Outright jealousy? - Linux

This is a discussion on Outright jealousy? - Linux ; http://dunedin.lug.net.nz/forums/arc.../t-291286.html Scroll to the bottom. > Then, when you add the need for documentation, document-routing > paperwork, bug-tracking, requirements cleanup, All wonderfully interesting. You should write a book. You are so knowledgeable. > Finally, studies have shown that there are ...

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  1. Outright jealousy?

    http://dunedin.lug.net.nz/forums/arc.../t-291286.html

    Scroll to the bottom.

    > Then, when you add the need for documentation, document-routing
    > paperwork, bug-tracking, requirements cleanup,


    All wonderfully interesting. You should write a book. You are so
    knowledgeable.

    > Finally, studies have shown that there are great differences
    > between developers. So count yourself lucky, Tim.


    STOP PRESS! Liarnut acknowledges not all developers are of the same
    ability! Wow! He is the new Messiah!

    *snip more bull**** from Liarnut explaining the bleeding obvious*

    Wow. You can read more of Hadron's civil interactions with other honest
    posters at the link.

    --
    `Just the place for a Snark!' the Bellman cried,
    As he landed his crew with care;
    Supporting each man on the top of the tide
    By a finger entwined in his hair.
    'Just the place for a Snark! I have said it twice:
    That alone should encourage the crew.
    Just the place for a Snark! I have said it thrice:
    What I tell you three times is true.'

  2. Re: Outright jealousy?

    Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    > http://dunedin.lug.net.nz/forums/arc.../t-291286.html
    >
    > Scroll to the bottom.
    >
    > > Then, when you add the need for documentation, document-routing
    > > paperwork, bug-tracking, requirements cleanup,

    >
    > All wonderfully interesting. You should write a book. You are so
    > knowledgeable.
    >
    > > Finally, studies have shown that there are great differences
    > > between developers. So count yourself lucky, Tim.

    >
    > STOP PRESS! Liarnut acknowledges not all developers are of the same
    > ability! Wow! He is the new Messiah!
    >
    > *snip more bull**** from Liarnut explaining the bleeding obvious*
    >
    > Wow. You can read more of Hadron's civil interactions with other honest
    > posters at the link.
    >


    There is something seriously wrong with the people in
    Amityville.Linux.Advocacy. Several of them truly need to be locked away
    in an asylum. There seems to be a link tossing contest happening in this
    chicken-**** NG. It's ridiculous.

  3. Re: Outright jealousy?

    On Oct 21, 8:33 am, Linux Pimps wrote:
    > Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    > > http://dunedin.lug.net.nz/forums/arc.../t-291286.html

    >


    [scrolled to the bottom for brevity :-) ]

    > There is something seriously wrong with the people in
    > Amityville.Linux.Advocacy. Several of them truly need to be locked away
    > in an asylum. There seems to be a link tossing contest happening in this
    > chicken-**** NG. It's ridiculous.


    And off-charter. We should be discussing the shortcomings and
    advantages of Linux and its derived works (such as Ubuntu, Debian,
    and of course my favorite distro Gentoo :-) ), not the shortcomings
    and advantages of posters and whether they should be locked
    in a rubber room or not. :-P

    Ideally, some of us would address Linux's and derived works'
    shortcomings as well, assuming they are sufficiently well-documented
    to do so (some posts here posit freezes and hangs, for example,
    but are less than clear as to what has been done to troubleshoot
    them apart from reinstalling or rebooting; perhaps a good quality
    voltmeter might be of assistance?)

    And then there are general issues such as Apache's relative insecurity
    (as
    documented anyway by zone-h.org, which I for one have not
    previously known of; these security issues may also need addressing,
    though ideally not here (though since Apache is a popular solution on
    top of Linux one might consider it for inclusion in an auxiliary
    thread or two).

    And then there's Vista; Google, when searching for
    "zone-h apache security breakdown", coughed up
    http://www.blumer.com.ar/category/Security.aspx
    whose second article is about zone-h (it's little more than
    a mention that it exists, admittedly), but whose *first* article,
    at least as of this writing, mentions a video
    that purports to give a cracker access to any Vista installation
    without even the requirement of a valid login into the box.

    The video is relatively useless, as the Vista volume is
    obviously unencrypted[*], but illustrates why dual-booting can
    be very dangerous in production environments. Basically,
    the cracker boots any Livedisc capable of editing Vista's
    NTFS, moves Utilman.exe to Utilman.old and copies cmd.exe
    to Utilman.exe, shutsdown, and reboots. As the video helpfully
    states at the end, it's game over at that point, and would
    probably work on a number of machines, but not with Bitlocker
    installed (though another video, requiring physical access to
    the box and more specialized software, might compromise that
    too).

    Is there a similar crack for Linux? For unencrypted volumes,
    yes; it's probably easiest just to use a Livedisc and
    execute something like the following procedure.
    (We assume the cracker has half a clue as to where the
    root partition is, but at worst he'd just try them all
    until he finds the right one.)

    (boot LiveDisc)
    # mount /dev/hdax /mnt/system
    # chroot /mnt/system /bin/bash
    # vi /etc/shadow
    (wipe out root's old encrypted password)
    # passwd
    New UNIX Password:
    Retype new UNIX Password:
    # exit
    logout
    # unmount /dev/hdax
    # reboot

    Say goodnight, Gracie. [+]

    There are a number of ways to forestall such obvious attacks;
    the simplest arguably is to lock down the BIOS and the boot
    loader so that dualbooting is not possible. Of course, one can then
    poke around in the innards with a paperclip if one's sufficiently
    technical,
    but at least it keeps the honest folk honest.

    But I digress.
    [*] unfortunately, only Vista Ultimate and Vista Enterprise offer
    Bitlocker.
    No doubt third parties might jump in at some point, if they haven't
    already.

    [+] depending on the cracker's intent, he might not edit /etc/shadow,
    but dink around in other areas, such as the crontab, startup scripts,
    and what not. Clearly this is not a Linux-specific attack, either; if
    the Livedisc understands FreeBSD, he can do similar edits
    to FreeBSD's files.

    (Teranews is malfunctioning again; I can view but not post.)

  4. Re: Outright jealousy?

    After takin' a swig o' grog, The Ghost In The Machine belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > On Oct 21, 8:33 am, Linux Pimps wrote:
    >> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    >> > http://dunedin.lug.net.nz/forums/arc.../t-291286.html

    >>

    >
    > [scrolled to the bottom for brevity :-) ]
    >
    >> There is something seriously wrong with the people in
    >> Amityville.Linux.Advocacy. Several of them truly need to be locked away
    >> in an asylum. There seems to be a link tossing contest happening in this
    >> chicken-**** NG. It's ridiculous.

    >
    > And off-charter. We should be discussing the shortcomings and
    > advantages of Linux and its derived works (such as Ubuntu, Debian,
    > and of course my favorite distro Gentoo :-) ), not the shortcomings
    > and advantages of posters and whether they should be locked
    > in a rubber room or not. :-P


    Trying to hijack my thread, huh Ghost?

    --
    What I mean (and everybody else means) by the word QUALITY cannot be
    broken down into subjects and predicates. This is not because Quality
    is so mysterious but because Quality is so simple, immediate, and direct.
    -- R. Pirsig, "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance"

  5. Re: Outright jealousy?

    After takin' a swig o' grog, the Linux Pimps idiot belched out
    this bit o' fsckwittery:

    > Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    >> http://dunedin.lug.net.nz/forums/arc.../t-291286.html
    >>
    >> Wow. You can read more of Hadron's civil interactions with other honest
    >> posters at the link.

    >
    > There is something seriously wrong with the people in
    > Amityville.Linux.Advocacy. Several of them truly need to be locked away
    > in an asylum. There seems to be a link tossing contest happening in this
    > chicken-**** NG. It's ridiculous.


    Don't worry, you're just as ridiculous.

    --
    Seeing is believing. You wouldn't have seen it if you hadn't believed it.

  6. Re: Outright jealousy?

    Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    > After takin' a swig o' grog, the Linux Pimps idiot belched out
    > this bit o' fsckwittery:
    >
    >> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
    >>> http://dunedin.lug.net.nz/forums/arc.../t-291286.html
    >>>
    >>> Wow. You can read more of Hadron's civil interactions with other honest
    >>> posters at the link.

    >> There is something seriously wrong with the people in
    >> Amityville.Linux.Advocacy. Several of them truly need to be locked away
    >> in an asylum. There seems to be a link tossing contest happening in this
    >> chicken-**** NG. It's ridiculous.

    >
    > Don't worry, you're just as ridiculous.
    >


    Did I get a rise out of you Linux-Pimp? Did I pull you to the surface? :-P

    You are weak, you and your kill-filters. You lied through your lying
    teeth.




  7. Re: Outright jealousy?

    On 2008-10-21, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
    >
    > Is there a similar crack for Linux? For unencrypted volumes,
    > yes; it's probably easiest just to use a Livedisc and
    > execute something like the following procedure.
    > (We assume the cracker has half a clue as to where the
    > root partition is, but at worst he'd just try them all
    > until he finds the right one.)
    >
    > (boot LiveDisc)
    > # mount /dev/hdax /mnt/system
    > # chroot /mnt/system /bin/bash
    > # vi /etc/shadow
    > (wipe out root's old encrypted password)
    > # passwd
    > New UNIX Password:
    > Retype new UNIX Password:
    > # exit
    > logout
    > # unmount /dev/hdax
    > # reboot
    >
    > Say goodnight, Gracie. [+]
    >
    > There are a number of ways to forestall such obvious attacks;
    > the simplest arguably is to lock down the BIOS and the boot
    > loader so that dualbooting is not possible. Of course, one can then
    > poke around in the innards with a paperclip if one's sufficiently
    > technical,
    > but at least it keeps the honest folk honest.


    Hmmm.. another way to protect a machine from this type of crack is to
    lock the ****ing machine away so that physical access is restricted, or
    to remove the CD-ROM and lockdown the BIOS (using password) so that the
    machine cannot boot from USB.

    Problem solved.

    > But I digress.


    I'm SHOCKED!

    Ghost is digressing... quick...smelling...salts.....

    --
    Regards,

    Gregory.
    Gentoo Linux - Penguin Power

  8. Re: Outright jealousy?

    On Oct 21, 2:24 pm, Gregory Shearman wrote:
    > On 2008-10-21, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > > Is there a similar crack for Linux? For unencrypted volumes,
    > > yes; it's probably easiest just to use a Livedisc and
    > > execute something like the following procedure.
    > > (We assume the cracker has half a clue as to where the
    > > root partition is, but at worst he'd just try them all
    > > until he finds the right one.)

    >
    > > (boot LiveDisc)
    > > # mount /dev/hdax /mnt/system
    > > # chroot /mnt/system /bin/bash
    > > # vi /etc/shadow
    > > (wipe out root's old encrypted password)
    > > # passwd
    > > New UNIX Password:
    > > Retype new UNIX Password:
    > > # exit
    > > logout
    > > # unmount /dev/hdax
    > > # reboot

    >
    > > Say goodnight, Gracie. [+]

    >
    > > There are a number of ways to forestall such obvious attacks;
    > > the simplest arguably is to lock down the BIOS and the boot
    > > loader so that dualbooting is not possible. Of course, one can then
    > > poke around in the innards with a paperclip if one's sufficiently
    > > technical,
    > > but at least it keeps the honest folk honest.

    >
    > Hmmm.. another way to protect a machine from this type of crack is to
    > lock the ****ing machine away so that physical access is restricted, or
    > to remove the CD-ROM and lockdown the BIOS (using password) so that the
    > machine cannot boot from USB.


    I believe I already said part of that, but you're correct; put the
    thing in
    a cage and control access to a server. For a desktop, this isn't
    quite as simple to accomplish.

    >
    > Problem solved.
    >
    > > But I digress.

    >
    > I'm SHOCKED!
    >
    > Ghost is digressing... quick...smelling...salts.....


    Oh dear. Um....anyone know an available medic? :-)

    [.sigsnip]

  9. Re: Outright jealousy?

    On 2008-10-21, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
    > On Oct 21, 2:24 pm, Gregory Shearman wrote:
    >> On 2008-10-21, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
    >>
    >> > There are a number of ways to forestall such obvious attacks;
    >> > the simplest arguably is to lock down the BIOS and the boot
    >> > loader so that dualbooting is not possible. Of course, one can then
    >> > poke around in the innards with a paperclip if one's sufficiently
    >> > technical,
    >> > but at least it keeps the honest folk honest.

    >>
    >> Hmmm.. another way to protect a machine from this type of crack is to
    >> lock the ****ing machine away so that physical access is restricted, or
    >> to remove the CD-ROM and lockdown the BIOS (using password) so that the
    >> machine cannot boot from USB.

    >
    > I believe I already said part of that, but you're correct; put the
    > thing in
    > a cage and control access to a server. For a desktop, this isn't
    > quite as simple to accomplish.


    Hmmmm... a thin client model would work. Allow USB mass storage
    connections but don't allow the machine to boot from the USB. Don't
    allow a CDROM or don't allow booting from CDROM. Lock down the BIOS
    settings with a password.

    I'm sure there'll still be some arsehole that will get around the
    protections but... that's part of the "cold war" between
    whitehats/blackhats.

    >> > But I digress.

    >>
    >> I'm SHOCKED!
    >>
    >> Ghost is digressing... quick...smelling...salts.....

    >
    > Oh dear. Um....anyone know an available medic? :-)


    It's OK, mate. I'm fine now. Just keep those shocks to a
    minimum. 8-)

    You must admit that you don't often stay strictly to topic. I'm not
    saying that I always stay on topic.

    --
    Regards,

    Gregory.
    Gentoo Linux - Penguin Power

  10. Re: Linux security thread hijack

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Gregory Shearman belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > On 2008-10-21, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
    >> On Oct 21, 2:24 pm, Gregory Shearman wrote:
    >>> On 2008-10-21, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
    >>>
    >>> > There are a number of ways to forestall such obvious attacks;
    >>> > the simplest arguably is to lock down the BIOS and the boot
    >>> > loader so that dualbooting is not possible. Of course, one can then
    >>> > poke around in the innards with a paperclip if one's sufficiently
    >>> > technical,
    >>> > but at least it keeps the honest folk honest.
    >>>
    >>> Hmmm.. another way to protect a machine from this type of crack is to
    >>> lock the ****ing machine away so that physical access is restricted, or
    >>> to remove the CD-ROM and lockdown the BIOS (using password) so that the
    >>> machine cannot boot from USB.

    >>
    >> I believe I already said part of that, but you're correct; put the
    >> thing in
    >> a cage and control access to a server. For a desktop, this isn't
    >> quite as simple to accomplish.

    >
    > Hmmmm... a thin client model would work. Allow USB mass storage
    > connections but don't allow the machine to boot from the USB. Don't
    > allow a CDROM or don't allow booting from CDROM. Lock down the BIOS
    > settings with a password.
    >
    > I'm sure there'll still be some arsehole that will get around the
    > protections but... that's part of the "cold war" between
    > whitehats/blackhats.
    >
    >
    >
    > You must admit that you don't often stay strictly to topic. I'm not
    > saying that I always stay on topic.


    Subject change to reflect thread hijack. (The original thread started
    by the OP was stupid.)

    --
    The sourceforge approach is to place all of the projects in some bland
    "open source surburbia", where all of the houses are alike, with only the
    colors and minor style variations (which building plan was used for which
    particular house) are allowed by the restrictive covenants and local
    zoning laws. Sourceforege is the open source equivalent of the
    subdivision in the movie "Edward Scissorhands".
    -- Terry Lambert

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