Trying out Kubuntu, again - Linux

This is a discussion on Trying out Kubuntu, again - Linux ; "SomeBloke" wrote in message news:Vq-dncGEZ-t4cq_VnZ2dnUVZ8u2dnZ2d@posted.metronet... > Ezekiel wrote: > > >> >> Pot. Kettle. Black. >> > > I own the patent on that process, pay up or I will send the gents from the > Inland Revenue around to ...

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Thread: Trying out Kubuntu, again

  1. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again


    "SomeBloke" wrote in message
    news:Vq-dncGEZ-t4cq_VnZ2dnUVZ8u2dnZ2d@posted.metronet...
    > Ezekiel wrote:
    >
    >
    >>
    >> Pot. Kettle. Black.
    >>

    >
    > I own the patent on that process, pay up or I will send the gents from the
    > Inland Revenue around to inspect your paperwork!


    I thought you released "Pot. Kettle. Black." under the GPL?

    Besides, you had patented "Pot. Kettle. Black." with no trailing spaces.
    Mine version with a trailing space is clearly new and unique.


    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  2. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    On Tue, 20 May 2008 07:05:13 -0700, Rich wrote:

    > "Rick" wrote in message
    > news:vOSdnWO3p5CxMq_VnZ2dnUVZ_gCdnZ2d@supernews.co m...
    >> On Mon, 19 May 2008 13:19:08 -0700, Rich wrote:
    >>
    >>> It has been over a year since I tried out a Linux distro so I decided to
    >>> give the latest Kubuntu a try. Here is what I experienced.
    >>>
    >>> 1. I downloaded the DVD ISO from my nearest server. It took over 10
    >>> hours. I tried several servers and they all were extremely slow. I guess
    >>> you get what you pay for. These server are pathetic.

    >>
    >> ... or your ISP sucks.

    >
    > No, I get great download speeds from servers that aren't running in some
    > guys basement.



    Snicker...


    >>
    >>>
    >>> 2. I burned the DVD and booted from it into the Live version so I could
    >>> check it out before I installed it. I was impressed that it had no
    >>> problem detecting my display and setting the correct screen size. This
    >>> was not the case in the past so this has improved.
    >>>
    >>> 3. It put an icon on the desktop for my thumb drive but it could not
    >>> display the contents.

    >>
    >> Any idea why?

    >
    > The OS is a POS? It works just fine under Windows.


    It's the same old story.
    Linux loses no matter how you slice it.


    >>
    >>>
    >>> 4. I tried to browse my network. All of my shared drives (Windows XP
    >>> shares) were visible but I was unable to get it to authenticate. I
    >>> entered valid user name and passwords but could not get it to accept my
    >>> credentials. It just kept prompting for my password. I cancelled the
    >>> dialog box and it then listed the contents of the drive! I double
    >>> clicked on a jpg to view it and it said that the file doesn't exist.
    >>> Nice.

    >>
    >> Did you set up Samba correctly?

    >
    > Why should I have to set anything up? It just works under Windows. I do have
    > the time to waste on this crapware.


    Linux users love to tinker with their systems.
    In fact, tinkering is a major part of the *fun* for these loons.

    I'm surprised they haven't told you that your hardware is defective or that
    you are using the wrong distribution.

    As if their is a *Right* distribution.
    Most of them suck, and suck badly.


    >>
    >>>
    >>> 5. I decided to go ahead and install it on a second drive in my system.
    >>> There was an Install icon on the desktop so I did the install from
    >>> there. It offered to install it into the free space on my second drive
    >>> by default. That was impressive. I accepted the default and proceeded
    >>> with the install. It cranked away for about 15 minutes and then said it
    >>> had less than one minute remaining. After that it REMOVED a bunch of
    >>> language pack related files for another 15 minutes. I told it I wanted
    >>> an English install. Why did it install all this stuff in the first
    >>> place? Weird.

    >>
    >> Why does any OS install files that it then later removes during an
    >> install?

    >
    > Any OS has temporary files that it installs. This was different. It
    > installed a bunch of files that it did not need and then spent a long time
    > removing them. Poorly designed installer, but is very typical of Linux
    > crapware.



    With Linux it's not a matter of how *well* it installs....
    it's a matter of *if* it installs at all.

    You get what you don't pay for.



    >>
    >>>
    >>> 6. Against my better judgment, I let it modify my main Vista drive with
    >>> GRUB and rebooted the system. GRUB came up and immediately gave Error
    >>> 22. Helpful! I rebooted again, same thing. I looked for a repair option
    >>> when booting from the Kubuntu install DVD. The help screen said I should
    >>> select repair options from the menu but no such options existed. I
    >>> decided to do the Kubuntu install by booting from the DVD and installing
    >>> from there, instead of installing from within the Live CD mode. It found
    >>> the previously created partitions and said it was verifying them. It
    >>> cranked away for nearly 10 minutes and then said it had errors and went
    >>> to the manual mode for partitioning. At this point I realized that this
    >>> POS just isn't ready for prime time.

    >>
    >> ... or maybe there's a problem with your POS system?

    >
    > This system works just fine under Windows. Again, blame the user and their
    > hardware for the shortcomings of the mess that is Linux.


    I knew they would get to blaming hardware.

    They have the same old playbook.


    >>>
    >>> 7. I booted from my Vista DVD and used it's startup repair option to get
    >>> rid of GRUB. I used the partitioning tool in Vista to reclaim my free
    >>> space on the drive and am back in business.

    >>
    >> Yes, we see what you are trying to sell.

    >
    > I am not selling anything. I just pointed out that Vista came with the tools
    > to fix the mess that Linux made.


    You're lucky.
    Some people aren't able to recover after a Linux install gone wrong and
    they end up losing data.

    It's not a pretty sight.


    >>
    >>>
    >>> Maybe when I have nothing better to do I will try this again. As in the
    >>> past, Linux is still a bug ridden mess. If you have a lot of time on
    >>> your hands and no life, Linux is the OS for you.

    >>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> ^ Insert "Stupid Windows User" and "Distro Shufflle" comments here ^

    >>
    >> There is no need to insert stupid windows user comments. You did that
    >> yourself. As for the distro sguffle, there a plenty of people that prefer
    >> kubuntu to "Ubuntu" and other Linux based distros. You are the on that
    >> would have to decide to switch distros.

    >
    > And I would have a similar experience with all of them.


    Pretty much.
    The problems will change but the experience with Linux will still suck.


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  3. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    On Tue, 20 May 2008 07:08:07 -0700, Rich wrote:

    > "Linonut" wrote in message
    > news:PTyYj.25288$C8.8885@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
    >>* Rich peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>
    >>> ^ Insert "Stupid Windows User" and "Distro Shufflle" comments here ^

    >>
    >> Idiot.

    >
    > I guess I would have to agree. Why did I expect anything different from
    > Linux? It really is a bug ridden POS and I was stupid to think that a year's
    > worth of development time would have changed anything.


    They are releasing distributions by the hundreds.
    Linux must have over 1000 different versions by now.

    Ain't choice great!



    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  4. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    Ezekiel wrote:

    >
    > "SomeBloke" wrote in message
    > news:Vq-dncGEZ-t4cq_VnZ2dnUVZ8u2dnZ2d@posted.metronet...
    >> Ezekiel wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>
    >>> Pot. Kettle. Black.
    >>>

    >>
    >> I own the patent on that process, pay up or I will send the gents from
    >> the Inland Revenue around to inspect your paperwork!

    >
    > I thought you released "Pot. Kettle. Black." under the GPL?
    >
    > Besides, you had patented "Pot. Kettle. Black." with no trailing spaces.
    > Mine version with a trailing space is clearly new and unique.
    >
    >


    Your version is definitely derivative from my patented process (In all
    country's where patents are imposed. Happily not the UK) and so is subject
    to royalties. These will be donated to the EFF. Again I say, pay up or
    else!

  5. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    * Rich peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > "Linonut" wrote in message
    > news:PTyYj.25288$C8.8885@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
    >>* Rich peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>
    >>> ^ Insert "Stupid Windows User" and "Distro Shufflle" comments here ^

    >>
    >> Idiot.

    >
    > I guess I would have to agree. Why did I expect anything different from
    > Linux? It really is a bug ridden POS and I was stupid to think that a year's
    > worth of development time would have changed anything.


    You're just a troll and an idiot, son. What you're hoping to
    accomplish, I don't know. You only make yourself look dumb.

    --
    If you show people the problems and you show people the solutions they will be
    moved to act.
    -- Bill Gates, At Live8 (2 July 2005) as reported in BBC News (4 July 2005)

  6. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    On Tue, 20 May 2008 11:50:08 -0400, Ezekiel wrote:

    > "SomeBloke" wrote in message
    > news:Vq-dncGEZ-t4cq_VnZ2dnUVZ8u2dnZ2d@posted.metronet...
    >> Ezekiel wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>
    >>> Pot. Kettle. Black.
    >>>

    >>
    >> I own the patent on that process, pay up or I will send the gents from the
    >> Inland Revenue around to inspect your paperwork!

    >
    > I thought you released "Pot. Kettle. Black." under the GPL?
    >
    > Besides, you had patented "Pot. Kettle. Black." with no trailing spaces.
    > Mine version with a trailing space is clearly new and unique.


    You must be thinking of "Works for me".


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

  7. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    * Ezekiel peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > "Linonut" wrote in message
    >
    >> Linux downloads in /half/ the time of Windows XP.
    >>
    >> And I have no more time for your ridiculous, lying troll posts.

    >
    > Pot. Kettle. Black.
    >
    > First he claims that "Linux downloads 2X as fast as XP" but then the idiot
    > runs away by claiming that he doesn't have time for "ridiculous lying troll
    > posts."
    >
    > You can't make this stuff up people. I'm sure there are lots of reputable
    > sites in the web that show conclusive evidence that linux really does
    > download 2X as fast as XP. Right? Those sites are right
    > over.......?????????????


    I'm telling you only what I have observed when I have bothered making
    the measurements.

    The rates stated by the download software on XP (SP1 or SP2, I don't
    remember) are very consistently twice as fast for Linux.

    This ratio I have found to be consistent no matter what the absolute
    speed is, be it 33Kb/s or be it 11Mb/s.

    I'm not lying in any shape form or fashion. I have seen these numbers
    on my systems.

    --
    When we have the information highway, I'll put it [information about
    himself] out there. Everybody who wants to pay, I don't know, one cent, can
    see what movies I'm watching and what books I'm reading and certain other
    information. If I'm still interesting, I'll rack up dollars as people
    access that part of the highway.
    -- Bill Gates, Interview in Playboy magazine (1994)

  8. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    * chrisv peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > Rich wrote:
    >
    >>The ColaNuts are the idiots. I have followed this group off and on for
    >>several years. The same idiots talking about how Linux is taking over the
    >>world and that it is ready to replace Windows on the desktop. Not much
    >>progress that I can see. Same old buggy crapware that requires the user to
    >>spend countless hours doing things that Windows does for you. I guess you
    >>have time for that crap when you live in your momma's basement.

    >
    > You know, you had a pretty good rant going, until this. It's clear
    > that you have a bad attitude. It's also clear to anyone who has
    > actually tried a sampling of modern Linux distros, that the experience
    > that you claim is not typical. Indeed, it's quite clear that Linux in
    > fact is faster and easier to install than is Windows.


    Are feeling okay, chrisv? No *plonk*? Especially since this Rich idiot
    richly merits it?

    --
    Success is a lousy teacher. It seduces smart people into thinking they can't
    lose.
    -- Bill Gates

  9. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    On 2008-05-20, Linonut wrote:
    > * Rich peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >
    >> "Linonut" wrote in message
    >> news:PTyYj.25288$C8.8885@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
    >>>* Rich peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>>
    >>>> ^ Insert "Stupid Windows User" and "Distro Shufflle" comments here ^
    >>>
    >>> Idiot.

    >>
    >> I guess I would have to agree. Why did I expect anything different from
    >> Linux? It really is a bug ridden POS and I was stupid to think that a year's
    >> worth of development time would have changed anything.

    >
    > You're just a troll and an idiot, son. What you're hoping to
    > accomplish, I don't know. You only make yourself look dumb.


    ....what he accomplished is pushed us Linux Zealots to use their
    systems in ways that some new Windows user might. In so doing,
    we've come to realize that not only is this guy full of ****
    but that there has been some positive progress in this area.

    The samba stuff in nautilus/ubuntu is pretty slick and quite
    an improvement over the old way of doing things. I don't see it
    antagonizing a sincere Windows convert.

    --

    Truth is irrelevant as long as the predictions are good. |||
    / | \

    Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    http://www.usenet.com

  10. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    * Ezekiel peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > "Linonut" wrote in message
    >
    >> Linux downloads in /half/ the time of Windows XP.
    >>
    >> And I have no more time for your ridiculous, lying troll posts.

    >
    > Pot. Kettle. Black.
    >
    > First he claims that "Linux downloads 2X as fast as XP" but then the idiot
    > runs away by claiming that he doesn't have time for "ridiculous lying troll
    > posts."
    >
    > You can't make this stuff up people. I'm sure there are lots of reputable
    > sites in the web that show conclusive evidence that linux really does
    > download 2X as fast as XP. Right? Those sites are right
    > over.......?????????????


    Try this one. It seems to roughly bear out what I claimed:

    http://www.pamconf.org/2005/PDF/34310332.pdf

    Measured Comparative Performance of TCP Stacks


    Table 1. TCP performance during 5% bidirectional loss

    TCP Implementation Min Mean Max SD

    Linux 2.6.10 164.38 213.98 287.67 22.75
    Linux 2.4.27 153.82 207.42 248.70 22.86
    FreeBSD 5.3 136.77 176.20 225.01 17.11
    FreeBSD 5.2.1 128.74 162.81 219.01 19.56
    Windows XP SP2 89.90 137.31 191.00 21.67
    OpenBSD 3.5 63.84 117.98 166.82 22.11

    Table 2. TCP performance during reverse path congestion

    TCP Implementation Min Mean Max SD
    Linux 2.4.27 1220 1296 1375 33.3
    FreeBSD 5.3 1128 1242 1366 52.8
    FreeBSD 5.2.1 1099 1205 1289 48.6
    Windows XP 906 1024 1152 58.5
    OpenBSD 3.5 1273 1352 1438 40.4

    These are measurements of "goodput":

    Goodput is the amount of data successfully read from the TCP socket
    by the application at the receiving end of a TCP connection. Hosts H3
    and H4 are unused. Each test lasted 60 seconds.

    Just so you know I'm not nuts, at least in regard to download speeds.

    Really, the only things I'm nuts about are Linux and soccer .

    --
    If you think your teacher is tough, wait until you get a boss. He doesn't
    have tenure.
    -- Bill Gates

  11. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    Linonut wrote:

    >Are feeling okay, chrisv? No *plonk*? Especially since this Rich idiot
    >richly merits it?


    Eh? When have I ever plonked anyone? 8)

    --
    "I'm a liar." - Hadron Quark

  12. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again


    "Linonut" wrote in message
    news:sRDYj.51983$3v1.7552@bignews3.bellsouth.net.. .
    >* Ezekiel peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >
    >> "Linonut" wrote in message
    >>
    >>> Linux downloads in /half/ the time of Windows XP.
    >>>
    >>> And I have no more time for your ridiculous, lying troll posts.

    >>
    >> Pot. Kettle. Black.
    >>
    >> First he claims that "Linux downloads 2X as fast as XP" but then the
    >> idiot
    >> runs away by claiming that he doesn't have time for "ridiculous lying
    >> troll
    >> posts."
    >>
    >> You can't make this stuff up people. I'm sure there are lots of reputable
    >> sites in the web that show conclusive evidence that linux really does
    >> download 2X as fast as XP. Right? Those sites are right
    >> over.......?????????????

    >
    > Try this one. It seems to roughly bear out what I claimed:
    >
    > http://www.pamconf.org/2005/PDF/34310332.pdf


    Cool. At least you provided a link of sorts.


    > Measured Comparative Performance of TCP Stacks
    > Table 1. TCP performance during 5% bidirectional loss
    >
    > TCP Implementation Min Mean Max SD
    >
    > Linux 2.6.10 164.38 213.98 287.67 22.75
    > Linux 2.4.27 153.82 207.42 248.70 22.86
    > FreeBSD 5.3 136.77 176.20 225.01 17.11
    > FreeBSD 5.2.1 128.74 162.81 219.01 19.56
    > Windows XP SP2 89.90 137.31 191.00 21.67
    > OpenBSD 3.5 63.84 117.98 166.82 22.11
    >
    > These are measurements of "goodput":


    Goodput???? After intentionally introducing a 5% bidirectional packet loss.

    How bad is your network that you're randomly dropping 5% of all your
    packets? Perhaps if you're sending TCP/IP over a shortwave radio connection
    to Antarctica you may lose 5% of your packets. But even with my wireless
    connection it's rare to ever see dropped packets, let alone at a rate of 5%.

    This seems awfully contrived. How about some actual "real-life" throughput
    numbers over a network that works? I network between all sorts of machines
    all day long and if one OS did networking 2X as fast as some other OS then I
    or someone out in the world would have noticed. It wouldn't take some
    obscure research paper where they randomly drop 5% of all packets for this
    to be noticed.



    > Just so you know I'm not nuts, at least in regard to download speeds.
    >
    > Really, the only things I'm nuts about are Linux and soccer .


    I knew that somebody in America was crazy over soccer. I never knew it was
    you! (FWIW - My next door neighbor years ago was a retired soccer player
    from Brazil. I don't remember their last name but his first name was Ricardo
    and his wife's name was Alicia.)




    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  13. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    On Tue, 20 May 2008 07:05:13 -0700, Rich wrote:

    > "Rick" wrote in message
    > news:vOSdnWO3p5CxMq_VnZ2dnUVZ_gCdnZ2d@supernews.co m...
    >> On Mon, 19 May 2008 13:19:08 -0700, Rich wrote:
    >>
    >>> It has been over a year since I tried out a Linux distro so I decided
    >>> to give the latest Kubuntu a try. Here is what I experienced.
    >>>
    >>> 1. I downloaded the DVD ISO from my nearest server. It took over 10
    >>> hours. I tried several servers and they all were extremely slow. I
    >>> guess you get what you pay for. These server are pathetic.

    >>
    >> ... or your ISP sucks.

    >
    > No, I get great download speeds from servers that aren't running in some
    > guys basement.


    Then explain why it took 10 hours to DL that DVD ISO? I do it fairly
    often and it sure as hell doesn't take 10 hours.

    >
    >
    >>
    >>> 2. I burned the DVD and booted from it into the Live version so I
    >>> could check it out before I installed it. I was impressed that it had
    >>> no problem detecting my display and setting the correct screen size.
    >>> This was not the case in the past so this has improved.
    >>>
    >>> 3. It put an icon on the desktop for my thumb drive but it could not
    >>> display the contents.

    >>
    >> Any idea why?

    >
    > The OS is a POS? It works just fine under Windows.


    Bzzzt. Wrong. Try again.

    >
    >
    >>
    >>> 4. I tried to browse my network. All of my shared drives (Windows XP
    >>> shares) were visible but I was unable to get it to authenticate. I
    >>> entered valid user name and passwords but could not get it to accept
    >>> my credentials. It just kept prompting for my password. I cancelled
    >>> the dialog box and it then listed the contents of the drive! I double
    >>> clicked on a jpg to view it and it said that the file doesn't exist.
    >>> Nice.

    >>
    >> Did you set up Samba correctly?

    >
    > Why should I have to set anything up? It just works under Windows. I do
    > have the time to waste on this crapware.


    Because Linux isn't Windows. If you want to interact with Windows stuff,
    you might just have to set some things up. So, tell us, how do you go
    about browsing ext3 partitions form Windows. Surely such a great OS would
    allow that out of the box.

    >
    >
    >>
    >>> 5. I decided to go ahead and install it on a second drive in my
    >>> system. There was an Install icon on the desktop so I did the install
    >>> from there. It offered to install it into the free space on my second
    >>> drive by default. That was impressive. I accepted the default and
    >>> proceeded with the install. It cranked away for about 15 minutes and
    >>> then said it had less than one minute remaining. After that it REMOVED
    >>> a bunch of language pack related files for another 15 minutes. I told
    >>> it I wanted an English install. Why did it install all this stuff in
    >>> the first place? Weird.

    >>
    >> Why does any OS install files that it then later removes during an
    >> install?

    >
    > Any OS has temporary files that it installs. This was different. It
    > installed a bunch of files that it did not need and then spent a long
    > time removing them. Poorly designed installer, but is very typical of
    > Linux crapware.


    So, its OK for any OS to install temp files, but not Linux.

    >
    >
    >>
    >>> 6. Against my better judgment, I let it modify my main Vista drive
    >>> with GRUB and rebooted the system. GRUB came up and immediately gave
    >>> Error 22. Helpful! I rebooted again, same thing. I looked for a repair
    >>> option when booting from the Kubuntu install DVD. The help screen said
    >>> I should select repair options from the menu but no such options
    >>> existed. I decided to do the Kubuntu install by booting from the DVD
    >>> and installing from there, instead of installing from within the Live
    >>> CD mode. It found the previously created partitions and said it was
    >>> verifying them. It cranked away for nearly 10 minutes and then said it
    >>> had errors and went to the manual mode for partitioning. At this point
    >>> I realized that this POS just isn't ready for prime time.

    >>
    >> ... or maybe there's a problem with your POS system?

    >
    > This system works just fine under Windows. Again, blame the user and
    > their hardware for the shortcomings of the mess that is Linux.


    OK.. I'll blame the user... maybe the part between the chair and keyboard
    is a POS.

    >>
    >>
    >>> 7. I booted from my Vista DVD and used it's startup repair option to
    >>> get rid of GRUB. I used the partitioning tool in Vista to reclaim my
    >>> free space on the drive and am back in business.

    >>
    >> Yes, we see what you are trying to sell.

    >
    > I am not selling anything. I just pointed out that Vista came with the
    > tools to fix the mess that Linux made.


    Linux didn't make any mess. You did.

    >
    >
    >>
    >>> Maybe when I have nothing better to do I will try this again. As in
    >>> the
    >>> past, Linux is still a bug ridden mess. If you have a lot of time on
    >>> your hands and no life, Linux is the OS for you.

    >>
    >>
    >>>
    >>> ^ Insert "Stupid Windows User" and "Distro Shufflle" comments here ^

    >>
    >> There is no need to insert stupid windows user comments. You did that
    >> yourself. As for the distro sguffle, there a plenty of people that
    >> prefer kubuntu to "Ubuntu" and other Linux based distros. You are the
    >> on that would have to decide to switch distros.

    >
    > And I would have a similar experience with all of them.
    >

    So.. you're claiming clairvoyance now, too?


    --
    Rick

  14. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    On Tue, 20 May 2008 11:54:42 -0400, Moshe. Goldfarb wrote:

    > On Tue, 20 May 2008 07:05:13 -0700, Rich wrote:
    >
    >> "Rick" wrote in message
    >> news:vOSdnWO3p5CxMq_VnZ2dnUVZ_gCdnZ2d@supernews.co m...
    >>> On Mon, 19 May 2008 13:19:08 -0700, Rich wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> It has been over a year since I tried out a Linux distro so I decided
    >>>> to give the latest Kubuntu a try. Here is what I experienced.
    >>>>
    >>>> 1. I downloaded the DVD ISO from my nearest server. It took over 10
    >>>> hours. I tried several servers and they all were extremely slow. I
    >>>> guess you get what you pay for. These server are pathetic.
    >>>
    >>> ... or your ISP sucks.

    >>
    >> No, I get great download speeds from servers that aren't running in
    >> some guys basement.

    >
    >
    > Snicker...


    Laugh it up, basement dweller... that's what you call Linux users, and
    you claim you and your family use Linux.

    >>>> 2. I burned the DVD and booted from it into the Live version so I
    >>>> could check it out before I installed it. I was impressed that it had
    >>>> no problem detecting my display and setting the correct screen size.
    >>>> This was not the case in the past so this has improved.
    >>>>
    >>>> 3. It put an icon on the desktop for my thumb drive but it could not
    >>>> display the contents.
    >>>
    >>> Any idea why?

    >>
    >> The OS is a POS? It works just fine under Windows.

    >
    > It's the same old story.
    > Linux loses no matter how you slice it.


    More Flatfarb FUD.

    >
    >
    >
    >>>
    >>>> 4. I tried to browse my network. All of my shared drives (Windows XP
    >>>> shares) were visible but I was unable to get it to authenticate. I
    >>>> entered valid user name and passwords but could not get it to accept
    >>>> my credentials. It just kept prompting for my password. I cancelled
    >>>> the dialog box and it then listed the contents of the drive! I double
    >>>> clicked on a jpg to view it and it said that the file doesn't exist.
    >>>> Nice.
    >>>
    >>> Did you set up Samba correctly?

    >>
    >> Why should I have to set anything up? It just works under Windows. I do
    >> have the time to waste on this crapware.

    >
    > Linux users love to tinker with their systems. In fact, tinkering is a
    > major part of the *fun* for these loons.


    So, tell us again how Windows will natively read an ext3 partition.

    >
    > I'm surprised they haven't told you that your hardware is defective or
    > that you are using the wrong distribution.


    I don't know if he's using the wrong distribution. I don't know what his
    needs are.

    >
    > As if their is a *Right* distribution.


    There.. for some. PCLOS is the "right" distributio for me at the moment.

    > Most of them suck, and suck badly.


    Isn't that what they say about you?

    >>>> 5. I decided to go ahead and install it on a second drive in my
    >>>> system. There was an Install icon on the desktop so I did the install
    >>>> from there. It offered to install it into the free space on my second
    >>>> drive by default. That was impressive. I accepted the default and
    >>>> proceeded with the install. It cranked away for about 15 minutes and
    >>>> then said it had less than one minute remaining. After that it
    >>>> REMOVED a bunch of language pack related files for another 15
    >>>> minutes. I told it I wanted an English install. Why did it install
    >>>> all this stuff in the first place? Weird.
    >>>
    >>> Why does any OS install files that it then later removes during an
    >>> install?

    >>
    >> Any OS has temporary files that it installs. This was different. It
    >> installed a bunch of files that it did not need and then spent a long
    >> time removing them. Poorly designed installer, but is very typical of
    >> Linux crapware.

    >
    >
    > With Linux it's not a matter of how *well* it installs.... it's a matter
    > of *if* it installs at all.
    >
    > You get what you don't pay for.


    More flatfarb BS.

    >
    >
    >
    >
    >>>
    >>>> 6. Against my better judgment, I let it modify my main Vista drive
    >>>> with GRUB and rebooted the system. GRUB came up and immediately gave
    >>>> Error 22. Helpful! I rebooted again, same thing. I looked for a
    >>>> repair option when booting from the Kubuntu install DVD. The help
    >>>> screen said I should select repair options from the menu but no such
    >>>> options existed. I decided to do the Kubuntu install by booting from
    >>>> the DVD and installing from there, instead of installing from within
    >>>> the Live CD mode. It found the previously created partitions and said
    >>>> it was verifying them. It cranked away for nearly 10 minutes and then
    >>>> said it had errors and went to the manual mode for partitioning. At
    >>>> this point I realized that this POS just isn't ready for prime time.
    >>>
    >>> ... or maybe there's a problem with your POS system?

    >>
    >> This system works just fine under Windows. Again, blame the user and
    >> their hardware for the shortcomings of the mess that is Linux.

    >
    > I knew they would get to blaming hardware.
    >
    > They have the same old playbook.


    No, personally I think it's the POS part between the chair and keyboard.

    >
    >
    >
    >>>> 7. I booted from my Vista DVD and used it's startup repair option to
    >>>> get rid of GRUB. I used the partitioning tool in Vista to reclaim my
    >>>> free space on the drive and am back in business.
    >>>
    >>> Yes, we see what you are trying to sell.

    >>
    >> I am not selling anything. I just pointed out that Vista came with the
    >> tools to fix the mess that Linux made.

    >
    > You're lucky.
    > Some people aren't able to recover after a Linux install gone wrong and
    > they end up losing data.
    >
    > It's not a pretty sight.


    Isn't that what they say about you?

    >>>
    >>>> Maybe when I have nothing better to do I will try this again. As in
    >>>> the
    >>>> past, Linux is still a bug ridden mess. If you have a lot of time on
    >>>> your hands and no life, Linux is the OS for you.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>
    >>>> ^ Insert "Stupid Windows User" and "Distro Shufflle" comments here ^
    >>>
    >>> There is no need to insert stupid windows user comments. You did that
    >>> yourself. As for the distro sguffle, there a plenty of people that
    >>> prefer kubuntu to "Ubuntu" and other Linux based distros. You are the
    >>> on that would have to decide to switch distros.

    >>
    >> And I would have a similar experience with all of them.

    >
    > Pretty much.
    > The problems will change but the experience with Linux will still suck.


    If the experience with Linux will still suck why do you and your family
    still use it?


    --
    Rick

  15. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Rick

    wrote
    on Tue, 20 May 2008 15:32:04 -0500
    :
    > On Tue, 20 May 2008 07:05:13 -0700, Rich wrote:
    >
    >> "Rick" wrote in message
    >> news:vOSdnWO3p5CxMq_VnZ2dnUVZ_gCdnZ2d@supernews.co m...
    >>> On Mon, 19 May 2008 13:19:08 -0700, Rich wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> It has been over a year since I tried out a Linux distro so I decided
    >>>> to give the latest Kubuntu a try. Here is what I experienced.
    >>>>
    >>>> 1. I downloaded the DVD ISO from my nearest server. It took over 10
    >>>> hours. I tried several servers and they all were extremely slow. I
    >>>> guess you get what you pay for. These server are pathetic.
    >>>
    >>> ... or your ISP sucks.

    >>
    >> No, I get great download speeds from servers that aren't running in some
    >> guys basement.

    >
    > Then explain why it took 10 hours to DL that DVD ISO? I do it fairly
    > often and it sure as hell doesn't take 10 hours.


    I'm assuming you're both referring to
    kubuntu-8.04-desktop-i386.iso; this file is just under 700
    MB in size. At 5 kB/s, the download would take about 1 day
    15 hours. At 12.8 kB/s (this would be along the lines of
    an ISDN line), the download would take just over 15 hours.
    At 150 kB/s (which is what I have at home) it would take
    about 80 minutes.

    I have had problems with Earthlink's upfeed on occasion,
    though; something upstream of me or you might throttle
    things on occasion. No way to control it.

    >
    >>
    >>
    >>>
    >>>> 2. I burned the DVD and booted from it into the Live version so I
    >>>> could check it out before I installed it. I was impressed that it had
    >>>> no problem detecting my display and setting the correct screen size.
    >>>> This was not the case in the past so this has improved.
    >>>>
    >>>> 3. It put an icon on the desktop for my thumb drive but it could not
    >>>> display the contents.
    >>>
    >>> Any idea why?

    >>
    >> The OS is a POS? It works just fine under Windows.

    >
    > Bzzzt. Wrong. Try again.


    There's a fair number of issues here; either he's
    misconfigured the USB subsystem or his thumb drive has
    a filesystem Linux doesn't recognize -- a possibility if
    he's formatted it NTFS.

    I don't use thumb drives often but they work reasonably well
    the few times I've used them; basically, they look like a SCSI
    drive (/dev/sda, /dev/sdb), probably because that was easiest
    to hook in at the kernel level.

    >
    >>
    >>
    >>>
    >>>> 4. I tried to browse my network. All of my shared drives (Windows XP
    >>>> shares) were visible but I was unable to get it to authenticate. I
    >>>> entered valid user name and passwords but could not get it to accept
    >>>> my credentials. It just kept prompting for my password. I cancelled
    >>>> the dialog box and it then listed the contents of the drive! I double
    >>>> clicked on a jpg to view it and it said that the file doesn't exist.
    >>>> Nice.
    >>>
    >>> Did you set up Samba correctly?

    >>
    >> Why should I have to set anything up? It just works under Windows. I do
    >> have the time to waste on this crapware.

    >
    > Because Linux isn't Windows. If you want to interact with Windows stuff,
    > you might just have to set some things up. So, tell us, how do you go
    > about browsing ext3 partitions form Windows. Surely such a great OS would
    > allow that out of the box.


    There used to be a "fsdext2" utility running around,
    but that was during the Win95 era, and it didn't work all
    that well. (Certainly not part of Windows proper; one has
    to download it.)

    A little googling coughed up

    http://www.diskinternals.com/linux-reader/

    which appears to be a more modern freeware utility,
    allowing XP access to files on a Linux file system...at
    least the ext2 or ext3 one, anyway.

    Still not part of Windows...might be useful to somebody,
    especially since it has a picture preview capability
    built in.

    (No doubt extensions for reiserfs and jfs are also possible.)

    Another, more interesting utility allows read *and* write
    access:

    http://www.fs-driver.org/

    This variant appears to install as an actual driver, and
    allows NT/XP/Vista to "mount" or otherwise recognize ext2
    systems. A utility is provided for this mounting, with
    a rather green and goo-ey interface, or one can use Windows'
    "mountvol".

    The FAQ for the latter system mentions that access rights
    are essentially ignored. (Not unreasonable since the
    password systems are far different, but one does have to
    consider the security ramifications.)

    These do look far more polished as solutions nowadays.

    >
    >>
    >>
    >>>
    >>>> 5. I decided to go ahead and install it on a second drive in my
    >>>> system. There was an Install icon on the desktop so I did the install
    >>>> from there. It offered to install it into the free space on my second
    >>>> drive by default. That was impressive. I accepted the default and
    >>>> proceeded with the install. It cranked away for about 15 minutes and
    >>>> then said it had less than one minute remaining. After that it REMOVED
    >>>> a bunch of language pack related files for another 15 minutes. I told
    >>>> it I wanted an English install. Why did it install all this stuff in
    >>>> the first place? Weird.
    >>>
    >>> Why does any OS install files that it then later removes during an
    >>> install?

    >>
    >> Any OS has temporary files that it installs. This was different. It
    >> installed a bunch of files that it did not need and then spent a long
    >> time removing them. Poorly designed installer, but is very typical of
    >> Linux crapware.

    >
    > So, its OK for any OS to install temp files, but not Linux.


    I'll admit to wondering what exactly happened here.
    Given the amount of information here (not very much),
    I have no idea what went wrong, but Gentoo does have an
    option to install only specific locales (the only package
    that I know depends on this is glibc), and does delete
    obsolete files when a new version is built and installed.

    Since this was a fresh install, though, that's probably not it.

    >
    >>
    >>
    >>>
    >>>> 6. Against my better judgment, I let it modify my main Vista drive
    >>>> with GRUB and rebooted the system. GRUB came up and immediately gave
    >>>> Error 22. Helpful! I rebooted again, same thing. I looked for a repair
    >>>> option when booting from the Kubuntu install DVD. The help screen said
    >>>> I should select repair options from the menu but no such options
    >>>> existed. I decided to do the Kubuntu install by booting from the DVD
    >>>> and installing from there, instead of installing from within the Live
    >>>> CD mode. It found the previously created partitions and said it was
    >>>> verifying them. It cranked away for nearly 10 minutes and then said it
    >>>> had errors and went to the manual mode for partitioning. At this point
    >>>> I realized that this POS just isn't ready for prime time.
    >>>
    >>> ... or maybe there's a problem with your POS system?

    >>
    >> This system works just fine under Windows. Again, blame the user and
    >> their hardware for the shortcomings of the mess that is Linux.

    >
    > OK.. I'll blame the user... maybe the part between the chair and keyboard
    > is a POS.


    Otherwise known as PEBKAC.

    >
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> 7. I booted from my Vista DVD and used it's startup repair option to
    >>>> get rid of GRUB. I used the partitioning tool in Vista to reclaim my
    >>>> free space on the drive and am back in business.
    >>>
    >>> Yes, we see what you are trying to sell.

    >>
    >> I am not selling anything. I just pointed out that Vista came with the
    >> tools to fix the mess that Linux made.

    >
    > Linux didn't make any mess. You did.


    And in any event Vista's "fix" involves wipeout of the MBR.
    Hardly a fix, really.

    A list of GRUB error messages is at

    http://www.uruk.org/orig-grub/errors.html

    though I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Error 22:
    "Must load Multiboot kernel before modules" doesn't make
    a lot of sense to me, but might relate to the ordering of
    the grub.conf lines -- a config screwup, in other words.

    >
    >>
    >>
    >>>
    >>>> Maybe when I have nothing better to do I will try this again. As in
    >>>> the
    >>>> past, Linux is still a bug ridden mess. If you have a lot of time on
    >>>> your hands and no life, Linux is the OS for you.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>
    >>>> ^ Insert "Stupid Windows User" and "Distro Shufflle" comments here ^
    >>>
    >>> There is no need to insert stupid windows user comments. You did that
    >>> yourself. As for the distro sguffle, there a plenty of people that
    >>> prefer kubuntu to "Ubuntu" and other Linux based distros. You are the
    >>> on that would have to decide to switch distros.

    >>
    >> And I would have a similar experience with all of them.
    >>

    > So.. you're claiming clairvoyance now, too?
    >


    Of course. ;-)

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    Warning: This encrypted signature is a dangerous munition.
    Please notify the US government immediately upon reception.
    0000 0000 0000 0000 0001 0000 0000 0000 ...
    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  16. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    On Tue, 20 May 2008 14:35:17 -0700, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:

    > In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Rick
    >
    > wrote
    > on Tue, 20 May 2008 15:32:04 -0500
    > :
    >> On Tue, 20 May 2008 07:05:13 -0700, Rich wrote:
    >>
    >>> "Rick" wrote in message
    >>> news:vOSdnWO3p5CxMq_VnZ2dnUVZ_gCdnZ2d@supernews.co m...
    >>>> On Mon, 19 May 2008 13:19:08 -0700, Rich wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> It has been over a year since I tried out a Linux distro so I
    >>>>> decided to give the latest Kubuntu a try. Here is what I
    >>>>> experienced.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> 1. I downloaded the DVD ISO from my nearest server. It took over 10
    >>>>> hours. I tried several servers and they all were extremely slow. I
    >>>>> guess you get what you pay for. These server are pathetic.
    >>>>
    >>>> ... or your ISP sucks.
    >>>
    >>> No, I get great download speeds from servers that aren't running in
    >>> some guys basement.

    >>
    >> Then explain why it took 10 hours to DL that DVD ISO? I do it fairly
    >> often and it sure as hell doesn't take 10 hours.

    >
    > I'm assuming you're both referring to kubuntu-8.04-desktop-i386.iso;
    > this file is just under 700 MB in size. At 5 kB/s, the download would
    > take about 1 day 15 hours. At 12.8 kB/s (this would be along the lines
    > of an ISDN line), the download would take just over 15 hours. At 150
    > kB/s (which is what I have at home) it would take about 80 minutes.
    >
    > I have had problems with Earthlink's upfeed on occasion, though;
    > something upstream of me or you might throttle things on occasion. No
    > way to control it.


    If it's taking him 10 hrs to DL a DVD, he has a lousy connection. It may
    the only thing available, but it's still a lousy connection.

    >
    >
    >>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>> 2. I burned the DVD and booted from it into the Live version so I
    >>>>> could check it out before I installed it. I was impressed that it
    >>>>> had no problem detecting my display and setting the correct screen
    >>>>> size. This was not the case in the past so this has improved.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> 3. It put an icon on the desktop for my thumb drive but it could not
    >>>>> display the contents.
    >>>>
    >>>> Any idea why?
    >>>
    >>> The OS is a POS? It works just fine under Windows.

    >>
    >> Bzzzt. Wrong. Try again.

    >
    > There's a fair number of issues here; either he's misconfigured the USB
    > subsystem or his thumb drive has a filesystem Linux doesn't recognize --
    > a possibility if he's formatted it NTFS.


    All possible, but he wants to blame Linux up front.

    >
    > I don't use thumb drives often but they work reasonably well the few
    > times I've used them; basically, they look like a SCSI drive (/dev/sda,
    > /dev/sdb), probably because that was easiest to hook in at the kernel
    > level.
    >
    >
    >>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>> 4. I tried to browse my network. All of my shared drives (Windows XP
    >>>>> shares) were visible but I was unable to get it to authenticate. I
    >>>>> entered valid user name and passwords but could not get it to accept
    >>>>> my credentials. It just kept prompting for my password. I cancelled
    >>>>> the dialog box and it then listed the contents of the drive! I
    >>>>> double clicked on a jpg to view it and it said that the file doesn't
    >>>>> exist. Nice.
    >>>>
    >>>> Did you set up Samba correctly?
    >>>
    >>> Why should I have to set anything up? It just works under Windows. I
    >>> do have the time to waste on this crapware.

    >>
    >> Because Linux isn't Windows. If you want to interact with Windows
    >> stuff, you might just have to set some things up. So, tell us, how do
    >> you go about browsing ext3 partitions form Windows. Surely such a great
    >> OS would allow that out of the box.

    >
    > There used to be a "fsdext2" utility running around, but that was during
    > the Win95 era, and it didn't work all that well. (Certainly not part of
    > Windows proper; one has to download it.)
    >
    > A little googling coughed up
    >
    > http://www.diskinternals.com/linux-reader/
    >
    > which appears to be a more modern freeware utility, allowing XP access
    > to files on a Linux file system...at least the ext2 or ext3 one, anyway.
    >
    > Still not part of Windows...might be useful to somebody, especially
    > since it has a picture preview capability built in.
    >
    > (No doubt extensions for reiserfs and jfs are also possible.)
    >
    > Another, more interesting utility allows read *and* write access:
    >
    > http://www.fs-driver.org/
    >
    > This variant appears to install as an actual driver, and allows
    > NT/XP/Vista to "mount" or otherwise recognize ext2 systems. A utility
    > is provided for this mounting, with a rather green and goo-ey interface,
    > or one can use Windows' "mountvol".
    >
    > The FAQ for the latter system mentions that access rights are
    > essentially ignored. (Not unreasonable since the password systems are
    > far different, but one does have to consider the security
    > ramifications.)
    >
    > These do look far more polished as solutions nowadays.


    The above choices are not included with Windows out of the box, so you
    have to add something and configure it.

    >
    >
    >>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>> 5. I decided to go ahead and install it on a second drive in my
    >>>>> system. There was an Install icon on the desktop so I did the
    >>>>> install from there. It offered to install it into the free space on
    >>>>> my second drive by default. That was impressive. I accepted the
    >>>>> default and proceeded with the install. It cranked away for about 15
    >>>>> minutes and then said it had less than one minute remaining. After
    >>>>> that it REMOVED a bunch of language pack related files for another
    >>>>> 15 minutes. I told it I wanted an English install. Why did it
    >>>>> install all this stuff in the first place? Weird.
    >>>>
    >>>> Why does any OS install files that it then later removes during an
    >>>> install?
    >>>
    >>> Any OS has temporary files that it installs. This was different. It
    >>> installed a bunch of files that it did not need and then spent a long
    >>> time removing them. Poorly designed installer, but is very typical of
    >>> Linux crapware.

    >>
    >> So, its OK for any OS to install temp files, but not Linux.

    >
    > I'll admit to wondering what exactly happened here. Given the amount of
    > information here (not very much), I have no idea what went wrong, but
    > Gentoo does have an option to install only specific locales (the only
    > package that I know depends on this is glibc), and does delete obsolete
    > files when a new version is built and installed.
    >
    > Since this was a fresh install, though, that's probably not it.
    >
    >
    >>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>> 6. Against my better judgment, I let it modify my main Vista drive
    >>>>> with GRUB and rebooted the system. GRUB came up and immediately gave
    >>>>> Error 22. Helpful! I rebooted again, same thing. I looked for a
    >>>>> repair option when booting from the Kubuntu install DVD. The help
    >>>>> screen said I should select repair options from the menu but no such
    >>>>> options existed. I decided to do the Kubuntu install by booting from
    >>>>> the DVD and installing from there, instead of installing from within
    >>>>> the Live CD mode. It found the previously created partitions and
    >>>>> said it was verifying them. It cranked away for nearly 10 minutes
    >>>>> and then said it had errors and went to the manual mode for
    >>>>> partitioning. At this point I realized that this POS just isn't
    >>>>> ready for prime time.
    >>>>
    >>>> ... or maybe there's a problem with your POS system?
    >>>
    >>> This system works just fine under Windows. Again, blame the user and
    >>> their hardware for the shortcomings of the mess that is Linux.

    >>
    >> OK.. I'll blame the user... maybe the part between the chair and
    >> keyboard is a POS.

    >
    > Otherwise known as PEBKAC.


    hmmm .. an acronym. Must be official then :-)

    >
    >
    >>
    >>>>
    >>>>> 7. I booted from my Vista DVD and used it's startup repair option to
    >>>>> get rid of GRUB. I used the partitioning tool in Vista to reclaim my
    >>>>> free space on the drive and am back in business.
    >>>>
    >>>> Yes, we see what you are trying to sell.
    >>>
    >>> I am not selling anything. I just pointed out that Vista came with the
    >>> tools to fix the mess that Linux made.

    >>
    >> Linux didn't make any mess. You did.

    >
    > And in any event Vista's "fix" involves wipeout of the MBR. Hardly a
    > fix, really.


    It will suit him. It will effectively hide an Liunux install left.

    >
    > A list of GRUB error messages is at
    >
    > http://www.uruk.org/orig-grub/errors.html
    >
    > though I'm not sure how comprehensive it is. Error 22: "Must load
    > Multiboot kernel before modules" doesn't make a lot of sense to me, but
    > might relate to the ordering of the grub.conf lines -- a config screwup,
    > in other words.
    >
    >
    >>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>> Maybe when I have nothing better to do I will try this again. As in
    >>>>> the
    >>>>> past, Linux is still a bug ridden mess. If you have a lot of time on
    >>>>> your hands and no life, Linux is the OS for you.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> ^ Insert "Stupid Windows User" and "Distro Shufflle" comments here ^
    >>>>
    >>>> There is no need to insert stupid windows user comments. You did that
    >>>> yourself. As for the distro sguffle, there a plenty of people that
    >>>> prefer kubuntu to "Ubuntu" and other Linux based distros. You are the
    >>>> on that would have to decide to switch distros.
    >>>
    >>> And I would have a similar experience with all of them.
    >>>

    >> So.. you're claiming clairvoyance now, too?
    >>
    >>

    > Of course. ;-)



    :-)
    --
    Rick

  17. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    On 2008-05-20, Rich wrote:
    >
    > Notice how Windows "helps you out" but Linux expects you to do it yourself.
    > Yup, really ready for Joe average user, NOT!
    >


    Is that you, DFS?

    --
    Regards,

    Gregory.
    Gentoo Linux - Penguin Power

  18. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    Gregory Shearman wrote:
    > On 2008-05-20, Rich wrote:
    >>
    >> Notice how Windows "helps you out" but Linux expects you to do it
    >> yourself. Yup, really ready for Joe average user, NOT!
    >>

    >
    > Is that you, DFS?


    Does it say DFS on the package?



  19. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    * Gregory Shearman peremptorily fired off this memo:

    > On 2008-05-20, Rich wrote:
    >>
    >> Notice how Windows "helps you out" but Linux expects you to do it yourself.
    >> Yup, really ready for Joe average user, NOT!

    >
    > Is that you, DFS?


    DFS, Rich, Ian Semmel, OK, Zeke, and Moshe barely share one whole brain
    between them.

    --
    At Microsoft there are lots of brilliant ideas but the image is that they
    all come from the top - I'm afraid that's not quite right.
    -- Bill Gates

  20. Re: Trying out Kubuntu, again

    On Thu, 22 May 2008 11:08:50 -0400, Linonut wrote:

    > * Gregory Shearman peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >
    >> On 2008-05-20, Rich wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Notice how Windows "helps you out" but Linux expects you to do it yourself.
    >>> Yup, really ready for Joe average user, NOT!

    >>
    >> Is that you, DFS?

    >
    > DFS, Rich, Ian Semmel, OK, Zeke, and Moshe barely share one whole brain
    > between them.


    As compared to Linonut, HPT, Homer, Willy Poaster and Mark Kent who all
    share Roy Schestowitz's rectum.
    With their heads of course.
    The large one.
    In fact I believe LIARnut has managed to get his shoulders in there as
    well.


    --
    Moshe Goldfarb
    Collector of soaps from around the globe.
    Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
    http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/

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