IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source? - Linux

This is a discussion on IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source? - Linux ; In comp.os.linux.advocacy, RonB wrote on Thu, 17 Apr 2008 21:33:06 -0500 : > The Ghost In The Machine wrote: > >> OK, one more time, with feeling: >> >> LINUX DOES NOT SUPPORT PROGRAMMING! > > Yelling doesn't make bull**** ...

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Thread: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

  1. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, RonB

    wrote
    on Thu, 17 Apr 2008 21:33:06 -0500
    :
    > The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
    >
    >> OK, one more time, with feeling:
    >>
    >> LINUX DOES NOT SUPPORT PROGRAMMING!

    >
    > Yelling doesn't make bull**** golden.
    >


    At some point people are going to have to make the
    distinction between Linux, the kernel, and Linux, the
    distro -- and I'm not at all sure what to call the latter
    except that calling it Linux is at best confusing.

    Of course most Linux-based distros offer a fair number
    of programming aids, RAD tools, GUIfication methods,
    and API. Most of these can easily be ported to FreeBSD,
    MacOSX, and even Windows.

    So does Linux support programming, or not? Yes and no.

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    /dev/signature/pedantry: Resource temporarily unavailable

    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com


  2. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    In comp.os.linux.advocacy, chrisv

    wrote
    on Fri, 18 Apr 2008 13:45:56 -0500
    :
    > jim wrote:
    >
    >>"RonB" wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Could Linux's relatively small desktop presence have something to do with
    >>> the fact that Micro$haft has a monopoly on OEM OSs?

    >>
    >>No, it couldn't. That's a bull**** excuse for not taking proper action.
    >>
    >>Tell Mac users that MS has a monopoly on the desktop.

    >
    > Idiot. M$ has monopoly power in the market. The OEM's MUST use
    > Micro$oft products.
    >


    Gets a little more complicated than that. OEMs use
    Microsoft products because Microsoft offered them a deal --
    a deal that guarantees future lockin.

    I don't know the exact numbers but at one point OEMs might
    have been selling 80% Windows, 20% DOS[*]. If the hardware
    profit margin was 10%, Microsoft could easily give them
    a 10% discount.

    Here's how it worked, as I understand it.
    (The numbers are hypothetical.)

    Old deal:

    Revenue: 100,000 x $600 = $60M
    Cost: 80,000 x ($100 + $450) + 20,000 x ($50 + $450) = $54M
    Profit: $6M

    New deal:

    Revenue: 100,000 x $600 = $60M
    Cost: 100,000 x ($90 + $450) = $54M
    Profit: $6M

    Clearly this is OEM neutral -- but with a catch. Over
    time, the OEM will probably want to pay more attention
    to Windows, as the other solution's software costs
    ($50) are no longer part of the equation. The OEM cuts
    more costs that way (as they no longer have to support 2
    advertising campaigns), and can still reap the benefits
    of that 10% discount.

    Still want that "free" Windows software, everyone? ;-)
    [*] at one point it might have been a mixture of DOS and
    DOS-like systems, e.g. 4DOS, GEM.

    --
    #191, ewill3@earthlink.net
    /dev/signature/pedantry: Resource temporarily unavailable

    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com


  3. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?


    "chrisv" wrote in message
    newsvqh04dr3bvnt0bo06mg6kdmo4c6i3js3u@4ax.com...
    > jim wrote:
    >
    >>"RonB" wrote:
    >>>
    >>> Could Linux's relatively small desktop presence have something to do
    >>> with
    >>> the fact that Micro$haft has a monopoly on OEM OSs?

    >>
    >>No, it couldn't. That's a bull**** excuse for not taking proper action.
    >>
    >>Tell Mac users that MS has a monopoly on the desktop.

    >
    > Idiot. M$ has monopoly power in the market. The OEM's MUST use
    > Micro$oft products.


    That'll certainly be news to Dell. You'd better call them quick!

    jim



  4. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    "jim" writes:

    > "Linonut" wrote in message
    > news:lU0Oj.9520$tG6.8971@bignews1.bellsouth.net...
    >>* jim peremptorily fired off this memo:
    >>
    >>>
    >>> "jim" wrote in message
    >>> news:12SNj.44646$Er2.39701@bignews6.bellsouth.net. ..
    >>>> If so, this will be the death knell for Linux.
    >>>>
    >>>> http://www.cnet.com/8301-13505_1-9920531-16.html?tag=bl
    >>>>
    >>>> You people should have listened to me and made Linux as easy to program
    >>>> for noobs as VB made it for Windows. Hell, Mac programming is easier
    >>>> than
    >>>> Linux programming and Macs are kicking Linux's ass as a result.
    >>>>
    >>>> The ONLY thing that will save Linux's dreams of desktop acceptance (much
    >>>> less domination) is adoption by the masses. The only thing that the
    >>>> masses will adopt is something that is EASY to mold into what they want
    >>>> it
    >>>> to be.
    >>>>
    >>>> No VB for Linux = no hope for the Linux desktop.
    >>>>
    >>>> I don't care whether you agree or even like it. This is the cold hard
    >>>> truth. Now, adapt or die.
    >>>
    >>> Look...I'm not going to waste my time here refuting everything with a
    >>> beak
    >>> that pecks out an argument and posts it here.
    >>>
    >>> The facts are simple. Linux has been given away free for many, many
    >>> years.
    >>> It has been given away in a mostly professional package under the Ubuntu
    >>> banner since October 20, 2004.
    >>>
    >>> In all that time, Linux has not so much as moved the needle on the dial
    >>> guaging Linux desktop adoption.

    >>
    >> Bull****. Absolute bull****.

    >
    > Back up your claim. Show us the numbers.


    Liarnut gets more ridiculous with every post.

  5. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    jim wrote:

    > chrisv wrote:
    >>
    >> jim wrote:
    >>>
    >>>Tell Mac users that MS has a monopoly on the desktop.

    >>
    >> Idiot. M$ has monopoly power in the market. The OEM's MUST use
    >> Micro$oft products.

    >
    > That'll certainly be news to Dell.


    No it wouldn't, fsckwit.

    > You'd better call them quick!


    Why? They are well-aware of the situation.

    You see, you fscking retard, "Dell must use Micro$oft products" DOES NOT
    EQUAL "Dell must use Micro$oft products on every product they sell".

    How fscking STUPID are these trolls? Like I'm not aware that Dell and HP
    sell some computers that don't use Windwoes? Sheesh!

  6. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    Ezekiel wrote:
    > "High Plains Thumper" wrote...
    >> RonB wrote:
    >>> jim wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> If so, this will be the death knell for Linux.
    >>>
    >>> Has absolutely *nothing* to do with IBM's Linux markets.
    >>> It would be replacing IBM's office PCs, currently running
    >>> Windows, with Mac computers. Get a grip.

    >>
    >> It's another Wintroll. IBM embraced Linux by replacing a
    >> goodly portion of Windows computers already with Linux in
    >> its offices.

    >
    > This is absolute bull****. IBM has on several occasions come
    > out with press releases of how they "PLAN" on putting linux on
    > the desktop. But less than 1% of desktops at IBM have been
    > replaced with linux. And less than 1% is for all practical
    > purposes zero despite all the talk of how they "plan" on doing
    > it.


    Oh, really? Interesting gob****e. For one, there was an
    2004 internal memo that went forth from the corporate Chief
    Information Officer (CIO) as a relay from the CEO, urging his
    executives to have Linux and related application installed and
    used on their office workstations, along with their staff.

    http://www.theinquirer.net/en/inquir...-linux-desktop

    or http://tinyurl.com/4h2mmt

    Internal memo confirms IBM move to Linux desktop
    All stories come true eventually

    By Mike Magee: Wednesday, 07 January 2004, 4:39 PM

    While we have made important progress in transforming our
    business and IT systems we must be even more aggressive in
    driving this transformation. I am writing to you today because I
    need your assistance on two key projects that are central to our
    vision of IBM as an on demand business.

    First, our chairman has challenged the IT organization, and
    indeed all of IBM, to move to a Linux based desktop before the
    end of 2005. This means replacing productivity, web access and
    viewing tools with open standards based equivalents. The CIO
    office, in conjunction with Research and SWG, is building the
    Open Desktop project office to lead this effort. You need to have
    people participate in this project. You'll want people that can
    bring together the business and technical perspectives from your
    organization. These individuals will work with the project office
    to surface business unit issues and requirements and to
    communicate information back through your organization.
    Like many companies, IBM will not disclose all information about
    their infrastructure. For one, it is an internal affair. There
    is concern for industrial espionage and work matters are
    considered of a confidential nature. Disclosures to the outside
    are through their public affairs office and designated
    representatives.

    Since IBM is an integrator requires employees on various teams to
    be familiar with competing products and products they must
    integrate with. There will always be a presence of Windows, Unix
    and Linux in all flavours, Apple, and other used operating systems.

    Through the variety of products in various stages of
    implementation, they can test out feasibility and success, prior
    to deployment in the world. The best way to do this is to do it
    through their own resources.

    However, the CEO's desire was for his exec's to be fully aware
    and armed with practical knowledge of what they are selling. The
    only way to do this is to use Linux and applications under Linux.
    They are the salesmen and ombudsmen to other companies and
    offices. Management and sales staff cannot sell a product, if
    they are unfamiliar with it. The only way to get familiar with
    it is to use it. Also it is a way for passing feedback down for
    improvements and praise.

    So therefore, this troll's 1% assessment is wild arse guess that
    makes no sense.

    Further developments drive the point home:

    http://www.neoseeker.com/news/5436-i...inux-desktops/


    Interesting news from LinuxForum 2006

    During a presentation on IBM's involvement with Open Source,
    Andreas Pleschek from IBM in Stuttgart, Germany, who heads open
    source and Linux technical sales across North East Europe for IBM
    made a very interesting statement...

    "Andreas Pleschek also told that IBM has cancelled their
    contract with Microsoft as of October this year. That means that
    IBM will not use Windows Vista for their desktops. Beginning from
    July, IBM employees will begin using IBM Workplace on their new,
    Red Hat-based platform. Not all at once - some will keep using
    their present Windows versions for a while. But none will upgrade
    to Vista."
    I see this in two possible lights:

    1. There will be limited Vista presence. In their R&D efforts,
    some Vista workstations will be used, so the staff can work their
    integration and testing. However, they decided against a master
    contract for Vista on their remaining Windows machines. Any
    Vista purchases, IMHO, would be for smaller quantities and on
    purchase order with a justified needs basis.

    2. There will be no Vista presence. They have examined Vista.
    Perhaps its various auditing mechanisms disclose too much
    information back to their competitor to be an internal security
    breach?

    Those are my speculations, however, IBM's direction to cancel
    their contract sends signals that Vista's future may be in question.

    >> I put little faith in the truthfulness of the article.

    >
    > So when it comes to what IBM plans to do people are supposed
    > to believe a retard like you instead of IBMs own words.
    > ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **


    Well, they certainly aren't going to believe the Teranews
    nymshifting troll .....

    --
    HPT

  7. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    Moshe Goldfarb wrote:
    > High Plains Thumper wrote:
    >
    >> It's another Wintroll. IBM embraced Linux by replacing a
    >> goodly portion of Windows computers already with Linux in
    >> its offices. I put little faith in the truthfulness of the
    >> article.

    >
    > No they haven't. You are lying once again High Plains Thumper.


    http://tinyurl.com/6m6a8c

    Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy, alt.os.linux.ubuntu
    Subject: Re: [News] Red Hat Developer's Update on PulseAudio,
    Fedora Live CDs Interview
    Message-ID: Xns9A7D9779E7902thisnthatadelphianet@66.250.146.12 8
    Date: 11 Apr 2008 18:53:55 GMT


    > Dan, you're probably a nice guy, but we get a ton of "works
    > for me" crap in COLA and most times it's just people telling
    > lies.


    Believe what you want to believe. It's painfully obvious that you
    are completely anti-Linux, just like some are completely anti-MS,
    and have such strong preconceived beliefs that it doesn't really
    matter what anyone says about any particular Linux item,
    everyone's a liar, and nothing works out-of-the-box.
    --
    HPT

  8. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?


    "High Plains Thumper" wrote in message
    news:480acac5$0$22074$6e1ede2f@read.cnntp.org...
    > Ezekiel wrote:
    >> "High Plains Thumper" wrote...
    >>> RonB wrote:
    >>>> jim wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> If so, this will be the death knell for Linux.
    >>>>
    >>>> Has absolutely *nothing* to do with IBM's Linux markets.
    >>>> It would be replacing IBM's office PCs, currently running Windows,
    >>>> with Mac computers. Get a grip.
    >>>
    >>> It's another Wintroll. IBM embraced Linux by replacing a
    >>> goodly portion of Windows computers already with Linux in
    >>> its offices.

    >>
    >> This is absolute bull****. IBM has on several occasions come
    >> out with press releases of how they "PLAN" on putting linux on
    >> the desktop. But less than 1% of desktops at IBM have been
    >> replaced with linux. And less than 1% is for all practical
    >> purposes zero despite all the talk of how they "plan" on doing
    >> it.

    >
    > Oh, really? Interesting gob****e. For one, there was an
    > 2004 internal memo that went forth from the corporate Chief Information
    > Officer (CIO) as a relay from the CEO, urging his executives to have
    > Linux and related application installed and used on their office
    > workstations, along with their staff.
    >
    > http://www.theinquirer.net/en/inquir...-linux-desktop
    >
    > or http://tinyurl.com/4h2mmt
    >
    > Internal memo confirms IBM move to Linux desktop
    > All stories come true eventually
    >
    > By Mike Magee: Wednesday, 07 January 2004, 4:39 PM


    Wow. Some 5+ year old memo. Too bad none of it actually came true.



    >
    > http://www.neoseeker.com/news/5436-i...inux-desktops/
    >
    > [quote]
    > Interesting news from LinuxForum 2006
    >
    > During a presentation on IBM's involvement with Open Source,
    > Andreas Pleschek from IBM in Stuttgart, Germany, who heads open
    > source and Linux technical sales across North East Europe for IBM
    > made a very interesting statement...
    >
    > "Andreas Pleschek also told that IBM has cancelled their
    > contract with Microsoft as of October this year. That means that
    > IBM will not use Windows Vista for their desktops.


    And you managed to find another bull**** memo that amounts to zero. This
    one was so laughable that IBM officially denied it a couple of days later.


    http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS5756705765.html


    IBM Germany denies Linux-over-Vista decision
    Mar. 10, 2006

    [Updated Mar. 10] -- IBM Germany has refuted a Groklaw report that
    the division has decided to migrate Windows desktops to Linux rather than
    upgrade them to Vista. Groklaw's story was based on statements reportedly
    made by an IBM sales executive in a presentation at LinuxForum 2006.

    This morning, Hans Rehm, of IBM Germany's Press Relations department,
    emailed DesktopLinux.com the following, somewhat ambiguous, statement:


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------


    1. There have been reports that IBM does not plan to use the next
    version of Windows, Microsoft Vista. Is that true?

    No. We are now in early stages of evaluating Vista. We have not
    made any
    decisions on it yet.

    IBM continues to have a strong relationship with Microsoft. Our
    customers look to us for solutions and services on a variety of operating
    systems, including Windows.

    2. I've heard that your contract for Microsoft Office expired in
    June, 2005. Do you plan to renew the contract?

    As a business principle, we don't discuss our supplier contracts.


    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  9. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?


    "chrisv" wrote in message
    news:rf-dnVkqxsETr5fVnZ2dnUVZ_rHinZ2d@giganews.com...
    > jim wrote:
    >
    >> chrisv wrote:
    >>>
    >>> jim wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>Tell Mac users that MS has a monopoly on the desktop.
    >>>
    >>> Idiot. M$ has monopoly power in the market. The OEM's MUST use
    >>> Micro$oft products.

    >>
    >> That'll certainly be news to Dell.

    >
    > No it wouldn't, fsckwit.
    >
    >> You'd better call them quick!

    >
    > Why? They are well-aware of the situation.
    >
    > You see, you fscking retard, "Dell must use Micro$oft products" DOES NOT
    > EQUAL "Dell must use Micro$oft products on every product they sell".


    Wow. You're dumber than "7" and "chrisv" combined. Oh wait... you are
    'chrisv' so it's no surprise that you're a retard.


    > How fscking STUPID are these trolls? Like I'm not aware that Dell and HP
    > sell some computers that don't use Windwoes? Sheesh!


    So you managed to find some OEM's that sell both linux and Windows systems.
    And that proves what exactly?

    Good to see that you completely ignored 'penguincomputing', 'tuxmachines',
    'system76', 'eightvirtues' and 'IbexPc' who sell linux only computers and
    no Windows computers.

    Be sure to change your ignorant mantra to "Oems that sell Windows are
    forced to only sell Windows unless they want to sell linux too."

    IDIOT.


    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  10. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    Ezekiel wrote:
    > "High Plains Thumper" wrote...
    >> Ezekiel wrote:
    >>
    >>> This is absolute bull****. IBM has on several occasions
    >>> come out with press releases of how they "PLAN" on putting
    >>> linux on the desktop. But less than 1% of desktops at IBM
    >>> have been replaced with linux. And less than 1% is for
    >>> all practical purposes zero despite all the talk of how
    >>> they "plan" on doing it.

    >>
    >> Oh, really? Interesting gob****e. For one, there was an
    >> 2004 internal memo that went forth from the corporate Chief
    >> Information Officer (CIO) as a relay from the CEO, urging
    >> his executives to have Linux and related application
    >> installed and used on their office workstations, along with
    >> their staff.
    >>
    >> http://www.theinquirer.net/en/inquirer/news/2004/01/07/
    >> internal-memo-confirms-ibm-move-to-linux-desktop
    >>
    >> or http://tinyurl.com/4h2mmt
    >>
    >> Internal memo confirms IBM move to Linux desktop All stories
    >> come true eventually
    >>
    >> By Mike Magee: Wednesday, 07 January 2004, 4:39 PM
    >>
    >>
    While we have made important progress in
    >> transforming our business and IT systems we must be even
    >> more aggressive in driving this transformation. I am writing
    >> to you today because I need your assistance on two key
    >> projects that are central to our vision of IBM as an on
    >> demand business.
    >>
    >> First, our chairman has challenged the IT organization, and
    >> indeed all of IBM, to move to a Linux based desktop before
    >> the end of 2005. This means replacing productivity, web
    >> access and viewing tools with open standards based
    >> equivalents. The CIO office, in conjunction with Research
    >> and SWG, is building the Open Desktop project office to lead
    >> this effort. You need to have people participate in this
    >> project. You'll want people that can bring together the
    >> business and technical perspectives from your organization.
    >> These individuals will work with the project office to
    >> surface business unit issues and requirements and to
    >> communicate information back through your organization.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> However, the CEO's desire was for his exec's to be fully
    >> aware and armed with practical knowledge of what they are
    >> selling. The only way to do this is to use Linux and
    >> applications under Linux. They are the salesmen and
    >> ombudsmen to other companies and offices. Management and
    >> sales staff cannot sell a product, if they are unfamiliar
    >> with it. The only way to get familiar with it is to use it.
    >> Also it is a way for passing feedback down for improvements
    >> and praise.
    >>
    >> So therefore, this troll's 1% assessment is wild arse guess
    >> that makes no sense.

    >
    > Wow. Some 5+ year old memo. Too bad none of it actually came
    > true.


    Except that 1% is considerably short of 5%:

    http://www.informationweek.com/news/...ratingsystems/
    showArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=GIAYED3L5I1LUQSNDLPSK HSCJUNN2JVN?
    articleID=181502065&_requestid=675391

    or http://tinyurl.com/4anym4

    IBM Switches Linux Desktops, But Isn't Dumping Windows

    By Antone Gonsalves
    TechWeb News
    March 8, 2006 03:01 PM

    [....]

    The number of Linux users within the Armonk, N.Y., company is
    about 5 percent of IBM's 329,000 employees, spokeswoman Nancy
    Kaplan said. The workers include software developers and
    designers, people configuring software and hardware bundles for
    customers and others who need to use Linux as part of their jobs.

    >> http://www.neoseeker.com/news/5436-i...inux-desktops/
    >>
    >> [quote] Interesting news from LinuxForum 2006
    >>
    >> During a presentation on IBM's involvement with Open Source,
    >> Andreas Pleschek from IBM in Stuttgart, Germany, who heads
    >> open source and Linux technical sales across North East
    >> Europe for IBM made a very interesting statement...
    >>
    >> "Andreas Pleschek also told that IBM has cancelled their
    >> contract with Microsoft as of October this year. That means
    >> that IBM will not use Windows Vista for their desktops.

    >
    > And you managed to find another bull**** memo that amounts to
    > zero. This one was so laughable that IBM officially denied it
    > a couple of days later.


    Except that is was not a memo. Another reading comprehension
    problem?

    > http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS5756705765.html
    >
    >
    IBM Germany denies Linux-over-Vista decision Mar. 10,
    > 2006
    >
    > [Updated Mar. 10] -- IBM Germany has refuted a Groklaw report
    > that the division has decided to migrate Windows desktops to
    > Linux rather than upgrade them to Vista. Groklaw's story was
    > based on statements reportedly made by an IBM sales executive
    > in a presentation at LinuxForum 2006.
    >
    > This morning, Hans Rehm, of IBM Germany's Press Relations
    > department, emailed DesktopLinux.com the following, somewhat
    > ambiguous, statement:

    I see .... ambiguous, like the trolls in this newsgroup.

    > 1. There have been reports that IBM does not plan to use the
    > next version of Windows, Microsoft Vista. Is that true?
    >
    > No. We are now in early stages of evaluating Vista. We have
    > not made any decisions on it yet.
    >
    > IBM continues to have a strong relationship with Microsoft.
    > Our customers look to us for solutions and services on a
    > variety of operating systems, including Windows.
    >
    > 2. I've heard that your contract for Microsoft Office expired
    > in June, 2005. Do you plan to renew the contract?
    >
    > As a business principle, we don't discuss our supplier
    > contracts.


    For one, the article does not answer the question and confirms
    what I stated:

    >> Like many companies, IBM will not disclose all information
    >> about their infrastructure. For one, it is an internal
    >> affair. There is concern for industrial espionage and work
    >> matters are considered of a confidential nature. Disclosures
    >> to the outside are through their public affairs office and
    >> designated representatives.


    I have yet to see an official IBM statement in one of their
    publications or their website (not a quote from a news reporter)
    as a direct quote from them regarding their IT infrastructure mix.

    >> Since IBM is an integrator requires employees on various
    >> teams to be familiar with competing products and products
    >> they must integrate with. There will always be a presence of
    >> Windows, Unix and Linux in all flavours, Apple, and other
    >> used operating systems.
    >>
    >> Through the variety of products in various stages of
    >> implementation, they can test out feasibility and success,
    >> prior to deployment in the world. The best way to do this
    >> is to do it through their own resources.


    > ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **


    --
    HPT

  11. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?


    "High Plains Thumper" wrote in message
    news:480ba37d$0$22077$6e1ede2f@read.cnntp.org...
    > Ezekiel wrote:
    >> "High Plains Thumper" wrote...
    >>> Ezekiel wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> This is absolute bull****. IBM has on several occasions come out with
    >>>> press releases of how they "PLAN" on putting
    >>>> linux on the desktop. But less than 1% of desktops at IBM
    >>>> have been replaced with linux. And less than 1% is for
    >>>> all practical purposes zero despite all the talk of how
    >>>> they "plan" on doing it.
    >>>
    >>> Oh, really? Interesting gob****e. For one, there was an 2004 internal
    >>> memo that went forth from the corporate Chief Information Officer (CIO)
    >>> as a relay from the CEO, urging his executives to have Linux and related
    >>> application installed and used on their office workstations, along with
    >>> their staff.
    >>>
    >>> http://www.theinquirer.net/en/inquirer/news/2004/01/07/
    >>> internal-memo-confirms-ibm-move-to-linux-desktop
    >>>
    >>> or http://tinyurl.com/4h2mmt
    >>>
    >>> Internal memo confirms IBM move to Linux desktop All stories
    >>> come true eventually
    >>>
    >>> By Mike Magee: Wednesday, 07 January 2004, 4:39 PM
    >>>
    >>>
    While we have made important progress in transforming our
    >>> business and IT systems we must be even more aggressive in driving this
    >>> transformation. I am writing
    >>> to you today because I need your assistance on two key projects that are
    >>> central to our vision of IBM as an on demand business.
    >>>
    >>> First, our chairman has challenged the IT organization, and
    >>> indeed all of IBM, to move to a Linux based desktop before
    >>> the end of 2005. This means replacing productivity, web access and
    >>> viewing tools with open standards based equivalents. The CIO office, in
    >>> conjunction with Research and SWG, is building the Open Desktop project
    >>> office to lead
    >>> this effort. You need to have people participate in this project. You'll
    >>> want people that can bring together the business and technical
    >>> perspectives from your organization.
    >>> These individuals will work with the project office to surface business
    >>> unit issues and requirements and to communicate information back through
    >>> your organization.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> However, the CEO's desire was for his exec's to be fully aware and armed
    >>> with practical knowledge of what they are selling. The only way to do
    >>> this is to use Linux and applications under Linux. They are the
    >>> salesmen and ombudsmen to other companies and offices. Management and
    >>> sales staff cannot sell a product, if they are unfamiliar with it. The
    >>> only way to get familiar with it is to use it.
    >>> Also it is a way for passing feedback down for improvements
    >>> and praise.
    >>>
    >>> So therefore, this troll's 1% assessment is wild arse guess
    >>> that makes no sense.

    >>
    >> Wow. Some 5+ year old memo. Too bad none of it actually came true.

    >
    > Except that 1% is considerably short of 5%:


    So take the high end estimate of 5%. Big deal. IBM... the great linux
    champion... who's been promoting linux for years and years has managed after
    all this time to convince 5% of it's own employees to use linux. That means
    that roughly 90% or more of IBM's employees are using Windows.


    > http://www.informationweek.com/news/...ratingsystems/
    > showArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=GIAYED3L5I1LUQSNDLPSK HSCJUNN2JVN?
    > articleID=181502065&_requestid=675391
    >
    > or http://tinyurl.com/4anym4
    >
    >
    > IBM Switches Linux Desktops, But Isn't Dumping Windows
    >
    > By Antone Gonsalves
    > TechWeb News
    > March 8, 2006 03:01 PM
    >
    > [....]
    >
    > The number of Linux users within the Armonk, N.Y., company is
    > about 5 percent of IBM's 329,000 employees, spokeswoman Nancy
    > Kaplan said. The workers include software developers and
    > designers, people configuring software and hardware bundles for
    > customers and others who need to use Linux as part of their jobs.
    >


    So linux basically exists only on the desktops of geeks. Software
    developers, people who configure software/hardware for customers and others
    "who need to use Linux as part of their jobs." So other employees like
    secretaries, salespeople, marketing, product managers, human resources, etc.
    don't use linux. Linux is only being used by people "who need to use Linux"
    for their job.

    Wow... what a success story for desktop linux.

    "About" 5% of 329,000 means that at most 16,450 are using Linux. I'll be
    generous and give 5% to the Mac which leaves 90% or about 300,000 IBM
    employees running Windows. And that's at IBM - the worlds biggest linux
    champion.





    ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

  12. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    Ezekiel wrote:
    >
    > "About" 5% of 329,000 means that at most 16,450 are using
    > Linux. I'll be generous and give 5% to the Mac which leaves
    > 90% or about 300,000 IBM employees running Windows. And that's
    > at IBM - the worlds biggest linux champion.
    >
    > ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **


    This will be my last post with you, since you have no common
    sense or reasoning and ignored my points, thus showing your
    intent to troll.

    329,000 IBM employees don't all sit at a desk and use a desktop
    computer. Following is from IBM's 2007 Annual Report:

    FOR THE YEAR ENDED DECEMBER 31: 2005
    IBM/wholly owned subsidiaries 329,373
    Less-than-wholly owned subsidiaries 12,377
    Complementary 24,595

    Document also states,

    In 2007, total employees at IBM and its wholly owned subsidiaries
    increased 30,792 compared with 2006. The U.S. remained the
    largest country, with 121,000 employees, down modestly versus
    2006 due to the Printer divestiture, while resources increased in
    Asia Pacific, EMEA and Latin America.

    [....]

    The company has been adding resources aggressively in emerging
    markets, particularly in the BRIC countries — Brazil, Russia,
    India and China — where employment totals approximately 98,000.
    India experienced the largest growth, up 22,200 to approximately
    74,000 employees at year end. Higher employment in these
    countries reflects growth within these markets, as well as the
    company’s continued transformation to a globally integrated
    enterprise.
    Approximately 2/3rds of IBM employees reside outside US. Many of
    IBM manufacturing production factilities are located outside US.

    IBM's work segments are summarised in

    http://www.ibm.com/investor/company/index.phtml

    Business operations

    IBM delivers on demand solutions through the following business
    segments:

    *Hardware*
    Servers
    Storage
    Personal systems
    Printing systems
    Retail store solutions

    *Software*
    Connect operating systems, business processes, and applications
    seamlessly.

    *Services*
    Comprehensive IT services integrated with business insight to
    reduce costs, improve productivity, and assert competitive
    advantage.

    *Financing*
    A leading provider of financing and asset management services to
    companies selling or acquiring IT related products and services.

    *Research*
    Innovative technologies that produce leading-edge solutions.

    *Technology*
    Develop, market and deliver leading chip technologies and services.
    IBM does both hardware and software manufacturing. Many
    employees in manufacturing do not need access to a desktop PC to
    perform their work. Actual workforce numbers by trade are not
    shown. Figuring sales, R&D, personnel support, manufacturing
    support probably account for 1/3rd the workforce and the rest is
    manufacturing, that 5% is more like 15%. If Unix and
    virtualisation are included, that number is even higher.

    That was back in 2006. The number is now higher. Since IBM is a
    master integrator of IT resources, it will always have a mixture
    of operating systems.

    So to consider that 329,000 employees use a desktop PC and 95% of
    329,000 use Windows are simply not true.

    --
    HPT

  13. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    Quoting High Plains Thumper who, on Wed, 23 Apr 2008 00:42:00 -0600,
    posted:

    > Ezekiel wrote:
    >>
    >> "About" 5% of 329,000 means that at most 16,450 are using Linux. I'll be
    >> generous and give 5% to the Mac which leaves 90% or about 300,000 IBM
    >> employees running Windows. And that's at IBM - the worlds biggest linux
    >> champion.
    >>
    >> ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

    >
    > This will be my last post with you, since you have no common sense or
    > reasoning and ignored my points, thus showing your intent to troll.


    Ezekiel = Flatfish = Moshe Goldfarb.



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    This message was sent from a
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    100% free of the M$ Windoze virus.
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  14. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    William Poaster wrote:

    >Quoting High Plains Thumper who, on Wed, 23 Apr 2008 00:42:00 -0600,
    >posted:
    >>
    >> This will be my last post with you, since you have no common sense or
    >> reasoning and ignored my points, thus showing your intent to troll.

    >
    >Ezekiel = Flatfish = Moshe Goldfarb.


    Does not a troll, by any other name, stink so badly?


  15. Re: IS IBM snubbing open Linux foir Mac's closed source?

    Quoting chrisv who, on Wed, 23 Apr 2008 08:13:19 -0500, posted:

    > William Poaster wrote:
    >
    >>Quoting High Plains Thumper who, on Wed, 23 Apr 2008 00:42:00 -0600,
    >>posted:
    >>>
    >>> This will be my last post with you, since you have no common sense or
    >>> reasoning and ignored my points, thus showing your intent to troll.

    >>
    >>Ezekiel = Flatfish = Moshe Goldfarb.

    >
    > Does not a troll, by any other name, stink so badly?


    You mean like rotting fish? ;-)

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    computer which is guaranteed
    100% free of the M$ Windoze virus.
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