Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves. - Linux

This is a discussion on Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves. - Linux ; "Chris Ahlstrom" wrote in message news:bH_Kk.44670$IB6.22893@bignews8.bellsouth.net. .. > After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out > this bit o' wisdom: > >> On Sun, 19 Oct 2008 16:40:45 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom scribbled down: >> >>> After takin' a ...

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Thread: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves.

  1. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)


    "Chris Ahlstrom" wrote in message
    news:bH_Kk.44670$IB6.22893@bignews8.bellsouth.net. ..
    > After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    > this bit o' wisdom:
    >
    >> On Sun, 19 Oct 2008 16:40:45 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom scribbled down:
    >>
    >>> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >>> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>>
    >>>> S:\Software\ImageMagic>dir conv* iden*
    >>>
    >>> S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?

    >>
    >> It's a network drive that's mounted locally as S: ('S' is for Server)
    >>
    >> Easier than \\Server-name\Public\Software\....

    >
    > Not easier than not having to change to the S: drive and the actual
    > location of the executable, because the installer did not add yet
    > another entry to your %PATH%.


    The software was never installed on any of the machines in the house. It was
    simply copied out to the server and I'm basically the only person who uses
    this. It's not like the wife or kids are going to run CLI apps from the
    console to do any sort of image manipulation.




  2. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)


    "Mark Kent" wrote in message
    news:as7us5-2c8.ln1@ellandroad.demon.co.uk...
    > Chris Ahlstrom espoused:
    >> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>
    >>> S:\Software\ImageMagic>dir conv* iden*

    >>
    >> S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?
    >>

    >
    > Not DOS, CPM... it was CPM which introduced the drive letters, and DOS
    > was developed from CPM.


    It was *NOT* CPM which introduced drive letters.


    > Drive letters are a 1970s anachronism, rather like the concept of the
    > "desktop".


    And just like the "desktop" - it's still alive and well.


    > --
    > | mark at ellandroad dot demon dot co dot uk |
    > | Cola faq: http://www.faqs.org/faqs/linux/advocacy/faq-and-primer/ |
    > | Cola trolls: http://colatrolls.blogspot.com/ |
    > | Open platforms prevent vendor lock-in. Own your Own services! |
    >




  3. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    Ezekiel wrote:

    >
    > "Mark Kent" wrote in message
    > news:as7us5-2c8.ln1@ellandroad.demon.co.uk...
    >> Chris Ahlstrom espoused:
    >>> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >>> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>>
    >>>> S:\Software\ImageMagic>dir conv* iden*
    >>>
    >>> S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?
    >>>

    >>
    >> Not DOS, CPM... it was CPM which introduced the drive letters, and DOS
    >> was developed from CPM.

    >
    > It was *NOT* CPM which introduced drive letters.
    >


    BDOS function 14 (DRV_SET) - Select disc
    Supported by: All versions
    Entered with C=0Eh, E=drive number. Returns L=A=0 or 0FFh.
    The drive number passed to this routine is 0 for A:, 1 for B: up to 15 for
    P:.
    Sets the currently selected drive to the drive in A; logs in the disc.
    Returns 0 if successful or 0FFh if error. Under MP/M II and later versions,
    H can contain a physical error number.


    CP/M certainly used drive letters. Before MS-DOS did

    >> Drive letters are a 1970s anachronism, rather like the concept of the
    >> "desktop".

    >
    > And just like the "desktop" - it's still alive and well.
    >


    Well, windows keeps on using such sillyness

    --
    Proposed Additions to the PDP-11 Instruction Set:

    BBW Branch Both Ways
    BEW Branch Either Way
    BBBF Branch on Bit Bucket Full
    BH Branch and Hang


  4. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    Ezekiel wrote:

    >
    > "Chris Ahlstrom" wrote in message
    > news:bH_Kk.44670$IB6.22893@bignews8.bellsouth.net. ..
    >> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>
    >>> On Sun, 19 Oct 2008 16:40:45 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom scribbled down:
    >>>
    >>>> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >>>> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>>>
    >>>>> S:\Software\ImageMagic>dir conv* iden*
    >>>>
    >>>> S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?
    >>>
    >>> It's a network drive that's mounted locally as S: ('S' is for Server)
    >>>
    >>> Easier than \\Server-name\Public\Software\....

    >>
    >> Not easier than not having to change to the S: drive and the actual
    >> location of the executable, because the installer did not add yet
    >> another entry to your %PATH%.

    >
    > The software was never installed on any of the machines in the house. It
    > was simply copied out to the server and I'm basically the only person who
    > uses this. It's not like the wife or kids are going to run CLI apps from
    > the console to do any sort of image manipulation.


    Doesn't matter. The constructs windows uses (drive letter or
    \\Server-name\...) are simply anachronistic.
    --
    The UNIX Guru`s view of Sex:
    unzip; strip; touch; finger; mount; fsck; more; yes; umount; sleep


  5. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)


    "Peter Köhlmann" wrote in message
    news:48fca1bf$0$13397$9b4e6d93@newsspool4.arcor-online.net...
    > Ezekiel wrote:
    >
    >>
    >> "Mark Kent" wrote in message
    >> news:as7us5-2c8.ln1@ellandroad.demon.co.uk...
    >>> Chris Ahlstrom espoused:
    >>>> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >>>> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>>>
    >>>>> S:\Software\ImageMagic>dir conv* iden*
    >>>>
    >>>> S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Not DOS, CPM... it was CPM which introduced the drive letters, and DOS
    >>> was developed from CPM.

    >>
    >> It was *NOT* CPM which introduced drive letters.
    >>

    >
    > BDOS function 14 (DRV_SET) - Select disc
    > Supported by: All versions
    > Entered with C=0Eh, E=drive number. Returns L=A=0 or 0FFh.
    > The drive number passed to this routine is 0 for A:, 1 for B: up to 15 for
    > P:.
    > Sets the currently selected drive to the drive in A; logs in the disc.
    > Returns 0 if successful or 0FFh if error. Under MP/M II and later
    > versions,
    > H can contain a physical error number.
    >
    >
    > CP/M certainly used drive letters. Before MS-DOS did


    Clearly you are not very good at reading. Read it again and ask your bigger
    sister for help if you need it.

    I never said that CPM didn't have drive letters because it certainly did.
    But it was *NOT* CPM which introduced drive letters. Free hint - drive
    letters existed before CPM so therefor it wasn't CPM that "introduced" drive
    letters.



    >>> Drive letters are a 1970s anachronism, rather like the concept of the
    >>> "desktop".

    >>
    >> And just like the "desktop" - it's still alive and well.
    >>

    >
    > Well, windows keeps on using such sillyness


    The concept of directories also existed in CPM and they are still used.


    > --
    > Proposed Additions to the PDP-11 Instruction Set:
    >
    > BBW Branch Both Ways
    > BEW Branch Either Way
    > BBBF Branch on Bit Bucket Full
    > BH Branch and Hang
    >




  6. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    Mark Kent writes:

    > Chris Ahlstrom espoused:
    >> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>
    >>> S:\Software\ImageMagic>dir conv* iden*

    >>
    >> S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?
    >>

    >
    > Not DOS, CPM... it was CPM which introduced the drive letters, and DOS
    > was developed from CPM.


    Total and utter nonsense. Drive letters were in use about 10 years
    before CP/M existed.

    And DOS was not developed from CP/M. 86 Dos was a clone of CPM. Totally
    different things. This 86 DOS became the basis for MSDOS,

    >
    > Drive letters are a 1970s anachronism, rather like the concept of the
    > "desktop".


    Oh god. Here he goes ....

    --
    "At BT Global, our crown jewels are the services we supply to our
    customers. With jNetX we own the intellectual property for our
    services, allowing us to evolve the services as and when required."
    Mark Kent,Head of Technology Strategy,COLA Hypocrite

  7. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    "Ezekiel" writes:

    > "Peter Köhlmann" wrote in message
    > news:48fca1bf$0$13397$9b4e6d93@newsspool4.arcor-online.net...
    >> Ezekiel wrote:
    >>
    >>>
    >>> "Mark Kent" wrote in message
    >>> news:as7us5-2c8.ln1@ellandroad.demon.co.uk...
    >>>> Chris Ahlstrom espoused:
    >>>>> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >>>>> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> S:\Software\ImageMagic>dir conv* iden*
    >>>>>
    >>>>> S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Not DOS, CPM... it was CPM which introduced the drive letters, and DOS
    >>>> was developed from CPM.
    >>>
    >>> It was *NOT* CPM which introduced drive letters.
    >>>

    >>
    >> BDOS function 14 (DRV_SET) - Select disc
    >> Supported by: All versions
    >> Entered with C=0Eh, E=drive number. Returns L=A=0 or 0FFh.
    >> The drive number passed to this routine is 0 for A:, 1 for B: up to 15 for
    >> P:.
    >> Sets the currently selected drive to the drive in A; logs in the disc.
    >> Returns 0 if successful or 0FFh if error. Under MP/M II and later
    >> versions,
    >> H can contain a physical error number.
    >>
    >>
    >> CP/M certainly used drive letters. Before MS-DOS did

    >
    > Clearly you are not very good at reading. Read it again and ask your bigger
    > sister for help if you need it.



    Prepare for a deluge of COLA gang posts to drown out your, correct,
    position.

  8. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    Ezekiel wrote:

    >
    > "Peter Köhlmann" wrote in message
    > news:48fca1bf$0$13397$9b4e6d93@newsspool4.arcor-online.net...
    >> Ezekiel wrote:
    >>
    >>>
    >>> "Mark Kent" wrote in message
    >>> news:as7us5-2c8.ln1@ellandroad.demon.co.uk...
    >>>> Chris Ahlstrom espoused:
    >>>>> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >>>>> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> S:\Software\ImageMagic>dir conv* iden*
    >>>>>
    >>>>> S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Not DOS, CPM... it was CPM which introduced the drive letters, and DOS
    >>>> was developed from CPM.
    >>>
    >>> It was *NOT* CPM which introduced drive letters.
    >>>

    >>
    >> BDOS function 14 (DRV_SET) - Select disc
    >> Supported by: All versions
    >> Entered with C=0Eh, E=drive number. Returns L=A=0 or 0FFh.
    >> The drive number passed to this routine is 0 for A:, 1 for B: up to 15
    >> for P:.
    >> Sets the currently selected drive to the drive in A; logs in the disc.
    >> Returns 0 if successful or 0FFh if error. Under MP/M II and later
    >> versions,
    >> H can contain a physical error number.
    >>
    >>
    >> CP/M certainly used drive letters. Before MS-DOS did

    >
    > Clearly you are not very good at reading. Read it again and ask your
    > bigger sister for help if you need it.
    >
    > I never said that CPM didn't have drive letters because it certainly did.
    > But it was *NOT* CPM which introduced drive letters.


    CP/M was the first "OS" on PC-size machines which did

    > Free hint - drive
    > letters existed before CPM so therefor it wasn't CPM that "introduced"
    > drive letters.


    IBMs VM certainly wasn't for Z80 mychines


    --
    "...Unix, MS-DOS, and Windows NT (also known as the Good, the Bad, and
    the Ugly)." (By Matt Welsh)


  9. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)


    "Peter Köhlmann" wrote in message
    news:48fca7a1$0$13387$9b4e6d93@newsspool4.arcor-online.net...
    > Ezekiel wrote:
    >
    >>
    >> "Peter Khlmann" wrote in message
    >> news:48fca1bf$0$13397$9b4e6d93@newsspool4.arcor-online.net...
    >>> Ezekiel wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>
    >>>> "Mark Kent" wrote in message
    >>>> news:as7us5-2c8.ln1@ellandroad.demon.co.uk...
    >>>>> Chris Ahlstrom espoused:
    >>>>>> After takin' a swig o' grog, Ezekiel belched out
    >>>>>> this bit o' wisdom:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>> S:\Software\ImageMagic>dir conv* iden*
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Not DOS, CPM... it was CPM which introduced the drive letters, and
    >>>>> DOS
    >>>>> was developed from CPM.
    >>>>
    >>>> It was *NOT* CPM which introduced drive letters.
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> BDOS function 14 (DRV_SET) - Select disc
    >>> Supported by: All versions
    >>> Entered with C=0Eh, E=drive number. Returns L=A=0 or 0FFh.
    >>> The drive number passed to this routine is 0 for A:, 1 for B: up to 15
    >>> for P:.
    >>> Sets the currently selected drive to the drive in A; logs in the disc.
    >>> Returns 0 if successful or 0FFh if error. Under MP/M II and later
    >>> versions,
    >>> H can contain a physical error number.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> CP/M certainly used drive letters. Before MS-DOS did

    >>
    >> Clearly you are not very good at reading. Read it again and ask your
    >> bigger sister for help if you need it.
    >>
    >> I never said that CPM didn't have drive letters because it certainly did.
    >> But it was *NOT* CPM which introduced drive letters.

    >
    > CP/M was the first "OS" on PC-size machines which did


    Who the hell is talking about "PC-size" machines? If you need extra help
    moving those goal posts I'm sure Mark Kent will give you a hand.

    The original statement was:
    "it was CPM which introduced the drive letters, and..."

    My response that it wasn't CPM that "introduced" driver letters. Neither
    statement qualified that this had to be for "PC-size" machines, it's about
    "drive letters" and not the size of the box.



    >> Free hint - drive
    >> letters existed before CPM so therefor it wasn't CPM that "introduced"
    >> drive letters.

    >
    > IBMs VM certainly wasn't for Z80 mychines


    Who cares. It's about who "introduced driver letters" and not the CPU or how
    big the box is. Now is about the time to call in some more advocates - those
    goal posts you're trying to move seem rather heavy.


    > --
    > "...Unix, MS-DOS, and Windows NT (also known as the Good, the Bad, and
    > the Ugly)." (By Matt Welsh)
    >




  10. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    On Sun, 19 Oct 2008 17:50:31 GMT
    TomB wrote:

    > > Surprisingly, the latter form of thinking is far more productive.
    > > I am sure that Windows supports command line pipelining, but that
    > > doesn't mean that it's something that a Windows user is going to
    > > think of using. Even with something like Cygwin installed and the
    > > GNU utilities, pipelines are very costly under Windows. I wouldn't
    > > dream of using them there. It'd be like running a ./configure
    > > script and then putting a pot of coffee on; you'll have a nice cup
    > > of java before you get your time to run "make". (Note that I'm
    > > talking about WinXP on a single-core system from ~4 years ago;
    > > maybe Vista actually does these things better? but I wouldn't hold
    > > my breath to try to find out, even my part-time Windows-using
    > > girlfriend refuses to use Vista.)

    >
    > As a matter of fact I think cygwin runs pretty smooth on my 5 yrs. old
    > P-IV with XP at work. It's not the real deal, but recently I quite
    > comfortably compiled libdvdread and lsdvd under cygwin.


    Ahh, yes...

    I seem to recall the problems being in the recompiling of the GCC
    toolchain and some other "large" (relatively speaking) software. Took
    me _forever_ (wall-clock time, anyway) relative to doing a
    cross-compile on a GNU/Linux system.

    --- Mike

    --
    My sigfile ran away and is on hiatus.


  11. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    On Sun, 19 Oct 2008 16:40:45 -0400
    Chris Ahlstrom wrote:

    > S drive. LOL. When you Windozers gonna leave DOS behind?


    DOS will never completely die.

    My girlfriend has a laptop without a working optical drive. She wanted
    me to make it a dual-boot system with XP and Ubuntu. Now, Ubuntu is
    pretty easy: I have my network server which is capable of serving the
    Ubuntu installer environment by way of PXE.

    Windows XP on the other hand, was not quite so simple. I recalled from
    years ago that Windows XP can be bootstrapped via DOS when there is no
    other suitable option. However, DOS 7.x (which is what comes on
    "system disks" that you format using Windows) can't see her hard drive
    at all. So, I took my FreeDOS 1.0 CD and used it to create a USB stick
    that boots up with a few different utilities on it, and the "i386"
    folder from the XP CD. Using FreeDOS, LBACACHE, and 32-bit GNU cp, I
    was able to put the i386 directory on the laptop's hard drive and
    bootstrap the installer.

    A few caveats, though.

    The "WINNT.EXE" program cannot be run from the USB stick, since it gets
    the C: designation. Not a big deal, that just means that the directory
    has to be moved over to the hard drive and then the hard drive has to
    have FreeDOS booted on it before starting the installer.

    While FreeDOS can work with a ~200 GiB partition using FAT32, the
    WINNT.EXE XP bootstrap program for DOS cannot. It sees the partition
    has having a negative number of bytes free (while FreeDOS itself sees an
    accurate count of the free space). So, I had to make the partition ~20
    GiB, and during the XP installation, convert it to NTFS. Not a huge
    deal, but annoying, since I'll have to grow the partition and the
    filesystem to a more reasonable size for her later.

    Also, the process is a (little bit) slow. That's to be expected since
    it's bootstrapping itself from DOS. At least FreeDOS gives GNU cp the
    entire 2.5 GB of RAM to work with... Microsoft DOS's HIMEM.SYS only
    goes up to somewhere around 512 MB.

    GPL'd software for the win!

    --- Mike

    --
    My sigfile ran away and is on hiatus.


  12. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 17:20:30 +0200
    Peter Köhlmann wrote:

    > Well, windows keeps on using such sillyness


    To be fair, modern versions of Windows support two methods of accessing
    drives: classic-style drive letters (which is the default for A:, C:,
    and hot-plugged devices) and Unix-style "mount points". IIRC mount
    points are only supported, however, on NTFS file systems; I don't know
    why that limitation exists(ed?).

    --- Mike

    --
    My sigfile ran away and is on hiatus.


  13. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)


    "Michael B. Trausch" wrote in message
    news:20081020120830.3150cec9@zest...
    On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 17:20:30 +0200
    Peter Köhlmann wrote:

    >> Well, windows keeps on using such sillyness

    >
    >To be fair, modern versions of Windows support two methods of accessing
    >drives: classic-style drive letters (which is the default for A:, C:,
    >and hot-plugged devices) and Unix-style "mount points".


    Correct. NTFS has supported mount points since one of the Win2k service
    packs IIRC. However this isn't made obvious to most users who are familiar
    with and prefer drive letters.


    > IIRC mount points are only supported, however, on NTFS file systems;
    > I don't know why that limitation exists(ed?).


    Since NTFS is about the only filesystem that MS supports. There really isn't
    any sense for them to go and retrofit FAT/FAT32 to support mount points.



  14. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 12:15:36 -0400
    "Ezekiel" wrote:

    > > IIRC mount points are only supported, however, on NTFS file systems;
    > > I don't know why that limitation exists(ed?).

    >
    > Since NTFS is about the only filesystem that MS supports. There
    > really isn't any sense for them to go and retrofit FAT/FAT32 to
    > support mount points.


    Right, but that doesn't make sense.

    Mount point support should be intrinsic to any VFS/IFS layer, not
    specific to a given filesystem. Observe:

    ~> mount | grep dos /dev/sdb2 on /dos type vfat (rw,utf8,umask=007,gid=46)

    ~> sudo mount yellowdog-6.0-DVD_20080207.iso -o loop /dos/test
    [sudo] password for mbt:

    ~> mount | grep dos
    /dev/sdb2 on /dos type vfat (rw,utf8,umask=007,gid=46)
    /dev/loop1 on /dos/test type iso9660 (rw)

    Mount points should be supported centrally so that *any* filesystem can
    have mount points on it. I suppose Unix-like systems only support it
    that way because they can usefully have several types of different
    filesystems in use on a single system. That is one place where Windows
    is sorely deficient. I am pretty sure that I am not alone in wishing
    that Windows had far better support for more than just FATxx and NTFS.

    --- Mike

    --
    My sigfile ran away and is on hiatus.


  15. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    "Michael B. Trausch" writes:

    > On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 12:15:36 -0400
    > "Ezekiel" wrote:
    >
    >> > IIRC mount points are only supported, however, on NTFS file systems;
    >> > I don't know why that limitation exists(ed?).

    >>
    >> Since NTFS is about the only filesystem that MS supports. There
    >> really isn't any sense for them to go and retrofit FAT/FAT32 to
    >> support mount points.

    >
    > Right, but that doesn't make sense.
    >
    > Mount point support should be intrinsic to any VFS/IFS layer, not
    > specific to a given filesystem. Observe:
    >
    > ~> mount | grep dos /dev/sdb2 on /dos type vfat (rw,utf8,umask=007,gid=46)
    >
    > ~> sudo mount yellowdog-6.0-DVD_20080207.iso -o loop /dos/test
    > [sudo] password for mbt:
    >
    > ~> mount | grep dos
    > /dev/sdb2 on /dos type vfat (rw,utf8,umask=007,gid=46)
    > /dev/loop1 on /dos/test type iso9660 (rw)
    >
    > Mount points should be supported centrally so that *any* filesystem can
    > have mount points on it. I suppose Unix-like systems only support it
    > that way because they can usefully have several types of different
    > filesystems in use on a single system. That is one place where Windows
    > is sorely deficient. I am pretty sure that I am not alone in wishing
    > that Windows had far better support for more than just FATxx and NTFS.
    >
    > --- Mike


    It does.

    Ext2 for a start.

    --
    "Let the body stay buried wherever he put it, maybe it'll get
    found some day, maybe not. "
    -- "Bo Raxo" in alt.true-crime, comp.os.linux.advocacy

  16. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    "Michael B. Trausch" writes:

    > On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 18:27:49 +0200
    > Hadron wrote:
    >
    >> It does.
    >>
    >> Ext2 for a start.

    >
    > Via a third-party add-on. Microsoft doesn't support it, someone wrote
    > an add-in driver that does, though.
    >
    > I was more referring to Microsoft _supporting_ a large number of
    > filesystems. Say, for example, having out-of-the-box support for
    > ext{2,3,4}, ReiserFS, NTFS, and FATxx would be a great start. Also,
    > the ability to install on any of those systems would be a nice
    > addition, but not necessary.


    Yet in Linux its OK to have to have it packaged in a repository and then
    installed?

    >
    > I am pretty sure they just don't want to do it, and that's the reason
    > why they don't.


    Maybe they don't see the need since there was never really any need for
    them to do it. And the existence of the 3rd party tools pretty much
    scuppers anything else I would say.

    >
    > --- Mike


    --
    "XP is a flop and when users are still asking for W98 it shows that they
    aren't all taken in with the MS hype."
    comp.os.linux.advocacy - where they put the lunacy in advocacy

  17. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Michael B. Trausch belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > Mount point support should be intrinsic to any VFS/IFS layer, not
    > specific to a given filesystem. Observe:
    >
    > ~> mount | grep dos /dev/sdb2 on /dos type vfat (rw,utf8,umask=007,gid=46)
    >
    > ~> sudo mount yellowdog-6.0-DVD_20080207.iso -o loop /dos/test
    > [sudo] password for mbt:
    >
    > ~> mount | grep dos
    > /dev/sdb2 on /dos type vfat (rw,utf8,umask=007,gid=46)
    > /dev/loop1 on /dos/test type iso9660 (rw)
    >
    > Mount points should be supported centrally so that *any* filesystem can
    > have mount points on it. I suppose Unix-like systems only support it
    > that way because they can usefully have several types of different
    > filesystems in use on a single system. That is one place where Windows
    > is sorely deficient. I am pretty sure that I am not alone in wishing
    > that Windows had far better support for more than just FATxx and NTFS.


    Such as

    afs
    atfs
    aufs
    btrfs
    cramfs
    curlftpfs
    dosfs
    ecryptfs
    ext2fs
    ext3fs
    gnomevfs
    gvfs
    jfs
    isofs
    nfs
    nilfs
    ntfs
    obexfs
    procfs
    reiserfs
    smbfs
    squashfs
    sshfs
    stegfs
    sysfs
    udf
    unionfs
    vfat
    wikipediafs
    xfs
    zfs

    --
    Humor in the Court:
    Q. What is your brother-in-law's name?
    A. Borofkin.
    Q. What's his first name?
    A. I can't remember.
    Q. He's been your brother-in-law for years, and you can't remember his first
    name?
    A. No. I tell you I'm too excited. (Rising from the witness chair and
    pointing to Mr. Borofkin.) Nathan, for God's sake, tell them your first
    name!

  18. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    After takin' a swig o' grog, Michael B. Trausch belched out
    this bit o' wisdom:

    > On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 18:27:49 +0200
    > Hadron wrote:
    >
    >> It does.
    >>
    >> Ext2 for a start.

    >
    > Via a third-party add-on. Microsoft doesn't support it, someone wrote
    > an add-in driver that does, though.
    >
    > I was more referring to Microsoft _supporting_ a large number of
    > filesystems. Say, for example, having out-of-the-box support for
    > ext{2,3,4}, ReiserFS, NTFS, and FATxx would be a great start. Also,
    > the ability to install on any of those systems would be a nice
    > addition, but not necessary.
    >
    > I am pretty sure they just don't want to do it, and that's the reason
    > why they don't.


    "How many boxes will it sell?" -- Microsoft engineering job 1.

    Also forgot:

    ceph
    cifs
    coda
    cxfs
    fhgfs
    gfs
    hfs
    hfs+
    jffs
    lustre
    minix
    nasan
    ncpfs
    nss
    ocfs
    ocfs2
    psfs
    pvfs
    pvfs2
    reiser4
    spadfs
    starfish
    stornext
    vxfs
    xtreemfs

    I grow fatigued.

    --
    When the lodge meeting broke up, Meyer confided to a friend.
    "Abe, I'm in a terrible pickle! I'm strapped for cash and I haven't
    the slightest idea where I'm going to get it from!"
    "I'm glad to hear that," answered Abe. "I was afraid you
    might have some idea that you could borrow from me!"

  19. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    On 2008-10-20, Hadron was urged to write the following:

    > Yet in Linux its OK to have to have it packaged in a repository and then
    > installed?


    Dude, it's in the kernel...

    --
    Women need a reason to have sex. Men just need a place.
    ~ Billy Crystal

  20. Re: Getting a job done: GNU/Linux saves (nothing)

    TomB wrote:

    > On 2008-10-20, Hadron was urged to write the following:
    >
    >> Yet in Linux its OK to have to have it packaged in a repository and then
    >> installed?

    >
    > Dude, it's in the kernel...
    >


    Don't tell him. Hadron Quark is a "kernel hacker" of high fame...
    --
    Confucius: He who play in root, eventually kill tree.


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