[News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux - Linux

This is a discussion on [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux - Linux ; -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The joy of X - master the Linux GUI ,----[ Quote ] | If you're a Linux user you have no doubt heard of GNOME and KDE. These | popular desktop environments are really ...

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Thread: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

  1. [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    Hash: SHA1

    The joy of X - master the Linux GUI

    ,----[ Quote ]
    | If you're a Linux user you have no doubt heard of GNOME and KDE. These
    | popular desktop environments are really the pinnacle of a deep iceberg of
    | technology with the X-Windows graphical interface underpinning it all. Here
    | are a couple of ways to tame X, kicking off a journey of unlimited ability to
    | change the Linux look-and-feel.
    `----

    http://www.itwire.com/content/view/21102/1141/


    Recent:

    X Server 1.5.2 Released, Brings Bug Fixes

    ,----[ Quote ]
    | X Server 1.5.1 was only released two and a half weeks ago as a quick bug-fix
    | release to X Server 1.5.0, which is the server component for X.Org 7.4, but
    | today we have a third release. Adam Jackson has announced the release of X
    | Server 1.5.2 with 14 changes.
    `----

    http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...item&px=Njc3OA


    [ANNOUNCE] xserver 1.5.0

    ,----[ Quote ]
    | This is almost certainly the server that will go into Xorg 7.4. The
    | module set for same is available here:
    |
    | http://xorg.freedesktop.org/archive/...w-X11R7.4/src/
    |
    | If you see anything missing that should be present, or present that
    | should be absent, yell very loudly, right now. Otherwise that'll go
    | gold in a day or two.
    `----

    http://lists.freedesktop.org/archive...er/038187.html
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  2. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 13:09:16 +0000, Roy Schestowitz wrote:

    > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    > Hash: SHA1
    >
    > The joy of X - master the Linux GUI


    God knows you'll have to.

    As a Linux user you really have no choice but to get into the nasty innards
    of the X-server.

    Getting your graphics card and monitor working properly is usually the
    first time you get to visit that wonder called /etc/X11/xorg.conf.

    Hey. here is a little sample for you to get all starry eyed over:

    # nvidia-xconfig: X configuration file generated by nvidia-xconfig
    # nvidia-xconfig: version 1.0 (buildmeister@builder3) Thu Feb 14
    18:20:37 PST 2008

    # nvidia-settings: X configuration file generated by nvidia-settings
    # nvidia-settings: version 1.0 (buildd@vernadsky) Thu Jun 5 09:26:53
    UTC 2008
    # xorg.conf (X.Org X Window System server configuration file)
    #
    # This file was generated by dexconf, the Debian X Configuration tool,
    using
    # values from the debconf database.
    #
    # Edit this file with caution, and see the xorg.conf manual page.
    # (Type "man xorg.conf" at the shell prompt.)
    #
    # This file is automatically updated on xserver-xorg package upgrades
    *only*
    # if it has not been modified since the last upgrade of the xserver-xorg
    # package.
    #
    # If you have edited this file but would like it to be automatically
    updated
    # again, run the following command:
    # sudo dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg

    Section "ServerLayout"
    Identifier "Default Layout"
    Screen 0 "Screen0" 0 0
    InputDevice "Generic Keyboard" "CoreKeyboard"
    InputDevice "Configured Mouse"
    EndSection

    Section "Module"
    Load "glx"
    EndSection

    Section "ServerFlags"
    Option "Xinerama" "0"
    EndSection

    Section "InputDevice"
    Identifier "Generic Keyboard"
    Driver "kbd"
    Option "XkbRules" "xorg"
    Option "XkbModel" "pc105"
    Option "XkbLayout" "us"
    EndSection

    Section "InputDevice"
    Identifier "Configured Mouse"
    Driver "mouse"
    Option "CorePointer"
    EndSection

    Section "Monitor"
    Identifier "Configured Monitor"
    EndSection

    Section "Monitor"
    Identifier "Monitor0"
    VendorName "Unknown"
    ModelName "Envision 2219S-1"
    HorizSync 30.0 - 83.0
    VertRefresh 50.0 - 76.0
    EndSection

    Section "Device"
    Identifier "Configured Video Device"
    Driver "nvidia"
    Option "NoLogo" "True"
    EndSection

    Section "Device"
    Identifier "Videocard0"
    Driver "nvidia"
    VendorName "NVIDIA Corporation"
    BoardName "GeForce 6200"
    EndSection

    Section "Screen"
    Identifier "Default Screen"
    Device "Configured Video Device"
    Monitor "Configured Monitor"
    DefaultDepth 24
    EndSection

    Section "Screen"
    Identifier "Screen0"
    Device "Videocard0"
    Monitor "Monitor0"
    DefaultDepth 24
    Option "TwinView" "1"
    Option "TwinViewXineramaInfoOrder" "CRT-0"
    Option "metamodes" "CRT-0: 1680x1050_60 +0+0, CRT-1:
    1440x900_75 +1680+0; CRT-0: nvidia-auto-select +0+0, CRT-1:
    nvidia-auto-select +1680+0"
    SubSection "Display"
    Depth 24
    Modes "nvidia-auto-select"
    EndSubSection
    EndSection


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  3. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    > On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 13:09:16 +0000, Roy Schestowitz wrote:
    >
    >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    >> Hash: SHA1
    >>
    >> The joy of X - master the Linux GUI

    >
    > God knows you'll have to.
    >
    > As a Linux user you really have no choice but to get into the nasty innards
    > of the X-server.
    >


    I would put the windows registry contents for comparison but
    1. I don't run windows
    2. 1Mbps upstream is not enough to complete uploading it before christmas

  4. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 03:23:59 +0300, geonik wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >> On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 13:09:16 +0000, Roy Schestowitz wrote:
    >>
    >>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    >>> Hash: SHA1
    >>>
    >>> The joy of X - master the Linux GUI

    >>
    >> God knows you'll have to.
    >>
    >> As a Linux user you really have no choice but to get into the nasty innards
    >> of the X-server.
    >>

    >
    > I would put the windows registry contents for comparison but
    > 1. I don't run windows
    > 2. 1Mbps upstream is not enough to complete uploading it before christmas


    I've been in the registry maybe twice.
    Once to fully extract Symantec, don't ask, and once to speed up menus.

    Most people never have to touch the Windows registry.
    Most Linux users however get to know xorg.conf or smb.conf intimately.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  5. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    Homer wrote:

    > I have not seen an X config helper screw-up an X config in years,


    That must mean no one else has, either. Moron.


    > but
    > I'm greatly relieved that Linux uses the sensible approach to configs
    > that it does, because the thought of battling The Registry on Windows
    > is enough to make me want to give up on computing entirely.


    Results 1 - 10 of about 278,000 for corrupt registry
    Results 1 - 10 of about 26,600 for corrupt xorg.conf

    With an installed base approx 90x that of Linux, it's clear Linux loses
    again. And again. And again.





  6. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    DFS wrote:

    > Homer wrote:
    >
    >> I have not seen an X config helper screw-up an X config in years,

    >
    > That must mean no one else has, either. Moron.
    >
    >
    >> but
    >> I'm greatly relieved that Linux uses the sensible approach to configs
    >> that it does, because the thought of battling The Registry on Windows
    >> is enough to make me want to give up on computing entirely.

    >
    > Results 1 - 10 of about 278,000 for corrupt registry
    > Results 1 - 10 of about 26,600 for corrupt xorg.conf
    >
    > With an installed base approx 90x that of Linux, it's clear Linux loses
    > again. And again. And again.


    It is clear that you are unable to do a proper google search string.
    But thats the only thing which is obviously clear in this case
    --
    "Last I checked, it wasn't the power cord for the Clue Generator that
    was sticking up your ass." - John Novak, rasfwrj


  7. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    Verily I say unto thee, that Peter Köhlmann spake thusly:
    > DFS wrote:
    >> Homer wrote:


    >>> I have not seen an X config helper screw-up an X config in years,
    >>>

    >> That must mean no one else has, either. Moron.


    Well I'm sure it happens to idiots like you and Hardon all the time, but
    I'm not talking about idiots, I'm talking about normal people.

    >>> but I'm greatly relieved that Linux uses the sensible approach to
    >>> configs that it does, because the thought of battling The
    >>> Registry on Windows is enough to make me want to give up on
    >>> computing entirely.

    >>
    >> Results 1 - 10 of about 278,000 for corrupt registry Results 1 - 10
    >> of about 26,600 for corrupt xorg.conf


    Results 1 - 10 of about 27,200 for DFS is an idiot

    >> With an installed base approx 90x that of Linux, it's clear Linux
    >> loses again. And again. And again.

    >
    > It is clear that you are unable to do a proper google search string.
    > But thats the only thing which is obviously clear in this case


    DooFy is a "special needs" Googler, so let's help him out.

    File /corruption/ is not the same as a misconfiguration, unless of
    course that configuration file is a binary blob - the likes of which is
    all-too common on Windows, in which case it might as well be corrupted
    for all the difference it makes to actually repairing it.

    Like I said, it's been /years/ since I've seen a misconfigured X config
    (not since the days of XFree86 in fact), but if and when that config is
    /either/ misconfigured /or/ actually corrupted - at least one can repair
    it ... /really/ repair it ... using just a text editor.

    OTOH, on Windows ... pray you have a backup.

    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "At the time, I thought C was the most elegant language and Java
    | the most practical one. That point of view lasted for maybe two
    | weeks after initial exposure to Lisp." ~ Constantine Vetoshev
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
    14:29:01 up 2 days, 23:24, 2 users, load average: 0.00, 0.02, 0.00

  8. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    On 2008-10-13, DFS wrote:
    > Homer wrote:
    >
    >> I have not seen an X config helper screw-up an X config in years,

    >
    > That must mean no one else has, either. Moron.
    >
    >
    >> but
    >> I'm greatly relieved that Linux uses the sensible approach to configs
    >> that it does, because the thought of battling The Registry on Windows
    >> is enough to make me want to give up on computing entirely.

    >
    > Results 1 - 10 of about 278,000 for corrupt registry
    > Results 1 - 10 of about 26,600 for corrupt xorg.conf


    So? What do you think that proves?

    If you corrupt X, then it's a major inconvenience but not fatal.
    It's also rediculously easy (as compared to the windows registry) to
    backup and restore your copy of xorg.conf.

    It's so obvious that it wouldn't even be considered worth mentioning
    in most places that backing up files are lot more simple, robust and
    straightforward than backing up any sort of database.

    >
    > With an installed base approx 90x that of Linux, it's clear Linux loses
    > again. And again. And again.


    ...not that X even necessarily needs a conf file to boot anyways.

    --

    Metallica is not worth the ruination of someone |||
    who has pirated their music / | \


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  9. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    On 2008-10-13, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
    > On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 02:51:27 +0100, Homer wrote:
    >
    >> When any of those five binary blobs called "The Registry" are damaged
    >> then you're screwed, because they're the only repository for all your
    >> configurations

    >
    > You might want to bring yourself up to this century. I've never even
    > *HEARD* of a registry corruption since XP SP1, some 6 years ago, other than


    ....then mebbe you should get out more often and stop pretending you
    know something about 3D programming.

    [deletia]

    Professional Windows SA's that don't have some perverse axe to
    grind will freely admit to Windows having problems of this nature.
    This is the difference between professionals and shills.

    --

    Metallica is not worth the ruination of someone |||
    who has pirated their music / | \


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    ----------------------------------------------------------
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  10. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Roy Schestowitz

    wrote
    on Sun, 12 Oct 2008 13:09:16 +0000
    <5592130.mj9sJCm0IY@schestowitz.com>:
    >
    > The joy of X - master the Linux GUI


    Pedant Point: X is *not* a GUI, any more than a foundation
    is a house. However, it does make for a very solid,
    robust foundation, if used properly.

    Also, parts of X are no longer in use -- in particular XrmQuark.

    >
    > ,----[ Quote ]
    > | If you're a Linux user you have no doubt heard of GNOME
    > | and KDE. These popular desktop environments are really
    > | the pinnacle of a deep iceberg of technology with the
    > | X-Windows graphical interface underpinning it all. Here
    > | are a couple of ways to tame X, kicking off a journey
    > | of unlimited ability to change the Linux look-and-feel.
    > `----
    >
    > http://www.itwire.com/content/view/21102/1141/


    There are a number of minor problems with X; most of
    them have been worked around by such packages as Cairo
    (superseding Pango) and various extensions. Providing for
    these extensions is one of X's strengths.

    OpenGL + X is a combination that might still need work,
    though that might be more of a driver/board issue than
    anything else. Ideally, though, OpenGL would work through
    the network much like X does, albeit more slowly for
    obvious reasons.

    >
    >
    > Recent:
    >
    > X Server 1.5.2 Released, Brings Bug Fixes
    >
    > ,----[ Quote ]
    > | X Server 1.5.1 was only released two and a half weeks ago as a quick bug-fix
    > | release to X Server 1.5.0, which is the server component for X.Org 7.4, but
    > | today we have a third release. Adam Jackson has announced the release of X
    > | Server 1.5.2 with 14 changes.
    > `----
    >
    > http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...item&px=Njc3OA
    >
    >
    > [ANNOUNCE] xserver 1.5.0
    >
    > ,----[ Quote ]
    > | This is almost certainly the server that will go into Xorg 7.4. The
    > | module set for same is available here:
    > |
    > | http://xorg.freedesktop.org/archive/...w-X11R7.4/src/
    > |
    > | If you see anything missing that should be present, or present that
    > | should be absent, yell very loudly, right now. Otherwise that'll go
    > | gold in a day or two.
    > `----
    >
    > http://lists.freedesktop.org/archive...er/038187.html



    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Windows. Multi-platform(1), multi-tasking(1), multi-user(1).
    (1) if one defines "multi" as "exactly one".
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  11. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 07:46:56 -0400, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:


    > You might want to bring yourself up to this century. I've never even
    > *HEARD* of a registry corruption since XP SP1, some 6 years ago, other than
    > when there is a hardware failure (failing disk or controller), in which
    > case you can't trust anything on the drive and would have to reinstall no
    > matter what OS you were using.


    I've had exactly ONE, single registry corruption in the last few years
    maybe longer.
    That one was on my latptop after it went through the airport scanner, which
    I'm convinced hosed it.

    During logon it would say "Applying User Settings" or something like that
    and go into an endless loop.
    Nothing I did got me out of it so it was restore time.

    I believe I googled it later and found out it was some hive corruption
    having to do with security and basically there was no way out of it because
    even a repair didn't work.

    Other than that, Windows XP has been extremely reliable for me.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  12. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    Verily I say unto thee, that JEDIDIAH spake thusly:
    > On 2008-10-13, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
    >> On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 02:51:27 +0100, Homer wrote:


    >>> When any of those five binary blobs called "The Registry" are
    >>> damaged then you're screwed, because they're the only repository
    >>> for all your configurations

    >>
    >> You might want to bring yourself up to this century. I've never
    >> even *HEARD* of a registry corruption since XP SP1, some 6 years
    >> ago, other than


    Did SP1 make XP immune to power cuts, Ewik?

    > ...then mebbe you should get out more often and stop pretending you
    > know something about 3D programming.


    Or filesystems, even.

    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "At the time, I thought C was the most elegant language and Java
    | the most practical one. That point of view lasted for maybe two
    | weeks after initial exposure to Lisp." ~ Constantine Vetoshev
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
    21:25:04 up 3 days, 6:20, 2 users, load average: 0.04, 0.04, 0.06

  13. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Homer

    wrote
    on Mon, 13 Oct 2008 21:25:23 +0100
    :
    > Verily I say unto thee, that JEDIDIAH spake thusly:
    >> On 2008-10-13, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
    >>> On Mon, 13 Oct 2008 02:51:27 +0100, Homer wrote:

    >
    >>>> When any of those five binary blobs called "The Registry" are
    >>>> damaged then you're screwed, because they're the only repository
    >>>> for all your configurations
    >>>
    >>> You might want to bring yourself up to this century. I've never
    >>> even *HEARD* of a registry corruption since XP SP1, some 6 years
    >>> ago, other than

    >
    > Did SP1 make XP immune to power cuts, Ewik?


    The question might very well be registry recovery in that case.
    I'll admit to some curiosity.

    Linux for its part is not immune to powercuts either; one
    hopes that the journaling is sufficiently robust in ext3,
    reiserfs, and jfs such that an interrupted disk transaction
    can be recovered up to a certain point during filesystem
    consistency checks.

    And there's always the possibility of a battery backup, if
    one wishes such. In laptops, that's almost trivial (though
    if the battery runs out there's not a lot one can do ;-) ).
    On desktops, one might purchase additional hardware, which
    is basically a battery+charger unit.

    I would think that Linux journaling has been tested to death,
    actually, and of course one can attempt code review, since
    the code is readily available.

    Do we have that option in Windows? :-)

    >
    >> ...then mebbe you should get out more often and stop pretending you
    >> know something about 3D programming.

    >
    > Or filesystems, even.
    >


    I'll admit to some concerns about reiserfs, mostly because
    of lack of atomicity (as yttrx pointed out). I use ext3
    on this laptop.

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Useless C/C++ Programming Idea #1123133:
    void f(FILE * fptr, char *p) { fgets(p, sizeof(p), fptr); }
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  14. Re: [News] In Praise of X Server in GNU/Linux

    Verily I say unto thee, that The Ghost In The Machine spake thusly:
    > In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Homer wrote on Mon, 13
    > Oct 2008 21:25:23 +0100 :


    >> Did SP1 make XP immune to power cuts, Ewik?

    >
    > The question might very well be registry recovery in that case. I'll
    > admit to some curiosity.
    >
    > Linux for its part is not immune to powercuts either; one hopes that
    > the journaling is sufficiently robust in ext3, reiserfs, and jfs such
    > that an interrupted disk transaction can be recovered up to a certain
    > point during filesystem consistency checks.
    >
    > And there's always the possibility of a battery backup,


    Yes, there are a few ways of protecting data from disaster, such as RAID
    mirroring (to an extent); journaling; UPS protection; and simple backup,
    but on systems that use proprietary data formats such as Windows, with a
    blob (actually 5 blobs) of incomprehensible data, the only way to repair
    corruption (of any type) to that data, is to restore from backup, if you
    actually /have/ a backup.

    Under GNU/Linux, *repair* is actually possible - under Windows it isn't.

    > I'll admit to some concerns about reiserfs, mostly because of lack of
    > atomicity (as yttrx pointed out). I use ext3 on this laptop.


    Reiser doesn't support extended attributes for SELinux, which is mainly
    why I don't use it.

    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "At the time, I thought C was the most elegant language and Java
    | the most practical one. That point of view lasted for maybe two
    | weeks after initial exposure to Lisp." ~ Constantine Vetoshev
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
    23:10:38 up 3 days, 8:06, 2 users, load average: 0.07, 0.02, 0.00

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