[News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive - Linux

This is a discussion on [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive - Linux ; China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive Chinese PC users are angry at Microsoft’s draconian anti-piracy software, says Linton Chiswick FIRST POSTED OCTOBER 23, 2008 http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/45716,...i-piracy-drive http://tinyurl.com/6nzrhz The Chinese are taking on mighty Microsoft. Just days after announcing a self-styled ...

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Thread: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

  1. [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive


    Chinese PC users are angry at Microsoft’s draconian anti-piracy software,
    says Linton Chiswick

    FIRST POSTED OCTOBER 23, 2008

    http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/45716,...i-piracy-drive
    http://tinyurl.com/6nzrhz

    The Chinese are taking on mighty Microsoft. Just days after announcing a
    self-styled 'Global Anti-Piracy Day', Microsoft has been forced onto the
    defensive by computer users in the world's most populous nation, furious at
    the company's latest clampdown on unlicensed copies of Windows.

    Microsoft rolled out the disingenuously named Windows Genuine
    Advantage 'feature' in the West first. Downloaded during a Windows update
    and designed to check the user has paid for and licensed the operating
    system, it has always been controversial, criticised on privacy grounds and
    prone to system failures. Some genuine licensees have reported receiving
    annoying onscreen 'nag' notices.

    In China, where pirated copies of Windows sell for less than 50p and an
    estimated 80-90 per cent of software used is unlicensed, a newer, more
    aggressive version of Windows Genuine Advantage, designed to black out the
    entire screen every hour, has created newspaper headlines, a tide of
    hostility on Chinese web fora, and is likely to end in the courts.

    Beijing lawyer Dong Zhengwei claims that remotely attacking the
    functionality of an individual's computer is illegal under Chinese law, and
    has branded Microsoft "the biggest hacker in China".

    Even the Chinese Software Industry Association, an organisation charged with
    working in the best interests of software developers and their intellectual
    property rights, is said to be planning legal action.

    Should Microsoft, who have already slashed the cost of some of their
    products to a tiny fraction of Western price points, be concerned?

    In a statement released today, Microsoft defended Windows Genuine Advantage,
    denying accusations that the program harvested any personal information and
    reiterating the importance of intellectual property protection.

    But the early signs are that the Chinese will want to turn a matter of
    licensing into a larger debate about nationalism and technological
    self-sufficiency. A Chinese technology researcher, quoted by the state
    press agency, asks: "Aren't worse things likely to happen in the future?
    Now people understand why China needs its own software."


    --
    Facts are sacred ... but comment is free

  2. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:

    > China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive


    That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to have.
    Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come as no
    surprise.

    Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.
    Why?
    They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    anything and so forth.

    Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  3. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    > On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >
    >> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    >
    > That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to have.
    > Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come as no
    > surprise.
    >


    Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users on
    the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?

    Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
    personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
    human rights of the Chinese?

    > Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.


    Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their promise
    of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to themselves.

    > Why?
    > They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    > anything and so forth.


    Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why do
    they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? And why do they seek to
    thrust their products on people by using the law?

    >
    > Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!


    No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in the
    business!

    Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
    particular Linux, is the way to go.


    --
    Facts are sacred ... but comment is free

  4. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:01:30 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>
    >>> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    >>
    >> That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to have.
    >> Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come as no
    >> surprise.
    >>

    >
    > Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users on
    > the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?


    Companies are in business to make a profit.
    Stealing their works cuts into that profit and thus the shareholder's
    profits as well.

    Linux is free.
    They can use Linux if they want.

    Sorry but your line of reasoning is, well, it's loony.


    > Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
    > personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
    > human rights of the Chinese?



    How about the cheap good they dump on the rest of the world?
    How about them playing with their currency?
    How about the chemical tainted food, toys etc they export?


    Linux is free.
    They can use Linux if they want.

    >> Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.

    >
    > Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their promise
    > of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to themselves.


    Linux is free.
    They can use Linux if they want.


    >> Why?
    >> They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    >> anything and so forth.

    >
    > Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why do
    > they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? And why do they seek to
    > thrust their products on people by using the law?


    They seem to be able to afford cars, electronics etc .

    Besides:

    Linux is free.
    They can use Linux if they want.

    Nobody is forcing them to use Microsoft.



    >>
    >> Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!

    >
    > No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in the
    > business!
    >
    > Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
    > particular Linux, is the way to go.


    Yet the Chinese pirate Windows en mass instead of using Linux.

    Why is that?

    Nobody is forcing them top use Microsoft.

    Linux is free.
    They can use Linux if they want.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  5. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    Robin T Cox wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>
    >>> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    >>
    >> That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to have.
    >> Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come as no
    >> surprise.
    >>

    >
    > Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users on
    > the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?
    >
    > Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
    > personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
    > human rights of the Chinese?
    >
    >> Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.

    >
    > Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their
    > promise of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to
    > themselves.
    >
    >> Why?
    >> They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    >> anything and so forth.

    >
    > Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why do
    > they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? And why do they seek
    > to thrust their products on people by using the law?
    >
    >>
    >> Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!

    >
    > No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in
    > the business!
    >
    > Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
    > particular Linux, is the way to go.


    Excuse me if I'm butting in on a private argument Robin, but did Flatty just
    show in the above that 90% of WINDOWS users in China are "pirates", while
    NO Linux users in China are pirates, and simultaneously show that Linux
    users RESPECT the terms of their licence (GPL) while WINDOWS users (EULA)
    do NOT?

    I must admit though that I fail to see how he concludes that Windows users,
    pirating Microsoft software, would make good Linux advocates.
    He seems to have his argument totally about face.

    - one might say "He doesn't seem to know his arse from his elbow", in fact?

  6. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    > On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:01:30 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >
    >> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive
    >>>
    >>> That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to
    >>> have. Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come as
    >>> no surprise.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users
    >> on the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?

    >
    > Companies are in business to make a profit.
    > Stealing their works cuts into that profit and thus the shareholder's
    > profits as well.
    >


    Fair enough. But please don't give us lectures about morality. Or about
    stealing, when Microsoft steal advantage over poor and ignorant Chinese by
    pretending to offer them a square deal, when we all know that a square deal
    is the very last thing that Microsoft will offer them.

    And also don't give us lectures about stealing when Microsoft have always
    stolen their work from others.

    > Linux is free.
    > They can use Linux if they want.
    >


    Of course, which is what we are here to proclaim, and it's refreshing to
    hear you endorse that message.

    > Sorry but your line of reasoning is, well, it's loony.
    >


    Not sorry, but I really think that you have ended up contradicting yourself.

    >
    >> Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
    >> personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
    >> human rights of the Chinese?

    >
    >
    > How about the cheap good they dump on the rest of the world?


    And Microsoft?

    > How about them playing with their currency?


    And the US doesn't?

    > How about the chemical tainted food, toys etc they export?
    >


    And of course the US is totally blameless in all these respects?

    >
    > Linux is free.
    > They can use Linux if they want.
    >


    Yes, and please keep affirming this truth.

    >>> Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.

    >>
    >> Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their
    >> promise of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to
    >> themselves.

    >
    > Linux is free.
    > They can use Linux if they want.
    >


    Again, this is so true, that I wonder why you continue to defend Microsoft.

    >
    >>> Why?
    >>> They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    >>> anything and so forth.

    >>
    >> Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why do
    >> they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? And why do they seek
    >> to thrust their products on people by using the law?

    >
    > They seem to be able to afford cars, electronics etc .
    >
    > Besides:
    >
    > Linux is free.
    > They can use Linux if they want.
    >
    > Nobody is forcing them to use Microsoft.
    >


    Ah, but what if Microsoft have so contrived matters that they don't get to
    know about Linux?

    Isn't that 'forcing?

    >
    >
    >>>
    >>> Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!

    >>
    >> No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in
    >> the business!
    >>
    >> Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
    >> particular Linux, is the way to go.

    >
    > Yet the Chinese pirate Windows en mass instead of using Linux.
    >
    > Why is that?


    Why do so many people in the West do the same?

    >
    > Nobody is forcing them top use Microsoft.
    >


    See above.

    > Linux is free.
    > They can use Linux if they want.
    >


    Well done. I think you're getting the message.

    And I think at last we agree:

    Linux is free. We don't have to use Windows. We can use Linux if we want.

    Now let's hear you say this over and over again in future.

    Because even if you don't, Microsoft themselves will continue to piss off
    people all over the world and convince them that Open Source, and Linux in
    particular, is the way to go.

    --
    Facts are sacred ... but comment is free

  7. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    bbgruff wrote:

    > Robin T Cox wrote:
    >
    >> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive
    >>>
    >>> That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to
    >>> have. Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come as
    >>> no surprise.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users
    >> on the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?
    >>
    >> Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
    >> personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
    >> human rights of the Chinese?
    >>
    >>> Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.

    >>
    >> Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their
    >> promise of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to
    >> themselves.
    >>
    >>> Why?
    >>> They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    >>> anything and so forth.

    >>
    >> Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why do
    >> they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? And why do they seek
    >> to thrust their products on people by using the law?
    >>
    >>>
    >>> Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!

    >>
    >> No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in
    >> the business!
    >>
    >> Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
    >> particular Linux, is the way to go.

    >
    > Excuse me if I'm butting in on a private argument Robin, but did Flatty
    > just show in the above that 90% of WINDOWS users in China are "pirates",
    > while NO Linux users in China are pirates, and simultaneously show that
    > Linux users RESPECT the terms of their licence (GPL) while WINDOWS users
    > (EULA) do NOT?
    >
    > I must admit though that I fail to see how he concludes that Windows
    > users, pirating Microsoft software, would make good Linux advocates.
    > He seems to have his argument totally about face.
    >
    > - one might say "He doesn't seem to know his arse from his elbow", in
    > fact?



    Please do join in, bbgruff, and let's all state the obvious for the benefit
    of those who still don't get it yet.

    As Moshe says:


    Linux is free.
    They can use Linux if they want.


    --
    Facts are sacred ... but comment is free

  8. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 21:16:44 +0100, bbgruff wrote:

    > Robin T Cox wrote:
    >
    >> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive
    >>>
    >>> That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to have.
    >>> Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come as no
    >>> surprise.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users on
    >> the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?
    >>
    >> Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
    >> personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
    >> human rights of the Chinese?
    >>
    >>> Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.

    >>
    >> Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their
    >> promise of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to
    >> themselves.
    >>
    >>> Why?
    >>> They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    >>> anything and so forth.

    >>
    >> Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why do
    >> they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? And why do they seek
    >> to thrust their products on people by using the law?
    >>
    >>>
    >>> Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!

    >>
    >> No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in
    >> the business!
    >>
    >> Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
    >> particular Linux, is the way to go.

    >
    > Excuse me if I'm butting in on a private argument Robin, but did Flatty just
    > show in the above that 90% of WINDOWS users in China are "pirates", while
    > NO Linux users in China are pirates, and simultaneously show that Linux
    > users RESPECT the terms of their licence (GPL) while WINDOWS users (EULA)
    > do NOT?


    You're reading into it way too much dude.
    All I'm saying is that it's well documented that the Chinese people are
    pirating Windows rather than using free Linux.
    What the number is, I dunno, but I would say it's probably even higher than
    90 percent.
    Are all of those pirates?
    Of course not.
    A good portion are though.

    When I was in FSU you could buy DVD with Windows, Photoshop, 'name your
    application in just about any computer store.
    All pirated.
    It's just the way it is.


    > I must admit though that I fail to see how he concludes that Windows users,
    > pirating Microsoft software, would make good Linux advocates.
    > He seems to have his argument totally about face.


    You miss the point.

    Maybe foist was a strong word, but what I am saying is that Linux is free
    yet people are willing to pirate Windows rather than use Linux.
    That's a powerful fact.



    > - one might say "He doesn't seem to know his arse from his elbow", in fact?


    One might say you mis-interpret what I am saying because you are allowing
    your zealot like behavior to cloud your judgment.

    BTW I didn't say one word of what you misquoted above....
    I'm just stating MY points.




    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  9. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 20:34:56 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:01:30 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>
    >>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive
    >>>>
    >>>> That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to
    >>>> have. Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come as
    >>>> no surprise.
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users
    >>> on the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?

    >>
    >> Companies are in business to make a profit.
    >> Stealing their works cuts into that profit and thus the shareholder's
    >> profits as well.
    >>

    >
    > Fair enough. But please don't give us lectures about morality. Or about
    > stealing, when Microsoft steal advantage over poor and ignorant Chinese by
    > pretending to offer them a square deal, when we all know that a square deal
    > is the very last thing that Microsoft will offer them.


    What are you talking about?
    Square deal?

    The product is for sale.
    You either buy it or you don't.

    What are you talking about?


    > And also don't give us lectures about stealing when Microsoft have always
    > stolen their work from others.


    Whatever.
    I knew that was coming because you guys can't have a single conversation
    without interjecting something about Microsoft being satan.


    >> Linux is free.
    >> They can use Linux if they want.
    >>

    >
    > Of course, which is what we are here to proclaim, and it's refreshing to
    > hear you endorse that message.


    So what's the problem?

    >> Sorry but your line of reasoning is, well, it's loony.
    >>

    >
    > Not sorry, but I really think that you have ended up contradicting yourself.



    No I haven't.
    I have taken your argument apart, you just have not realized it yet.

    It's very simple:

    1. Windows is a commercial product that comes with a licence.
    2. You are not forced to purchase it, espeicalluy in China where we have
    been hearing from the Linux community how Linux loaded laptops are sold
    very inexpensively.
    3. If you violate the terms, Microsoft is entitled to seek compensation.

    It's all very simple.

    If the Chinese people want to take the chance of pirating the software then
    they have also assume the risk of being caught.

    They can always use free Linux.

    But they don't.

    Why?


    >>
    >>> Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
    >>> personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
    >>> human rights of the Chinese?

    >>
    >>
    >> How about the cheap good they dump on the rest of the world?

    >
    > And Microsoft?


    But......... You keep telling me about how expensive Microsoft is and how
    the Chinese people cannot afford it so they pirate it.

    See how I am taking you apart?


    >> How about them playing with their currency?

    >
    > And the US doesn't?


    Not to the extent the Chinese are doing.
    It's on a massive scale.

    >> How about the chemical tainted food, toys etc they export?
    >>

    >
    > And of course the US is totally blameless in all these respects?


    When the Chinese are doing it to their own people yes.
    See baby formula for example.


    >>
    >> Linux is free.
    >> They can use Linux if they want.
    >>

    >
    > Yes, and please keep affirming this truth.


    So why don't they?
    Exactly what is wrong with Linux that makes people ignore it?


    >>>> Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.
    >>>
    >>> Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their
    >>> promise of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to
    >>> themselves.

    >>
    >> Linux is free.
    >> They can use Linux if they want.
    >>

    >
    > Again, this is so true, that I wonder why you continue to defend Microsoft.


    I'm not defending anyone.

    If Suse Server Linux or whatever their commercial offering was being
    pirated in China I would defend their right to compensation as well.


    >>
    >>>> Why?
    >>>> They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    >>>> anything and so forth.
    >>>
    >>> Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why do
    >>> they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? And why do they seek
    >>> to thrust their products on people by using the law?

    >>
    >> They seem to be able to afford cars, electronics etc .
    >>
    >> Besides:
    >>
    >> Linux is free.
    >> They can use Linux if they want.
    >>
    >> Nobody is forcing them to use Microsoft.
    >>

    >
    > Ah, but what if Microsoft have so contrived matters that they don't get to
    > know about Linux?


    But....... according to you these people cannot afford Windows and when you
    are in that position, free looks pretty good.

    Except when it is free Linux, apparently.

    Look, firefox is free and people use it.
    Why?
    Because it is better than IE.


    > Isn't that 'forcing?


    Nope.


    >>
    >>
    >>>>
    >>>> Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!
    >>>
    >>> No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in
    >>> the business!
    >>>
    >>> Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
    >>> particular Linux, is the way to go.

    >>
    >> Yet the Chinese pirate Windows en mass instead of using Linux.
    >>
    >> Why is that?

    >
    > Why do so many people in the West do the same?


    Good question.
    Come up with a solution and you will get rich.

    I'll get you started, compared to Windows Linux sucks.
    It really does.
    It gets better each year, and Microsoft is releasing less than stellar
    products like Vista which is encouraging those sick of Microsoft to go to
    Apple.

    They are certainly not going to desktop Linux.

    >>
    >> Nobody is forcing them top use Microsoft.
    >>

    >
    > See above.


    Yep.

    >> Linux is free.
    >> They can use Linux if they want.
    >>

    >
    > Well done. I think you're getting the message.
    >
    > And I think at last we agree:
    >
    > Linux is free. We don't have to use Windows. We can use Linux if we want.
    >
    > Now let's hear you say this over and over again in future.
    >
    > Because even if you don't, Microsoft themselves will continue to piss off
    > people all over the world and convince them that Open Source, and Linux in
    > particular, is the way to go.


    But yet, even in countries where people are poor, they still pirate Windows
    rather than use Linux.

    That says it all.


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  10. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 20:37:57 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:

    > bbgruff wrote:
    >
    >> Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>
    >>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive
    >>>>
    >>>> That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to
    >>>> have. Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come as
    >>>> no surprise.
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users
    >>> on the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?
    >>>
    >>> Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
    >>> personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
    >>> human rights of the Chinese?
    >>>
    >>>> Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.
    >>>
    >>> Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their
    >>> promise of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to
    >>> themselves.
    >>>
    >>>> Why?
    >>>> They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    >>>> anything and so forth.
    >>>
    >>> Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why do
    >>> they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? And why do they seek
    >>> to thrust their products on people by using the law?
    >>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!
    >>>
    >>> No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in
    >>> the business!
    >>>
    >>> Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
    >>> particular Linux, is the way to go.

    >>
    >> Excuse me if I'm butting in on a private argument Robin, but did Flatty
    >> just show in the above that 90% of WINDOWS users in China are "pirates",
    >> while NO Linux users in China are pirates, and simultaneously show that
    >> Linux users RESPECT the terms of their licence (GPL) while WINDOWS users
    >> (EULA) do NOT?
    >>
    >> I must admit though that I fail to see how he concludes that Windows
    >> users, pirating Microsoft software, would make good Linux advocates.
    >> He seems to have his argument totally about face.
    >>
    >> - one might say "He doesn't seem to know his arse from his elbow", in
    >> fact?

    >
    >
    > Please do join in, bbgruff, and let's all state the obvious for the benefit
    > of those who still don't get it yet.
    >
    > As Moshe says:
    >
    >
    > Linux is free.
    > They can use Linux if they want.
    >


    Yea, but they don't......
    If they did, especially in a place like China, Microsoft wouldn't have a
    problem with piracy.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  11. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    > But yet, even in countries where people are poor, they still pirate
    > Windows rather than use Linux.
    >
    > That says it all.
    >


    No it doesn't.

    There's more of a song and dance made by Microsoft when Windows gets pirated
    than when Linux gets pirated. Because, as you have so correctly pointed
    out:

    Linux is free.

    People can use Linux if they want.

    So you can't compare the numbers of people who prefer to pirate Windows with
    the numbers of people that prefer to pirate Linux, because people don't
    need to pirate Linux.


    --
    Facts are sacred ... but comment is free

  12. Re: [Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    On Oct 24, 4:37*pm, Robin T Cox wrote:
    > bbgruff wrote:
    > > Robin T Cox wrote:

    >
    > >> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    >
    > >>> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:

    >
    > >>>> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    >
    > >>> That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to
    > >>> have. Oh well, considering their human rights record this should comeas
    > >>> no surprise.

    >
    > >> Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users
    > >> on the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?

    >
    > >> Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
    > >> personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
    > >> human rights of the Chinese?

    >
    > >>> Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.

    >
    > >> Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their
    > >> promise of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to
    > >> themselves.

    >
    > >>> Why?
    > >>> They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
    > >>> anything and so forth.

    >
    > >> Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why do
    > >> they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? *And why do they seek
    > >> to thrust their products on people by using the law?

    >
    > >>> Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!

    >
    > >> No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in
    > >> the business!

    >
    > >> Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
    > >> particular Linux, is the way to go.

    >
    > > Excuse me if I'm butting in on a private argument Robin, but did Flatty
    > > just show in the above that 90% of WINDOWS users in China are "pirates",
    > > while NO Linux users in China are pirates, and simultaneously show that
    > > Linux users RESPECT the terms of their licence (GPL) while WINDOWS users
    > > (EULA) do NOT?

    >
    > > I must admit though that I fail to see how he concludes that Windows
    > > users, pirating Microsoft software, would make good Linux advocates.
    > > He seems to have his argument totally about face.

    >
    > > - one might say "He doesn't seem to know his arse from his elbow", in
    > > fact?

    >
    > Please do join in, bbgruff, and let's all state the obvious for the benefit
    > of those who still don't get it yet.
    >
    > As Moshe says:
    >
    >
    > Linux is free.
    > They can use Linux if they want.
    >

    >


    What about the fact that they'd rather take Microsoft to court instead
    of switching?

  13. Re: [Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    After takin' a swig o' grog, cc belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > On Oct 24, 4:37*pm, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>
    >> Please do join in, bbgruff, and let's all state the obvious for the benefit
    >> of those who still don't get it yet.
    >>
    >> As Moshe says:
    >>
    >>
    >> Linux is free.
    >> They can use Linux if they want.
    >>

    >
    > What about the fact that they'd rather take Microsoft to court instead
    > of switching?


    That's obvious, cc. There's a lot of infrastructure still dependent on
    Windows there.

    --
    The sooner you make your first 5000 mistakes, the sooner you will be
    able to correct them.
    -- Nicolaides

  14. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    On Sat, 25 Oct 2008 11:02:19 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> But yet, even in countries where people are poor, they still pirate
    >> Windows rather than use Linux.
    >>
    >> That says it all.
    >>


    You're all over the place HPT, err Robin...

    > No it doesn't.

    Yes it does.

    > There's more of a song and dance made by Microsoft when Windows gets pirated
    > than when Linux gets pirated. Because, as you have so correctly pointed
    > out:
    >
    > Linux is free.
    >
    > People can use Linux if they want.
    >
    > So you can't compare the numbers of people who prefer to pirate Windows with
    > the numbers of people that prefer to pirate Linux, because people don't
    > need to pirate Linux.


    I'm not comparing numbers.

    You've moved the goalposts in this discussion all over the place.

    I'm simply saying Linux is free, the people are poor (according to you) yet
    they seem to be willing to pirate Windows rather than use Linux.

    Why is that?


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  15. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    On Sat, 25 Oct 2008 05:53:57 -0600, High Plains Thumper wrote:

    > Robin T Cox wrote:
    >> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>
    >>> But yet, even in countries where people are poor, they still
    >>> pirate Windows rather than use Linux.

    >>
    >> Only according to Microsoft, who apparently also allege that
    >> everyone else has been stealing their patents, but refuse to
    >> say which.

    >
    > Obviously the Singapore Government wasn't very impressed with
    > Microsoft in 2004, when told this:
    >
    > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/11...inux_lawsuits/
    >
    > [quote]
    > Use Linux and you will be sued, Ballmer tells governments
    > Lawsuit doom over 228 'stolen' patents predicted

    And do you actually think some Chinese person buying a pirated copy of
    Windows from a kiosk on main street in Beijing cares about this?

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  16. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    > High Plains Thumper wrote:
    >> Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> But yet, even in countries where people are poor, they
    >>>> still pirate Windows rather than use Linux.
    >>>
    >>> Only according to Microsoft, who apparently also allege
    >>> that everyone else has been stealing their patents, but
    >>> refuse to say which.

    >>
    >> Obviously the Singapore Government wasn't very impressed
    >> with Microsoft in 2004, when told this:
    >>
    >> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/11...inux_lawsuits/
    >>
    >> [quote] Use Linux and you will be sued, Ballmer tells
    >> governments Lawsuit doom over 228 'stolen' patents predicted
    >>

    > And do you actually think some Chinese person buying a pirated
    > copy of Windows from a kiosk on main street in Beijing cares
    > about this?


    Legitimate user in China is concerned about this. Even users in US:

    http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/m...ves/152210.asp

    (I should also add that Windows Genuine Advantage has upset users
    in the U.S. too. Microsoft was sued in June 2006 by a user who
    alleged that the company didn't adequately disclose details of
    the tool when it was delivered to PC users through the company's
    Automatic Update system. And last summer, a Windows Genuine
    Advantage malfunction led some machines with legitimate software
    to slip into a "reduced functionality mode").
    --
    HPT
    Quando omni flunkus moritati
    (If all else fails, play dead)
    - "Red" Green

  17. Re: [News][Rival] China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    > Robin T Cox wrote:
    >> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>
    >>> But yet, even in countries where people are poor, they
    >>> still pirate Windows rather than use Linux.
    >>>
    >>> That says it all.

    >
    > You're all over the place HPT, err Robin...


    Oh, I see! So RTC is HPT? Pfffffhhht ..... Bwaaaahaaahaaa!
    Now I have to clean the coffee spray off my monitor! This
    is killing me! The illiteracy is astounding!

    --
    HPT
    Quando omni flunkus moritati
    (If all else fails, play dead)
    - "Red" Green

  18. Re: China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive

    On Oct 25, 11:53*am, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    > After takin' a swig o' grog, cc belched out
    > * this bit o' wisdom:
    >
    > > On Oct 24, 4:37*pm, Robin T Cox wrote:

    >
    > >> Please do join in, bbgruff, and let's all state the obvious for the benefit
    > >> of those who still don't get it yet.

    >
    > >> As Moshe says:

    >
    > >>
    > >> Linux is free.
    > >> They can use Linux if they want.
    > >>

    >
    > > What about the fact that they'd rather take Microsoft to court instead
    > > of switching?

    >
    > That's obvious, cc. *There's a lot of infrastructure still dependent on
    > Windows there.
    >


    Taking Microsoft to court to make the pirated copies legal won't
    change that.

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