Alpha Users UNITE!!! - Linux

This is a discussion on Alpha Users UNITE!!! - Linux ; We need to start letting our numbers be heard and start requesting software vendors and the like to start supporting Alpha's again, its getting rediculous. When I can going to a website and they have a BeOS port, thats a ...

+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 16 of 16

Thread: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

  1. Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    We need to start letting our numbers be heard and start requesting software
    vendors and the like to start supporting Alpha's again, its getting
    rediculous. When I can going to a website and they have a BeOS port, thats a
    sign that something wrong. Hell I don't think there are more that a dozen
    BeOS users in the whole freak'n country!

    We need to let ppl know, there's more out there than GCC... We also need to
    start getting on HP for better releases of Compaq C, something with a little
    more GCC formatting support. Hell its been several years since the
    'bastages' released something 'new' on the Alpha Linux home front. They said
    they would support the Alpha platform for the next 25yrs... its getting
    pretty damn sparse just a couple of years down the road... Will L G

    Voice your concerns:
    http://h30097.www3.hp.com/comments.html

    GTK.org [for support other than GTK-1.29]
    http://gtk.org/people.html




  2. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    " DiskMan" writes:

    > We need to start letting our numbers be heard and start requesting software
    > vendors and the like to start supporting Alpha's again, its getting
    > rediculous. When I can going to a website and they have a BeOS port, thats a
    > sign that something wrong. Hell I don't think there are more that a dozen
    > BeOS users in the whole freak'n country!
    >
    > We need to let ppl know, there's more out there than GCC... We also need to
    > start getting on HP for better releases of Compaq C, something with a little
    > more GCC formatting support. Hell its been several years since the
    > 'bastages' released something 'new' on the Alpha Linux home front. They said
    > they would support the Alpha platform for the next 25yrs... its getting
    > pretty damn sparse just a couple of years down the road... Will L G


    You didn't really believe that lie about 25 years, did you?

    > Voice your concerns:
    > http://h30097.www3.hp.com/comments.html
    >
    > GTK.org [for support other than GTK-1.29]
    > http://gtk.org/people.html


    What do you mean? The latest GTK versions have no problems running on
    Alpha.

    --
    Måns Rullgård
    mru@inprovide.com

  3. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    I'm talking about compiling it with CCC... It definately needs a speed
    boost... Will L G

    "Måns Rullgård" wrote in message
    news:yw1x8y2eqou3.fsf@ford.inprovide.com...
    > " DiskMan" writes:
    >
    > > We need to start letting our numbers be heard and start requesting

    software
    > > vendors and the like to start supporting Alpha's again, its getting
    > > rediculous. When I can going to a website and they have a BeOS port,

    thats a
    > > sign that something wrong. Hell I don't think there are more that a

    dozen
    > > BeOS users in the whole freak'n country!
    > >
    > > We need to let ppl know, there's more out there than GCC... We also need

    to
    > > start getting on HP for better releases of Compaq C, something with a

    little
    > > more GCC formatting support. Hell its been several years since the
    > > 'bastages' released something 'new' on the Alpha Linux home front. They

    said
    > > they would support the Alpha platform for the next 25yrs... its getting
    > > pretty damn sparse just a couple of years down the road... Will L G

    >
    > You didn't really believe that lie about 25 years, did you?
    >
    > > Voice your concerns:
    > > http://h30097.www3.hp.com/comments.html
    > >
    > > GTK.org [for support other than GTK-1.29]
    > > http://gtk.org/people.html

    >
    > What do you mean? The latest GTK versions have no problems running on
    > Alpha.
    >
    > --
    > Måns Rullgård
    > mru@inprovide.com




  4. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    DiskMan wrote:
    > We need to start letting our numbers be heard and start requesting software
    > vendors and the like to start supporting Alpha's again, its getting
    > rediculous. When I can going to a website and they have a BeOS port, thats a
    > sign that something wrong. Hell I don't think there are more that a dozen
    > BeOS users in the whole freak'n country!
    >
    > We need to let ppl know, there's more out there than GCC... We also need to
    > start getting on HP for better releases of Compaq C, something with a little
    > more GCC formatting support. Hell its been several years since the
    > 'bastages' released something 'new' on the Alpha Linux home front. They said
    > they would support the Alpha platform for the next 25yrs... its getting
    > pretty damn sparse just a couple of years down the road... Will L G
    >
    > Voice your concerns:
    > http://h30097.www3.hp.com/comments.html
    >
    > GTK.org [for support other than GTK-1.29]
    > http://gtk.org/people.html
    >
    >
    >


    dude, you're talking to a wall... HP doesnt give a flying cookie about
    Alpha & Tru64...and that includes Linux on Alpha.


    HP's support SUX like nothing that has ever SUCKED before. they
    DEFECATE on their customers and then blame us poor customers for obvious
    engineering flaws...then not fix an obvious bug!

    there are still a few good people left from the DEC merger... but it
    seems they are not being heard or assimulated into this bad business
    practice.


    my $0.02

    --

    BOFH excuse #93: The cause of the problem is: Internet outage

  5. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    I know what you mean... It comes down to the 'bottom dollar'. I remember a
    few years ago when I purchased a Pavilion 8765C [I think that was the model
    number]. They took the 'screw you' attitude when it came to upgrading to
    WinXP. Despite pushing the AMD machine as being able to handle an XP upgrade
    when the time came and being pushed as XP compatible, it wasn't. It would
    install XP but would crash constantly do to and issue with the onboard AGP
    chipset and XP. HP took the 'tough tittie' attitude and wouldn't release a
    patch. The only patch out at the time was one to DISABLE AGP, that was the
    only fix.

    Another issue cropped up with their Csi 3300 scanners, they weren't going to
    release drivers for XP. It took also a YEAR after XP to come out before they
    released drivers for my scanner and printer. I promised myself I would never
    buy anything from HP again. Then when their sales began to take a dump, they
    has a CSR [customer service rep] calling up their previous customers trying
    to pursuade to purchase much needed HP merchandise...

    When I told the CSR I had no plans on purchasing another HP product he tried
    to explain to me how they're products all supported XP. I even took the guy
    on HP's site and showed him in black and white, they weren't EVER going to
    support XP on the 8765C, that it was a MELLINIUM only machine... he about
    fell over, it totally contradicted his script! After showing him the release
    date of the drivers for my peripherals, he didn't have a thing to say...the
    earliest driver release was something like 7months after the release of XP
    and that was only due to a boat load of HP customers griping... my 2¢ Will L
    G

    PS I posted a 'gripe' at HP Forums and pointed out that I had a lot of the
    drivers available for XP but they were from the original manufacturers... I
    was getting XP driver requests for close to 2 yrs...for the RipTide
    Modem/Soundcard, MultiMedia Keyboard, Riva Vanta TNT vidcard, etc.


    "UNIX pSyChO" wrote in message
    news:iq2ql2-551.ln1@xsssvr.xssnet.com...
    > DiskMan wrote:
    > > We need to start letting our numbers be heard and start requesting

    software
    > > vendors and the like to start supporting Alpha's again, its getting
    > > rediculous. When I can going to a website and they have a BeOS port,

    thats a
    > > sign that something wrong. Hell I don't think there are more that a

    dozen
    > > BeOS users in the whole freak'n country!
    > >
    > > We need to let ppl know, there's more out there than GCC... We also need

    to
    > > start getting on HP for better releases of Compaq C, something with a

    little
    > > more GCC formatting support. Hell its been several years since the
    > > 'bastages' released something 'new' on the Alpha Linux home front. They

    said
    > > they would support the Alpha platform for the next 25yrs... its getting
    > > pretty damn sparse just a couple of years down the road... Will L G
    > >
    > > Voice your concerns:
    > > http://h30097.www3.hp.com/comments.html
    > >
    > > GTK.org [for support other than GTK-1.29]
    > > http://gtk.org/people.html
    > >
    > >
    > >

    >
    > dude, you're talking to a wall... HP doesnt give a flying cookie about
    > Alpha & Tru64...and that includes Linux on Alpha.
    >
    >
    > HP's support SUX like nothing that has ever SUCKED before. they
    > DEFECATE on their customers and then blame us poor customers for obvious
    > engineering flaws...then not fix an obvious bug!
    >
    > there are still a few good people left from the DEC merger... but it
    > seems they are not being heard or assimulated into this bad business
    > practice.
    >

    >
    > my $0.02
    >
    > --
    >
    > BOFH excuse #93: The cause of the problem is: Internet outage




  6. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    DiskMan wrote:
    > I know what you mean... It comes down to the 'bottom dollar'. I remember a
    > few years ago when I purchased a Pavilion 8765C [I think that was the model
    > number]. They took the 'screw you' attitude when it came to upgrading to
    > WinXP. Despite pushing the AMD machine as being able to handle an XP upgrade
    > when the time came and being pushed as XP compatible, it wasn't. It would
    > install XP but would crash constantly do to and issue with the onboard AGP
    > chipset and XP. HP took the 'tough tittie' attitude and wouldn't release a
    > patch. The only patch out at the time was one to DISABLE AGP, that was the
    > only fix.
    >

    <...snip...>

    hehe... funny thing you mention that scanner... a guy i work with has
    one of those scanners and complained a few months ago how he had to keep
    an old Win98/Me PC around just to use his scanner... then he checked
    back recently and saw the drivers magically appear after lots of
    complaints from users. hmm...

    most of my problems lately have been with StorageWorks. somehow HP took
    a fairly rock-solid HSG80 and made it barely be able to do snapshots!?
    why advertise it if it cant??? the response from HP; "try not to do too
    much I/O...and we wont fix it anytime soon...sorry you paid so much for
    it...". nevermind the EVA bugs!!! again, i'm left with an almost
    useless diskfarm that can barely do a snapshot!? and since i'm ranting,
    didnt HP say they were going to carry TruCluster and AdvFS into Tru64?
    stupid me for beleiveing them and actually staying with HP thinking
    they'd put in some cool features in HP/UX.

    as for Linux, wasnt Compaq trying hard to sell Alpha's running linux? a
    few years later HP makes these pretty expensive servers useless!? RH
    7.2 isnt maintained anymore... hence came the alphacore port.

    --

    BOFH excuse #109: The cause of the problem is: The rolling stones
    concert down the road caused a brown out

  7. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    On 2005-05-17, UNIX pSyChO wrote:
    >
    > as for Linux, wasnt Compaq trying hard to sell Alpha's running linux? a
    > few years later HP makes these pretty expensive servers useless!? RH
    > 7.2 isnt maintained anymore... hence came the alphacore port.




    It's possible Compaq was trying at one time to sell Alphas.
    However, in 1999 I tried to get evan ballpark pricing to buy
    one XP1000 (IIRC) and the local sales person could not tell
    me what it would cost to buy one. So, I sunk a wad into a
    UP2000-based machine that got sick just past the end of the
    3-year warranty. (Fortunately, Visa extended warranty
    covered mobo repairs--but not return shipping.) Now, I'm
    stuck using nasty X86 machines infested with prefix bytes,
    the A20 mode pin, and segment registers. (Meanwhile, the
    Alpha box sits in the corner collecting dust. Sigh.)



    Good luck.

    Robert Riches
    spamtrap42@verizon.net
    (Yes, that is one of my email addresses.)

  8. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    Yea I remember that.. it had bad power traces and they managed to fix it,
    kinda... I know I'm relegated to AMD/Intel 64bit models... My Alpha is
    pretty committed to serving webpages and the like and serving as teaching
    tool for ANSI C [via Compaq C's anal retentive interpretation of it
    *hehehe*].

    I might get a another Alpha someday but I would doubt it... The price just
    isn't right... When I can get an AlphaPC DP64 for around $500+ and a
    Pentium/AMD 3+ghz model [3 to 4 times faster] for about the same price, i386
    is going to get my vote... Will L G

    "Robert M. Riches Jr." wrote in message
    news:slrnd8la1v.73v.rob@one.localnet...
    > On 2005-05-17, UNIX pSyChO wrote:
    > >
    > > as for Linux, wasnt Compaq trying hard to sell Alpha's running linux? a
    > > few years later HP makes these pretty expensive servers useless!? RH
    > > 7.2 isnt maintained anymore... hence came the alphacore port.

    >
    >
    >
    > It's possible Compaq was trying at one time to sell Alphas.
    > However, in 1999 I tried to get evan ballpark pricing to buy
    > one XP1000 (IIRC) and the local sales person could not tell
    > me what it would cost to buy one. So, I sunk a wad into a
    > UP2000-based machine that got sick just past the end of the
    > 3-year warranty. (Fortunately, Visa extended warranty
    > covered mobo repairs--but not return shipping.) Now, I'm
    > stuck using nasty X86 machines infested with prefix bytes,
    > the A20 mode pin, and segment registers. (Meanwhile, the
    > Alpha box sits in the corner collecting dust. Sigh.)
    >
    >

    >
    > Good luck.
    >
    > Robert Riches
    > spamtrap42@verizon.net
    > (Yes, that is one of my email addresses.)




  9. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    DiskMan wrote:

    >They said
    >they would support the Alpha platform for the next 25yrs... its getting
    >pretty damn sparse just a couple of years down the road... Will L G
    >
    >

    Can you find a quote of that somewhere, about support? I don't remember
    ever hearing that, although I wasn't really listening. The "25 year"
    number I heard bandied about, was how long the Alpha architecture was
    designed to last, in engineering terms. Completely different from
    marketing and support issues. As an ex-DECcie who was quite skilled at
    Alpha ASM, I'm very sad that my favorite processor bit the commercial
    dust. I'm still waiting for industry to catch up to what we were doing
    with 64-bit in 1998 when I quit my job.

    --
    Cheers, www.indiegamedesign.com
    Brandon Van Every Seattle, WA

    When no one else sells courage, supply and demand take hold.

  10. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    UNIX pSyChO wrote:

    >there are still a few good people left from the DEC merger... but it
    >seems they are not being heard or assimulated into this bad business
    >practice.
    >
    >

    It was over even as of the Compaq merger, which was in progress when I
    quit in 1998. Too many people inside DEC were fidgety about Alpha vs.
    Intel. Alpha adherants had already become the minority within DEC.

    --
    Cheers, www.indiegamedesign.com
    Brandon Van Every Seattle, WA

    When no one else sells courage, supply and demand take hold.

  11. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    "Brandon J. Van Every" writes:

    > DiskMan wrote:
    >
    >>They said they would support the Alpha platform for the next
    >>25yrs... its getting pretty damn sparse just a couple of years down
    >>the road... Will L G
    >>

    > Can you find a quote of that somewhere, about support? I don't
    > remember ever hearing that, although I wasn't really listening. The
    > "25 year" number I heard bandied about, was how long the Alpha
    > architecture was designed to last, in engineering terms. Completely
    > different from marketing and support issues. As an ex-DECcie who was
    > quite skilled at Alpha ASM, I'm very sad that my favorite processor
    > bit the commercial dust. I'm still waiting for industry to catch up
    > to what we were doing with 64-bit in 1998 when I quit my job.


    Yes, Alpha assembler makes everything else look like a sendmail
    configuration file.

    --
    Måns Rullgård
    mru@inprovide.com

  12. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    Brandon J. Van Every wrote:
    > UNIX pSyChO wrote:
    >
    >> there are still a few good people left from the DEC merger... but it
    >> seems they are not being heard or assimulated into this bad business
    >> practice.
    >>
    >>

    > It was over even as of the Compaq merger, which was in progress when I
    > quit in 1998. Too many people inside DEC were fidgety about Alpha vs.
    > Intel. Alpha adherants had already become the minority within DEC.
    >


    i know very well... i was there during that time during the 1st merger.

    --

    BOFH excuse #364: The cause of the problem is: parallel processors
    running perpendicular today

  13. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    Brandon J. Van Every wrote:

    > Can you find a quote of that somewhere, about support?


    HP has committed to the US DoD to support OpenVMS for a rolling 25 years. As
    to whether this support is on alpha or perhaps Itanium I don't know for
    sure but if it's Alpha it's sure to be on a limited range of hardware
    (I'm guessing what the DoD use would be the range...)
    --
    Huw Davies | e-mail: Huw.Davies@kerberos.davies.net.au
    Melbourne | "If soccer was meant to be played in the
    Australia | air, the sky would be painted green"

  14. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    Måns Rullgård writes:
    > > For *SIZE* ??!? WTF for???

    >
    > For a challenge. I wrote that snippet as a result of a Usenet
    > discussion some time ago concerning the possibility to do what that
    > program does in 100 bytes or less, and that version is 108 bytes as
    > object code.


    Moreover, sometimes code compiled with -Os is faster than -O2 or -O3 just
    because it's smaller...
    --
    Mathieu Chouquet-Stringer
    "Le disparu, si l'on vénère sa mémoire, est plus présent et
    plus puissant que le vivant".
    -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry, Citadelle --

  15. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    "Brandon J. Van Every" wrote:
    >
    > DiskMan wrote:
    >
    > >They said
    > >they would support the Alpha platform for the next 25yrs... its getting
    > >pretty damn sparse just a couple of years down the road... Will L G
    > >
    > >

    > Can you find a quote of that somewhere, about support?


    Check the OpenVMS "Rolling Roadmap" (Compaq/HP-speak for "what we're
    saying this week, subject to change without notice or good reason") for
    some idea of where Alpha support is headed.

    http://www.hp.com/go/openvms

    > I don't remember
    > ever hearing that, although I wasn't really listening. The "25 year"
    > number I heard bandied about, was how long the Alpha architecture was
    > designed to last, in engineering terms. Completely different from
    > marketing and support issues. As an ex-DECcie who was quite skilled at
    > Alpha ASM, I'm very sad that my favorite processor bit the commercial
    > dust. I'm still waiting for industry to catch up to what we were doing
    > with 64-bit in 1998 when I quit my job.


    Indeed. Itanic is the original "money pit" of CPUs, it seems.

    --
    David J Dachtera
    dba DJE Systems
    http://www.djesys.com/

    Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/

    Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/

    Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/

    Coming soon:
    Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page

  16. Re: Alpha Users UNITE!!!

    huw.davies@kerberos.davies.net.au wrote:
    >
    > Brandon J. Van Every wrote:
    >
    > > Can you find a quote of that somewhere, about support?

    >
    > HP has committed to the US DoD to support OpenVMS for a rolling 25 years. As
    > to whether this support is on alpha or perhaps Itanium I don't know for
    > sure but if it's Alpha it's sure to be on a limited range of hardware
    > (I'm guessing what the DoD use would be the range...)


    So, that means we gotta find someone with influence within the DoD who
    can be convinced to advocate for OpenVMS on x86-64 to help insure VMS's
    survival.

    Linux began and has always been where VMS will (it seems) never be:
    IA32. So, it is not endangered, from that perspective: it it has always
    run on one of the most ubiquitous, longest-lived, most successful
    processor architectures in the world.

    --
    David J Dachtera
    dba DJE Systems
    http://www.djesys.com/

    Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/

    Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/

    Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:
    http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/

    Coming soon:
    Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page

+ Reply to Thread