Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges. - Linux

This is a discussion on Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges. - Linux ; On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:47:08 +0200, Hadron wrote: > Roger writes: > >> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:29:01 +0000, Robin T Cox wrote: >> >>> Roger wrote: >>> >>>> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 09:01:00 -0700, nessuno@wigner.berkeley.edu wrote: ...

+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 71

Thread: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

  1. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:47:08 +0200, Hadron wrote:

    > Roger writes:
    >
    >> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:29:01 +0000, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>
    >>> Roger wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 09:01:00 -0700, nessuno@wigner.berkeley.edu wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> On Sep 17, 8:53 am, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>>>> Roger wrote:
    >>>>>> > Generally I like Linux and would use it more but right now there
    >>>>>> > are way too many rough edges for the general consumer to use this
    >>>>>> > OS on a regular basis.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Poor dears simply need to be taken care of by a nice friendly large
    >>>>>> US corporation, of course.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Yeah.
    >>>>>> --
    >>>>>> Facts are sacred ... but comment is free
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Funny, isn't it, how all these one-timers with no previous posting
    >>>>> history on cola or anywhere else just pop up out of nowhere with
    >>>>> "Linux destroyed my hard disk" type stories. They always love Linux,
    >>>>> but just find themselves unfortunately forced to go back to Windows.
    >>>>> Sort of reminds you of our all-time master of nymshifting, anonymous
    >>>>> posting, ie Moshe flatfish Goldfarb himself.
    >>>>
    >>>> So search for "scrollkeeper-update CPU" and the first dozen or so hits
    >>>> are people complaining how it's "extremely CPU intensive."
    >>>>
    >>>> Do a similar search for gDesklets not automatically starting up on
    >>>> login. It's also correct and accurate.
    >>>>
    >>>> The updates for Firefox that are supposedly available are not really
    >>>> available. But feel free to also ignore that fact.
    >>>>
    >>>> Fireup gedit yourself and try to save a file. The CORRECT way is for
    >>>> the Save-As dialog to appear and focus to be in the correct place where
    >>>> the user can simply type in the filename and press to save the
    >>>> file. But that's not how it works.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Funny, isn't it, how a moron like you worries more about posting
    >>>> history than actual verifiable problems with an OS. I guess it's easier
    >>>> to try and discredit the messenger than to actually acknowledge that
    >>>> Linux has more than a few rough edges.
    >>>
    >>> Nothing is perfect, dear chap. And if we all have to wait until every
    >>> invention of mankind is perfect before letting the general consumer use
    >>> it, then clearly Mr Ford was doing us all a grave disservice in
    >>> releasing his Model T.
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> Nobody is asking for or expecting perfection. But your straw man argument
    >> of nothing is perfect doesn't hold water. If airplanes were randomly
    >> falling out of the sky at a rate of 2 per hour you couldn't excuse it by
    >> claiming that nothing is perfect.
    >>
    >> I'm not asking for or expecting perfection. But I don't expect my CPU to
    >> run pegged at 100% capacity after a few minutes because some application
    >> goes into an infinite loop. And I expect a simple File Save-As dialog box
    >> to let me type in the name of a file without having to manually set the
    >> focus to the Filename field which visually looks like it already has the
    >> focus.

    >
    > Gnome is worse in general. Buttons and so forth do not work unless you
    > move the mouse away from them and then refocus them.
    >
    > There are some real rough edges in a lot of the GUI apps. A shame. In
    > COLA they things thats ok because they are not "wintards". They are, of
    > course, simply clueless and pretend to see the benefit of a consistent
    > UI experience with sensible defaults for initial focus and tab order.


    The simple, most basic "File Save" dialog is a complete joke. Surely the code monkeys that wrote the file-save dialog would have tested it once or twice themselves.

    And this is nothing. I tried a couple of graphic apps and each one of them felt the need to create their own Color Chooser disaster. You'd think it would be more efficient if they got together and created one diasterous nightmare dialog that they all could use. But of course every code monkey wants his own 5 minutes of fame because wants to re-invent the same thing again his own way.





  2. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:52:27 -0500, JEDIDIAH wrote:

    > On 2008-09-17, Roger wrote:
    >> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:16:59 -0400, Linonut wrote:
    >>
    >>> * Roger peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>>
    >>>> ***** Suddenly I notice that the cooling fan on the laptop is
    >>>> roaring. I run PS and see that some 'scrollkeeper-up' application is
    >>>> pegging my CPU.
    >>>
    >>> "Roaring". Nice hyperbolic touch, there.
    >>>
    >>>

    >> Yeah "roaring" - I've had this laptop for about 2 years and I've never
    >> heard the CPU fan have to run at the highest speed in order to keep the

    >
    > You must use it like a doorstop then.
    >

    I use it the way many people use a laptop. For email, web surfing and
    light computing. If I need to transcode a bunch of videos then I have a
    desktop for heavy computing needs. And since it's for light computing, the
    fan shouldn't be running at max speed to cool the CPU. Oh, that's right.
    Some Linux app hung and is trying to fry my CPU and kill my battery.


    >> CPU cool. Evidently this 'scrollkeeper-up' application has a history of
    >> maxing out the CPU so what do you expect a laptop to do when the CPU
    >> runs at 100% for who knows how long.

    >
    > Ok, so some application that is basically the Linux equivalent of
    > "some 3rd party app" isn't so hot. Big fat hairy deal.


    If it got installed from the Ubuntu CD then it isn't a 3rd party app. And
    it is a big fat hairy deal if it's making someone's laptop run hot and is
    draining the crap out of the battery.


    > [deletia]
    >
    > Without the trolls, some of us would never be aware of some of t
    > these "problems".


    Your ignorance and ability to ignore Linux faults isn't my problem.


    > If this app is eating up your CPU cycles and is a mystery then the
    > obvious thing to do is to KILL it and then uninstall it.

    Kill it huh? For starters most users will have no idea how to kill an app
    or that it's even in a endless loop. Other than the cooling fan running at
    max speed and the hot air being blown out the back of the case most people
    won't know that some Linux app just **** the bed on them.

    Uninstall it huh? Another "brilliant" idea from the resident idiot who
    thinks he actually knows something.

    http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=578472


    However, when I run Ubuntu I noticed a process called "scrollkeeper-up"
    (=> scrollkeeper-update) often running and consuming a lot of CPU
    resources. This is undesirable for two reasons: 1) The noisy CPU fan
    begins to operate 2) The system becomes less responsive

    So I want to uninstall Scrollkeeper if possible. But when I try to do that
    using the Synaptic package manager, it indicates that this operation will
    require removing software that I do not want removed under any
    circumstance

    But unfortunately there are also about 30 other programs besides
    "ubuntu-desktop" that Synaptic wants to remove, including "gedit",
    "nautilus" and "synaptic",



    Yeah.. so just "uninstall it" and watch half the OS get uninstalled along
    with it. Your break is over. Get back to what you know something about...
    serving burgers and fries.



    > This goes for any OS but probably is easier for Linux.


    I wonder why Linux makes it so easy to "kill" applications. It had to evolve this way because so much crap gets broken that users have to kill apps.


  3. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:38:42 -0400, Roger wrote:


    >
    > I wonder why Linux makes it so easy to "kill" applications.
    >It had to evolve this way because so much crap gets broken that users have to kill apps.


    It looks like you are running Ubuntu 7.xx ?

    If so, I would update to 8.xx, IOW Hardy.

    There is a world of difference between the 7 versions and the 8 version.
    I had a lot of troubles with 7.xx and in general was not impressed with Ubuntu.

    Trying out Hardy made all the difference for me.
    Same machine except for video card.




    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  4. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:59:50 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    > On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:38:42 -0400, Roger wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    >> I wonder why Linux makes it so easy to "kill" applications.
    >>It had to evolve this way because so much crap gets broken that users
    >>have to kill apps.

    >
    > It looks like you are running Ubuntu 7.xx ?
    >
    > If so, I would update to 8.xx, IOW Hardy.
    >
    > There is a world of difference between the 7 versions and the 8 version.
    > I had a lot of troubles with 7.xx and in general was not impressed with
    > Ubuntu.
    >
    > Trying out Hardy made all the difference for me. Same machine except for
    > video card.





    I would upgrade but it was such a PITA to configure and get everything working with 7.10 that I don't want to have to go through that again... ever.

    It's been a while now (obvious since 7.10 is fairly old) but I had to make all sorts of tweaks and changes to get wireless and the video working properly. There's a bunch of other changes I made that are mostly network related to control access to the other machines on the network, DNS, file sharing, printing etc.

    I'd upgrade but I don't want to see all of my custom settings wiped out where I have to go through that **** all over again.

    And why did Ubuntu drop support for 7.10 less than a year after it was released. I've heard morons wining that MS was dropping support for Win98. That's TEN freaking YEARS ago. Ubuntu won't support their **** for 10 months.



  5. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:26:42 -0400, Roger wrote:

    > On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:59:50 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:38:42 -0400, Roger wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>> I wonder why Linux makes it so easy to "kill" applications.
    >>>It had to evolve this way because so much crap gets broken that users
    >>>have to kill apps.

    >>
    >> It looks like you are running Ubuntu 7.xx ?
    >>
    >> If so, I would update to 8.xx, IOW Hardy.
    >>
    >> There is a world of difference between the 7 versions and the 8 version.
    >> I had a lot of troubles with 7.xx and in general was not impressed with
    >> Ubuntu.
    >>
    >> Trying out Hardy made all the difference for me. Same machine except for
    >> video card.

    >
    >
    >
    >
    > I would upgrade but it was such a PITA to configure and get everything working with 7.10 that I don't want to have to go through that again... ever.
    >
    > It's been a while now (obvious since 7.10 is fairly old) but I had to make all
    >sorts of tweaks and changes to get wireless and the video working properly.
    > There's a bunch of other changes I made that are mostly
    >network related to control access to the other machines on the network, DNS, file sharing, printing etc.
    >
    > I'd upgrade but I don't want to see all of my custom settings wiped out
    > where I have to go through that **** all over again.
    >
    > And why did Ubuntu drop support for 7.10 less than a year after it was released.
    >I've heard morons wining that MS was dropping support for Win98.
    >That's TEN freaking YEARS ago. Ubuntu won't support their **** for 10 months.


    A lot of the configuration stuff should be in your /home directory.

    I would take the time to update if I were you.

    The upgrade cycle for Linux is a lot different than Windows.
    There are advantages and disadvantages to both models.


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
    Please Visit www.linsux.org

  6. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On 2008-09-17, Roger wrote:
    >>

    > I use it the way many people use a laptop. For email, web surfing and
    > light computing. If I need to transcode a bunch of videos then I have a
    > desktop for heavy computing needs. And since it's for light computing, the
    > fan shouldn't be running at max speed to cool the CPU. Oh, that's right.
    > Some Linux app hung and is trying to fry my CPU and kill my battery.


    Cut the hyperbole, buddy.

    It isn't a "linux" app. I don't even have it installed.

    According to your posted "top screenshot" it wasn't running at 100%, but
    at less than 70%. How the **** could it "fry" your CPU or "kill" your
    battery?

    >> Ok, so some application that is basically the Linux equivalent of
    >> "some 3rd party app" isn't so hot. Big fat hairy deal.

    >
    > If it got installed from the Ubuntu CD then it isn't a 3rd party app. And
    > it is a big fat hairy deal if it's making someone's laptop run hot and is
    > draining the crap out of the battery.


    Oh boohoo... my heart bleeds for you.

    Fix it and stop ****ing whining.

    >> Without the trolls, some of us would never be aware of some of t
    >> these "problems".

    >
    > Your ignorance and ability to ignore Linux faults isn't my problem.


    Your "problem", you fix it.

    >> If this app is eating up your CPU cycles and is a mystery then the
    >> obvious thing to do is to KILL it and then uninstall it.


    > Kill it huh? For starters most users will have no idea how to kill an app
    > or that it's even in a endless loop. Other than the cooling fan running at
    > max speed and the hot air being blown out the back of the case most people
    > won't know that some Linux app just **** the bed on them.


    "Most" users know how to hit the the "k" button. You are being
    deliberately obtuse.

    Are you whining about your inability to run Linux, or are standing as a
    representative of the mythical "General User"?

    [trolling deleted]

    --
    Regards,

    Gregory.
    Gentoo Linux - Penguin Power

  7. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:33:18 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:

    > On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:26:42 -0400, Roger wrote:
    >
    >> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:59:50 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:38:42 -0400, Roger wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> I wonder why Linux makes it so easy to "kill" applications.
    >>>>It had to evolve this way because so much crap gets broken that users
    >>>>have to kill apps.
    >>>
    >>> It looks like you are running Ubuntu 7.xx ?
    >>>
    >>> If so, I would update to 8.xx, IOW Hardy.
    >>>
    >>> There is a world of difference between the 7 versions and the 8
    >>> version. I had a lot of troubles with 7.xx and in general was not
    >>> impressed with Ubuntu.
    >>>
    >>> Trying out Hardy made all the difference for me. Same machine except
    >>> for video card.

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> I would upgrade but it was such a PITA to configure and get everything
    >> working with 7.10 that I don't want to have to go through that again...
    >> ever.
    >>
    >> It's been a while now (obvious since 7.10 is fairly old) but I had to
    >> make all
    >>sorts of tweaks and changes to get wireless and the video working
    >>properly.
    >> There's a bunch of other changes I made that are mostly
    >>network related to control access to the other machines on the network,
    >>DNS, file sharing, printing etc.
    >>
    >> I'd upgrade but I don't want to see all of my custom settings wiped out
    >> where I have to go through that **** all over again.
    >>
    >> And why did Ubuntu drop support for 7.10 less than a year after it was
    >> released.
    >>I've heard morons wining that MS was dropping support for Win98. That's
    >>TEN freaking YEARS ago. Ubuntu won't support their **** for 10 months.

    >
    > A lot of the configuration stuff should be in your /home directory.
    >
    >


    My own settings for stuff like the browser and mail are in my home
    directory. But the system settings are all over the place. The ones that I
    can think of are somewhere in the /etc dir structure. The other ones that
    I can't think of are?????

    /etc/samba/smb.conf for shared folders /etc/X11/xorg.conf for the display
    /etc/squid/squid.conf for the proxy server /etc/resolv.conf has a bunch of
    networking settings /etc/hostname has the name of the machine

    There's probably a few more files that I had to setup and config along the
    way. Hell if I know what and where they are.


    > I would take the time to update if I were you.
    >
    > The upgrade cycle for Linux is a lot different than Windows. There are
    > advantages and disadvantages to both models.



    Upgrading either Windows or Linux basically sucks. At least with Windows
    it's once every few years but Linux expects you to upgrade (or lose
    support) every other month. Here's one area where the Mac does it better
    than either one IMO.

  8. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    Hash: SHA1

    ____/ Roger on Wednesday 17 September 2008 15:31 : \____

    > X-Trace: feeder.motzarella.org
    >

    U2FsdGVkX18Cy30qLzycfJRXjC/8HCcVy9YIGRNaFOR9kl4P//uuy8aG0c6fbuQ/hEwKwUnHIEnGy5r8Awb3Oiwh4+3JiTdgi/fi/351jnTL1MIi2ZjjHp9IiULkUcAlrUHLy9c+9Q0ULKhYC32uP

    ..-------------------------------------------------.
    |____________________________________________O_-_X|
    | File Options Tools Help |
    `_-_____-________-______-_________________________'
    | Alert |____________
    | *Plonk* ' Subject |______________
    `----------. *Sender* ' Troll |
    `----------. Idiot |
    | Moron |
    | Twit |
    | Imbecile |
    | Changeling |
    | Cretin |
    | Asshole |
    | Weird |
    | Dunce |
    | Kook |
    | Eerie |
    | *Linewrap* |
    | Morph |
    `------------'
    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
    Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)

    iEYEARECAAYFAkjRdp8ACgkQU4xAY3RXLo7HZQCgrsJrmX45Be i3ZYjxorZT2bPX
    SmoAnjaxEF5vF+qEjEnKq2t3SUY/Xulj
    =9VbJ
    -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

  9. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On 2008-09-17, Roger wrote:
    > On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 18:47:08 +0200, Hadron wrote:
    >
    >> Roger writes:
    >>
    >>> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:29:01 +0000, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> Roger wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 09:01:00 -0700, nessuno@wigner.berkeley.edu wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> On Sep 17, 8:53 am, Robin T Cox wrote:
    >>>>>>> Roger wrote:

    [deletia]
    >>> focus to the Filename field which visually looks like it already has the
    >>> focus.

    >>
    >> Gnome is worse in general. Buttons and so forth do not work unless you
    >> move the mouse away from them and then refocus them.
    >>
    >> There are some real rough edges in a lot of the GUI apps. A shame. In
    >> COLA they things thats ok because they are not "wintards". They are, of
    >> course, simply clueless and pretend to see the benefit of a consistent
    >> UI experience with sensible defaults for initial focus and tab order.

    >
    > The simple, most basic "File Save" dialog is a complete joke. Surely the code monkeys that wrote the file-save dialog would have tested it once or twice themselves.
    >
    > And this is nothing. I tried a couple of graphic apps and each one of them felt the need to create their own Color Chooser disaster. You'd think it would be more efficient if they got together and created one diasterous nightmare dialog that they all could use. But of course every code monkey wants his own 5 minutes of fame because wants to re-invent the same thing again his own way.


    ....applications recreating all of the basic widgets.

    That makes me nostalgiac for Windows development.

    You are trying to damn Linux for something the 800lb gorilla
    in the market isn't prone to do any better with.

    [deletia]

    The trolls are reduced to whining about minutia...

    --

    Nothing today, likely nothing since we tamed fire,
    is genuinely new: culture, like science and |||
    technology grows by accretion, each new creator / | \
    building on the works of those that came before.

    Judge Alex Kozinski
    US Court of Appeals
    9th Circuit


    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    http://www.usenet.com

  10. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On 2008-09-17, Roger wrote:
    > On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:52:27 -0500, JEDIDIAH wrote:
    >
    >> On 2008-09-17, Roger wrote:
    >>> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:16:59 -0400, Linonut wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> * Roger peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>>>
    >>>>> ***** Suddenly I notice that the cooling fan on the laptop is
    >>>>> roaring. I run PS and see that some 'scrollkeeper-up' application is
    >>>>> pegging my CPU.
    >>>>
    >>>> "Roaring". Nice hyperbolic touch, there.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>> Yeah "roaring" - I've had this laptop for about 2 years and I've never
    >>> heard the CPU fan have to run at the highest speed in order to keep the

    >>
    >> You must use it like a doorstop then.
    >>

    > I use it the way many people use a laptop. For email, web surfing and
    > light computing. If I need to transcode a bunch of videos then I have a


    IOW, a doorstop. You would be better off getting a lesser machine
    and then not worry so much about heating and ventilation issues.

    Some software decided to take advantage of the available hardware.
    How dare it. It (and it's developers) should be just so ashamed.

    > desktop for heavy computing needs. And since it's for light computing, the
    > fan shouldn't be running at max speed to cool the CPU. Oh, that's right.
    > Some Linux app hung and is trying to fry my CPU and kill my battery.


    Ok. So some app is running amok.

    What do you do when a Windows app runs amok? It's a common enough
    occurence.

    >
    >
    >>> CPU cool. Evidently this 'scrollkeeper-up' application has a history of
    >>> maxing out the CPU so what do you expect a laptop to do when the CPU
    >>> runs at 100% for who knows how long.

    >>
    >> Ok, so some application that is basically the Linux equivalent of
    >> "some 3rd party app" isn't so hot. Big fat hairy deal.

    >
    > If it got installed from the Ubuntu CD then it isn't a 3rd party app. And
    > it is a big fat hairy deal if it's making someone's laptop run hot and is
    > draining the crap out of the battery.


    See rant #1.

    >
    >
    >> [deletia]
    >>
    >> Without the trolls, some of us would never be aware of some of t
    >> these "problems".

    >
    > Your ignorance and ability to ignore Linux faults isn't my problem.


    No. This is just "so not the drama" you trolls make it out to be.

    >
    >
    >> If this app is eating up your CPU cycles and is a mystery then the
    >> obvious thing to do is to KILL it and then uninstall it.

    > Kill it huh? For starters most users will have no idea how to kill an app


    Same problem as if they were using Windows:

    Willful ignorance.
    Willful helplessness.

    > or that it's even in a endless loop. Other than the cooling fan running at
    > max speed and the hot air being blown out the back of the case most people
    > won't know that some Linux app just **** the bed on them.
    >
    > Uninstall it huh? Another "brilliant" idea from the resident idiot who
    > thinks he actually knows something.
    >
    > http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=578472
    >
    >
    > However, when I run Ubuntu I noticed a process called "scrollkeeper-up"
    > (=> scrollkeeper-update) often running and consuming a lot of CPU
    > resources. This is undesirable for two reasons: 1) The noisy CPU fan
    > begins to operate 2) The system becomes less responsive
    >
    > So I want to uninstall Scrollkeeper if possible. But when I try to do that
    > using the Synaptic package manager, it indicates that this operation will
    > require removing software that I do not want removed under any
    > circumstance
    >
    > But unfortunately there are also about 30 other programs besides
    > "ubuntu-desktop" that Synaptic wants to remove, including "gedit",
    > "nautilus" and "synaptic",


    ...a great example of "cherry picking".

    That same thread also tells you that you can install an alternate
    without problems or just remove the offending app directly.

    >
    >
    > Yeah.. so just "uninstall it" and watch half the OS get uninstalled along
    > with it. Your break is over. Get back to what you know something about...
    > serving burgers and fries.
    >
    >
    >
    >> This goes for any OS but probably is easier for Linux.

    >
    > I wonder why Linux makes it so easy to "kill" applications. It had to evolve this way because so much crap gets broken that users have to kill apps.
    >


    Yes. Developers will write crap. It's been going on since the dawn
    of time. You can either make your OS so that it's somewhat tolerant of this
    sort of thing (VMS, Unix, MacOSX, Linux) or you can make it so it will ****
    a brick throw up a panic and die (MS-DOS, Windows).

    I had never heard of this before you trolls brought it up. It runs
    in 3 minutes on a "cheapest I could lay my hands on" sort of system.
    Meanwhile, everything chugs along on it's merry way.

    The only way you would know to complain is that a cpu fan is on.

    --

    Nothing today, likely nothing since we tamed fire,
    is genuinely new: culture, like science and |||
    technology grows by accretion, each new creator / | \
    building on the works of those that came before.

    Judge Alex Kozinski
    US Court of Appeals
    9th Circuit


    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    http://www.usenet.com

  11. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On 2008-09-17, Roger wrote:
    > On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:33:18 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:26:42 -0400, Roger wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:59:50 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:38:42 -0400, Roger wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> I wonder why Linux makes it so easy to "kill" applications.
    >>>>>It had to evolve this way because so much crap gets broken that users
    >>>>>have to kill apps.
    >>>>
    >>>> It looks like you are running Ubuntu 7.xx ?
    >>>>
    >>>> If so, I would update to 8.xx, IOW Hardy.
    >>>>
    >>>> There is a world of difference between the 7 versions and the 8
    >>>> version. I had a lot of troubles with 7.xx and in general was not
    >>>> impressed with Ubuntu.
    >>>>
    >>>> Trying out Hardy made all the difference for me. Same machine except
    >>>> for video card.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> I would upgrade but it was such a PITA to configure and get everything
    >>> working with 7.10 that I don't want to have to go through that again...
    >>> ever.
    >>>
    >>> It's been a while now (obvious since 7.10 is fairly old) but I had to
    >>> make all
    >>>sorts of tweaks and changes to get wireless and the video working
    >>>properly.
    >>> There's a bunch of other changes I made that are mostly
    >>>network related to control access to the other machines on the network,
    >>>DNS, file sharing, printing etc.
    >>>
    >>> I'd upgrade but I don't want to see all of my custom settings wiped out
    >>> where I have to go through that **** all over again.
    >>>
    >>> And why did Ubuntu drop support for 7.10 less than a year after it was
    >>> released.
    >>>I've heard morons wining that MS was dropping support for Win98. That's
    >>>TEN freaking YEARS ago. Ubuntu won't support their **** for 10 months.

    >>
    >> A lot of the configuration stuff should be in your /home directory.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > My own settings for stuff like the browser and mail are in my home
    > directory. But the system settings are all over the place. The ones that I
    > can think of are somewhere in the /etc dir structure. The other ones that
    > I can't think of are?????
    >
    > /etc/samba/smb.conf for shared folders /etc/X11/xorg.conf for the display
    > /etc/squid/squid.conf for the proxy server /etc/resolv.conf has a bunch of
    > networking settings /etc/hostname has the name of the machine


    ....IOW, in the /etc/ directory.

    >
    > There's probably a few more files that I had to setup and config along the
    > way. Hell if I know what and where they are.


    It could be worse. You could be stuck figuring out arcane windows
    registry keys. Some of that stuff is intentionally obfuscated or
    obfuscated by design.

    >
    >
    >> I would take the time to update if I were you.
    >>
    >> The upgrade cycle for Linux is a lot different than Windows. There are
    >> advantages and disadvantages to both models.

    >
    >
    > Upgrading either Windows or Linux basically sucks. At least with Windows
    > it's once every few years but Linux expects you to upgrade (or lose
    > support) every other month. Here's one area where the Mac does it better
    > than either one IMO.


    A Linux "upgrade" will not alter a working configuration.

    What you are describing is "blowing it away" and reinstalling it.

    With a Debian variant (like Ubuntu), you will get prompted whether
    or not you want to retain a configuration that you've changed locally.

    --
    Apple: Because a large harddrive is for power users.
    |||
    / | \

    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    http://www.usenet.com

  12. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    Roger wrote:

    > And why did Ubuntu drop support for 7.10 less than a year after it was
    > released. I've heard morons wining that MS was dropping support for Win98.
    > That's TEN freaking YEARS ago. Ubuntu won't support their **** for 10
    > months.


    Not FYI, but rather that of any innocent noob who might be reading the tripe
    that you are posting:-

    AFAIK Ubuntu support for 7.10 is 18 months from release, so to April 2009.

    LTS releases have 3 years from release, 5 years for server editions.
    8.04 *is* a LTS release, and will be supported until April 2011 (2013 for
    Server).

    New LTS releases occur on a 2-year schedule, 6-month schedule for other
    releases.

    (If I have any of that wrong, perhaps somebody who knows what they are talking
    about can correct me, rather than this Roger clown?)


  13. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On 2008-09-17, bbgruff wrote:
    > Roger wrote:
    >
    >> And why did Ubuntu drop support for 7.10 less than a year after it was
    >> released. I've heard morons wining that MS was dropping support for Win98.
    >> That's TEN freaking YEARS ago. Ubuntu won't support their **** for 10
    >> months.


    There is of course a BIG difference with Windows.

    You PAID for Windows.

    You will have to PAY to get something to replace it.

    There are also artifical planned obsolences that will push
    you away from the old Microsoft product and to the new Microsoft
    product. It's not just the lack of respect from Microsoft but
    across the board.

    If Microsoft were offering free copies of Vista to everyone
    then the situation would be comparable.

    >
    > Not FYI, but rather that of any innocent noob who might be reading the tripe
    > that you are posting:-
    >
    > AFAIK Ubuntu support for 7.10 is 18 months from release, so to April 2009.
    >
    > LTS releases have 3 years from release, 5 years for server editions.
    > 8.04 *is* a LTS release, and will be supported until April 2011 (2013 for
    > Server).
    >
    > New LTS releases occur on a 2-year schedule, 6-month schedule for other
    > releases.
    >
    > (If I have any of that wrong, perhaps somebody who knows what they are talking
    > about can correct me, rather than this Roger clown?)
    >



    --
    Apple: Because a large harddrive is for power users.
    |||
    / | \

    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    http://www.usenet.com

  14. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:38:42 -0400, Roger wrote:

    > If it got installed from the Ubuntu CD then it isn't a 3rd party app.



    If you're the first and Ubuntu is the second, then which
    party made firefox?


    -Thufir

  15. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On 2008-09-17, Roger wrote:
    > On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:59:50 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >
    >> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:38:42 -0400, Roger wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>> I wonder why Linux makes it so easy to "kill" applications.
    >>>It had to evolve this way because so much crap gets broken that users
    >>>have to kill apps.

    >>
    >> It looks like you are running Ubuntu 7.xx ?
    >>
    >> If so, I would update to 8.xx, IOW Hardy.
    >>
    >> There is a world of difference between the 7 versions and the 8 version.
    >> I had a lot of troubles with 7.xx and in general was not impressed with
    >> Ubuntu.
    >>
    >> Trying out Hardy made all the difference for me. Same machine except for
    >> video card.


    > I would upgrade but it was such a PITA to configure and get everything working with 7.10 that I don't want to have to go through that again... ever.


    Why should you have to "got through" anything?

    > It's been a while now (obvious since 7.10 is fairly old) but I had to make all sorts of tweaks and changes to get wireless and the video working properly. There's a bunch of other changes I made that are mostly network related to control access to the other machines on the network, DNS, file sharing, printing etc.


    Ah! I see why things are so much trouble for you. You have a badly
    configured network. DNS, printing, file "sharing" etc should be
    automatically configured via DHCP etc...

    > I'd upgrade but I don't want to see all of my custom settings wiped out where I have to go through that **** all over again.

    So backup /etc... problem solved.

    You sure sound like a troll to me.


    > And why did Ubuntu drop support for 7.10 less than a year after it was released. I've heard morons wining that MS was dropping support for Win98. That's TEN freaking YEARS ago. Ubuntu won't support their **** for 10 months.


    You obviously have no clue at all about running a system. Give it away,
    so we don't have to see your whining.

    --
    Regards,

    Gregory.
    Gentoo Linux - Penguin Power

  16. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    Roger wrote:

    > I decided to boot my laptop into Ubuntu today. I was probably due for a
    > few updates and I wanted to check out a few things. I start Ubuntu, log in
    > and the first thing that I notice is that some of the gDesklets that I
    > installed didn't start. Logging out then logging back in fixed this and
    > now I have the CPU, Memory, network and Analog Clock desklet running
    > again.
    >
    > A few seconds later the notifier pops up telling me that I have 20-Megs of
    > updates to download and install. The list looks good so I type in my
    > password and start the download. A couple of the downloads that it tells
    > me that are available are these Firefox updates:
    >
    >
    > Version 2.0.0.15+1nobinonly-0ubuntu0.7.10:
    >
    > * New security/stability upstream release (v2.0.0.15)
    > - see USN-619-1
    >
    >
    > Great except that the download fails. It tells me that the downloads are
    > available but apparently they aren't.
    >
    >
    > W: Failed to fetch
    >

    http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/po....7.10_i386.deb
    > 404 Not Found
    >
    > W: Failed to fetch
    >

    http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/po....7.10_i386.deb
    > 404 Not Found
    >
    >
    >
    > ***** Suddenly I notice that the cooling fan on the laptop is roaring. I
    > run PS and see that some 'scrollkeeper-up' application is pegging my CPU.
    >
    >
    > top - 15:55:42 up 36 min, 2 users, load average: 2.12, 3.19, 2.68
    > Tasks: 113 total, 2 running, 111 sleeping, 0 stopped, 0 zombie
    > Cpu(s): 52.0%us, 4.2%sy, 13.9%ni, 22.0%id, 7.3%wa, 0.4%hi, 0.3%si,
    > 0.0%st
    > Mem: 507596k total, 501904k used, 5692k free, 13500k buffers
    > Swap: 1052248k total, 34700k used, 1017548k free, 140912k cached
    >
    > PID USER PR NI VIRT RES SHR S %CPU %MEM TIME+ COMMAND
    > 6553 root 35 10 58232 55m 1464 R 69.3 11.1 5:09.34
    > scrollkeeper-up
    > 12946 zeke 15 0 43660 27m 11m S 7.9 5.6 0:09.14 python
    > 1 root 18 0 2952 1856 532 S 0.0 0.4 0:01.34 init
    > 2 root 14 -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 kthreadd
    > 3 root RT -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 migration/0
    > 4 root 34 19 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 ksoftirqd/0
    > 5 root RT -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 watchdog/0
    > 6 root 10 -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.01 events/0
    > 7 root 17 -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 khelper
    >
    >
    >
    > I decide to capture all of this into a file so that I can post it here. So
    > I run gedit 2.20.3. I then press "Ctrl+S" to save the file and even this
    > is screwed up.
    >
    > Focus appears to be at top of the dialog where you type in the filename
    > for the document. But you can't even type in the filename because even
    > though it "looks" like that's where the input focus is when you start
    > typing chars the list of folders/subdirectories is getting selected as you
    > type. You have to explicitly set the focus to the filename control before
    > you can enter the name of the file.
    >
    > Absolutely terrible!!!!
    >
    >
    > Generally I like Linux and would use it more but right now there are way
    > too many rough edges for the general consumer to use this OS on a regular
    > basis.


    You're a poor sad case. I've just recently installed Ubuntu 8.04 on an MSI
    Wind. Throughout the whole process, the computer was not stressed in the
    slightest. The whole installation process, including copying across my home
    directory, took around an hour. It is now a really great little travel
    partner.

    For what I have to do, Ubuntu has far fewer rough edges than Windows.

    Ian

  17. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On 2008-09-19, Ian Hilliard claimed:
    > Roger wrote:




    > You're a poor sad case. I've just recently installed Ubuntu 8.04 on an MSI
    > Wind. Throughout the whole process, the computer was not stressed in the
    > slightest. The whole installation process, including copying across my home
    > directory, took around an hour. It is now a really great little travel
    > partner.
    >
    > For what I have to do, Ubuntu has far fewer rough edges than Windows.


    It was the cheesy (motzarella) moron. Probably pieced together a bunch
    of crap discovered on search engines so s/h/it could have "problems"
    like that.

    --
    "Windows Vista performance", on the next "In Search Of".

    ---- Posted via Pronews.com - Premium Corporate Usenet News Provider ----
    http://www.pronews.com offers corporate packages that have access to 100,000+ newsgroups

  18. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    Ian Hilliard writes:

    > Roger wrote:
    >
    >> I decided to boot my laptop into Ubuntu today. I was probably due for a
    >> few updates and I wanted to check out a few things. I start Ubuntu, log in
    >> and the first thing that I notice is that some of the gDesklets that I
    >> installed didn't start. Logging out then logging back in fixed this and
    >> now I have the CPU, Memory, network and Analog Clock desklet running
    >> again.
    >>
    >> A few seconds later the notifier pops up telling me that I have 20-Megs of
    >> updates to download and install. The list looks good so I type in my
    >> password and start the download. A couple of the downloads that it tells
    >> me that are available are these Firefox updates:
    >>
    >>
    >> Version 2.0.0.15+1nobinonly-0ubuntu0.7.10:
    >>
    >> * New security/stability upstream release (v2.0.0.15)
    >> - see USN-619-1
    >>
    >>
    >> Great except that the download fails. It tells me that the downloads are
    >> available but apparently they aren't.
    >>
    >>
    >> W: Failed to fetch
    >>

    > http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/po....7.10_i386.deb
    >> 404 Not Found
    >>
    >> W: Failed to fetch
    >>

    > http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/po....7.10_i386.deb
    >> 404 Not Found
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> ***** Suddenly I notice that the cooling fan on the laptop is roaring. I
    >> run PS and see that some 'scrollkeeper-up' application is pegging my CPU.
    >>
    >>
    >> top - 15:55:42 up 36 min, 2 users, load average: 2.12, 3.19, 2.68
    >> Tasks: 113 total, 2 running, 111 sleeping, 0 stopped, 0 zombie
    >> Cpu(s): 52.0%us, 4.2%sy, 13.9%ni, 22.0%id, 7.3%wa, 0.4%hi, 0.3%si,
    >> 0.0%st
    >> Mem: 507596k total, 501904k used, 5692k free, 13500k buffers
    >> Swap: 1052248k total, 34700k used, 1017548k free, 140912k cached
    >>
    >> PID USER PR NI VIRT RES SHR S %CPU %MEM TIME+ COMMAND
    >> 6553 root 35 10 58232 55m 1464 R 69.3 11.1 5:09.34
    >> scrollkeeper-up
    >> 12946 zeke 15 0 43660 27m 11m S 7.9 5.6 0:09.14 python
    >> 1 root 18 0 2952 1856 532 S 0.0 0.4 0:01.34 init
    >> 2 root 14 -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 kthreadd
    >> 3 root RT -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 migration/0
    >> 4 root 34 19 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 ksoftirqd/0
    >> 5 root RT -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 watchdog/0
    >> 6 root 10 -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.01 events/0
    >> 7 root 17 -5 0 0 0 S 0.0 0.0 0:00.00 khelper
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> I decide to capture all of this into a file so that I can post it here. So
    >> I run gedit 2.20.3. I then press "Ctrl+S" to save the file and even this
    >> is screwed up.
    >>
    >> Focus appears to be at top of the dialog where you type in the filename
    >> for the document. But you can't even type in the filename because even
    >> though it "looks" like that's where the input focus is when you start
    >> typing chars the list of folders/subdirectories is getting selected as you
    >> type. You have to explicitly set the focus to the filename control before
    >> you can enter the name of the file.
    >>
    >> Absolutely terrible!!!!
    >>
    >>
    >> Generally I like Linux and would use it more but right now there are way
    >> too many rough edges for the general consumer to use this OS on a regular
    >> basis.

    >
    > You're a poor sad case. I've just recently installed Ubuntu 8.04 on an MSI
    > Wind. Throughout the whole process, the computer was not stressed in the
    > slightest. The whole installation process, including copying across my home
    > directory, took around an hour. It is now a really great little travel
    > partner.
    >
    > For what I have to do, Ubuntu has far fewer rough edges than Windows.
    >
    > Ian


    That strange. I always thought your chose the OS *after* you did what
    you had to do :-;

    --
    "I do believe I have stated that he should be given the benefit of the
    doubt, as is his right. If he did this crime, as it would seem, then he
    should be punished as the law requires."
    -- alt in alt.true-crime, comp.os.linux.advocacy

  19. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On Thu, 18 Sep 2008 05:19:33 +0000, Gregory Shearman wrote:

    > On 2008-09-17, Roger wrote:
    >> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:59:50 -0400, Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:38:42 -0400, Roger wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> I wonder why Linux makes it so easy to "kill" applications.
    >>>>It had to evolve this way because so much crap gets broken that users
    >>>>have to kill apps.
    >>>
    >>> It looks like you are running Ubuntu 7.xx ?
    >>>
    >>> If so, I would update to 8.xx, IOW Hardy.
    >>>
    >>> There is a world of difference between the 7 versions and the 8 version.
    >>> I had a lot of troubles with 7.xx and in general was not impressed with
    >>> Ubuntu.
    >>>
    >>> Trying out Hardy made all the difference for me. Same machine except for
    >>> video card.

    >
    >> I would upgrade but it was such a PITA to configure and get everything working with 7.10 that I don't want to have to go through that again... ever.

    >
    > Why should you have to "got through" anything?
    >


    You have no idea what you're talking about.


    >> It's been a while now (obvious since 7.10 is fairly old) but I had to make all sorts of tweaks and changes to get wireless and the video working properly. There's a bunch of other changes I made that are mostly network related to control access to the other machines on the network, DNS, file sharing, printing etc.

    >
    > Ah! I see why things are so much trouble for you. You have a badly
    > configured network.


    Ubuntu didn't recognize the wireless adapter in my laptop. What the hell
    does my network configuration have to do with anything if Linux can't
    properly detect or configure my wireless adapter?


    > DNS, printing, file "sharing" etc should be automatically configured via
    > DHCP etc...


    You are beyond cleuless. How is DHCP going to automatically configure my
    printing or file sharing? DHCP will retrieve the DNS information but DHCP
    has absolutely nothing to do with printer and file sharing.

    >
    >> I'd upgrade but I don't want to see all of my custom settings wiped out
    >> where I have to go through that **** all over again.

    > So backup /etc... problem solved.



    Not solved at all. Then I should do what after I install the new OS.
    Simply overwrite every new file in /etc with the older version from my
    previous install? That's a sure way to create a entire set of new
    problems.


    > You sure sound like a troll to me.


    You sure sound like a clueless idiot to me. Tell me again how Ubuntu's failure to detect my wireless adapter is a configuration issue with my network. Or tell me oh-wise-one how DHCP is going to configure Samba file sharing for me.

    >
    >> And why did Ubuntu drop support for 7.10 less than a year after it was
    >> released. I've heard morons wining that MS was dropping support for
    >> Win98. That's TEN freaking YEARS ago. Ubuntu won't support their ****
    >> for 10 months.

    >
    > You obviously have no clue at all about running a system. Give it away,
    > so we don't have to see your whining.



    You obviously have no clue about anything. Hey Greggy boy... tell me how DHCP automatically configures printer sharing for me you moron.


  20. Re: Linux works - If you ignore the rough edges.

    On Fri, 19 Sep 2008 06:42:47 -0500, Sinister Midget wrote:

    > On 2008-09-19, Ian Hilliard claimed:
    >> Roger wrote:

    >
    >
    >
    >> You're a poor sad case. I've just recently installed Ubuntu 8.04 on an MSI
    >> Wind. Throughout the whole process, the computer was not stressed in the
    >> slightest. The whole installation process, including copying across my home
    >> directory, took around an hour. It is now a really great little travel
    >> partner.
    >>
    >> For what I have to do, Ubuntu has far fewer rough edges than Windows.

    >
    > It was the cheesy (motzarella) moron. Probably pieced together a bunch
    > of crap discovered on search engines so s/h/it could have "problems"
    > like that.




    Yeah right moron. According to your 'midget brain' nobody has "problems" with Ubuntu. Ubuntu is perfect and all of these reported problems are people just finding stuff on the web to complain about.

    Run along now midget brain. The short bus will be here shortly to bring you to idiot school.


+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 LastLast