Who wants to go linux? - Linux

This is a discussion on Who wants to go linux? - Linux ; Users want a Mac. Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience. Users want Microsoft. That is where the jobs are. Users don't want Linux. NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks. Why is this so hard for linux ...

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Thread: Who wants to go linux?

  1. Who wants to go linux?

    Users want a Mac.
    Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience.

    Users want Microsoft.
    That is where the jobs are.

    Users don't want Linux.
    NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.

    Why is this so hard for linux geeks to understand?

  2. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On Tue, 05 Aug 2008 06:51:21 -0700, Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:

    > Users want a Mac.


    Some do.

    > Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience.
    >
    > Users want Microsoft.


    As hard as it is to believe, some actually do want Microsoft. The
    overwhelming majority, however, are just caught up in inertia.

    > That is where the jobs are.


    That is where some jobs are.

    >
    > Users don't want Linux.


    That would explain why Linux systems just got to 2.8% marketshare (at
    least) in England. That would explain why the Linux based Netbooks are
    sellingout.

    > NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.


    Are you inferring that you have to use a terminal in order to use Linux
    based systems? if so, you're an idiot.

    >
    > Why is this so hard for linux geeks to understand?


    Why are you such an idiot, and a dishonest idiot at that?


    --
    Rick

  3. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On Tue, 05 Aug 2008 06:51:21 -0700, Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:

    > Users want a Mac.
    > Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience.
    >
    > Users want Microsoft.
    > That is where the jobs are.


    Interesting. I worked a 30 year career of scientific software support and
    development without MS. Last 15 was entirely Unix and Linux.

    >
    > Users don't want Linux.
    > NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.


    Can use the terminal if you want, but it is certainly not necessary. I
    guess you haven't heard of X windows.


    >
    > Why is this so hard for linux geeks to understand?


    Possibly because it's not true.


  4. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On 2008-08-05, Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:
    > Users want a Mac.
    > Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience.
    >
    > Users want Microsoft.
    > That is where the jobs are.
    >
    > Users don't want Linux.
    > NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.


    That old line again eh?

    Unix had a proper GUI before Microsoft did.

    >
    > Why is this so hard for linux geeks to understand?


    ....probably the part about being a total lie.

    Nevermind the whole long sorted history of WinDOS being exactly
    the sort of actively user hostile sort of thing that Lemmings
    like to mischaracterize Linux as.

    --
    If you are going to judge Linux based on how easy
    it is to get onto a Macintosh. Let's try installing |||
    MacOS X on a DELL! / | \

    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
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  5. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Psyc Geek (TAB)

    wrote
    on Tue, 5 Aug 2008 06:51:21 -0700 (PDT)
    <53f2d6da-97cc-47ab-9c9e-55c5c20a474e@m73g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>:
    > Users want a Mac.


    Users want something that works. Macs do fill the bill
    in many particulars; so does a Intel computer preloaded
    with Windows software.

    If anything, MacOSX is eating our lunch. ;-)

    > Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience.


    They do make Aqua colorful, and reasonably useful.

    >
    > Users want Microsoft.
    > That is where the jobs are.


    That's a bit of a non-sequitor. Users want *Windows*,
    or Microsoft tools. (I'm not even sure about the latter,
    though the term "Linux job" is a bit of a misnomer,
    methinks, unless someone is sought for writing a driver
    for a new interface board.)

    >
    > Users don't want Linux.
    > NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.


    It is entirely possible that a casual computer user who
    can't figure out where to put his hands on his (say)
    lingerie-wearing wife, let alone a modern 100+-key
    keyboard, might prefer a GUI; one would hope most people
    are a little more sophisticated than that.

    In that, Apple has a major advantage: Mac mice generally
    have exactly one button. (Of course, those of us used to X
    -- which BTW allows for up to 5 buttons, though back then
    I think the notion was a digitizing puck -- can usually
    handle at least three, with the other two being part of
    the scroll wheel actually.)

    >
    > Why is this so hard for linux geeks to understand?


    And what precisely is missing from a modern Linux gui?
    Be specific.

    I'll admit I'd like to see more GUIfication of things
    such as entries in /etc/hosts, /etc/fstab, /etc/pam.d, and
    'crontab -e' (though in the last case little more is needed
    other than to use an actual GUI editor such as gedit),
    but anyone with more than two functioning neurons can
    probably read any of those files and figure out what new
    entries to put therein, especially with 'man' helping out.

    Then again, if one can't figure out that "Microsoft Windows"
    is a trademark and "basement windows" is not, then I have
    no idea how to teach users in the subtleties of
    /dev/disk/by-uuid/????????-????-????-????-???????????? .
    (yes, that's a legitimate glob).

    Too geeky for you? Perhaps. But computers are not toasters,
    wishes of certain Mac execs notwithstanding.

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Insert random misquote here.
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  6. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On 2008-08-05, Rick wrote:

    >> NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.

    >
    > Are you inferring that you have to use a terminal in order to use Linux
    > based systems? if so, you're an idiot.


    Exactly my though. Anyone who cannot get X up and running in this day
    and age must have some serious issues in the brain cell department...
    X is so advanced I can install it on a USB stick, boot it off almost any
    computer I want and have a fully functional DE with full colour depth
    and resolution.

    Besides, one wants to use the terminal to get the job done as quickly
    as possible, not because ones's a geek.

    --
    Hasta la vista, baby.
    ~ T-1000

  7. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    * The Ghost In The Machine peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > shows some of the more interesting particulars. Basically,
    > Windows 1.0 was announced (and demonstrated!) in 1983;
    > Windows 1.01 was released in late 1985.


    What version was it before Windows mastered the basics of overlapping
    Windows (as opposed to tiled windows)?

    --
    If little green men land in your back yard, hide any little green women
    you've got in the house.
    -- Mike Harding, "The Armchair Anarchist's Almanac"

  8. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    Linonut wrote:

    > * The Ghost In The Machine peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >
    >> shows some of the more interesting particulars. Basically,
    >> Windows 1.0 was announced (and demonstrated!) in 1983;
    >> Windows 1.01 was released in late 1985.

    >
    > What version was it before Windows mastered the basics of overlapping
    > Windows (as opposed to tiled windows)?
    >


    2.x
    --
    Don't steal. Microsoft hates competition.


  9. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On Aug 5, 10:38*am, ray wrote:
    > On Tue, 05 Aug 2008 06:51:21 -0700, Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:
    > > Users want a Mac.
    > > Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience.

    >
    > > Users want Microsoft.
    > > That is where the jobs are.

    >
    > Interesting. I worked a 30 year career of scientific software support and
    > development without MS. Last 15 was entirely Unix and Linux.
    >
    >
    >
    > > Users don't want Linux.
    > > NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.

    >
    > Can use the terminal if you want, but it is certainly not necessary. I
    > guess you haven't heard of X windows.
    >


    Yes, there we have it. A Linux Geek that say's
    linux just works.

    Look at the page for ubuntu. this is april, 2008:

    http://www.ubuntugeek.com/install-mp...rdy-heron.html

    CAN YOU SAY, let me say, hold me back, T E R M I N A L
    CAN YOU SAY, let me say it, S U D O .... wooo wooooo.

    Those are the first set of instructions I found on google to insall
    codecs.
    Why do users want CODECS. Let me guess. I know the answer.
    DVD's? MMMMMMMM??????

    ANOTHER FIB CAUGHT, AND THE TRUTH WILL SET YOU FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Yep, one lie, two lies, three lies, four. Get linux and lie some
    more.

    Are you a hair dresser, by chance?




  10. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On Tue, 5 Aug 2008 15:32:49 -0700 (PDT), Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:

    > On Aug 5, 10:38*am, ray wrote:
    >> On Tue, 05 Aug 2008 06:51:21 -0700, Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:
    >>> Users want a Mac.
    >>> Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience.

    >>
    >>> Users want Microsoft.
    >>> That is where the jobs are.

    >>
    >> Interesting. I worked a 30 year career of scientific software support and
    >> development without MS. Last 15 was entirely Unix and Linux.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>> Users don't want Linux.
    >>> NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.

    >>
    >> Can use the terminal if you want, but it is certainly not necessary. I
    >> guess you haven't heard of X windows.
    >>

    >
    > Yes, there we have it. A Linux Geek that say's
    > linux just works.
    >
    > Look at the page for ubuntu. this is april, 2008:
    >
    > http://www.ubuntugeek.com/install-mp...rdy-heron.html
    >
    > CAN YOU SAY, let me say, hold me back, T E R M I N A L
    > CAN YOU SAY, let me say it, S U D O .... wooo wooooo.
    >
    > Those are the first set of instructions I found on google to insall
    > codecs.
    > Why do users want CODECS. Let me guess. I know the answer.
    > DVD's? MMMMMMMM??????
    >
    > ANOTHER FIB CAUGHT, AND THE TRUTH WILL SET YOU FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    >
    > Yep, one lie, two lies, three lies, four. Get linux and lie some
    > more.
    >
    > Are you a hair dresser, by chance?


    The COLA Linux *advocates* will LIE for LIEnix every chance they get.

    I don't think Ray is a hairdresser but I suspect High Plains Thumper might
    be a hairdresser or maybe an interior decorator.

    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  11. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Peter Köhlmann

    wrote
    on Tue, 05 Aug 2008 23:23:52 +0200
    <4898c4e8$0$12943$9b4e6d93@newsspool2.arcor-online.net>:
    > Linonut wrote:
    >
    >> * The Ghost In The Machine peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>
    >>> shows some of the more interesting particulars. Basically,
    >>> Windows 1.0 was announced (and demonstrated!) in 1983;
    >>> Windows 1.01 was released in late 1985.

    >>
    >> What version was it before Windows mastered the basics of overlapping
    >> Windows (as opposed to tiled windows)?
    >>

    >
    > 2.x


    An interesting point. Win 2.03 wasn't released until Nov 1987.
    Win 2.11 came out March 1989.

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Linux. Because life's too short for a buggy OS.
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  12. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On Tue, 05 Aug 2008 15:32:49 -0700, Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:

    > On Aug 5, 10:38Â*am, ray wrote:
    >> On Tue, 05 Aug 2008 06:51:21 -0700, Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:
    >> > Users want a Mac.
    >> > Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience.

    >>
    >> > Users want Microsoft.
    >> > That is where the jobs are.

    >>
    >> Interesting. I worked a 30 year career of scientific software support
    >> and development without MS. Last 15 was entirely Unix and Linux.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> > Users don't want Linux.
    >> > NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.

    >>
    >> Can use the terminal if you want, but it is certainly not necessary. I
    >> guess you haven't heard of X windows.
    >>
    >>

    > Yes, there we have it. A Linux Geek that say's linux just works.
    >
    > Look at the page for ubuntu. this is april, 2008:
    >
    > http://www.ubuntugeek.com/install-mp...imedia-codecs-

    libdvdcss2w32codecsw64codecs-in-ubuntu-804-hardy-heron.html
    >
    > CAN YOU SAY, let me say, hold me back, T E R M I N A L CAN YOU SAY, let
    > me say it, S U D O .... wooo wooooo.
    >
    > Those are the first set of instructions I found on google to insall
    > codecs.


    You can certainly do it that way but again, it is certainly not necessary.


    > Why do users want CODECS. Let me guess. I know the answer. DVD's?
    > MMMMMMMM??????
    >
    > ANOTHER FIB CAUGHT, AND THE TRUTH WILL SET YOU FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    >
    > Yep, one lie, two lies, three lies, four. Get linux and lie some more.
    >
    > Are you a hair dresser, by chance?


    Actually, I'm a retired computer scientist.



  13. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On 6 Aug 2008 00:47:53 GMT, ray wrote:

    >
    > Actually, I'm a retired computer scientist.


    Interesting.
    How far back do you go?
    I go back to the 370, magnetic core storage, carriage control tapes and
    punched cards...
    I actually saw a 360 machine but it was just about to be replaced so I
    didn't have any interaction with it.

    Dam, now I'm depressed


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  14. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    * The Ghost In The Machine peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Peter Köhlmann
    >> Linonut wrote:
    >>> * The Ghost In The Machine peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>>
    >>>> shows some of the more interesting particulars. Basically,
    >>>> Windows 1.0 was announced (and demonstrated!) in 1983;
    >>>> Windows 1.01 was released in late 1985.
    >>>
    >>> What version was it before Windows mastered the basics of overlapping
    >>> Windows (as opposed to tiled windows)?

    >>
    >> 2.x

    >
    > An interesting point. Win 2.03 wasn't released until Nov 1987.
    > Win 2.11 came out March 1989.


    I remember using Codeview (IIRC) from Microsoft, to do debugging. All
    tiled windows. Then I bought a copy of Borland C++, and started using
    their Turbo Debugger. Quite a bit superior, and it had tiled windows.

    (These were all text-based windows, by the way).

    So, at that point, I got the idea the Microsoft were kind of brute-force
    coders, not prone to try to generalize their software.

    But, later, they killed Borland, and rather gleefully so, as related in
    "Dynamic of Software Development", Microsoft Press, by Jim McCarthy, the
    Visual C++ team leader years ago.

    He's the guy who also said

    Portability is for canoes.

    (In spite of that bit of denseness, the book is a good view into
    programming.)

    --
    After all, what is your hosts' purpose in having a party? Surely not for
    you to enjoy yourself; if that were their sole purpose, they'd have simply
    sent champagne and women over to your place by taxi.
    -- P. J. O'Rourke

  15. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On 2008-08-05, Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:
    > On Aug 5, 10:38*am, ray wrote:
    >> On Tue, 05 Aug 2008 06:51:21 -0700, Psyc Geek (TAB) wrote:
    >> > Users want a Mac.
    >> > Apple spends a lot of time of the user experience.

    >>
    >> > Users want Microsoft.
    >> > That is where the jobs are.

    >>
    >> Interesting. I worked a 30 year career of scientific software support and
    >> development without MS. Last 15 was entirely Unix and Linux.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> > Users don't want Linux.
    >> > NOBODY wants to terminal but geeks.

    >>
    >> Can use the terminal if you want, but it is certainly not necessary. I
    >> guess you haven't heard of X windows.
    >>

    >
    > Yes, there we have it. A Linux Geek that say's
    > linux just works.
    >
    > Look at the page for ubuntu. this is april, 2008:
    >
    > http://www.ubuntugeek.com/install-mp...rdy-heron.html
    >
    > CAN YOU SAY, let me say, hold me back, T E R M I N A L


    On my copy of Ubuntu 8.04 it all just handled it automatically.

    The first time I tried to open up a DVD or media file it just
    stepped through installing the relevant packages.

    [deletia]

    Mebbe you should trawl google less and actually use this stuff...

    --
    ....as if the ability to run Cubase ever made or broke a platform.
    |||
    / | \

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    ----------------------------------------------------------
    http://www.usenet.com

  16. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    JEDIDIAH wrote:

    > Mebbe you should trawl google less and actually use this stuff...


    Geek is still trying to master the concept of opposable thumbs.

    --
    RonB
    "There's a story there...somewhere"

  17. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    * RonB peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > JEDIDIAH wrote:
    >
    >> Mebbe you should trawl google less and actually use this stuff...

    >
    > Geek is still trying to master the concept of opposable thumbs.


    He's currently gotten as far as twiddling his thumbs.

    --
    A bachelor never quite gets over the idea that he is a thing of beauty
    and a boy for ever.
    -- Helen Rowland

  18. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    > On 6 Aug 2008 00:47:53 GMT, ray wrote:
    >
    >>
    >> Actually, I'm a retired computer scientist.

    >
    > Interesting.
    > How far back do you go?
    > I go back to the 370, magnetic core storage, carriage control tapes
    > and punched cards...
    > I actually saw a 360 machine but it was just about to be replaced so I
    > didn't have any interaction with it.


    Was it a Gas Fired Shell Core 360? ;-)
    http://mecusedfoundryequipment.com/i...Machine028.jpg

    >
    > Dam, now I'm depressed










  19. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    On Wed, 6 Aug 2008 17:00:06 +0200, Clogwog wrote:

    > Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >> On 6 Aug 2008 00:47:53 GMT, ray wrote:
    >>
    >>>
    >>> Actually, I'm a retired computer scientist.

    >>
    >> Interesting.
    >> How far back do you go?
    >> I go back to the 370, magnetic core storage, carriage control tapes
    >> and punched cards...
    >> I actually saw a 360 machine but it was just about to be replaced so I
    >> didn't have any interaction with it.

    >
    > Was it a Gas Fired Shell Core 360? ;-)
    > http://mecusedfoundryequipment.com/i...Machine028.jpg


    That looks more like the Linux model to me, but I could be wrong?

    http://mecusedfoundryequipment.com/i...Machine028.jpg
    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  20. Re: Who wants to go linux?

    "Moshe Goldfarb." schreef in bericht
    news5u9t6zdlish$.g9ma2gw1qltv$.dlg@40tude.net...
    > On Wed, 6 Aug 2008 17:00:06 +0200, Clogwog wrote:
    >
    >> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
    >>> On 6 Aug 2008 00:47:53 GMT, ray wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Actually, I'm a retired computer scientist.
    >>>
    >>> Interesting.
    >>> How far back do you go?
    >>> I go back to the 370, magnetic core storage, carriage control tapes
    >>> and punched cards...
    >>> I actually saw a 360 machine but it was just about to be replaced so I
    >>> didn't have any interaction with it.

    >>
    >> Was it a Gas Fired Shell Core 360? ;-)
    >> http://mecusedfoundryequipment.com/i...Machine028.jpg

    >
    > That looks more like the Linux model to me, but I could be wrong?
    >
    > http://mecusedfoundryequipment.com/i...Machine028.jpg


    I bet Rex Ballard has one in his basement, on which he developed
    Mork/Java/Internet/Netscape/GPL/SSL/grid/cluster computing, etc.
    http://www.uh.edu/engines/ibm360.jpg


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