A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP - Linux

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Thread: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

  1. A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)

    Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.

    Windows install:
    Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly obvious
    BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere and it's
    easy to miss one.

    Done....

    Linux?

    I still don't have it installed....

    Supposedly it's supported by the hplip program, which PCLinuxOS has
    installed.
    The problem is the version is old and there doesn't seem to be a newer one
    in the repositories. I have all of them checked BTW.
    No problem, I go to the HP website like the documentation suggests and I
    end up here:

    http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/d...435684&lang=en

    Which brings me to another page which brings me to a dead link!

    http://hplip.sourceforge.net/install/index.html

    Ok, so I walk the link and end up here:

    http://hplipopensource.com/hplip-web/downloads.html

    Things are looking good!!



    I download the Hplip program, follow the instructions and now starts my
    dependency hell.....

    First it wants C++development libraries.
    Then it wants something else.
    Then another devel library which I can't find, but I google and find some
    poor soul who has the same problem and use command line apt-install to get
    that one.

    So after about 5 of these things, I am finally left with this one, which I
    can't resolve because it needs other things which when I check the boxes
    they point back to the original box I checked and now I am in a circle.....

    Here is the dependency I am currently searching...
    I don't have the full screen because it seems the install program fills the
    buffer with all the extractions, but here is the latest nightmare
    dependency.

    ********************************************

    P Linux Imaging and Printing System (ver. 2.8.9)
    HPLIP Installer ver. 5.0

    Copyright (c) 2001-8 Hewlett-Packard Development Company, LP
    This software comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
    This is free software, and you are welcome to distribute it
    under certain conditions. See COPYING file for more details.

    Installer log saved in: hplip-install_Tue-30-Sep-2008_13:33:21.log

    |
    note: Defaults for each question are maked with a '*'. Press to
    accept the default.


    INSTALLATION MODE
    -----------------
    Automatic mode will install the full HPLIP solution with the most common
    options.
    Custom mode allows you to chose installation options to fit specific
    requirements.

    Please choose the installation mode (a=automatic*, c=custom, q=quit) : a

    Initializing. Please wait...


    INTRODUCTION
    ------------
    This installer will install HPLIP version 2.8.9 on your computer.
    Please close any running package management systems now (YaST, Adept,
    Synaptic, Up2date, etc).


    DISTRO/OS CONFIRMATION
    ----------------------
    Distro appears to be PCLinuxOS 2007.

    Is "PCLinuxOS 2007" your correct distro/OS and version (y=yes*, n=no,
    q=quit) ? y


    SELECT HPLIP OPTIONS
    --------------------
    Would you like to enable support for parallel (LPT connected printers?
    (y=yes, n=no*, q=quit) ? n


    ENTER ROOT/SUPERUSER PASSWORD
    -----------------------------
    Please enter the root/superuser password:
    Password accepted


    RUNNING PRE-INSTALL COMMANDS
    ----------------------------
    su - -c "/etc/init.d/cups restart" (Pre-install step 1)
    su -c "touch /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms && echo
    '=/dev/usb/dabusb* /dev/usb/mdc800* /dev/usb/rio500 /dev/ttyUSB*' |
    tee /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms" (Pre-install step 2)


    INSTALL MISSING REQUIRED DEPENDENCIES
    -------------------------------------
    warning: There are 2 missing REQUIRED dependencies.
    note: Installation of dependencies requires an active internet connection.
    warning: Missing REQUIRED dependency: cups-devel (cups-devel- Common Unix
    Printing System development files)
    warning: This installer cannot install 'cups-devel' for your distro/OS
    and/or version.
    error: Installation cannot continue without this dependency. Please
    manually install this dependency and re-run this installer.

    ************************************************** *******

    Understand I've been doing this for the last hour with like 5 other
    dependencies I had to find and resolve, which lead to other dependencies I
    needed to find and resolve.

    This is a complete joke....

    And people wonder why Linux isn't ready for average Joe?


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  2. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    > HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)
    >
    > Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.
    >
    > Windows install:
    > Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    > It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly obvious
    > BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere and it's
    > easy to miss one.
    >
    > Done....
    >
    > Linux?
    >
    > I still don't have it installed....
    >
    > Supposedly it's supported by the hplip program, which PCLinuxOS has
    > installed.
    > The problem is the version is old and there doesn't seem to be a newer one
    > in the repositories. I have all of them checked BTW.
    > No problem, I go to the HP website like the documentation suggests and I
    > end up here:
    >
    >

    http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/d...435684&lang=en
    >
    > Which brings me to another page which brings me to a dead link!
    >
    > http://hplip.sourceforge.net/install/index.html
    >
    > Ok, so I walk the link and end up here:
    >
    > http://hplipopensource.com/hplip-web/downloads.html
    >
    > Things are looking good!!
    >
    >
    >
    > I download the Hplip program, follow the instructions and now starts my
    > dependency hell.....
    >
    > First it wants C++development libraries.
    > Then it wants something else.
    > Then another devel library which I can't find, but I google and find some
    > poor soul who has the same problem and use command line apt-install to get
    > that one.
    >
    > So after about 5 of these things, I am finally left with this one, which
    > I can't resolve because it needs other things which when I check the boxes
    > they point back to the original box I checked and now I am in a
    > circle.....
    >
    > Here is the dependency I am currently searching...
    > I don't have the full screen because it seems the install program fills
    > the buffer with all the extractions, but here is the latest nightmare
    > dependency.
    >
    > ********************************************
    >
    > P Linux Imaging and Printing System (ver. 2.8.9)
    > HPLIP Installer ver. 5.0
    >
    > Copyright (c) 2001-8 Hewlett-Packard Development Company, LP
    > This software comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
    > This is free software, and you are welcome to distribute it
    > under certain conditions. See COPYING file for more details.
    >
    > Installer log saved in: hplip-install_Tue-30-Sep-2008_13:33:21.log
    >
    > |
    > note: Defaults for each question are maked with a '*'. Press to
    > accept the default.
    >
    >
    > INSTALLATION MODE
    > -----------------
    > Automatic mode will install the full HPLIP solution with the most common
    > options.
    > Custom mode allows you to chose installation options to fit specific
    > requirements.
    >
    > Please choose the installation mode (a=automatic*, c=custom, q=quit) : a
    >
    > Initializing. Please wait...
    >
    >
    > INTRODUCTION
    > ------------
    > This installer will install HPLIP version 2.8.9 on your computer.
    > Please close any running package management systems now (YaST, Adept,
    > Synaptic, Up2date, etc).
    >
    >
    > DISTRO/OS CONFIRMATION
    > ----------------------
    > Distro appears to be PCLinuxOS 2007.
    >
    > Is "PCLinuxOS 2007" your correct distro/OS and version (y=yes*, n=no,
    > q=quit) ? y
    >
    >
    > SELECT HPLIP OPTIONS
    > --------------------
    > Would you like to enable support for parallel (LPT connected printers?
    > (y=yes, n=no*, q=quit) ? n
    >
    >
    > ENTER ROOT/SUPERUSER PASSWORD
    > -----------------------------
    > Please enter the root/superuser password:
    > Password accepted
    >
    >
    > RUNNING PRE-INSTALL COMMANDS
    > ----------------------------
    > su - -c "/etc/init.d/cups restart" (Pre-install step 1)
    > su -c "touch /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms && echo
    > '=/dev/usb/dabusb* /dev/usb/mdc800* /dev/usb/rio500 /dev/ttyUSB*' |
    > tee /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms" (Pre-install step 2)
    >
    >
    > INSTALL MISSING REQUIRED DEPENDENCIES
    > -------------------------------------
    > warning: There are 2 missing REQUIRED dependencies.
    > note: Installation of dependencies requires an active internet connection.
    > warning: Missing REQUIRED dependency: cups-devel (cups-devel- Common Unix
    > Printing System development files)
    > warning: This installer cannot install 'cups-devel' for your distro/OS
    > and/or version.
    > error: Installation cannot continue without this dependency. Please
    > manually install this dependency and re-run this installer.
    >
    > ************************************************** *******
    >
    > Understand I've been doing this for the last hour with like 5 other
    > dependencies I had to find and resolve, which lead to other dependencies I
    > needed to find and resolve.
    >
    > This is a complete joke....
    >
    > And people wonder why Linux isn't ready for average Joe?
    >
    >


    If you're an example of the average Joe, then God help us.

    I recently bought a HP DeskJet 1460 from Comet in Kirkcaldy, Scotland.

    I run Debian Lenny from my machine, and my wife runs Kubuntu Dapper from
    hers. We are linked together via Ethernet in a wired home LAN.

    All I did was to plug this printer in and immediately we could both access
    it and print from it, with no need to load drivers from disk or anything
    else.

    The trouble with many ex-Windows users is that they don't expect the setting
    up of printers etc to be so easy, and instead go hunting round for drivers
    that really interrupt what the system alone just does, if left alone.

    --
    Facts are sacred ... but comment is free

  3. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 14:02:21 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)


    >Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.


    >Windows install:
    >Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    >It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly obvious
    >BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere and it's
    >easy to miss one.


    >Done....


    Maybe in an hour after it copies a gig of crap.

    Move your printer cable to a different USB port and you get to see it
    get repeated.

    Windows: "Oh my god! on a different port! It must be
    like nothing I've ever encountered before"

    Linux: Select hplip from package manager. Open printer setup manager and
    add printer. Done.
    The time required to look up "hp linux" on the web is still one
    tenth the time required for the windows version to display the donald
    duck graphics and move a gig of crap to the hard drive.

  4. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On 2008-09-30, AZ Nomad wrote:
    > On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 14:02:21 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)

    >
    >>Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.

    >
    >>Windows install:
    >>Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    >>It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly obvious
    >>BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere and it's
    >>easy to miss one.

    >
    >>Done....

    >
    > Maybe in an hour after it copies a gig of crap.
    >
    > Move your printer cable to a different USB port and you get to see it
    > get repeated.
    >
    > Windows: "Oh my god! on a different port! It must be
    > like nothing I've ever encountered before"
    >
    > Linux: Select hplip from package manager. Open printer setup manager and
    > add printer. Done.
    > The time required to look up "hp linux" on the web is still one
    > tenth the time required for the windows version to display the donald
    > duck graphics and move a gig of crap to the hard drive.


    With my HP multifunction printer "it was already there". Oddly enough
    with this same printer I had to "Linux it". Using the driver media just
    didn't seem to be getting me anywhere. Basically, there still wasn't any
    new printer entries even with multiple attempts at it.

    Finally I "guessed" at an older printer that was already there that
    I thought might work.

    Since this is all PCL and PS here for the most part it's really not
    a big deal...

    It's too bad that Windows doesn't have "generic PCL" or "generic PS"
    as options.

    --

    Unfortunately, the universe will not conform itself to
    your fantasies. You have to manage based on what really happens |||
    rather than what you would like to happen. This is true of personal / | \
    affairs, government and business.


    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    http://www.usenet.com

  5. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 18:12:38 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)
    >>
    >> Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.
    >>
    >> Windows install:
    >> Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    >> It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly obvious
    >> BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere and it's
    >> easy to miss one.
    >>
    >> Done....
    >>
    >> Linux?
    >>
    >> I still don't have it installed....
    >>
    >> Supposedly it's supported by the hplip program, which PCLinuxOS has
    >> installed.
    >> The problem is the version is old and there doesn't seem to be a newer one
    >> in the repositories. I have all of them checked BTW.
    >> No problem, I go to the HP website like the documentation suggests and I
    >> end up here:
    >>
    >>

    > http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/d...435684&lang=en
    >>
    >> Which brings me to another page which brings me to a dead link!
    >>
    >> http://hplip.sourceforge.net/install/index.html
    >>
    >> Ok, so I walk the link and end up here:
    >>
    >> http://hplipopensource.com/hplip-web/downloads.html
    >>
    >> Things are looking good!!
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> I download the Hplip program, follow the instructions and now starts my
    >> dependency hell.....
    >>
    >> First it wants C++development libraries.
    >> Then it wants something else.
    >> Then another devel library which I can't find, but I google and find some
    >> poor soul who has the same problem and use command line apt-install to get
    >> that one.
    >>
    >> So after about 5 of these things, I am finally left with this one, which
    >> I can't resolve because it needs other things which when I check the boxes
    >> they point back to the original box I checked and now I am in a
    >> circle.....
    >>
    >> Here is the dependency I am currently searching...
    >> I don't have the full screen because it seems the install program fills
    >> the buffer with all the extractions, but here is the latest nightmare
    >> dependency.
    >>
    >> ********************************************
    >>
    >> P Linux Imaging and Printing System (ver. 2.8.9)
    >> HPLIP Installer ver. 5.0
    >>
    >> Copyright (c) 2001-8 Hewlett-Packard Development Company, LP
    >> This software comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
    >> This is free software, and you are welcome to distribute it
    >> under certain conditions. See COPYING file for more details.
    >>
    >> Installer log saved in: hplip-install_Tue-30-Sep-2008_13:33:21.log
    >>
    >>|
    >> note: Defaults for each question are maked with a '*'. Press to
    >> accept the default.
    >>
    >>
    >> INSTALLATION MODE
    >> -----------------
    >> Automatic mode will install the full HPLIP solution with the most common
    >> options.
    >> Custom mode allows you to chose installation options to fit specific
    >> requirements.
    >>
    >> Please choose the installation mode (a=automatic*, c=custom, q=quit) : a
    >>
    >> Initializing. Please wait...
    >>
    >>
    >> INTRODUCTION
    >> ------------
    >> This installer will install HPLIP version 2.8.9 on your computer.
    >> Please close any running package management systems now (YaST, Adept,
    >> Synaptic, Up2date, etc).
    >>
    >>
    >> DISTRO/OS CONFIRMATION
    >> ----------------------
    >> Distro appears to be PCLinuxOS 2007.
    >>
    >> Is "PCLinuxOS 2007" your correct distro/OS and version (y=yes*, n=no,
    >> q=quit) ? y
    >>
    >>
    >> SELECT HPLIP OPTIONS
    >> --------------------
    >> Would you like to enable support for parallel (LPT connected printers?
    >> (y=yes, n=no*, q=quit) ? n
    >>
    >>
    >> ENTER ROOT/SUPERUSER PASSWORD
    >> -----------------------------
    >> Please enter the root/superuser password:
    >> Password accepted
    >>
    >>
    >> RUNNING PRE-INSTALL COMMANDS
    >> ----------------------------
    >> su - -c "/etc/init.d/cups restart" (Pre-install step 1)
    >> su -c "touch /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms && echo
    >> '=/dev/usb/dabusb* /dev/usb/mdc800* /dev/usb/rio500 /dev/ttyUSB*' |
    >> tee /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms" (Pre-install step 2)
    >>
    >>
    >> INSTALL MISSING REQUIRED DEPENDENCIES
    >> -------------------------------------
    >> warning: There are 2 missing REQUIRED dependencies.
    >> note: Installation of dependencies requires an active internet connection.
    >> warning: Missing REQUIRED dependency: cups-devel (cups-devel- Common Unix
    >> Printing System development files)
    >> warning: This installer cannot install 'cups-devel' for your distro/OS
    >> and/or version.
    >> error: Installation cannot continue without this dependency. Please
    >> manually install this dependency and re-run this installer.
    >>
    >> ************************************************** *******
    >>
    >> Understand I've been doing this for the last hour with like 5 other
    >> dependencies I had to find and resolve, which lead to other dependencies I
    >> needed to find and resolve.
    >>
    >> This is a complete joke....
    >>
    >> And people wonder why Linux isn't ready for average Joe?
    >>
    >>

    >
    > If you're an example of the average Joe, then God help us.
    >
    > I recently bought a HP DeskJet 1460 from Comet in Kirkcaldy, Scotland.


    Different printer.

    > I run Debian Lenny from my machine, and my wife runs Kubuntu Dapper from
    > hers. We are linked together via Ethernet in a wired home LAN.


    Different distribution.

    Nothing more need be said.



    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  6. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 13:25:13 -0500, AZ Nomad wrote:

    > On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 14:02:21 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)

    >
    >>Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.

    >
    >>Windows install:
    >>Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    >>It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly obvious
    >>BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere and it's
    >>easy to miss one.

    >
    >>Done....

    >
    > Maybe in an hour after it copies a gig of crap.


    Nope.
    5 minutes tops, not counting the video showing how to unpack and setup the
    printer.

    > Move your printer cable to a different USB port and you get to see it
    > get repeated.


    Wrong again.
    Just tried it in fact.

    > Windows: "Oh my god! on a different port! It must be
    > like nothing I've ever encountered before"


    Some devices give a pop-up, so what?
    It doesn't load all the software again.
    Big deal.
    Click the X and you are done.

    > Linux: Select hplip from package manager. Open printer setup manager and
    > add printer. Done.


    Again you dorks fail to read....

    Come back after you have actually read the post.


    > The time required to look up "hp linux" on the web is still one
    > tenth the time required for the windows version to display the donald
    > duck graphics and move a gig of crap to the hard drive.


    Try again AZNomad.
    The link is dead and if you actually read the post you would know that.

    BTW where are those screenshots of your millions of tmp files under Vista?
    At least I offer some proof of my claims.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  7. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 14:02:21 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    > HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)
    >
    > Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.
    >
    > Windows install:
    > Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    > It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly obvious
    > BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere and it's
    > easy to miss one.
    >
    > Done....
    >
    > Linux?
    >
    > I still don't have it installed....
    >
    > Supposedly it's supported by the hplip program, which PCLinuxOS has
    > installed.
    > The problem is the version is old and there doesn't seem to be a newer one
    > in the repositories. I have all of them checked BTW.
    > No problem, I go to the HP website like the documentation suggests and I
    > end up here:
    >
    > http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/d...435684&lang=en
    >
    > Which brings me to another page which brings me to a dead link!
    >
    > http://hplip.sourceforge.net/install/index.html
    >
    > Ok, so I walk the link and end up here:
    >
    > http://hplipopensource.com/hplip-web/downloads.html
    >
    > Things are looking good!!
    >
    >
    >
    > I download the Hplip program, follow the instructions and now starts my
    > dependency hell.....
    >
    > First it wants C++development libraries.
    > Then it wants something else.
    > Then another devel library which I can't find, but I google and find some
    > poor soul who has the same problem and use command line apt-install to get
    > that one.
    >
    > So after about 5 of these things, I am finally left with this one, which I
    > can't resolve because it needs other things which when I check the boxes
    > they point back to the original box I checked and now I am in a circle.....
    >
    > Here is the dependency I am currently searching...
    > I don't have the full screen because it seems the install program fills the
    > buffer with all the extractions, but here is the latest nightmare
    > dependency.
    >
    > ********************************************
    >
    > P Linux Imaging and Printing System (ver. 2.8.9)
    > HPLIP Installer ver. 5.0
    >
    > Copyright (c) 2001-8 Hewlett-Packard Development Company, LP
    > This software comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
    > This is free software, and you are welcome to distribute it
    > under certain conditions. See COPYING file for more details.
    >
    > Installer log saved in: hplip-install_Tue-30-Sep-2008_13:33:21.log
    >
    >|
    > note: Defaults for each question are maked with a '*'. Press to
    > accept the default.
    >
    >
    > INSTALLATION MODE
    > -----------------
    > Automatic mode will install the full HPLIP solution with the most common
    > options.
    > Custom mode allows you to chose installation options to fit specific
    > requirements.
    >
    > Please choose the installation mode (a=automatic*, c=custom, q=quit) : a
    >
    > Initializing. Please wait...
    >
    >
    > INTRODUCTION
    > ------------
    > This installer will install HPLIP version 2.8.9 on your computer.
    > Please close any running package management systems now (YaST, Adept,
    > Synaptic, Up2date, etc).
    >
    >
    > DISTRO/OS CONFIRMATION
    > ----------------------
    > Distro appears to be PCLinuxOS 2007.
    >
    > Is "PCLinuxOS 2007" your correct distro/OS and version (y=yes*, n=no,
    > q=quit) ? y
    >
    >
    > SELECT HPLIP OPTIONS
    > --------------------
    > Would you like to enable support for parallel (LPT connected printers?
    > (y=yes, n=no*, q=quit) ? n
    >
    >
    > ENTER ROOT/SUPERUSER PASSWORD
    > -----------------------------
    > Please enter the root/superuser password:
    > Password accepted
    >
    >
    > RUNNING PRE-INSTALL COMMANDS
    > ----------------------------
    > su - -c "/etc/init.d/cups restart" (Pre-install step 1)
    > su -c "touch /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms && echo
    > '=/dev/usb/dabusb* /dev/usb/mdc800* /dev/usb/rio500 /dev/ttyUSB*' |
    > tee /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms" (Pre-install step 2)
    >
    >
    > INSTALL MISSING REQUIRED DEPENDENCIES
    > -------------------------------------
    > warning: There are 2 missing REQUIRED dependencies.
    > note: Installation of dependencies requires an active internet connection.
    > warning: Missing REQUIRED dependency: cups-devel (cups-devel- Common Unix
    > Printing System development files)
    > warning: This installer cannot install 'cups-devel' for your distro/OS
    > and/or version.
    > error: Installation cannot continue without this dependency. Please
    > manually install this dependency and re-run this installer.
    >
    > ************************************************** *******
    >
    > Understand I've been doing this for the last hour with like 5 other
    > dependencies I had to find and resolve, which lead to other dependencies I
    > needed to find and resolve.
    >
    > This is a complete joke....
    >
    > And people wonder why Linux isn't ready for average Joe?


    I finally fixed it....
    Again the problem is this printer is NOT SUPPORTED UNDER THE CURRENT
    VERSION OF HPLIP THAT PCLINUXOS INSTALLS OR HAS IN IT"S DATABASE.


    I also tried the PCLinuxOS hardware manager which found the printer (it
    lists it in the box) and then asks if I want to install it, but now all of
    a sudden it doesn't know what printer I have so it gives me a drop down
    with 8 million printers in it and no search function.
    Even skipping to the HP section has hundreds of printers listed in some
    oddball order so you have to scan through them
    Bottom line it's not listed, SEE ABOVE.....

    I NEED THE NEWEST VERSION OF hplip....

    HP tells you this on their site.

    Are you bozos getting this yet?

    What I did was UNINSTALL the current hplip stuff, and the hundred or so
    other things it depends upon (SANE for example?)
    Then, from the COMMAND LINE, NOT FROM SYNAPTIC GUI, I did an apt-install
    hplip and FINALLY, now it works........

    The system was up to date BTW as of a couple of days ago and Synaptic GUI
    lists NO UPDATES available.


    A noob doesn't stand a chance....

    Cue: "My Samsung under Ubuntu worked great."
    "My Lexmark under Gentoo worked fine."
    "All I did was plug it in."

    Yada yada yada..... and all the other distro dance, hardware switch-r-roo
    crap that the Linux community is famous for.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  8. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    > On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 18:12:38 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >
    >> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>
    >>> HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)
    >>>
    >>> Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.
    >>>
    >>> Windows install:
    >>> Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    >>> It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly
    >>> obvious BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere
    >>> and it's easy to miss one.
    >>>
    >>> Done....
    >>>
    >>> Linux?
    >>>
    >>> I still don't have it installed....
    >>>
    >>> Supposedly it's supported by the hplip program, which PCLinuxOS has
    >>> installed.
    >>> The problem is the version is old and there doesn't seem to be a newer
    >>> one in the repositories. I have all of them checked BTW.
    >>> No problem, I go to the HP website like the documentation suggests and I
    >>> end up here:
    >>>
    >>>

    >>

    http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/d...435684&lang=en
    >>>
    >>> Which brings me to another page which brings me to a dead link!
    >>>
    >>> http://hplip.sourceforge.net/install/index.html
    >>>
    >>> Ok, so I walk the link and end up here:
    >>>
    >>> http://hplipopensource.com/hplip-web/downloads.html
    >>>
    >>> Things are looking good!!
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> I download the Hplip program, follow the instructions and now starts my
    >>> dependency hell.....
    >>>
    >>> First it wants C++development libraries.
    >>> Then it wants something else.
    >>> Then another devel library which I can't find, but I google and find
    >>> some poor soul who has the same problem and use command line apt-install
    >>> to get that one.
    >>>
    >>> So after about 5 of these things, I am finally left with this one,
    >>> which I can't resolve because it needs other things which when I check
    >>> the boxes they point back to the original box I checked and now I am in
    >>> a circle.....
    >>>
    >>> Here is the dependency I am currently searching...
    >>> I don't have the full screen because it seems the install program fills
    >>> the buffer with all the extractions, but here is the latest nightmare
    >>> dependency.
    >>>
    >>> ********************************************
    >>>
    >>> P Linux Imaging and Printing System (ver. 2.8.9)
    >>> HPLIP Installer ver. 5.0
    >>>
    >>> Copyright (c) 2001-8 Hewlett-Packard Development Company, LP
    >>> This software comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
    >>> This is free software, and you are welcome to distribute it
    >>> under certain conditions. See COPYING file for more details.
    >>>
    >>> Installer log saved in: hplip-install_Tue-30-Sep-2008_13:33:21.log
    >>>
    >>>|
    >>> note: Defaults for each question are maked with a '*'. Press to
    >>> accept the default.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> INSTALLATION MODE
    >>> -----------------
    >>> Automatic mode will install the full HPLIP solution with the most common
    >>> options.
    >>> Custom mode allows you to chose installation options to fit specific
    >>> requirements.
    >>>
    >>> Please choose the installation mode (a=automatic*, c=custom, q=quit) : a
    >>>
    >>> Initializing. Please wait...
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> INTRODUCTION
    >>> ------------
    >>> This installer will install HPLIP version 2.8.9 on your computer.
    >>> Please close any running package management systems now (YaST, Adept,
    >>> Synaptic, Up2date, etc).
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> DISTRO/OS CONFIRMATION
    >>> ----------------------
    >>> Distro appears to be PCLinuxOS 2007.
    >>>
    >>> Is "PCLinuxOS 2007" your correct distro/OS and version (y=yes*, n=no,
    >>> q=quit) ? y
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> SELECT HPLIP OPTIONS
    >>> --------------------
    >>> Would you like to enable support for parallel (LPT connected printers?
    >>> (y=yes, n=no*, q=quit) ? n
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> ENTER ROOT/SUPERUSER PASSWORD
    >>> -----------------------------
    >>> Please enter the root/superuser password:
    >>> Password accepted
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> RUNNING PRE-INSTALL COMMANDS
    >>> ----------------------------
    >>> su - -c "/etc/init.d/cups restart" (Pre-install step 1)
    >>> su -c "touch /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms && echo
    >>> '=/dev/usb/dabusb* /dev/usb/mdc800* /dev/usb/rio500 /dev/ttyUSB*' |
    >>> tee /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms" (Pre-install step 2)
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> INSTALL MISSING REQUIRED DEPENDENCIES
    >>> -------------------------------------
    >>> warning: There are 2 missing REQUIRED dependencies.
    >>> note: Installation of dependencies requires an active internet
    >>> connection. warning: Missing REQUIRED dependency: cups-devel
    >>> (cups-devel- Common Unix Printing System development files)
    >>> warning: This installer cannot install 'cups-devel' for your distro/OS
    >>> and/or version.
    >>> error: Installation cannot continue without this dependency. Please
    >>> manually install this dependency and re-run this installer.
    >>>
    >>> ************************************************** *******
    >>>
    >>> Understand I've been doing this for the last hour with like 5 other
    >>> dependencies I had to find and resolve, which lead to other dependencies
    >>> I needed to find and resolve.
    >>>
    >>> This is a complete joke....
    >>>
    >>> And people wonder why Linux isn't ready for average Joe?
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> If you're an example of the average Joe, then God help us.
    >>
    >> I recently bought a HP DeskJet 1460 from Comet in Kirkcaldy, Scotland.

    >
    > Different printer.
    >
    >> I run Debian Lenny from my machine, and my wife runs Kubuntu Dapper from
    >> hers. We are linked together via Ethernet in a wired home LAN.

    >
    > Different distribution.
    >
    > Nothing more need be said.
    >
    >
    >


    Except that if you want less aggro in future, then consult the hardware
    list.

    https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport

    It is regrettable, but not Linux's fault, that the hardware manufacturers do
    not always ensure that their hardware works successfully with Linux.

    --
    Facts are sacred ... but comment is free

  9. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 19:47:04 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 18:12:38 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>
    >>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)
    >>>>
    >>>> Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.
    >>>>
    >>>> Windows install:
    >>>> Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    >>>> It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly
    >>>> obvious BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere
    >>>> and it's easy to miss one.
    >>>>
    >>>> Done....
    >>>>
    >>>> Linux?
    >>>>
    >>>> I still don't have it installed....
    >>>>
    >>>> Supposedly it's supported by the hplip program, which PCLinuxOS has
    >>>> installed.
    >>>> The problem is the version is old and there doesn't seem to be a newer
    >>>> one in the repositories. I have all of them checked BTW.
    >>>> No problem, I go to the HP website like the documentation suggests and I
    >>>> end up here:
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>

    > http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/d...435684&lang=en
    >>>>
    >>>> Which brings me to another page which brings me to a dead link!
    >>>>
    >>>> http://hplip.sourceforge.net/install/index.html
    >>>>
    >>>> Ok, so I walk the link and end up here:
    >>>>
    >>>> http://hplipopensource.com/hplip-web/downloads.html
    >>>>
    >>>> Things are looking good!!
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> I download the Hplip program, follow the instructions and now starts my
    >>>> dependency hell.....
    >>>>
    >>>> First it wants C++development libraries.
    >>>> Then it wants something else.
    >>>> Then another devel library which I can't find, but I google and find
    >>>> some poor soul who has the same problem and use command line apt-install
    >>>> to get that one.
    >>>>
    >>>> So after about 5 of these things, I am finally left with this one,
    >>>> which I can't resolve because it needs other things which when I check
    >>>> the boxes they point back to the original box I checked and now I am in
    >>>> a circle.....
    >>>>
    >>>> Here is the dependency I am currently searching...
    >>>> I don't have the full screen because it seems the install program fills
    >>>> the buffer with all the extractions, but here is the latest nightmare
    >>>> dependency.
    >>>>
    >>>> ********************************************
    >>>>
    >>>> P Linux Imaging and Printing System (ver. 2.8.9)
    >>>> HPLIP Installer ver. 5.0
    >>>>
    >>>> Copyright (c) 2001-8 Hewlett-Packard Development Company, LP
    >>>> This software comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
    >>>> This is free software, and you are welcome to distribute it
    >>>> under certain conditions. See COPYING file for more details.
    >>>>
    >>>> Installer log saved in: hplip-install_Tue-30-Sep-2008_13:33:21.log
    >>>>
    >>>>|
    >>>> note: Defaults for each question are maked with a '*'. Press to
    >>>> accept the default.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> INSTALLATION MODE
    >>>> -----------------
    >>>> Automatic mode will install the full HPLIP solution with the most common
    >>>> options.
    >>>> Custom mode allows you to chose installation options to fit specific
    >>>> requirements.
    >>>>
    >>>> Please choose the installation mode (a=automatic*, c=custom, q=quit) : a
    >>>>
    >>>> Initializing. Please wait...
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> INTRODUCTION
    >>>> ------------
    >>>> This installer will install HPLIP version 2.8.9 on your computer.
    >>>> Please close any running package management systems now (YaST, Adept,
    >>>> Synaptic, Up2date, etc).
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> DISTRO/OS CONFIRMATION
    >>>> ----------------------
    >>>> Distro appears to be PCLinuxOS 2007.
    >>>>
    >>>> Is "PCLinuxOS 2007" your correct distro/OS and version (y=yes*, n=no,
    >>>> q=quit) ? y
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> SELECT HPLIP OPTIONS
    >>>> --------------------
    >>>> Would you like to enable support for parallel (LPT connected printers?
    >>>> (y=yes, n=no*, q=quit) ? n
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> ENTER ROOT/SUPERUSER PASSWORD
    >>>> -----------------------------
    >>>> Please enter the root/superuser password:
    >>>> Password accepted
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> RUNNING PRE-INSTALL COMMANDS
    >>>> ----------------------------
    >>>> su - -c "/etc/init.d/cups restart" (Pre-install step 1)
    >>>> su -c "touch /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms && echo
    >>>> '=/dev/usb/dabusb* /dev/usb/mdc800* /dev/usb/rio500 /dev/ttyUSB*' |
    >>>> tee /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms" (Pre-install step 2)
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> INSTALL MISSING REQUIRED DEPENDENCIES
    >>>> -------------------------------------
    >>>> warning: There are 2 missing REQUIRED dependencies.
    >>>> note: Installation of dependencies requires an active internet
    >>>> connection. warning: Missing REQUIRED dependency: cups-devel
    >>>> (cups-devel- Common Unix Printing System development files)
    >>>> warning: This installer cannot install 'cups-devel' for your distro/OS
    >>>> and/or version.
    >>>> error: Installation cannot continue without this dependency. Please
    >>>> manually install this dependency and re-run this installer.
    >>>>
    >>>> ************************************************** *******
    >>>>
    >>>> Understand I've been doing this for the last hour with like 5 other
    >>>> dependencies I had to find and resolve, which lead to other dependencies
    >>>> I needed to find and resolve.
    >>>>
    >>>> This is a complete joke....
    >>>>
    >>>> And people wonder why Linux isn't ready for average Joe?
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> If you're an example of the average Joe, then God help us.
    >>>
    >>> I recently bought a HP DeskJet 1460 from Comet in Kirkcaldy, Scotland.

    >>
    >> Different printer.
    >>
    >>> I run Debian Lenny from my machine, and my wife runs Kubuntu Dapper from
    >>> hers. We are linked together via Ethernet in a wired home LAN.

    >>
    >> Different distribution.
    >>
    >> Nothing more need be said.
    >>
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Except that if you want less aggro in future, then consult the hardware
    > list.
    >
    > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport
    >
    > It is regrettable, but not Linux's fault, that the hardware manufacturers do
    > not always ensure that their hardware works successfully with Linux.



    The dammed installer knows I HAVE and SUPPORTS PCLINUXOS.
    It's right in the log I posted.....

    How much more support do you want?????

    (Maybe if you had actually read the OP you would know this)
    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  10. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    Yup, been there, done that.

    First Windows:
    Open box, first thing you see is a big red warning sign: "WARNING! Install
    Printer Drivers BEFORE Connecting the Printer!".
    Yup, that's because if you hook it up, and Windows decides it's Device XYZ
    instead of the actual printer, there's no way to make Windows change its
    mind, short of a full reinstall -- at least not in a way the Average Joe
    can do it. And yes, I've met plenty of people who have been bitten by this,
    simply because they reinstalled Windows and didn't remember the warning
    sign etcetera.
    But OK, let's assume all goes well. Insert CD, click Start, click Next a few
    dozen times, get a huge amount of crap installed apart from the actual
    drivers (and wasn't there something about HP's drivers reporting to the
    mothership?), click Finish. OK, Done.
    Now let's finally hook up the printer to the USB port. And lo and behold, it
    works. Capital.
    Oh, I need to get something from my USB key. Whoops, we're short on USB
    ports. OK, I unplug the printer, insert the USB key, and yup, there's the
    systray icon, telling me "New Hardware Found". But uh-oh, nothing happens
    when I click it. After ten minutes it turns out that this problem
    is "fixed" by rebooting. Great. But alas, hooking up the printer makes the
    USB port unusable for anything else until after a reboot. Ah well, the
    usual crapware from Redmond, or from HP, trying to accommodate Redmond's
    crapware. And there's nothing I can do, as Windows is like a car with the
    hood welded shut.

    Now Linux, Mandriva 2008.1:
    I hook up the printer. Mandriva recognizes the printer and asks me if I want
    to install drivers for it. I click Yes, enter the root password, and wait
    for a few minutes while everything is installed. And oh joy, the printer
    works perfectly allright. And if I swap the printer cable for a USB key,
    there's no problem at all. The key is recognized, and I can simply use it.
    Swapping the USB key for the printer again, and I can once again print my
    documents without a hitch.
    Now /this/ is how things usually go when installing printers under Linux.

    Richard Rasker
    --
    http://www.linetec.nl

  11. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    > On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 19:47:04 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >
    >> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 18:12:38 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Windows install:
    >>>>> Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    >>>>> It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly
    >>>>> obvious BTW because there are little orange protective clips
    >>>>> everywhere and it's easy to miss one.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Done....
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Linux?
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I still don't have it installed....
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Supposedly it's supported by the hplip program, which PCLinuxOS has
    >>>>> installed.
    >>>>> The problem is the version is old and there doesn't seem to be a newer
    >>>>> one in the repositories. I have all of them checked BTW.
    >>>>> No problem, I go to the HP website like the documentation suggests and
    >>>>> I end up here:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>

    >>

    http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/d...435684&lang=en
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Which brings me to another page which brings me to a dead link!
    >>>>>
    >>>>> http://hplip.sourceforge.net/install/index.html
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Ok, so I walk the link and end up here:
    >>>>>
    >>>>> http://hplipopensource.com/hplip-web/downloads.html
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Things are looking good!!
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I download the Hplip program, follow the instructions and now starts
    >>>>> my dependency hell.....
    >>>>>
    >>>>> First it wants C++development libraries.
    >>>>> Then it wants something else.
    >>>>> Then another devel library which I can't find, but I google and find
    >>>>> some poor soul who has the same problem and use command line
    >>>>> apt-install to get that one.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> So after about 5 of these things, I am finally left with this one,
    >>>>> which I can't resolve because it needs other things which when I check
    >>>>> the boxes they point back to the original box I checked and now I am
    >>>>> in a circle.....
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Here is the dependency I am currently searching...
    >>>>> I don't have the full screen because it seems the install program
    >>>>> fills the buffer with all the extractions, but here is the latest
    >>>>> nightmare dependency.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> ********************************************
    >>>>>
    >>>>> P Linux Imaging and Printing System (ver. 2.8.9)
    >>>>> HPLIP Installer ver. 5.0
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Copyright (c) 2001-8 Hewlett-Packard Development Company, LP
    >>>>> This software comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
    >>>>> This is free software, and you are welcome to distribute it
    >>>>> under certain conditions. See COPYING file for more details.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Installer log saved in: hplip-install_Tue-30-Sep-2008_13:33:21.log
    >>>>>
    >>>>>|
    >>>>> note: Defaults for each question are maked with a '*'. Press
    >>>>> to accept the default.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> INSTALLATION MODE
    >>>>> -----------------
    >>>>> Automatic mode will install the full HPLIP solution with the most
    >>>>> common options.
    >>>>> Custom mode allows you to chose installation options to fit specific
    >>>>> requirements.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Please choose the installation mode (a=automatic*, c=custom, q=quit) :
    >>>>> a
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Initializing. Please wait...
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> INTRODUCTION
    >>>>> ------------
    >>>>> This installer will install HPLIP version 2.8.9 on your computer.
    >>>>> Please close any running package management systems now (YaST, Adept,
    >>>>> Synaptic, Up2date, etc).
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> DISTRO/OS CONFIRMATION
    >>>>> ----------------------
    >>>>> Distro appears to be PCLinuxOS 2007.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Is "PCLinuxOS 2007" your correct distro/OS and version (y=yes*, n=no,
    >>>>> q=quit) ? y
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> SELECT HPLIP OPTIONS
    >>>>> --------------------
    >>>>> Would you like to enable support for parallel (LPT connected
    >>>>> printers? (y=yes, n=no*, q=quit) ? n
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> ENTER ROOT/SUPERUSER PASSWORD
    >>>>> -----------------------------
    >>>>> Please enter the root/superuser password:
    >>>>> Password accepted
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> RUNNING PRE-INSTALL COMMANDS
    >>>>> ----------------------------
    >>>>> su - -c "/etc/init.d/cups restart" (Pre-install step 1)
    >>>>> su -c "touch /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms && echo
    >>>>> '=/dev/usb/dabusb* /dev/usb/mdc800* /dev/usb/rio500 /dev/ttyUSB*'
    >>>>> | tee /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms" (Pre-install step
    >>>>> 2)
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> INSTALL MISSING REQUIRED DEPENDENCIES
    >>>>> -------------------------------------
    >>>>> warning: There are 2 missing REQUIRED dependencies.
    >>>>> note: Installation of dependencies requires an active internet
    >>>>> connection. warning: Missing REQUIRED dependency: cups-devel
    >>>>> (cups-devel- Common Unix Printing System development files)
    >>>>> warning: This installer cannot install 'cups-devel' for your distro/OS
    >>>>> and/or version.
    >>>>> error: Installation cannot continue without this dependency. Please
    >>>>> manually install this dependency and re-run this installer.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> ************************************************** *******
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Understand I've been doing this for the last hour with like 5 other
    >>>>> dependencies I had to find and resolve, which lead to other
    >>>>> dependencies I needed to find and resolve.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> This is a complete joke....
    >>>>>
    >>>>> And people wonder why Linux isn't ready for average Joe?
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> If you're an example of the average Joe, then God help us.
    >>>>
    >>>> I recently bought a HP DeskJet 1460 from Comet in Kirkcaldy, Scotland.
    >>>
    >>> Different printer.
    >>>
    >>>> I run Debian Lenny from my machine, and my wife runs Kubuntu Dapper
    >>>> from hers. We are linked together via Ethernet in a wired home LAN.
    >>>
    >>> Different distribution.
    >>>
    >>> Nothing more need be said.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> Except that if you want less aggro in future, then consult the hardware
    >> list.
    >>
    >> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport
    >>
    >> It is regrettable, but not Linux's fault, that the hardware manufacturers
    >> do not always ensure that their hardware works successfully with Linux.

    >
    >
    > The dammed installer knows I HAVE and SUPPORTS PCLINUXOS.
    > It's right in the log I posted.....
    >
    > How much more support do you want?????
    >
    > (Maybe if you had actually read the OP you would know this)


    Had you read the link I just posted, you would have not chosen this printer
    if you wanted an easy life.

    https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupp...entsPrintersHp

    The write-up says:


    HP
    LaserJet 1006P
    foo2xqx
    Yes
    Yes
    v8.04 (Hardy)
    Must run hp-setup utility to obtain plugin. Print quality bad using 600x600
    dpi, must use 1200x600 dpi.
    2008-04-16



    --
    Facts are sacred ... but comment is free

  12. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 14:15:10 -0500, JEDIDIAH wrote:

    > It's too bad that Windows doesn't have "generic PCL" or "generic PS"
    >as options.


    What is really gross is when a windows user has gone through 4 or 5 printers and
    never uninstalled any of them ending up with several gigs of crapware and a pile
    of printer managers all running in parallel, all climbing onto the internet
    looking for updates and providing lovely backdoors for spyware to slide slide
    in.

  13. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 20:10:09 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 19:47:04 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>
    >>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 18:12:38 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Windows install:
    >>>>>> Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    >>>>>> It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly
    >>>>>> obvious BTW because there are little orange protective clips
    >>>>>> everywhere and it's easy to miss one.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Done....
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Linux?
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I still don't have it installed....
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Supposedly it's supported by the hplip program, which PCLinuxOS has
    >>>>>> installed.
    >>>>>> The problem is the version is old and there doesn't seem to be a newer
    >>>>>> one in the repositories. I have all of them checked BTW.
    >>>>>> No problem, I go to the HP website like the documentation suggests and
    >>>>>> I end up here:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>

    > http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/d...435684&lang=en
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Which brings me to another page which brings me to a dead link!
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> http://hplip.sourceforge.net/install/index.html
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Ok, so I walk the link and end up here:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> http://hplipopensource.com/hplip-web/downloads.html
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Things are looking good!!
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I download the Hplip program, follow the instructions and now starts
    >>>>>> my dependency hell.....
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> First it wants C++development libraries.
    >>>>>> Then it wants something else.
    >>>>>> Then another devel library which I can't find, but I google and find
    >>>>>> some poor soul who has the same problem and use command line
    >>>>>> apt-install to get that one.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> So after about 5 of these things, I am finally left with this one,
    >>>>>> which I can't resolve because it needs other things which when I check
    >>>>>> the boxes they point back to the original box I checked and now I am
    >>>>>> in a circle.....
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Here is the dependency I am currently searching...
    >>>>>> I don't have the full screen because it seems the install program
    >>>>>> fills the buffer with all the extractions, but here is the latest
    >>>>>> nightmare dependency.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> ********************************************
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> P Linux Imaging and Printing System (ver. 2.8.9)
    >>>>>> HPLIP Installer ver. 5.0
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Copyright (c) 2001-8 Hewlett-Packard Development Company, LP
    >>>>>> This software comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
    >>>>>> This is free software, and you are welcome to distribute it
    >>>>>> under certain conditions. See COPYING file for more details.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Installer log saved in: hplip-install_Tue-30-Sep-2008_13:33:21.log
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>|
    >>>>>> note: Defaults for each question are maked with a '*'. Press
    >>>>>> to accept the default.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> INSTALLATION MODE
    >>>>>> -----------------
    >>>>>> Automatic mode will install the full HPLIP solution with the most
    >>>>>> common options.
    >>>>>> Custom mode allows you to chose installation options to fit specific
    >>>>>> requirements.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Please choose the installation mode (a=automatic*, c=custom, q=quit) :
    >>>>>> a
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Initializing. Please wait...
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> INTRODUCTION
    >>>>>> ------------
    >>>>>> This installer will install HPLIP version 2.8.9 on your computer.
    >>>>>> Please close any running package management systems now (YaST, Adept,
    >>>>>> Synaptic, Up2date, etc).
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> DISTRO/OS CONFIRMATION
    >>>>>> ----------------------
    >>>>>> Distro appears to be PCLinuxOS 2007.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Is "PCLinuxOS 2007" your correct distro/OS and version (y=yes*, n=no,
    >>>>>> q=quit) ? y
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> SELECT HPLIP OPTIONS
    >>>>>> --------------------
    >>>>>> Would you like to enable support for parallel (LPT connected
    >>>>>> printers? (y=yes, n=no*, q=quit) ? n
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> ENTER ROOT/SUPERUSER PASSWORD
    >>>>>> -----------------------------
    >>>>>> Please enter the root/superuser password:
    >>>>>> Password accepted
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> RUNNING PRE-INSTALL COMMANDS
    >>>>>> ----------------------------
    >>>>>> su - -c "/etc/init.d/cups restart" (Pre-install step 1)
    >>>>>> su -c "touch /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms && echo
    >>>>>> '=/dev/usb/dabusb* /dev/usb/mdc800* /dev/usb/rio500 /dev/ttyUSB*'
    >>>>>> | tee /etc/security/console.perms.d/60-hplip.perms" (Pre-install step
    >>>>>> 2)
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> INSTALL MISSING REQUIRED DEPENDENCIES
    >>>>>> -------------------------------------
    >>>>>> warning: There are 2 missing REQUIRED dependencies.
    >>>>>> note: Installation of dependencies requires an active internet
    >>>>>> connection. warning: Missing REQUIRED dependency: cups-devel
    >>>>>> (cups-devel- Common Unix Printing System development files)
    >>>>>> warning: This installer cannot install 'cups-devel' for your distro/OS
    >>>>>> and/or version.
    >>>>>> error: Installation cannot continue without this dependency. Please
    >>>>>> manually install this dependency and re-run this installer.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> ************************************************** *******
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Understand I've been doing this for the last hour with like 5 other
    >>>>>> dependencies I had to find and resolve, which lead to other
    >>>>>> dependencies I needed to find and resolve.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> This is a complete joke....
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> And people wonder why Linux isn't ready for average Joe?
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> If you're an example of the average Joe, then God help us.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I recently bought a HP DeskJet 1460 from Comet in Kirkcaldy, Scotland.
    >>>>
    >>>> Different printer.
    >>>>
    >>>>> I run Debian Lenny from my machine, and my wife runs Kubuntu Dapper
    >>>>> from hers. We are linked together via Ethernet in a wired home LAN.
    >>>>
    >>>> Different distribution.
    >>>>
    >>>> Nothing more need be said.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> Except that if you want less aggro in future, then consult the hardware
    >>> list.
    >>>
    >>> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport
    >>>
    >>> It is regrettable, but not Linux's fault, that the hardware manufacturers
    >>> do not always ensure that their hardware works successfully with Linux.

    >>
    >>
    >> The dammed installer knows I HAVE and SUPPORTS PCLINUXOS.
    >> It's right in the log I posted.....
    >>
    >> How much more support do you want?????
    >>
    >> (Maybe if you had actually read the OP you would know this)

    >
    > Had you read the link I just posted, you would have not chosen this printer
    > if you wanted an easy life.
    >
    > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupp...entsPrintersHp
    >
    > The write-up says:
    >
    >
    > HP
    > LaserJet 1006P
    > foo2xqx
    > Yes
    > Yes
    > v8.04 (Hardy)
    > Must run hp-setup utility to obtain plugin. Print quality bad using 600x600
    > dpi, must use 1200x600 dpi.
    > 2008-04-16
    >


    Yep that's it, criticize the hardware, user, anything but Linux

    Prints fine here under Linux and Windows.

    I don't know what that guy is talking about.,...

    And for the 10th time THE VERSION OF HPILP WAS DOWNLEVEL.
    THE PRINTER WAS NOT RECOGNIIZED.
    THE PROBELM WAS UPGRADING IT TO THE LATEST VERSION.

    Had the software been at the latest version, or easily upgradeable, it
    would have been plug it in, run the program and it would have worked.

    It wasn't and PCLinuxOS offered NO UPGRADE on the standard repositories.

    ALSO...

    MOST PEOPLE will read the piece of paper that is taped on the printer which
    tells you where to go and what to do.

    Problem is it DOES NOT WORK BECAUSE LINUX IS HOSED....
    Even the link on the Sourceforge page is dead.

    BTW the printer gets at least 4 out of 5 stars on every site I have found,
    Circuitcity for example:

    http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Print...ategorylist.do

    http://tinyurl.com/3eqs99

    Sounds like your person has a problem with Linux.
    No surprise there.


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  14. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 15:13:33 -0500, AZ Nomad wrote:

    > On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 14:15:10 -0500, JEDIDIAH wrote:
    >
    >> It's too bad that Windows doesn't have "generic PCL" or "generic PS"
    >>as options.

    >
    > What is really gross is when a windows user has gone through 4 or 5 printers and
    > never uninstalled any of them ending up with several gigs of crapware and a pile
    > of printer managers all running in parallel, all climbing onto the internet
    > looking for updates and providing lovely backdoors for spyware to slide slide
    > in.


    Is that what you do?
    BTW where is your proof of those millions of tmp files you claimed Vista
    created on a friend's system?

    You sure ran from that one fast.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  15. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 22:06:22 +0200, Richard Rasker wrote:

    > Yup, been there, done that.
    >
    > First Windows:
    > Open box, first thing you see is a big red warning sign: "WARNING! Install
    > Printer Drivers BEFORE Connecting the Printer!".
    > Yup, that's because if you hook it up, and Windows decides it's Device XYZ
    > instead of the actual printer, there's no way to make Windows change its
    > mind, short of a full reinstall -- at least not in a way the Average Joe
    > can do it. And yes, I've met plenty of people who have been bitten by this,
    > simply because they reinstalled Windows and didn't remember the warning
    > sign etcetera.
    > But OK, let's assume all goes well. Insert CD, click Start, click Next a few
    > dozen times, get a huge amount of crap installed apart from the actual
    > drivers (and wasn't there something about HP's drivers reporting to the
    > mothership?), click Finish. OK, Done.
    > Now let's finally hook up the printer to the USB port. And lo and behold, it
    > works. Capital.
    > Oh, I need to get something from my USB key. Whoops, we're short on USB
    > ports. OK, I unplug the printer, insert the USB key, and yup, there's the
    > systray icon, telling me "New Hardware Found". But uh-oh, nothing happens
    > when I click it. After ten minutes it turns out that this problem
    > is "fixed" by rebooting. Great. But alas, hooking up the printer makes the
    > USB port unusable for anything else until after a reboot. Ah well, the
    > usual crapware from Redmond, or from HP, trying to accommodate Redmond's
    > crapware. And there's nothing I can do, as Windows is like a car with the
    > hood welded shut.
    >
    > Now Linux, Mandriva 2008.1:
    > I hook up the printer. Mandriva recognizes the printer and asks me if I want
    > to install drivers for it. I click Yes, enter the root password, and wait
    > for a few minutes while everything is installed. And oh joy, the printer
    > works perfectly allright. And if I swap the printer cable for a USB key,
    > there's no problem at all. The key is recognized, and I can simply use it.
    > Swapping the USB key for the printer again, and I can once again print my
    > documents without a hitch.
    > Now /this/ is how things usually go when installing printers under Linux.
    >
    > Richard Rasker


    Different printer.
    Different distribution.
    Apples and oranges.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  16. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On 2008-09-30, Richard Rasker wrote:
    > Yup, been there, done that.
    >
    > First Windows:
    > Open box, first thing you see is a big red warning sign: "WARNING! Install
    > Printer Drivers BEFORE Connecting the Printer!".
    > Yup, that's because if you hook it up, and Windows decides it's Device XYZ
    > instead of the actual printer, there's no way to make Windows change its
    > mind, short of a full reinstall -- at least not in a way the Average Joe
    > can do it. And yes, I've met plenty of people who have been bitten by this,
    > simply because they reinstalled Windows and didn't remember the warning
    > sign etcetera.
    > But OK, let's assume all goes well. Insert CD, click Start, click Next a few
    > dozen times, get a huge amount of crap installed apart from the actual
    > drivers (and wasn't there something about HP's drivers reporting to the
    > mothership?), click Finish. OK, Done.
    > Now let's finally hook up the printer to the USB port. And lo and behold, it
    > works. Capital.
    > Oh, I need to get something from my USB key. Whoops, we're short on USB
    > ports. OK, I unplug the printer, insert the USB key, and yup, there's the
    > systray icon, telling me "New Hardware Found". But uh-oh, nothing happens
    > when I click it. After ten minutes it turns out that this problem
    > is "fixed" by rebooting. Great. But alas, hooking up the printer makes the
    > USB port unusable for anything else until after a reboot. Ah well, the
    > usual crapware from Redmond, or from HP, trying to accommodate Redmond's
    > crapware. And there's nothing I can do, as Windows is like a car with the
    > hood welded shut.
    >


    I keep wondering what version of Windows you people are running - since I have
    NEVER had any issue at all with USB on windows.

    --
    Tom Shelton

  17. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On 2008-09-30, Tom Shelton wrote:
    > On 2008-09-30, Richard Rasker wrote:
    >> Yup, been there, done that.
    >>
    >> First Windows:
    >> Open box, first thing you see is a big red warning sign: "WARNING! Install
    >> Printer Drivers BEFORE Connecting the Printer!".
    >> Yup, that's because if you hook it up, and Windows decides it's Device XYZ
    >> instead of the actual printer, there's no way to make Windows change its
    >> mind, short of a full reinstall -- at least not in a way the Average Joe
    >> can do it. And yes, I've met plenty of people who have been bitten by this,
    >> simply because they reinstalled Windows and didn't remember the warning
    >> sign etcetera.
    >> But OK, let's assume all goes well. Insert CD, click Start, click Next a few
    >> dozen times, get a huge amount of crap installed apart from the actual
    >> drivers (and wasn't there something about HP's drivers reporting to the
    >> mothership?), click Finish. OK, Done.
    >> Now let's finally hook up the printer to the USB port. And lo and behold, it
    >> works. Capital.
    >> Oh, I need to get something from my USB key. Whoops, we're short on USB
    >> ports. OK, I unplug the printer, insert the USB key, and yup, there's the
    >> systray icon, telling me "New Hardware Found". But uh-oh, nothing happens
    >> when I click it. After ten minutes it turns out that this problem
    >> is "fixed" by rebooting. Great. But alas, hooking up the printer makes the
    >> USB port unusable for anything else until after a reboot. Ah well, the
    >> usual crapware from Redmond, or from HP, trying to accommodate Redmond's
    >> crapware. And there's nothing I can do, as Windows is like a car with the
    >> hood welded shut.
    >>

    >
    > I keep wondering what version of Windows you people are running - since I have
    > NEVER had any issue at all with USB on windows.
    >


    Wait a minute... I take that back. About 4 or 5 years ago, I had an XP box
    that would crash everytime you plugged in a USB device. Turned out to be a
    bad mother board.

    --
    Tom Shelton

  18. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    Tom Shelton wrote:

    < snip >

    >
    > I keep wondering what version of Windows you people are running - since I
    > have NEVER had any issue at all with USB on windows.
    >


    I have. Often
    There are *lots* of USB devices out there which are detected as "new
    hardware" if you just plug them into a different USB port.
    And no, I simply don't care if it is a driver issue or a windows issue.
    Windows does the "device detecing" and fails in finding that it already has
    the correct driver installed.

    This has never happened on any of my linux boxes. No matter where I plugged
    the very same (troublesome under windows) devices they were found at once
    and worked.
    --
    We are Linux. Resistance is measured in Ohms.


  19. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    On 2008-09-30, Robin T Cox wrote:
    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> On Tue, 30 Sep 2008 18:12:38 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>
    >>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> HP P1006 personal Laser Printer ($69.99 on sale at OfficeMax)
    >>>>
    >>>> Fully supported by Windows/Mac and Linux.
    >>>>
    >>>> Windows install:
    >>>> Put CD in and click enter a couple of times.
    >>>> It even shows you how to unpack the printer, which is not exactly
    >>>> obvious BTW because there are little orange protective clips everywhere
    >>>> and it's easy to miss one.
    >>>>
    >>>> Done....
    >>>>
    >>>> Linux?
    >>>>
    >>>> I still don't have it installed....
    >>>>
    >>>> Supposedly it's supported by the hplip program, which PCLinuxOS has
    >>>> installed.


    Pick a close match and move on with your life.

    This isn't rocket science; you just want it to look that way.

    [deletia]
    >> Different printer.


    ...which most likely supports one of 2 printer languages (if
    not both) that Linux has supported very well and easily since
    pretty much "the dawn of time".

    >>
    >>> I run Debian Lenny from my machine, and my wife runs Kubuntu Dapper from
    >>> hers. We are linked together via Ethernet in a wired home LAN.

    >>
    >> Different distribution.
    >>
    >> Nothing more need be said.
    >>
    >>
    >>

    >
    > Except that if you want less aggro in future, then consult the hardware
    > list.


    Yeah, but it's an HP printer. These are the people that CREATED the
    standards that other companies use that allow Unixen to easily use
    printers. What could they possibly be doing?

    >
    > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport
    >
    > It is regrettable, but not Linux's fault, that the hardware manufacturers do
    > not always ensure that their hardware works successfully with Linux.
    >



    --


    Some people have this nutty idea that in 1997 |||
    reading to a hard disk and writing to a hard disk / | \
    both at the same time was something worth patenting.


    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    http://www.usenet.com

  20. Re: A Tale of Two Printer Installs.... Linux vs Windows XP

    Tom Shelton wrote:

    > On 2008-09-30, Richard Rasker wrote:
    >> Yup, been there, done that.
    >>
    >> First Windows:
    >> Open box, first thing you see is a big red warning sign: "WARNING!
    >> Install Printer Drivers BEFORE Connecting the Printer!".
    >> Yup, that's because if you hook it up, and Windows decides it's Device
    >> XYZ instead of the actual printer, there's no way to make Windows change
    >> its mind, short of a full reinstall -- at least not in a way the Average
    >> Joe can do it. And yes, I've met plenty of people who have been bitten by
    >> this, simply because they reinstalled Windows and didn't remember the
    >> warning sign etcetera.
    >> But OK, let's assume all goes well. Insert CD, click Start, click Next a
    >> few dozen times, get a huge amount of crap installed apart from the
    >> actual drivers (and wasn't there something about HP's drivers reporting
    >> to the mothership?), click Finish. OK, Done.
    >> Now let's finally hook up the printer to the USB port. And lo and behold,
    >> it works. Capital.
    >> Oh, I need to get something from my USB key. Whoops, we're short on USB
    >> ports. OK, I unplug the printer, insert the USB key, and yup, there's the
    >> systray icon, telling me "New Hardware Found". But uh-oh, nothing happens
    >> when I click it. After ten minutes it turns out that this problem
    >> is "fixed" by rebooting. Great. But alas, hooking up the printer makes
    >> the USB port unusable for anything else until after a reboot. Ah well,
    >> the usual crapware from Redmond, or from HP, trying to accommodate
    >> Redmond's crapware. And there's nothing I can do, as Windows is like a
    >> car with the hood welded shut.
    >>

    >
    > I keep wondering what version of Windows you people are running - since I
    > have NEVER had any issue at all with USB on windows.


    Nah, I never had any issue with USB on Windows either, because I never use
    Windows.
    Oh no, wait, I tell a lie -- no, two lies, at that: I /have/ used Windows
    (albeit only a few hours) and I /did/ have issues with USB during that
    time.
    Some four years ago, my parents gave me an Acer TravelMate 515TE, freshly
    installed with Windows XP. At that particular occasion, I also received a
    watch with a 64MB USB memory chip. Now I intended to install Linux on it
    anyway, but out of curiosity, I fired up the laptop, with XP. I was not
    impressed at all, but it appeared to run OK -- that is, until I tried
    installing the driver software that came with the USB watch. At the end of
    the driver install, XP crashed and froze. OK, nothing out of the ordinary
    Windows-wise, so I simply rebooted the machine.
    Windows started allright, and seemed to run OK, but plugging in any USB
    device would make XP crash and lock up two times out of three.
    After a few hours of fruitless attempts to fix this problem, I decided
    enough was enough, and installed Linux on it, and never had a problem
    since. And this is just my own personal experience. And oh, I used W98, and
    it was just the same rubbish. And W95 was worse ...

    Face it: Windows is a mess. It's utter crap. It's **** sold as gold. Just
    look at Microsoft's modus operandi: just when they sort of fixed perhaps
    half of XP's serious flaws, after, what, six years or thereabouts, so it
    actually becomes sort of usable? Well, that's when they tell all those
    stupid, gullible suckers around the globe that XP is history, and that
    everyone must move on to the next steaming heap of bug-infested excrements
    called Vista.

    Richard Rasker
    --
    http://www.linetec.nl

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