel B

  7. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Erik Funkenbusch belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > On Thu, 6 Nov 2008 18:24:22 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    >
    >> The trouble with counting apps is the redundancy of functionality. Windows
    >> has a lot more apps, but a greater overlap in functionality.

    >
    > Overlap has nothing to do with it, and nobody but a moron counts raw app
    > numbers, they count how many apps fullfil given needs, and Linux lacks
    > fullfilling solutions in many of those categories.


    Such as?

    >> But Linux does have a lot more window managers! And file systems!

    >
    > Indeed.


    --
    "Say yur prayers, yuh flea-pickin' varmint!"
    -- Yosemite Sam

  8. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Erik Funkenbusch belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > On Fri, 07 Nov 2008 01:52:46 +0000, Homer wrote:
    >>
    >> Given that the only "apps" the vast majority of people run is a Web
    >> browser; an Email client (actually Web mail seems more popular these
    >> days); a messaging client; and an office suite...

    >
    > A personal finance program that ocnnects to their bank


    FUD.

    > a tax program that lets them file their taxes electronically


    I'll bet that's FUD too.

    > greeting card makers from major greeting card companies


    Weasel wording to shift tiny goalposts.

    Wonder if this one is any good?

    http://www.softplatz.com/Soft/Games/...ard-Maker.html

    WinNT 3.x, WinNT 4.x, WinXP, Windows2000, Windows2003, Windows CE, Unix,
    Linux, Linux Console, Linux Gnome, Linux GPL, Linux Open Source, MS-DOS,
    AS/400, OS/2, OS/2 Warp, OS/2 Warp 4, MAC 68k, Mac PPC, Mac OS X, Mac
    Other, Palm OS 1.0, Palm OS 2.0, Palm OS 2.1, Palm OS 3.0, Palm

    http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&rh=n...9861011&page=1

    Who knows? Or knowing, who /cares/!?

    > various games, Resume makers, business card
    > makers, blah blah blah


    *LOL*

    > You really have little idea of what real people use their compters for, do
    > you?
    >
    >>, I'd say that such an
    >> "opinion" (if indeed it is a widely held one) is thoroughly misguided,
    >> and no doubt instigated and perpetuated by FUDsters like you.

    >
    > I guess that's why return rates of Linux net pc's are 4x higher than their
    > Windows counterparts...


    Nope. That's because people who bought the cheaper Linux version hoping to
    get XP working on them were disappointed, heh heh.

    >> So tell me Erik, what "kind of apps" do the good people supposedly want,
    >> that Linux does not have? Can you honestly come up with anything more
    >> than a few obscure corner cases (most of which can probably be done on
    >> Linux is other ways)?

    >
    > People don't want "other ways". Sure, you can create a greeting card in
    > the gimp, but who wants to when a specialized program with content from a
    > major greeting card company makes it much easier.


    My have times changed, when all Erik has

    --
    If some day we are defeated, well, war has its fortunes, good and bad.
    -- Commander Kor, "Errand of Mercy", stardate 3201.7

  9. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Erik Funkenbusch belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    >> One of the best references on this whole general topic is this:
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Interesting quote from that article:
    >
    > "glibc 2.1 and later provide a generic implementation written for standards
    > compliance rather than performance."
    >
    > So even Linux doesn't have performance in mind when it wraps AIO with
    > standard functions.


    Another ignorant person who conflates GNU and Linux.

    In any case, you don't need to use glibc's functions. Try libaio.

    --
    Slous' Contention:
    If you do a job too well, you'll get stuck with it.

  10. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

    > After takin' a swig o' grog, Erik Funkenbusch belched out
    > this bit o' wisdom:
    >
    >> On Fri, 07 Nov 2008 01:52:46 +0000, Homer wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Given that the only "apps" the vast majority of people run is a Web
    >>> browser; an Email client (actually Web mail seems more popular these
    >>> days); a messaging client; and an office suite...

    >>
    >> A personal finance program that ocnnects to their bank

    >
    > FUD.


    Utterly bull**** would be more on the mark

    >> a tax program that lets them file their taxes electronically

    >
    > I'll bet that's FUD too.


    It is. In germany we have the option of doing taxes prep online since
    several years. Linux is supported

    >> greeting card makers from major greeting card companies

    >
    > Weasel wording to shift tiny goalposts.
    >
    > Wonder if this one is any good?


    Didn't you know: Everyone is using these "killerapps" like "greeting cards"

    And one could probably bet that those run just fine under WINE (if there is
    someone with a need for such "killerapps").

    >

    http://www.softplatz.com/Soft/Games/...ard-Maker.html
    >
    > WinNT 3.x, WinNT 4.x, WinXP, Windows2000, Windows2003, Windows CE,
    > Unix, Linux, Linux Console, Linux Gnome, Linux GPL, Linux Open Source,
    > MS-DOS, AS/400, OS/2, OS/2 Warp, OS/2 Warp 4, MAC 68k, Mac PPC, Mac OS
    > X, Mac Other, Palm OS 1.0, Palm OS 2.0, Palm OS 2.1, Palm OS 3.0, Palm
    >
    >

    http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&rh=n...9861011&page=1
    >
    > Who knows? Or knowing, who /cares/!?
    >
    >> various games, Resume makers, business card
    >> makers, blah blah blah

    >
    > *LOL*


    If it weren't so sad

    >> You really have little idea of what real people use their compters for,
    >> do you?



    Obviously wintendo fanbois use them for "killerapps" like greeting cards,
    business cards and other idiotic trivia

    < snip >
    --
    Microsoft's Guide To System Design:
    If it starts working, we'll fix it. Pronto.


  11. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    Chris Ahlstrom writes:

    > After takin' a swig o' grog, Erik Funkenbusch belched out
    > this bit o' wisdom:
    >
    >> On Thu, 6 Nov 2008 18:24:22 -0500, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    >>
    >>> The trouble with counting apps is the redundancy of functionality. Windows
    >>> has a lot more apps, but a greater overlap in functionality.

    >>
    >> Overlap has nothing to do with it, and nobody but a moron counts raw app
    >> numbers, they count how many apps fullfil given needs, and Linux lacks
    >> fullfilling solutions in many of those categories.

    >
    > Such as?


    Do you live in the real world?

  12. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    Tim Smith writes:

    > In article <6nfpg5Fl9c1aU3@mid.individual.net>,
    > Christopher Hunter wrote:
    >> > Do you play any computer games yourself?

    >>
    >> Not any more - I have better things to do with my time.
    >>
    >> > It seems to me only non-gamers believe this to be true. In my personal
    >> > experience, there are several games which can never be as good on a
    >> > console as they are on a proper computer.

    >>
    >> Games that require clever graphics are /certainly/ better done on a dedicated
    >> games console. However, the XBox is (as with everything from that company)

    >
    > Consoles usually have an advantage at launch, but then PC graphics cards
    > catch up and surpass the consoles.


    Actually no. Since they decide on the video HW a long time before
    release.


  13. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    Hadron II quacked:

    >Chris Ahlstrom writes:
    >>
    >> Fuddie wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Overlap has nothing to do with it, and nobody but a moron counts raw app
    >>> numbers, they count how many apps fullfil given needs, and Linux lacks
    >>> fullfilling solutions in many of those categories.

    >>
    >> Such as?

    >
    >Do you live in the real world?


    Piss off, Hadron II. We all know there's a lot of niche applications
    that Windows has that don't run natively under Linux. That doesn't
    change the fact that a huge chunk of the market has no need of niche
    applications, and can be well-served by Linux.


  14. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    Baho Utot wrote:
    > High Plains Thumper wrote:
    >> Baho Utot wrote:
    >>> Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
    >>>> snipe wrote:

    >
    > [putloin]
    >
    >>>> Sure, most people don't need to drive more than 300
    >>>> miles from their home on a regular basis, but every now
    >>>> and then they do.. and they can't have a car that limits
    >>>> them to that.
    >>>
    >>> That's what rental cars are for

    >>
    >> Or Jeepneys.

    >
    > Nah Jeepneys are for local ( quick trip to the market...leave
    > at 8:00am return at 9:00pm ). You need to take the buss if you
    > want to go across island.


    LOL! Or relative's Jeepney with driver.

    It has gotten better though. By now they should have completed
    the highway to Olongapo City.

    Speaking of Jeepney trip, Mall of Asia was too western
    commercialised. Watched children ice skating whilst the PA sang
    Bing Crosby's, "Let it Snow". All prices are Western (high), saw
    very few Ilocano's there (heh!).

    ..... and for our Win-trolls:

    http://www.computerworld.com.au/inde...163450117;pp;1

    23,000 Linux PCs forge education revolution in Philippines
    Linux still cheaper than heavily-subsidized Microsoft products
    Rodney Gedda 29/01/2008 10:53:27

    Providing high school students with PCs is seen as a first step
    to preparing them for a technology-literate future, but in the
    Philippines many schools cannot afford to provide computing
    facilities so after a successful deployment of 13,000 Fedora
    Linux systems from a government grant, plans are underway to roll
    out another 10,000 based on Ubuntu.

    Visiting Australia to discuss Linux and open source software in
    education at this year's linux.conf.au in Melbourne, independent
    open source consultant Ricardo Gonzalez, said there were a number
    of factors that led to Linux being chosen over the venerable
    Microsoft Windows.

    Gonzalez, based in Manila, told Computerworld Linux became
    popular in the Philippines soon after the 1997 Asian financial
    crisis when open source was investigated for its value
    proposition to organizations.
    --
    HPT

  15. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    chrisv writes:

    > Hadron II quacked:
    >
    >>Chris Ahlstrom writes:
    >>>
    >>> Fuddie wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>> Overlap has nothing to do with it, and nobody but a moron counts raw app
    >>>> numbers, they count how many apps fullfil given needs, and Linux lacks
    >>>> fullfilling solutions in many of those categories.
    >>>
    >>> Such as?

    >>
    >>Do you live in the real world?

    >
    > Piss off, Hadron II. We all know there's a lot of niche applications
    > that Windows has that don't run natively under Linux. That doesn't
    > change the fact that a huge chunk of the market has no need of niche
    > applications, and can be well-served by Linux.


    he said "such as". That is one the most ludicrous statemetns I have ever
    read. It indicates that Chris has very limited exposure to real
    businesses running applications in their verticals. There are millions
    of specialised Windows application developed for these which have no
    Linux equivalent. In fact you agreed with me. So take your tongue out
    and try to look objectively at the stupidity this Chris is exhibiting.

    "Such as" !




  16. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    Hadron II quacked:

    >he said "such as". That is one the most ludicrous statemetns I have ever
    >read. It indicates that Chris has very limited exposure to real
    >businesses running applications in their verticals. There are millions
    >of specialised Windows application developed for these which have no
    >Linux equivalent. In fact you agreed with me. So take your tongue out
    >and try to look objectively at the stupidity this Chris is exhibiting.
    >
    >"Such as" !


    Greeting cards, from "a major greeting card company"!

    --
    'I didn't say "dishonest", Roy. I said "Intellectually dishonest".'
    - Erik Funkenbusch

  17. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    On Nov 5, 5:15 pm, Maxwell Lol wrote:
    > Erik Funkenbusch writes:
    > > On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 14:03:18 -0600, Ignoramus31261 wrote:

    >
    > >>> Which is entirely different from async I/O.

    >
    > >> Not "entirely". They are both nonblocking and do not use CPU.

    >
    > > No. Async I/O is not "non-blocking". Non-blocking means that you call the
    > > I/O function and either it returns with data, or it returns with a return
    > > code indicating there is no data yet.

    >
    > And when you call select with a timeout of zero, it is also non-blocking.



  18. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    dennis@home wrote:
    >
    >
    > "Maxwell Lol" wrote in message
    > news:878wrw8ijf.fsf@com.invalid...
    >> "dennis@home" writes:
    >>
    >>> I don't need to see it.
    >>> If it does what he states it will make the data order somewhat mixed.
    >>> If he wants it debugged then he will have to post the code and agree
    >>> the fees.

    >>
    >> If he's doing select(), then he can handle several input and output
    >> files simultaneously.

    >
    > He could but that isn't what he said.
    > He said he could make his application simulate AIO by using several
    > threads to do whatever the application was doing before. A sure way to
    > screw up the order.


    Oh dear. You had better tell Zeus that. Thats what they do and they only
    manage to be a few orders of magnitude faster and less memory intensive
    than Apache. Now I know why whenever I went to te server for page A, I
    got page b instead. How come no one else has ever noticed it?

    ;-)


  19. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    Maxwell Lol wrote:
    > Jean-David Beyer writes:
    >
    >> In the UNIX model, this was impossible because once a read or a write
    >> was called, the application stalled until the IO was completed (what I
    >> would call serial IO) and only when the IO was complete could the nest
    >> read or write could be issued. The return of one of these IO functions
    >> implicitly informed the application that the operation was complete
    >> (or failed, as the case might be).

    >
    > One way to solve that problem would be to use threads.


    Don't confuse him with facts.

  20. Re: My employer completed migration of apps to Linux

    After takin' a swig o' grog, chrisv belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > Hadron II quacked:
    >
    >>he said "such as". That is one the most ludicrous statemetns I have ever
    >>read. It indicates that Chris has very limited exposure to real
    >>businesses running applications in their verticals. There are millions
    >>of specialised Windows application developed for these which have no
    >>Linux equivalent. In fact you agreed with me. So take your tongue out
    >>and try to look objectively at the stupidity this Chris is exhibiting.
    >>
    >>"Such as" !

    >
    > Greeting cards, from "a major greeting card company"!


    Yeah, Hadron II claims there a "millions" of Windows-only apps -- no, wait a
    minute, read that again -- "millions of specialised Windows applications
    developed for these which have no Linux equivalent".

    And all Erik can come up with when I ask him "such as" is greeting cards,
    resumes, and business cards.

    I'm not sure why Hadron II thinks asking a *leading* question, a mere ploy
    to continue the conversation, is a demonstration of stupidity, though.
    Especially since he thinks something actually silly:

    "There are millions of specialised Windows application developed for
    these which have no Linux equivalent."

    Millions! *LMAO*

    Hadron II does it again.

    --
    She's learned to say things with her eyes that others waste time putting
    into words.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 11 of 13 FirstFirst ... 9 10 11 12 13 LastLast