[News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash - Linux

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  1. [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    Hash: SHA1

    BSA: Software piracy's 'tragic' impact on US society

    ,----[ Quote ]
    | The BSA-sponsored IDC study, available here (pdf), pinpointed eight US states
    | in the report. It found significant variations from the national piracy
    | figure of 20 per cent.
    `----

    http://www.channelregister.co.uk/200...states_piracy/

    It's not "piracy" and it's clear who is paying for that pro-RAND, anti-FOSS BS
    (see below for recent BSA-IDC-Microsoft circuses all across the EU). Also new:

    European Commission sounds new patent offensive

    ,----[ Quote ]
    | Following the April 2007 initiative on "Enhancing the patent system", the
    | European Commission has now published a communication on a European
    | industrial property rights strategy (PDF). It hopes this will improve access
    | to the patent system and to trademark protection for small and medium-sized
    | enterprises (SMEs). The Commission has also announced that it intends to work
    | harder on ensuring the quality of patents granted and the promotion of
    | innovation associated with it.
    |
    | European Commission sounds new patent offensive
    |
    | Following the April 2007 initiative on "Enhancing the patent system", the
    | European Commission has now published a communication on a European
    | industrial property rights strategy (PDF). It hopes this will improve access
    | to the patent system and to trademark protection for small and medium-sized
    | enterprises (SMEs). The Commission has also announced that it intends to work
    | harder on ensuring the quality of patents granted and the promotion of
    | innovation associated with it.
    `----

    http://www.heise.de/english/newstick...985/from/rss09


    Recent:

    Microsoft urges resellers to play it straight, beef up revs

    ,----[ Quote ]
    | Microsoft has claimed that each dollar it “loses” to software piracy equals
    | $5.50 in “lost opportunities” to the firm’s channel partners.
    |
    | A Microsoft-sponsored white paper (pdf) released by IT analyst house IDC
    | yesterday highlights the effects of copyright infringement on the software
    | ecosystem across the tech industry.
    |
    | [...]
    |
    | The BSA has claimed that the value of just PC software that was counterfeited
    | in 2007 was close to $50bn worldwide.
    `----

    http://www.channelregister.co.uk/200...piracy_claims/


    BSA plays the IP card against the European Commission

    ,----[ Quote ]
    | Leave it to the Business Software Alliance (BSA) to distort the definition
    | of "open standard" in order to serve the interests of Microsoft and its other
    | members. The BSA doesn't like the European Commission's increasing interest
    | in open source and open standards to deliver software interoperability. *
    `----

    http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-9984162-16.html


    Has Anyone Received the BSA's $1M Software Piracy Reward?

    ,----[ Quoye ]
    | "The BSA hasn't yet paid out $1 million, although we are very willing to do
    | so if the opportunity arises," writes BSA spokesman Rodger Correa in an
    | e-mail. "That's how serious we take our mission of [intellectual property]
    | protection."
    `----

    http://www.pcworld.com/businesscente...cy_reward.html
    http://tinyurl.com/5m7fp2
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  2. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Roy Schestowitz

    wrote
    on Fri, 18 Jul 2008 18:33:42 +0000
    <1240058.FsmLz5orMg@schestowitz.com>:
    >
    > BSA: Software piracy's 'tragic' impact on US society
    >
    > ,----[ Quote ]
    > | The BSA-sponsored IDC study, available here (pdf), pinpointed eight US states
    > | in the report. It found significant variations from the national piracy
    > | figure of 20 per cent.
    > `----
    >
    > http://www.channelregister.co.uk/200...states_piracy/
    >
    > It's not "piracy" and it's clear who is paying for that
    > pro-RAND, anti-FOSS BS (see below for recent
    > BSA-IDC-Microsoft circuses all across the EU).


    I'm not even sure it's theft (provided the writer is
    properly identified in the credits of the borrowed work),
    though it might be unrealized sales revenue. Granted,
    someone -- I'd have to look up who but it's either one of
    the Founding Fathers or someone back in the 18th century,
    if not earlier -- proposed copyrights, the intent being
    to stop plagiarism, presumably; the general ideas include
    the ability to control distribution, an issue if one were
    to write something for the military (e.g., detailed plans
    for a rocket propulsive device[*], perhaps, after one
    retires from active service). Controlling distribution
    is a bit tough today, given things such as the Web,
    YouTube, and widespread media digitization.

    And of course there are issues if person A writes something
    and person B includes it in his work; "fair use" used
    to cover that though I'm not sure if it does anymore.
    (It was a lot easier before cut and paste, I suspect.)

    Admittedly, under ideal conditions FLOSS would track
    everyone's contributions and changes, giving proper credit,
    but even with a modern versioning tracking system such
    as CVS, Subversion, Clearcase, or VSS (not all of which
    are open source!), I frankly don't know if this will be
    100% doable, and not everyone uses such a system. Also,
    I can spin a couple of scenarios about disputed fixes.

    [rest snipped for brevity]
    [*] the 18th century not having figured out how to make
    uranium-235 go kaboom yet.

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Useless C/C++ Programming Idea #104392:
    for(int i = 0; i < 1000000; i++) sleep(0);
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  3. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    Hash: SHA1

    ____/ The Ghost In The Machine on Friday 18 July 2008 18:37 : \____

    > In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Roy Schestowitz
    >
    > wrote
    > on Fri, 18 Jul 2008 18:33:42 +0000
    > <1240058.FsmLz5orMg@schestowitz.com>:
    >>
    >> BSA: Software piracy's 'tragic' impact on US society
    >>
    >> ,----[ Quote ]
    >> | The BSA-sponsored IDC study, available here (pdf), pinpointed eight US
    >> | states in the report. It found significant variations from the national
    >> | piracy figure of 20 per cent.
    >> `----
    >>
    >> http://www.channelregister.co.uk/200...states_piracy/
    >>
    >> It's not "piracy" and it's clear who is paying for that
    >> pro-RAND, anti-FOSS BS (see below for recent
    >> BSA-IDC-Microsoft circuses all across the EU).

    >
    > I'm not even sure it's theft (provided the writer is
    > properly identified in the credits of the borrowed work),
    > though it might be unrealized sales revenue. Granted,
    > someone -- I'd have to look up who but it's either one of
    > the Founding Fathers or someone back in the 18th century,
    > if not earlier -- proposed copyrights, the intent being
    > to stop plagiarism, presumably; the general ideas include
    > the ability to control distribution, an issue if one were
    > to write something for the military (e.g., detailed plans
    > for a rocket propulsive device[*], perhaps, after one
    > retires from active service). Controlling distribution
    > is a bit tough today, given things such as the Web,
    > YouTube, and widespread media digitization.
    >
    > And of course there are issues if person A writes something
    > and person B includes it in his work; "fair use" used
    > to cover that though I'm not sure if it does anymore.
    > (It was a lot easier before cut and paste, I suspect.)
    >
    > Admittedly, under ideal conditions FLOSS would track
    > everyone's contributions and changes, giving proper credit,
    > but even with a modern versioning tracking system such
    > as CVS, Subversion, Clearcase, or VSS (not all of which
    > are open source!), I frankly don't know if this will be
    > 100% doable, and not everyone uses such a system. Also,
    > I can spin a couple of scenarios about disputed fixes.
    >
    > [rest snipped for brevity]
    >
    >[*] the 18th century not having figured out how to make
    > uranium-235 go kaboom yet.


    The issue here is less to do with incentives but more to do with legislation
    that's FOSS-hostile, by nature. RAND is a good example. Isn't that beyond the
    remit of responsibility of the BSA?

    - --
    ~~ Best of wishes

    Roy S. Schestowitz | Linux: does exactly what it says on the tin
    http://Schestowitz.com | RHAT GNU/Linux | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
    20:00:01 up 4 days, 9:27, 2 users, load average: 0.97, 0.76, 0.67
    http://iuron.com - help build a non-profit search engine
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  4. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Roy Schestowitz

    wrote
    on Fri, 18 Jul 2008 20:06:01 +0000
    <3769997.pFX01qiRE7@schestowitz.com>:
    >
    > ____/ The Ghost In The Machine on Friday 18 July 2008 18:37 : \____
    >
    >> In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Roy Schestowitz
    >>
    >> wrote
    >> on Fri, 18 Jul 2008 18:33:42 +0000
    >> <1240058.FsmLz5orMg@schestowitz.com>:
    >>>
    >>> BSA: Software piracy's 'tragic' impact on US society
    >>>
    >>> ,----[ Quote ]
    >>> | The BSA-sponsored IDC study, available here (pdf), pinpointed eight US
    >>> | states in the report. It found significant variations from the national
    >>> | piracy figure of 20 per cent.
    >>> `----
    >>>
    >>> http://www.channelregister.co.uk/200...states_piracy/
    >>>
    >>> It's not "piracy" and it's clear who is paying for that
    >>> pro-RAND, anti-FOSS BS (see below for recent
    >>> BSA-IDC-Microsoft circuses all across the EU).

    >>
    >> I'm not even sure it's theft (provided the writer is
    >> properly identified in the credits of the borrowed work),
    >> though it might be unrealized sales revenue. Granted,
    >> someone -- I'd have to look up who but it's either one of
    >> the Founding Fathers or someone back in the 18th century,
    >> if not earlier -- proposed copyrights, the intent being
    >> to stop plagiarism, presumably; the general ideas include
    >> the ability to control distribution, an issue if one were
    >> to write something for the military (e.g., detailed plans
    >> for a rocket propulsive device[*], perhaps, after one
    >> retires from active service). Controlling distribution
    >> is a bit tough today, given things such as the Web,
    >> YouTube, and widespread media digitization.
    >>
    >> And of course there are issues if person A writes something
    >> and person B includes it in his work; "fair use" used
    >> to cover that though I'm not sure if it does anymore.
    >> (It was a lot easier before cut and paste, I suspect.)
    >>
    >> Admittedly, under ideal conditions FLOSS would track
    >> everyone's contributions and changes, giving proper credit,
    >> but even with a modern versioning tracking system such
    >> as CVS, Subversion, Clearcase, or VSS (not all of which
    >> are open source!), I frankly don't know if this will be
    >> 100% doable, and not everyone uses such a system. Also,
    >> I can spin a couple of scenarios about disputed fixes.
    >>
    >> [rest snipped for brevity]
    >>
    >>[*] the 18th century not having figured out how to make
    >> uranium-235 go kaboom yet.

    >
    > The issue here is less to do with incentives but more to
    > do with legislation that's FOSS-hostile, by nature.


    FOSS is hostile to ownership of source code by *its* nature;
    stands to reason. Of course that's the whole point anyway;
    share the code, stand on the shoulders of giants, improve
    the codebase, do it out of love ("amateur").

    > RAND is a good example. Isn't that beyond the
    > remit of responsibility of the BSA?


    I frankly don't know about RAND. A quick Google on "RAND
    legislation" coughed up

    http://www.rand.org/pubs/technical_reports/TR288/

    which appears to be more concerned about intelligence (in
    the military or espionage sense) than intellectual property.

    The original channelregister.co.uk link looks like a press
    release tailored to sell the notion that the BSA is out
    to help us.

    >
    > - --
    > ~~ Best of wishes
    >
    > Roy S. Schestowitz | Linux: does exactly what it says on the tin
    > http://Schestowitz.com | RHAT GNU/Linux | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
    > 20:00:01 up 4 days, 9:27, 2 users, load average: 0.97, 0.76, 0.67
    > http://iuron.com - help build a non-profit search engine



    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Windows Vista. Because it's time to refresh your hardware. Trust us.
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  5. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws ThroughBrainwash

    Verily I say unto thee, that The Ghost In The Machine spake thusly:
    > In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Roy Schestowitz
    > wrote on Fri, 18 Jul 2008 18:33:42 +0000
    > <1240058.FsmLz5orMg@schestowitz.com>:


    >> It's not "piracy" and it's clear who is paying for that pro-RAND,
    >> anti-FOSS BS (see below for recent BSA-IDC-Microsoft circuses all
    >> across the EU).

    >
    > I'm not even sure it's theft (provided the writer is properly
    > identified in the credits of the borrowed work)


    It is theft if the law defines it as such, however IMHO software of any
    kind should not be classified as property, and thus obtaining it out of
    license should not be a crime. However, it is still perfectly feasible
    to sell artistic work that is not restricted by copyrights. Copyrights
    are merely an attempt to /enforce/ sales, which is just the legislative
    equivalent of DRM, and is not actually /required/ to sell artistic work
    of any kind. Here's two examples of such work that is distributed under
    permissive terms /and/ sold:

    Bound by Law (by-nc-sa license)
    http://www.law.duke.edu/cspd/comics/buy.html

    The Cathedral and the Bazaar (Open Publication License)
    http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/
    (Also available on Amazon.)

    Plagiarism is another matter. Authors should rightfully be credited with
    attribution, provided it is known and provided it is practical to do so.

    > though it might be unrealized sales revenue.


    I believe that's false reasoning. Those who are disinclined to pay will
    not pay anyway, regardless of whether or not the license is restrictive.
    The only difference between releasing artistic work under a restrictive
    license, and releasing it under a permissive licence, is that those who
    obtain that work without paying are only classed as "criminals" in the
    former case. I don't believe the final outcome would change at all, in
    terms of actual units sold.

    There will always be those who prefer official channels; or gift-sets;
    or signed copies; or some other value-added presentations of the work,
    and will happily pay for it. Look at the success of Radiohead's "free"
    music deal (despite U2 manager Paul McGuinness' speculative cynicism).
    People /still/ paid for something they /could/ have obtained for free.

    Why?

    I strongly believe that most ordinary people simply do not even /think/
    about the implications of licensing at all. They just obtain whatever
    they want to obtain, by whatever means they prefer, with little or no
    regard for licensing.

    > Granted, someone -- I'd have to look up who but it's either one of
    > the Founding Fathers or someone back in the 18th century, if not
    > earlier -- proposed copyrights


    The first copyright law was Statute of Anne in 1709, although there
    seems to have been more limited monopolies granted earlier than that:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_copyright_law

    Nick Mailer, the director of The Positive Internet Company, has a rather
    interesting talk on the subject:

    http://ftp.acc.umu.se/pub/debian-mee...nd_profits.ogg

    > the intent being to stop plagiarism, presumably


    The motives have been many and varied over the centuries, some rather
    sinister, including censorship, and apparently even an "attempt to
    prevent the spread of the Protestant Reformation", according to Wiki-P.

    > the general ideas include the ability to control distribution, an
    > issue if one were to write something for the military (e.g., detailed
    > plans for a rocket propulsive device[*], perhaps, after one retires
    > from active service).


    I would have assumed that such information would fall under the category
    of trade (or in this case /military/) secret, and classified as a matter
    of national security, rather than merely restricted by copyright for
    commercial considerations.

    > Controlling distribution is a bit tough today, given things such as
    > the Web, YouTube, and widespread media digitization.
    >
    > And of course there are issues if person A writes something and
    > person B includes it in his work; "fair use" used to cover that
    > though I'm not sure if it does anymore.


    Not according to the Associated Press, anyway, who have unilaterally
    decided to arbitrarily revoke fair use rights by demanding $12.50 to
    quote five words from one of their articles. They don't specify if that
    is five /consecutive/ words though, nor if common words like "and";
    "or"; "the"; "if" and "but" are exempted (do I now owe AP $12.50?).

    http://license.icopyright.net/user/o...AGE&urt=nullit

    > (It was a lot easier before cut and paste, I suspect.)


    There's even a javascript hack to prevent that, although it's easily
    circumvented.

    > Admittedly, under ideal conditions FLOSS would track everyone's
    > contributions and changes, giving proper credit


    Authors should always be recognised for their work, but sometimes
    providing attribution can lead to problems, as with the original BSD
    license (the so-called "advertising clause"):

    When people put many such programs together in an operating system, the
    result is a serious problem. Imagine if a software system required 75
    different sentences, each one naming a different author or group of
    authors. To advertise that, you would need a full-page ad.

    This might seem like extrapolation ad absurdum, but it is actual fact.
    In a 1997 version of NetBSD, I counted 75 of these sentences.
    (Fortunately NetBSD has decided to stop adding them, and to remove those
    it could.)
    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/bsd.html

    Of course attribution doesn't have to be in a /license/, it can be in
    the comment blocks of the source, although even that can sometimes
    spiral out of control, leading to kilobytes of comments for just a few
    lines of code.

    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining
    | armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos
    | neatly ignores the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate
    | technology, led them into it in the first place." ~ Douglas Adams
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.23.8-63.fc8
    01:46:56 up 210 days, 22:22, 4 users, load average: 0.09, 0.14, 0.18

  6. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 01:47:18 +0100, Homer wrote:


    > It is theft if the law defines it as such, however IMHO software of any
    > kind should not be classified as property, and thus obtaining it out of
    > license should not be a crime.


    Another Linux freeloader who likes to steal software.


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  7. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    * Homer peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > Bound by Law (by-nc-sa license)
    > http://www.law.duke.edu/cspd/comics/buy.html
    >
    > The Cathedral and the Bazaar (Open Publication License)
    > http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/
    > (Also available on Amazon.)


    Another:

    http://svnbook.red-bean.com/

    This is the online home of Version Control with Subversion, a free
    book about Subversion, a new version control system designed to
    supplant CVS. As you may have guessed from the layout of this page,
    this book is published by O'Reilly Media.

    This is a place to read HTML and PDF versions of the book (although
    you can certainly buy a copy if you'd like to). We'll do our
    best to keep the site up-to-date. As Subversion development
    continues, the product will continue to grow new features, and we
    plan to continue documenting those changes.

    WE NEED YOUR HELP! Ben, Fitz and Mike are wrapping up final edits for
    the production of Version Control with Subversion, Second Edition.
    Your technical review of the book would be most helpful! Please see
    http://www.red-bean.com/rbwiki/OnePointFiveTechReview for how you can
    help.

    Beautiful!

    --
    Adding sound to movies would be like putting lipstick on the Venus de Milo.
    -- actress Mary Pickford, 1925

  8. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws ThroughBrainwash

    Verily I say unto thee, that Linonut spake thusly:
    > * Homer peremptorily fired off this memo:


    >> Bound by Law (by-nc-sa license)
    >> http://www.law.duke.edu/cspd/comics/buy.html
    >>
    >> The Cathedral and the Bazaar (Open Publication License)
    >> http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/
    >> (Also available on Amazon.)

    >
    > Another:
    >
    > http://svnbook.red-bean.com/


    Yet another:

    Two Bits: The Cultural Significance of Free Software (by-nc-sa license)
    http://twobits.net

    > Beautiful!


    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining
    | armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos
    | neatly ignores the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate
    | technology, led them into it in the first place." ~ Douglas Adams
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.23.8-63.fc8
    19:27:00 up 211 days, 16:02, 3 users, load average: 0.29, 0.38, 0.35

  9. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    * Homer peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > Yet another:
    >
    > Two Bits: The Cultural Significance of Free Software (by-nc-sa license)
    > http://twobits.net


    Thanks!

    --
    "No, `Eureka' is Greek for `This bath is too hot.'"
    -- Dr. Who

  10. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Moshe Goldfarb.

    wrote
    on Sat, 19 Jul 2008 00:40:42 -0400
    :
    > On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 01:47:18 +0100, Homer wrote:
    >
    >
    >> It is theft if the law defines it as such, however IMHO software of any
    >> kind should not be classified as property, and thus obtaining it out of
    >> license should not be a crime.

    >
    > Another Linux freeloader who likes to steal software.
    >


    Details, please.

    If you're going to dish on Homer, do give us the spicy,
    juicy bits.

    :-P

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Useless C/C++ Programming Idea #40490127:
    for(; ;
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  11. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 12:24:37 -0700, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:

    > In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Moshe Goldfarb.
    >
    > wrote
    > on Sat, 19 Jul 2008 00:40:42 -0400
    > :
    >> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 01:47:18 +0100, Homer wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>> It is theft if the law defines it as such, however IMHO software of any
    >>> kind should not be classified as property, and thus obtaining it out of
    >>> license should not be a crime.

    >>
    >> Another Linux freeloader who likes to steal software.
    >>

    >
    > Details, please.
    >
    > If you're going to dish on Homer, do give us the spicy,
    > juicy bits.
    >
    > :-P


    [Homer] Said:

    "IMHO software of any kind should not be classified as property, and thus
    obtaining it out of license should not be a crime. "



    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  12. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Moshe Goldfarb.

    wrote
    on Mon, 21 Jul 2008 15:37:06 -0400
    <1om5ivr5f71kv$.tn468wvqid6z$.dlg@40tude.net>:
    > On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 12:24:37 -0700, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
    >
    >> In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Moshe Goldfarb.
    >>
    >> wrote
    >> on Sat, 19 Jul 2008 00:40:42 -0400
    >> :
    >>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 01:47:18 +0100, Homer wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> It is theft if the law defines it as such, however IMHO software of any
    >>>> kind should not be classified as property, and thus obtaining it out of
    >>>> license should not be a crime.
    >>>
    >>> Another Linux freeloader who likes to steal software.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Details, please.
    >>
    >> If you're going to dish on Homer, do give us the spicy,
    >> juicy bits.
    >>
    >> :-P

    >
    > [Homer] Said:
    >
    > "IMHO software of any kind should not be classified as
    > property, and thus obtaining it out of license should
    > not be a crime. "
    >


    That's fine; I was more interested in the specifics as
    to what software Homer has actually *stolen* (or, failing
    that, would like to steal and has admitted to desiring to
    steal), not his advocacy.

    (In any event, obtaining it out of license is only a crime
    if the economic damage is greater than a certain amount,
    if memory serves. The thinking behind this verges on the
    bizarre, though one might argue that below $1,000 it's
    not worth investigating.)

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Windows Vista. It'll Fix Everything(tm).
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  13. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws ThroughBrainwash

    Verily I say unto thee, that The Ghost In The Machine spake thusly:
    > In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Moshe Goldfarb.
    > wrote on Mon, 21 Jul 2008 15:37:06 -0400
    > <1om5ivr5f71kv$.tn468wvqid6z$.dlg@40tude.net>:


    >> [Homer] Said:
    >>
    >> "IMHO software of any kind should not be classified as property,
    >> and thus obtaining it out of license should not be a crime. "

    >
    > That's fine; I was more interested in the specifics as to what
    > software Homer has actually *stolen* (or, failing that, would like to
    > steal and has admitted to desiring to steal), not his advocacy.


    Flatty has a problem differentiating between someone advocating the
    abolition of a law and someone breaking that law. IOW he's an idiot.

    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining
    | armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos
    | neatly ignores the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate
    | technology, led them into it in the first place." ~ Douglas Adams
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.23.8-63.fc8
    23:22:06 up 213 days, 19:57, 4 users, load average: 0.32, 0.26, 0.26

  14. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Homer

    wrote
    on Mon, 21 Jul 2008 23:22:30 +0100
    <8qefl5-0ab.ln1@sky.matrix>:
    > Verily I say unto thee, that The Ghost In The Machine spake thusly:
    >> In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Moshe Goldfarb.
    >> wrote on Mon, 21 Jul 2008 15:37:06 -0400
    >> <1om5ivr5f71kv$.tn468wvqid6z$.dlg@40tude.net>:

    >
    >>> [Homer] Said:
    >>>
    >>> "IMHO software of any kind should not be classified as property,
    >>> and thus obtaining it out of license should not be a crime. "

    >>
    >> That's fine; I was more interested in the specifics as to what
    >> software Homer has actually *stolen* (or, failing that, would like to
    >> steal and has admitted to desiring to steal), not his advocacy.

    >
    > Flatty has a problem differentiating between someone advocating the
    > abolition of a law and someone breaking that law. IOW he's an idiot.
    >


    Shhhh....don't tell him that; everyone will want one! :-)

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Useless C/C++ Programming Idea #104392:
    for(int i = 0; i < 1000000; i++) sleep(0);
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  15. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    Homer wrote:
    >> That's fine; I was more interested in the specifics as to what
    >> software Homer has actually *stolen* (or, failing that, would like to
    >> steal and has admitted to desiring to steal), not his advocacy.

    >
    > Flatty has a problem differentiating between someone advocating the
    > abolition of a law and someone breaking that law. IOW he's an idiot.
    >

    Indeed. Flatty and co have labelled me a thief just because I insist on the
    use of correct english in describing copyright infringement as copyright
    infringement (and not theft).

    Poor old hardon just can't get it through his thick skull that there's a
    difference and keeps on calling me a thief because of it.

    It's rather sad how far their mental problems have gone really, isn't it?
    --
    | spike1@freenet.co.uk | "I'm alive!!! I can touch! I can taste! |
    | Andrew Halliwell BSc | I can SMELL!!! KRYTEN!!! Unpack Rachel and |
    | in | get out the puncture repair kit!" |
    | Computer Science | Arnold Judas Rimmer- Red Dwarf |

  16. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Andrew Halliwell

    wrote
    on Tue, 22 Jul 2008 00:33:25 +0100
    <5vifl5-qp6.ln1@ponder.sky.com>:
    > Homer wrote:
    >>> That's fine; I was more interested in the specifics as to what
    >>> software Homer has actually *stolen* (or, failing that, would like to
    >>> steal and has admitted to desiring to steal), not his advocacy.

    >>
    >> Flatty has a problem differentiating between someone advocating the
    >> abolition of a law and someone breaking that law. IOW he's an idiot.
    >>

    > Indeed. Flatty and co have labelled me a thief just because I insist on the
    > use of correct english in describing copyright infringement as copyright
    > infringement (and not theft).
    >
    > Poor old hardon just can't get it through his thick skull that there's a
    > difference and keeps on calling me a thief because of it.
    >
    > It's rather sad how far their mental problems have gone really, isn't it?


    Me too.

    The only thing I can even hope to identify is loss
    of potential revenue, and even then Homer insists (and
    probably correctly; I can't tell) that the main individuals
    interested in getting payware for free would not have gone
    for the payware in the first place anyway; therefore no
    revenue is lost.

    Either way, it's hardly theft, just unrealized sales potential.

    And yet, the RIAA insists on harassing grandmothers who
    were in the wrong place at the wrong time, and
    apparently supporting rather restrictive DRM solutions.
    I doubt the BSA is far behind, though would have to check.

    Yeah, great brownie points there.

    Google coughed up this article on the matter:

    http://news.cnet.com/2100-1027-5113188.html
    (dated 2003)

    Google also coughed up this article:
    http://www.eff.org/riaa-v-people
    (also dated 2003)
    There is a follow-on report dated 2007 which, boiled down,
    suggests that the RIAA's tactics are not working nearly
    as much as the RIAA would like. The page 11 table in
    particular suggests P2P is still growing, though the
    correlation is less than perfect. Oocalc estimates (via
    regression line), very roughly, that the number of sharers
    could be as high as 18 million as of August 2008.

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Been there, done that, didn't get the T-shirt.
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  17. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    Andrew Halliwell writes:

    > Homer wrote:
    >>> That's fine; I was more interested in the specifics as to what
    >>> software Homer has actually *stolen* (or, failing that, would like to
    >>> steal and has admitted to desiring to steal), not his advocacy.

    >>
    >> Flatty has a problem differentiating between someone advocating the
    >> abolition of a law and someone breaking that law. IOW he's an idiot.
    >>

    > Indeed. Flatty and co have labelled me a thief just because I insist on the
    > use of correct english in describing copyright infringement as copyright
    > infringement (and not theft).
    >
    > Poor old hardon just can't get it through his thick skull that there's a
    > difference and keeps on calling me a thief because of it.
    >
    > It's rather sad how far their mental problems have gone really, isn't
    > it?


    And I suspect Hans didn't "murder" his wife. He merely facilitated a
    seizure of the heart.

    You can weasel but everyone knows what you mean. God knows you said you
    can not steal a non physical item often enough ....

  18. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws Through Brainwash

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Hadron

    wrote
    on Tue, 22 Jul 2008 02:26:28 +0200
    :
    > Andrew Halliwell writes:
    >
    >> Homer wrote:
    >>>> That's fine; I was more interested in the specifics as to what
    >>>> software Homer has actually *stolen* (or, failing that, would like to
    >>>> steal and has admitted to desiring to steal), not his advocacy.
    >>>
    >>> Flatty has a problem differentiating between someone advocating the
    >>> abolition of a law and someone breaking that law. IOW he's an idiot.
    >>>

    >> Indeed. Flatty and co have labelled me a thief just because I insist on the
    >> use of correct english in describing copyright infringement as copyright
    >> infringement (and not theft).
    >>
    >> Poor old hardon just can't get it through his thick skull that there's a
    >> difference and keeps on calling me a thief because of it.
    >>
    >> It's rather sad how far their mental problems have gone really, isn't
    >> it?

    >
    > And I suspect Hans didn't "murder" his wife. He merely facilitated a
    > seizure of the heart.


    The forensic evidence for the murder is apparently not
    clear enough to determine the actual failure mode (for
    starters, the actual body is missing). The easiest would
    probably be major trauma to the blood vessels of the brain
    by imparting a lead pellet at high energy at close range,
    using a commercially-prepared explosive mixture, presumably
    of sulfur, charcoal, and saltpetre[*], though other mixes
    are possible.

    An alternative would be imparting said pellet at high
    energy through muscles of the heart, causing major failure
    of the circulatory system, leakage of the blood into the
    main body cavity, and various other symptoms which are
    presumably readily observable in a sufficiently fresh
    corpse by forensic pathologists -- if they can find it.

    A third method is anoxia, caused by immersion in water,
    though that would leave no blood per se (the struggle
    of course could leave traces thereof, if sufficiently
    violent).

    Not that it matters. He has been convicted, and faces
    25 years in prison, though a plea deal is also mentioned.

    And of course, since reiserfs is a critical part of Linux [1],
    Linux is junk [2], and therefore everyone should just go out
    and update their hardware [3] to run Microsoft Windows Vista[4].

    >
    > You can weasel but everyone knows what you mean. God knows you said you
    > can not steal a non physical item often enough ....

    [*] the proportions given in Wikipedia are KNO3: 75%; C: 15%; S: 10%.
    These yield a black powder. I don't know what modern cartridges
    use, though; Wiki mentions cordite, among others.

    [1] Yeah right. There are a fair number of systems one can use;
    the most obvious one being ext2 or ext3, but one can also use jfs,
    or fat32 in a pinch (though security would be ugly). One can
    also roll one's own, with a fair amount of work; Google in
    particular developed 'yaffs' which is tailored for Android and
    for NAND Flash sticks.

    [2] Yeah right.

    [3] There is a pending lawsuit on "Vista ready" hardware,
    so caveat emptor. Best I can do is suggest a good 2
    GB or 4 GB RAM machine with sufficient disk space and
    a good graphics card capable of handling Aero's rather
    demanding requirements.

    [4] The (sorry) state of the art operating system that everyone
    (FSVO) loves (FSVO).

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Windows Vista. Now in nine exciting editions. Try them all!
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  19. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws ThroughBrainwash

    Verily I say unto thee, that The Ghost In The Machine spake thusly:

    > The only thing I can even hope to identify is loss of potential
    > revenue, and even then Homer insists (and probably correctly; I can't
    > tell) that the main individuals interested in getting payware for
    > free would not have gone for the payware in the first place anyway;
    > therefore no revenue is lost.


    That's the "pirates" argument, not mine.

    Mine is quite simply that revenue !== exclusivity (monopoly).

    Linonut and I have already posted several links to creative works that
    are /sold/ for profit, and yet have no restrictions on distribution,
    proving that such a method does work (of course history also proves
    this, since copyrights did not always exist).

    > And yet, the RIAA insists on harassing grandmothers who were in the
    > wrong place at the wrong time


    They also insisted on threatening a 10 year old schoolgirl by making
    menacing phone calls and stalking her at school:

    http://www.rollingstone.com/rockdail...-and-stalking/

    This is the true face of those "hard working artists that deserve to be
    paid royalties in perpetuity". I see no "artists", just gangsters.

    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining
    | armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos
    | neatly ignores the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate
    | technology, led them into it in the first place." ~ Douglas Adams
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.23.8-63.fc8
    10:59:25 up 214 days, 7:34, 3 users, load average: 0.33, 0.37, 0.34

  20. Re: [News] [Rival] More BSA-IDC-Microsoft Circus for New Laws ThroughBrainwash

    Verily I say unto thee, that Hardon spake thusly:
    > Andrew Halliwell writes:


    >> Poor old hardon just can't get it through his thick skull that
    >> there's a difference and keeps on calling me a thief because of it.
    >>
    >> It's rather sad how far their mental problems have gone really,
    >> isn't it?

    >
    > And I suspect Hans didn't "murder" his wife. He merely facilitated a
    > seizure of the heart.


    How did we get from you making libellous allegations of theft, to Hans
    Reiser?

    --
    K.
    http://slated.org

    ..----
    | "The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining
    | armour to lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos
    | neatly ignores the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate
    | technology, led them into it in the first place." ~ Douglas Adams
    `----

    Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.23.8-63.fc8
    11:04:57 up 214 days, 7:40, 3 users, load average: 0.40, 0.38, 0.35

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